Seeking advice from folks in the log truck industry..

[LogTruckin]

Good morning,

I would like to ask a question for the folks in the log truck industry. I have been debating back and forth if this is a business venture worth entering. I don't have any background in logging or truck driving. However, I feel that this is something that genuinely interests me because I love trucks and driving and love the forestry aspect of things as well. My ultimate goal is to operate a single O/O log truck in the PNW. So, my question is in two parts:

Is this a business worth entering? If so, I would like advice from O/O's who have been doing things for some time as to what would be a good start to learning the driving side of things and how to learn the business side and how to ultimately be successful in this particular industry?

Thank you for all the feedback!! 

[Southside]

I would suggest as a starting point you find an O/O near you and ask if you can ride shotgun for a few days to get a feeling for what it's really like.  Then begin to assess your present skill and financial level to that which you can see first hand is needed for the job and you will have a good idea of what you are up against.  

[barbender]

Of all of the places to learn to not only drive truck, but also run a business, I would rate the woods as probably the hardest. But, some people have got into the business and made out well, because they didn't know any better🤷🏽‍♂️

[BargeMonkey]

 Are you married ? Might not be after you live in the truck 20hrs a day 😂 like they both said, find someone to ride with for a while, see what your getting into long before you jump. 

[LogTruckin]

No I'm not married. Im single no kids. When my dad started his business he worked 7 days a week 12 to 14 hours a day.

[sawguy21]

What the others said. Log hauling is definitely not an easy way to make a living, it involves long hours of hard work. At one time I considered making my living at it, got my cdl learners permit and did the air course. My buddy was making what to me looked like good money but after getting up at 3 to hit the bush, putting in 12 hours hauling then spending evenings and weeknds maintaining the truck it didn't look quite so appealing. It can be rewarding, lots of guys wouldn't do anything else, but it is a lifestyle not a job. Forget having a girlfriend. ;D

[Southside]

It's been a few years but a customer of mine owned a small fleet of OTR Fed-Ex tractors as he was a contractor for them. Each year Keith would go to some tractor trailer high end competition in Oklahoma (I think that's where it was) and do things like compete in backing up doubles, the man could drive.  Well he was in our yard and trying to get onto a door for a load of bagged shavings, took several times and could not get the trailer onto the door.  Half joking I asked him if he needed me to spot the trailer and he said without lines he could not back up - our yard was gravel, well gravel and mud most of the time, and actually long enough and flat that a truck could front up to the door and get straight, which is not always the case at a log landing.  Kinda made me realize there is a difference between a guy who drives a truck and one who drives a truck in the woods.   

[LogTruckin]

I believe it is definitely a lifestyle and not just a job. So is it safe to say I shouldn't even bother driving a regular truck on paved roads as gravel/dirt driving is a different animal? 😁

[Skeans1]

What part of the PNW? Can you get up early reliably? Do you already have a CDL? 
It's a completely different life style being in the industry to say the least, I know out here in NW Oregon the guys start loading at 130 to 2 depending on how far out from the mill they are as well as how many trucks they have to load out. Off highway driving is pretty rough on a truck especially running up to the tower jobs the road can be tight curvy and one wrong move you could be going for your last ride.

[quilbilly]

Skeans and I both operate out of the PNW. I would say if you're willing to put in the hours and do basic maintenance and mechanical work you can make it for sure. Area and setup are important. Some companies are moving to hourly which helps, but as an OO you're on your own. A younger fella about 28 got into trucking a few years ago and he's making a solid living. Bought a new truck even. Gotta be willing to chase the work though.

[LogTruckin]

Skeans and I both operate out of the PNW. I would say if you're willing to put in the hours and do basic maintenance and mechanical work you can make it for sure. Area and setup are important. Some companies are moving to hourly which helps, but as an OO you're on your own. A younger fella about 28 got into trucking a few years ago and he's making a solid living. Bought a new truck even. Gotta be willing to chase the work though.

I would be willing to relocate to anywhere pretty much there is work. Do you mean setup as in the type of truck used?

[LogTruckin]

What part of the PNW? Can you get up early reliably? Do you already have a CDL?
It's a completely different life style being in the industry to say the least, I know out here in NW Oregon the guys start loading at 130 to 2 depending on how far out from the mill they are as well as how many trucks they have to load out. Off highway driving is pretty rough on a truck especially running up to the tower jobs the road can be tight curvy and one wrong move you could be going for your last ride.

I don't have a CDl at the moment.

[Skeans1]

Skeans and I both operate out of the PNW. I would say if you're willing to put in the hours and do basic maintenance and mechanical work you can make it for sure. Area and setup are important. Some companies are moving to hourly which helps, but as an OO you're on your own. A younger fella about 28 got into trucking a few years ago and he's making a solid living. Bought a new truck even. Gotta be willing to chase the work though.

I would be willing to relocate to anywhere pretty much there is work. Do you mean setup as in the type of truck used?

The main setups you see out here are Long Loggers and Mule Train short loggers, with the long logger you can add an insert between the bunks to haul short logs, or long logs of varying lengths. The short loggers or mule trains you are more or less stuck unless the truck was setup with quick pin bunks allowing you to remove one of the bunks from the truck and placing it more towards the center of the frame. The other option that you see if space is available for turn around and the grade isn't too bad is a fifth wheel hay rack which isn't as common for the reason stated above.

[barbender]

As far as on road/off road experience, you need both. Any time behind the wheel meshing gears is beneficial, and you have to be able to negotiate highway traffic, too. But offroad driving takes another level of skill IMHO. Some days I'll have 10+ different trucks hauling off of a job, using the same turnaround etc., some guys never or rarely have a problem and others manage to get stuck every time. Don't be one of them😊 Think and look ahead. Maintain momentum, and leave yourself a gear to jump to (easier with some transmissions than others.) Watch the guys that are good at it and copy them. A lot of it is just paying attention, a lot of times the guys that suck at it just don't pay attention to what's going on around them.

[LogTruckin]

I appreciate all the input everyone. All the feedback is greatly appreciated!! 

[Ianab]

I don't have a CDl at the moment.

Get your licence and a job in the field. Drive for someone else for a few years, get the experience and contacts. You will get a feel for how the economics work out, and have the experience to actually do the job. 
Then you can decide if the local market is going to match up with your plan.  If it doesn't you still have a CDL and some experience, so plenty of other jobs out there. 

[thecfarm]

This was 20 years.The guy that use to truck for me made a living at it. I went to school with him.Drive during daylight hours,work on his truck at night. He had a big garage too. Than at about 40 he sold his truck and started to drive for a paper company driving wood to NH each day. Than onto Poland Spring delivering water. He had some driving at night,did not like that much,now he's delivering forklifts,and high lifts,rentals or new ones in ME,MA,NH,VT and is home for supper most nights.

[quilbilly]

Yes skeans pretty much nailed it. Most mule train guys near me are really busy. I know a guy who says he'd sell out cause he's tired of trucking, I think it's just talk though. With all the thinning going on mule trains are getting more popular near me. Long loggers still get business especially those with a pup, we could've really used a truck with a pup on our last job. If you are really interested in getting into it, call up the local Mills and see if they have any use for a driver in a timber sale they bought etc. I have a buddy who simply called SPI when he moved to Bellingham for his wife's school and was working everyday within a week.

[Riwaka]

Another way some log truck drivers start off driving the roading trucks hauling gravel and sand or agricultural trucks hauling grain and fertilizer, then move onto log/ sawn timber  trucks.

Is the driver/ steerer in the back unit on half pay? 
Blue line pole truck with rear under logs steering unit. 
Logging 125 FOOT POLES on SWITCHBACK CORNERS!!! Clear and Level Logging and Lee Levanen Logging - YouTube

Some drivers can go onto move the expensive heavy equipment, it appears from some accidents that some move into the job before they can safely/ fully manage the task. 

I-40E bridge etc - the driver's response to the officer's question ' What happened man?'   Driver's response - 'The bridge was tooo loow'     
I-65N at I-40E Overpass Bridge Crash - YouTube

[Skeans1]

@quilbilly
We're all going the other direction down here even thinning long loggers with the inserts to do everything. There use to be a local truck down here that ran a rack with a pup that could be loaded onto the rack, if I remember right the rack is down at Kelso Pape.

[Skeans1]

Another way some log truck drivers start off driving the roading trucks hauling gravel and sand or agricultural trucks hauling grain and fertilizer, then move onto log/ sawn timber  trucks.

Is the driver/ steerer in the back unit on half pay?
Blue line pole truck with rear under logs steering unit.
Logging 125 FOOT POLES on SWITCHBACK CORNERS!!! Clear and Level Logging and Lee Levanen Logging - YouTube

Some drivers can go onto move the expensive heavy equipment, it appears from some accidents that some move into the job before they can safely/ fully manage the task.

I-40E bridge etc - the driver's response to the officer's question ' What happened man?'   Driver's response - 'The bridge was tooo loow'    
I-65N at I-40E Overpass Bridge Crash - YouTube

That's the old style pole trailer, most even doing longer don't have anyone riding in them anymore they are remotely operated from the cab of the truck.

[quilbilly]

@quilbilly
We're all going the other direction down here even thinning long loggers with the inserts to do everything. There use to be a local truck down here that ran a rack with a pup that could be loaded onto the rack, if I remember right the rack is down at Kelso Pape.

I think for some reason the Mills a little further north haven't moved to a min length yet. So everyone is cutting hardwood as short as possible, SPI is paying the same for 16' as 40' almost all CNS and 6"+ Mills here take wood 27' and less.

[Skeans1]

@quilbilly
We're all going the other direction down here even thinning long loggers with the inserts to do everything. There use to be a local truck down here that ran a rack with a pup that could be loaded onto the rack, if I remember right the rack is down at Kelso Pape.

I think for some reason the Mills a little further north haven't moved to a min length yet. So everyone is cutting hardwood as short as possible, SPI is paying the same for 16' as 40' almost all CNS and 6"+ Mills here take wood 27' and less.

That was one nice thing about Cascade Hardwoods camp run pricing per top diameter. Even our CNS sorts are doing an average length of 33's or 35's required per load, I can ship shorter wood just not full loads of it anymore the days of doing short logs down here are coming to an end the mills are fighting the guys still doing them by dropping their P.O. out of no where.

[Dieseldog5.9]

Aside from being a viable Buisness and getting a license driving a truck 12 hours a day takes a certain person. I came out of the shop, drove for a buddy of mine to help out while he found a driver, Day 1 this is fun driving the big rigs, Day 2 yeah this is cool, Day 3 noontime, what Did I get myself into.

My advice Drive for a company for 2 years, as an O/O you need 2 years experience for an insurance company to take you on.  You will either love it or like your next job better because of it.

Best advice, get a job at UPS, they pay stupid good wage and fantastic retirement.

And the best way to make a Million dollars trucking is to start with 2 Million.

[sawguy21]

X2 There is a lot more to being an O/O than buying a truck and heading for a fat paycheck. It is a business and with any business costs have to be kept under control. Too many truckers take the attitude that they just need to keep driving, any money left over at the end of the month must be theirs. A friend and his son run two logging trucks. The older KW had to have the front end rebuilt before it would pass inspection. Then the axle let go on the Pete's jeep under a load, fortunately not on the highway. First day out with another jeep a rear end piled up, that was covered by warranty but the truck was down for almost a week waiting for parts. It goes on and on.
The logging industry is hurting right now, prices are down and mills are closing. This is really not a good time to be investing in expensive equipment. Do you want a new or used truck. New you are chasing your tail just to keep up with payments. Used you don't have to work as hard but be prepared for a lot of shop time. I'm not trying to kill your dream, it can be very rewarding, but you need to go into it with your eyes open. Good luck.