? Market for red maple, beech and black gum in S. Central PA

[Greyhound]

I have about 8 acres of forest that I would like to manage for oak and poplar, so I would like to thin out the red maple, beech and black gums from the understory.  Is there any monetary value in these trees?  Some are up to 18-20" dbh.  I may actually mill up a few of the biggest, straightest maples myself for lumber for personal use,  but 98% I'd be happy to sell off.  Thanks in advance for any input. 

[mike_belben]

don't cut any red maple until you've tried that first sip of syrup off them or you'll regret it when you finally do.  it is highly habit forming. 

[ehp]

is the red maple white in color or wormy and what color and size is the heart , good white red maple here is pretty much the same price as good red oak

[ehp]

never cut a black gum but have seen them , the forester will not make any of them so they are left 

[mike_belben]

Tupelo is rarely straight.  Makes good firewood but is often spiral grain and will jam a 4 way splitter. 

[ehp]

beech is pretty not a bad word here as most of it is dead with a hole in it , if sound I just cut timber logs out of it and send to the mill

[GAB]

don't cut any red maple until you've tried that first sip of syrup off them or you'll regret it when you finally do.  it is highly habit forming.

Maple syrup made with a blend of sugar maple and soft(or red)maple sap make a tasty syrup.
GAB

[mike_belben]

Mine are straight red maple and i just drank my 5th test shot a few minutes ago.. Its incredible and i should just cut to the chase and inject it cuz im hooked. 

[cutterboy]

I have sold a lot of red maple lumber over the years. I sell mostly to hobby woodworkers and some of them prefer red maple to hard maple. One customer told me he would never go back to hard maple because red maple works much more easily and looks the same as hard maple.


 

 

The beech is a harder wood than red maple and makes beautiful lumber. I sawed my first beech in 2017 and started selling the lumber in 2018. I sold out quickly so I sawed up more and am selling that now.


 
The sap wood has a buttery look to it.


 
The heart wood is a darker brown.


 

I would think there must be a market for both red maple and beech but I have no experience with gum.

Good luck to you.....Cutter

[livemusic]

I have about 8 acres of forest that I would like to manage for oak and poplar, so I would like to thin out the red maple, beech and black gums from the understory.  Is there any monetary value in these trees?  Some are up to 18-20" dbh.  I may actually mill up a few of the biggest, straightest maples myself for lumber for personal use,  but 98% I'd be happy to sell off.  Thanks in advance for any input.

I don't know but around here, even if you have trees of value, you will have one heckuva time finding a logger who will come and cut 'only' eight acres. The small loggers have disappeared here. A guy I went to highschool with who was a small logger is one of few left and he's not small. No telling how much money he has tied up in equipment... lots! Has to be million$. Multiple tractor trailer rigs, multiple skidder type machines, dozers, forwarders, big shops, a mill to make board road mats, etc. He's a great guy but my understanding is he only cuts larger tracts now; quite an operation now to just move all that stuff.

[Greyhound]

I have about 8 acres of forest that I would like to manage for oak and poplar, so I would like to thin out the red maple, beech and black gums from the understory.  Is there any monetary value in these trees?  Some are up to 18-20" dbh.  I may actually mill up a few of the biggest, straightest maples myself for lumber for personal use,  but 98% I'd be happy to sell off.  Thanks in advance for any input.

I don't know but around here, even if you have trees of value, you will have one heckuva time finding a logger who will come and cut 'only' eight acres. The small loggers have disappeared here. A guy I went to highschool with who was a small logger is one of few left and he's not small. No telling how much money he has tied up in equipment... lots! Has to be million$. Multiple tractor trailer rigs, multiple skidder type machines, dozers, forwarders, big shops, a mill to make board road mats, etc. He's a great guy but my understanding is he only cuts larger tracts now; quite an operation now to just move all that stuff.

You got that right!  No way any logger would touch such a small lot , actually 16 acres total, but ~8 that need to be thinned.  However, I'm working on trying to manage and harvest some lumber for personal use, some to sell and the rest for firewood.  I think I'll process the best of the red maples into lumber myself.  The lower grade maple, beech (no decent grade trees like above) will go to firewood.  Black gum is good for nothing, trash.

[mike_belben]

I dunno guys.. A reputable logger on this forum just told me a very substantial sum of money he paid on a 3 acre purchase.  


The timber dictates who will show up and what theyll pay. 

[Ron Scott]

I agree with what's been said about the taste of red maple syrup. Some of the best maple syrup that I've had came from a commercial 80 acre sugar bush that was all red maple.

[ehp]

I donot go by size of the woodlot , I go by tree types and can I make money doing the job . I cut lots of 5 acre woodlots and would say I cut 20 to 30 acre woodlots the most 

[SwampDonkey]

Mine are straight red maple and i just drank my 5th test shot a few minutes ago.. Its incredible and i should just cut to the chase and inject it cuz im hooked.

Good way to get the 'flying axe handles'. ;D

[mike_belben]

Is that like a hold my syrup and watch this sort of tradition i dont know about yet?

[livemusic]

I think I have read that red maple is the most common tree in the eastern USA. I have a bazillion of them and I am in Louisiana. I never knew red maple could make syrup. Does it require a cold climate? I wonder how far south anyone has ever made syrup.

EDIT: I have found two articles, one mentions North Carolina and one is in eastern Tennessee. Has to be below freezing at night. We get some of that, but apparently not enough. The TN guy mentioned using red maple as well.

North Carolina maple syrup

[mike_belben]

There are a handful of producing farms in TN.. Im still trying to figure out the season.  Have not got a gusher yet.  We are back into a cold spell now. 

[SwampDonkey]

Works with birches to, but they don't run as much and not as long a season. Different flavour since it is fructose. I made some, but takes a lot of boiling. I had a bot full of sap that made perhaps a 1/4 cup. :D

[SwampDonkey]

There are a handful of producing farms in TN.. Im still trying to figure out the season.  Have not got a gusher yet.  We are back into a cold spell now.

20's at night 40's by day. You have that window to work with unless your doing stuff like Chris is.

[SwampDonkey]

Maple anything is the most common tree here in New Brunswick. I can go into the woods and within seconds have my hands on a maple. You can find maple on a black spruce or white cedar clear cut if you want to. ;D

[SwampDonkey]

Is that like a hold my syrup and watch this sort of tradition i dont know about yet?

Google that phrase, and I bet it is in the top 3, if not than #1. Of course with Google shenanigans it may be more tailored to your historical searches. ;D

[mike_belben]

20's at night 40's by day. You have that window to work with unless your doing stuff like Chris is.

Ive had 2 weeks with those conditions and the max 1 day production so far has been 1 gallon over 21 taps.  My buddy in mass has 20 taps in sugar maples and will get 30-50 gallons when it hits, so we are playing by different rules that im still learning.   I havent found a local who has ever tapped to advise me on it.  



Another peculiar thing is some trees dont produce anything when they should and the others are drooling.  Then when nothing should happen, the dud is the only one drooling.  I dont get it.   


Man obeys nature, nature doesnt obey man.  

[mudfarmer]

Is it the same site conditions for dud vs gushers?

When we tap on a north slope the trees will not start pumping until much later than the southern exposure slopes for instance. Some trees in the steep valleys get hours less sun per day than those upslope or on top of the ridges and that will make a huge difference as well, that sort of thing.

If it's all the same, well then, what you said ;D

[mike_belben]

Well.. I guess theyre are micro differences.  My place is a ripple so i have multi faced slopes not far from each other.  Ill pay more attention and report in a syrup thread if theres any rhyme to it

[HousewrightVA]

I am tapping all reds in central VA. On buckets some trees will run well and others might as well be telephone poles. Put everything on vacuum and everything runs. If you have good slope 3/16 lines do well.

[chep]

A major factor that lots of people forget about in maple sap runs is length of daylight. Trees do not wake up just because the temps are right. (If there is a long stretch then they may), but they are genetically programmed to react to sun light. When the days get longer they begin to stretch/yawn and prepare for the hard work of nutrient/sugar transport to the new leaf sites. 
 I would say even with your southern location Mike, that your trees are not quite ready. I bet February is much more productive for you.

[foresterdj]

Just a thought on red maple, some have curled figure in the sapwood and make excellent rifle stocks. I know of at least one rifle manufacturer in PA who is always on the lookout for good red maple. Any harvest should try to sort for these trees (ones with curl or other unique grain pattern), may as well sort out and market for the best use.

[B.C.C. Lapp]

I cut any where from 30 to 100 red maple logs a day. Sort them?  Ain't realistic.

[Mbunten]

Another peculiar thing is some trees dont produce anything when they should and the others are drooling.  Then when nothing should happen, the dud is the only one drooling.  I dont get it.  

Mike, you just described sugaring to a T! We tap both sugar and reds.  I've actually tested individual trees and found a few reds with a higher sugar content than sugar maples.