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cost per brd ft to charge to charge

Started by 1234wood, April 09, 2016, 12:40:06 PM

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1234wood

hi all what should I charge to cut 8000 brd ft of walnut it for a large sawmill they dont want to cut it anymore because of it could get in with there other saw dust pile .normally I charge by hr but I don't want to lose money doing it it will have to be .25 cents or more not sure I will have dull blades  fuel, broken blade ,ect just not sure I have work logging with them for 20 years

Magicman

Welcome to the Forestry Forum, 1234wood.  Adding your location and sawmill to your profile helps with questions such as this.

Will travel  be necessary?  Are they bringing them to you or are you going portable to them?  What about log/lumber handling?  Who is providing the help? 

Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

1234wood

Sorry magicman I will be at there location in michigan I will have a man there to off load lumber less than 5 miles from home, I have lt40 hyd 2000 best regards and they will be loading mill with loader

WV Sawmiller

1234wood,

   Why not continue your hourly rate if that is what you are used to and comfortable with? Does the customer require a bf rate?

   if so, how many hours would it take you to saw comparable logs? How much would you make/charge for that? I'd just divide that rate by 8K bf and use that as your rate plus any reasonable extra costs you expect.

   I generally charge by the bf but have an hourly rate for special jobs. I frequently check what I made using bf against my hourly rate and they generally work out pretty close to each other.
Howard Green
WM LT35HDG25(2015) , 2011 4WD F150 Ford Lariat PU, Kawasaki 650 ATV, Stihl 440 Chainsaw, homemade logging arch (w/custom built rear log dolly), JD 750 w/4' wide Bushhog brand FEL

Dad always said "You can shear a sheep a bunch of times but you can only skin him once

1234wood

Vw sawmiller if I tell 60 hr there going to think it to high if I say 25 cents it seems lower  it comes out to 2000 out of that fuel dull blades and help ect.   And if all things run like well oil machine it mite be possible to cut in 4 to 5 days this would be a on going job with them they cut  8 to10 million bd ft a year  there like brothers to me so I got cut a little deal to keep it alive just not sure how much I will have to calculate a few things

Chuck White

Welcome to the Forestry Forum, 1234wood!
~Chuck~  Cooks Cat Claw sharpener and single tooth setter.  2018 Chevy Silverado and 2021 Subaru Ascent.
With basic mechanical skills and the ability to read you can maintain a Woodmizer  LT40!

WV Sawmiller

1234W,

   Your call and sounds like you know the folks. Do keep in mind if you lowball them to get the first job it is going to hard to raise your prices later if you find you aren't clearing enough to make it worth while. 

   What would happen if you gave them your hourly rate and told them you expect to cut ___ bf/hr?

    Good luck.
Howard Green
WM LT35HDG25(2015) , 2011 4WD F150 Ford Lariat PU, Kawasaki 650 ATV, Stihl 440 Chainsaw, homemade logging arch (w/custom built rear log dolly), JD 750 w/4' wide Bushhog brand FEL

Dad always said "You can shear a sheep a bunch of times but you can only skin him once

1234wood

Hi 1234w, your probly right hard to get a inch back out of board if its to short lol .With that said I probly go by hr then i cant go wrong  .Another ? Do yu know any one that up graded there log turner yu know from the claw turner to chain turner I have lt40hyd it never wants to grab a 36 log as most probly know?

Magicman

I am assuming that you would be sawing 1" but you did not say. 

$60 per hr is not too high if you are sawing good production.  2Mbf per day @ .25 is $500 so it is a wash.  Personally I would be looking for $75 per hour or .30 per bf.

I prefer to saw bf rate rather than hourly rate.  It takes the questioning from the customer and puts the production responsibility on me which is where it belongs.  Now if you are loosing sawing time because of poor help or them not bringing and staging enough logs to keep you rolling, then you would have to address that very quickly.

I have never had a problem with the claw not grabbing a large log.  Sometimes it may take both the two plane clamp and the turner working together to turn a large heavy log.
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

1234wood

Thanks magicman better to be on target far as money

GAB

1234wood:
You did not mention if you would be sawing live edge or not, how thick, and how long the logs are.  These, are other factors like log cleanliness could affect production.  For metal and foreign objects I charge blade cost and a fee for lost production.
Also I charge more for quartersawing as it is more time consuming.
You have many factors to consider.  You need to sit down and write all the variables and do like a mathematical equation and try to solve it fairly for both you and your customer. 
Personally I like happy customers, repeat business, and positive word of mouth advertising.
Good luck,
Gerald
W-M LT40HDD34, SLR, JD 420, JD 950w/loader and Woods backhoe, V3507 Fransguard winch, Cordwood Saw, 18' flat bed trailer, and other toys.

1234wood

Hi 1234w, 4/4 by 10 and 12 ft very clean log not much taper most around 24 to 35" not to big

1234wood

1234w, no live edge brds not quarter sawen

thechknhwk


Cedarman

Will you be sawing for grade?  If so, do you know the walnut grading rules?  A lot of money can be made or lost sawing walnut if not sawn to specs. Grading rules for walnut are much different than other hardwoods.
When confronted with these situations I always call it R&D.  Research and Development.
Since this could be a long term project, then both sides must work to come out ok.
So, I suggest sawing one day for $50 per hour or whatever per hour you want.  Measure the footage to see how productive you can be, but allowing for first day inefficiencies.  They will have an idea of cost per foot.
After the first day, you can adjust per hour costs or figure a board foot cost.
Also, ask yourself, is it more important that you put money in their pockets or yours?
When you saw for them, will you be losing money because you can not saw for others at a higher rate?
Will you make more money in the long run because you have steady work?
Lots of questions to ponder.
I am in the pink when sawing cedar.

Cedarman

Do you have a metal detector to help when metal is encountered in the log?  When we hit metal the slab and log comes off the mill to be scanned and an appropriate decision made as to chop or discard.
I am in the pink when sawing cedar.

1234wood

Hi cedarman no metal detector  they want to be charge by the 1000 bdft not sure on price there's about 60 logs total the number keeps going up far as logs .  hey its a job ? I  know the grading rules they will have a grader there as I'm cutting and so on

sandsawmill14

i have a deal similar to what you are describing. i was called to come saw about 10mbdft of oversized oak logs in late fall  2014 and have been there ever since just passed the 500mbdft  :o mark a few weeks back i charge $200 a 1000 but he furnishes the loader and does all the edging :)  the best thing about it is i havent missed a days work yet because of no logs and havent worked a day that i didnt want to ;D
hudson 228, lucky knuckleboom,stihl 038 064 441 magnum

terrifictimbersllc

Maybe you already know the conditions there but a bf price has to have agreement  about log readiness and lumber handling.   You don't want to be off bearing yourself for 25 cents a bf. 
DJ Hoover, Terrific Timbers LLC,  Mystic CT Woodmizer Million Board Foot Club member. 2019 LT70 Super Wide 55 Yanmar,  LogRite fetching arch, WM BMS250 sharpener/BMT250 setter.  2001 F350 7.3L PSD 6 spd manual ZF 4x4 Crew Cab Long Bed

Andries

I mill for a custom home builder, the timbers and half logs that I produce are used "as is". Getting to where I felt at ease with my work took a bit of time and R&D.
Quote from: Cedarman on April 10, 2016, 07:51:57 AM
.... When confronted with these situations I always call it R&D.  Research and Development.
Since this could be a long term project, then both sides must work to come out ok.
So, I suggest sawing one day for $50 per hour or whatever per hour you want. . . .
Excellent suggestion from Cedarman.
All your questions get answered pretty darn quickly when you're on the job.  ;)
LT40G25
Ford 545D loader
Stihl chainsaws

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