Considering a career in Forestry.....

[Tom]

Good Show, Brandon!

Work and study hard when you get in.  I want to see you succeed.

[BrandonTN]

Thanks again, Tom.  You've been instrumental in the massively, sometimes overly complicated operation that is the making up of my mind.  ;D

Cheers to the Forestry Forum in general!!!

[Phorester]

You won't be sorry.

[Ron Scott]

Great! Put your mind to it and you will do fine. I had to take several non-credit classes at night and on week-ends that were required for college entrance with better grades also.

If I hadn't been a Korean war veteran, I wouldn't have been accepted at all. ;)

[WDH]

Good luck Brandon.  Study hard!

[BrandonTN]

Phorester, Ron S., WDH.....thank you, sirs! I'll be continuing to learn from you guys via this board for a long time, hopefully.

[WDH]

And we'll be learning from you too.  A person has to keep learning.  Your education doesn't end with the "book learning".  Carry on the torch.  We need that because the world is an ever complicated place.  Forestry will be even more important function as we utilize our natural resources to improve the lives of people why at the same time as we conserve our right to do so.

[BrandonTN]

A bit discouraged...(just a little.  )  My co-worker's boyfriend's father is a forester in Alabama, and last week I told her I am going to forestry school this Fall.  Apparently, she asked her boyfriend about forestry in the meantime and reported to me smugly  that "Forester's make even less money than graphic designers.  My boyfriend said there are more people than jobs."

Help.

[Ron Wenrich]

So what.  When I graduated there were no jobs.  You needed a Masters and military credit just to get a Technicians job. My class had 69 graduates, and only 5 had jobs at graduation.

What became of the rest?  A couple are professors, a couple became consultants, one of them owned a sawmill, a few became loggers.  Some never set foot into the woods or worked with wood after graduation.  But, few would not have taken the journey. 

All college can do is give you an education.  They can teach you stuff, but they can't live your life.  You have to make it what you want.  If you want to do forestry work, then do it. 

As for the money, yes, some of the guys don't make much.  But, that's a choice.  I know guys who did real well, and some who didn't .  Its all what you make it.

[WDH]

Remember what Tom said.  Life is short.  Do what you want to do.  You can't take the money with you when you expire.  Foresters do OK.  IIt has been great for me.  My oldest daughter is in graduate school (Forestry) and I can't express how proud I am of her. 

[Pilot]

My graduating class was similar to Ron Wenrich's--about 63 graduated and only 3 had jobs right out of school, but a few months later, everyone I heard about had a job--but I didn't hear about everyone.  That was in '75.  I was ex-military and had a BA in Political Science and a BS & MS in Forestry and was the only one to get 2 job offers, one with the USDA Forest Service, which I took.

Move on a few years and affirmative action kicked in.  If you were not a female or minority, kiss off working for the feds.  One couple I worked with, she was an average student, he was an A student; she was hired right out of school, he had to work as a technician for a few years before he got on as a professional forester.  A woman who worked for me barely graduated from forestry school, had several D's and was hired right out of college (I didn't do the hiring, she was reassigned to me when she couldn't cut it in another department).  I could go on.  The point is, don't count on a job with the feds.  Even if you are an affirmative action candidate, they aren't hiring many people theses days in the northwest--they are still cutting back.

Private industry hiring ebbs and flows with the economy.  If you get laid off, it will be when no one else is hiring.

On the positive side, I loved my forestry work.  Before I became a district silviculturist, I was in charge of reforestation and we planted about 2200 acres a year.  You drive thru the district and see all those trees growing and know they are there because of what you did, it gives you a great feeling. District silviculturist was also a great job.  I never found a higher level job I wanted because everyone above me was tied to a desk.

So, given those dreary facts about finding and keeping a job, work out some strategy to deal with the uncertainties and realities.  Here are just a few ideas. 

Be an A student.  Be sure to get summer work that is in forestry, and better yet, get a different kind of job each summer.  There's no substitute for experience.  And, some of our summer workers eventually got on permanent, full time with the agency.  Being known as smart, hard workers made the difference.

Teaching forestry at the college level is probably more secure, if you can get hired.  While working on your degree, talk to your profs about what it takes to get hired to teach, if you are interested in that.

State agencies may not be so tied to affirmative action? 

Given concerns about global warming and the growing interests in carbon credits, there may be some opportunities coming along there n a few years. 

Have a fallback skill you could market at any time, unrelated to the housing market so you won't starve if you get laid off.  If you have a family, you gotta have money.

Talk to industry people who do the hiring about which schools are best.  When I was in forestry school, a fad had spread thru the college community for backing off the hard core subjects.  Consequently you could graduate from UC Berkeley without a course in dendrology (tree species identification).  Can you imagine a forester who can't tell the difference between a Douglas-fir and a noble fir?  At that time, only a few western schools still had rigorous programs--Humboldt in California and OSU in Oregon being notable exceptions to the fad.  The big name eastern schools such as Harvard, had gone with the fad.

If you want to work for industry, I suspect most of the jobs go to forest engineering majors, but that is just my guess.  Probably more true in the west.

Be mobile, especially if you work for industry.  You gotta be willing to go where the jobs are.

While you are in forestry school, make friends with those in classes ahead of you and keep in contact with them after they graduate.  They can let you know about how they got hired, who is hiring, what it took to get hired, etc.  If there is a forestry club, participate in that for the same reason.

Those are just some ideas from one who has been there, at least with one agency.  Other people's experiences are probably different and as times change opportunities and challenges change, so some of the foregoing may no longer be true.

Getting that first job will be your greatest challenge.  But as a friend told me once when I told him about my concerns before going to forestry school, "There are always opportunities for good people."  So be a good people & you'll probably do OK.

Richard Scott
Retired silviculturist

[BrandonTN]

Welcome to the board, Pilot!  Thanks for the info, too.  I'll try to be a good people.
Ron, you nailed it: the journey is what it's all about.
WDH, thanks again.

As of right now, I'm admitted to the school; just registered for orientation for May 18th.  Over the weekend, I took out the school catalog and assembled my class schedule as well as I could.  I'm psyched!!!!!!  8) ;D :P

I have a buddy who is a restoration ecologist (restores native species) who owns a nursery and lives near Nashville.  I'm gonna work part-time with him this Spring on the weekends when I can.  Maybe I'll gain some kind of experience there.

[BrandonTN]

Well, I just got back from orientation at UT today.  Registered for classes, picked out an apartment, and visited the agriculture campus.

I'm on my way!!!  8) :P :P :P :P :P :P 

;)

[WDH]

 8) 8) 8)

I had the opportunity to attend Total Quality and Designed Experiment classes there a while back, and it was a blast.  I really liked the campus.  I guess we are now rivals :. 

[Riles]

Tuition and fees: $12,184
Gas for commuting 27,000 miles in the car and 13,000 on the Harley: $3300
Nanny to watch the kids while Dad plays college student again: $22,000

Forester's logo under your name on the The Forestry Forum: Priceless!

It was a group effort, thanks guys.

BSF, La Tech, 2007

[BrandonTN]

Riles, Ha ha ha ha haha!!! :D :D  Congrats, man!


WDH....rivals help each other try harder, so it is good.  ;D

[WDH]

Congrats Riles 8).

[jon12345]

Thank god for grant and scholarship when I went and I dont even get a cool logo  :D :D

Congrats Riles.

[Riles]

Yup, that's my third degree and Uncle Sam paid for most of all three.

This fits right in to this thread. You're never too late to consider a career in forestry.

Of course, I'm 45 and looking for an entry level forestry job now...

[BrandonTN]

How goes the job hunt, Riles?   btw, what area of forestry did you 'specialize' in within(or outside) your major, Riles?  As for now, my plan is to fill my elective credits with journalism classes....but I also yet haven't discussed this at length w/ any forestry professors.   

[WDH]

A journalistic environmentalistic Forester?

[SwampDonkey]

There are quite a few foresters that write for 'Atlantic Forestry' magazine. There must be some like magazines in the US where a forester could contribute. And writing is something that is a must. I've read some reports from some new graduates and they could use some good writing classes. Although, as I recall you are writing at least a couple of reports a week for assignments. It's not just writing for the sake of writing, but it's your analytical skills and being able to get that info down on paper that is critical. You could be the best writer out there but get poor grades on your assignments and the guy that recognizes what's going on in his lab exorcise and puts it to paper will triump. That's the difference between drivel and actually 'getting it'.  ;)

[Riles]

No job yet. Still getting settled into the new digs here in NC. (Got my flag updated, still need to move my tree on the big map). Waiting on a call from the state about my application for a service forester-in-training position, they have an opening at the district office a couple miles down the road.

Already picked up the tractor, got the forks based on advice from the forum. Been bush-hogging and moving downed cedars into a pile pending the delivery of the skillmill. Got the rails last week, but UPS lost the sawhead. (Seems someone else got a sawhead but UPS lost the rails. Hmmm.) Captain and crew have another one on the way, so I may be cutting this weekend.

Got a good look at the trees on the farm, and I'm ready to take up mass murder of deer. They really put a hurtin' on the oak seedlings.

Dang, I'm working too hard to get a job!

[BrandonTN]

Yeah, SD I imagine the challenging part will be the understanding what I'm writing about as a whole, rather than the actual activity of writing. 

As of right now, I'd like to work for the Forest Service.  I just watched The Greatest Good dvd, and am inspired.  But I suppose any forestry work will be good.  I want to work in a position where I can learn more and more, on the job,  firsthand about timber management...learning is my goal.

[Phorester]

If you haven't already done it Brandon, join your State Forestry Association if you have one.  Suscribe to forestry and wildlife related magazines such as are put out by some State Associations, Forestry or Game Depts, private forest industries.  Go to landowner forestry courses, tours, etc.  Get just more than a structured educational education.  If you can, go out a day or so with game biologists, USFS foresters, State Foresters, consulting foresters, procurement foresters, loggers, foresters who manage industry forestland, forest nurserymen, arborists, etc., etc. Get a broad exposure to forestry.  Find out the compromises that have to be made between the interests of each, the biological, monetary, technological, etc.  limits as to what can actually be done in the woods.

As with all professions, my college education only gave me the basic understanding and underpinnings of actually learning about forestry and the environment.  My eyes were really opened in the first few months on the job right out of college. There has to be the knowledge and experience on how to transfer the "book learning" to real in-the-woods accomplishments. 

People skills are needed just as much as forest managment skills.  You have to be able to communicate forestry knowledge to people. Some will have a sincere love of the forest and all it's amenities. Others only want to exploit it.  Usually, neither know anything about biology, forest or wildlife management, etc.  You have to be able to figure out what people want and be able to persuade them to do what your knowledge and expertise say is the best thing to do in their woods to get what they want from the forest that they control.

It's frustrating and rewarding at the same time.