still didn't buy any blades for the 70

woodmills1 · October 01, 2009, 07:26:49 PM

rapidly running out of what are now bob's reshapened 13 degree blades

what I need is an all purpose blade for clear and knotty pine as well as oak, my two tree most often cut

should I buy a box of 10 degree .055 and a box of 7 degree to try or will the 7 be enough.

still on the learning curve mills :P

MartyParsons · October 01, 2009, 08:36:33 PM

How about we send you two to try of the 7 degree? I like them.

customdave · October 01, 2009, 11:23:34 PM

Woodmills 1 , when you get a chance to try those 7 degree blades let me know what you think of them in the pine .would appreciate it , been toying with trying them too! Thankyou sir

Custom Dave

P.S. Play safe

Papa1stuff · October 02, 2009, 06:14:53 AM

They don't cut nails off any better ;D ;D

backwoods sawyer · October 02, 2009, 10:28:19 AM

I was cutting some big dry oak yesterday using the 10*, It was slow going in the 20"+ cuts, I put on a 13* saw to see if having the deeper gullet would make a difference. It did. I was able to cut at about twice the feed rate.
I have not lost a saw all summer and still have saws in the box that have not been put into rotation yet. I have been considering shifting over from the 10* to the 7*, I like the 13* for softwoods. Let use all know how they work out for you, and treat them like you would all the rest of your saws so the results are comparable.

ladylake · October 02, 2009, 01:36:38 PM

Quote from: backwoods sawyer on October 02, 2009, 10:28:19 AM
I was cutting some big dry oak yesterday using the 10*, It was slow going in the 20"+ cuts, I put on a 13* saw to see if having the deeper gullet would make a difference. It did. I was able to cut at about twice the feed rate.
I have not lost a saw all summer and still have saws in the box that have not been put into rotation yet. I have been considering shifting over from the 10* to the 7*, I like the 13* for softwoods. Let use all know how they work out for you, and treat them like you would all the rest of your saws so the results are comparable.

Did you mean you put a 7* blade on? It's not the gullet dept, it's the hook angle that makes the difference. I sharpen my blades to 4* with the same gullet dept as my new 10* blades (had to make a few mods to my sharpener to do that) and the 4* blades cut way better and faster than the 10* new blades. Steve

backwoods sawyer · October 02, 2009, 06:03:52 PM

Nope!!!
I put the 13* saw on because I do not have any 7* saws at this time, and it has the deeper gullet and making the wide cuts was filling up the gullets of the 10* saws and over flowing. I normally only use the 13* saws for softwoods. The deeper gullet allowed the sawdust to be carried out of the cut rather then being packed on both sides of the cut, so there was less friction, less drag, and faster feed speeds, I would prefer to have used a 7* saw because it is less aggressive. Mind you, I was not just ripping and tearing thru the cut. I was throttling back the feed speeds to the point where the motor was running free, and it was still faster then the 10* with a steady pull on the motor.

MartyParsons · October 02, 2009, 06:46:33 PM

Take a piece a paper and trace the profile of the blades. You will find there are other differences in blades other than just hook angle. 4* has a high tooth angle like the 10 *. The 7 degree has a deep gullet and a steep back grind. Every * has a different set also. The 9 degree has a shorter tooth height. We are sawing Tulip and Red Oak at the Elkins show today. The 10 * blades was working but seemed to be cutting slow. I changed to the 9 degree and it worked much better. We are showing a 28 hp LT40HD. The Red oak was real nice logs but they were smeared with mud and stones. I had the debarker working well but I think we had some mud on the out side cuts.
Hope this helps.
The 4 * slows the cut normaly but if nothing will cut it works well. It is nice to have a choice or a slection of * blades. I hardly ever leave for a show with out 4 degree blades. Sometimes I never use them but when I need them we got'em
M

Dave Shepard · October 02, 2009, 07:27:37 PM

Yup, the 4° blades are the git r done blades for sure. :D I was trying to saw up a couple of old white oaks and a few fresh hard maples last year. The 10s and 9s wouldn't do it, and I was afraid to use my last 4 in case of metal (had a big locust job the next day). I put the 4 on and sawed the lot without a hiccup. Customer was going to use the white oak for trailer planks 'til I sawed into it. ;) ;D

ladylake · October 02, 2009, 08:31:16 PM

Quote from: backwoods sawyer on October 02, 2009, 06:03:52 PM
Nope!!!
I put the 13* saw on because I do not have any 7* saws at this time, and it has the deeper gullet and making the wide cuts was filling up the gullets of the 10* saws and over flowing. I normally only use the 13* saws for softwoods. The deeper gullet allowed the sawdust to be carried out of the cut rather then being packed on both sides of the cut, so there was less friction, less drag, and faster feed speeds, I would prefer to have used a 7* saw because it is less aggressive. Mind you, I was not just ripping and tearing thru the cut. I was throttling back the feed speeds to the point where the motor was running free, and it was still faster then the 10* with a steady pull on the motor.

[/quote

Why are you thinking if switching from 10* to 7* if you cut way faster with 13* in big dry oak. I'm confused. Why is it hard to believe the hook angle has something to do with cutting big tough wood. When I sharpen my blades at 4* they have the same gullet profile as my new 10* blades yet cut way better. Why do 10* blades with the shallow gullet cut just fine and fast in easy to saw wood if we are having trouble with the gullet filling up. Steve

Papa1stuff · October 02, 2009, 09:21:13 PM

? for Marty
I purchased a box of 7* blades and before I put my 10* grind stone on my sharpener ,I tryed it in a 7* blade,It seemed to fit perfectly.
should it?

woodmills1 · October 03, 2009, 01:14:42 AM

Thanks for the offer Marty, send them please.

I have 2 more of bobs that haven't hit metal and about 6 that have

I can get by next week but am thinking a box of both 7 and 10 is in my future

I like the LT70 but was so well tuned to the old 40 I would not be asking these questions

Ahhh an older newbie I be :D :D :D

backwoods sawyer · October 03, 2009, 01:54:51 AM

Quote from: ladylake on October 02, 2009, 08:31:16 PM
Why are you thinking if switching from 10* to 7* if you cut way faster with 13* in big dry oak. I'm confused. Why is it hard to believe the hook angle has something to do with cutting big tough wood.

Why are you thinking if switching from 10* to 7* if you cut way faster with 13* in big dry oak. I'm confused. Why is it hard to believe the hook angle has something to do with cutting big tough wood.

First of all, why would I consider a 7* over a 10* when the 13* cut faster then the 10*. It is really rather simple. Hook angle. The lower hook angle of the 7* saw will cut the fibers as the saw is pushed into the wood, where the steeper 13* hook angle tends to self feed, and pull the motor down. With softwoods like cedar making a 24" cut and the saw takes a heavy bite it will not slow the saw down. Where a 13* saw self feeding in a 24" cut of hard Oak it will pull the motor down and snake the cut, and for that reason I do not use the 13* saw even when milling Doug-fir which is considered to be a softwood. You will be cutting at a good feed rate and cut thru a knot and there will be a wave. I know what you are going to say, "Even the big mills say you can not cut Doug-fir with out snaking" and yes, that is true to an extent. You can either choose to cut your wood at 1.650 with some snake to it and plane off the excess, or you can choose to use the right saw for the job and minimize the amount of allowable snake and mill your wood at 1.570, with a finished target of 1.500.

As for the second part: "Why is it hard to believe the hook angle has something to do with cutting big tough wood". I was referring to the gullet depth of the 10* saws rather then the issue of hook angle. The 7* saw have a deeper gullet as well as less hook angle, therefore they "should" be a better choice for wide cuts in real hard wood.

No one saw is going to fit all your cutting needs if you are cutting a variety of species that have a varying amount of dry time. Sure, no mater what saw you put on your mill, if the mill is properly aligned the saw will cut wood. However, you will have better results if you match the saw up to the type of wood and the conditions before you start milling.

On this particular batch of Oak, I had ran one saw per log and was still seeing a small amount of snake with excessive amounts of sawdust caked on the sides of the cut, that tells me that the gullet is over flowing. Do you read it as being a different issue? My solution was to try another type of saw to see if a deeper gullet would help, and it did, that told me that in this situation a deeper gullet was more of an issue then the hook angle. Do you read that the same way?

I might add that I had sharpened all of the 10* saws followed by the 13* as one batch just changing cams and angle between batches so there should be no issues with them being sharpened in different manors. All of the saws had the teeth set prior to sharpening as well. The 10* saws were set at .022 and the 13* saws were set at .027. They are all 1 ½", .055, 184" Woodmizer bands. Therefore, it seems to me that it was a fairly controlled test. I was cutting 3"x 12" bridge planks, out of 28"-34" logs, therefore all the cuts were wide cuts.

ladylake · October 03, 2009, 05:20:44 AM

You don't have to talk me into less hook angle in tough wood, mostly knotty burr oak and white ash. I've been sawing straight at a good feed rate for years with a 4* hook, I even tried going back to 7* a couple of months ago and that didn't work nearly as well as 4*. I don't think the gullet dept has anything to do with it, it might if your sawing 20" wide at 60 feet per minute, then they might get full and overload. If those 13* blades worked better in oak it was most likely due to the set or sharpness. Steve

woodmills1 · October 07, 2009, 11:58:14 AM

the blades came today, I will try them fri or sat.........thanks Marty

woodmills1 · October 13, 2009, 09:57:34 PM

got to try one of the freebie 7 degree saturday. my resharps were working on various species till I went for the older ash log,(didn't realize till today the cherry had a nail in it way down the other end), put on the 7 OMG fast and straight even after it must have hit something that the debarker didn't catch,

got the other donated(thanks marty and woodmizer) left and ordered a box of 7 today

Dave Shepard · October 13, 2009, 10:16:47 PM

Width and thickness please.

customdave · October 13, 2009, 10:19:29 PM

Woodmills 1, right on , after you run three or four blades & different species of logs , would you mind up dating this thread ,I'm really curious what your findings will be after . Thanks & keep the sawdust flying & play safe1....

Dave

woodmills1 · October 13, 2009, 10:31:33 PM

.055 1.5 inch wide cut like mad on the ash and then later on the no identifiable logs. looks like oak ona bark looks sorta like walnut or butternut when cut, but has a leaf like elm.

ladylake · October 14, 2009, 05:35:59 AM

No suprize there, now when you get in frozen wood give 4* a try. Steve

woodmills1 · October 14, 2009, 08:22:22 PM

still using the first of the free and cut 648 bd ft of nice oak, fast and straight. So over 800 feet on the one blade, hope they do that well after woodmills resharp. The new box is in the UPS trail and I ordered a new cutter for the sharpener and some extensions for the blade holders. The blades for the 70 being much longer. I will try some spruce and some knotty pine soon. Very very happy 8)

backwoods sawyer · October 16, 2009, 12:06:23 PM

Quote from: woodmills1 on October 14, 2009, 08:22:22 PM
I ordered a new cutter for the sharpener and some extensions for the blade holders. The blades for the 70 being much longer.

Those extensions are a joke, they let the saw sag so it is flexing at the point where the grinder is. You are better off taking the screw ends out of the old arms and crimping them into a new length of conduit and cut it to size. I have no idea as to why woodmizer dose not make an actual arm for the 184" saws, but rather send you three 6" pieces of conduit with couplers to cobble together something that was designed for the LT-40 rather then the LT-70.

woodmills1 · November 07, 2009, 11:52:09 PM

I used the 7 degree on oak today and fast and straight they were, still have to enter slow to not rise a little but much faster in the cut.............

EXCEPT FOR THE NAILS

Papa1stuff · November 08, 2009, 07:41:56 AM

Nails? ;D ;D

woodmills1 · November 08, 2009, 10:54:34 AM

I was cutting an order for 1x6x10 red oak fencing. I did get 27 pieces from the first log along with 9 nails and a screw eye...........the 7 cut them all..or should I say it took 3 sevens to cut them all :D

Magicman · November 08, 2009, 08:59:00 PM

Wow, 3 blades for 27 1X6's really cuts into your production/profit..... :( I know that sometimes it just "goes with the territory", but it's still.... :(