Help with a dig pattern.

[Jeff]

I've got a leak. It may be an old unknown by me, shallower over flow. My overflow never got used.

[Old Greenhorn]

Could it just be seepage through that end that looks like a dike? The seepage is wicked on my neighbors pond when the water hits a certain level. I had to drop the spillway level to keep it below that.

[oldgraysawyer]

I've got a leak. It may be an old unknown by me, shallower over flow. My overflow never got used.

Jeff, a buddy of mine built a nice little pond and whenever the water level reached a certain place it slowly began seeping and always went down to about the same place and stayed there until almost full again. He eventually dug it out and let it dry out and if I remember right he put down about a foot or foot and half of good clay liner and has not had any issues since. He said he found a spot a little below the lower level of the water line there was a spot that appeared to be the issue. It was the weight of the full level that triggered the weakest spot to begin leaking.

So the hydrostatic pressure at full was compressing the area that would allow the leak. You may have a similar issue and may never find it unless you go down the same rabbit hole he did. But every time it would go down he was out trying to find the leak to no avail. 

Good Luck in your "rabbit huntin'"

[doc henderson]

being a new pond that has not had much water at that level, it may just need to seal itself off.  you could get some clay/bentonite and add it to the soil at the higher levels.  at least at that level, ir there is a low spot you should be able to see it.  I saw some ruts, but I assume those are from run in, not run out.

[Jeff]

I think it may be roots. I cut several aspens off that bank when I first started clearing that old pond out. I can see where it is flowing out but not exactly, of a mass of brush and clay  on the shallow end of the dike. 

[doc henderson]

I have been told that duck poop will seal off a pond.  but they also dig along the sides and tear it down and silt in the pond.  and the ones trained to poop where the leaks are, do not come cheap.  

[SwampDonkey]

Glacial water filtered and unfiltered.    The Meziadin meets the Nass.



The water in the lake is icey blue as the silt settles out, that settled out lake water feeds the creek. Around here the water is either like black coffee or as clear as tap water. The dark stuff comes out of bogs, the clear stuff is spring fed.

[aigheadish]

The previous owners planted trees every 30 or so feet on the far side of my pond and I'm fairly positive that their roots are causing some of my leaks as well. I don't know that mine has ever really held water. They used to use creek water to fill it. I've got a pump to try that myself but haven't yet. The creek is full of mud, from running off the farm field across the street. My assumption is that my pond with fill with silt and dirt if I pump much in from there. If I got a big 250 gallon tote or whatever size they are I could fill it from farther down the creek, where it clears up but it'd take a lot of trips to empty the tote into the pond. Otherwise I'd need several hundred feet of hose and probably a much more robust pump.

Here's the latest picture of mine, yours looks way nicer Jeff.

[Jeff]

The pond filled back up yesterday, and my well guy got me a smoking deal on 500lbs of Sodium Bentonite. Looks like the conditions should be perfect to take care of my leak/seep

[21incher]

How you going to drain the pond to apply it ?

[Jeff]

I don't need to. I am going to use the sprinkle method. I need the water level above the line at which it leaks, but little incoming water, and little wind. Im hoping all of those conditions come together in the next couple days. The exiting water,  will take the bentonite with it, collecting other suspended particles and swelling over 15 time it size sealing off the leak Thats the theory.  Dave, one of the well guys, just helped his dad seal up some muskrat holes. He filled me in on his techniques.

[aigheadish]

From everything I've read the sprinkling method is supposed to work really well. Can I ask what a smoking deal is for that? My initial looks, years ago lead me to believe I'd need tons of it. 

I ought to consider that option as well, but I'd like to dig down several more feet before I did. 

[Jeff]

I said smoking in comparison to everything I found on line.  The cheapest I found was 50 for 50lb  bag plus delivery.  I got this for $20 a 50lb bag, no shipping, in fact they backed up to my truck in my driveway, and delivered the 10 bags right to the back of my truck. 

[Jeff]

I got up here at the perfect time to learn what was going on, sorta.  The two leaks are obvious just above the old high waterline.I'm trying the clay. The pond was going back down when we got here, from the high we could see on the camera. I used 5 bags, the water level is now going back up. The outflow has slowed a bunch, but not stopped, but im hopeful it will.

If not, That leak can be worked on without lowering the pond below the level it was all winter.

[Jeff]

The pond currently is about 5" from the actual overflow. 

[SwampDonkey]

Won't be long before the peepers sing, it is April after all. 

[aigheadish]

Peepers haven't started up there yet? I just checked my notes and I heard the first one on 2/27/2024, last year I didn't hear them until about a month later. They make an amazing amount of noise, and I love it! 

[SwampDonkey]

End of April, first part of May here. Cold don't bother them too much as long as stuff doesn't turn into blocks of ice. They are tough. 

[Jeff]

Cedar and I walked down this morning. We gained 3-4" in depth over night. It's dead calm out there, and I could not see any disturbances on the water surface. No movement of any surfaces,  but, there is still water moving slightly at the bottom of the dike, so its coming from somewhere.

The footprint of the pond is much bigger in just a day.

[Magicman]

This Summer you may have to take the backhoe and dig down, cut a core trench, and then backfill/compact with new soil.  That way you would be fixing rather than patching.

[YellowHammer]

Bentonite not only swells when it gets wet, it also changes the ion structure of most clay soils, much like a catalyst, and causes them to "slump" and flow into holes like gravy.  So the pond clay as well as the bentonite produce a flowable slurry.  Some clays work better than others, and there are easy ways to tell how well it might work, using a desk top experiment.  

[Jeff]

I found more seeps this morning, up higher than the ones I worked on yesterday. I can tell you one thing, if you get a mixture of the native clay and the bentonite on your boots, you aint kicking or simply rinsing it off.

The first leaks yesterday, instantly clouded the outflow when I started giving them attention.
This mornings leaks, were just a swirl on the water over a couple inches of water. It took several minutes for the outflow to cloud on this find and repair. The outflow is getting harder to detect. It has went from having a visible ripple to it, to having to watch the debris in the water for movement.  I think Im getting there.

[Don P]

We watch where we walk when the well guys leave, you can track that stuff forever. I was somewhere below Butte driving on dirt roads in the rain in bentonite country, hit a section line correction and I think I saw the back end of the truck a half dozen times  . The porta potties out there all had that buff color.

[Jeff]

I took the backhoe back yesterday to rake out the garbage from the base of the dike. That is whene I found where it was all coming from. A pushed over small tree, that still had the stump in the side of the dike and roots heading for the pond.  I know exactly where it is coming out now. More to come.

[Jeff]

Before and now