Pine Boards are Molding....I BEAT IT!

[WDH]

The mold that I got was on a 5 foot stack.  About the only species that I am comfortable anymore with a 5 foot stack are the oaks, walnut, and cherry. 

[red oaks lumber]

you need to have your piles in an area that has the most air flow,  that location might not be the most conveinent but, moldy lumber is not real conveinet either.
use stickers that are closer to 42" keeping your stack narrower, less air flow will still be effective.
  just remember air flow, air flow , air flow.

[POSTON WIDEHEAD]

   How wide are your stacks?  the pic shows them to be fairly wide.  Try a small stack outside with 42inch long stickers. are your boards on the outside of the stack getting moldy also?

My stacks are .......drum roll...... .......9 foot wide. And yes I am getting mold on the edge boards. In fact my pic shows the first 2 or 3 boards.

[crosscut]

poston i might add if you use the borates be carefull of any runoff thinking it will kill grass and trees they  get to much of it.

[POSTON WIDEHEAD]

poston i might add if you use the borates be carefull of any runoff thinking it will kill grass and trees they  get to much of it.

[slider]

David i have been using strait bleach on my wide boards,pine,with good results but a pain.I'm going to try running a big fan next batch .I think once the moisture is below 20% you are good to go.

[bandmiller2]

Question for you smart woodsy types,are the mold spores born upon the wind or naturally on/in the logs.What part does woodyard hygene play,do yards get infected.??As stated I think quick dry is best and easiest cure,I've had some luck with narrow piles and a big fan. Frank C.

[NMFP]

Spores are everywhere.  The issue is that the sugars are redily exposed and alot of them so, the mold starts immediately.  This is also true for Birch logs as well.  Take a birch log and cut it and let it lay for a year, you will see that the log will be rotting much quicker than most other species.  Birch has a very high sugar content which provides a HUGE beffet of sugars to be consumed.

All log yards will have the same problems, its just in how you manage your sawing rotation and what species you saw at certain times of the year. 

Pine, spruce, maples, basswood  = cool weather

[POSTON WIDEHEAD]

I have a pile of FRESH sawdust I dump everyday in a pile away from the mill. Why does the pile of fresh sawdust not mold deep inside? Deep inside the pile it gets NO air. Shouldn't mold be present there? It's not.

Just wondering.

[Alyeska Pete]

David,
Maye it's an optical illusion, but it appears that you don't have much horizontal separation between each board in each lindividual ayer.  That would really inhibit air circulation vertically if you don''t have much air flow horizontally be it natural or induced.
Pete

[POSTON WIDEHEAD]

David,
Maye it's an optical illusion, but it appears that you don't have much horizontal separation between each board in each lindividual ayer.  That would really inhibit air circulation vertically if you don''t have much air flow horizontally be it natural or induced.
Pete

Hey Pete.....no illusion.....I have stacked boards every which way I can. In S.C. this time of year, we have NO air flow at all. Just stale, hot, humid air.
I'm on my way to WAL-MART to get some bleach.

[smwwoody]

We dead stack and spray every layer with sta-brite from ISK Biocides.  Dead stacked pine can set for up to 2 weeks with no mold.  we mix it 100:1 with water and spray it with a demand pump through a car wash type set up.

http://www.loghelp.com/p-1001-sta-brite-p-biocide-5-gal.aspx

Woody

[Bogue Chitto]

I sell a lot of those 1x8x8 also David and have the same problem (South Louisiana). The only thing I have ever used is bleach.  One of my customer that buys the lumber makes furniture.  He said that a lot New Orleans people like the stain so I just keep him a stack of moldy boards. To much mold he runs them through a sander.

[PC-Urban-Sawyer]

David,

The nine foot wide stacks surely have a lot to do with the problem. I believe you need to redesign your stacks and use MUCH narrower stacks, 48" max and probably 42" would be even better. And provide separation between the stacks. Align the stacks so that prevailing winds move though the stacks (side to side) parallel to the stickers.

Good Luck!

Herb

[Tree Feller]

I have a pile of FRESH sawdust I dump everyday in a pile away from the mill. Why does the pile of fresh sawdust not mold deep inside? Deep inside the pile it gets NO air. Shouldn't mold be present there? It's not.

Just wondering.

Most fungi are obligate aerobes...they need oxygen to grow. No oxygen = no mold.

[NMFP]

There is no to little oxygen in the middle of your sawdust pile.  Therefore, the microorganisms need feed and oxygen to grow, not just one of the variables but 2.  This is the same as you put a post in water and it rots off at the water line.  Not above or below.  The wood under water is free of axygen so the bacteria cannot feed and above water line, there is oxygen and food source but must commonly, the airflow keeps the moisture level too low in the wood for an organism to effectively feed.

Does this seem to clear up the situation.

On another note, you can use box fans but becareful!  They will produce laminar air flow and not turbulant because of being in an open environment.  Laminar air flow is like the air flow on the wing of an air plane.  Turbulant air flow is a circular pattern.  Meaning, laminar air flow if you have a lot of heat beside a pack of lumber, you will effectively move the hot air directly across the face of the lumber, moving spores from one board to the other.  Turbulant air flow will move the same heat, but in a circular pattern across the lumber.  You will also have spore movement but......the chances of those spores dropping on the next board are reduced greatly.

Sorry for the simpified version but not liking to type is a reason for simplified.  I teach this stuff to my students but we go into a lot more details and scientific experiments.

[SCsawdawg]

David,
I'm in the Rock Hill area too.  Now that the temps are in the 100s and that humidity is up there too, my pine is that pretty "Carolina blue" color as well.  I'm thinking about charging extra ;D.  You wouldn't be talking about Nichols store by any chance because that place is beautiful.
Generally speaking most of my customers are building sheds and barns so it usually not a problem for me, but I must admit I've learned a great deal from this post and am very happy you asked the question.

[POSTON WIDEHEAD]

David,
I'm in the Rock Hill area too.  Now that the temps are in the 100s and that humidity is up there too, my pine is that pretty "Carolina blue" color as well.  I'm thinking about charging extra ;D.  You wouldn't be talking about Nichols store by any chance because that place is beautiful.
Generally speaking most of my customers are building sheds and barns so it usually not a problem for me, but I must admit I've learned a great deal from this post and am very happy you asked the question.

Sawdawg, The store above my house is NIVEN'S on hwy. 5. Darren's place does look GREAT inside and out. My buddy John that was killed a few weeks ago, sawed a lot of Cedar for Nichol's Store.
And like you, I have learned a lot from my thread also!
Oh, by the way.......106 degrees this coming Saturday!  8)

[Cypressstump]

Oh, by the way.......106 degrees this coming Saturday!  8)

Catching a bit of a cold snap eh?

Our humidity is 90% and heat index of 104. just lovely !

[snowshoveler]

Hmmm...70 maybe 75 here and my pine will get that very special and highly valued blue too.
Just learn to market it different.I think someone here suggested calling it denim pine and that it is value added.
You normally have to charge more for it.
Chris

[dblair]

my friends have lots of wood stacked and they always put inch or better between the boards  so the air flows bottom up  . what do you think , maybe ?  on the other hand what works in Va. maybe not in S.C.  for instance tobacco in Va. will age in unconditioned warehouse  without mold in Ga. it molds .

[Ianab]

The humidity is the main issue.

We have problems with pine moulding like that too, with average humidity around 80% year round, and pushing 100 at times. Airflow might help, but you are pushing damp air into the stack, so drying is limited, and you can't get it dry on the surface  before mould starts.

Things that help.

Where you stack it.  One trick is to stack it up on a hill, where the wind and sun gets at it.  Not always practical, but better than  in the shade and shelter.

Get it into a kiln. Straight into a kiln and get it heated and dry right away. Pine can be dried as fast as your kiln will allow.

Spray it with an anti-sapstain chemical. It's only got to inhibit the mould for a few weeks until the surface of the wood gets dry enough.

While the way you are stacking does affect things as well, it may just be that no matter how you stack it, the mould is going to take hold to some extent. As the others have said, the spores are airborne, so they will take hold anywhere, and if conditions are correct, temp, water, sugar, oxygen and no chemicals to inhibit mould growth... then it grows.

Change even ONE of the parameters and you are OK.

Ian

[SCsawdawg]

David it is a small world indeed.  Mr. John's death was a great blow to me.  In fact, he taught me to saw, encouraged me to get my own mill, and was a true and dear friend.  The sawing community lost one of its best.  He set an example with his life that I hope I can come close to with mine.  My hats off to the sawyers who take the time to teach their trade to younger bucks like me.  He even taught me the bleach trick!  Are you the gentleman who is going to help Ms. Audrey sell his mill?  I was helping Mr. John work on it before he got sick. 

That's what I like about this forum.  People trying to help each other because they want to.

[POSTON WIDEHEAD]

David it is a small world indeed.  Mr. John's death was a great blow to me.  In fact, he taught me to saw, encouraged me to get my own mill, and was a true and dear friend.  The sawing community lost one of its best.  He set an example with his life that I hope I can come close to with mine.  My hats off to the sawyers who take the time to teach their trade to younger bucks like me.  He even taught me the bleach trick!  Are you the gentleman who is going to help Ms. Audrey sell his mill?  I was helping Mr. John work on it before he got sick. 

That's what I like about this forum.  People trying to help each other because they want to.

John was a good one Sawdawg. Like you, I worked on that mill many times. And yes, gonna try to help Ms. Audrey sell it. Woodmizer just did a service on it in April. Somebody will get a pretty good saw.

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Good points Ian. I have tried the fan but just blowing hot, humid air, it seems the mold grew just as fast.
I don't have any hills on the place.....but I got a bull dozer.  :D Might build one.


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Now believe this or not, I was reading these replies an hour ago and a Lady called wanting 30 boards. She and her husband are going to build some kind of small wall in their bedroom. They're from Texas and want a western look on a small wall. They just now left. When they went to load the boards I had to open my BIG MOUTH and start trying to explain about the mold. I talked for 10 minutes giving reason I can't control mold. He finally said he was a wood worker and he's seen it for years when it comes to Pine. He said all he had to do was run a belt sander over it and the mold would be gone. He's coming back with his trailer Sat. to get more.

Things that make you go ummmm!  say_what

[WDH]

The mold and mildew that turns the outside of the board black and the fungus that stains the interior of the wood that nice blue color are different critters.