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General Forestry => Tree, Plant and Wood I.D. => Topic started by: A-z farmer on November 02, 2020, 06:22:08 AM

Title: Do polar trees get shake like hemlock
Post by: A-z farmer on November 02, 2020, 06:22:08 AM
Almost two years ago I milled up some live standing poplar into 2x4 and 5/4 x8 inch boards 12.5 feet long .I built a honey house entirely out of the wood this fall but after planing and jointing I noticed there was a lot of boards that had cracked the whole length.Was this from internal stresses or from an internal disease like shake .
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52480/92032AF8-600F-45EA-86D8-246FB4639274.jpeg?easyrotate_cache=1604315002)
 
Title: Re: Do polar trees get shake like hemlock
Post by: GAB on November 02, 2020, 08:31:01 AM
A - z farmer:
What percentage of the boards had defects like that?
Could it have happened when the tree was dropped?
Some of the boards with shake (hemlock) that I have sawed the delamination lines were much closer together.
Sorry I have more questions than answers.
GAB
Title: Re: Do polar trees get shake like hemlock
Post by: A-z farmer on November 02, 2020, 12:35:58 PM
The poplar trees were about 30 inches and they did not show any signs of splitting when I dropped them .I think it was about 25 percent of the lumber with the 12.5 foot ones being the worst .I used a lot of the boards I cut into 8,5 feet long for bee boxes in the spring and did not notice the splitting as much .
This was my first time milling or using poplar lumber and I am not in any hurry to use it again .
Thank you 
Title: Re: Do polar trees get shake like hemlock
Post by: Don P on November 02, 2020, 09:23:51 PM
It can have shake but it is not anything at all like hemlock as far as frequency. That does appear to be shake not stress, the crack is together that entire length, if it was stress I'd expect to see the crack opening along its length not staying together. Tulip poplar is one of my favorite woods.
Title: Re: Do polar trees get shake like hemlock
Post by: mike_belben on November 04, 2020, 12:37:24 PM
I have cut small poplar logs where you can actually push the core out and have a log noodle and a post from one butt log.    Not sure the cause.  

Think ive only ever seen something like that in sourwood before.. And one white oak that either had bacteria from hogs or lightning.. Everyone who saw it chose one or the other explanation. Who knows. 
Title: Re: Do polar trees get shake like hemlock
Post by: A-z farmer on November 05, 2020, 12:27:35 PM
The title should have said poplar trees not polar 
I thought it might be shake because when I milled it up it stunk like a swamp .Also when I jointed and planed the wood it still smelled bad ,but I thought it was just the smell of normal poplar .I only sawed about 3000 board feet of it and have used over half of it this year.
Thank you 
Zeke
Title: Re: Do polar trees get shake like hemlock
Post by: Don P on November 05, 2020, 01:32:40 PM
Ahh, there's your sign, the oh! of bacterial infection smiley_airfreshener.
Title: Re: Do polar trees get shake like hemlock
Post by: kantuckid on November 18, 2020, 09:06:50 AM
Shake is mentioned above as a disease- I thought it was a combo of that species growth habits and how it handled the wind and weather and location where it grows?

Poplar does sort of stink at times. 
Title: Re: Do polar trees get shake like hemlock
Post by: Don P on November 18, 2020, 07:07:38 PM
Ring shake is usually caused by bacteria (clostridium?) in the soil entering through the roots, very often livestock damaged roots, and then moving up the stem. The enzyme produced by the bacteria weakens the bond between growth layers. It moves slowly up the stem, often you can start docking off firewood from the butt until you get above it.

Hmm, going from memory here, clostridium is a wicked bunch of bacteria, I believe it is also the genus that contains botulism and C.Diff.
Title: Re: Do polar trees get shake like hemlock
Post by: kantuckid on November 19, 2020, 08:57:23 AM
So the rule of thumb is to not lick yer fingers around ring shake wood? :D
Botulism sounds a bit worse than me thinking it was the wind. Maybe I've read somebody wrongly call it "wind-shake"? Or, is there ring shake and wind shake? 
Title: Re: Do polar trees get shake like hemlock
Post by: Don P on November 19, 2020, 05:13:06 PM
No it's the same thing, our understanding of the cause has changed. 
@GeneWengert-WoodDoc (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=20498) can fill in the blanks here better than me.
Title: Re: Do polar trees get shake like hemlock
Post by: moodnacreek on November 26, 2020, 07:29:01 PM
Quaking Aspen can have shake just like hemlock, very common around here. I always thought shake was caused by the wind and said so here. So I have been told there are other reasons. I have seen damaged stumps produce star burst cracks that ruined the but log. Ring shake I would not blame on wind but hemlock from up on the hill will often be full of shake and the lower trees not.