More firewood ?'s

Timberwerks · July 10, 2004, 05:42:42 AM

Sorry for all the questions but I'm new to this.

What lengths should I cut my logs to? My market will be fire places and wood stoves so I'm thinking 16" or 24".

I know a cord is 4x4x8. If I have three rows of 16" logs will the face of that stack be a face cord or is half the stack a face cord?

I quess what I need is for someone to explain how the wood should be sold.

Thanks again
Dale

Bro. Noble · July 10, 2004, 07:40:05 AM

A face cord is 4' high, 8' long, by whatever length you cut it.

In Misssouri, it's not legal to advertise firewood in measurememts other than cords--------probably because face cord isn't an exact measurement and is often not understood.

Either 24 or 16 inch wood should sell well. Experience will tell you what the demand is.

Make your packages clean and attractive for those upscale fireplaces. My father-in-law told about being at a lumberyard one time where they were cutting wood lath into short lengths. Some rich dude was buying it for kindling :

beenthere · July 10, 2004, 08:56:58 AM

Timberwerks
Bro-Noble filled you in well with the cord question. If me, I would go with the 16" (a customer who wants 24" can use 16, but a customer who wants 16, can't use 24"). I cut 18" and get remarks a lot about my extra long wood :

, but I only cut to burn for myself.

An area man has made a niche market business for about 25 years selling birch firewood in a Chicago area market. He has ended up with only white birch because it burns fairly quick, dries fairly rapidly, and is available locally (may have some trucked in too). He is an 'inventive' man, always been looking for shortcuts, and ways to get a final product with less effort. Continuous kiln drying was one venture, but now puts all his wood in crates about 3x3x3', stacked 2-3 high and in long rows for air drying. He then bundles after drying (not sure if same size bundles or varying size) and I am not sure what retail outlets he supplies in Chicago.
He received complaints from customers if adding other species of wood to the birch. Seems the 'elite' customers want just enough wood to make one fire in the fireplace, and want it to go out (not have a piece of oak or hickory in there that keeps burning) at an expected time. Just a single species allows him to have better control of the drying schedule too, I believe. And white birch has some 'appeal' to it as well.
Just passing on extra info, in case you can use any of it.

Bro. Noble · July 10, 2004, 10:42:06 AM

The term 'rank' is used locally more than face cord, but is interchangable.

Beenthere's comments on birch reminded me of one of my grandad's fireplaces. He kept a few pieces of birch in the fireplace all summer to look at. When the weather turned cool, he would store the birch away and burn oak. Those few birch sticks were probably older than me. It probably came out of someones yard since it only grows here as an ornamental. :D

beenthere · July 10, 2004, 11:21:04 AM

Bro.Noble
Exactly what I do.

I have 6 white birch logs that I cut in 1968, and have 'stored' them in the rec room fireplace every summer since. They get moved to my shop when the weather cools in Sept. and stay there until late in May.

"rank" Haven't heard that term, but have rick and rack, which sometimes have local interpretation and meaning.

bennelson · July 10, 2004, 01:58:06 PM

I have a firewood company in the chicago area and around here the norm is 16 to 18 inches. Face cord is the most commonly used term but every now and again someone asks for a rick. I aint seen a clear definition of a rick yet and they differ every where you go. Try stacking 3 or 4 4x8 facecord racks and counting them take the average and go by a rough count. 4x8 of big logs will be a lot less count than 4x8 of smaller logs. Doing it this way and doing a rough count of logs at a delivery will alleviate worries of amount given to the customers.

Haytrader · July 10, 2004, 04:42:53 PM

I always understood a stack of wood 2' (could be 16" and up) x 4' x 8' was a rick and 4' x 4' x 8' (or two rick) is a cord.

dave7191 · July 12, 2004, 04:10:01 PM

I would think you need to check the area We"re about 30 miles north of Springfield,Mo and if i am cutting to sell there i would cut 18 to 20 in if i'm coming to Springfield it will be 16
there are just to many of those fire place inserts that need 16" wood
Dave

SwampDonkey · July 12, 2004, 04:21:33 PM

Bro Noble:

We also use the same terminology, rank, face cord and so on. Some unsuspecting folk think they are getting a full cord with those face cords, but they don't understand what their getting.

ADfields · July 12, 2004, 07:41:29 PM

A rick is a half cord or 2'x4'x8' by my Websters, and that is what I have always been told. I don't find nothing about a rank of wood in Websters, new one to me. ??? I sell by the stacked cubic foot (as it sits on the truck), a cord (4x4x8 ) is 128 cubic foot. I show the buyer before I unload and make sure they understand that it will come up different every time you re-stack it, but this right hear is the amount of wood they get for the money. ;) I will sell 1/4, 1/2 or hole cords (all by the foot) but I charge more for the small orders, last year it was $55 for a 1/4, $85 for a 1/2 and $135 a cord delivered 5 miles. I have a "you" pick it up at my place price, a delivered price and I add for packing it around to the back yard then add more to stack it! Every time you handle it takes much longer and to load it up, then toss it off, pack it around back, then stack it is more work then it was to cut and split in the first place so I need to get paid for it. :-/ I have never made much money from firewood but it gives us a good Christmas every year. ;) Got to go now, I have 3 cords of logs sitting on my trailer to buck and split tonight before sundown (thats about 1am hear in Alaska ;D). :

Good luck!
Andy

rebocardo · July 12, 2004, 09:01:26 PM

I have found 14" to 16" and about 4 inches across the best for most people. Though noone complains about the 12" either. On really big logs about 24 dbh, I cut it 12" long so it is easier to lift into my truck.trailer for splitting later.

People with smaller stoves can not handle anything bigger then 14-16". I always get "talk" from big fireplace owners that want big logs, though they never want to put a deposit down on a cord cut big and since it is a lot harder to split a 24" log by hand then a 14" I cut them all on the small size.

SwampDonkey · July 13, 2004, 03:50:20 AM

I bet you stove wood guys run into all kinds. My grandfather used to cut and hall wood to town and there was this one lady he got wood for that he never forgot. The woman came to the window as grandfather came up the drive with the wood and asked him to through it down cellar and pile it. Well she was a known shiester and he went in for the money and she said some fella she was with stole all her money. So he never got any pay. It was also in depression years and he pretty much knew she didn't have anything to start with. He used to haul wood for the church and the natives on the reserve where he always got his pay. It was the folks in town or neighbors he had most troubles with.

ADfields · July 13, 2004, 05:11:27 PM

Don't take but one time of getting stiffed for me to get Wise and get paid before I unload!!! ;) ;) A fella got me and my brother for 6 cords way back when we was kids. >:( Odd thing happened, a bit after that all that wood burnt along with his haystack we put the wood next to. ;) Teen age boys will be boys, not a good plan to rip off a week of their work. :-/ He called the Sheriff's office and they just laughed at him over it, they all knew what went on as we had called them over getting ripped off. But I ain't real proud of it today. :

Andy

bennelson · July 13, 2004, 05:28:51 PM

Cash up front is deffinately a must. We were servicing a campgrounds firewood needs on a credit basis and 60 days after invoicing they said they were not going to pay. That just aint right. We had some fun in there and are still working on getting our money back.

Timberwerks · July 13, 2004, 07:17:52 PM

Thanks for all the feedback everyone. I will make sure I get paid up front. What do you think a fair price is for delivery? Also stacking?

Thanks

bennelson · July 13, 2004, 08:10:46 PM

We deliver and stack for free. Extra time but it is an edge in the market. Sumthin to think bout. Places round here do like a radius from their shop. 10 miles 15 dollars farther 20. Add on ten to fifteen for stacking(more if you dont want to do it, occasionly youll get a taker) and your profit margin just went up.

Rancher · July 14, 2004, 02:50:51 PM

I hate to repeat everything but I will a little bit. Around here I have found that if I stay 14-16" it will nearly everybodys needs. Just like milled lumber,being honest and generous as well as consistant keeps them coming back for more. I would rather give someone two sticks than to short them one. Word-of-mouth will kill business fast in a small community.
I'm asked if I give a discount to multiple cord orders and I tell them no. I give the best price to everyone. Peole appreciate the honesty enough that I've never had anyone try to argue the point.
My 2 cents worth

Dave