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Author Topic: Uniformly Loaded Beam Overhanging One Support  (Read 1142 times)

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Offline Sedgehammer

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Uniformly Loaded Beam Overhanging One Support
« on: April 30, 2021, 07:35:39 AM »
Putting in a big beam for my barn build. it'll hold up the upstairs and and over hanging balcony that has 4' of it unsupported. Least wise that's what I am wanting. The area that this covers is 20 deep x 32 wide. The balcony is 4 additional depth and still 32' wide. A SYP beam that has one support at the 19' mark only needs to be a 10x14, yet to over hang it 4' unsupported if my cypherin is correct needs to be a 12x18. Is my cypherin wrong? 

Thanks

Offline Sedgehammer

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Re: Uniformly Loaded Beam Overhanging One Support
« Reply #1 on: April 30, 2021, 07:57:13 AM »
I'm trying to get by using one post. If I need to go to 2, then i'll not overhang. Thus the fuss.

Offline mike_belben

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Re: Uniformly Loaded Beam Overhanging One Support
« Reply #2 on: April 30, 2021, 10:42:02 AM »
Im not exactly picturing it. But can you brace the overhang back into the post that the beam is on?
Psalm 37:16

Online Don P

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Re: Uniformly Loaded Beam Overhanging One Support
« Reply #3 on: April 30, 2021, 11:45:46 AM »
Ditto, full drawings needed. People tend to forget, a brace puts a side buckling load on an already end loaded post. Push down on a yardstick from the end. Now while doing that also push on it from the side. That complex combined interaction equation is a whole other level of fun and depending on the slenderness ratio of the post often results in "don't do it".
The future is a foreign country, they will do things differently there - Simon Winchester

Offline mike_belben

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Re: Uniformly Loaded Beam Overhanging One Support
« Reply #4 on: April 30, 2021, 01:58:03 PM »
Double the post.  Truss the post.  Add another member in a Г + /  configuration all the way to the ground with plywood sides to form a monocoque structure. Or make it a steel beam.  


A poor guy woulda had this built from pallet wood already cmawn.  ;D
Psalm 37:16

Offline Sedgehammer

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Re: Uniformly Loaded Beam Overhanging One Support
« Reply #5 on: April 30, 2021, 05:23:57 PM »
This is all exposed. Post be a 12x12 or a matching post to beam. 

I'll try and do some drawings, but they'll prolly be later after ballgames. I'll try and splain it betters now

Total length on beam is 24'6". The 6" is buried in north wall. Beam runs south 24'. Post is at the 19' mark. This beam is in the middle of a 20' deep (north/south) X 32' wide (east/west) kitchen and dining room. Above this beam is the 3x12x16'6" floor joists 2" OC that are under the 2 upstairs bedrooms. The 4' over hanging balcony is south side of the bedrooms. 

Offline Sedgehammer

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Re: Uniformly Loaded Beam Overhanging One Support
« Reply #6 on: May 01, 2021, 07:35:33 AM »
Pictorial of the drawing





 

Offline Tom King

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Re: Uniformly Loaded Beam Overhanging One Support
« Reply #7 on: May 01, 2021, 08:42:31 AM »
I have almost always used a steel flitch plate for cantilevers.  One can be hidden inside two beams.

Offline Sedgehammer

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Re: Uniformly Loaded Beam Overhanging One Support
« Reply #8 on: May 01, 2021, 08:52:20 AM »
Yeah, i used that on my old farm house remodel years ago. needed the ceiling height, so used i think 5, 2x8 and put a thin plate betwix them all. worked great.

I could use 2 beams, but prefer one. The 10" x 14" SYP beam i can order is about $1,250 dried. I can get a green one much cheaper, but prefer not the hassle of the green build. I can also make the SYP beam bigger. I can also buy some reclaimed, but they are darn expensive. around $2,700 for a 12" x 15"

Offline mike_belben

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Re: Uniformly Loaded Beam Overhanging One Support
« Reply #9 on: May 01, 2021, 12:24:50 PM »
For wide span doorways my dad would sister a pair a 2x lumber with a steel flat plate bolted in tbe center rather than plywood to shim for thickness.  No sag or sheetrock cracks 20yrs later. 
Psalm 37:16

Offline Sedgehammer

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Re: Uniformly Loaded Beam Overhanging One Support
« Reply #10 on: May 02, 2021, 12:26:29 PM »
Ditto, full drawings needed. People tend to forget, a brace puts a side buckling load on an already end loaded post. Push down on a yardstick from the end. Now while doing that also push on it from the side. That complex combined interaction equation is a whole other level of fun and depending on the slenderness ratio of the post often results in "don't do it".
knock, knock if ya ain't too busy

Online Don P

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Re: Uniformly Loaded Beam Overhanging One Support
« Reply #11 on: May 02, 2021, 12:30:36 PM »
I was politely thinking, "that bunch of chicken scratches ain't goin on the fridge". I can't make heads or tails of it. Back out and draw more of the footprint, surrounding walls, you've lost me.
The future is a foreign country, they will do things differently there - Simon Winchester

Offline Sedgehammer

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Re: Uniformly Loaded Beam Overhanging One Support
« Reply #12 on: May 02, 2021, 01:01:08 PM »
I was politely thinking, "that bunch of chicken scratches ain't goin on the fridge". I can't make heads or tails of it. Back out and draw more of the footprint, surrounding walls, you've lost me.
Alrighty

Oh you're fine. Frankness is best although I don't know frank......

Be later, at ball games

Offline mike_belben

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Re: Uniformly Loaded Beam Overhanging One Support
« Reply #13 on: May 02, 2021, 04:10:44 PM »
I cant tell if its a ground view or a birdseye view. 
Psalm 37:16

Offline Sedgehammer

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Re: Uniformly Loaded Beam Overhanging One Support
« Reply #14 on: May 02, 2021, 04:15:20 PM »
I was politely thinking, "that bunch of chicken scratches ain't goin on the fridge". I can't make heads or tails of it. Back out and draw more of the footprint, surrounding walls, you've lost me.
Heres ya goes. Was able to get this done

They won again, so one more game at 4

Anyways, the yellow is what will be up upstairs. Orange is the beam

Floor joists are 3x12 2' OC
Proposed beam is 10x14x24 SYP




Offline Sedgehammer

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Re: Uniformly Loaded Beam Overhanging One Support
« Reply #15 on: May 02, 2021, 04:17:08 PM »
I cant tell if its a ground view or a birdseye view.
 birdy

Online Don P

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Re: Uniformly Loaded Beam Overhanging One Support
« Reply #16 on: May 02, 2021, 11:08:40 PM »
"Plan view"

And that is why we use drawings, that is nothing like what the word pictures had conjured up in my head. Don't try to describe stuff, draw it and draw it well.

Tributary area supported by the beam is highlighted within the red box;
 

 

Trib width would be 16' x 50psf (40LL+10DL) = 800 lbs per lineal foot load on the beam.

This calc;
https://forestryforum.com/members/donp/oerhangbm.htm

You're cutting it mighty fine in #1SYP
The future is a foreign country, they will do things differently there - Simon Winchester

Offline Sedgehammer

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Re: Uniformly Loaded Beam Overhanging One Support
« Reply #17 on: May 03, 2021, 12:12:28 AM »
"Plan view"

And that is why we use drawings, that is nothing like what the word pictures had conjured up in my head. Don't try to describe stuff, draw it and draw it well.

Tributary area supported by the beam is highlighted within the red box;
 
(Image hidden from quote, click to view.)
 

Trib width would be 16' x 50psf (40LL+10DL) = 800 lbs per lineal foot load on the beam.

This calc;
https://forestryforum.com/members/donp/oerhangbm.htm

You're cutting it mighty fine in #1SYP
Yup, that all be correct

Makes it all like easy. No confusing what someone thinks they spellin and what someone thinks they readin.......

passes by 5% if I include the post area span of 234"

passes by 20% if i don't include post area span of 12", since that area isn't spanned

seems since you mentioned skinny (well ok, you didn't say that directly, but you're not talking beauty ;D), that the post area should be included.......?

what % over do you consider is 'healthy'

Thanks

Online Don P

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Re: Uniformly Loaded Beam Overhanging One Support
« Reply #18 on: May 03, 2021, 07:14:38 AM »
A pass is good, just watch the material quality. For kicks try an LVL... Fb 2800, E 2.0, Fv 280. Each ply of an LVL is 1-3/4" thick, 11.875 tall or 14" tall
The future is a foreign country, they will do things differently there - Simon Winchester

Online moodnacreek

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Re: Uniformly Loaded Beam Overhanging One Support
« Reply #19 on: May 03, 2021, 07:57:44 AM »
I got an overhung beam [shed type roof] sitting on 2 posts, reaching way out to hold up this roof, no post. I was afraid if snow stayed up there it could tip and fail so I hung a barrel of concrete on the back. The beam is steel tube. 


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