Hydro-Ax Shears, 611 EX in northern hardwoods thinning.
Is that ours Ron? Maybe not, I thought Billsby's has a saw head. You say thats a shear.
No, That one's Rothig Forest Products working on the Dahlgren Sale across from the Timbers Resturant on H-115 northwest of Cadillac. I think I gave the better photos of yours along with your survived skidder (the stuck in the wetlands photo on the forum) to the landowner.
Landowners like to have photos of their land management activities, especially those that don't get to see the action first hand.
You should have some large oak to saw from the Austin Sale just purchased. I'll get some photos there.
Barko 885 with sawhead thinning in oak
Timbco T 415-D; tracked feller buncher Thinning in red pine.
Sidell Forest Products used a similar Timbco, maybe the same model, equipped with a saw head on an aspen, soft maple clearcut chip harvest on Grandma's a couple years ago. Very impressive machine to watch in operation 8). The operator kept two BIG John Deere grapple skidders busy and never waiting ;D.
This was a new machine, just 6 months old. It was producing 25 + cords/day in the red pine. Its saw head can handle 24" oak trees. Machine is owned by Ellias Hilliard who works for ADJ Forest Products, but was working for Jason Lutke at the time, producing for Pine Tech, Inc.
It was down for awhile one day after a heavy snow storm when the encoder on the computer was acting up and it wouldn't function. Weather related I guess, but impressive.
John Deere DC-70D Feller Buncher on Tracks. Older model working in red pine thinning.
Sawyer with Stihl Chain Saw. Thinning in red pine.
I've heard snowbird farmers talking about cutting their trees in the winter like this picture shows. Then they say they go back in the spring and cut the 10 or 12 foot butt cut. :D
Tom,
That's after they shovel out the power poles and power lines. ;)
Sawyer with 2 "Huskies" harvesting Oak logs.
Kubota with skidding winchGordon
Valmet 546 Feller-Buncher. Works well in pine.
Gordon, I sure hope you don't over load the tractor for pulling. 8) 8) 8)
Hay Frank, you that that Mobile Dimension mill you have could handle a log that big? :D
Little twigs like that come in handy to put in the soft areas of the skidding trails. Waste not what not.
Gordon
They work great, also for bar ditching. :D:D
Valment 546 Forwarder.Working in a red pine thinning. A good system with the 546 Feller/Buncher of previous photo.
Old model Canadian Feller Forwarder Buncher Hauler Stacker Harvester
I have one that looks a lot like that one, Kevin. An older model but it still works pretty good. I've been thinking about retiring it to the house, the new models are too quick. :-/
Kevin,
Excellent picture. It's hard to find a chain saw on some of the jobs here anymore. I sure endorse them for still doing some of the better quality work.
How about expaining some of your "colorful" clothing and its purpose, i.e. the Kevlar boots etc.
And the Hat! Don't forget the hat!
Ron,
I wouldn`t consider operating a chainsaw without every available safety device.
I wear chainsaw protective boots, chaps, gloves and hardhat when operating any chainsaw.
I try to wear bright colored clothing so other people that I may be working with can see me from a distance.
The work as you know is dangerous enough without taking unnecessary risks.
When I get tired I quit and go back another day or put the chainsaw away and do something else.
I think if we keep informing people of the dangers involved we`ll get a few to buy the stuff and wear it.
If a few think it`s too costly, I say ... try having an accident !
Jeff, I knew you would spot that sooner or later, that was for the photo opp. :)
right on with the woods work be careful info. i go into the woods fresh and rested, wear orange hard hat and protective shirt. no drinking the night before. best advice might be to think and plan. trees come down fast and hard and are not forgiving. also if something doesn't feel safe it probably isn't.
Hey Kevin, I've been looking for boots that have kevlar, steel toes and paks. I can find steel-toed paks, but not with kevlar. Do they have anything like that in your neck of the woods?
The boots are from Husqvarna, my local dealer stocks a pretty good supply.
These are kevlar, steel toes and paks.
Excellent Safety Tips for chain saw users from those with sawyer experience. The bright colors are life and limb savers.
Many of the chain saw dealers, especially, "Husky" handle the Kevlar rubber boots. The Forestry Suppliers Catalog also has them, the Swede Pro brand. I imagine that the other logger supply catalogs have them also. (See Forum Links)
Cedar-Eater, if your ever down this way near Ebels' Hardware Store in Falmouth, MI, they have them. They're a popular Husky dealer in this area.
John Deere 548 G Grapple Skidder. Tree length skidding Red Pine.
John Deere Grapple Skidder. Tree length skidding hardwood pulpwood.
Timberjack Cable Skidder. Small size, skidding tree length logs and pulpwood.
Cable Skidder, Older model, home built.
Pig with an AxeYoung pig, around 200 lbs.
(Sorry Ron, couldn't resist :D )
THIS PIG DOES NOT COUNT TOWARDS CONTEST!
Another Pig Trimming stump height to please the consulting forester.
THIS PIG DOES NOT COUNT TOWARDS CONTEST!
A good ending to this Thread as it dies for lack of interest! :'(
It's not dead yet. What's that homemade rig built out of? It looks good. Sombody put a lot of time into it. That Timberjack looks to be from a distance the same model I've been running for the last two winters. Works great in hardwoods. The guys who own it have sold it and it goes down the road Monday :(. Glad I'm almost done with it.
You losing interest, Ron? I'm not! 568 reads says somebody's interested. Would be nice if someone else would chip in a pic or 2, though. Thanks for the ride.
Hey Ron Got any more info on that or another home built skidder?
I hope there is a picture here of a Skyhook used in my area in the 1950s. It had dual 2" skylines,and 7/8" traction lines,with a 300' dropline underneath.It was suspended across a steep valley.(notice the operator hunched over)
I just had to pipe in here with a great book. Handloggers by W. H. Jackson. I've only been able to find it as a collectors item for big dollars, but if you get a chance to read it, do. It takes place in S.E. Alaska in the 50's and 60's. The technique at the time was to find a nice stand of timber that was growing on a steep hillside above saltwater and either fall the timber directly into the water or slide it down the steep slope into the water. Often the tree would hang up and he would have to jack it loose so it could continue on its way.
He and his wife would live on their little troller (boat) and raft up logs until the order was filled, then tow it to town.
Steve
Steve,I read that book several years ago.I really enjoyed it.That independence,and the chance to make a few buck in the process is appealling.I wonder what would happen if we fell trees directly into fish habitat these days? ::)
I spect you'd be wearing stripes and looking out small windows !! :D
I don't know just exactly what this cable skidder was all made from. Just bits and pieces from his home junk yard.
He was a firewood producer who came in to cut firewood and clean up the topwood after a sawlog job. The skidder was just able to handle the lighter topwood. It was a little under powered for bigger stuff. It was a conversation piece when compared to the fancy Timber Jacks etc.
This person was the type who just made everything from junk parts, his wood splitter, haul truck etc were all home built as needed. He had to pour oil into the wood splitter engine while he split wood; quite an operation, but not environmentally sound.
He bought an old big Ford Crown Victoria from the landowner who had it parked in his "bone yard" back in the woods for a number of years. He paid $25.00 for it. I didn't think that it would ever run and asked him what he was going to do with it.
The next day he was driving it around the woods to his firewood operation. He was more of an inventor than a firewood producer as things seemed to run without all the parts.
Don't even think those sorts of things :o
Now I'm gonna have to look over my shoulder for weeks to be sure the envir-cops and the forest service aren't following me. The get downright snippy if they catch you rolling a beach log back into the water. And that's one that's already been in the water for awhile. I've seen people get fined for walking too close to a "salmon stream" that hadn't had any fish in it for twenty years.
It was fun while it lasted. But now Alaska is closed except for tourism. And I here the "tree-huggers" will be starting on that next. The smoke from the cruise ships is causing air pollution don't you know.
Bruce
Here are a couple of pictures taken spring 1993,near Pemberton B.C. They are of my dads two brothers,Harold,and Thor. Harold (with his back turned) started falling with axe and misery whip in 1950,with his dad.He said if it wasn't for power saws coming shortly after,he would be doing something else.He quit falling fulltime at 64.
This is Thor.He was 58 in 1993.He was a skilled and highball faller.In July that year a pine snag came down as he was falling a D-Fir and broke his lower back.We packed him out on a spine board,and he was air lifted out on a chopper.He never fell again,but is healthy and fishing now 8)
Fir stand in Pemberton
Now we're getting into some of the "bigger" timber from other forest areas.
Iron Mule 501 C Forwarder. An old standby for short wood logging. Unit is carrying out aspen and red maple pulpwood to landing.
Seeing the picture of the forwarder reminded me of this couple of pages of pictures I had. Ohia logging and milling the south end of the Big Island.
http://www.curlykoa.com/webpics2/Ohia.html
Steve
Iron Mule Forwarder. Carrying sugar (hard) maple sawlogs to the landing.
Shortwood Pulp truck used for years to support families on tops, tailings and Urban wood until the big companies saw fit to favor long wood loads. This is an indangered industry in the south.
Alot of people around here used to cut bolt wood/pallet wood. There were two mills that sawed only short stuff. There both closed now. There were lots of rough looking old trucks on the roads. That was also when the weighmasters were friendlier :)
Tom,That was interesting.What species was on the truck? What would be the value of that load? I hate to see the end of an era,where a guy can make a buck with what is on hand,and a little perseverance.Anymore on the subject would be welcome.
Paul
Paul,
That load is pine. Eddy said he was getting $25 per ton and his load will be about five tons. Most of the pine grown in plantations here is longleaf, Slash and Loblolly. Pond Pine (pocosin or black pine) is common and used for pulp but not grown commercially. These trucks generally carried wood that was left by the big loggers and filled a niche by picking up Urban woods (Oak, Pine or various trees that Arborist need to have disposed).
This gentlemn is a 74+ year old preacher who carries 4 to 6 loads a week to stay out of trouble. The wood is usually free for the asking and is sold for $75 to $250, dependent upon species and market,. per load. It is purchased by the ton. It takes him about 2 1/2 or 3 hours to create a load by himself.
I get wood from the county. Some I saw, some is not good for anything I want to do. I give the wood to Eddy, the pulpwooder, just to get it out of the yard. He knows that when wood is scarce, he can pick up a load or fill out a load at my place. He also follows a couple of Arborist around and removes their wood.
The biggest detriment to this work is the independence of the big pulpwood companies. they will buy shortwood only one or two days a week and will go sometimes for weeks refusing to buy any at all. The shortwood haulers used to be welcomed and let into the log yard ahead of the big trucks so they could unload and return for more. Now I understand they have to wait in line with all the rest of the haulers and it limits them to one or perhaps two loads a day at best.
Fewer and fewer of these operators can be found today. Most are selling to an intermediate log yard for a small portion of what they could get at the mill. The intermediate yard owner holds the wood until the market opens and carries the wood to the mill on big trucks.
Many of the pulp mills are recycling paper. They get their pulp from boxes etc and seldom buy logs at all.
The sawmills are/were owned by the pulp industry. Lumber was considered a byproduct of making paper rather than the other way around. Now the sawmills are being recognized for providing the pulp companies with a good portion of their bottom line. Chip 'n Saws are making lumber and providing clean chips to the pulp mills. Short wood has little market here any more.
Iron Mule Forwarder. Loading out shortwood. These small forwarders are becoming a thing of the past and hard to find. I still like to see their use as they are good for "light on the land" timber harvesting which most small private landowners want.
One small producer still has two of them. He runs one and his wife the other. They do some of the best work in quality hardwood jobs.
Keep these pictures coming Ron and everyone. It's not only interesting, but educational for me to see these machines in action. It looks like I might be having a sawtimber harvest followed by a pulp harvest later this year, so I'm extra curious.
Timberjack 230A Forwarder. Working short wood in a hardwood selection harvest.
Ron, A question.What would have been used 40-50 years ago, to log in these same areas? I am not familiar with this type of logging,and it's quite interesting.Would small Cats(D3-D-4) have been used?
What was used to load? Gin pole maybe?
This old Mac was still hauling in Oregon,1995.It was hauling out of a skyline thinning show
Yes the small to medium sized crawlers were the primary use machines during that period. They were in the process of replacing horses back then They were versatile over much of the varied terrain and an all purpose machine for road buiding, snow plowing, skidding, forwarding, etc. They were slow in production however, especially for high volumes of production needed to feed the pulpwood mills coming on line. They were also harder on the landscape (people were more respectful of the loggers work methods back then).
Some crawlers were equiped with loading booms, or front loaders. "Gin poles", spars, and "A" frames were also set up at primarly landings to load trucks as were some labor intensive hand methods of "hand roll and lift platforms".
The boon to loading was the development of the Prentice loader in the 1960's. This hydraulic loader was developed by Leo Heikkinen in Wisconsin, and helped revolutionize log loading.
Rubber tired and flexible frame skidding units were being developed, but it took and adjustment to change period and awhile to perfect a rubber tire that would hold up to the woods abuse, not puncture, etc.
The Gafner Iron Mule as those previously pictured was first built in 1957. They went through several improved models and was one of the most successful pulpwood forwarders ever made. They're still a favorite of mine.
Those western trucks log trucks are monsters. Appreciate your photo. I'll get into a truck series from this part of the country later. I need to get some more photos as I've given many of my best ones away to the owners, drivers, landowners, fellers, operators,etc.
Timberjack 230C Forwarder. Working short wood in northern hardwood thinning.
I am enjoying learning about the logging methods out there. I can see how it would shine on the valley floor here.We have a mix of Birch,Alder,Cottonwood,and wild Cherry.
Here are a few old pictures from the area. This one is another view of the Skyhook,used in Squamish B.C. in the 1950s.The box beneath is carrying the fallers. :oJoe Seymour was the rigger on the Skyhook.He is now 74,and driving our off highway log truck,with no plans to retire in the near future!
This one is of moving a steam donkey.All done with block purchase and bullwork.Also a lot of brainpower.Its just cresting the rise.
And there she is.Then it starts all over again,moving blocks,pulling line.....
...
Timberjack 230 C Forwarder, older model. Working aspen sawlogs and pulpwood. Aspen removal in hardwood selection harvest.
Hydo-Axe Feller Buncher Saw Head Working red pine site clearing.
Moving a 1010 Lawrence on a sleigh.The 1010 had a 6 cyl flathead Chrysler gas engine.Built in the 1940s,it was a small two drum winch,with a strawline drum.Perfect for the little gypo loggers on the coast
Ron, this little A frame loading poles would be similar to the type you metioned before,wouldn't it?This picture was taken in 1938,Squamish B.C
The pole isn't bent,it was a small picture and my scanner didn't like it.
Some good logging history photos. Yes that would be an "A Frame" loader type from the old logging days; "where there was a will, there was a way". Some interesting methods used, even with "real horsepower".
John Deere DC70D Feller Buncher Tracked unit; previous photos show it at work. Now ready to leave the job for another area.
"Husky" Chainsaw on Hard Maple sawlogs. A reliable method.
Two Loads of Sawlogs. Log haulers out of the woods and parked to tighten down their binders for the highway haul to the mill.
Ron, nice shots of the Kenworths. Where are they going,sawmill,or sorting yard?Looks like nice wood to me.
Ron,
What size of Husky are they using for felling and bucking?
TJACK
Yes these were some of our better sawlogs. These logs are going directly to Quality Sawlog's Mill in Sunfield, Michigan. They were the direct buyer of this selectively marked northern hardwoods timber sale.
Most of the Husky saws used on the hardwood sawlog harvests are the Heavy Duty Professional model 385 XP. Most cutters have two of them on the job, though one of the back up saws might be a lighter or older model, especially for use on the smaller size pulpwood. All the saws are usually the Pro series models.
Hauling Log Load out of Woods. Autocar with over cab loader and "pup" trailer.
NOW, that is a Whack of logs! ;)
Log Load Out of the Woods. Load binder tightening time on county road before trip to the mill. Autocar with over cab loader and "pup" trailer. Loaded with mixed oak logs.
that aint no pup trailer with that whack loaded its a full grown log dog :D :D
Total Tree Processor. Processing red pine landscape timbers and pulpwood.
Morbark Chipper. Chipping oak tops and loading chip van for trip to cogeneration plant.
Ron,have you been around chippers much? The Enviroment Ministry has been talking about phasing out burning debris piles.We have done a little digging on prices for tub grinders,but they are way up there in price.That one looks a little more in line with our waste size.
Chipper Being Set Up. Another similar Chipper being set up at landing to begin chipping tops from sawlog & pulpwood timber harvest.
There are various commercial size chippers from small to large. The tree and utility companies use a small size and those in the log and pulpwood chipping business use the medium and larger sizes for production and handling of the larger wood sizes.
I'm not overly familiar with all of them, best to check your specific needs with the various equipment outlets.
Hydro-Axe 411E. Proctor Logging, Inc. producing Oak & Aspen sawlogs and pulpwood for Billsby Lumber Company, Inc.
Sawyer Cutting Oak Logs. Cutting with Model 2095 Jonsered chainsaw.
Timberjack 230A Forwarder. On hardwood selection harvest, short wood operation.
Timberjack 230A Forwarder Decking Pulpwood. Woods landing where forwarder operator separates and decks species and products.
Timberjack 230A Forwarder. Operator sorting oak, maple, and aspen sawlogs at landing.
John Deere De-Limber & Slasher Processing & Kenworth Hauler Loading Out Red Pine Landscaping Timber.
John Deere De-Limber. Working tree length red pine, first thinning.
Heavy Belarus with Farmi skidder. 160 feet of 5/8 cable gets them out of hills and hollers.
Red Pine Cabin Logs. Some "60 footers" loading out on the Kenworth to Natural Log Homes. Log Homes built by the Amish. Watch for theses logs in another thread.
Wow! I'd hate to hafta buy a set of tires for that thing! :o
How are those logs treated before building a house from them? Do they kiln dry them or use any kind of preservative?
QuoteRed Pine Cabin Logs. Some "60 footers" loading out on the Kenworth to Natural Log Homes. Log Homes built by the Amish. Watch for theses logs in another thread.
Whooeee! What a gorgeous load! Where from, what species, how d'ya grow them suckas to be that pretty!? :o lw
DanG, thats a baby trailor its only got 6 axles. Heres a pic of our 48 foot 8 axle with a long days work on board. 30,000 feet of Aspen.
Jeff,
We hitch a team of those little trucks up to one of our Canadian logging trucks just to get it roll`n.
These are red pine logs from a sale I selective marked and sold for the landowner. The sale was purchased by the Amish (Natural Log Homes) who are quite experienced in building log homes. They knew where each log was going to go by size before the trees were cut.
They just de-bark them with pressured water and build the home on the mill site to be sure it all fits together. They mark the logs, take the log home down, transport the pieces to the buyer and then re-erect it on their site piece by piece for the final home. I don't know if any special preservative is used just maybe some clear oil after air drying.
The trees were harvested near Mesick, Michigan just 22 miles from Cadillac, Michigan. The Amish had a timber producer harvest the trees and transport them. They had to get one of the larger trucks in the area to haul the long lengths.
Cabin Logs Being De-Barked. The red pine cabin logs are being debarked by the Amish non-motorized method. High pressure water spray.
The Red Pine Product. Log Home Being Constructed by Amish Home Builders.
Timber Jack skidder loading the saw deck of a portable sawmill with longleaf pine logs.
Then we found the
Hitachi track hoe was a lot easier.
Hey whats that blue thing?
Timberjack 360 Grapple Skidder. Identical Timberjack Skidder Used to drag tops for chipping on recent clear-cut operation in Lower Michigan.
Timberjack 230A Forwarder. Sorting Oak Logs for Billsby Sawmill.
Timberjack 230A Forwarder. Decking Aspen.
Timberjack 230A Forwarder Assisting Sawyer. Falling trees in a sensitive roadside area may require teamwork.
Timberjack 230A Forwarder Insures Fall Direction
John Deere 750 BLT Crawler. Clearing access road and landing for site clearing timber sale. Clearing site for new Clam Lake Township Administrative site. Red pine and hardwoods removal.
John Deere 750 BLT Crawler. Working the landing for incoming haulers. Note all wood products being utilized including topwood ready for chipping.
Hydro-Ax 511E. Working a site clearing timber harvest.
John Deere 548 G Grapple Skidder. For tree length skidding on site clearing timber harvest.
John Deere 548 G Grapple Skidder. Skidding Tree Lengths to the Landing.
John Deere 548 G Grapple Skidder & Operator. The operator carries a "Husky" chainsaw for top trimming tree lengths as necessary enroute to the Processor at the landing.
Serco 170-A Processor. Processes total tree lengths into the various forest products.
Ron, is that a cut off saw buried under the brush?I can't tell if it's attached to the loader or part of it.
Paul_H
Yes, that's a cut-off saw cutting off various products up to a 4" top. It's an all one unit processor trailered in to the work site.
The clam loader picks up the wood in tree length, lays it down for the cut-off saw to process the various length products to a 4" top and then picks it up to be placed in the product pile, sawlogs, bolts, pulpwood etc. Whatever is being markedted at the time.
The clam loader then picks up the remaining top wood and places it in a seperate pile for later chipping.
The wood chips are then blown into a chip-van and hauled to the local cogen plant for wood fuel.
This is a total wood utilization operation.
See following photo also.
Serco 170-A Processor & Cut-Off Saw
Trelan 23L Chipper. Bringing the Chipper in.
Timberjack Skidder Assists the Chipper. The skidders are often used as "pushers" when needed.
Trelan 23L Chipper. Getting set in place for the chipping operation.
Trelan 23L Wood Chipper. Getting ready to chip red pine tops piled from processing operation.
Ron,
Do you carry a video camera?Any chance to see it as "sawmills in action"?It looks like a real tree eater!
No I don't have a video camera. I just carry a simple Ricoh 35 mm with 400 film and a $25.00 backup Kodak when that fails. I'm not too high tech.
That Chipper does eat up the trees and spits them out.
Trelan 23L Chipper Blowing Chips. Some excess chips at the end of the operation are blown out to mulch and stabilize the landing before closure.
Kenworth & "Pup". Loading out pulpwood from the landing.
Kenworth Starting to Roll. Loaded with pulpwood.
Kenworth Under-way. Headed for the mill with load of hardwood pulp.
Y'all must have a tremendous used tire problem up there. Lordy, look at all those axles.
They do keep the tire shops in business and we do have a used tire problem. The cogeneration plants fueled by wood chips are now seeking permits from DEQ to burn tires in a mixture with the wood chips. Expensive scrubbers are required on their stacks however to eliminate the sulfides etc. That's the political debate right now.
This producer whose truck is pictured has seven such semi's and an equal number of chip vans and he has another new semi on order. Just think of his tire bills alone. I remember when he started with a chain saw and old iron-mule forwarder on one of my first jobs. He is one that has done well.
Sawmill Loading Out Excess Sawdust. A mill's sawdust may also find a market for increased wood utilization.
Rons' picture of the sawdust loading reminded me of a question that I hear all the Time. What do you guys do with your waste?
I say there is no waste in our mill. Everything is utilized. The Bark is shredded and used for Mulch and Landscaping.
The Sawdust is used for animal bedding, or trucked to co generation plants to be burned and converted to energy. The slabs are chipped and find thier way to a multitude of companies that process them into other products.
Every spec of every Log that comes into our mill is fully used.
Jeff,
Maybe you can get some pictures of such waste product uses at your mill for posting. Where does the "waste" go?What happens to chips and sawdust is an often asked question, thus the reason I put that picture in. That one was taken at Nelson's Sawmill near Bristol, MI.
Sawmill by-productShredded bark. This is just the way it comes off of the log using our Morbark Debarker. This bark may find its way to almost any part of our state for lanscaping or mulch. Some customers purchase the bark then regrind adding color which makes it last longer. I like it natural, but then again if mine gets to looking old I know where the big pile is. ;)
THIS PIG WAS FOUND BY FURBY
Bark in our area only gets used if it is aged. They want that dark brown color. Most bark is double ground, and very little gets dyed.
Our wood chips are also turned into mulch. We don't do it, but another outfit buys chips to shred. There are also guys who shred old pallets. This is profitable since they charge to take the pallets away, and it is cheaper than tipping fees at landfills. Wood mulch can be aged or dyed.
Red Pine Thinning. Red pine thinning area after last winter's work with the Timbco T415D tracked feller buncher seen in previous photos.
Ron, around here they fight over the bark and the sawdust. All we have to do is keep track of whos checks are good. Sorry Kevin "Cheques" :)
I have sure appreciated this series. I have found it to be better than a Sears Catalog on a rainy day. :P 8) 8)
Thanks for the complement. I didn't know if there would be much interest when I started it. We need some logging photos from other parts of the country also to see how things are done else where.
Red Pine Thinning. The first thinning just starting with hand cutter. The slash and woody debris will be left on site to go back into the soil.
Gafner 5110-Iron Mule. This will be the forwarder used on the short-wood red pine sale.
John Deere DC70D Feller-Buncher. Completed its work, being "loaded out" upon completion and closure of timber harvest area.
John Deere 450G Crawler. There is often work to do after the timber harvest. One such task is to clean, grade, level, and seed the landings.
Handwork. Handwork is sometimes needed for the finishing touch, especially where the landing access joins the County road.
Log Landing Becomes Wildlife Opening. The landing is seeded with a wildlife seed mixture to be maintained as a wildlife opening until the next harvest in 8-10 years.
Hagar the Horrible. The tree fights back.
John Deere 450G Crawler. The "clean up" dozer. Access roads and connecting skid trails often need to be closed to prevent unwanted motortized vehicle access on the property after the timber harvest is completed.
The Living Forest. "Good Forest Management" may merit a sign.
How do get one of those signs?
From the Michigan Resource Alliance, if they still have them. I got some from Eva Rice when the MFRA Office was in the UP at Crystal Falls.
I don't know where they're at now. Maybe Jeff knows or can round up a sign for you. Let me know if you locate any? Some landowners really like them as they publicize Sustainable Forestry and are good PR.
Red Pine Thinning. There is still hand work to be done on small jobs and/or sensitive areas.
Unloading bush truck at dry sort.
The driver,Joe Seymour, is in his early 70's,with no plans to retire anytime soon.He was the Hook& Rigger that set up the Skyhook in the early 1950's.
My brother Don is running the loader.
Hey guys, try making your pictures 300 to 350 pixels wide before optimizing. that way they are big enough to see, but still small enough to optimize and retain quality for the 15k limit.
I must be getting old, I cant hardly see em. :D
Cool pics guys. Whil I am at it, here is a tip that will help prevent future problems and a good rule of thumb when dealing with picture files for the internet, or anywhere for that matter.
When naming a file NEVER EVER use capital letters, spaces, or special charactors. They will give a web server fits.
example Mypicture #4.jpg this breaks all 3 rules, and any one of them could or would cause a problem. The one special character that can be used without trouble is the underscore. Here is the way I would name this file.
my_picture4.jpg or simply mypicture4.jpg
The uder score lest you make a discriptive name that is good for our gallery when trying to find the picture again.
Example: kevins_big_orange_mill.jpg is easier to find later then kevinsbigorangemill.jpg and if you used Kevins big orange mill.jpg, you might never find it!
Jeff,is that why my picture showed up as an empty box at first?KW #2 should have been kw_log_truck2 or similar?
Also, I was using the Optimiser the hard way,not the right way.
Yup, sure is. I went in and changed the file name and then fixed your post. Thats why you see it now. Yes, that file name would work well. Discriptive and won't make a webserver hic-up. :)
View of drysort from millsite.
Steve,offbearer for the Mobile Dimension.The fir log on the mill,would only fetch pulp price,so it was milled into 7"x10"x 20' planks for RR.Some beautiful clear edge grain came of as well.We are hoping to mill more of our logs,but this is a trial run.
One of the sort machines (966C Cat) helping out the 763 Bobcat.
The logs in the sort are bush hauled in from different blocks.As far away as 30 miles,average 15-20 miles.The off-highway truck hauls 60-70 m3.The logs are sorted by grade&species,then shipped out on hwy.trucks 2 1/2 hour to the water.More and more of our logs are also heading over the pass to the interior mills.
That's quite a log 8) Why only pulp price?
Greg,
It was "rough" because it grew next to a large slide tract.Being in the open,it had some pretty large limbs.It was too big at 52" inside bark,for our standard sawlog sort,And too rough for our premium oversize.There aren't to many mills aroud here that can take,or want the big ones. :-/
It was somewhere between 260-300 years old.
Red Pine Thinning. First thinning of red pine next to a golf course.
Thats a nice looking stand.Are there many markets for the logs,finger joint,etc? The Forest service in our district,are starting to put up similar,D-Fir,Western Hemlock timber sales.
Roadside Loading Red Pine. Yes, there are good markets for red pine in this area. Depending upon size, it is marketed for utility poles, cabin logs, sawlogs, saw bolts, landscape timbers, fence posts, pulpwood, etc.
Hydro-Ax 321. The smaller three wheeled unit for light, close work.
We have considered such an outfit as this or the three wheeled BELL harvestor. We only log our own timber so wonder if we can justify one. We have about 400 acres of mixed timber---mostly on steep hillsides and about 100 acres of planted yellow pine.
We see used ones advertised as low as $10,000---$30,000. What's the chance of getting one in that price range that would be worthwhile for us. Would we just be begging for trouble?
If you use the shear heads., how much of the butt is damaged?
I wouldn't use this unit on steep hill sides. It works best on flat terrain. A shear head may damage a foot or so of the butt depending upon the operator, shear maintenance, and tree species.
They are "pricey". Check the maintenane records and demo it when buying a used one. There are some good buys if one shops around a bit.
I believe this unit is for sale. It is located up in Michigan's western Upper Peninsula at Iron River, MI.
On the Road. "Highballing" on the US 27 freeway with pine pulpwood load for the mill.
How are the trucks unloaded? It looks like both trucks have a space between front and back.
Truck Loader/Unloader. Located at rear of most semi's main bed. Center position allows loading/unloading of truck and its "pup".
How long does it take to unload a truck and pup trailer like that?
Loading Time for truck and "pup" for the average operator is about 1 hour.
Unloading Time at the mill is about 20 minutes.
Mill will often unload you with its yard unloading equipment, but if there is a line-up of semis to be unloaded, they will let you go ahead and unload yourself. An advantage of such a "rig".
On the Road. Drive defensively. Watch for those small vehicles on the "blind" side.
Red Pine, 1st Thinning. A 3rd row removal. Short wood operation with chain saw. Slash looped and scattered.
Red Pine, 1st Thinning. The Iron Mule forwarder picks up the harvest wood along the thinned rows and runs over the remaining slash for aethetics and decay back into the soil.
Railroad Transportation. Wood products are also transported by rail. Hardwood pulpwood has been loaded into rail cars at the Gulliver Siding in Michigan's Upper Peninsula.
Timberjack 380C Grapple Skidder. On lowboy transport; being delivered to hardwood timber sale for road closure work.
Timberjack 380C Grapple Skidder. Lifts large oak log to set in place for road closure. Access roads often need to be closed after the timber harvest.
Timberjack 380 Grapple Skidder. Placing the second large oak log for closure of timber harvest access road.
There is a piece of "abandoned" property next door to me where folks have found a place to have pot parties etc. I put a live oak log as big or bigger than those logs in the picture above, across the road and it butted from tree to tree on either side. It was a strain on my 555 backhoe but I got it in place Ju-u-s-s-s-t right.
The scoundrels moved it that night. From the tracks they had used a pickup truck. :-/ >:( :D
Tom,
Road closures are often violated, but one needs to be persistent in maintaining the closure.
This one of oak logs isn't the best, but the landowner lives right across the road and its in a well traveled residential area, so there are many to keep an eye on it.
Oak logs especially aren't good to use, but these were two large hollow cull logs that would have been left on the landing for grouse drumming logs or wildlife dens. Instead we used them for the road closure for a more natural appearance.
If they were good oak sawlogs, they would soon be "stolen". If they were smaller trees, especially oak trees, fallen across the road, they would have been soon cut up for firewood and the road again opened.
In the back woods areas we usually build a series of "tank traps" (earthen mounds covering exposed stubby woody debris about 4' high or so). We placed an earthen mound at the ends of the logs here, but not excessive. When excessive, they aren't too aesthetically pleasing.
In some cases a heavy steel gate with concrete filled steel posts is used. This is more permanent.
It depends upon what the landowner wants and if he can keep it maintained. ORV's and snowmobiles are usually the most problem, but then when the violator wants to remove the closure they will use a 4x4 truck with chain, winch, or whatever.
Tom, I find if you put a very large rock on both sides of the big log it really is much harder for the scoundrels to move it. ;)
James, we don't have any rocks around here. :D
The closest thing I've seen to a rock was the concreted base of a Power Pole in town one time years ago and on it some youngster had written the Ad for a local radio station. ROCK 105. I laughed till I thought I'de die.
Sea Shells wouldn't work, Huh?
If these kids are anything like we were then, the harder you make it to move, the more determined they are to move it. I may get better results by putting wheels on it. :D
Large Rocks are excellent here also, but usually had to find unless we haul them in. Expensive, bit that's done sometimes also.
Tom,
How about a couple alligators tied to those logs down your way? :D
The kids would just eat them Ron. :D ........the gators I mean. :D :D
Ahhh the subject of road closures. Last week we spent four days in the Pigeon River SF reclosing roads. We got the north half done and the south half will have to wait til fall. We used mainly earthen berms and mixed large rocks, stumps, logs etc in with the dirt. A couple places we used large boulders for blockages. We set them into the ground a foot or so. This makes it hard to pull them with a 4x4. Most of our wildlife openings and some other areas are accessed through heavy pipe gates that have a chain and padlock on them. For the most part these stay locked. Some of them we have problems with people cutting the locks but not too bad. The worst times are bear dog training season and bear season. This brand of hunter around here has no respect for locked gates. One lock I picked up had been cut off with a torch :o. At this particular site I built a berm behind the gate too. They still cut the lock off even though there was no way over the blockage on the other side. Some of the managers want to try something new. Treated barrier posts. We've put some in but they are doomed to fail. We wanted to drill them and put a piece of 1/2" rebar in the center to keep them from being cut off. Oh no then in case of a fire the fire officers couldn't cut them off. It did no ggod to remind them that the fire crew would have a 450 JD dozer or a big four wheel drive that could push out or drive around the posts. Oh well job security 8) 8)
Road closures are a major management issue and concern in forest land and resource management, both pro and con. Especially in public land management.
All are aware of the Roadless Areas initiated during the Clinton administration and still under debate.
Road closures are worthy of a new Thread.
Timberjack 380C Grapple Skidder and its Carrier. Being loaded for transport after the job is done.
Iron Mule 5110 Forwarder. With a bunk load of aspen pulpwood.
Valmet 544X Forwarder. Loading aspen pulpwood on harvest area for transport to the landing.
Red Pine Processing Area. Note the slasher in operation and differnt product piles. Tops are in background awaiting the chipper.
Timber Harvest Access Road. Timber harvest access roads often need to be improved for access and trucking. This hill section of road is being straightened out some and graded before receiving 200 plus yards of gravel. 4 wheeled drive was needed to make the sandy hill before the road work.
A John Deere 750B Crawler does the work.
That kinda looks like what I've been doing lately except I use a D9 Cat for the access roads,I just got done my 65 acre clear cutting job,so I guess tomorrow I'll be starting my white pine thinning job it oughta be a fun time,nothing like workin the woods.
Here's a pic of my new
Rob
Heres some Pine
http://www.ronayne.co.nz/pine/logging.jpg
Her's a load on it's way
http://www.superiornationalforest.org/july4thstorm1999/images/visuals/Logging%20truck%20loaded.jpg
It's good to see some posts by loggers from other parts of the country. Keep them coming!
Aspen Deck. A "whack" of aspen pulpwood. Double decked side by side awaiting trucking.
looks more like 40 whacks :D
Ron,
Here's a pic of my friends Deere 640 w/ big floaties :D
http://www.rolligon.com/jpg/tires/72x68-28log.jpg
Her's My Buncher :o
http://www.audubon.org/chapter/mo/mo/feller~2.jpg
Here's another pic my chipper
http://www.sawbill.com/chipper.jpg
This was about 3 days work and 4 truck loads were already hauled out so I called it a "whack". A " mechanized whack". Done with feller buncher, 2 Cat Grapple skidders tree length skidding, and a slasher processing at the landing. No wasted motion.
Hood Slasher. Processing aspen sawlogs and pulpwood and decking at the landing.
Ron,
There's nothing like seeing a Slasher at it's BEST ;D
Do you have any more pics??
Rob.
Welcome to the Jungle :D
http://www.pwamazon.com.br/Arraste2.jpg
Where in the "Rain Forest" are you and what kind of logs?
Hood Slasher processes aspen products.
Hood Slasher processing and decking aspen pulpwood
Two New Cat 525B Grapple Skidders. New to the job. The one on the right has smaller tires for working pine plantation rows.
Some Armor Here. Two Cat 525 B Grapple Skidders and Hydro Ax 511 EX with sawhead.
Valmet 544X Forwarder. Loading variable length oak sawlogs.
John Deere 648 Grapple Skidder. Working on 5 Oaks Hunt Club Timber Harvest.
Ron,
That kinda reminds me of my skidder a little bit,I' ve been cutting and skidding alot of whiet and yellow Pine as of late,in fact I just bought a new 385XP Husqvarna for some felling and a brand new ;D '02 John Deere 748G dual function grapple skidder,Very nice machine though.I'll post some pics asap
Rob..
John Deere 648 Grapple Skidder. Skidders may be used for various purposes. Here its used to push the "pay load" of aspen pulpwood out over the sandy access road.
Her's a link to a pic of the 748G
http://www.cfr.msstate.edu/images/forestry/skidder.gif
Here's another one of my 748's in Colebrook N.H. in June 02
Valmet 544X Forwarder. It is also used in pushing the aspen "pay load" over the sandy access road from the harvest area. Note oak logs on bunk for weight.
Pulpwood Haulers backed up. Two rigs backed up on sandy section of seasonal county road awaiting a pull and push from skidders. Five Oaks Hunt Club Timber Harvest.
Truck Names. Loggers often name their hauling rigs.
This one is "Hard Times".
This one is named "Your Next".
O.K. Ron, be careful. There are some names that come into our mill we aint posting here :D
I dont know how they go down the road like that.
Yes, some are unprintable, but a library in themselves.
Just thought I'd say HI ;D ;D 8)
Later Rob.. I gotta go change the oil in the skidder now should be a fun time...
Timberjack 230A Forwarder. The hardwood stand is now being selectively harvested in a second operation after the red pine selective thinning.
The infastructure of access road, landing, etc. were put in first during the red pine thinning.These are now being used for the hardwood harvest at a higher value and less cost.
Cay Newhouse Hardwood Sale
Roads should be maintained to provide adequate sighting distances. This is a mainline haul road on the Plumas National Forest in California. This road is driven by the public to access private property and recreational sites. Log trucks were using this road when the picture was taken.
This is the same road as previous image.
Some roads are difficult to build and maintain. This is the end of a section of road that keeps sliding into the creek. It should be relocated and engineered to stay on the hill.
Also there are inadequate pulloffs on this section which is about a mile long.
40" 16' Douglas Fir log, about 1000 bf.
48" 16' Douglas Fir log, over 1000 bf.
Cull deck.
Oak logs... no market.
California's lack of markets and high hauling costs leads to lots of wasted logs. This should lead to lots of opprotunities for small portable mill owners but rarely does. The California Forest Practices Rules discourage these opprotunities. You will need to be a Licensed Timber Operator, and file a salvage exemtion with the Calfornia Department of Forestry to get these. As a general rule, large land owners in the state will not allow salvaging these logs due to liabilty reasons. You will have to have a minimum of $2;000,000 liability policy and you will not be allowed to mill on site.
What does it take to be a "Licensed Timber Operator"? Could a Miller operate under a Broker's insurance policy?
If the wood is on Privately owned land, why couldn't the miller mill on site? I don't understand where the landowner loses the right to process his own trees. If the miller were milling the salvage logs for the landowner, would the State still prohibit the operation? Would the landowner then have to be a "Licensed Timber Operator"?
How does the State explain the logs left in the woods to Environmentalist Whacko's when there is a market for the salvaged wood? I would think that the Government could encur as much grief over this as the landowner may encur from the Wackos for harvesting in the first place.
Just trying to understand because obviously, I don't. ???
I sure wish I could get my saw to those logs. :)
Good questions Tom.
In these pictures these logs belong to a large industrial land owner with no milling capacity.
Large land owners in California are very shy about liabilty. They believe that the economic gain is overshadowed by the possibilty of a lawsuit caused by the operation. (Fire, accident on the road etc.) Also, many times it will cost more to process the paperwork than the logs are worth.
You only lose the right to process your own trees when you sell the lumber or other final product. You used to be able to cut and process your own trees for personal consumption with any regs. This was abused (Large Ski Resort near Tahoe) and now the regs apply but to what extent I don't know.
To harvest any logs in California even on your own land you have to be a LTO. This includes firewood.
A miller can mill logs... just don't ask any questions about the logs source. The miller will not get in trouble... the land owner will.
Insurance requirements are up to the land owner, most require $2,000,000 or more. The state will not issue an LTO license without proof of $1,000,000 logger broad form. A land owner can get this requirement waved if they log on their own land only.
Then, in order to log your own land you have to put a plan together that is put together by a certified foresters that certain fees and reg. that he must file and pay for? This could or will cost you several thousands of dollars? I see in the future that Oregon woodland owners will be falling into this trap?! :'( :-[
Valmet 544X Forwarder. It comes over the hill on the skid road to pick up another load on the Five Oaks Hunt Club timber harvest.
Valmet 544X Forwarder. Loads oak sawlogs for transport to the landing. Five Oaks Hunt Club Timber Harvest.
Valmet 544X Forwarder. Carries load of oak to the landing. Five Oaks Hunt Club timber Harvest.
Where's Five Oaks Hunt Club?
It's a small private hunt club southeast of Manton, MI and north of Long Lake neighboring State forest land. Cabin and property is owned by 3 brothers and associates from Novi, Dearborn, MI area.
They contract ARC Consulting Services for their land & resource management planning, timber harvests etc.
Another such hunt club I work with is Circle V Hunt Club up on Wheeler Creek north of the Manistee river east of Sherman, Mi and south of Traverse City, MI. It also neighbors State forest land. Such clubs have a lot of huntable acres with the public use of adjoining State forest lands.
The Circle V Hunt Club won the Wexford County Conservationist of the Year award a few years ago due to their land and resource management planning and projects.
Ron,
You got any new pics of any harvest's??
Not right now. Should have some more soon; didn't want to bore you. Hopefully others will post some. I would like to see some from other parts of the country.
Hey Ron here's on of my friends site's with my skidder and his forwarder
http://www.mackenziechamber.bc.ca/skidder_forwarder.jpg
Boy I wish I had a digital camera !
Several posts ago Ron showed a picture of a logging road blocked by two large rocks. About 6 miles north of us there is a logging road closed the same way. The rocks are about belly button high. Yesterday morning we went by there and there was an old junky looking 4WD pickup with big tires balanced on top of the rocks. I can't wait to hear the rest of the story.
Noble
Was he balanced on his wheels or his rocker panels? It makes a big difference. :D
If he was on his wheels, it is a great sign of defiance. ::)
If he was on his rocker panels it was a sign of defeat ??? ;D :D
All four tires were in the air. I thought maybe the landowner had put it there to be funny, but it was gone this morning. I'll bet someone was wearing a real sheepish look.
Noble
Noble, you don't have to spend a lot of money to own a digital camera. Go to Walmart and look for a Vivitar "Vivicam 10." It is a point and shoot digital camera that sells for under $50. Comes with all the software you need, and takes some pretty nifty pictures. If I wasn't so lazy, I'd learn how to post pics and show you some samples.
BTW, it isn't displayed with the fancy cameras. It comes on a bubble wrap card and you will find it over with the Instamatic type rigs.
DanG, I appreciate that info.
Now all I need is a new computer that can handle the pictures. I see one advertised on TV for about $700 with all the bells and whistles I would need.
We visited our kids at college this weekend. Our son is working on a PHD in math and teaches a couple of classes. He had a little work that had to be done at his office so I went along to check the forum. Their computers were so much faster than this one it was unreal. The moniter was about one inch thick. There was a plug-in on the keyboard to hook the digital camera direct. I WANT ONE !!
Noble
Stihl,
Excellent pictures and some impressive equipment. I note that you are usually chained up or have tracks on the rubber tires. Do you run this way all the time in New Hampshire or can you run straight rubber?
Ron,
I don't always run chains on my equipment,but one of the skidders always has a set on it at all times,and my other skidder usually just runs on the rubber,New Hampshire is strange in some spots you really have to run chains and other's you don't it all depends on where I'am,one thing I know is it's no fun to take them on and off all the time :-[.
Later Rob....
Here is the set up at woodman's place. (he made me do this!)
garry
Truck Names
Some log hauler truck names noted in route while crossing the U.P. to Iron River and up to Hancock, MI the past few days were:
"Broke Again"
"Double Vision"
"Spud"
Here are a couple for ya!
These were both in Ketchikan, Alaska years ago.
"Hardly Able" logging company. It was his real parent given name.
"Preporation H" Pile driving company. They put in docks and such.
Haven't seen too many "creative" names on log trucks, around here, but there was a small paving company, a few years back, that was owned and operated entirely by women. They called it T&A Construction Co. ;D
There is a small 3 man home building company down here called Close Enough Construction . The name alone would give me doubts about even having them build me a dog house.
I like AFAB Construction. Anything For A Buck :D
A friend of mine used to have this sign over his shop door.
"We screw the other guy and pass the savings on to YOU!!"
Back in the 60's the favorite stock car driver in Springfield Mo. was Lester Friebe. He drove a purple Buic. Lester had a garbage route in Springfield. His purple trucks had a sign on the side "Satisfaction guaranteed or double your garbage back"
Noble
A couple of signs, seen locally:
On a local radiator shop: "A great place to take a leak."
On the back of a portable toilet truck: "Do your business with us."
I won't even mention what was on the truck of a local butcher's shop. :D :D ;D
On the side of a septic system cleaner's truck:
We're Number One In The Number Two Business!
:D :D :D
a frined of mine had a septic pumping service with the picture of a skunk painted on the back along with a caption, "STINKY". Boy, are we getting far from the thread? :'(
Guy's what happened to the original thread???
Stuff goes round and round here Stihl_Magnum. It'll come back around one day :D
"Log hauler" rig names. I talked to one driver yesterday with a new rig. He is going to name the new one "Hard Times". The old one was named "Two Tracker".
My Southern Loggin' Times has an article in the Industry News Roundup that Timberjack Replaces the 240D Skidder.
I quote the first paragraph:
"Timberjack made history again last summer when it ceased production of its 200 Series of skidders. The last unit, a 240C cable machine bearing serial number WC240CC001178 rolled off the assembly line June 18 at Timberjack's plant at Woodstock, Ontario. It was number 23,795 of the series, introduced by the company in 1961."
Tom,
You are right the 240 is now gone forever,that was a very good machine for it's size a few friends of mine have a couple that I use from time to time..It will be missed :-[
Later Rob,....
What's Timberjack going to replace the 240 with? It seems to be the most most popular forwarder here. There are 4 of them working on 3 on my short wood jobs at present.
A couple more "log hauler" names noted are:
"Daddy"
"Poor Boys Dream"
Small Slasher, Hawk Hydaulics, Inc. Cuts hardwood round wood products at the landing.
Tree Farmer C5D Cable Skidder. Used on "short wood" job for pulling down leaners and road side trees where safety and falling placement is critical.
Harris Hardwood Sale, 10/02.
Hey Ron nice little tree farmer you got there how do you like it?Nice pics by the way I'm suprised no one else post's any pics for us to look at...I have been thinking about looking into purchasin one of the new JD 848G series dual function skidder's for a few weeks now I guess I'll have to swing by NorTrax East this week.... ;)
Later Rob....
A Logger's Pick-Up Carries Their Needs.Tool Box; Fuel Tank for skidder & forwarder fuel; Storage Boxes for spare parts, hydraulic hoses etc., Lunch Cooler; Chain Saw Oil; Extra Chain Saw ( Husky 288XP) etc.
That JD 848 is that the TJ 660 painted yellow?
Black Cherry Logs. Ready to be forwarded to the landing after the cutter returns from his lunch break.
smwwoody,
I don't really know for sure but I will let you know by the middle of next week..
Ron,
Nice pics as always ;DI almost thought that you took a pic of my truck till I saw the 288 and not a 385 and 064 ;).
Later Rob..
1990 Timberjack 240A Forwarder. Carrying out a "bunk" of hardwoods. Harris Hardwood Sale 10/02.
Ron do they leave the middle piece (the one that saw is touching)in the woods or do they take it out to be sawed into lumber? It seems to me that there would be some real nice crotch wood in that piece.
Thanks Hillbilly
Hillbilly,
The center crutch piece of the black cherry was left in the woods. It's there for anyone that wants it or it becomes a grouse "drumming log".
Timberjack 240A Forwarder Unloads Sawlogs at the Landing. Harris Hardwood Sale 10/02.
Ron,
I have noticed in your area they use a lot of forwarders. Is there an advantage in time or perference in getting the job over cable skidders? I realize there is less impact on the land. Why do I ask? I live in North Western PA where most of the timber harvesting (saw logs and veneer, black cherry, red oak and maple) is with cable skidders, very few forwarders. If you cut pulp or firewood, grapple skidders. Maybe do to the hills?
TJACK
T jack
Forwarders don't work real well on our hill sides I have rented that big franklin that grotzinger equiptment has a few times when we had over a 1.5 mile long skid and used the skidders to pre bunch and then hauled to the landing with the forwarder. and one time when we could not get the log trucks through the snow and the state would not let us plow the truck road because it was being used as a snowmobiel trail so we prehauled with the forwarder down off of the ridge road in emporium to the golf course where the log trucks could get to. Woody
Ron
that puzzles me as I would think that someone could make some high dollar boards out of that. I don't know anything about sawmilling or logging I just use the boards. But I hope to get a mill in the next 2 years. I own a small farm and would like to cut some of my own trees for lumber.
Hillbilly
Most of my hardwood sales are selectively marked and require short wood variable length logging with none over 17 feet in length. Tree length skidding is not permitted as the primary method, thus forwarders are primarily used.
The land owner clients I have do not want their forest landscape and remaining trees damaged. More resource damage is often done with excessive use of cable skidders.
The forwarders are also easier on the landowner roads and trails. However, there is usally a limited need for cable skidders being used as you stated on hill sides, reaching into wet areas, assisting cutters in pulling down leaners, etc.
Most timber producers have both a forwarder and a supporting cable skidder on the job for support as needed, but they are not the primary skidding method.
There are timber harvests were tree length skidding is permitted and grapple and cable skidders are used, but not in quality hardwood selective harvests. Remaining trees to improve a landowner's stand quality and values can not be damaged in excess.
I've worked both in West Virginia and Pennsylvania and know the hills well in your landscapes. It is much more difficult than what we have here in Michigan, thus the terrain may dictate more use of cables.
I can recall $70,000 +/mile haul roads in West Virginia 20 years ago. We just need to be as "light on the land" as possible.
QuoteMore resource damage is often done with excessive use of cable skidders.
that should read excessive use of caable skidders with bad or lazy opperators.
Truck Driver and Timber Producer. They "talk things over" as they get ready for "a load to the mill".
Ron
how many ton do they put on those things?
I agree. The resource damage is proportinal to the experience and care of the skidder "or forwarder" operator and also the job foreman overseeing the harvest.
If you look back through this thread, you will see cables and grapples in use also. One recent timber harvest had both type machines in full production. The select hardwood area used forwarders and the aspen clear-cut areas used grapples. A cable skidder was used as a support unit on both areas.
Soil types and soil disturbance is also a concern often overlooked as to the type of unit used.
Woody,
20-30 tons of green wood depending upon the species.
Getting A load Of Sawlogs Out. While the timber producer decks a "bunk" of pulpwood with the 230A Timberjack Forwarder.
Both sawlogs and pulpwood are harvested concurrently during the selective timber harvest. (Harris Hardwood Sale, October 2002.)
Ron,
It seems as though you have allot of self loader trucks in your region. Self loaders are rare in California since they usually service small landowners that do their own logging. Lots of them comparetively in Oregon and Washington though.
Is it common to use self loaders even when a loader is available on the landing. I ask this since the loggers out west are very concerned about truck payloads since the loader reduces this.
When a forwarder is used out here part of it's task is to load trucks. So a self loader is redundant for this type operation.
Yes, the self-loaders are very popular here with the truckers that haul all roundwood products. Some of the Sawlog only producers will have just the flat bed rig and a seperate loading machine serving at the landing.
They usually don't tie their skidders up for loading trucks. If not a self loader, the seperate loading machine is often a large fork lift.
I'll show a picture of just a log rig maybe tomorrow.
The most common loader in California is the 966 Cat wheel loader with log forks much to the disdane of some Foresters including me. Landing are too big when these are used. I had never seen one in the woods until working in California. The Northwest uses hydraulic excavators (Cats, Hitachi, Link-Belt, mostly) which are much superior for sorting logs and working under a yarder. Also landing size is greatly reduced on the ground based sytem sides using these. I forgot to mention that self loader haul costs are considerably more compared to the long logger used here so that limits their role to do it your selfers, very small operators, and cleanup loads.
Till,
How about posting some pictures of the California or the Pacific Northwest logging operations when you can? Everthing's on a much bigger scale out there with different techniques for the "high country".
I once worked a 16 person logging crew in Oregon during my firefighting days. They were real professionals falling that ponderosa pine on those steel slopes. We traveled in there own bus which their mill provided.
On the Road Again. Load of sawlogs on flat bed rig traveling down State Highway 115.
Some more Log Hauler Names noted:
"Fast Forward II " (Not sure where Fast Forward I is??)
"Walking The Dawg"
"Gear Jammer"
"Bigger Bear"
These were all noted in Michigan's U.P. "Spud" was also on the road again.
I've been trying Ron, but unlike you I don't often get to work with loggers. My tasks are over long before they show up, sometimes years before. I was trying to find time to get pictures of a yarder operation in the Sierras this summer but never got over there before they were done. Yarders are not real common in the Sierras any more.
These pictures were taken in 1980,when we were logging at Woodfibre BC.
The top picture is a 1963 Madill yarder.The spar is hinged,and is raised first with a hydraulic ram,then lifted the rest of the way up with the two raising guylines on the front.As it goes up,the donkey puncher,slacks off the other four,till the spar is near vertical.Then they are slacked off & tightened till the pipe is at the desired position.
The man standing on the log pile,is my dad.The donkey puncher is Lorne Crocker.The winch on the yarder is a 110 Skagit, handjammer.It was taken off it's sleigh in 1963,and fitted on a Madill carrier.This was the last season we used it.
The bottom pic is the yarder(Back down the road) and a LS-98 Linkbelt loader.
Link- Belt with a snorkel no less, never seen a snorkel in the US. 8)
Tillaway,
They're kind of a BC thing aren't they? Do they still run many Link-belts down there?
Never heard of one until I went to the Charlottes. Never saw a grapple yarder either. Those are unique to BC. The company out there had a snorkel and a super snorkel on a Madill.
All most all those cable Link-Belts were converted to shotgun yarders as soon as the hydraulics started to get popular. Some of the old boys still run them in Washington. I've even seen some old dipper stick type there.
Have you got any shovels with tong throwers up there yet?
I haven't seen any around here.There were a few super snorkels around a few years ago,but aren't to practical anymore because of multi chart areas.It would cost to much to break down,move and reasemble.There was a 150' on a American 72-20.I saw a few working,and was impressed by them.
We have a newer LS98 now that we added a kit to the power down side of the winch.It gives us twice the line speed when needed,and we yard comfortably up to 450'.The 98 is used mostly for cherry picking,but occasionally yard and loads corners and small patches.
I will try to take some pictures of the grapple yarder this week.We mostly use the grapple,but have the dropline carriage on right now.
I took some pictures of the grapple yarder,and 330LL working in the fog today.
Looking down from the guyline stump.
View from the cab of the 330LL
Those pictures are 8) Paul. When I was laying out Blocks for the grapples we try to limit the yarding distance to 200 meters. Can you yard futher than that or is that about it. We also tried to layout so as we could get a hoe trail around the bottom to use the hoe for a tail spar.
Some " heavy duty " logging. Great to see other parts of the country and their forests at work.
This is a small block,and the maximum distance yarding is around 600-700'.The two mainlines on the yarder are 1150'.They have to be kept close in length,or one line will pull faster,and the grapple will tend to open and close at will.
600'(around 200 meters) is optimum for this machine,but we've been out to the end of the mainlines a few times.In a steep block like this,especially when it's raining,almost every log needs to be grabbed by the loader,before the GY can let go.If not ,the logs will shoot back down to the crew below.
Tillaway,
We love it when there are backspar trails.Number one production 8) Too steep here though,the slope has no break,till the road mainline at the bottom.
Does anyone have any pictures or expirience with CAT crawler skidders like the 527 or 517. I like thses machines but i don't know a lot about them.
Lot's of them out here. The preferred skidder in these parts, but hey it's steep. They run them here on slopes up to 70% with with steeper pitches allowed. :o I'm sure theres a serious pucker factor though. ;D
Thats interesting. Unforunatly here on the east coast there really isn't any need for them but i'd really like to see someone try one just to see how it goes. You don't have any pictures of them at work do you?
So with this high lead grapple, no chokers/setters? Can the yarder operator can see what he is doing and grab the logs?
What a tough dangerous job to eliminate, if that is the case.
Steve,
In most cases,the operator can spot his own logs.If he can't,the hooker has a radio to guide him.It also speeds things up in the landing,by not having to drop the logs,and slack the lines,and have the chaser run in and unhook the chokers.
If there is poor deflection,the dropline carriage is used,or in extreme ground,the butt rigging is used.Both require chokers
Paul
How does production compare to your drop line rigging. I'm trying to figure why I haven't seen any working in Oregon or Washington. One of the reasons I can think of might be the limited yarding distances.
I don't have any pictures of the 527 yet. I'll try to get some next time I see one. I was told by someone that operated them that they really excell at skidding but don't work as well as a regular dozer for earth moving. It has something to do with the weight balance.
Tillaway,
The grapple will out produce the dropline in most cases,especially up to 700-800'.Faster turns,faster landing,no crew to scramble out of the way.Even faster hanging on the excavator.If we are in small wood,and out 800-1000',then it's usually better to fly 3 or 4 chokers on the carriage.
I wonder if the drop carriage is used more in the States because of the thinning and shelterwood systems?I also noticed more Longline shows.In our district,we have more for small patches,and guts&feathers left by the bigger outfits that came through before us.
I think your right Paul, it's the partial cuts. Road building is another, it's avoided whenever possible. The blocks I was laying out up there had allot more roads bisecting them. We would have just put one road at the top or bottom in the states and long lined it.
I had the pleasure of working with a very sharp logging engineer for several years. They take great pride in logging helicopter units with cable. He used a 110' Berger tower with massive skyline extensions to do one near Happy Camp, CA. They flew out the haywire with a helo and used a rock drill to bore holes in a cliff face to set bolts to use for tail holds. There wasn't any trees on that side of the canyon that would hold. I can't remember how far it was to the tail holds but I do know it was over a mile. He did some serious pencil scratching to figure that one out.
Tillaway,
That is a mind boggling distance.They must have had a block purchase to lift the skyline.Just the weight of the line alone,would be something,then to add the weight of the logs onto that,look out.Were there intermediate supports?
The rock anchors work well,but we always feel better hung on a stump.,Just a mindset I think.
Are there breaks/incentives for logging a heli block with a conventional system?
No multispan, they were operating at the absolute weight limits. I asked him about the wieght problem and he had it all calculated. They had to buck the logs in the same mind set as on a helo unit to keep the weight within the working load of the lines. By the way they had just respooled the yarder with fresh cable and, may haved been the swaged stuff but I DonT recall. I asked him about the bolts as well and he said that they were stronger than any stump, of course he was in good rock too.
I was at the Oregon Logging conference a few years back and the manufacturer of Acme carriages was giving a seminar on long spans. It was his belief that 90% of whats helo logged now could be cable logged. He had a video of one his carrriages working rediculously long span 6000' or so If I remember correctly. The yarder hit fourth gear sending the carriage out. It was a 300' drop from the carriage to the ground.
Nearly avery cable logger does multispan and has long span capabilities, if you don't then you are very limited on the jobs coming your way.
There's a significant financial payoff for logging helo ground with the long spans. Company "A" bids on the timber sale as laid out for helo planning to use helo. Thier bid on the timber will be significantly lower than company "B" that plans on getting creative with a cable system.
Have you seen the Eagle carriage that can go around curves? It was also discussed in the seminar. So now if you want to cable log in Oregon or Washington you need to be able to multi-span, long-span and go around curves. ::)
We have been dragging our feet on doing any heli logging.There has been pressure from our District Manager at BCForest Service to access hard to reach timber.We have built road into some pretty tough spots,and have done a cold deck and swing in a block at North Creek.The numbers were run before hand,and it was worth it.
One reason we don't want to fly our wood is it would shorten up the season for our crew.Another is we have the equipment,and the manpower,but most of it would sit idle,while the helicopter company is making the money.Heli has its place,but not for us right now.
Do you remember the size of the Skyline(diameter).Berger is a pretty good yarder isn't it?
I haven't seen the Eagle carriage,but it sound interesting.Is it the Eaglet motorized carriage that is used down your way?
I don't remember the size of the skyline, it's been a while maybe 1 1/4" but its just a guess.
The engineer that did the pencil scratching was also part owner of the mill and purchased that big Berger years before. It was the biggest he could buy at the time. He liked them allot and in fact and this yarder was pretty much the last of the really big iron running in the state in the late 1980's. Part of their niche was contracting out to competing mills to log sale units that could only be done with the big Berger.
Yes Eagles, Acmes, and Boman come to mind. I don't know which is more popular. They are all motorized carriages.
Heli is popular in California simply because yarders are scarce outside of Redwood country. Also the loggers that do have them usually aren't interested in multi-span, long-span operations. Also forest engineers are scarce here and the Foresters that write the Timber Harvest Plans are not real up on engineering so they don't write a skyline option into the plans. Also CDF is not real sharp about logging systems either, so allot of cable units get flown needlessly (Columbia Helicopters is happy about that).
The last OLC I was at Canadian Air Crane put on seminar about selective harvesting high quality trees in really nasty places. They would climb the trees and limb and top them then cut at the stump leaving a little strip of holding wood with wedges in the saw kerf to hold them up. They hung a set of Esco graples horizontally form a Skycrane and grabbed the upright tree, gave it a wiggle and flew away with it. The tree never hit the ground until it reached the landing.
This was taken in 1987 from the tail block on the Skyline.We had a 071 Madill mini tower.The spar on the yarder was 42' high.The system we were using is what we learned as a North bend.The mainline comes out through the fall block,and up to the carriage block on the skyline.It allows us to side block along the skyline road,and take a larger swath.This ground was broken up,and had a sharp break at the backend,and a bad hump in the middle.This particular road was out over 1000'
This shot was taken up at the hump,looking back toward Mt Garibaldi.(dormant volcano)
Tillaway,
I have seen pics of that heli grapple system in a lumbermans magazine,interesting.Have you seen where they are flying disasembled hoe chuckers into heli blocks in pieces,then reasembling them?They chuck the block into bundles for the chopper.
I bet it's a real bear to reassemble them in the block. Do they fly the under carriage first then set the house on top with the boom to follow?
Do you run your own D lines and use Logger PC?
This is the machine I was refering to,not an excavator at all ::)
It belongs to Tymatt Contracting,here in BC.He contracts for Weyerhauser,Stillwater Division.These next two pictures are from Logging &Sawmilling Journal.They show the buncher being reasembled after it's components were flown in by chopper.
Tillaway,
We don't run our own deflection lines,that is done by our forestry consultant,John C Howe of JCH Forestry.He is based out of Squamish,but also does a lot of work on BC s mid coast.They didn't lay our skyline block out,it was done by a engineer by the name of Dave Cameron.He had cut the line off at a good point,but there was good wood just behind it that we felt was worth the extra rigging.
Logging Journal link (http://www.forestnet.com/archives/Sept_2002/index.htm)
On The Road Again. Log haulers headed north on I-75. An empty passing a full load.
Log Hauler Names, noted on last trip up to western U.P.
"Animal"
"Flash"
"Gear Jammer"
"Not Satisfied"
"Spud"
"Hot Dog"
Chip Van. Ready "to roll" with a load of fuel wood for the local Cogen. Plant.
Jonsered 2054 Turbo Chainsaw. Being rested on a stump while harvesting black cherry and hard maple sawlogs.
Load Of Sawlogs On Way To The Mill. Hardwood sawlogs from the Newhouse Hardwood Sale; October 2002.
Timberjack 240A Forwarder and Tree Farmer C5D Cable Skidder. Parked at the landing. Timber producers often have one of each type on the job. Harris Hardwood Sale ; October 2002.
Delivering The Equipment To Start The Logging Job. During the winter's first snow. Kendziorski Hardwood Sale; December 2002.
The Logger's Pick-up. A look at another one carrying the needs for the day. Kendziorski Hardwood Sale; December 2002.
I am going to try this one more time this is my friends Timberjack460 cable skidder and JD650g
Wow I finally figured it out the pic is a little fuzzy but I think its ok.
Looks like you did it to me Craigc90. It takes some gettin used to but should be easier now. That's some nice equipment. I just wish I had some like it.
Hillbilly
Valmet 544X Forwarder. With "bunk" of hardwood pulpwood. Kendziorski Hardwood Sale; December 2002.
Those look like some nice sticks for pulp. Do you guys use a chipper in the woods or are those logs chipped at the mill?
We do both here Scott, but in the case of the load on that forwarder, that wont be chipped in the woods I would bet. When total chipping in the woods they take tops and all. Most chip operations will use a feller buncher to "bunch" skids of wood in a accessable spot the usually a grapple skidder will take it on to the landing.
Quite an interesting thread of posts and photos. Too bad I can't sit still for long enough to look at all of them!
If any of you ever get to NY state, there is an extensive and quite interesting logging exhibit at the Adirondack Museum in the hamlet of Blue Mountain Lake in the Adirondacks. See www.adirondackmuseum.org. Visit their section on history/adirondack industries. Also check out the book store in the History section for some books on the history of logging. Very Interesting.
Now you guys talk about a "whack of logs"?? Let's see if I can make this picture load!
Tha's quite a Wack, MV.
Yep I drink a lot of coffee too ;D :D
Make your next cup decaf and see if you can stay awhile, we
re having fun and the more the merrier. ;) :)
Husquvarna 395XP Chainsaw. Being used by this cutter to harvest Aspen and Oak sawlogs and pulpwood. Kendziorski Hardwood Sale; December 2002.
Pulpwood Hauler. Prepares for turn off US-2 for access into Mead Paper Mill's wood yard. Escanaba, Michigan; December 2002.
Railroad Siding. Rail cars of pulpwood being loaded for pick-up at the Gulliver R.R. Siding in Michigan's U.P.; December, 2002.
I am suprised all these photos don't show snow on the ground, being in the UP of Michigan. We haven't seen grass in Northern PA since a week before Thanksgiving. Great pictures Ron. It is interesting to see how things are done in your neck of the woods.
TJACK
Yes, it has been somewhat unusual so far. We haven't had a lot of snow yet. The snow has been all around us. Not much in the UP either. They were getting a little yesterday I guess. It rained here most of the day yesterday with temps up to 40 degrees. Got washed out of the woods.
There will be some snow photos ahead though.
How about some Pennsylvania photos? I do recall some heavy snow seasons there.
Ron,
I may have spoken to soon, it was 50 here today. Now I can see grass on the road sides. It was refreshing as I drove with the window part way down. As far as pictures, I don't have a digital camera although, I do have a friend that will let me use his. I will see what I can do.
Take care and have a happy new year,
TJACK
I don't have a digital camera either. Just a plain 35 mm and use a scanner.
Hey Ron, how come the trucks you show always have so many axles? Seems like more than is needed.
The heavy loads that they are allowed to carry here in Michigan require the multi-axels. The gross weights that these mult-axels carry run 154,000 - 157,000 pounds. They can only run in Michigan as most states only allow single axel rigs.
The State has been trying to stop the multi-axels, but the logging industry has prevailed in their use so far.
They may run the multi-axels into Ohio some by special permit only
Thats pretty interesting Ron. Are the multi axles only used in the hardwood or does the softwood loads weigh alot too? Around here trailers usually only have 2 or 3 axles on log trailers and the B-train chip vans have 2, not very exciting but it works i guess.
The mult-axel rigs are used for both hardwoods and softwoods. Double axels trailers are used also. That's what the chip vans are.
Log Hauler Wears Christmas Wreath. Roadside loading during December's snow (now gone). Note the multi-axels with
42 tires. Kendziorski Timber Harvest; December 2002.
Thats a nice tough looking truck Ron. I don't know much about trucking so i can't really carry on a conversation about them. I see you have a lot of forwarder pictures. Do you have any expirience with the boogie tracks used on them sometimes?
Not much experience with the tracks of the forwarders since they aren't used much in this area. Mostly just just the rubber tires.
Do the forwarders do as much rutting as the skidders Ron? In my area i've seen a lot of skidder action and i'm quite disgusted with them. I'm sure if the operators actually cared about what they were doing things would be better. Around here not many operators run a CTL operation so i don't really know much about them, it seems like a better system in a lot of cases though.
Valmet 544X Forwarder. Picking up sawlogs and pulpwood behind the cutter. Kendziorski Hardwood Sale; December 2002.
Yes, the rubber tired forwarders compared to skidders are usually easier on the landscape with less disturbance and resulting damage on selection harvest areas.
Hi Ron. I notice you were listing truck names awhile back. I rember seeing one called the Bacon Maker. Once when i was visiting my relitives in Nova Scotia I saw a tow truck called the happy hooker :o. :D.
Timbco Tracked Processor Stuck. A logger's day takes a turn for the worse when the productive Timbco tracked processor broke through a "spring hole". The unit was stuck for a better part of two days."Heavy armor" had to be called in to retreive it.
Harris Hardwood Sale; December 2002.
Oops...I did that with a pickup once... took me a week to get it back.
Timbco Tracked Proccessor Still Stuck. A Komatsu Crawler (D7 size) with winch frame is called in to assist in removal of the Timbco from "spring hole". Harris Hardwood Sale; working aspen clear cut area near head waters of Wheeler Creek; December 2002.
Those pictures reminded me of something that happened up here a couple years back. The contractor was working behind a Fabteck FT133 in a cedar swamp skidding cedar (naturally). at the beginning of the swamp was a very steep hill, maybe 30 feet. Anyway the skidders were in after a good rain and when they went to go back up the hill with a grapple full of wood they got mired down. The mud was the nice black stuff cedar swamps are known for. The timberjack 560 and 450 were burried about 2 feet up the arch. the 560 was in worst and it was lop sided the mud on the side farthest in was up to the window on the door. The loggers got a hitachi EX200 in but it got stuck too. The front of the tracks were sticking out of the mud a few inches but in the back the engine compartment was litterally level with the ground. Interestingly enough it started right back up. Words can't descride how bad these guys were stuck. I wish i had a camera with me. Nice timbco Ron.
Timbco Still Stuck. More heavy equipment is called in to work on freeing the tracked Timbco from the "sink hole" while workers place aspen logs under the tracks to "jump it out". Harris Harfdwood Sale; December 2002.
Timbco Back On Firm Ground. It now needs to be taken in for a "steam cleaning". Harris Hardwood Sale; December 2002.
Ron it's good to see you guys got the processor un stuck,your right it looks like it could use a bath ::)
Later Rob.
Ron do you happen to know if that Timbco was put together in Iron River. It looks like one of the models they build at the Lakeshore Plant.
Chet,
I don't know if this one was an Iron River product. It is owned by Sam Fahl, Fahl Forest Products, Mancelona. I never did get a "clean" look at it as it was already "sunk" when I came on the job.
I'll check the Timbcos out closer in the future to see if they're from Iron River though.
Timberjack 380B Grapple Skidder Harris Hardwood Sale; December 2002.
Timberjack 1010B Double Bunk Forwarder Harris Hardwood Sale; December 2002.
John Deere 540C Cable Skidder. Used for logging the hillside terrain on the Harris Hardwood Sale; December 2002.
John Deere 540C Cable Skidder. Rolls down hillside skid trail to remove selectively marked sawlog and pulpwood trees.
The hillside skid trail was waterbarred with round wood and slash upon completion to prevent any possible future erosion.
Harris Hardwood Sale; December 2002.
Nice work Ron I see it's kinda muddy out your way also..
Falling and Bucking Black Oak Sawlogs The cutter uses a Husky 395XP chainsaw. Kendziorski Hardwood Sale; December 2002.
More wood hauler truck names noted in my travels.
"Blue Ox"
"Patchwork"
"Spud" (Again)
"Dog Train"
"Boo"
"Polar"
An informal survey of the number of wood hauler semi's traveling Michigan highways was made during a recent trip from Cadillac, Michigan to Iron River, Michigan to Hancock, Michigan and return.
Miles Traveled: 974 miles
Number of Days enroute: 3 days
Number of Wood Haulers counted enroute: 82 semi's
Results:
1 log hauler /11.9 miles of highway
27 log haulers per day on highways
A good way to pass the time; "counting logging trucks" and observing their "handles".
Ron,
I'm with you , but I doubt it'll ever replace "a hunnart boddles uf beer on da wall"
Noble
Take a look.
There has just got to be one heck of a story to go with this picture!!! :o
Sure would like to hear it. This guy had a badder day than I did today ;D
klh
Yes, lets hear more. More pictures also??
Unfortunatly i don't know the story. I found them on a local university site. I'll email them and see if anyone knows anything.
This one isn't as bad.
Is this a road building job, pipeline construction, or a timber harvest??
Ron, i found it on the university's forestry section so i assume it was a logging road they were building. I have no clue why the guy drove on the pond or whatever he's on.
What do you guys think of this rig?
John Deere 740 Skidgine. 900 gallon water capacity, 300 gallon foam tank, front water monitor, full plumbing of a conventional fire engine and an angle blade.
A new life for an old skidder. This is a fully functional fire engine that saw service in Colorado and other fires during the summer of 2002. It's back at the shop for upgrades.
Fire fighting is has always been a side business for western logging contractors. Some take it more seriously than others.
We have the Firetrack here as well. It is owned by another contractor. It is a converted Army missile carrier that now sports a blade, fire engine capabilies and a flame thrower for back fires and slash burns.
Fornt view of monitor.
A $8000 dollar addition.
The controls, notice the joystick in the upper right corner. This is used to control the monitors spray direction and foaming capabilty. The foam is used to prevent structures from ignition during wild fires.
Hi Scott
What is that thing? Looks like at cross between a Treefarmer and an IHC Quadratrack farm tracktor with heavy duty tracks. I'll bet it really pulls!
Mark
It must be a custom kit. I've only saw 2 pictures of such machines on the web and both were from Canada. i think the base machine is a Timberjack 480B or C.
Make: Timberjack
Model: 480 4-track
Year:
Price: $$30,000.00 CD
Condition: good
Hours: 6955
Serial: CK2316
Description: D5H running gear, winch and grapple U/C good condition; Cummins 6BT motor; 11'8" wide weight 53000 lbs. steep slope skidder
Ron, lets see some more pictures.
I don't want to bore everyone, but will have some more pictures as the logging picks up some with improvements in the weather. Hopefully others will post some also.
I DonT think you gotta worry about boring anyone, Ron. :) You've posted some fantastic pictures on this thread. Just keep'em coming. You really should look into a digital camera, though. You must be spending a fortune in film developing. :o
Iron Mule 5010 Forwarder. Carries a "bunk" of aspen pulpwood. Harris Hardwood Sale 1/03.
Thas a funny looking forwarder. Is there any reason for the short bunk and the front axle being back so far?
Iron Mule 5010 Forwarder. A closer look. The Gafner, Iron Mule, first built in 1957, went through several improved models and was one of the most successful pulpwood forwarders ever made. It was very popular during the mid 1960's an 70's.
In 1988, the Gafner family of Escanaba, Michigan sold their Michigan-based operation to the Finnish state-owned Valmet corporation.
A number of Iron Mules still operate in selective managed timber stands where they can articulate in and around trees doing "short-wood" harvesting with minimum impact and least damage to the residual stand and remaining crop trees.
I'm always pleased to have an Iron Mule working on my managed timber harvests.
Winter Logging Can Be Tough. Here the 230A Timberjack forwarder is being used to clear the "knee deep" snow away from the selectively marked trees to allow for low stump cutting by the chainsaw faller. Jaynes Hardwood Sale, Kalkaska County, 2/03.
Timberjack 230A Forwarder With Chains. This forwarder has its front tires chained-up for working in the heavy snow of Kalkaska County. Jaynes Hardwood Sale 2/03.
Timberjack 230A Forwarder. Decking pulpwood in a snowy woods. Kalkaska County; Jaynes Hardwood Sale 2/03.
Black Cherry Sawlogs . Falling & bucking in heavy snow. The 2084 Jonsered chain saw sits on the end of a log. Jaynes Hardwood Sale 2/03.
Caterpillar End Loader. Being used to open the access road into the timber sale area and to clear the landing and decking area of snow before starting the timber harvest.
Piotrowski Timber Sale 2/03.
Any specific reason for using the loader with a bucket? I've found that buckets are a little slow for clearing snow, I think angle blades work a lot better. How deep is the snow there Ron?
Yes an angle blade or dozer would be faster, but this timber operator doesn't have such equipment so he just brought out his own end loader from the mill to do the snow removal job.
They often make use of what they have. The snow depth there is about 18".
I never thought of that Ron. I think we have more than18 inches right now. I'm guessing we had 3 feet before the rain so its probably about 2 now. Makes for good skidding but digging out around all the stumps is a pain.
"Lumber Jill". Assists "lumber jack" (husband) in falling white pine sawlog trees. Piotrowski timber harvest 2/03.
Vintage Machine. 1968 Tree Farmer cable skidder with a "dray" hook-up for short wood logging. Tree length skidding is no permitted on this selection harvest. Piotrowski timber harvest; 2/03.
Theres a nice setup. Are those old TreeFarmers reliable Ron? I see ones like that for sale around here a lot for good prices but always figured they were junkers. The tires are a little skinny, can you get tires for them? I've never seen them with wide tires before.
I don't see many of them in use here at present. This has been the first recently on any of my jobs. Its reliable, but just very slow. I expect to see this unit replaced with a faster unit soon as the skidder owner is out looking for another machine.
A few years back there was a C5 working around here. I remeber it being a slow machine. Interestingly enough the owner did a whole bunch of illegal cutting and when the landowner found out how little he would get out of a court action he burned the machine. Or at least thats what I herd :).
Timberjack 290D Cable Skidder. Front tires chained-up for winter work. Used on timber harvest areas to dispatch "hangers", move trees on hillsides to safe bucking area, support the rubber tired forwarders as necessary, work around the log landing, etc. Piotrowski timber harvest 2/03.
Boy seeing all this old equipment, snow, and trees really makes me home sick :'(.
Sometimes I really hate being stuck out here on the DanG prairie where you have to rummage through the dump to find trees. :(
Next time someone goes into Fabco in Green Bay or Michigan Cat in Novi tell them you know where there's a lab manager who wants to move east. Heck I'd even consider Fabick!
Mark
Ron,
Clean looking Timberjack 290D.
We have one logger who has a Timberjack 208. I get to run it in the spring for a couple of weeks. It's great on the side hills, because of the low center of gravity. But it lacks a few ponies.
Our other loggers run JD 540's and a JD640 cable skidders.
Great for long and big hitches.
Around here the crews use Tiger paw chains all the way around.
ElectricAl
Valmet 544X Forwarder. Decking oak sawlogs on the landing. Used in short-wood logging. Again chained-up on the front tires only. Loggers seem to economize on the cost of chains as occasionally needed during a winter such as this one.
More care is needed in their use as chains will cause more damage to the selected "leave trees" if bumped hard by a careless operator. Piotrowski timber harvest 2/03.
As I was sawing on Friday, I watched as a truckload of logs came in. The guy was driving a bit slower than most. When he climbed up on the loader, he seemed to be taking his time and his unloading took longer than most. As he left I could see that he was probably in his mid seventies. The name one his truck?
Geritol Express
Great name for the "older" trucker. A few more truck names noted this past week are:
Grumpy
Gear Jammer
Dyer's Tonka Toy
A few more: Lost Cause
Wooden Nickles
Little Devil
and my favorite, Makin Payments
Timberjack 230A Forwarder. Working "tightly" among crop trees in a hardwood selection harvest. A. Jaynes timber harvest 2/03.
Ron,
How long is the deck on a forwarder? Most of the saw logs in your pictures look like they are around 8 to 10 feet. I know the length cut is requested by the buying mill, but can they manage a load of 16' saw logs?
Thanks,
TJACK
The single bunk units vary some, 5 - 6 feet maybe, depending upon make and size of unit. I'll measure some up to check for sure. Most of the sawlogs are cut at 8 foot (100"), but lengths will vary. I usually don't allow forwarding of logs longer than 17 feet to prevent any damage or skinning of the residuals and crop trees in a selectiveyl marked northern hardwood stand.
They will usually place the longer length logs in the center of the bunk with the 8 footers around the sides.
Jonsereds at Work. A 2065 and 2054 are "rested" on a hard maple crutch block. Most fallers have at least two saws in their "arsenal". Usually both of the same manufacturer.
A. Jaynes hardwood harvest 2/03.
Logger's Pick-up A nice Dodge. Piotrowski timber harvest 2/03.
QuoteHow long is the deck on a forwarder? Most of the saw logs in your pictures look like they are around 8 to 10 feet.
The bunk length on the Timberjack 230A is 10 feet from the "headache" cage to the back-end frame.
Around here most forwarders are setup as a "double bunk". they can carry two lenths of 8' or one of 16'. Most bunks measure 16 feet alought some are up to 24 i think.
"Lumberjill" Operating the 1968 Franklin Tree Farmer Cable Skidder. Piotrowski timber harvest 3/03.
Dray Attachment. Attachment for the 1968 Franklin Tree Farmer Cable Skidder to allow "short wood" forwarding. 10 foot bunk frame with 5 feet between stakes. Piotrowski timber harvest 3/03.
"Timber" The faller harvests a selectively marked oak sawlog tree with a "husky" chainsaw. Piotrowski timber harvest; 3/03.
Bucking Oak Sawlogs. The slash is layed down for an aesthetic appearance. The Valmet 544X forwarder will also run over it to break it up further. Piotrowoski timber harvest; 3/03.
Hey Ron,
Wonder if any of those dray attachments ever made it down south- N C? pretty neat piece of equipmeny ,what price range,availability? Are you sure the Tree Farmer was made by Franklin? I thought they were two different co.s .I only live about 50 -60 miles from Franklin factory.
I don't know about the availability of the dray for this unit. I think that it was more of a "home" built unit customized for this cable skidder. The current owner bought it all as a unit.
Yes, Tree Farmer and Franklin were two different companies. Tree Farmer was introduced in 1958 in Enumclaw, Washington as a west coast skidder and the Franklin skidder by the Drake Family in 1962 in Franklin Virginia.
The Drake family took over the Tree Farmer operation and merged the operation with their Frankiln line of equipment, retaining the Tree Farmer name. In 1990 Tree Farmer was sold to Franklin.
Pinched "Husky". One faller helps another release his pinched "Husky" from the white oak sawlog tree. Piotrowski timber harvest; 3/03.
I think that costs at least a six pack out here. "That old familiar sound of my partner hung up again".
Valmet 544X Forwarder. Grabs a white oak sawlog.
Piotrowski timber harvest; 3/03.
Valmet 544X. Lifts a white oak sawlog.
Piotrowski timber harvest; 3/03.
Two photos of my pine cutting operations this winter in Massachusetts. although the snow was deep it packed well and skidding was relatively easy. At least no mud!!
Nice pics Maple I myself cut alot of pine up here in NH also,but we don't load the log trucks that high..man thats a load ;D
Later Rob.
Yeah, the trucker took one 16 ft'r off when he realized he had too much on. That one went with the shorter stuff in the next load.
Yeah I figured he must have taken atleast a few logs back off of that load..Nice logs though,what type of machine is that in the second pic??I'm glad most of the snow is finally melted but now it's getting pretty muddy man I hate mud season :-/Where in Mass are you located? if you don't mind me asking.
Later Rob..
The "machine" is an Allis Chalmers 5050 FWD with a Farmi Winch. Yeah, I kinda work it to the limit.
Yeah I guess you do use it to it's optimum potential.. ;DSo how do you like the Farmi winch??I though it was small for a skidder..
Later Rob.
Loading Sawlogs. The trucker loads the sawlog rig for a trip to the mill. Piotrowski timber harvest; 3/03.
Rig Almost Loaded. A full load of sawlogs for Wheelers Wolf Lake Sawmill. Piotrowski timber harvest; 03/03.
The logger on my red oak sawlog sale works alone except for his log dog.
Pulp Hauler. Getting underway on snow covered access road. Note that there is no "pup" trailer due to the tight turn around at the landing, heavy snow, and the first day of the "frost law" in effect. A. Jaynes timber harvest; 3/03.
More Wood Hauler Names Noted On the Road
"Wild Man"
"Lone Wolf"
"Night Ware"
"Move It"
Pulpwood Hauler. Heads out from the landing with a "pay load" of hardwood pulp. A. Jaynes timber harvest 3/03.
Bucking White Oak Sawlogs. This faller uses a 395XP Husky.
Fueling the Husky. Fueling is needed to continue bucking the white oak into sawlogs to be forwarded to the log landing. The sawyer earns his pay.
Piotrowski timber harvest; 4/03.
Old TreeFarmer Forwarder: The logger on my red oak sawlog sale uses this old beast like it was attached from birth.
Cedar Eater
C.E,
Forwarders from what I see are a great way to keep from tearing up the land compared to tree length skidding but I have'nt really seen many forwarders out this way in NH mostly just skidders.That is a nice old TreeFarmer though I sometimes wish I had one for some of the work I do.
Later Rob.
Valmet 544X Forwarder. Loading white oak sawlogs for forwarding from the cutting area to the landing. Piotrowski timber harvest, 4/03.
Wood Hauler Names Noted on recent trip across U.P.
"Ahloa"
"Best Buy"
"Taz Toy"
"Bear Paw"
"Wood-n-Nickle"
"Big Guy"
"Daddy"
A Log Hauler's Mud Flaps. Wheeler's Wolf Lake Sawmill Log Hauler; 4/03.
Faller Delimbing Large White Oak Tree. Before bucking it into the desired sawlog lengths. Piotrowski timber harvest 4/03.
Ron,
Nice pics as always,those mud flaps look familar the Northeastern Loggers' Association sells something like those to it's members..That is a very nice White Oak the faller is delimbing..
Rob.
"Lumber Jill" Trims Limbs with Chain Saw. On harvested white oak tree. Slash is cut low and "looped and scattered" for aesthetics. "Lumber Jill" team works with her husband on the timber harvest work. Piotrowski timber harvest 4/03.
Timberjack 230A Forwarder. Working in an oak thinning. Witte timber harvest 4/03.
Northern Hardwood Thinning. A. Jaynes timber harvest; 4/03.
Ron,
Looks like another excellent job very nice timber stand,keep on improving the woodlands your doing a great job.
Rob.
Wood Hauler names noted "on the road" during recent U.P. trip.
"Stretch"
"Country Boy"
"Boo"
"Doc"
"Spud"
"Knucklehead"
"PaPa Toad"
Chaining Down the Load. Oak sawlogs ready for hauling to Wheelers' Wolf Lake Sawmill. Piotrowski timber harvest 4/03.
Safety Signing. Logging operations often need to sign their accerss roads for public safety. Brown/Krantz timber harvest 5/03.
Ron,
Where can those signs be purchased and how much are they?
Jeff,
They can be purchased at any of the sign companies or made up yourself. I'm not sure on price as there are different sizes etc.
This particular signing is used by Cook's Forest Products, Inc. down your way and placed by Jake Smith's step son who is running the operation for Cooks. Have Jake check for their source of the signs. It may be locally there somewhere.
Also, ask Jake if he looked at the Sweet timber sale there off Maple Grove Road in Farwell. Have him give me a call since its in his neighborhood. It may be a good Billsby/ Cooks operation since it has sawlogs, pulpwood, chipping, clear cutting, selection marking etc.
I never thought, I'll bet they have them at Running Gears. Miller's logging Store. Its right acrossthe highway from Cooks Log yard there off of Mansiding rd and 127
Jeff, check out the Forest Resourses Association, web site.
They have some kool signage.
Ed K
Hydro-Ax 511B with Boom Processor. Thinning a red pine plantation. Krantz red pine harvest; 5/03.
Wow Ron,
I have run and seen my share of bunchers but never a Hydro-Ax with a boom,thats a strange machine..How do it compare to using a 445 Timco or something to that effect?
Thanks Rob.
Ah I just noticed it's a processor not just a buncher wow now thats really weird.. :oWhoever owns it how do they like it??
Cook's Forest Products, Harrison, MI owns the Hydro-Ax processor. Its ok for the job intended, red pine plantation, first thinning.
It can process different product lengths and sizes to readily satisfy current market demand. Its wood utilization and slash removal is good. I'll get more photos of it in action.
Timberjack 1010 Double Bunk Forwarder. Krantz pine thinning; 5/03.
Last fall there was a TJ 1010 working on a woodlot next to ours. The land is very wet and soft but he didn't do much rutting, he didn't have chains or those track chains on it either. Nice working machine.
Western Star Wood Hauler. Comes for a load of oak sawlogs. Witte timber harvest 5/03.
Lokomo FMG 347 Processor with Sawhead (Swedish mfg.) Nelson's Sawmill Inc. harvesting aspen. Witte timber harvest; 5/03.
Another piece of forestry equipment I have never seen before,that is a weird looking little machine,kinda reminds me of the Bobcats they put tracks and a saw head on but a little bigger..
Rob.
Lokomo FMG 347 Processor (Swedish MFG.). Yes, very similar to the Bobcat processor.
Harvesting aspen pulpwood. Witte timber harvest 5/03.
Looks a lot like the cab and engine off the 1010
1 redneck, 1 ATV, 1 homemade logging arch. Thinning Doug fir. Doesn't really show, but this was a fair grade up and out to the skid road. This area was horse logged in the 1920's and hasn't had any management since. Unfortunatley, the pine beetles are killing all the big Ponderosas, but they make nice timbers if you get to 'em quick enough. BWW
Better view of arch.
Picking Up the Chains. The log hauler operator picks up his "tie down" chains for placement with the loader's clam. This "trick" and "skill" saves time and unnecessary labor. Witte timber harvest 6/03.
This is my part homemade and part bought, TSI trailer. I've already decided that the 4/wheeler isn't going to be heavy enough for any hills. But its a good excuse to get a bigger 4x4 - 30hp tractor.
As promised here are a ton of pics my girlfriend took while I was at work on a lot clearing job..I'll have some before and after shots in a week or so.Hope you guys like.
a little pine clearing
a down log view
a view towards the pile of 4 foot firewood
me hookin some chokers
Here's a shot of the big Oak stump me and fellow Forum member Chris Girard felled last Saturday
Knot bumpin'
some more bore cutting
A view of the Stand
A view of the larger Oaks
and another
a little skidding with the Treefarmer
Doing some decking at the landing
Here I'am starting the bore cut on the Pine
Here I'am on the phone ::)
here's another view of the stand being left,it does need a few trees removed in certain areas though
Here's a rear shot of the Farmer
and another
Here I'am winchin in a turn,well thats all I have for now I hope you liked them ;D
Great pictures Rob. I'll snap some pictures of the stuff going on around here, its been really busy lately but i don't have a scanner :'(. The local contractor has all his equipment within a few miles of my place. last month his 3 year old fabteck ft133 burned so he just bought a used deere 690d with an ulitmate disc saw harvester head. other equipment includes a tanguay slasher, kenworth dump truck, 2 TJ 450's (one blue/green one orange), komatsu d85 dozer and a deere 690d excavator.
Thanks Scott I figured everyone would like to see some pics from the East Coast Loggers.. ;DI would definetly like to see some pics of that equipment when you get a chance.
Rob.
Thanks for the pictures Rob. I'll dream tonight about logging. It's raining again here, so no logging for awhile.
Lokomo FMG 347. A small tracked processor with sawhead being used to harvest the aspen pulpwood stand within an oak sawlog harvest area. Witte timber harvest 6/03.
Hydro-Ax 511 B With Boom Processor. Thinning red pine in a plantation. Krantz pine harvest; 6/03.
Timberjack 1010 Double Bunk Forwarder. Krantz pine harvest; 6/03.
Loading Red Pine Cordwood. Loading the "pup" trailer of the Western Star wood hauler. Brown pine harvest; 6/03.
A very nice clean looking operation. One benefit of CTL.
"Soft Wood"; Peterbuilt Wood Hauler. Parades in July 4, 2003 celebration.
Timber Cutter & Timberjack Forwarder. Working sawlogs and pulpwood around cabin and lake area. Witte timber harvest 7/03.
Forwarder Picks Up Aspen. Sawlogs and Pulpwood.
Witte timber harvest 7/03.
Truck/logger names
Snow Ball
Puddle Jumper
Some more named rigs noted "on the road".
Pony
Rufus
PaPa Todd
John Deere 548D. Rubber tired forwarder outfitted for forest fire supprerssion. It is outfitted with a 750 gallon water tank (carries "wet water"), side spray nozzles, and a Michigan fire plow.
This unit was demonstrated by the Michigan DNR at Da Picnic, August 8, 2003.
i think you guys missed one peice of equipment granted it is low tec and takes alot of man power but when theres no other way i'm clearing 5 acers cant afford clearing saw so all the saplings are coming down with the use of loppers. ::) ::) and i can tell you its no fun but gotta do what you gotta do.
Loppers? Neat looking rig Ron, for more wildfire fighting pictures visit www.wildlandfire.com theres some nice equipment photos in there.
like i said not fancy. but when you have alot of saplins and no clearing saw and not alot of money, loppers work. not fun but i've done 3 acers with them so far. but i'd give my right arm for the right equipment. :D :D i'll tell you though i'd love to have some of the equipment i've seen. :) if i had it my land would already be cleared. 8) 8) but since i dont i'll have to make do..
Loppers? Can you show us a picture? :D :D :D
Seriously, what are you gonna do with five acres of sapling stumps that start to resprout? I generally use a bush hog, but my father has a 5' mower that goes on the front of a skid steer (aka skip loader aka Bobcat). It'll cut up to 4" trees. I'll try to get a picture.
Cedar Eater
well i plan on opening up the whole 5 acers all the trees that are big enough i will turn into cordwood for sale. ;D the saplins i will just burn or get someone in here with a chipper. the girls want horses ::) so thats were they'll go. i hope to remove all stumps and make it look nice sick of looking at just trees part of it i plan to plant some kind of greenery like clover for deer and other wildlife and i'm sure they'll like it. 8) becuase like i've said eariler not much open space around here. but your right it does grow back real quick around here. :'(
David_p,
To keep those stumps from resprouting, paint the top with round up just after you cut them. It will go down into the root system and prevent any new growth.
Might be a good way for the girls to help earn their horses :), they could follow you around and paint the stumps. Just make sure they have some rubber gloves on.
Another good tool for what your doing is a brush axe:
http://www.leevalley.com/garden/page.asp?SID=&ccurrency=1&page=10246&category=2,45794
Good luck,
Ian
thanks indy i will definatly check out the round up and it would be nice to put the girls to work :D the axe might be nice for clearing trails but i can get lower to the ground with the loppers. thanks though what i really need (want) is a cearing saw.
go through the area and spray "Crossbow" it is a brush killer, and will not kill the grass around the stump, allowing it to sbe applied with a sprayer. our horse pastures always grow up in cedars and hedge trees. we just run the bush-hog through there to clear it out.
charles
thanks charles where can i get that? like agway or something
we go to the county noxious weed department. in KS it is considered a controlled chemical and you have to have a applicators liscence for it. there are several other brush killers out that stores like TSC and Orschlens have that do the same job. Just make sure that you read the label as to what types of vegetation it kills
Charles
More "log hauler" names noted.
*Nose cone
*Getty-Up & Go
*Big Bird
*One-Of-Seven
*Dog Train
*No...You
Forwarding Oak. Forwarding oak sawlogs and pulpwood through an oak thinning area. Witte timber harvest 8/03.
nice pic Ron lets see some more.
Classic Log Hauler. 1946 Chev carries load of white pine logs. Note modern day log hauler behind. Logging Congress, Escanaba, MI 9/03.
nice old truck. now theres a man that gets every bit of use out of a peice of equipment.
Good to see old logging trucks like that , There becoming a thing of the past ::)
What is or are Loppers ??? ???
like pruners for your garden but bigger i can lop a 2" tree with them. a clearing saw would be better but......
Thanks ... ;) now I can go to bed smarter.... ;D
"Big Bird". This new Kenworth was just being delivered to Lutke Forest Products, Manton, MI and was on display at the Logging Congress, 9/03.
Owner Jason Lutke lets his drivers pick their truck color, thus the name "Big Bird". Jason must have found someone to drive it home as it can now be easily spotted "on the road" at work.
Western Log Hauler. parked along the roadside waiting for a "loaded hauler" to come out of the timber harvest area's single lane haul road before it enters for its load of logs.
Note its "piggy backed"extended log trailer when traveling empty.
Tahoe National Forest, CA; 9/03
Timber Harvest; Regeneration Cut. Tahoe National Forest, CA; 9/03.
Ron, I would think the erosion on a slope like that would be significant, what's your experience?
Yes, erosion can be a problem if the resource management doesn't continue with post harvest management. Water bars are placed, vegetative seeding is done or trees are planted, survival counts are completed the 1st and 5th years with regeneration to be insured within 5 years after the harvest.
With proper management planning, implemention, monitoring, and evaluation the erosion is controlled.
There is a tree service in Jacksonville, quite a lucrative one, that has all new equipment. Each of the crews was allowed to name his truck and the owner, Ben, had someone do the artwork for each one. They were doing the job where I was sawing Live Oak at the Church in Mandarin, Fl. and I wish I had gotten pictures of each truck. there were 5 or 6 on site. The are emerald green with yellow art work on each one. This one is the "The Hulk" and the driver has even stuck a hulk toy (red) in the radiator grill.
The owner of the company came wheeling in this afternoon in his brand new emerald green three quarter ton with fancy wheels, radios, and aluminum tool boxes. Emblazoned across the front of his hood in big Yellow letters it read, "BOSS". :D
Some really appreciate their equipment with a "personal interest" and take pride in it. Such care and "colors" soon becomes their trade mark as well as good advertising.
Some more Truck Names.
- Hello Darling
- PaPa's Ride
- The Buzzard
Husky 372 XP. This sawyer is happy with his new 372 XP as he breaks it in on some white oak sawlogs. Witte timber harvest 10/03.
Home brew skidder I stumbled across in a right of way.
My best side...
Ron, the quality of the hardwood in your area really impresses me, most of the stuff around here is chipper or firewood quality. How much does a cord of that nice oak go for?
Here is our '58 Ford.
Oak stumpage prices in this area run as follows depending upon quality and logging costs:
Red Oak Sawlogs: $307.00 - $475.00 per MBF
White Oak Sawlogs: $70.00/MBF
Red Oak Pulpwood: $7.35 - $9.60/cord
White Oak Pulpwood: $7.25 - $15.85/cord
Timberjack Forwarder. Loads an oak sawlog from an oak thinning. Witte timber harvest 10/03.
Wow. You must have really really poor white oak. Ours probably isn't wonderful but brings significantly higher prices (300-600 MBF).
Yes, we don't have much white oak of quality. Mostly northern red oak which brings a much higher price on the stump.
I read this entire post, that took a while! I'm in New Brunswick and cable skidders are the unit of choice for medium guys. Unfortunately they are rough on remaining trees and terrain with them and really give loggers a bad name. Driving them through streams while skidding, knocking over unharvested trees.
Small guys use tractors and things like Bombardier Bombi's.
Generally the cab is not fitted, only a roll cage. A tracked pulp trailer is pulled behind and a winch is fitted front or rear.
Timberjack Forwarder Picks Its Way. The operator carefully picks his way through the oak thinning to pick up sawlogs and pulpwood behind the cutter.
Care is needed so as not to damage any residual trees. Cable skidding was not permitted on this harvest. Witte timber harvest 10/03.
Outstanding bunch of photos, I just spent 2 hours going through them and enjoyed them greatly. Thanks to all, FMK
WELCOME KELTIC. I ENJOY THE PICS ALSO BUT I HAVENT SEEN THEM ALL YET . IM NEW HERE ALSO AND THERES A LOT TO CATCH UP ON. HOPE YOU ENJOY THE INFO AND FUN :D :D :D
Timberjack Forwarder. Picks up another load of oak along the cutters falling lane. The oak thinning is now completed and the sale closed. Witte timber harvest 10/03.
QuoteThe boots are from Husqvarna, my local dealer stocks a pretty good supply.
These are kevlar, steel toes and paks.
i've got a pair that look like those, but they are made by Viking. they have ice spikes too. good boots, ive had them for 3 years and they take a lickin' and keep on kickin' ;)
WOW, I can't imagine seeing a tree that large, much less trying to figure out how to cut it up for lumber! Was there really sawmills that were large enough to cut something like that? Are there any douglas fir still living today that are that large? I had heard of the big redwoods but I didn't know that the douglas fir could be that size. I would like to imagine myself walking through a forrest of trees this large. Only in my dreams probably.
yeah i wasa trying to picture them my self last night, apparently i would have to be a smurf haha... i wonder how tall that 22 footer was.
I can see some folks need an all expenses paid trip to "Mystery Trees". 8) Seein' a 300 footer growin' on another tree's branch is quite a treat. :o
I don't think they sawed logs that big although there may have been a couple mills that could handle logs that big. I think they blew them apart with explosives and sawed the pieces
Explosives huh! That is so cool.. I put that's how the egyptians built those pyramids too!!!!!!
Large trees.......yes they are still here in the NW.
This is Washington's current coastal DF
http://www.americanforests.org/resources/bigtrees/register.php?details=1956
Oregon has one 36 feet 6 inch circumference........329 feet in height.
The biggest are probably still not located in either state. 8)
Vinking, I had to delete your photos. They must be under 15k and be on our server. I had some complaints about these pages loading so slow with your photos. Please format and repost only those that belong to you. Photos from other sites are NOT allowed. They MUST belong to the person uploading or you MUST have explicit permission to use them.
I don't want to dampen your enthusiasm, its great, but we have to follow some set guidelines here.
all of the pics were mine, and they were hosted on my own webspace,.but i know most of them were just over 22kb. ill convert them into gif, and insure they are under 15kb, then repost them, i purchased them from my friends for 1cent, now I own them, so I will post them agian :)
Gif will never get under 15, and they must be on our server. I wont take the chance that a month from now our forum is full of little red x's. Purchased photos of other peoples equipment is of little interest here. If you have photos of equipment you run or deal with and can tell us something about it thats great.
Go to tools/uploading photos to get instructions.
Ok, I only worked with two of those.
Let us know if you need help formatting the pictures and we will give you some help or point you the right way for answers.
Timberjack 1410 Forwarder
Perfect! Thank-you.
A couple more "log hauler" names noted on the road.
"Tree Hugger"
"Fast Forward II"
C-4 Tree Farmer Cable Skidder; 1960 Vintage. Parked next to a Case 600/800 forwarder with Barko loader.
The C-4 originally had a gas engine but was converted to diesel with a 128 Ford 4 cylinder diesel engine which they tell me fits right in to it. Lee hardwoods timber harvest, 1/04.
Got any shots of the Case? I had no idea they made skidders...
C-4 Tree Farmer Cable Skidder. At the landing with a Valmet forwarder decking wood and loading logs on the log hauler. Lee timber harvest; 1/04.
http://www.hypro.se/welcome/welcome.htm
The girls says, -It´s not the size........ 8)
Swede
I'll get some photos of the Case when I visit the job again. The weather hasn't been very good for picture taking larely, mostly "survival".
I hear ya on the survival.. Many thanks...
That C 4 is very similar to my old honey, mine was made by Can Car in Ontario. Good pics thanks!
Hardwood Thinning; Selective Harvest. Valmet forwarder and Timberjack cable skidder parked near loggers pick-up; "lunch break"! Lee timber harvest; 12/03.
We got "blown off" this job today. Just too much snow and wind; now over two feet of snow on the hill sides. Loggers moved equipment out to other jobs further south with flatter ground and less snow.
We hope to return in March to finish this one.
Well its nice to see, I'm not the only one battling the wind. yesterday I had tops swaying 8' to 10'. today was great, no wind even got out of the hooded sweatshirt. The biggest suprise was the skidder starting at 12* 8).
Just an old swede
< http://www.elmia.se/wood/woodnews/2001/eng/torsdag/bamse.asp >
and another some years younger
< http://user.tninet.se/~irs543h/volvobm/400band.html >
Most farmers in Sweden have small areas with both woodland and fields. With accessories like "halvband" and using the same tractor everywhere he could save some money.
It was before the 4WD:s came and now they can hire a Timberjack to do a whole winter job in a week or two. But a Timberjack don´t leave anything, most forest here looks like fields.
I can drive many miles without facing two trees at a time thats time to harvest. Most areas with 5-40 y.o. coniferous trees that should be thinned out years ago. Government´s and big companys behave more badly than small/private. Money, money, moey.........
Swede.
Case 600/800 Forwarder. Old unit, re-manufactured unit with Barko loader. Parked at the landing. Lee hardwood timber harvest; 1/04.
Many thanks! I didn't know Case made skidders/forwarders. Anyone have any info on them?
1970 Timberjack Cable Skidder. This well maintained unit skids tree lengths off the hill side for bucking below. Lee timber harvest;1/04.
1970 Timberjack Cable Skidder. Cleaning snow from a spot at the base of the steep slope to buck up the tree lengths harvested off the hill side. Lee timber harvest; 1/04.
just wanting to say thanks for all the great logging pictures. I hauled 4 loads one summer from palco lumber in scotia california up at the humboldt redwoods to a little place in dalton ohio where they made little backyard sheds out of those huge beautiful redwood trees :'(, I had never seen trees or equipment that big and probably never will but the redwoods out there are something to see, back to lookin at these great loggin photos !
Bucking the Tree Lengths. Tree lengths cable skidded off the cleared ski slope area are bucked up on the flats below the slope. Lee timber harvest; 1/04.
The Valmet Forwarder takes a load of hard maple out to the landing for decking. Lee timber harvest; 1/04.
Valmet Forwarder. Sorts its product load at the roadside landing for trucking. Lee timber harvest; 1/04.
Wicked looking wood!
Getting a Load Out. The Valmet forwarder assists the "wood hauler" in loading for its 150+ mile trip to the paper mill on a blizzardy day. Lee timber harvest; 1/04.
4501 Iron Mule. Working in the winters heavy snow. Flint timber hatvest; 1/04.
Have You heard about oxen logging? 8)
http://www.myreback.com
http://www.myreback.com/Oxen1.jpg
No, other than the "live oxens" discussed and shown elsewhere on the Forum. Is that an engined powered bunk unit and does it need another prime mover??
Ron.
As any oxen the "iron" oxen is moving itselfe........slowly.
There is an Iron horse ( JÄRNHÄST) to.
http://www.se.jonsered.com/index.asp
Swede.
4501 Iron Mule. Picks up a snow covered sawlog. Flint timber harvest 1/04.
I tried hock'n a stick or two out today but the trail is still too --Photos MUST be in the Forestry Forum gallery!!!!!--.com/photo/74882584/116791060CJRumT
4501 Iron Mule. Parked at the landing for the day. This was a "snow day" for the loggers with all schools in the area closed due to the heavy snow. Travel was to a minimum. Flint timber harvest; 2/04.
4501 Iron Mule. A good "work horse" in a "tight" hardwood thinning area. Flint timber harvest; 2/04
Thinning Northern Hardwoods. Winter logging; Flint timber harvest; 2/04.
4501 Iron Mule Works in Northern Hardwood Thinning. Loading firewood bolts from the topwood. A good winter for firewood sales as well as sawlogs and pulpwood. Good wood utilization; Flint timber harvest; 2/04.
Some "wood-hauler" names recently noted on the road to and from the western UP.
"Fast Forward II"
"Killing Time"
"Unbelievable"
"Never Satisfied"
"Brute"
"Big Woody"
Over a 785 mile round trip, 83 "wood-haulers" were noted in route. Stretched out, that would be a few at 9.5 rigs/mile.
I have not seen a crawer skidding logs on this site. I use a Cat D5B with a winch. I skid tree lenth and skid usally 2 or 3 large trees in good conditions. The crawer don't cut ruts like a skidder in soft ground.
Hi mrelmertoots. I'd like to get a little dozer for skidding some day. Our woodlot is soft in places and needs roads put in. A D5 might be a little big for my needs but its still a nice size for sure. I agree with you on the rutting thing and thats one of the reasons I like dozers. They may not be as productive as a skidder and they may cost more to run but you can do more types of work and if you use it right you'll leave the land in nice shape. I've seen a few operators who can steer clutch brake almost as well as one of those new hydrostatic/ differential steering machine. I'd love to see some pictures of your D5 at work.
The rubber tired skidders and forwarders have pretty much replaced the crawlers for production logging. They are more efficient and effective on most jobs producing more board feet output per day.
Loggers that have crawlers here use them mostly for road construction, reconstruction, leveling and grading roads and landings, moving snow, etc. They then park them for the rubber tired units to do the tree and log moving.
A lot of loggers here do most of thier road builing with junker excavators to get a rough grade built up then back drag the road with a skidder blade. The roads are usually more damaging to the environment than a old dozer road but I guess they get the added grade they want by digging deep ditches. If you want production then skidders win hands down in most situations. The ground froze up real nice here this winter and the skidders aren't doing much damage.
Here is a road side 8 ' slasher.
slashing hardwood, aspen and softwood from treelength
The guy working around here has a slasher something like that except its an older Tanguay. The things pretty slow and it breaks down a lot but i guess it gets the job done. I think they cut 8 and 16 foot logs (mostly cedar) with it plus they use it for loading trucks.
Yeah this slasher can cut to any length you want. I'm not sure of the model. The contractor uses it mostly on his crown land operations. We had to use this slasher because of the small diameter hardwood we were thinning in. Helped speed up production. And it came in handy to trim up the butt rot in the fir and it also did a good job on the veneer aspen. For some reason, all my photos where from the yards. Should have taken some pictures of the job. :-/
SwampDonkey I think that slaher is a HOOD machine. The Tanguay has its saw on a slider rail and can be adjusted to most lengths. I'll try to get some pictures of the operation within this week but the film will be awhile. I'll probably be posting a bunch of snowy pictures in july :D
I just watched a movie on the Quadco site with their Levesque processor in it. Pretty slick unit. Doesn't need to make a cut on the butt of the log to know where to start measuring from like a harvester head would and it doesn't need a butt plate either.
http://www.quadco.com/site/english/home.html
I had a look at the Quadco site also. Its quite slick at that small diameter wood. By the looks of the tops it must have been mainly white birch because the crowns were small. I wonder how it handles mature hardwood with big twisty tops like yellow birch. I guess its mostly for pulp processing. But I don't see it being used for other than clearcut jobs. In stands where thinning is required there would be a lot of mechanical damage to residuals and regeneration I suspect. I don't know that it would be more productive than a feller buncher and short wood processor/forwarder (3 machines versus 2 hmmm). I've seen those types of machines used on sites with thick softwood regen underneath and the regen gets a major pounding. Because the tree gets jerked back and forth to delimb and the head reaches for the wood often times grabbing a bunch of regen in its grip. In order to be productive the operator looses contact with the leave trees and focuses on that tree he's processing.
I'de like a short wood forwarder and manual felling/bucking and limbing on thinning sites. You have to cut that wood up where it falls, and fall it in such a way that the forwarder can reach the piece. But your trail system will assure you can reach every piece anyway. Of course use directional felling, can't fall trees every which way if your going to do a good job. You'll end up passing over the same ground at different times because you can't buck the wood if its all criss-crossed either.
Hey! Git that Skidder outa my way. :D
SwampDonkey, I see quite a few Hornet/ Target processors for sale around here so i'm guessing they handle most of the stuff we'd come up against. I think theyre rated for a 24 inch log. I think most guys use them for in woods delimbing (follows the buncher around) For processing felled trees i'd think them to be more efficient than a regular dangle head harvester because you don't have to cut a slab off the butt to start measuring.Maybe they aren't all like that but any I've seen have to make that cut. I agree with you on the chainsaw thing. the machines may e fast but they can sure make a mess pretty easy.
Scott:
Yes I agree with the efficiency of that head, but you still need that forwarder to pickup the pieces, load'em and transport. Plus the extra cost of that 3rd machine to buy and maintain. There is also an increased chance that wood is wasted unless care is taken to keep the short wood together and not scattered all over. Although, not a problem in most cases.
What I doen't like about some whole tree operations is the fact that your road side has a mountain of tops. What we've both mentioned for harvesting systems eleviates that problem somewhat and your tops break down quicker on site when scattered. Athough, they aren't quite as scattered as with manual felling and topping. Doing pre-commercial thinning has proven this, there's hardly a tree top that hasn't pretty well rotted out by 12 years. Those road side slash piles just stick around a long time on whole tree operations.
Tom, what's that contraption for on front? Looks to me it's for piling up logs or brush.
It's a root rake. It's used for general cleanup around the landng and on the skid trails and roads. Practically a subsoiler, it will push out stumps and roots that bother trucks and other road vehicles using the woods roads and landing. It comes in real handy when piling wind-rows or burn piles. You'll notice that one tooth is missing. curt lost it on the last job when the bolts loosened. He means to put it back on soon.
Makes the front of that skidder look real mean, doesn't it?
Thanks for the explanation Tom. You'all must have sandy soild there and no rocks. Around here in our rocks and heavy clay I'd have all the teeth ripped off before the day was done.
We've used those root rakes up here on abandoned farmland to clear off alder and brush. Then later, plant white spruce on the site. Been 100's of acres prepared with those. Sometimes they are on dozers. We only had limited success because some operators cleared off duff and all, which cause frost heaving problems with the planted trees.
DanG it why does water expand when frozen? :D
It really doesn't expand, Swamp Donkey. It's an old wives tale. Actually what happens is that it becomes very stable and the rest of the world shrinks in the cold. I know all about that shrinking in the cold.........don't ask. :D
Errmmm :-/ I won't ::) :o
Yep, Tom .....my belt shrinks too, even when it isn't cold. ;D
Delimber & Slasher. Processing wood at the landing and decking area. Ski Brule Mountain timber harvest 2/04.
690 E John Deere Delimber. Works at the landing. Yooper Timber Cutting; Ski Brule Mt. timber harvest; 2/04.
Prentice Slasher. Processes wood products at the landing. Ski Brule Mt. timber harvest 2/04.
John Deere 850B Crawler with Angle Blade. Being used for road construction and building site clearing. Ski Brule Mt. timber harvest; 2/04.
I was wondering what folks would recommend for a small forwarder. One with a 2 cord capacity bunk and a loader, 6 feet wide bunk, closed in cab. Is there one for around $35,000 USD? I was thinking about using one in commercial thinning operations with average piece size at 6 inches. My production would be 0.75 cord/hr after trail wood is cut. I remember seeing a demo on a woodlot field day and I think they wanted $80,000 CDN, which was too pricey for the production it could muster. We are starting to see a trend up this way where the price of replacing old equipment is gone too crazy, so there are very few younger folks attempting to get into the woods business after their fathers retire. I was told by someone today that he knew a fellow that would have to dish out $1.5 million to upgrade and he's now 57 years old. He says the guy is going to work with what he has and then he's done. He's even laying off 19 people and retaining his top 3 men.
cheers
1.5 million isn't actually that bad now. I saw a 455 timbco leveling buncher with a Keto 500 harvesting head for 500 thousand. I'd imagine 2 new skidders, a buncher, a delimber and a log loader would run 1.5 to 2 million easy.
Nice looking dozer Ron, seems to be well equiped for woods work.
The small timberjack and valmet forwarders are popular here along with the vintage iron mules. Most of the timber producers work with "used" pieces but they keep them maintained and in good shape.
The large producers have "big bucks" in their logging equipment and the payments don't stop during spring break-up. :-[
The higher their costs, the more they have to produce /day.
Its quite a chunk of change, just the same, when you consider that pulp and softwood sawlogs have only increased by 15% in 15 years, while machinery cost has increased 100% and trucking costs are 30 % of your gross. I wouldn't want that bill over my head. ;) You have to have alot of ground to work to pay them bills. Just to reflect a little bit. Most farms including buildings, land and equipment is barely worth that. I know first hand, we sold 850 acres (450 acres woods) 3 years ago and we had a 160 foot by 120 foot potato storage shed with 20 foot ceilings, 10 years old. We sold the potato shed for less than half its value.
cheers
Timberjack Feller-Buncher. A tracked unit works well in heavy snow. Ski Brule Mt. timber harvest; 2/04.
There's a lot of 6 and 8 wheel forwarders around the maritimes with those wheel tracks on, they must work well.
SwampDonkey, a TJ 215 forwarder is a nice smaller machine, prices are decent too.
Scott
Do you have a link to the 215? I can only find the 810D or larger.
http://www.timberjack.com/products/forwarders/810D.htm
The 215 is an older machine, see them in the equipment trader now and then. Rotobec makes a nice small forwarder but I'd bet theyre pricey.
The Logger's Pick-Up. The spare saw on the tail gate is a Husky 254 XP. Flint timber harvest; 2/04.
Sharpening Saws. The chain saws are checked over and sharpened before starting out on a days cutting. Flint timber harvest; 2/04.
Iron Mule Forwarder. Decking wood at the landing. Flint timber harvest; 2/04.
Northern Hardwood Thinning. Selection Harvest. Flint timber harvest; 3/04.
The "Boss" and His Cutter. They ponder as to how to best buck the large sugar maple for its best grade, Corey timber harvest; 3/04.
The Timberjack Forwarder Assists the Cutter. The large sugar maple log is rolled out of the cutter's way in the deep snow. Corey timber harvest; 3/04.
Measuring the Cuts. The cutter makes measurements on the sugar maple prior to making his sawlog cuts. Corey timber harvest; 3/04. His saw is a Husky 385XP.
I had a yard full of maple like that, but they had birds eye figure in the sapwood, not all the way to the pith. So what happened was the veneer buyer rejected them for defect and the figure buyer said the figures didn't go deep enough for his market. So, St. Anne made Kraft pulp out of'em for Eastman Kodak. ::)
cheers
Equipment Repairs. A "moble welding unit" visits the timber harvest area for on site repairs to the iron mule forwarder. A fatiue crack needs welding. Flint timber harvest; 3/04.
How do you go about posting photos here. We have a bunch you might be interested in, it's at yahoo groups and is called loaderlarrys. It has pics of some forestry stuff here in north western ont.
Norant,
Go to the Forum Tools bar above and Uploading Pictures. Instuctions there should help.
Vintage Crawler This D-6 Caterpillar was being used for snow removal and road and landing grading. I'm told that it is a 1946 model. The steering was "a little loose". Corey timber harvest; 3/04.
Timberjack 230A Forwarder. Working in a northern hardwood selection harvest. Short wood, variable length logging. Corey timber harvest; 3/04.
Timberjack 230A Forwarder. Sorts wood into products at the landing/decking area. Corey timber harvest; 3/04.
Western Star Wood Hauler. The wood hauler gets prepared to leave the landing with a load of pulpwood during a "spring break-up" morning. The 230A timberjack forwarder stands by for assistance. Corey timber harvest; 3/04.
Western Star Wood Hauler. Starts to leave the timber sale area with a load of pulpwood during spring break-up. Corey timber harvest; 3/04.
Western Star Wood Hauler. Assistance is needed from the 230 A Timberjack forwarder to get underway for the hill climb ahead. Spring break-up; Corey timber harvest 3/04.
Could there be something wrong with my computer settings (monitor) because I don't see the 'forwarder' in Ron's picture at all (only an outline of the boom) unless I download the pic to photo software, and adjust the brightness considerably. Then the green forwarder stands out very clearly.
Should I adjust the monitor? The brightness is set as 'bright' as it will go, as well as the contrast.
Not complaining, but seems I am missing details of pics with what I have set up now.
Any ideas? Thanks
Beenthere,
I see the green timberjack ok, but I have monitor on Max brightness. Photo is a little dark though due to weather at the time and darker at the rear end of the wood hauler where forwarder is pushing.
I'm at max brightness on the monitor.
Here is how I brightened up the pic (at least I'll see if it comes out any different) by adding 'brightener'. ;D
Sorry to clutter up your thread here, and will delete if helpful to do so.
Red pine thinning western Ma. 04-19-04.
Good to see some logging photos from other parts of the country!!! :P
New forwarder at the Northeast Expo.
I need $$$ ;D.
:)
I was wondering when someone would post a Rottne! I work for Rocan Forestry in Dieppe NB. 8) We are the distributor for Rottne in Canada.
http://www.rocan.com/
theres a rottne forwarder working a red pine thinning up the road. i'll try and get a picture of it to post.
i saw that one at the expo 215k with tracks and chains, thats some serious money.
http://www.rocan.com/equipment.htm
There are videos of Rottnes on this site, if some of you are interested.
how the heck am i supposed to get this picture i wanterd to show to get on here? every time i do it it just winds up in the archive.
You almost had it. Read the instructions in Forum Tools at the top of the page.
The Picture was very small. You must have shrunk it to the 15k rather than optimizing it.
Tom said ""You must have shrunk it to the 15k rather than optimizing it. ""
Looks like that is a clue to what I am doing wrong to. I will try to work on that. I have one site that only takes 10k, and seems the only way I can get to 10k is shrink it. Now I will need to look into optimizing it. I will head for the instructions tomorrow. Going to postpone taking down a windmill, as the wind is to be 20 - 25 mph and chance of thunderstorms. I'll stick to the ground and try to not become the "ground" for any lightnin bolts.
Dom:
Welcome to the forum.
cheers :)
Thanks Tom but i cant seem to make them any bigger and still get them in here ::) i dont know what else to do so it looks like i wont be posting any pics. i just aint that smart i quess.
Dave:
If your using photoshop, I find that it encodes some extras into the jpg image files and its hard to optimize the photo. I use fireworks and it doesn't seem to stuff the image with 'filler'.
I live ~30 miles from Rotte so I have seen some of them. :) Most machines working in the forrests here are Rottne and Timberjack.
Swede.
I use Photoshop 5.0. Once I get the image brightness and to 100%, I just click "Image size" and change the width to 300 or less. Nearly every time, it will be under 15K. I rarely use optimizer anymore ?????????
Honest truth is, I dont use it any more either. I bought adobe photoshop 7.0 for my web graphic work and it has a save for web function with an awsome compresion tool. Bought it on Amazon but it was still pretty pricey. It is an awsome chuck of software if you can justify it.
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/stores/offering/list/-/B000063EMG/all/103-1082702-0939024
It makes it kinda hard to offer instructions when there is no baselline. I recommend that Everybody is on their own. :)
Tom why is there no baseline? The baseline is still the instructions we have always given at https://forestryforum.com/upload.htm
I just find that when Xat come into the conversation more folks than not talk about not using it. If I were a just getting started, I wojld try to follow the experts, not some "outmoded piece of software.
I think Photoshop is a fine piece of programming but its a bit of overkill for most folks probably and the price will likely turn most off. Just us folks that do web publishing and some commercial art works will likely want to dish out the $$ doh $$. I use photoshop for matching aerial photography for my GIS work. You can take two images and match them to your GIS Layers by stretching, rotating, rubbersheeting and adjusting the aspect within Photoshop and you can also create an Annotation Layer for your GIS. You can only do this fancy photomatching in Photoshop format( PSD or PDF). They are treated as layers and once you get the photos corrected you flatten the image to reduce the file size. Also, if your using it in a GIS it will be saved as MrSID or TIFF. I use TIFF, which also has LZW or jpeg compression. The compression isn't supported by some GIS programs as it takes a bit of CPU power and VM when your scrolling around in a Aerial photo layer and having to decompress it for display on your GIS. I can think of one GIS program that it would be a nightmare on, and that is ArcGIS. Every pan of a layer and the HD goes screeching. In Maptitude it pans much more efficiently and your not sitting and waiting for screen updates. Plus working with aerial photography in ArcGIS costs as much money for the extension as the entire Maptitude program suite. :D ArcGIS, definately has some nice pluses over Maptitude, don't get me wrong there. But, for what I need to do, and most natural resource management folks, it doesn't justify the price. Hmm $500 for Maptitude, versus $1600 for ArcGIS? Same scenario between Photoshop and the current available freebies or shareware online. ;)
Have a look at my crafty work with aerial photography on Photoshop and Maptitude GIS
http://www.klondikekonsulting.com/orthographic.htm
The scale is 1: 12,500 (m). The black thin lines outline property boundaries and the black circles are cruise sample locations. Looking at the photo along the International boundary you might thing the line is shifted. But, no there is a narrow and long property there. I just have not included the outline of the properties south of the Meduxnekeag Stream. I don't think ArcGIS even has sign shields for N.B. highways as I've used on route 540. You should be able to see the splice between the photos. ;D
trying again
heres a picture of my work truck
heres another picture of the rottne from the otherside
heres a load of logs fromthe yale forest.
heres a picture of the job
Good to see some Rottne's pictured. We don't have any being used locally here that I know of.
David_c
Nice work and nice pictures ta boot. :)
thanks for the compliment swampdonky but i can only take credit for the pics.
here are a few pics of the last job we did.. Heres a pic of the 648E skid
der
here are some better pictures now that they are resized thanks Jim. Heres the back of my friends work truck .. thats my 385xp on the gate , generator,fuel cans etc..
heres a pic of me skidding up over the hill before the landing
heres another pic of me skidding
same pic as before pushing leaners over
herea a pic of us skidding on top of the sandpit cliff
Well I have more to come soon..stay tuned for more timber harvesting pictures from the Northeast..
Rob
heres a pic of part of the select cut we did
heres anotehr pic
heres a picture of rob on his skidder i took today.
heres another one
The "Cutter's Stump". The large stump of a recently harvested beech tree serves as a work place for the faller working nearby. He leaves an extra bar and chain for his 385XP, sharpening file, gas & oil, and a pair of gloves for further use as needed. Corey timber harvest; 4/04.
on
the skid road 3/04
Timberjack 230A Forwarder. Decking hardwood sawlogs at the landing. Corey timber harvest 4/04.
QuoteDom:
Welcome to the forum.
cheers :)
Thanks ! Its a nice forum. :)
I'll have to take pics of the machines at work. We have a bunch of different harvesters and forwarders, mostly what we sell though.
DOM:
Did ya happen to notice how many times this thread has been read?
We except pics of any make of machinery, I'm sure. ;)
From all the Forest Forums I've came across on the web so far, this is the best maintained one and a super bunch of folks.
Western Star Wood Hauler. Prepares to leave the landing with a load of aspen sawlogs. Doyle Logging; 4/04.
Western Star Log Train. A load of aspen sawlogs slowly gets underway from the landing. Doyle Logging job next to one I'm currently preparing for sale; 5/04.
MAC Trucks. Husby Forest Products, truck no 8 with a load of hemlock and cedar from the Nadin watershed (Graham Island) on the Queen Charlotte Islands. On the way to the dry land sort for scaling , then to be loaded and barged to Vancouver Island.
Canadian Air Sky Crane used in heli-logging operations in sensitive areas on the Queeen Charlottes. The engineers do maintenance on the huge engine. 20,000 lb lift capacity.
Vancouver Island Helicopters taxi the crew to a landing on top of Sommerville Island in NW BC, just east of Porcher Canal and near the mouth of the Khutzeymateen Grizzly Bear Sanctuary on the main land. 45 minutes return flight from Prince Rupert,BC.
The crew get ready to descend down slope to the work site to mark out stands for heli-logging on Sommerville Island in BC. Near Porcher Canal.
Wait don't leave me here on this deserted island with these guys :D :D ;D
Ron, did you ask where those aspen logs were going? We have been buying 10's from Doyle lately. Seeing is is is a whole load of ten's I bet they are coming here. Looks like what they been hauling. Some of them a little on the small side. :(
Nice pics there Donk
Jeff,
No I don't know just where Doyle was taking the aspen sawlogs to other than were he was getting "top dollar" for them. If Ray is paying "top dollar" that may be where they are going. They're coming from the Lazy Lake Gun Club property in Fork Township, Mecosta county. Doyle is using the access across the Mike Austin property which we are currently prepairing for sale. 400 acres of oak, aspen etc to work over there.
Do you know when Jake plans to get started on the Dean Sale here north of Cadillac? The landowner is getting anxious.
I'm also working on a small sawlog sale down near Temple north of the Trevino Sale that Billsby done for me a few years ago so Jake might be interested in this one when I get it out on the bid market. This constant wet weather and UP trips has put things behind some.
Close-up view of the sky crane engine and the maintenance engineers.
Its us then. Hes paying more then anybody.
Timberjack 230A Forwarder; Proctor Logging The forwarder transports hardwood sawlogs to the landing. Corey timber harvest; 5/04.
More Wood Hauler Names Noted:
* Dyer's Tonka Toy
* Polish Express
* Brute
* Big Woody
* Alecia Taylor
The Truck naming must be regional. I have seen only one area in Eastern Oregon where this was done. Everybody else just uses numbers, sometimes the drivers name is on the door just under the window. I passed "Grumpy" the other day, the name looked fitting. ;D
Truck naming seems to be most popular with the wood haulers here. The company or truck owner's name is often panted on a plate on top of the cab and on the cab doors.
The truck's name (not all are named) is usually painted on the nose over the grill. Where there's a stainless grill as many of the newer ones are, the name may be on the side panels behind the cab doors.
The trucks are usually named by the owner or the owner allows his hired driver to name it. It's just a fun thing with me to note the different truck names and then note where I may see that truck again. Some put a lot of miles between places.
That Timberjack 230A Forwarder on the picture from Jeff.........For me it looks too short. Has anyone cut one axle and 9' off or is it how they make them for US market? ::)
Most logs here is 10 to 20', Just small thinning out logs and pulp wood is 8' 4"
Swede.
Sorry! :o that picture was sent from Ron! ::)
Blind Swede.
Swede,
That is what we call a single bunk forwarder. It is just like my Valmet 644 and is used for shortwood (100 inch long) wood, although I have hauled some 10',12', and even 16 footers. It is very useful in close quarters because the axles are the same distance from the center pivot and so the rear wheels follow exactly in the tracks of the front wheels.
I don't think any manufacturer is selling the single bunks anymore as everyone wants to get bigger and go to a 6 or even 8 wheel double bunk with 4 uprights. Even though I can out manuever a double bunk any day, I wish I had a double bunk so I could sort more while loading and I sometimes need the bogey wheels and tracks under the load for flotation.
The other problem with single bunks is most manufacturers are now mounting the loader on the rear section and a single bunk does not have enough weight to keep from tipping over when you reach out to the side with the loader. They must compensate with shorter loaders and automatic pivot locks but that has not been enough.
Gary
The single bunks are very popular here for "short wood" operations, though they will carry variable lengths up to 17 feet as max. Many private land owners just don't want the "big stuff" in their woods.
I think many people here use to big forest machies and tractors. One with 80 acre, stands in every ages, have an old vreck, Volvo 868. If he had a 4-WD tractor with half the power + loging trailer with 4-WD it could make the same job as that old vreck. + a lot more than just hauling logs less than 50 hours a year.
I also know one with more than 100 acres using a Fordson Dexta or a Volvo 400. That´s a little crazy too but he use them much more for harvesting hay.
Many people here just looks for tractors with 80-130HP, doesn´t matter how small areas they have, forest or agriculture. ::)
I DO understand the need for them short forwarders! :) Think I could see them here if we had some hardwood and cut short logs. But the loader at rear end at a forwarder ..... :o and why? ???
About sorting during loading, I´ve seen some trailers with 2 uprights in the middle for easyer sorting. Sometimes they load much more on one side than the other........Then it doesn´t work! ;D
Swede.
Bucking Sugar Maple Sawlogs. The Husky 385 XP is the saw of choice by this feller. Corey timber harvest; 5/04.
That's where the infamous "bow-saw" would make for an easier day. .......if it were used properly...... :P :)
Swede,
The first forwarders had the loader mounted on the rear of the front section just in front of the pivot. Some even had the loader mounted on the cab roof. When it came time to drive ahead, you had to find a level place on the load to set the grapple and put the swing, graple rotate, and up-down controls in the float position so the loader would follow the rear section as you turned or drove over humps. If you did not find a good level spot, the graple would fall off the side of the load, usually taking all 4 hoses off quicker than you could say "Aw Shucks." :'(
Been there. Sometimes you get lucky and only lose 1 hose. Incidentally in MN if you spill over 5 gallons of hydraulic fluid, you are required to call the Duty Officer and report the spill.
The newer models now have the loader mounted on the front of the rear section, just behind the pivot. You can just leave the loader over the middle of the load, no float needed, This way you do not need 4 spare hoses, wrenches, and extra hydraulic fluid. 8)
The problem with the loader on the rear section is most of the weight when empty is in the front section. However they have added a hydraulic swivel lock between the front and rear that is automatically locked except when you are driving. Some adventurous operators will swing the grapple and manually unlock the swivel to grab that log that is just out of reach.
Gary
Eric;
"The newer models now have the loader mounted on the front of the rear section, just behind the pivot"
That´s where we have placed the loaders the last 40 years and I think it´s what You ment earlier.
On tractors with forest equipments from the -50 and -60´s some loaders here too was placed on the roof. Have never seen a forwarder built that way.
Swedish log trucks have their loaders on the rear end of the bed so they can load even the trailer. They also have a cab on the loader!
I have never seen a semi truck with logs here. Driving off the asphalt they should be in the mud for ever. :D
http://www.vemservice.se/0245160.htm
-50 and -60´s: http://hem.passagen.se/vaxjobilfrakt/gast/gastbilder1.htm
hey swede heres a picture i copied from an ad by lakeshore equipment and truck sales in lumberman's equipment digest.
i hope this is o.k Jeff
Timberjack 230A Loading Sugar Maple Sawlog. Corey timber harvest; 5/05.
It doesn't have to be fancy :)
It's an old Super Major with a front end loader and an attached backhoe.
The skid hook was being used on the loader to pick up logs to carry
to the sawmill. The backhoe was used to get logs out of the woods.
Gary_C or Ron Scott:
Does anyone use 'Spill Check' on their hydrologics down that way. It comes in handy with busted hydrolic hoses.
www.spillcheck.ca
Not that I know of. Not sure anyone has heard of it here.
Cutter Trims His Tops. Tops are trimmed so as to lie within 4 feet of the ground in this hardwood selection harvest. The saw in use is also a Husky 385XP. Corey timber harvest; 5/04.
Sawyer Starts Cut on Large Sugar Maple. The saw in use is a Husky 372XP. Squires timber harvest; 5/04.
Timber! The faller exits to a safe distance with his Husky 372XP in hand as the sugar maple starts its directional fall. Squires timber harvest; 5/04.
Dont see no chaps.
A lot of guys wear saw pants that have the chaps sewn on the inside. There is another variation, where the chaps snap on the inside of the pants and tuck into pockets located further down the leg. Thats the style I prefer. I use the same chaps inside my carhart bibs,blue jeans or whatever.
Chet,
Thanks for the explanation on some of the chap types. That's what this faller is wearing. The chaps are in the pants, a nice looking jean type pant held up by heavy duty suspenders (I'd like to have a set of these myself). He's also wearing a carhart padded jacket, kevlar gloves, new helmet with ear muffs and face screen, kevlar boots etc.
He's one of our better fallers and one of the "best" dressed though not all is visible in the photo.
I haven't seen a faller without chaps or armored pants in ages though I've seen some well worn chaps.
Another photo will show a close up when I can get to it to see the PPE closer while he's bucking the tree.
I've seen lotsa of people here without protection. But, they tend to be the weekend cutter or people working their own ground. Anyone working for a contractor has protection, but if WCB wasn't on their case there would be a few not bother. That's just human nature. My father would be one of those working his own ground without any kind of protection. One of them live for ever types who's now half deaf of course. ;)
One should always be geared up for the woods, especially if he/she is working alone. You can do alot of personal injury in a short time. ::)
Feller Bucks the Sugar Maple into Sawlogs He is wearing safety pants, padded carhart jacket, hard hat with hearing and eye protection, gloves, and safety boots.
His saw is a Husky 372XP. Squires timber harvest; 5/04.
Teamwork.l The forwarder operator helps the tree faller with bucking the heavy sugar maple tree. The tree is lifted to assist the tree faller with bucking the tree into sawlog lengths and prevent possible "pinching" of the saw.
Squires timber harvest; 5/04.
That's big stuff. On crown land last week I was in a maple stand and those big ones are all dead with just big pecker pole stubs left. The average diameter was 10 inches and this stand had never been logged. Its just that the old trees have lived their life. So the short of it is, you might as well use those big trees in pulp or logs or maybe veneer cause they don't live forever. But, they have value as wildlife trees too, for owls, pileated wood peckers and such. Depends on what your values are. ;)
230A Timberjack Forwarder Loads Large Sugar Maple Sawlog. Squires timber harvest; 5/04.
Here's a harvest we did at one of the forests I work at last fall. Salvage Harvest on steep terrain, we decided to do something different. Carson Helicopters was the contractor.
Carson uses a modified Sikorsky S-61. The max lift is a little over 5 tons, a typical turn weighed 4 tons, or somewhere around 600MBF Doyle. Logs were bucked in the woods prior to lifting. Turns on this job took 45secs-2mins.
Organization on this type of harvest is important. When a turn lands, the co-pilot of the chopper releases the chokers. These guys hurry out and unhook the chokers and recoil them. Once every 2-3 turns they attach more chokers to the long line at the landing and take more chokers to the "hookers" in the woods. Our staff got excited when we heard the "hooker crew" was coming only to be disappointed when they all turned out to be middle-aged men :D
Large choppers use a lot of fuel. Typical refuels were once every 1.5-2hrs. Weight is also an issue so they usually wouldn't fill up completely.
That's cool swampwhite. On the BC coast they used the sikorsky as support helicopter to bundle the wood for the sky crane which had 20,000 lb lift. Didn't know it was cost effective to use'm in the east. Were you cutting veneer logs?
Carson is nearly full-service, they provide their own loader. Not sure the model but it's a cat track loader, can work effeciently even in a wet landing. This harvest produced 680MBF Doyle, I had cruised it at 1MMBF International (for all grades). Low grade and pulpwood had to be left in the woods due to economics. I was pleased at the utilization, I had feared that it would be much worse.
QuoteThat's cool swampwhite. On the BC coast they used the sikorsky as support helicopter to bundle the wood for the sky crane which had 20,000 lb lift. Didn't know it was cost effective to use'm in the east. Were you cutting veneer logs?
It's borderline cost-effective. It can make money but compared to conventional it isn't even close. The advantages were speed, being low impact, and being able to reach areas that would have been near impossible with conventional equipment. Disadvantages were that it's expensive so we get less utilization, lower stumpage prices, and the stand has to be good to even consider it. It also cut out the local loggers.
A sawmill bought the job so I couldn't say the entire breakdown of what the wood went for. There was a lot of large diameter trees -white oak, black oak, yellow-poplar, and some cherry, walnut, and red oak. I'm certain a lot of it went veneer but it was mainly just nice sawlogs.
None of us would expect ya to give that private info about total $$, but price per thousand by species and grade would be nice. If nothing else, its nice to know what mill delivered prices are in different areas. ;)
Thanks for the photos and the scoop.
Cheers :)
well I can tell you this much:
This type of harvest will cost between 300-500/MBF for logging and loading. Total cost depends on many factors and I don't want to go into the exact numbers. It also takes a buyer that can handle 20-30 tractor trailers of sawlogs per day.
This stand would have probably gone for 350-400 MBF when it was standing for conventional harvest. After our ice storm which higher logging costs it would have probably been around 250/mbf. We got 51/MBF for the total 1MMBF stumpage, which they probably took 80%. Conventional Logging costs in this area were roughly 180-200MBF before the ice storm, and are now 225-260. You can run the math and figure out how much a log needs to be worth to maximize return on a lump sum basis.
Mill delivered state-wide averages are available on the web, let me search for that link.
http://www.dnr.state.oh.us/forestry/Landownerasst/TPR0104.htm
Swampwhite, nice link to the prices. I was surprised to see red oak was worth more than white oak, cause around here it goes for pulp unless someone gathers it up for a small saw mill operator to mill some lumber. Its not real common here is the main reason, and they tend to be quite limby. I'm glad to see black cherry prime is fetching big bucks. Again only small quantities here and its diseased, so a small mill owner will save some out for sawing. Mostly ends up as pulp or left standing. They can get it from the NE states here for around $900-$1200/th in log form for veneer, its sometimes in the loads with oak so it gets separated out.
Here (http://www.forestnet.com/archives/March_04/contractor_profile2.htm) is a profile from the Logging and Sawmilling Journal on using the Ergo harvester and Buffalo forwarder. I know both the owner and the Forest Tech in the article. (March 2004 issue)
cheers
I see on Paul_H's site it says his company does shovel logging. This is one method I've yet to see mentioned on this thread. Maybe someone can shed some light on the topic. From what I gather its getting really popular in the west.
Scott,
There are several photos of "shovel logging" machines in the thread. The harvesting and skidding is performed by swing machines successively moving trees or stems from one pile to another in the direction of the skid. They are typically track machines.
Its usually called hoe chucking with excavator type equipment. Then there is the super snorkler used in grapple yarding to yard up to a road landing and a mobile back spar/tower is used along the lower cut block boundary to clear the ground with the load. If your yarding down hill you usually use spar trees to anchor the line, especially on slopes over 50 %. The coutour maps were so poor or too small a scale we had to run deflection lines all over the cut block to make our own contour maps. (the last link below has a PPT presentation to explain this) We didn't want to lay out road that would have blind spots to the yarders and create deep gouges in the hillside. This is what we called the side hill gouger. On them side hills with damage you could always expect slope failures during or after the site was logged. As we layed out the logging blocks we also assessed any gullies (gully assessment procedure) for potential risk of slope failure from slash and large wody debris loads in the gully systems. Some of our blocks had to be defered from logging because of this risk.
ere's an Article on hoe chucking (http://www.forestnet.com/archives/Dec_Jan_03/bc_coastal_logging.htm)
Article on Grapple Yarding (http://www.forestnet.com/archives/april_00/alberta.htm)
Photo set of different Yarders (http://www.cnr.vt.edu/visser/cable_logging/Yarders.htm)
Here's a Power Point Presentation (http://www.cnr.vt.edu/visser/cable_logging/How%20it%20works.ppt) from VT.EDU to explain the cable yarding system.
Enjoy. :)
So it sounds like shovel logging is best suited to heavier cutting. It doesn't sound like it would work really good in select cuts or for the private woodlot owner who just wants to take a few sticks out. From what gather it's usually used on ground too wet or steep for skidders. In Canada it seems to be mostly a BC thing. How would a shovel compare to a grapple skidder for productivity?
I haven't any numbers Scot on productivity but the Grapple Skidder would be more productive. We layed out ground inland from the coast up in the Nass River country in BC for grapple skidder. There where alot of natural benches in the hills to break the long slopes. SOme sites where borderline though and we always had the option of the grapple yarder. As you have read or researched, the hoe chuck system is used in the rain belt of the coast where a skidder wouldn't have a chance in all that goose goo soil and slopes. I'de like to call it something else but this being family oriented. errm ;) Walk ahead 2 steps slide back 1. :D :D You could find info published by FERIC on productivity of these machines. UNBSJ must have some reports in their library, you could browse Ferics website for the specific reports and go search them at the library. Irving probably has a subscription as does Fraser/Nexfor to FERIC, so you might find a report through them.
FERIC website (http://www.feric.ca/en/mempartner/reports/index.php?year=2003)
I guess there may be differences as to what we call "shovel logging" in different parts of the country. Here, it is a cutting head on an excavator or "shovel" type machine with an arm and turnbuckel. Usually a tracked machine that does the cutting and processing into variable lengths.
It is usually supported by a rubber tired forwarder to remove the cut products.
Ron:
Sounds like a feller buncher and a separate forwarder.
We used to be menaced by the Koering Feller Forward that would cut the tree at the stump and pile it on behind whole. It would be forwarded to a landing where a flail debarker was used on the tree, limbs and all and then passed through a chipper and into a van destined to the hardwood pulpmill. What those monsters didn't cut was simply pushed over and mauled over.
Crawler, high lead, rubber tired skidder, or shovel yarding. Done them all at least once. No buncher involved, there is no way anything else can keep up with a shovel on slightly sloping ground. Some places a buncher will make you puke with the steepness of the ground it will cover. And the operators are as near to crazy as one person can get.
Bruce_A
They use them feller bunchers up and down our hardwood hills here if they are rolling, and if they are steep pitched and bouldery, no way. I think Fraser's has used some high lead logging with spar trees around Clear water and Stanley mountains, which didn't get logged back in the 70's and early 80's conventionally. Now those ridge tops are all scalped down to the bed rock. Growing back to white birch, black spruce and fir mainly, just like after a forest fire.
Swamp Donkey, from what I've seen on the internet it seems like they use shovels a lot more than track skidders on steep slopes out there. Is this because the shovels can tackle a steeper slope or just bcause most companies already have a shovel around?
Swamp Donkey, i think this is what you mean.
http://www.unb.ca/web/standint/nbcc/machine/forwarders/kff_a.html
The one at the woodsmans museum is a bit different, I believe it has a delimber and is set up for shortwood. I think i have a pic of it around somewhere.
http://www.stthomasu.ca/~pmacdona/tresearch/ffh.htm
Yup that's the beast and Valley Forest didn't use a delimber or slasher for their hardwood rape and pillage. They just unloaded the trees road side off the Koering and the debarker crammed limbs and all into it and the chipper spurt the chips into the van. I know the debarkers had to convert from gas engine to diesels. I think Valley burnt more than one engine up before the switch.
The site that Zundel has was probably a Fraser operation, they were always colaberating with UNB on studies with machines and processes. Zundel was a new professor at UNB when I graduated. Didn't care for'em too much as a professor or for chat. I think the position went to his head. He could have lightened up a bit since those days. ;)
I remember Frasers using them in hardwood to chase softwood, so alot of hardwood was wasted on crown lands, and no one was allowed to utilize it for firewood. The roadsides had thousands of cord rotting and some was burnt in fall. Everyone used to spray the white birch on the boreal sites, or if it was left after the softwood was cherry picked it died from sun scald within 3 years.
Your right about the Koering at the museum, now that I think about it. Its been 15 years since I've been there. ;D
whats with all the axels on the log truacks over your way??? ???
In Australia, standard log trucks have either single or double steer axels, bogie drives and tri trailor axels
simon
QuoteZundel
Zundel as in Dr. Pierre? Did some work for him on a horse drawn grapple skidder project. Usually dealt with his grad student though.
SwampDonkey nods ;D
Some more log hauler names noted "on the road".
"Double vision
"Hello Darling"
"I Love The Money"
"Double Trouble"
"Who's Next?"
"Money Pit"
Quotewhats with all the axels on the log truacks over your way??? ???
In Australia, standard log trucks have either single or double steer axels, bogie drives and tri trailor axels
simon
I don't know which picture you're looking at, but I would guess the trucks with lots of axles travel on roads with a low peraxle weight limit. Most likely, that would be due to steep slopes or Winter and Spring road conditions. That's the case with gravel haulers, so I'm assuming it applies to logging trucks.
Cedar Eater
Logger's Pickup. Tailgate up.
Lee timber harvest; 7/04.
[
That's one a them fancy loggers pick-ups. Round here the loggers all got oil and dents painted on the tailgate.
Logger's Pick-up. Tailgate down.
Lee timber harvest; 7/04
Timberjack 230A Turbo Forwarder. Loading pulpwood and firewood. Dean timber harvest; 7/04.
Loading the Wood Hauler With Sawlogs For Jeff's Mill.Dean timber harvest; 7/04.
so those logs are goin to jeff_b?
Tightening The Binders Before "Hitting the Road". Yes, the logs will be going to the mill where Jeff is sawyer.
Dean timber harvest; 7/04.
Ron what length is the logs on the truck , dose the log trucks have to have a wide load permit . ???
QuoteRon what length is the logs on the truck , dose the log trucks have to have a wide load permit . ???
I can answer that. In Michigan, the limit is 8' for not needing a wide load permit, but for logs stacked sideways, they allow 100" (8' 4"). That gives the mill a tolerance.
I believe The actual width limit here is 102 inches but may be wrong.
Leaving The Landing For The Mill. On its way to the mill with a sawlog load. The sawlogs are in 100" lengths and within the 9 foot width limit. A wide load permit is not necessary. They must be loaded properly without excess overhang.
Dean timber harvest; 7/04
Bucking Sugar Maple Sawlogs. Working in heavy foliage and ground cover. Can you see the "two" cutters at work? Lee timber harvest; 8/04.
One on the right has an orange hard hat and the one on the left has an orange saw. Had to brighten up the image to find them. Looks like fun. :)
That is a problem with heavy folage it does not make that safe of a working environment but as long as your care ful I had one guy that put his saw down next to him the chain still had alittle speed and it cut this other guys boot you have to be real careful. You can never have enough orange
Working in Heavy Foliage. Heavy foliage makes hard work for the cutters with added safety concerns. Often, all that can be seen is their "orange" hard hats and "orange" chain saws. The hill side work here also has added risks. Lee timber harvest; 8/04.
I can imagine those thickets are shrubs and young hardwood. Add some balsam fir undergrowth to that and its like working in the closet with no view to the crowns of the harvest trees. A person has to take time and cut that stuff out for safety exits. I hope them trees are worth it. ;)
Yes, the sugar maple sawlogs in this area are worth it, but some tough logging.
This is still in the same area where we cleared a ski slope on last winter until we were "blown out " by the constant heavy snow. Earlier photos on this tread show the ski slope harvest and winter conditions.
Hopefully we will be done in this area in another month.
Yup, I've been following your posts and pictures Ron. :) Hardwood on most ski hills above 400 meters in this area are nothing but shrubby short pulpwood. Look nice from a distance and in fall colors, but that's about it. Crabbe mountain has better hardwood, but its not that high in elevation. It juts up from the fringe of the New Brunswick lowlands.
I found this website a couple days ago... its very very interesting to see the different kinds of operations that are around. I was lookin through all the pages of the different kinds of methods, n i taught to myself, "i sure would like to show these guys the equipment i run and work around" well... a couple pages later i see a picture with a 690stroke delimber and a prentice 210 slasher sittin on a landin. I found it very odd considering we have both them machines... i then scroll down and sure enough there is a couple more picutres... THen i realize THAT IS OUR EQUIPMENT!!! lol... funny how that worked. We have an interesting operation. 5 brothers and me a nephew. We run a CTL operation and what we call a "full tree" operation, what involves the slasher delimber fellerbuncher n skidder. I'm the forwarder operation. I run a 1110d Jack. I run behind a 1270d(there is a picutre of it one this site a couple pages back) Any body have questions?... i'd love to answer em...
Scott
timberjack_teen, who do you work for? Maybe I know of them if they work in Michigan. Was it one of your guys that is on here too that posted the pictures? Thats pretty interesting about finding your own equipment on here! :)
Yup, that sure makes for an interesting conversation finding out your equipment is posted in a forum and not knowing it. ;) Timberjack_teen, stick around and I'm sure someone will throw a question or two your way. Just one thing, we kinda gotta know which page in the thread to look for that equipment before we start sling'n them questions, she's a purdy long thread ya know. ;)
This thread is probably one of the most popular threads of the forum, thanks to all the find folks that contributed and posted pictures. 8)
cheers
I work for Piwarski Brothers Logging. and no it was none of them that posted the pictures on this site. The pictures are one page 31 of this thread. there is 4 pictures i believe, one of the delimber and slasher, one of the delimber, one of our 850 and one of our 1270.
Timberjack_teen,
Piwarski Brothers Logging is well known there in Iron River and some good people. I was visiting Ski Brule Mt. and my friend Steve Polich there last winter and noted your logging operation going on there near the chalet area parking lot.
It had a good diversity of equipment in a small area so it made for some good logging equipment photos. I was never able to catch someone on site though. Were you working there then?
I'm from Iron River also. I'd like to get out on a "big job" with you some time when I'm back up that way.
The Noon Lunch-Break. The "boss" checks in with the mill office with his cell phone while his cutter sharpens the 395 Husky's for the afternoon's work. Lee timber harvest; 8/04.
I always like to keep five or six spare chains so I do not have to sharpen them in the field I think that is a pain in the butt. Nice looking truck though f250 or f350. I have to wait for my dakota to die to get a truck like that.
Repairs Are Needed. The harvest crew work to repair the Valmet forwarder. Its' boom doesn't work due to a worn "O ring" in the control box. A large hex wrench is needed for the job which they don't have in their tool box. They try to improvise. Lee timber harvest; 8/04.
A Load of Quality Sawlogs. Ready for delivery to Wheelers Wolf Lake Sawmill. Lee timber harvest; 8/04.
Finally figured out how to post an image!
This is a Prentice 384 in North Carolina processing Loblolly pine - largest butts 26"
Welcome, CosmoPack!
You're a pretty quick study to get it on the first post. :D :D
I had to make several attempts before I figured it out! I've got a lot of photos of logging in the south and overseas too! I've got to scan a few of them in and add to the gallery.
As always, It's great to see some other region timber harvest methods & equipment.
A Load of Veneer Logs Heads North on the Freeway. H-131 north; 8/04.
FabTech FT-133 Processor. Working in red pine. Deschermeir timber harvest; 8/04.
FabTec FT-133 Processor. Moves through the landing and decking area on to the next timber stand for processing. Deschermeir timber harvest; 8/04.
Here is some work a college of mine is doing near Miramichi Lake, 10 miles south of Juniper, NB. The harvesting is being done for Fraser Sawmills in Juniper, NB. I've been helping with trail layout this week for a couple days. We are in mixedwood stands of balsam fir, red spruce, maple and birch species. The prescription is to remove the mature fir. Any softwood in the trails, except white pine are also taken. Its a challenge on some sites working with the terrain. I forgot to snap a shot of one of the rocky peeks I encountered today. 20-30 % of the volume is being harvested.
The Timber Jack 608B processor out on the yard. The crew has gone home for the weekend. Its Moose season. ;D
Felling head, close-up
TimberJack 230A forwarder, idle on the yard. It rests against the toolshed truck to secure the tools against theft. An all too common occurance in the woods.
6 foot tall, high flotation tires.
Here's some wood, red spruce and balsam fir sawlogs.
Here are some views of the trail network. The orange-black striped ribbon mark the trail network. Well, I guess they're not possible to see at this scale, sorry.
Main Trail used by the processor and forwarder, leading to the yard.
Side trail: trails are running parrallel to the camp roadway. There are several camps on in the road on Miramachi Lake.
Trails are spaced 15 meters apart. All watercourses and wet areas are flagged and buffered from machine travel.
Here's a couple views of the Miramichi Lake, autumn colors are beginning to show on the surrounding hillsides.
Some camps on the lake
Its been a warm and beautiful week to be in the bush, 75 deg today.
Cheers :)
Ron, there was a little FT-133 that worked around here for a few years. They used it for final felling, up to 20 inch logs and almost all tree length. Also they had him working on some pretty mean hills. I posted some pictures of it awhile back when it burned.
Swamp Donkey, looks like a really nice job theyre doing there. Those haul paths look more like nature trails.
There were some large spruce in there the operator couldn't get the felling head around, so had to go around them ones. :D There were even some fir that where very close to being too big for it. At one point awhile back my college was told to take more wood. :D We are treating this area real special because of the camps on in beyond the harvesting. And them big overmature fir will stap off real easy in high winds. I seen on the leeward side of the site the snow has been mauling down the softwood regen, but them red spruce are pretty tough customers. I hate that when snow drifts and packs down on the regen. >:(
Them trails look like nature trails in person to. ;D
Fabtech FT 1-33 Processor. Harvesting aspen. Deshermeir timber harvest; 8/04.
Fabtech FT-133 Processor. Working in hardwoods.
Deshermeir timber harvest; 8/04
Wood Hauler "All Show". Lee timber harvest 9/04
More Wood Hauler names noted:
"All Show"
"Finndian Outlaw"
"Out of Work"
"Bill's B Train"
"Power Stroke"
"Last Ride"
"Should Have Been Home"
"Dog Train"
"Big Guy" (Gee Jeff has a truck named after him)
"Scare Crow"
I'll know that I have finally arrived if one of the mill manufactures ever name a model "Big Guy" :D
:D :D
Jeff, where ya headed? ;)
I have some pics of our operation here in the U.P. Not quite sure how to get them on here. We have a valmet 544h harvester and a 5010 ltx iron mule. I would like to share them with everyone so any help gettin them on here will be appreciated. thanks
Here is a couple of links for information on posting pictures.
https://forestryforum.com/upload.htm
https://forestryforum.com/posting_images_to_forum.htm
Good to hear from an Iron Mule user. There are a few pictures at work here. I favor them as a "low impact" and "light on the land" machine due to their small size.
It's getting harder and harder to find them and the existing ones are kept working.
Tree Faller Prepares to Buck Sugar Maple Tree. The sugar maple tree has been fallen and limbed. It is now ready to be bucked into sawlogs. Lee timber harvest; 10/04.
Tree Faller Limbing Another Sugar MapleTree. The tree is on the downside of a steep hill. It will be cabled tree length up hill to the flat on top for bucking with use of a 230A Timberjack cable skidder. Lee timber harvest; 10/04.
Skidding Sawlogs Up Hill. The Timberjack cable skidder is backed up against some standing trees on the hill top. The standing trees will hold the skidder in place while it is used to winch the sawlog trees up the hillside. The trees will then be skidded to and bucked in the flat field on the hill top. Lee timber harvest 10/04.
I also drop my blade and set the brake when druming in a turn.
Valmet Forwarder & Timberjack Cable Skidder. The Valmet forwarder picks up the "cut to length" products from the tree lengths pulled to the hill top by the Timberjack cable skidder. The forwarder will carry the wood products to the landing/decking area across the field where they will be trucked to the saw and pulp mill. Lee timber harvest; 10/04.
These photos are of a New England Central RR train passing the station in St. Albans VT on its way to the McNeil Station Generating plant in Burlington, VT. A 55 Mw wood chip fired generating station. Chips are delivered to a yard in Swanton, VT where they are loaded onto hopper cars for the trip to McNeil. This keeps the neighbors happy without the truck traffic.
I like the fact that there are still trains being used to move forest products. In my local area it was common place to have trains move wood chips, pulp and paper products. The train is no longer operating in the upper Saint John River Valley as they were removed in the 1980's because of declining business and increasing demand for trucks. At the time some serious flooding had removed older bridges, which the railway companies seized as a way out of the area. The old rail ways are now part of New Brunswick Trail system. They will only remain that way as long as the politics of the day allows it.
cheers
Interesting information about the generating plant and where the wood chips come from:
http://www.burlingtonelectric.com/SpecialTopics/Mcneil.htm
I wasn't surprised to see the cost of the chips off the train were higher becasue the trucking rate is probably fixed by the trucking association in the area. Add that to the train freight cost and it's got to be 1/3 more, at least.
There is a wood fired generating plant in Fort Fairfield, Maine. It is owned and operated by a Canadian company, Boralex Inc of Quebec. Sawmills in New Brunswick close to the plant will send hog fuel and other waste residue they can't use as pulp. The source of most of this residue from New Brunswick is from crown lands and a smaller percentage from purchased private woodlot wood.
Click here (http://www.recyclingtoday.com/articles/article.asp?Id=4280&SubCatID=29&CatID=7)
Working Over The Timber Access Road. Final repairs and maintenance is made to the access road that needed to be build to access the timber sale area. The access road must be left in a suitable condition for future use by 2 wheel drive vehicles. Lee timber harvest 10/04.
nothing like getting to the job site and finding out your batt. won't work in the camera >:( :( :'(.
Ed :D Do you use rechargeables. Them regular lithiums are expensive when ya use the onscreen display often :(
Murphy's Law with the batteries. I now always carry extra batteries and/or a second camera since this happened to me when some photos where very important as evidence in a timber trespass and damage case.
Final Grading of the Access Road. The cable skidder is used to make a final grading of the constructed access road prior to closure of the timber sale. The loggers leave the landowner with a good access road to the back end of his property.
The constructed access road will serve the landowner's continued land management needs and increase future timber values. Lee timber harvest; 10/04.
[
Here's a few shots from around here.
690E excavator converted to tree harvester.
450 skidder hauling through the old field.
equipment at the landing
truck getting ready to leave the field.
Hmmm, the most recent post musta been deleted cause I received notice through email and I don't see it on here. Oh well, I missed it. ;)
Forwarder & Cable Skidder. Parked at the landing waiting to be "hauled off" to the logging contractor's next job. Lee timber harvest; 9/04.
Ron's playing hide and go seek the skidders tonight. ;)
Nice bunch of wood there. Now here's a man that puts the pictures before his words. :)
Well as they say a picture is worth a thousand of'm. ;)
"All Show" Is Ready To Move The Forwarder and Cable Skidder Off To Another Timber Harvest Job. Lee timber harvest 10/04.
Tree Length Skidding. This older Timberjack cable skidder is being used to pull tree lengths off a hill side timber harvest. The sawlog, pulpwood, and firewood products are then cut to length for trucking from the top and bottom of the hillside. Jakielek timber harvest 11/04.
Harvesting From a Lowland Area. The Timberjack cable skidder sets up at the edge of the lowland area which is too soft for the forwarder to work in. The fallen tree lengths will be cabled out to drier ground for bucking. Sportsman's Port, LLC timber harvest; 12/04.
Harvesting From a Lowland Area. The Timberjack cable skidder pulls tree lengths from the included lowland hardwood area. The large hardwood tree tops have been removed and trees limbed by the cutters before skidding so as to prevent any damage or skinning to the remaining trees. The trees will then be bucked into variable lengths by chainsaw on higher ground. Sportsman's Port, LLC timber harvest; 12/04.
Anyone out there still using a dozer for their skidding? Our land is fairly wet and I'm thinking of getting a track machine for hauling in the wetter areas. A small dozer seems like a good choice as I could could use it for skidding and making small roads. Any thoughts?
Scott, I don't know of anyone using a dozer for logging. A neighbour has one for roads and uses the winch to rescue other stuck equipment from the woods.
The thought of putting new undercarriage or tracks on a bulldozer scares the $$$ out of me :D Nothing on them seems to be cheap!
You mention your land is pretty wet, do you mean swamp? I'm just thinking little dozers don't do real well in swamp, and are harder to get out.
One of those J-5's with a tracked forwarder trailer and winch are pretty neat. Up in north nb they drive em on the peat bogs.
Scott,
I use an old John Deere 450CA crawler/loader to skid with on my property. I have a pair of log forks that replace the bucket when I need them and a nice big timber winch on the back. There are times I wish it was a dozer with a 6way blade and the wider tracks but more times I am glad to have the versatility of the bucket or forks. When the ground is wet I pay the cable in and out to move the logs. Before I figured this out I buried the critter up to its belly pan when I hit a soft spot skidding up a slope. Pulled myself out with the winch.
Parts aren't cheap but then parts aren't cheap for a skidder either. the major drawback is the time it takes to skid a long distance. The trade off is that the impact to the woods is far less than the big wheeled skidders.
OWW when you say the impact is lower than a skidder, do you mena cause you're going slower and don't smash into things or are you strickly talking footprint on the ground?
Both. A crawler or dozer spreads the weight accross a much wider area than a skidder so compaction of the soil is lessened. Newer tire designs I believe have improved the soil compaction of skidders but I think they still compact more than a tracked vehicle. Wheeled skidders came into being for speed. That same speed can cause some serious rutting on damp soils. I am not an authority on the subject of wheeled versus tracked vehicles but this is my understanding of the impact difference.
My family's land has some swamp on it but is most just wet and soft. Right now we have a MF 1040 tractor, its about 33 horse power. The tractor is to light for heavy pulling and its very narrow, making it tippy even on fairly tame ground. Also those skinny little 4x4 front tires slice pretty bad. Most likely we'll end up getting a larger tractor (50 to 60 HP) with wider tires on it. We've also looked at the J5's with winches and trailers. The dozer seemed like a well rounded tool for the woodlot. Travel speed isn't a big deal for us. Undercarriages are expensive but we wouldn't be running it alot so it would probably last a long time (an average dozer UC lasts 2 years around here if run daily) . Maybe I could do some work on the side to help pay for it? Dad wants a machine that can work in tight spots and not rip things up in the woods. Right now we're still just weighing out our options.
I think I know the MF you mean, its a compact model made by Iseki or something like that? They do have tiny tires up front!
If you do go tractor, they make tires now called R1W's that have a wide footprint and run at low pressures. Kubota have em on the M6800-9000's as options at most of the good dealers in NB. New Holland have em too, I think some of the bigger dealers of other brands carry them too.
Compared to a standard tire they more than double the footprint.
I've seen some of those powered forestry trailers lately that use ground speed pto (only some tractors have this), seems this would make a nice combo in the woods.
My concern on the crawler is many older ones have narrow tracks and seem to get stuck in wet spots, but this may be only if they are trying to push dirt.
Ken
Back before my time, father sold stumpage to loggers that used crawlers. They didn't use skidders in those days. Our woodlands were all nice and flat, no side hills. And the ground had gravelly knowls and wet narrow slews where springs come out of the gravel mounds. They used to yard wood quite a long way to the fields and didn't rut the ground up. In later years they used skidders with decent tires on the woodland we owned and didn't rut the ground like what you'd think, we just worked around the wet runs. When I got old enough to cut with dad we left the woods with hardly any evidence we were there. The trails always seemed to seed in with spruce, cedar, white ash or fir. In my plantations there is more ground disruption with C&H plough than any skidder we used cutting wood.
cheers
Slowzuki, yeah the tractor is made by some weird Japanese company, it doesn't run nearly as smooth as the larger Perkins powered Masseys. If we went the tractor route we'd be using the wider flat profile tires that you were talking about, we also thought of using those industrial tires. We would put a farmi winch on the tractor and not a trailer. The trailers are a bit pricey for us and also they probably wouldn't work really well on our land. Those powered trailers are pretty cool though. I'd like to get a machine that can be used to for more than just logging. We could use the tractor for plowing snow, bush hogging, yard work and launching the boat in the river. A dozer could be used for road building, stumping and other such work. A J5 is really handy for getting way back in the woods especially if your taking some cargo. I'm not sure whered youd get parts for those old rigs though. We have a mixed woodlot with mixed terrian. Some of it is fairly solid and flat. There are some decent hills and there are some real wet areas. The timber consists mostly of old growth spruce. there's also birch and maple and a fair bit of cedar.
Hi Scott; i use a 70 hp 4x4 massey/ 8800lbs winch,405 patu log loder with home made power trailer( older masseys have ground speed match up too a two speed rearend 10-20 tires) no trans and pto running at a fast speed.I have a 420 case dozer ,used it some for yarding ::)all i can say is slow,rufffffff rideand watch out for wood in the tracks( they like too come off ).Hall's has a nice IH winch,chains roll bars for the woods.Oh about that cedar?? ;Dhow much? JN
If you go tractor, I've had great luck driving through swamps on our property in the colder months, they freeze up ok and with snow packed down they bridge the wet holes ok too.
I wouldn't get the regular industrials, they don't work well in mud. Michillen makes a wide style radial industrial carcas with the R1W tread on it. This gives the deeper lugs and sharper V.
http://www.michelinag.com/agx/en-US/products/product_detail_pages/XM27UI.jsp
There was a Kubota M4900 (45 hp) 4x4 tractor for sale in Moncton with a winch and dozer blade on it, FOPS on tops and full skid plating recently. I'll try to dig up a link.
Quotewe also thought of using those industrial tires. We would put a farmi winch on the tractor and not a trailer.
I've seen the tractors that you guys mentioned. I'd probably want to set the tractor up a lot like that, except i wouldn't want that little skidder blade. I'd want a decent loader on it instead, theyre just too handy not to have one. JN, if ya like I can show you around the woodlot, your proabably only a 10 minute drive from here.
JN, is this the machine you were talking about?
Check this link: http://www.payeur.com/
look for "The Forester" A medium 4WD Kioti tractor especially rigged for forestry work. they sell a lot of it and they are very reliable tractor. Carol
Sawyer Cuts Variable Lengths The tree lengths skidded from the lowland area are bucked into product lengths on high ground to prevent excessive rutting in the lowland. They will then be forwarded to the landing for trucking. Sportsman's Port, LLC timber harvest; 12/04.
The problem we have with smaller tractors is that they don't have enough weight for skidding some of the large trees on our land. The Forester tractor is a really good setup, i got to look at one a couple years ago at the forestry show. Do they come any bigger then the one they show?
HI SCOTT; yes that is the one, not a bad setup other then it being a IH they don't like the cold. The massey that i use has the rear tires loaded chains on all four, we have steep hills and then your in the wet ground.We haul five trees (soft wood) most of the time. No problems, i don't like to make too much of a mess thier needs too be a future? Like to take you up on the tour someday always wanting to learn. ;D JN
Yes you can have a bigger one rigged like the forester.Carol
I have been glued to this thread for over two hours and have learned a lot. Really enjoyed the heli pics as I was involved in it for five years. Hanks Truck Pictures has a lot of terrific logging truck shots. Swamp Donkey and Paul will feel right at home.
Hanks is a great page, there's some good shot from up on the oilfields. Check out the Ron Grieve collection.
I'd like to get a New Holland TN 65 or 75 and put one of those forester packages on it.
Tractor finally came in, we traded a 33 hp MF for a 5860 Landini.
Here the whole package.
I'm hoping this tractor will be heavy enough to handle 1/2 cord of wood. The massy was a great upgrade from a 350 big bear 4x4. But just didn't have the weight to move wood.
The 230A Timberjack Forwarder. The variable lengths are picked up on high ground and forwarded to the landing and decking area. Sportsman's Port, LLC timber harvest; 12/04.
I was wondering how a system of manual felling and bucking along with a 230A forwarder wood work. If ya have the operator/owner of the machine participate in the bucking process, I think you could put up quite a bit of wood in a day. The quality of the wood would be higher than if machine cut I would think, no pull-out and such. Problem might be when the owner/operator gets too comfy in that seat. Both fallers would have to have good experience with directional felling. Too often I see in the woods are guys that let'r fall where ever. That doesn't matter much when clearcutting, but with reagards to improving the woodlot one has to use directional felling. If the odd tree got hung the forwarder could be called in to give the butt a quick jerk. Any soft ground could be buffered from the harvest with ribbons, which possibly may be part of wetlands anyway. Buffers on wetlands here start at their outter edges, not measured from stream-side.
I've been told that a manual chopper and a forwarder, will have all the work they could possibby do. This is why I upgraded to the equipment shown above. Last week with the addition of this equipment, I signed a contract for a thinning & logging job that will keep it busy for the next 2 yrs. A lot of the thinning I do, the land owner is looking for minimal signs of equipment. With a 230 forwarder, you could work both sides of the low impact idea. Manual cutting or work behind a processor. Work either way you look at it.
Swampdonkey,
As to your question, it depends on the terrain. Most of the ground I work on in the mountains I do like the loggers Ron Scott showed did, I skid the logs out to an in-woods landing and then forward them to the roadside. It would be nice to take the forwarder to the stump, as you suggested, but it is pretty near impossible for me to do. Of course, their are places in the upper-midwest where this is a common practice.
When skidding the logs to my in-woods landing I rarely pull them tree length. Most logs are cut apart into mill-ready lengths right at the stump, and only short, sixteen foot maximum, logs are skidded. This gives me the advantages that a forwarder has in that I'm not causing alot of damage to residual trees. The logs are going to be cut-to-length anyway, so I might as well do it at the stump.
I don't need a large area for an in-woods landing either. Any wide spot along a woods road that will hold a thousand or so board feet will do.
By using the skidder and forwarder together, and adapting to the terrain at hand, I can harvest timber efficiently and still keep the foresters happy.
Nice tractor Ed! We have an older version of your MF that you traded and we're having the same problem with it (not enough weight) I think i'm going to have to look at the Landinis before i do any buying :). your tractor is pretty much exactly what my dad and I are looking for.
Frickman:
I could see the advantages of the skidder in that situation and I like the idea of bucking to length in the bush to reduce damage. I'm just on the edge of the Appalachian range here and the land is farely flat for logging, but rolling. I've seen some folks try to fight the terrain and skid long length and bulldoze skid trails all over the side hills. What an erosion mess they make. The ground is either gravelly or shaly, at any rate, makes a real mess. They should either avoid using that method on that ground or find an alternative. The environment doesn't seem to make waves over it, which is surprising since that silts up the streams below in a heavy rain. ::) Sometimes we don't have the luxury of picking and choosing our job sites I guess, especially with high equipment lease payments. Oh, if everything was perfect. ;)
Swampdonkey,
You mentioned high-lease payments. My method of logging will not work profitably if you have high payments. It does work real well if you care about the land however. The way I log is alot slower than tree-length logging for several reasons. I care about what I'm doing, and take my time doing it. I'm obviously pulling out less footage per trip than a large skidder dragging tree length. And I'm moving alot of work that I'd be doing at the landing or mill back to the stump. This saves some time down the line though, especially at clean-up time. I leave most of the loose bark, sawdust, knots, end trims, etc. back in the woods where they belong, instead of hauling them to the landing or mill yard. It helps keep the landing and mill yard neat and tidy.
The one thing that I've learned over the years about logging is you have to be adaptable. Just as one prescription for harvest will not work on every tract you mark, one certain method of logging will not be feasible on every job I work. All my equipment is paid for, so it works for me, I don't work for it. Since I don't have a loan payment bearing down on me every month I'm able to do things a little different than some other outfits.
Frickman,
I think that is great that you own your equipment and have no lease payments to worry about. I'm sure there are plenty of other worries, like with any business. You can certainly see that not everyone has the luxury of a large bank roll to purchase their harvest equipment. Alot of the guys working on private buy big equipment to work on public forest land as their main source of employment. On public forest land you have supervisors who stand over ya and harp on production, but also want what's best for the land. Sometimes hard to find that balance. Some guys end up, part time, hiring out to contractors on private so they tend to bring some old habits along. But, also it comes back to the high cost of equipment which they can't afford to have sit idle. As another senario to the side hills, add some boulder fields and rock outcroppings to the harvest area and I think even you would be left thinking, 'what am I doing here'. Dang glaciers eh?
cheers ;)
The Forwarder Leaves the Landing After Delivering and Decking a Load of Sawlogs. Only a small landing is needed for the variable length (short wood) logging method. The product lengths are cut at the stump as stated above.
Sportsman's Port, LLC selective timber harvest; 12/04.
This method works especially well if you don't have to turn a tractor trailor on the yard, but it means more road building is involved if you need a road to loop around. Works fine with straight trucks. I know one guy in our area who uses a skidder converted as a forwarder and a tracked Dion forwarder he uses to cut to length at the stump and forward to a small landing. His problem is that his equipment is old and spends alot of time fixing it. It's not a high production operation, but he's always busy.
Converted C4 Forwarder C-4 Tree Farmer skidder and mounted Patu log loader on the rear frame with hitched Patu tandem log trailer. Makes for an efficient, low-cost forwarder that is well suited for sites that are not too steep.
Dion Forwarder F-4 Dion tracked short wood forwarder loading 100 inch pulpwood ona straight truck. It has a low centre of gravity and can work on steeper slopes than most forwarders.
The machine comes with a fully enclosed cab for winter operation, with windows for good visibility. The forwarder uses a hydraulically-powered stick steering system. The hydraulics also control the stabilizers that make contact with the ground to keep the forwarder steady while the operator loads logs, as well as the boom. Everything else is mechanically driven through the transmission and differentials.
The forwarder has facing seats, so that after being driven in one direction, the operator can simply change seats and drive it back in the opposite direction. Although it has a five-speed transmission, He operates the forwarder primarily in third gear, slowing down in particularly muddy or rocky areas to avoid both ground and track damage.
A Happy Landowner. The landowner watches as a load of grade hardwood sawlogs leaves the landing enroute to the mill that purchased her timber. Sportsman's Port, LLC timber harvest; 12/04.
This is where I worked in 2001 , hauling off road to the Tembec mill yard in Tee lake Témiscamingue Québec....A load of spruce for pulp mill The saw logs will be cut out at the mill yard with a slasher
275 B Barko loading us at Two Rivers , Témiscamingue Québec... White pine , again will be cut to logs at the yard
Heading down to the yard with a load of pine ... It was all off road hauling , two meter radio system ... about 140 kilometers of off road driving to get to the yard in Tee Lake ...
isawlogs,
Lotsa snow eh? :) I see they plow the roads like here, when you meet another truck one of ya have to turn out in the snow bank. They have wide roads, but plow narrow. I never invested in a radio so I stay off them roads in winter. I see those are some nice white pine logs. Looks like your picking them from hardwood or mixed stands. Sure is a long trek to the mill. :o
Swomp.. I got myself a scanner ....
When you met a truck if it was loaded .. you took the snowbank , it was kinda hard to stop these once they got rolling ... priority was to the loaded truck at all times ... Next on the priority list was the empty truck coming back up then the sanders .... anything else on the road was low in the priority list ;D ;)
The grader that was used to open the roads ... he is on a mission , going to try and pull and push a truck up a hill ...
644G John Deer loader with log clamp , he's getting the dozer blade and turning around to come and push the truck up the hill
All together ... Sander spreading sand , grader pulling and loader pushing , made it up on second try ....
We had lots of fun .... Had to put the chains on the truck ....
Nice pics, sounds like a day of fun and games!
Isaw are they not using chains on those truck tires?
We never put the chaines on ... only if we did not make the climb the first time .. then we would try being pushed by the loader ... if that didn't work we would put the chains and deep lock up , and try her again ... in this case we had to get more help thats why the grader was called in and the sander ....
If it snowed I would put the chains on .... other then that there was so much wheight on the drives to get you going anywhere if it was not at the botom of a hole like this ....
We where hauling 60,000 kilos to 75,000 kilos net ... there was weight on the tires only needed a little sand
WOW :o 45,000 kilos isn't even allowed here on the highways. I can't imagine hauling that on off-road and rough roads.
Do you folks use BWS trailors? They make'm here in town, and most around here use'm for logging. I know they use'm in Ontario and Quebec in some places.
http://www.bwstrailers.com/logger.php
Most used these Témisko trailers they are built at Notre Dame du Nord . Témiscamingue Qué.
We had one truck that had three axle drive I'll get some pictures of ti later on and post them .. it had the extend a bunk on his trailer ... I beleive that it would extend 20" it would make a big difference in the center of gravety ....
isawlogs,
Looks like a nice heavy duty trailor.
Swamp....
they had to be .. not that I want to put them in a better quality , it just happened that they where built not far from where we worked ...
Some of the trucks would be hauling at over 100,000 kilos crosse ,
we had little loads on at 60,000kilo net .... Most of it being placed on the front of the trailer so that the weight would be on the drives ....
I'm stay'n outta those woods in winter. ;) :D
international paystar with heated sander , exhaust would go through the box of the sander , it being double walled and keep the sand from freezing .... most of the time ....
We had three of these on the road at all times , one would be at the main camp at Tee Lake for a back-up...
This one had a 400 cummins with 15 speed fuller , it had full lock on rear end ...
A Load of Sawlogs Is On Its Way To The Mill. The trip will take approximately 2 hours. The trucker will then make a return trip for another load. Sportsman's Port LLC timber harvest; 12/04.
Marcel
those pictures of your 's show some extreme log hauling . It looks like it was a chore just to keep the roads passable . I have to agree with Swampdonkey on stayin away from those woods . I thought we had some problems dealing with coal haulers on our roads . Do I understand that these roads where for the logging activities only .
Ron
That looks like a pretty heavy load of sawlogs on that truck also . How many Bd/Ft can they haul in a load like that ?
It was for hauling only .... had signs up at the begining of road and every 10 kilo. ... but people dont know how to read wether it be french or english or chinese for that matter . Made for some hair rising times at times ...
It was not that hard to keep the road open the trucks would do it most of the time , at the speed we traveled the trailers would sweep the roads , only during major storms that the grader would be called to grade the road , or when there would be to much ice build up. the sanders wher out 24 hrs , two 12 hr shifts... We had 18 trucks and would haul 24 hrs ...
I'll put more pic on when I dig them up ....
Forgot to metion that we had 10 pickets on the trailers , the 8' where to short ...
10-12 MBF on our loads or about 50 tons.
I really enjoy this thread it's one I always check. Thanks Ron for all the great pictures. :)
Marcel what kinds of logs were you guys hauling?
Thanks Norm. The Thread seems to get a lot of interest. I enjoy the posts and photos of others here also. Marcel is now showing some of the hard work and effort that goes into winter logging and trucking.
Norm ...
Depending on which sector we were in . We had a login radius of give or take 175 kilometers from the log yard which was at Tee Lake , small logging town 20 kilometers from Témiscamingue in Québec .
We would haule pine , spruce and balsam , poplar , and mixed hard wood .
The pine was tree lenght so was the pulp , but the hard wood would of been cut by slasher in the bush , had 2 slashers going at it 24 hours .
I'll go back on the photos that I put on and write down what type of wood was being drawn out ...
I worked for this logging outfit for 5 winters , it was at the time one of the largest privatly owned and operated logging companie in the province .
We had during the peak winter months over 175 people on the payroll . Went from goffer , cooks, kitchen helper , mecanics , want to be mecanics , operaters, dozer, shovel ,skidder,back hoe, front loader, slasher , log loaders ,maintenance crew, welder , grader operator , truck drivers , and then all the office folks ... we had 2 foresters on and all the crew for the marking and blazing of the roads and trees to be cut down ...
All this in three different camps that where spreads out the logging terrotory...
all the camps had sleeping quarters , full kitchen dinning area
One camp we had for the trucks to have a home base and had the garage
The other two where ... one for the cutting crew , the other was for the road maintenance crew ... Sanders grader loaders the shovels once the cutters where done in one sector we would move into there camp and they would take ours ....
Some more wood hauler names noted on the road.
"Blackfoot"
"Tree Hugger"
"Red Hot And Rolling"
"Doc"
"Big Woody"
"Waxy"
"Scooby Duty"
i use a f-250 pu and 16' utility trailer w/ front mounted 4 ton winch. i fabricated a quad pod that attaches to rear of trailer that supports a pully bout 5' above trailer floor. i back trailer to big end of log, run cable through pully and attach to log bout 1' from near end then detach truck and begin winching. trailer will rear up til tail hits ground then log and trailer will come together then log wil raise onto trailer. then remove quad pod and reattach cable to log couple times to bring log farther onto trailer. as log is winched/loaded trailer will come down slowly. better have trailer chucked! works really easy, kinda like a rollback wrecker. i can haul up to a single 36" 17' log. thats about 5000lbs and thats all i need. not much for production but for a hobbist/weekend warrior its great. small potatoes compared to you guys. 1953greg
1953greg
Its not the amount of potatoes thats in the plate that counts .... trust me I would of being a lot less stressed out hauling your load .... ;) And having a lot more fun ...
Its what you get to do with whats in the plate ....
Feel free to put some pictures on , we love to see what others do ....
Oh and by the way welcome aboard , it is the first time I see you here ...
I have a question for Ron S and those up in the area. I ahve been seeing alot of posts in here of thinning red pine. I was wondering if the natural red pine stands are growing in soil that tend to be reddish (iron rich). In New Brunswick the natural red pine grows on iron rich podzols. Of course we have red pine planted on darker soils of farmlands but I'm not counting those sites. I'm just curious.
Swamp,
Much of our red pine here is on a well drained sandy soil. a lot of it is rubicon sand which is quite a sterile sand. If you have ever read the book, "The Lands That Nobody Wanted" that's where a lot of our red pine was planted, especially during the CCC era. Much of this is on National Forest and State Forest system lands.
There is also a lot growing on abandoned farm lands which may be a darker sandy loam or loam soil.
These soils are sandy clay loams with a clay dominated C (compact) horizon. They tend to be real snotty in the rainy season. The soil on the farm here is more sand dominated sandy-clay loam and dries fast after a heavy rain.Our sandy soils are dominated by jackpine-black spruce boreal-like forests.
As I said earlier I was most curious. I find it curious as to why our red pine prefer those soils over the more fertile humo-ferric or brunisols in our area. Well I have the answer, partially, those richer soils where dominated by hardwood which are more shade tolerant and longer lived than red pine. I never seen a red pine in a hardwood stand. ;)
BTW, I never heard of that book. Sounds interesting if not just for its historical content.
What is the CCC era? clear-cut carve and concrete? Remember I'm just a pour old northern hick not that well versed in the local abbreviations. :D
Red pine will tolerate a lot of different soils, from sand to clay to mostly rock, but they do like sunshine. We planted a few seedlings in our grove. The ones on the south side against a field are 20+ feet tall, but one that was planted the same day but near some aspen that partially shaded it is only about 4 feet tall. Same soil type.
Just trying to post a pic, load of English Walnut I got the other day.
Minnesota Boy:
I've also noticed red pine growing on rock cut faces along highways. You'd wonder how a tree can grow from solid rock. I suppose there is soil washed down into crevasses and the rock would be impermiable to water so it would hold there as well.
Have few pictures of a harvest taking place on my old stomping grounds growing up. The land was sold by all the local farmers to Crabbe Lumber who is contracting the harvesting to RA Pheeny Logging and Trucking Company.
The harvesters are mounted on 2 escavators and a pair of huge JD grapple skidders are dragging all the bunches back. A cable skidder crew is working the area next to the stream as it is too steep.
The hill they are working the cable skidder on and the dozer for road repair. The skidder sits outside the stream buffer area and drags cut trees out of the buffer area to the skid road. The clearcut part is about 1000 acres or so now and growing.
Slowzuki,
Was just wondering if you see Gary Goodwin or Marc Blanchard superviing the job. I don't know if they travel that far south. Just curious. I worked with Marc a few years before he went to Crabbe Lumber.
cheers
SwampDonkey,
CCC stood for Civilian Conservation Corps. It was a "make-work" program run by the government here in the states to put out-of-work men to work during the Depression. They lived in camps and planted trees, built roads and campgrounds, and other did other things to improve government land holdings.
I have not met either but Marc Blanchard has a connection. Our property has a Crown Reserve Road beside it. The reserve was trimmed from our property back in the day but has alway remained with our land. Our fields extend onto it and there is a 200 year old fence on the far side of it.
As a note for others, a Crown Reserve Road is a 66ft wide right of way owned by the Crown / Goverment for potential development. People can apply to develop it but it is public land and can't be gated.
Crabbe built a road next to the reserve so they could gate it. The problem is they hit a swamp and needed to divert onto what was part of our property at least on paper. Marc came to visit our friend who owned the land at the time said sure but he didn't think he owned back that far. A trip to the registry office showed he had been paying tax on it since 1946 when he bought the front parcel. St. Anne Nackawic came to visit him and did a boundary adjustment. He agreed they could have the land back if the taxes where paid back. Well the lawyer came and they got the land back, but he never got his taxes back. We bought the front part of the land after that and he passed away this spring.
So now St Anne is in bankruptcy, he never got his taxes back, we don't have as much land as what was described to us when we bought it and that is it!
I'm thinking about tracking down the history on it to see who really should have title to it.
Quote from: SwampDonkey on January 31, 2005, 04:48:13 PM
Slowzuki,
Was just wondering if you see Gary Goodwin or Marc Blanchard superviing the job. I don't know if they travel that far south. Just curious. I worked with Marc a few years before he went to Crabbe Lumber.
cheers
Civilian Conservation Corps (CCC)
http://www.cccalumni.org/history1.html
A couple of log hauler names around here,
"unchained"
"termite"
"toad"
"grumpy" ;D
well lets see if this works :D this is the HD6E we've used for years. this thing will go places a billy would be scared to gene
An Icy Day In The Woods The logger's pick-up towing the Iron Mule forwarder on its flat bed trailer spins out during a "freezing rain" on an icy hill top on the way to start a new timber harvest.
The entire unit slides backwards down the hill off the road and is luckily caught and held up by some trees to prevent rolling over in the swamp area below.
A "large wrecker" was called to winch the unit back on the road for delivery to the landing. An exciting and new experience for a new logger just starting out in the "life of a logger".
I finally got some batt. for the camera, here are a few picts of our current job. This is some of the 30mbf of hardwood, we have a few sticks of veneer.
This is some nice whitepine.
This on is a 17ft whitepine we had a time with getting up the hill, ground is still froze, and it was a winch in and unreel and winch again, and it was one of the farthest tree down.
This is starting to get easier putting in picts.
Here we are starting up with a hitch.
This is the last hill to the top, it a 40 deg slope.
This is Marty J s husband cutting a nice whitepine, he's getting his workout.
This is the noisy beast we're pulling in the wood with 453 detroit (2 mufflers) earmuffs are required.
This is our model 30 MF with loader,forks and grapple, to sort and stack.
They are cutting some large trees along the road north of North Conway , NH for a bigger road and intersection. They had a whole tree chipper there as well as straight trucks removing saw logs. Took a picture of the shear.
Got a few more pictures of the log hauling that was done up in Témiscamingue , Québec .
Barko 275B loader , Spruce and balsam for pulp and sawlogs . The logs will be taken out at the yard with a slasher . These trees where taken down to make way for new road .
Western Star tri-axle with a load of popler logs and tree lenght
Western Star , with a load of white birch and maple , the saw logs will be taken out at the yard these tree where cut to make way for a new hauling road .
Hey Ron, I bet that was fun on the ice. ;)
Ohio Bill, you can scale your images to 400 pixels wide and compress the image to get under 20 k. That's the nice thing about jpeg format. ;) I think DougInUtah had a link to a nice image processing program for free. Then there is also www.xat.com
Doug's Link (http://www.picasa.com/)
hey ron where are you based out of??? i would love to get you out on one of our operations this summer.
Timberjack_teen
I'm based in northwestern Lower Michigan and do travel across the UP some and elsewhere.
ohio bill, only 500 made! i saw one on ebay a few months back, only 900 hrs on it, but the winch was gone. is also one a mile west of crawford colorado, he also has a 220 both are parts machines i believe. i have a massey ferguson 220, my first skidder. old and abused, but just keeps going. for the small selective cuts that i do it is an awsome machine.
Iron Mule Forwarder Enters the Landing. Treais timber harvest; 2/05
Iron Mule Forwards Hardwood Sawlogs. Treais timber harvest; 2/05
I ran into this very interesting harvester when hunting for something...
Claims it can go over 5' high obstructions and work on side hill
http://www.voelkerequipment.com/a91pics.html
Joan:
That is an interesting machine. It appears to change wheel positioning or stance, based on the work that it is doing. It either involves a challenge for the operator or the unit's electronics, or both.
Thanks,
Mike
That is an interesting machine. Rottne has a harverster that will rise and lower. I beleive one of the reason which they make it so you change the ride is so that you can lower the center of gravity while harversting, and rise the machine when traveling on rough terrain. Its the Rottne 5005. There are a few videos on this site: http://www.rottne.com/uk/Movies/movie.htm.
Two Iron Mule Forwarders At Work. Two Iron Mule forwarders are being used on this timber harvest. Treais Timber harvest; 2/05.
Iron Mule Forwarder Works Aspen Area; Treais timber harvest; 3/05.
Iron Mule At the Aspen Landing/Decking Area. The logger's pick-up with snowplow is used to keep the access roads open. Treais timber harvest; 3/05.
Western Star Log Hauler. Hardwood sawlogs are being loaded for trucking to the purchaser's mill some distance away. Treais timber harvest; 2/05.
Figured I'd post a pic of the logging winch we are using. It is an old school Farmi with no butt plate and a self releasing snatch block worth its hefty weight in gold.
The owner has a Ford 7610 2wd with cab he uses it on which has a front mount snowblower that extends to the rear through the winch legs.
We are using it on a 4wd, 50 hp Kubota. It does well but not quite enough weight for my taste. It will pull 2 50-60ft, 16" diameter butt trees from the tops with tractor and trees in snow. 3 if on the flat or going a bit downhill.
Kenworth Pulpwood Hauler. Hardwood pulpwood is being loaded for trucking to a pulp mill some distance away; Treais timber harvest; 2/05.
You have too many wheels on that log truck. In Minnesota you rarely see more than 2 sets of duals on the back of the trailer. Of course, the loads are smaller too, but that has to do with the upper limit of the license allowed here.
Not here in Michigan. They are even considering allowing longer lengths. :( There's a "pup trailer" in the rear.
How long are they looking to go?
They have 3 to 4 axels on trailors here and haul 32 to 46 tonne (that's a metric tonne which is 10 % larger than a short ton). This time of year we have 80 % restrictions on secondary roads.
Most folks are using these trailors
http://www.bwstrailers.com/logger.php
Maine is the same with their trailers.Our pup trailers are alot shorter,when we do see them.There are some good size trailers up north on the paper companies roads,but I don't see big loads on state or towns roads down at my neck of the woods.
Approximately 120 miles trucking to the pulpmill in Muskegon, MI
I think in Michigan they will allow weights up to 140,000 lbs if you have enough axles. In Minnesota you are allowed 80,000 max with 5% over for forest products. In the winter you are allowed 10% over when the roads are frozen or 88,000 plus the 5% tolerance. Last year in Minnesota they started allowing trucks with 6 axles to be licensed for 90,000 but not many have added a third axle on their trailers.
You have to be very careful with that 5% tolerance because if you exceed the tolerance by any amount, the overweight goes back to the max weight allowed. Since many of the pulp mills are now weight scaling, the DOT can and will go to the mills and check all weight tickets back 30 days and send you a ticket for any loads that are overweight. So just because you are not stopped with a heavy load, it does not mean that you got away with an overload.
Multi-axel trucks can be used in Michigan only; maybe in Ohio by special permit.
The pulpwood hauler pictured above will have a gross weight including truck weight of 154,000 - 157,000 lbs carrying a payload of 22 - 25 cords under good road conditions.
In Michigan we use the federal weight limit which is 160,001 lbs. But you can only get it with 11 axles and 1 having a 9' spread. It's all in the axle spreads to get the weight. My truck weighs 55,000 empty w/ the pup legal for 154,000. They are talking about extending the legal lengths for "gravel trains" and construction trucks on nondesignated routes. Log truck are already allowed to be 9' wide and up to 70' long loaded.
I spoke with a hauler here last fall that said he does 160,000#.
I don't recall how many axels he had though.
hey ed k that looks like the skidder i drive (when im able to) lol great pictures everyone!!! and also whoever posted the first pictures on this thread...id give anything to drive that machine!!!
More Wood Hauler Names Noted:
"Timber Taz"
"Doc"
"I Love The Money"
"Fast Forward II"
"Big Boz"
"Chapter II"
Pulpwood Load Crosses "Big Mac"This load is headed south from "Yooper Land" to a pulp mill in northern lower, Michigan; 3/05. Numerous loads of forest products cross the Mackinaw Bridge each day.
A Load of Aspen Pulpwood. A load of aspen pulpwood leaves the harvest area for the mill approximately 100 miles north. Treais timber harvest; 3/05.
Iron Mule Forwarder. This machine works cautiously along the edge of the wetland. Treais timber harvest; 3/05.
The Iron Mule Forwarder Needs A New Tire. The left rear tire on the forwarder is replaced "on the job" with a new one. Treais timber harvest; 3/05.
ron it'a a joy to come in this thread and see what new you have posted thanks gene
Thanks tnlogger. The interest is very much appreciated.
As a Kiwi, I hate to admit that the Aussies have another one up on us but I came across this record for an Aussie "Road Train" 79 trailers, length 1018 meters GVW 1072.3 metric tonnes
Ernie, must take them weeks to load and hook up all their trailers!!
At a kilometre long, how does the driver see their rear trailers in the mirrors? ??? They must pale into insignificance.
When making a turn, they must need at least 1/2km clear inside radius, otherwise it's total wipe-out of anything in their path. :o
Iron Mule Forwarder Back on The Job. With a new left rear tire and chains on the front tires, the Iron Mule continues its work in the northern hardwood thinning. Treais timber harvest; 4/05.
very nice equipment, wish i had a camera to take some we work with, oh well
Small Timberjack Cable Skidder. Parked at the landing. Outfitted with new paint job, new tires, and new chains on front tires. Osterlund Road timber harvest; 3/05.
Ok, this thread is driving me insane. I need someone to pm me their snail mail address that would scan and post a picture or 2 of my skidders. I am becoming insanely jealous. Thanks.
robert take um to walmart and they'll put them on a disc for you ;D
Thank you. Will do.
A Wack of Quality Sawlogs.These sawlogs are laid out on the landing for sale to the "highest bidder". Osterlund Road timber harvest; 3/05.
Here are some pics of a house lot we cut in Late May a few weeks ago ..
Heres a back view of the 525B I run
another pic of the 525B
and another.. finally got my digital cam going :)
Heres the 525 a lil dirty not bad though considering I had it in the mud to door level last week at that lot , amazing what a little rain can do
Heres a pic of the Model 30 Morbark chipper we run
and another one
heres a lil action shot from the top pile getting chipped up
here a few pics of the hitches I was grabbing
and another view
Heres a view of the lot from inside the machine
and well heres a look when we moved out of there , place had over a foot of standing water on the ground , 4 land clearing companies tried but could not get the wood cut and out cause of the mud , so they called the company I work for and well , we got 'er done ..
Well hope you enjoy my pics , I 'll have a lot more in the upcoming weeks .
Rob
sorry heres a last pic ..
Ok, I am going to try to stick my skidder picture in here real quick. But I am supposed to be working. I hope to post more shortly. This, if it works, is Molly and Ginger pulling a pinoak pallet log this winter.
https://forestryforum.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pos=-11404
Hope it works!!
I want the image, not the link. What did I do wrong?
Ok, got some advice. I'll try again.
Wish me luck.
Wahoo!! It works on the preview--here goes the real deal. (Thanks Ed). Yall are going to be sorry I learned this!
The near horse is a 1992 model. She is a Belgian. The far horse, which you can't see well, is a 1998 model. She is the daughter of the other horse, half Belgian and half sneaky little fence jumper. But they work great together as a team.
Glad you got them posted Robert.They were worth the wait!
Now that's a great looking team you have there Robert, thanks for taking the effort to show us. :)
You've got some beautiful horses there. Thanks for the pictures. :)
Nice team!!!!
Way to go 8). Nice team, hope to fence jumper isn't into chicken plucking ;D.
Great pics and looks like a good life too, way to go, no pollution and keeping the old ways alive.
Are you going to pit saw the log ;D
Nice team Robert. My uncle had a team of Belgians, they were twins he raised from colts. Bud and Sailor. Had them 16 years until one died and then he sold the other. One was as wild as the wind and the other was quiet. They worked well together. But, get the wild one alone and hooked to a log, get out of the way. :D He used to use them to yard logs, haul stovewood, cut hey and haul the hey wagon. I don't remember him ploughing with them. It was more of a hobby for him as they never were worked too hard because my uncle never did. ;D
cheers
Timberjack Forwarder. Working an area of aspen removal and oak thinning, Austin timber harvest; 5/05
Here's the new trailer used to bring out cordwood & some sawlogs
Eve - Cowl lot
6/10/05
Ed_K,
How do ya like the trailor? Looks like a good setup for thinning plantations.
S.D. the trailer is nice, holds about 3/4 of a cord. The loader could use more reach, only 9.5'. I have to be careful with the controls, yesterday I picked a log off and it swung up to the knuckle and broke the fitting off the hydro line >:(. I'm running a 7000# tractor, and coming down hill with ledges it will slide some with the trailer loaded full. If it keeps happening, I'll put the ice chains on.
Ed ,
Is that the tractor you where telling me about at the Bangor show ...
Very nice set up , I would not mind having one of those trailers . Sometimes the skidder is a little big and only have a few logs to go get . That trailer would be ideal behind the pick-up .
Isawlogs, it is. Only thing I changed, was to move the wheels out to 7' so it's not tippy.
Nashwaak Lake Area Road maintenanceThis road was constructed approximately 8 years ago and was in need of grading and brushing before trucks and equipment are brought into the site.
Red Spruce StandHarvest block of red spruce and over-mature balsma fir. Lots of blow down around the block perimeter, not seen.
Porter Porter on the way out to the landing
Almost there
Sorting the wood by species on the yard
Some more "wood hauler"names noted while "on the road".
"Animal"
"Gordy"
"Deno"
"Just Logging"
"The Girls" Think My Truck Is Sexy"
"4-Play"
"Get R Down"
"Lone Wolf"
"Big Red One"
"Brow"
"Big Boz"
"Money Pit"
Timberjack 1010 Forwarder. Double bunk forwarder with tracks. Mansfield timber harvest; 5/05.
Nice rig. There was one just like that on the lot beside ours a couple years back. It didn't have the blade or the half tracks and it was a a 6 wheeled one. Worked good though :)
Here are a few pics of the 545 Cat I run and the Hood 24000 Loader/Slasher set up..hope you guys enjoy
Heres a shot of the Hood itself
Heres is a shot of me going through the muddy part of the job...it's a lil deep in spots
here is a better view
Here is a shot from the inside of the skidder , Hood slashing and stacking tops getting ready to move in the chipper to process..
Hope you enjoy the pics there will be lots more to come throughout the next few months..
Rob
nice pic Rob ;) thank's
No problem .. I will be taking some more this coming week so stay tuned
NICE PICS ROB
Is this a clear cut job
Great pics, great machines--- envy is a sin right?
Quote from: Rob on July 24, 2005, 09:56:53 AM
Heres is a shot of me going through the muddy part of the job...it's a lil deep in spots
Bit of an understatment ;) nice pics keep'em comming
Keep the pictures coming I'll look at them ;)
Rob,
What's the reason for working in the mud?? Working a wetland, spring break up, drainage ??? :-[
Ron i'm not certain it is necessarily a wetland. everything in these parts is just saturated from all the rain we have had this spring & summer. but either way it is still a bit to wet. nothing has had a chance to dry out since winter. we still have small springs that only run after winter melt and in spring that are still going quit heavely.
David and Rob,
Does working in a spring or pond and making a mud hole impair your relationship with the land-owner? Is that something that a consulting forestor would rather not happen or is some of it condoned?
we have a lot of wet land (not wetlands) that a skidder can do irrepairable damage to down here. I've seen skidders working in mud where you couldn't see the tires, just a swirl in the mud. Usually a deep hole like that can be worked around but some of the skidder operators will go through them anyway. Some of the Hammocks or small Cypress heads that are damaged by ruts can get a consulting forester in a lot of trouble. I'm not famiiar with the ground up there or the ramifications of rutting, but sure would like to know. It could be that the awareness is more stringent down here because of the number of swamps we have.
Tom i think in this area it is more common than elsewhere. especially if there isn't a forester involved. like i said though chances are thats not even a wetland just wet land. personally i hate seeing the woods all rutted up like that (pet peeve of mine). but in some cases it really is unavoidable (didn't look so in this case though) unless you work the area when the ground is frozen. but i'm not there so i honestly cant pass judgement. i'm sure Rob is only doing what he's told to do.
Best Management Practices (BMP's) would not allow us to "run through mud" areas. We would need to wait for the "dry season"; properly road and drain it, cable the wood across to high and dry ground, or not harvest the area.
We are working one such area of included hydric soil right now as its the first time we've been able to get in to it in three years since it is finally dry enough due the current dry season. We are cabling selected trees out over temporary "slashed over" routes to high ground then cutting into short wood lengths on site to be forwarded out to the landing. Skidding is kept to a minimum to prevent rutting.
first rob welcome to the forum and good looking equipment too
As i read you operate the skidder so i have a couple of questions being a logger in Maine and tenn for over 30yrs.i wonder are you the contractor or just run the skidder for wages.(2) is this a clearcut on company land or a private landowner. The reason i ask and i am in no way placing blame here is the impact of logging practice like this on the forest that is the reason i quit the big companys and started on my own. i value land management more the profit.
now this is just my 2cents worth and in am i judging you. i just feel that land management and soil conservation is more important. :P again welcome gene
hey TNlogger Rob has been a member here for quit some time. also he is just a hired hand. side note he posted some pics awhile back and mentioned that they where logging a patch that no else could becuase of the mud. so i tend to think this is common practice for this company. just an fyi i didn't post this to pass judgement on Rob i've meet him and he seems a decent enough guy.
Rob,
Thanks for the pics.
How will the damage to the soils be mitigated? I would really like to see pics of the repair work. Many years ago a skidder harvesting my woods left ruts like that on the side of a ravine. They put water bars in at the top but those were soon washed out. I ended up grading the shoulders down, using the dirt to fill the ruts and then I rocked it all over using spoils from one to the local quarries. I now use this as my main woods acces road.
dave sorry bout that and i wasn't trying to get on to anyone it's just when i see something like that i sorta let my heart take over instead of my brain. :)
The worst rutting I see occurs at heads of gullies with steeper sloped gully walls. So the guy runs his skidder up the gully which 99 % of the time have springs seeping out that feed streams below. The gully walls are too steep to keep out of the wetter gully trough. But, sometimes the gully is not even deep and the skidder runs up the trough of the gully because it's a wide gradual path, making an easier trek to the yard. This practice is shunned by the best intended folks, but often gets forgotten when their chasing wood for machine payments. On the family farm we were always fortunate that we never had gullies or steep side hills to work. Nice and flat with gentle running streams and wet runs. I've seen some pretty dramatic erosion on farm fields though untill folks changed their farming practices in the 1980's. It was amazing the erosion on gentle slopes, you could burry a tractor in the erosion ditch. There is still some serious erosion in the New Denmark area from farming practices, even though steps have been made to reduce it by terracing and green belts, but some fields are just too steep.
tnlogger there is no reason to appoligize. like you i also hate to see things like that. i was just letting you know Rob has been a member here and that he is just a hired hand.
Load of Quality Sawlogs. This load of quality sawlogs is moving across "Big Mac" from Lower Michigan into Upper Michigan.
I did that one time. ;D Go across the Mac from lower Michigan into Upper Michigan, I mean. Jeff took me. Man! What a bridge.
we can hardly see the shore on they other side.... :o
I'm looking forward to walking across the "Big Mac" come Labor Day.........if I can find a way.
Ron, why are the logs going North?
Are there no mills closer?
That above mud job looks a perfect place for horses to show their worth, snaking through the timber around the edge of the mud to the other side but I am biased. Got to do some of that this summer for a real logger. Had a ball. Took the logs across a golf course--he set them on my wagon running gears with his piece of equipment and we hauled them across the course and then he off-loaded directly onto his trailer with a hydraulic arm. We took several semi loads out and you couldn't even tell we had been there--except for the occassional "horse hazard"!
Tom, there must be some fairly long bridges down on the Keys aren't there? We have Confederation Bridge here between New Brunswick and PEI, which is 8 miles long.
Link to Live Bridge Cam (http://www.confederationbridge.com/en/media_gallery/bridge_cam.html)
"Big Mac" is 5 miles long, but the largest suspension bridge in the world.
There are a number of saw and veneer mills here in northern Lower Michigan, but these logs must have found a better market in the UP. There are also UP and Wisconsin buyers buying here so the laod may be going to one of these clients.
Loads also come from the UP into northern Lower Michigan, so it depends wherever the quality and price is best I guess.
We have the overseas highway from the mainland to Key West that has one link that is 7 miles long. There are two bridges there now, the old and new. It's quite a trip,but, nothing like the bridge over Lake Ponchartrain in louisianna. It's 24 miles long.
A breathtaking a bridge is The New River Bridge on US-19 in W.V. You happen up on that bridge, unsuspectingly, and all of a sudden your vehicle is suspended half-way to the moon. "How'd I get here?" is how I feel everytime I cross it. :D
That's Arden Cogar, jr country, a new FF member. I know its high enough to sky dive off of. ;)
Yikes, I don't like them high bridges. Just get me as fast as possible to the other end. :D I've never even crossed the Confederation Bridge, which spans the icy cold Northumberland Straight. They sometimes shut it down because of high cross winds. I've been over to the Island many times by ferry. For me personally, it's kind of like the phrase 'been there done that' as far as going over there. I've been to the New River on the Virginia side, near Radford where I stayed with friends. Wow :o 24 miles is a long trek on a bridge, hope no one is forced to walk it. ;D If I'm ever on a bridge, it won't be to skydive, unless someone with a vengence is trying to do me in. ::)
Well first and foremost I have been a member here for close to 3 years now , have not posted nearly as much as i use too because I have been too busy working to get on here , but thanks for welcoming me anyway.
As for the job in question Iam just the skidder operator for the company , they tell me to pull the wood and well that what I do , I myself know how to avoid rutting but on this job in was inevitable to avoid plus the old operator pretty much destroyed that part of the job before they removed him from the skidder permanetly. Yes the job is a clear cut it is a 165 home development & golf course , the pictures where you see the mud is the big cultasac and there was a foot of standing water there apparently before I got to the job and the old op just twisted and turned through the whole area causing it a too turn to mud. So when i got there I had no choice or chance to avoid the area as the was roughly 60 hitches of bunched wood on the other side of it so i was forced to go through the area.
We are a landclearing company not select cut loggers , we come in cut , skid , chip , stump and grind with tub grinders , we can not leave slash anywhere on the jobs must all be picked up. As for any repair work the area will be filled in as the road will be going there and that is up to the site workers not us. Like I said we are not a timber harvesting operation. If I was to start that job before the old operator I probably could have avoided the rutting , but its hard to avoid when the damage is done before.
Well I hope this answered any conflicts and questions and if you would like me to stop posting pictures then I will do so , but please dont make me out to be the bad guy or bad operator as there was no way to avoid what happened...We do alot of muddy jobs that other companies can not do , this part just got rained on and it stayed there , we usually use swamp mats but the contractor told us there was no need as they would be digging and filling that area. Now I have been running skidders for the past 11 or so years and consider myself a decent operator who does not bounce and scar up "save trees" , avoid rutting and going through muddy areas if possible,this cut was just impossible to avoid rutting it was mud treeline to treeline so there was no choice.
Rob
Rob
Thanks for the good explanation of what you were doing. It makes sense that way. I don't think anyone meant to be pointing a finger at you specifically, but more pointing to what it looked like was happening. Who of us wouldn't enjoy a trip or two through the mud hole if we had a chance. :D I would! But I wouldn't want to run my own equipment through it and get 'mud' on it. :)
I suspect that often posts are answered, such as yours, just because of stirring up the mud and leaving the ruts, in what appeared to be a logging job, and really was mentioned for what others could learn from it (as well as to let others know that 'we' know better than to do that). So it, to me, was just a 'good' example of what not to do, and others were using it to point out that they knew better than to do that.
So, thanks for posting the picture that so many used to stomp on the 'muddy' skidder practice, as without it, that subject of mudding up a logging trail would probably not have come up. I hope you consider it in the light that it was a good example, and that others didn't know all the facts as to why it was being done that way. Sure hope you don't back away, as you can offer a lot to the 'logging' discussions, IMO.
Thanks for posting and bringing this up to date. It would have been easy to just have your feelings hurt and disappeared.
(and DanG, running that rig looks like fun, but expect it could get like work some days too :) )
Rob I see your points and think on the internet.....a feeding frenzie developes on a topic.and people just chim in as if what they are discussing is the gospel.....when in fact it is comment on a comment about an idea someone posted about an assumption about a picture a guy posted for others to enjoy.
I dont think you have any reason to explain yourself or any such thing. Neither does the owner of the company.
You are doing a tough job the best and most practical way possible.
What diffeece are 1000 ruts gonna make when the D-9 cat gets done re shaping that entire parcel into something nice for people to enjoy ;)
HI Rob,
I agree with beenthere in the fact that we weren't pouncing on your job. In fact my post about rutting was just an example I've seen going on. We were on the subject of rutting so..... ;) I don't attack people's work without knowing the before and after conditions. I'll often here these sunday driver types drive by a piece and say what a mess. It's mostly because of the brush that's left, and there is nothing economical we can do to remove it. Or someone will look at a select cut and call it high grading without being there before hand to see that the lot was mostly pulpwood and the guy was trying to leave at least something for seed. Just because a tree has a fork 20 feet up and a bunch of rot on the trunk doesn't mean the seed produced from that tree will produce trash trees. ::) If that were the case than we'de never get a smooth beech resistant to beech scale growing in a stand of severely diseased beech. I've seen some nice second growth sugar maple stands previously harvested for firewood. In fact they look better than alot of stands not worked at all.
cheers
rob glad to see you show up :) after reading your explanation it all makes sence. and i am one that gets over excited when i see stuff like that and nope i wasn't getting on to you just was trying to find out some facts ;D
And shoot stick around more as the sawyers out number us poor loggers way to much. :D
Rob,
Thanks for the follow-up. I understand about coming up on a job after someone else has butchered the place. I am working on cleaning up a site right now where the loggers did not use any BMPs or even pretend to. A lot of what I am doing is pulling tops out of the washes for the landowner so limbs do not end up down stream when it rains. I am reducing the tops for firewood and when I am done I will put in water bars on all the skid trails. Any pics of the site in its current state would raise a lot of questions too.
Keep up the good work and post when you can.
Hi Guys ,
Well first off thanks for understanding were I was coming from with my post I made recently , when I posted the pics I had a feeling it would stir up some controversy but I did it anyway . Sometimes there are just no ways around the mud and usually we will use swamp mats for that issue but like I said contractor so do it so thats what went on , I will be going back to that job in the next couple months to when we have to make the second cut for the golf course after the shaper comes in and I will get some more pics of that area for everyone. Well again thank you for hearing my explanation on this topic .
Oh a lil off topic news guys my Fiancee' is pregnant so Im gonna be a daddy !! Just found out last night..
Rob
Congrats Rob.
Thanks David Im hoping it will be a boy , of course she wants a girl but hey thanks ... Another Timber Industry kid will be in the world
8) Way to go Rob 8).
congrat Rob ;)...
Thanks fellas Im sure it will be fun ;D
Timberjack 608 B Tracked Harvester; Mansfield, MI 5/05
Nice big undercarriage on that rig, must be pretty stable ???
Quote from: Rob on August 06, 2005, 07:58:45 PM
. Another Timber Industry kid will be in the world
that one prob we are facing here ..there no young folk's who whante's to work in the forest anymore.I read one's,the average age of forest worker is some like 45 years old :o
I see alot of father and son crews around here.
SD how old is the son ???
OLD_JD
20's and 30's and I know a couple brother crews in their 40's. But your probably right with your avarage. It just costs so much to enter this business, just like farming. Most new entrants into farming are dutch immigrants around here, they get so many government subsidies that your son will never see.
Loggers Are Often Families. Here, older brother, Jim Jr. (age 32) bucks aspen sawlogs and pulpwood while his younger brother John (mid-twenties) is off picking up wood with the forwarder. Dad, Jim Sr. does the trucking. Johnson aspen timber harvest; 7/05.
good link about forest equip ;)
http://perso.wanadoo.fr/laurent.guillot/English%20real%20model%20links.html
Brilliant link OLD_JD.
I particularly like the Menzi Muck steep terrain harvester....similar principle to an Austrian Kaiser?? I used to repair.
Another good one is the innovative Konrad from Austria, ideal for poor traction situations.
THanks for that Tim
Family Logging Business. "Dad" loads aspen pulpwood on the Western Star wood hauler "Get R Dun". Johnson Aspen timber harvest; 7/05.
Family Logging Business. The youngest son forwards aspen pulpwood harvested from the sawlog tops. Johnson Aspen timber harvest; 7/05.
Timberjack Cable Skidder. Getting in position to pull tree lengths from lowland area of hemlock/lowland hardwoods thinning. Mosher timber harvest; 7/05.
Timberjack Cable Skidder. Pulls red maple tree lengths to firm ground for product length cutting with chainsaw. Hemlock/Lowland Hardwoods; Mosher Hardwoods timber harvest; 7/05.
Valmet 544X Forwarder. This machine has performed well under a diversity of conditions. It is currently working in a hemlock/lowland hardwoods stand forwarding cut to length products bucked from tree lengths moved from the wetter areas by the Timberjack cable skidder. Mosher hardwoods timber harvest; 8/05.
Hemlock/Lowland Hardwoods Stand. Trees are selectively marked for harvest. Mosher timber harvest; 8/05.
"Checking The Pull Down". Pulling down hardwood tree lengths with cable skidder in thick hemlock/ hardwoods stand. Effort needs to be made so as not to damage any standing trees. Mosher hardwoods timber harvest; 8/05.
More "Wood Hauler" names noted while "on the road"
"Short Stuff"
"Power Stroke"
"Finnlandian Outlaw"
"Against the Grain"
"Unbelievable"
"Nose Cone"
"Dirty Hog"
"Hammer"
Pulling A Cut Tree Down. The Timberjack cable skidder is being used to remove the selectively marked cut trees within the thick hemlock/lowland hardwoods stand on hydric soils. Mosher timber harvest; 8/05.
Skidding A Tree Length. The timberjack cable skidder pulls the basswood tree length from the hemlock/lowland hardwoods stand to high ground where it is "cut to length". Mosher timber harvest; 8/05.
Some vidéo about timber harvest method :
http://www.afm-forest.fi/movies/80.mpg
http://www.afm-forest.fi/movies/60.mpg
http://www.afm-forest.fi/movies/55.mpg
http://www.afm-forest.fi/movies/50.mpg
http://www.afm-forest.fi/movies/45.mpg
http://www.deereforestry.com/flv/index.htm#
http://www.forstmaschinen-profi.de/downloads/johndeere.wmv
http://www.forstmaschinen-profi.de/downloads/ecologforwardermittel.wmv
http://www.forstmaschinen-profi.de/downloads/ecologharvestermittel.wmv
http://www.forstmaschinen-profi.de/downloads/hannibal.wmv
http://www.hytecmfg.com/HTMLobj-218/RS5500clip1-high.mp4
http://www.hytecmfg.com/HTMLobj-222/RS6000clip1-high.mp4
http://www.hittner.hr/documents/Akcija55V.mpg
http://www.hittner.hr/documents/Akcija120V.mpg
http://www.komatsuforest.com/default.asp?id=1374
http://www.forsttechnik.at/movies/KONRAD-modern-times-mini.mov
http://www.menzimuck.com/forst/video/durchforst.MPG
http://www.menzimuck.com/forst/video/fahren.mpg
http://www.menzimuck.com/forst/video/fo-steil1.MPG
http://www.menzimuck.com/forst/video/fo-sturm1.MPG
http://www.menzimuck.com/forst/video/fo-sturm2.MPG
javascript:openvideo('video13VFB.htm');
http://www.quadco.com/english/videos/TG470_2.mov
http://www.quadco.com/english/videos/5600_samsung250.wmv
http://www.quadco.com/english/videos/240_softwood.wmv
http://www.quadco.com/english/videos/240_hardwood.wmv
http://www.quadco.com/english/videos/daewoo-L240_2.mov
http://www.quadco.com/english/videos/TG370_L220_2.mov
http://www.rottneusa.com/video/wh20.htm
http://www.rottneusa.com/video/backings/video1_03.gif
http://www.forstmaschinen-profi.de/downloads/silvatecharvester8266th.wmv
http://www.teleforest.com/fre/video2.html
http://timberpro.com/video/TS%20620%20low1.wmv
http://timberpro.com/video/TF%20820%20CB%20low.wmv
http://timberpro.com/video/TF%20820%20Combo%20low.wmv
http://timberpro.com/video/TF%20820%20forw%20low.wmv
http://timberpro.com/video/TB%20620%20logmax%20low.wmv
http://timberpro.com/video/TB%20620%20Saw%20low.wmv
http://timberpro.com/video/2005%20tour_reduced.wmv
http://timberpro.com/video/630%20w%20Rolly.wmv
http://timberpro.com/video/TF%20830%20Features.wmv
Great info! Some good showings of mechanical harvesters in action.
that should keep me busy for a little while. :D
Thank-you, Clark! :P
Great collection of videos! :)
The Komatsu design of a combined harvester and forwarder seemed very impressive! Is it more efficient to use the two separate machines rather than the combined design? ???
Ever see those old Koering Feller Forwarders?? They were monsters especially with a ful load of treelength hardwood laying on the bunk behind.
Some info and pictures on the beast (http://www.stthomasu.ca/~pmacdona/tresearch/ffh.htm)
Clark,
you've been busy :o Do you collect forestry machine videos as well as FM models.
Octoman,
Combination machines are more of an issue of economics than efficiency, usually driven by small time owner/operator contractors.
There is a father/son team 10 miles from us, who have 1½ harvester and forwarder combos.....1 is full time, the other on standby when needed
They have no intention of joining the big boys.
Tree Lengths Are "Cut To Length". Short wood logging in a hemlock/lowland hardwoods stand. Mosher timber harvest; 8/05,
Check out the attachments, a pic of the Koering tree length and short wood machine.
Look at all the moving heads on the short wood machine!!!
Many of our engineers and our President designed most of those Koehring machines. They were innovative concepts in those early days of mechanized harvesting. That philosphy and innovation has been passed on to our equipment today. Thanks for all of the great old pictures. Over and out from the Koehring home town!
Regards,
Steve Young
Tigercat Industries
Valmet Forwarder. Picks up and removes "cut to length" products hand cut from tree lengths pulled to dry ground by the timberjack cable skidder from the wetter soils of the hemlock/lowland hardwoods stand. Mosher timber harvest; 8/05.
Ron ,
How have you been ? Suprised not too see any new pics on the thread from you in almost a month ??? Im gonna try and get some from the 100 acre cut were doing , hopefully before weeks end .
Rob
hi
hey syoung we still have a 618 koehring feller buncher,very reliable machine.still gets used as a back up machine must have 20000+ hrs on it 8)
Our logging jobs have slowed down some due to current market conditions so the pictures have slowed down also. Hopefully it will pick up after the rifle deer season and as winter comes on.
We have a lot of oak standing on the stump, but markets are poor at present, so the loggers are "sitting" on it hoping for better prices. :'(
Oak prices are down here in Maine too. Forestys are telling the land owners to wait until the market goes up.
Ponsse Caribou Forwarder. With tracked rear wheels, it works in a northern hardwood thinning. Cleveland Cliff's timber harvest in Michigan's U.P.; 11/05.
The oak market is down here in Southern NH also , we are on a 100 acre select cut for wildlife , mainly deer as the property is soon to be a deer hunting camp . The are some very large red oaks and it's a shame we have to cut them now with the price being nearly $500 per mbf less than it was 6 months ago .. The lot looks very nice almost nothing standing but Red Oak , with some mixed in Hemlock , Pine .. The deer are loving it . I'll try and get some pics as we will be done by weeks end.
Rob
Logger's Service & Supply Truck. This used mobile welder's truck makes a good service and supply truck for the logging company. Mosher lowland hardwoods timber harvest; 9/05.
Yes that's a dandy. Alot of fellas around here have panel trucks where they can get inside out of the cold, hot sun or bugs and file the saws and fix things for their machines. There's a post up there of mine someplace with one and a forwarder braced against the door for extra security. People like to steal tools on the weekends. ::)
Some more Wood Hauler names noted while on the road.
"Hooter Patrol"
"Chapter II"
"Pedlar"
Nice Thread Ron. Thanks for the time you put into all the pictures. And the same to everone else that has posted. Great Forum here lots of good info. 8)
here is a picture of my BIL cutting aspen on the landing. He's a mechanical engineer for Bell helicopter down in Fort Worth, TX. He and my sister were up for christmas, and he wanted to help me out for a few days. So, after a short trainig period ( he'd never ran a chainsaw before) I put him to work cutting on the landing. He did pretty good too, especially considering the mess I made of the landing( I never ran a skidder before. Aspen pulp is at $102/cord at the ainsworth osb plant in Grand Rapids. Lot of money for pulp. $102/cord-$16/cord= $86/cord on the landing, and this is wood off of our property, so no stumpage.
That's a good price barbender, it's more than the Burla Group is gonna pay here. They dropped the price to mid 80's pricing. (~$75/cord). No private producer is going to be selling there unless they just like excercise and giving wood away. I'de rather make worm food and pecker poles out of it. Their mill yard is going to be pretty empty for awhile.
"pecker poles out of it" we cut a lot of them ;D
Wow, 75.00 per cord is that landed at the mill...
Here it is the grand price of 47.00 (CDN) on my landing....what a joke!!! :-[
No, roadside price Woodhog. We were getting $110 a cord a couple years ago. According to the news tonight UPM in Miramachi is faultering. UPM puts the blame on the inefficiencies of it's labour force, which has caused the mill to be unprofitable for the last 10 years. And another contributing factor I beleive (and this is speculative) is Irving undercut them on a contract for pulp deliveries by $20/m^3 with cheap crown wood (180,000 m^3). A contract that UPM made with a Quebec company for wood from private sources, but it was never signed. ::) But, apparently Irving had to obtain wood later from Fraser/Nexfor to overcome a shortfall, because of closed deliveries of private wood. I got that info from 'Atlantic Forestry Review'. ::) All kinds of fun stuff. :-\
Ron, Where was that CCI harvest located?
bwalker,
The harvest was being done in the area behind the Iron River water tank and the old Bates mine.
Had a good time watching this little skidder working in my back yard today.
They're finally getting underway with the power line I've been whining about for the past 2 years. This guy is helping to clear the right of way. Here he is delimbing a twitch by driving over them with the blade. It's amazing how quickly a good operator can clean up a whack of logs this way.
Headed for the landing with a half-truckload behind.
That is some skidder!
She looks like she could swim, logs and all. ;)
That's quite a whack of wood. :)
That is not a skidder is a SKIDDDEEEEEER
smiley_eek_dropjaw smiley_eek_dropjaw smiley_eek_dropjaw
I guess if you want a big skidder you have to buy Canadian eh?
(Tigercat)
Biggest skidder I have ever seen. Paul, I have to wonder how it might work in your part of the woods although doing endo's probably is not an issue. ;D
I've seen them use skidders up on the Nass River, BC. We laid out most harvest blocks up there for skidder. In the area we were at, the ground was more rolling and not steep mountains. Although we were in full view of coast mountains with snow on their peeks.
Was out riding with a buddy of mine yesterday who runs a Ponsse harvester. He is working on a black spruce clear cut right now, I'll try and post the pics I took. I love watching those machines- they are amazing.
I'll try that again
and again
and one more
I have watched skidders a lot and driven them a couple of times, to move them around the yard, but never one 6 wheels. It looks like it might be clumsy to turn and maybe tough to back up.
He didn't seem to have any trouble maneuvering, Sawguy. The thing did seem a bit slow moving around, though. There was a more normal looking Franklin skidder working with him, and it would run circles around the big guy, but only drag about a fourth as much wood. That seemed to be more of a traction issue. He had 4 tires on the ground, and the big'un had 12.
barbender, where you at? The wood doesn't look much bigger than plantation black spruce, although that doesn't look like plantation. Should have maybe been thinned a long time ago though. Nice peice of equipment. ;)
Swampdonkey- I am in north- central minnesota. That is just wild grown black spruce in a peat swamp, they never really thin the black spruce around here. All I have seen on black spruce is clear cuts. The management plan called for aerial reseeding, which they do a lot of around here with both white and black spruce. Something I thought was cool was my buddy would take a stem and run it into the ground to measure the frost, and keep it going down through the peat until it hit something hard- about twelve feet down. It's been so unusually mild this winter that there is hardly any frost in the ground, so the loggers have been having a hard time getting at the winter timber in the swamps. The day I took those pictures we had just got a cold snap with lows in the -20 to -30F range, so the job they were working was just freezing enough that the forwarder wasn't breaking through anymore.
Alot of those black spruce bogs are layered here. The lower branches of a black spruce gets trained by snowload over a period of years and eventually takes root. Often you'll see a taller tree in the middle of little ones circling it. Never had any personal experience with aerial seeding, but I would think it would be fairly successful in moss. They don't do it here, they just plant by hand. Often times, if the logging is timed right in a good seed year there is all kinds of regen in 3 years and alot of those are advanced seedlings from before logging if the stand isn't too dense. The overwintering semi serotinus cones open up in the slash in the heat of the sun during spring and early summer. Terrible slow growing sites though. ;D
swampdonkey- I didn't check any of these trees but our black spruce grows real slow here. It wouldn't surprise me if those trees in the pics were 75-100 years old.
Here are a few pics I snapped while at work..select cutting 160 acres in New Hampshire
Rob
here is one of the skid roads
Here is a downhill view of another skid road
Here is a pic of our landing thats our 460D skidder and 384 TMS Prentice delimber/slasher and in the back in the 280 Prentice used for feeding chipper and loading trucks
Here is a pic of our 425 Timbco heading thru the woods
here is a pic of the timbco with a fresh cut beech in the head
another pic of the 460D
Great pictures Rob, thanks. Your settup was similar to a fellow I cruised wood and layed trails out for. He and his partner headed west after the big down turn in the industry and do trucking out there in the northern part of the praries. Alot of outfits had to leave NB in the last couple of years.
There is birch mixed in that stand too, but I'm not cutting that. Here's the beast I'm skidding with
Aspen sure can yield alot of volume per acre if it's healthy and large stuff. We cut over 300 cords of just aspen on 10 acres in 1983, that was besides the hardwood and softwood that wasn't cut. Only thing was, the rest should have been taken because the stand was too open and the maples died and alot of the softwood blew over and made fertilizer. If your not careful with the amount of basal area you remove around the birch they will start to die back in 3 years, and if you cut one with symptoms it will be full of pocket rot.
Here goes a load of pulp off of our property
These trucks are running about 100,000lbs. in the winter now, with the third axle they can license for around 90,000lbs and in the winter they can hual 10% over that. The 90,000lb license is new in MN in the last year. I don't think you'll see as many center mount loaders anywhere as you do in MN, I'd say 90% of the woodhualers have a center mount. What's it like in other areas? I've been a few place out west, and they use those pole trailers that load up onto the truck when they are empty. I have a buddy that worked for a cut to length logger in georgia, they had bunk trailers that they loaded out with the forwarder.
There are many of them here in Michigan also. Some are pictures in above photos.
Looks just like here in Carleton county ;)
What is it BWS or EZ-Load stamped on the mud flaps? ;)
barbender, you are right, tree length loads are the norm out here. Some operators process in the bush and haul short logs on b-train, particularily to specialty mills. Paul H, Frank Pender, Tillaway and others probably have some pics that would give you grey hairs and religion :D
Serco? Not sure if I understand what you meant swampdonkey ??? I was out cutting again today- heres some pics
Mess in the back of the truck
Homebrew skidsteer grapple I use for stacking on the landing
I'm getting pretty attached to this old borrowed Timberjack
There's a lot of small white pine in here I'm trying to save, you ever notice how a falling tree is attracted to leave trees, like a magnetic force ::)
More of the cut area
Real loggers see my methods and shake their heads- is that a skidder or a forwarder?
A dandy barber chair, this tree was leaned over at about 45degrees right over some white pines, so I cut it a little at a time while lifting on it with the skidder. Ended up snapping anyways, but I missed the pines for once
Here's the snag that ended up on top of the skidder in the previous picture
barbender, EZ-Load or BWS is a company that makes logging trailors to sell all over the country. Everyone here has them. There used to be alot of self laoders here a few years ago, but they have gone to trailors without loaders for the most part. I prefer the self loader guys when I buy firewood because it's not a hassle to get the firewood hauled and unloaded.
You sure you haven't got any DeMerchant blood in ya? The Demerchant boys are always in those scrapes with trees falling on the skidder and such and the old man tells me 'I can't learn them boys nuthin'. :D :D :D ;) I get a kick out of it. I gotta go out and see the old feller one of these days. He was one of the original guys that set up our marketing system in our area.
Swampdonkey- no Demerchant blood here, though I'm sure there's folks that would tell you they "couldn't learn me nuthin' " either :D. I didn't actually drop that tree on the skidder, it was a snag I was pushing over and it somehow ended up on top of of the machine- same difference maybe ::) Most of the trailers you see around here are Sta-Lite and Savage, one is made in Cook,Mn and the other in Wisconsin I think. Then they usually have a Serco or Lemco loader on them, which are both made pretty close to here. Shop at home, I guess. I am starting to see a few more bunk trailers without loaders now, probably haul another 1 1/2 cords without one. You still see a few pole length trailers around here to, a few with front mount loader (those guys can throw on a load quick! I've had a fellow with that set-up haul house logs for me a couple of times) The main reason I think there are still so many center-mounts is the way people log around here. The big outfits go in and hammer the wood down, and it may be 2 weeks after the woods crew is gone before the trucks even show up to start hauling. A buddy that works for one of them said that they had a couple thousand cords out ahead of the trucks at one point. I guess it just makes the logistics a lot easier.
Quote from: barbender on March 23, 2006, 12:35:58 PM
I didn't actually drop that tree on the skidder, it was a snag I was pushing over and it somehow ended up on top of of the machine- same difference maybe.
:-X :-X
Trailer configurations are an interesting subject. It really depends on overall logging systems used. I've seen setups where bunk trailers are loaded by forwarder, which requires a spare trailer to be left to load at the block while the truck's hauling the full trailer. In a jam the forwarder piles the wood roadside to load the trailer later, but that's lots of handling for an expensive forwarder to do when it should be movign wood. This setup is usually more popular with smaller stump-to-dump operations.
If you need to move alot of wood from one place, ie. 800ha clearcut in Northern Ontario, it's worthwhile to float a dedicated loader in to make loading of the trailers fast (for either tree length or CTL). A loader can usually support a fleet of 6-8 trucks, so when you move one in, you better have the inventory / hot logging production to keep all the trucks and loader going. In these situations, when trucks get stuck, broken down, etc. you're not just wasting the $ tied up in the trucks not producting but also a loader at a high $/scheduled hour cost. In additon to quick loading times, loaderless trailers legally haul more wood per trip.
In situations where small volumes are beign produced, ie. small blocks or a single team of gear picking away at a large block, it makes sense to send in a self loader truck in sporadically to move fresh wood, rather than having to build up a big enough inventory of wood to justify floating in a loader.
Self loaders are also good in multiproduct sort CTL operations that demand flexibility to supply a varitey of mills with the right products just in time. For example, a fleat of self loaders might have to haul from three or four different blocks simultaneously in order to supply seperate pulp mill, osb, veneer, softwood and hardwood mills with their requirements just-in-time. If one road goes to @#$ becuase of bad weather you don't have a loader trapped in there and have the flexibility to go somewhere drier if you can with a self loader. Self loaders are often used to "clean up" the last few loads in blocks primairly hauled with straight (loaderless) trailers. Another advantage of self loaders is they can unload themselves in a pinch at the mill if there are lineups for the loader or it's down.
I am surprised swamp donkey hasn't mentioned detach-loader tucks. They're prety popular in the Canadian Maratime provinces, but I haven't seen many anywhere else. They've got a heay duty self loader that's center mounted that gives the trucker flexibility similar to a self loader to move his own loader around from block to block, but the mount enables the trucker to leave his loader at the block to decrease his tare weight, and increase payload. The detach loaders are a bit more robust and have a bit longer reach than the more permanently mounted self loaders so they can load faster, but you'e got to go back to the same block again to make them worth it. Basically they are a hybrid of the two other systems.
Loading cross-ways seems to be a reigonal thing too. Obvioulsy, you can only do it if you're moving 8' wood. I know in some regions you're not allowed to load this way any more. For instance, in new brunswick I dont' think you'r eallowed to sell trailers set up for this any more, but you can still load this way if you already have a trailer set up this way. The load aligning drums that the trucks drive through to straighten the load out are quite the sight to see in action. Somone should put up a picture of them.
Combination trailers are interesting too. They can convert to haul chips or logs. They're kind of an experimental thing here but are used in europe. They are good if you're route is condusive to hauling chips in one general direction and logs in another, minimizing the amount of travel done empty.
Steve, I havn't seen many detached loaders around private woodlots. Possibly used more on crown lands. Alot of guys do have a dedicated loader truck with Prentice loaders and load trailors without self loaders. Those guys usually don't own trucks, they hire the trucking. It's funny the guys trucking off private get way more than off crownlands. The industrial land barons keep beating the rates down. So, if your atually a trucker and making money, it's best to keep it to yourself. But, some of those guys don't know enough not to brag. ;)
I've always wondered about those loader trucks. I've seen a few of them in the woods but never acutally watched them work. Seems like you'd need to have a road wide enough for the loader and trailer side by side? Do these loadertruck setups limit themselves compared to a tracked loader that can sit off to the side of the road? Do you have to build wider in-block roads for them?
The loader truck sits behind the trailor and loads over the back if they have treelength. If it's 100" wood then they may have to sit side by side. Alot of guys use straight trucks in small operations and close to mills, so they load over the back if it's 100" wood.
For any of you Canadian's here have you read the article called "Working Double time" in the latest copy of Canadian Forest Industries? It tells alot about the new fad of multi-use trailers in Canada. Although it is commonly used in Europe it is in the beginning works of becoming very popular here in western Canada. They claim that the best way to make money with one of these is to use it on a triangular shaped route and hauling on atleast two legs of the route. It is also considerably more to get set up with one of these trailers at being about $40,000 more than a conventional chip van. I feel that one of the biggest downfalls to these trailers is the downtime to convert from chips to logs or vise versa. 2.5 hours each time you need to convert is an awefull lot of time to be down if you ask me.
Read this article if you haven't already. It may just open your eyes a little at what some of the logging operations are trying to achieve these days.
Brad.
Here is a set of pulp rollers, they are about 45 min west of Miramichi on the way to Little Sheephouse Falls (waterfall)
slozuki, are they the ones over by McGraw Brook? They've been there for 25 years I think, I remember them as a kid. There used to be a zoo and park and ranger office near there.
Swampy I don't know, I've only ever been there once and it seemed to be in the middle of nowhere on the road to the old mines.
"Reserve of spruce fir and white pine forest, spring-fed brooks and waterfalls, interpretative signing looped trails with walking bridge, steep rock cliffs. Entrance is accessed off the Fraser Burchill road from Rte 430 approx. 48 km (30 mi.) northwest of Newcastle(Miramichi). A specific interest is the trunk of a 350 years old white pine displayed at the trail head. Dry groomed trail"
McGraw Brook dumps into the Renous river off route 108, SW of Miramichi. Probably a different area than you suggested. Your description sounds like Heath Steel country over on the Nepisiquit License, or the Sevogle License. But, I believe it's Nepisiquit, quite certain. That's not far from Popple Depot in one direction and Heath Steel back toward bathurst. 'The Big South' it's called near Big Bald Mountain. Any of that sound familiar? ;D There ain't anyplace much I haven't been to in NB by hoof or by wheel. :D :D
Big baldy sounds familier, the falls that I grabbed the directions from is located in the REPAP nature park the rollers are about 10 k or less from there. Was 4 years ago that I was there, and before I owned a GPS.
Yeah, Heath Steel is kind of at the divide between the North West Br of the Mirimachi/Sevogle and the Nepisiquit. Since you mentioned RePAP, that would lean more toward the Mirimachi/Sevogle R drainage. But seems to me it was Repap that had the logging camp up along the Nepisiquit River where I stayed during forestry fall camp. The bridge crossing the river was named after Heath Steel. Anyway a fella could toss a wooden coin in the air up there and if the wind was blowing right, it would float down the Mirimachi or down the Nepisiquit. :D :D :D
I never walked the nature trail up there, but the woodlands manager (might even been higher up then that) at the time put that park together during the 1995 blow down up there to appease the protestors who where making a fuss about the logging companies cleaning up the mess. I remember old Sunny, who ran the half way inn on the 108, he had to take a bunch of them do gooders out for a ride to show them some old growth. Opened up a few eyes as I recall. I recall a website they put up and who ever took the photos of the area, didn't know where they were. I know the area like my own woodlot and when I seen a photo of Lake Serpentine mislabled I emailed the guy responsible. Surprisingly, I did get a reply, but he played dumb at the time and didn't even recall what he had on his site. Anyway, the site has disappeared into oblivian since, and the fuss has all subsided. I've been in that country, pretty much since they opened it up with forestry roads and have been to every lake and stream 3 m wide or more. Alot of times we walked for at least an hour to get to them, sometimes took 3 hours to walk out though. :D
Heath Steel, yes that name was on a sign very near the gravel road we turned onto on our way there.
Northern Hardwood Thinning. Selective harvest thinning to 70-90 sq. ft. basal area with gap openings. Wittke timber harvest; 4/06.
"Tailgate" Safety Session. The Michigan Association of Timbermen (MATSIF) Safety Officer travels around to active timber harvests, inspects their safety performances and provides required "tailgate" safety sessions.
Here the "experienced" tree fallers are paying attention as the Safety Officer provides the required safety training session on chain saw use and tree falling. A "Timber Jill" is on the right. Wittke timber harvest; 1/06.
They are suppose to come around our thinning crews, but in all the years I've been in this business I've never seen a soul. We leave DNR and the Marketing Board maps and photos. Up here we are required to have work permits from DNR to be in the woods as well as fire suppression equipment.
Swampdonkey,
When I was in New Brunswick a government occupational safety (WSB?) guy used to come around periodically to check on us. I never actually saw the guy, but several of the mechanical operations I looked after were visited by him. He would sometimes call me up and ask where the gear was working, and I know he would also go out and check on the brushsaw thinners periodically. This was all on crown land though, not sure about private. From what I could tell from talking to him on the phone and from what people said after they were inspected he was a prety good guy. I remeber having to get a work permit from DNR and giving them a list of fire suppression stuff on site whenever we strated a new block on freehold land. It was kind of an archaic system, filling out a paper form, while the system for notifying the DNR of Crown acrivities was all computerized (due to the electronic scaling, more intensive monitoring, etc. on crown). On crown land in New Brunswick, Alberta and Ontario fire equipement inspections are done by both government and supervisors from the private company that holds the forest licence. One interesting thing i came across in Southern new brunswick was the prevelance of water pump theft. Since there is a water tank and pump kept on site wherever there's a forwarder working, people would steal the pump off the tank and supposedly use them to watter pot plantations. Ah yes... weird thefts on forestry operations, there's enough for another thread. Sad that people target harvest contractors,with the theives incorrectly thinking that the stuff is the property of the big bad forestry company or that the contractor can afford to be a theft victim because he (really the bank until the machine's scrap) owns a $400 000 machine.
Muffler Modifications:
I notice people on this forum talking about modifing chainsaw mufflers. With the work I have done in both Alberta and New Brunswick, anyone who modiffied the muffler and specifically the spark arrestor on a brush saw or chainsaw would definitly have to imediately stop working with that equipment due to fire risk and writen warning given. Repeat "offenders" would definitly be fired or loose their contract, and I imagine if a fire strated near silvictural or chiansaw operatins, investigators would be checking for muffler modficatins on any equipment, and I wouldn't want to be the one that had the muffler drilled. I would just guess that in the age of litigation, the same probably holds true in the US. If the forest burns, right or wrong someone's going to be looking for a forest worker to pin the blame to (and possibly send the bill for the fire fighting).
Another jobber on another of my timber harvests was visited by the Michigan Association of Timbermen's (MAT) insurance inspector this morning. The falling crew was individually checked for safe tree falling operations and a good chain saw use safety session was provided.
The safety inspector said that he had checked another of my jobbers yesterday and all went well there also. All have been passing and are receiving their certificates with increased safety aweareness to tree falling.
Most cutters have years of experience falling trees, but I'm glad that MAT is taking the "game of logging" methods right out on the jobs to reach many of the loggers who probably wouldn't get the specific safety training.
After 45 years "in the woods", I'm finding that tree falling is a real science and skill to be learned correctly. I appreciate the effort being made by the MAT in this regard and feel better about the skills of our loggers. smiley_hardhat
Chainsaw Safety Training. The MATSIF safety officer looks over 3 aspen sawlog trees for "testing" the tree fallers on for their chain saw certification. Wittke timber harvest; 1/06.
Ron,
Is there mandatory chainsaw training for workers in your parts, or are these checkups, etc. voluntary?
In canada there are several types of chainsaw certification required for anyone getting paid to use a chainsaw. The most basic mandatory course is two days, and then you need to take a refresher 1 day course every few years. The requirements are slightly different between different provinces.
In Ontario you need the basic chiansaw course to work with one, and then if you are logging you need to do a more specific cut and skid course, that requires that an experinced certified supervisor sign off on an on-the-job component once you've put in some time. New Brunswick also has a similar two tiered system for general chiansaw use and logging. I can't remember the details, but this is generally how it works. In New Brunswick you're not allowed to use a chiansaw alone eaither, so technically there's no need to have a chiansaw in your pickup as you drive to work unless you've got a passenger.
Supervisors from the forest products companies are required to make sure all employes of any logging contractor working for them are properly trained and certified. I was always worried that the 50 yr old loggers would be opposed to a 28 year old kid supervisor telling them they need their mandatory refresher course in the spring before they can start work again, but most are prety good about it saying that a safety refresher is good and they learn alot even after many years of experince. I guess you can kill yourself or co-worker as easily logging as you can driving, so that's why there's training and licencing for both. In Ontario they are also bringing in mechaized logging safe work practices certification along the lines of the chainsaw courses, with a work experince component. As most logging in most areas is now strictly mechanized, very few loggers have the safety course, so they are actually not allowed to pull out a chiansaw to cut a tree from across a road, etc. It sounds crazy as all the older guys on mechanized jobs worked for years doing cut and skid work, and even did horse logging before the skidders, but without the course they can't use a saw in any type of work setting. In this day and age, if a freak accident happened to an uncertified chainsaw user and the supervisor couldn't prove that he did everything to prevent it he could be fined, jailed, etc. About this time a year ago I had to have a buncher on a float remove a tree from across a road because no-one has chainsaws or is certified.
Crazy how lawyers have so much influence in the most unlikely places.
I wonder if I need the course to legally start and demo a saw for a customer. We don't have a test log or a place to put one. I'm being serious, the employer liability issue is huge and the regulations here are mind boggling ::)
If the logging companies are insured through the Michigan Timbermen's self insurance program, their cutters then need to be certified in proper chain saw use and tree falling and safe other logging practices.
They are having their own inspector, trainer actually going out on the jobs to make it easier for the loggers to obtain their certifications since most don't have or take the time to attend specific formal classroom sessions. They are reaching more of the woodsworkers this way.
It's fun to hear the dialogs between the "oldtimers" who have been falling trees for years and the relatively young trainer who provides the certifications. All do appreciate the safety updates, new information, methods etc. however. A great benefit to the "new workers".
Chainsaw Safety. The MATSIF Safety Officer demonstrates proper and acceptable cutting for safe falling of the aspen tree to the "working"loggers. Each must then demonstrate the proper technique to receive their certification in chainsaw safety. Wittke timber harvest 1/06.
Falling Large American Beech Tree. The cutter prepares to fall a large American Beech Tree for bucking into sawlogs and pulpwood. Wittke timber harvest 4/06.
That is a brute. It's amazing that beech stays so smooth even when old growth. Unless it's diseased of course. :)
I remember having a call for beech saw timber from some outfit in NS. I said you'd have to high grade all our good disease resistant beech in New Brunswick to find enough decent saw material for your mill. ::)
at what we get for beech sawlog :(....here they all go in firewood ;)
I think we get up to $350/th for the good stuff, and not all the bucking and handling involved as with firewood. I gotta wonder how many people never figure in the bucking and extra time to process firewood. I know I've heard my uncle say several times, that his time isn't work much or the government would be taxing it. :D :D
we avrage aroud $275 mbf here if you take 70$ for transport and split by 2 for the land owner = 102.5$ each......now if i do 5 to 6 face corde at $75 each less the $10 for stump fee and i do local transport...$325 to $390 all in cash money ;D..
"Timber". The cutter makes his final cut and the large American Beech tree starts its fall. Note the stump rot and seam that the cutter had to deal with in making a safe fall.
The butt portion of this tree will be bucked off and useable sawlogs, pulpwood, and firewood will be harvested from the remainder of the tree. Wittke timber harvest; 4/06.
Artic Cat ATV, "Little Timberjack"; Parked next to the timberjack cable skidder. The on the job foreman uses the Artic Cat ATV to scout out the harvest area and run between cutting units as needed to check on cutters, haul chainsaws,fuel, lunches etc.
Quote from: OLD_ JD on April 29, 2006, 09:34:16 PM
we avrage aroud $275 mbf here if you take 70$ for transport and split by 2 for the land owner = 102.5$ each......now if i do 5 to 6 face corde at $75 each less the $10 for stump fee and i do local transport...$325 to $390 all in cash money ;D..
I only pay $190/cord this year. Stumped, bucked, split, delivered to my yard. Of course I have mostly rock maple and yellow birch, and I pay by cheque. If it were a sawlog beech, it would be more profitable to sell as logs depending on quantity unless your labour and machine hours mean nothing. No purchase tax here anyway on primary forest products, only income tax if selling. ;) ::)
Quote from: Ron Scott on April 27, 2006, 10:31:58 AM
If the logging companies are insured through the Michigan Timbermen's self insurance program, their cutters then need to be certified in proper chain saw use and tree falling and safe other logging practices.
Ron
Can you explain this self insurance program?
Gary, See their web site for full information.
http://www.matsif.com/
The Old Iron Mule. An older forwarder that continues to perform well, especially in selection harvests. Austin timber harvest; 4/06.
More names noted on the woodhauler trucks.
"Timber Wolf"
"Attitude"
"Smoking Joe"
"One Olf"
"Low Rider"
"Woody"
"Just Dew It"
"Lucky"
UUUMMMMM.........Ron it looks like maybe the Mat safety officer was not in the vicinity of the guy felling that big beech tree. From the picture it looks like he did not move away from the tree at least 15' and at a 45 deg angle from the direction of fall. What do you think?
Yes, The MAT Safety Officer made a point of discussing that with him and the other fallers observing, especially the 45 degree angle from direction of fall. A good refresher for all in attendance.
Here are some pictures of my cut to length equipment.
Valmet 546 Harvester Valmet 840 Forwarder Filled with fuel for the next day. Just traded a single bunk Valmet 644 for this machine this winter. I needed the extra capacity and the 6 wheel machine with tracks.
Load of Aspen Pulp All tied down and ready to roll. Jan 26, 05
Unloading Pulp wood at the mill This was taken July 8, 05
Nice looking equipment there Gary. What mill is that? If you don't mind me asking, what do you have invested in your team? I'm just curious cause I dream about having a team someday too, but I know it won't be new Ponsse's. Way too much dinero $$$.
Very cool equipment everyone has ! I will be thinking of all these pictures when I go to the woods soon with my old tractor and a 5 gallon can of gas and chainsaw . You all could yank out more logs in one day than I will in 2 months. But it sure is fun to see the pictures .
High Stumps Stump heights for sawlog size trees are to be cut to 12 inches. Here the sawyer recuts a "high stump" for contract compliance. Austin timber harvest; 6/06.
Ron, here is a link to procedures used to report residue and waste on crownlands in BC. I remember doing some of those surveys and you were partly doing forensics to piece together or reason certain situations. If you didn't you were constantly digging the logger even if he was following regulations in his logging practice especially when it came to WHSCC. In your pic, it almost looks like defect at the butt so the cut was made high. But, I
assume they are harsh on compliance with the contract.
http://www.for.gov.bc.ca/hva/manuals/rwprocedures/
[Furgott the link] ;D
Yes, in defective trees and in large multi-stem trunks such as oak the trees may be cut high, but then the high stump must be lowered to 12 inches or less.
We will allow some designated high stumps for wildlife purposes, etc. but not many excessive high stumps.
Great thread!!!
Last time our property was logged (we are on a 20-25yr cycle) it was one man and his cable skidder. He was excellent, a far better operator than the fellows who were here in the late 60s who managed to hit every tree within 15ft of the main skid road.
I do some very limited selective timber harvesting for my own use and need to up the capacity of my "skidder".
Here are a couple pictures from the other end of the spectrum:
Here's Dad securing a small Hickory log.
A long maple on it's way to the mill.
Anyone skidding with less than 12hp. :D ;D :D
Trimming Slash. Aesthetics of the harvest area is always a concern. The feller trims the slash to lie within 4 feet of the ground or less concurently with cutting. Austin timber harvest; 6/06.
Trimming Slash.
round here we call that "lop the tops" ...
Around here, it is trimming slash too if it is big enough. There was a time when it was justs as good a pulpwood as the logs, but, they've done away with the short-wood pulpwooder.
Now, instead of sawing a lot of it up with a chainsaw, it is run over with skidders or other big forest equipment to mash it close to the ground, where it will rot.
The contract wording for handling slash is "lop and scatter". It is cut with chain saw and or run over with forwarder, skidder, feller buncher, etc. to lie as close to the ground as possible.
Some high slash may be designated for leaving during the operation for wildlife purposes and firewood removal by the forester administering the harvest.
Quote from: Ron Scott on June 27, 2006, 05:37:19 PM
Trimming Slash. Aesthetics of the harvest area is always a concern. The feller trims the slash to lie within 4 feet of the ground or less concurently with cutting. Austin timber harvest; 6/06.
A local logger told me this spring if he can look out across his cut block and see a big top stuck up there 12 feet in the air he knows someone in his crew has wasted wood. He told me he has to lean hard on his crew to always use all the wood.
That's what we want, good wood utilization of all commercial wood. Our standard "rule of thumb" is that "everything is left straight with the world". "All uncut trees are left straight up and down and all slash is left horizontal with the ground so we can see across the stand".
Iron Mule Forwarder. At work; Austin timber harvest; 6/06.
Ron how much wood do those Irion mules hual out at once?
Approximately 1.5 cords or about 750 bd. ft. average when carrying mostly 8 foot lenghts.
Thanks thougt it was something like that.
Rubberboots with kevlar are safty but they are egendering perspiring feet. Against this drawback are special fleecesocks helping. If you wear this socks, you can work the whole day and in the evening when you put off the rubberboots, your feet are dry.
The same is being valid for leather boots with kevlar.
8)
Would you have an internet link that describes the above mentioned socks...my feet need all the help they can get in those rubber caskets...Thanks
You can also get a kind of slipper from Mark's Work Warehouse, Zellers used to carry them also. They are blue-gray in color and only ride up to ankle hieght. I find them and some good polymer insoles make my feet comfy in those safety chaulk (we call'm cork) boots. I'm like you Woodhog, my feet need to be in comfort or I feel like a crippled old man by 5 pm. Now if they could just make those boots so they don't chaiffe the hair of your legs. :(
Hello Woodhog,
got to this link: http://www.hellyhansen.com. Helly Hansen . An other pic is here:http://www.wobestellen.de/td-socken+heavy+navy-833964-2945.htm
Helly Hansen produces the best workwear for logging. In Germany all men who are working in the forest wearing this clothes.
I've never had any better luck with HH than I have with Viking or Husqy. A pair of those boots will barely last a season when working in thinnings. The sides and edges that are thin rubber always break down. The best set of rain gear I had was from a supplier in BC with double lined bibs and coat. Don't waste your good money on Gortex garments, you can buy that stuff for $2-3 a square foot and these big name brands stick an outrageous price on them. The best Gortex boot I ever had and still use is made by Red Wing in the US. I've had others and they break down before a year. My current boots are 3 years old.
I have a pair of Rocky boots with goretex that have lasted about 3 years now. They do need to be resoled, but the goretex is none the worse for wear.
Woodhauler, "Get R Dun". Loads Sawlogs from along the two track access road through the timber harvest area. Austin timber harvest; 6/06.
CTL Chain Saw
Barko 225
Sorting cypress with a Barko 225
Curt's Barko 225
Looks like you have some sawing to do, for sure. Looks like an off bearer sitten back waiting for some boards to tale. Can't disappoint him. ;D
{tried posting early this morning but the server was down or something} :'(
Woodhauler "Get R Dun" leaves the harvest area with another load of hardwood sawlogs. Austin timber harvest; 5/06
That is interesting, four drive axles on a shortlog truck. Must be tough on tires. ???
Just guessing, but I bet two of those axles are air up cheaters... I'd say the front one and the back one...
Woodhauler Get R Dun; "picks up steam" as it moves a load of sawlogs out over the two-track access road. Austin timber harverst 5/06.
For those of you who ever wundered how they got the chips out of the trucks when they got to the mills ..
This was taken at the Tembec mill in Témiscamingue Québec . Both wear being unloaded at the same time .
Great pictures Marcel. I was surprised no one had posted similar before. I've seen them do the same at Nackawick. It is also a Tembec mill, co-owned by Burla in India, where they make Rayon for clothing.
No equipement on my land as yet.They just came in to cut for a few days to try to get ahead of the forwarder.Here's a white pine that is a 3 footer.
This tree is about 80 years old.There are many more trees of this size to be cut.I have more pictures in my gallery if you want to view them.
I'm sure those are pine, right? I was curious if you folks have some good sized white ash in your area. The big ones have been harvested in my area, as there is a mill that buys ash exclusively. For my inquiry, a big one is over 24 inches on the butt. We'll have some nice ash again if folks don't keep pulping it along with aspen. ::)
Yes, I said they were white pine.There's been a logger about 10 minutes from me that has been hauling out big white ash,as you say,all summer.I know there are some bigger than 2 feet on the butt.I'm surprized to see it that big.
Had to go back and read a second time, as I missed it on the first read. ;)
Now , if we can keep the emerald ash borer out of here. ::)
Here's a few pictures of what they are doing on my land.
all loaded,ready to go
Picking up another log.
A big log.
More pictures will be coming of the forwader.Our new camera don't do all that great with the bright sun.Check out my gallery for more pictures.
Nice Pictures! A few questions though. What equipment are they using to harvest your pine other than the forwarder? Are they taking pulp out as well?
They are using 2 brand new Husky 372 with 20 inch bars.The pulp will be coming out at a later time.The forwarder operator pulls the pulp out by his roads and when they feel they have enough,out it comes.They really push the logs.Really no money in pine pulp here,just cleans up the woods.They will also bring out the cedar and hemlock too.The cedar and hemlock is for me to cut on my mill.They only cut what is in the way as far as anything besides white pine.They was in a small stand of cedar and pine.No sense in knocking it down and get nothing for it.They are leaving pine that is 2 feet through.I can handle that size myself.I've been watching this guy cut for more than 20 years.He always does a real nice job on the lots I've walked on.He knows that I am real picker with my land.It would not bother me one bit to kick him off my land if it wasn't coming out the way I feel it should be.So far it coming out good.Sure does look alot differant now.
I have spent last week and this on work in New Zealand. Lots of timbering both on the north island and the south island. Most of it I believe is Douglas fir but someone from the west coast would be much more authoritative on the subject ;). Trucking is done almost exclusively on a straight rig hauling a pup trailer. Return trip (empty) the pup is loaded on the back of the truck. Stakes on the truck fold down, on some units the pup stakes fold down also. I don't see anything like this on the east coast US so I found it quite interesting. Happened to see one trucker loading the pup onto the back of his rig at the port in Lyttleton.
I took a tourist tour in Rotorua on the north island and learned that they introduced a variety of species a number of years ago as an experiment and found that Douglas fir did quite well. So most everything is now planted to that. He said that they could grow a commercial tree in 25 years.
Interesting, I am on the forum at 3:59 am ET and there are still 2 members on, and 9 guests.
I can't sleep either :D Those are interesting pics from NZ. We don't see truck and pup setups like that here. Pole trailers for hauling tree length are piggy backed like that though. Short logs are usually hauled on a single semi trailer or b-train.
Hi Maple
The logs you saw are likely to be Doug Fir, there is a fair bit of that grown here, especially in the South Island. But most of the plantations (90%) are Radiata pine. They will produce good (2-3ft+) dia sawlogs in around 25 years. The Doug fir takes a bit longer, although is a better construction timber.
The truckers haul the trailers piggyback mostly to reduce the road tax they have to pay. All the trucks and trailers have hub meters, so if the trailer ones aren't spinning on the return trip it saves them 25% off the tax. ;)
They have also recently changed the regulations to allow longer traliers, allows them to carry 2 smalller bunks of logs at a reduced height. Makes the trailer more stable, there were a couple of messy crashes involving overturning trailers.
Cheers
Ian
I met some of these trucks hauling logs on the north island last week. If they didn't break the truck into two units it would never make it around the curves on the highways.
Ian, charging tax by the mile or km on the truck AND trailer is a nasty concept. :o I hope our politicians don't catch onto that one. Here, the trailers are piggy backed to save fuel and time on the return trip and space while turning around at the logging site. The trailer also adds weight to the drivers for badly needed traction on our steep logging roads.
Interesting about the Douglas fir being grown in NZ. I expect the climate is similar to our west coast so it should do well.
Couple more.
Nice looking older Timbco there your working with David , Rolly II head ..I have always liked those processing heads . So who did you get hooked up with out there anyway ? CTL crew by the looks of it , it's not Jon is it ?
Well glad to see your busy working anyway that is always a plus :) Did you ever get rid of your 380 or you still have that also with your 518 ? I assume your hand cutting and yarding with your skidder on this job . Well hey keep intouch and keep the pictures coming . We just had a job in your home town to harvest in Richmond , we subbed it out not sure to whom though , too far for us to travel .
Later Rob
I love this thread 8) 8)
Yea Rob I am subbing out to Jon. Still have the 380 :'( Yup all I do is cut and skid to where forwarder can come get it to bring to main landing. The forwarder I call the devourer. It just devours wood, 16 ton capacity.
Great pictures David! Keep 'em coming.
Thats cool , see Jon upgraded his equipment line up , from the Bell and cat cable skidder to Timbco and forwarder... How does he like the CTL so far ? Chadwick & BaRoss are done with the Timberjack lineup since Deere takeover and was talking with one of the Mechanics the other week and now they are going to be the New England Ponsee dealer ... Dont know how it's gonna work for them as not many CTL guys here in Southern NH ..well yet anyway
Rob I think it is kind of a love it and hate it kinda thing. Loves it when it is up and cutting wood. Hates it when it is broke down again.
Kool set up David, are you still working after yesterdays 3+" of rain? Only productive thing I did today was change pins & bushing on the steering pistons on the taylor ;D .
Rob, I like the ponsee line, just wish they were priced lower. I'm thinking of going CTL for the improvement cuts.
John Deere 643H Feller Buncher with saw head. MDNR State Forest timber harvest; 9/06.
MARCEL, the chip truck being unloaded reminds me of the story an old pulpwood cutter told me years ago. This is just about word for word from him. When they first started using these at the mill down here, the first time he ever backed his truck on one he just sat there in the cab.
He said, "Well, the operator comes over and says, 'ain't you gonna git out?" He said, "nope, I'll just go along for the ride". The operator says, "well, oookay......" (I doubt they would let anybody do this now. And this is the point in his story telling where his eyes got real wide). He said "well..., everything was fine until they got it about halfway up. I thought they was gonna stop but it kept going up and up an up..." "All I could see was clear blue sky!"
"Directly all the stuff I had on my dashboard came crashing down into the floorboard. About that time everything I had up over the visors came crashing down, a'hitting me in the face, along with - musta been a bushel of dust off'en each visor! Came down in my eyes so I couldn't see nothing!" "I sucked in a big wad of it and couldn't even breathe! "The truck was a'groaning and a'straining. It still kept a'going up and up! I thought it was just gonna keep going and turn slam over upside down head over tail!" "It musta been straight up in the ARR!" (He's now standing up with his arms stretched as far as they would go above his head, his eyes still big as dinner plates.)
"Directly it stopped. I was pinned in the seat, couldn't move, couldn't see, gagging on that dust". "It was quiet for about 2 seconds, then them chips let go with a great big WHOOOOOOOOOOSH that scared the sh*t right out of me! Made the whole truck shake like it was a'gonna come apart! "Then the truck jumped up and down a couple times, and everything got realllllll still....." "That was scarier than before!"
"Then it finally starting a'coming down! "I tell you, my stomach came up in my throat and I thought Lordy Lordy, it's a'coming down too fast and it's a'gonna flatten me and this here truck like a pancake!"
"When it finally stopped, I opened the door, got out and crawled around on the ground for 5 minutes". "All them fellers was rolling on the ground laughing at me".
"Ever since then I let one'a THEM back the truck on that dang thing!"
I was on the ground laughing myself for about 10 minutes.
Me Toooooo :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D Air!
Hope Patty, or anyone with a swaller of their morning coffee for that matter, don't let loose all over the 'puter screen.
I woulda loved to be one of the guys laugh'n. ;D
:D :D :D :D :D
John Deere 648G Grapple Skidder.Working on State forest timber harvest 9/06.
Phorester, I rode shotgun on a truck hauling chips to a rail dump north of Wenatchee. They made us get out of the cab and there was no way I was riding that thing anyway. :D :D
And on a smaller scale:
Serco 170-A Processor. The slasher bucks aspen and red maple products at the landing from tree lengths skidded by the grapple skidder.
John Deere Feller Buncher & Grapple Skidder. Parked at the landing. These units are common to a tree length clear-cut operation. State forest timber harverst; 9/06.
Ron,
How does the productivity of those drive-to-tree machines compare to a conventional buncher on tracks with a boom? I've always wondered about them as I've never seen one used anywhere in Canada. I would imagine that the wheeled machine would have a hard time if the ground was rought at all? I guess they'd be ok if you don't need to protect regen. or select from between residauls. Are they cheaper than a tracked machine? I would imagine they are easier to maintain? The common saying with tracked gera if "every meter you travel with those thinkgs is one day closer to their death".
I'd really like to see one of those wheeled bunchers work. The other two pieces of gear that I've only seen in pictures are bar saw slashers and pull through delimbers. What area thier advantages? In the pictures it always looks like they're in the southern US. We have lots processors, stroke delimbers, and circular saw slashers, but I've never seen the others in real life.
I've never seen one of those type of bunchers here either. All tracked and boomed. They are especially suited to work in mixed woods, softwood and on rocky terrain. Less compaction, less travel, a boom is much narrower to reach between trees. But, if you get the wrong operator on those boomed machines, I've seen them destroy advanced regen. You have to lift the tree clear and bring out to the trail to slash on the trail and not try to work over head of the regen. Now that ain't so easy with big heavy hardwood, if not impossible. I could see more traveling and such with Ron's machine but if your in big hardwood your doing less damage to residual trees even though your reach path is probably wider to get the trees out. A boomed outfit would work on most hardwood sites here because the average piece size is under 10 inches. You get wood 20 or 40 inches, I don't think I want a boom trying to reach and cherry pick your trees. You might end up over on your side.
A lot depends upon how firm the soil is, timber types, size, and type of harvest. The rubber tired feller bunches make good production on firm soils and smaller tree diameters of especially pine and aspen. They are also used more on "clear-cut" harvests rather than selective harvests.
More tracked machines with processing heads on a boom are used in Michigan's UP on the wetter soils and more for cut to length harvests where the tree lengths are processed at the stump. They do more processing rather than just total tree falling and bunching prior to skidding.
I have one tracked processor working on a job right now. I'll put on photos of it soon.
Hitacchi Tracked Processor With Issusu Engine. Working in an oak, aspen, and mixed hardwoods stand. Gothard timber harvest; 10/06.
This harvester was working just down the road from me recently.The land owners cut some individual w.pine and expanded a field.
Ron,
That looks like a slingshot processor. I've seen them work in softwoods and boreal hardwoods, but they were really too slow to be productive enough in those conditions. I always thought they'd make up for there speed with limbing force in hardwoods like you'd have in Michigan? Does this guy cut off the stump or process behind a buncher?
The operator cuts at the stump and then processes and piles the product lengths for forwarding.
On large sawlog trees they will delimb the tree, cut the smaller diameter products from above and leave the larger sawlog diameter section standing for the chainsaw faller to take down at the stump.
Quote from: Ron Scott on November 28, 2006, 08:43:15 PM
On large sawlog trees they will delimb the tree, cut the smaller diameter products from above and leave the larger sawlog diameter section standing for the chainsaw faller to take down at the stump.
That's a time saver 8) 8)
Valmet Forwarder. Picking up the "cut to length" products behind the tracked processor. Gothard timber harvest; 10/06.
Time To Sharpen The "Husky". The faller takes time to sharpen his saw while cutting oak and cherry saw logs. He makes use of the vice provided on the tool truck.
Hopefully I did it right and attached to this post ther'll be a picture of a buncher working in a mixed poplar, white pine shelterwood cut.
Regrading cutting big trees with a boomed feller-buncher: they cut a bit from one side of the tree and then move the carrier a bit and cut from the other side to get the big ones down with a buncher. (commonly refered to as "double cutting") It takes some skill and experince to do it well (and safely). The operator pushes the tree and lets it fall, instead of really guiding it down the whole way like they do with the smaller ones. The way they do it is similar to the way a single grip harvester (dangle head) fells trees. It's important to make sure trees that are borderline too big for a singel cut with the buncher head are cut using this two-cut method. Bunchers trying to cut trees that are too big in one cut, will "barberchair" them, causing a strip of wood to tear off the side of the lower portion of the cut stem. This greatly reduces the size/quality of the part of the tree with the most value. Barberchairing can also happen on smaller stems, if the buncher doesn't cut parrallel with the ground, and instead angles the head into the tree, pushing it more from above before it can create a clean cut. As swampdonkey said earleir, a good buncher operator can do a great job of protecting regen. by lifting small and medium sized trees that they cut up and over regen, but obviously can't do the same with a tree that's too big to do anything with, other than guide it down in the direction they want.
New cable skidder.
Very nice machine 8). You don't see many new cable skidders around anymore. What model is it?
It's a 540G III. It's a very popular model around here.
Bunchers and grapple skidders probably cut about 60% of the wood around here though. In the pine shelterwood and hardwood selection cuts of central Ontario, full tree harvesting isn't allowed, so everything is done tree-length. Because of the size of the pine and limbs of the tolerant hardwoods there is concern about the limbs causign too much damage to residual trees, so everything has to be delimbed with chainsaws in the bush, even if you're using a buncher-grapple skidder system. Cut-to-lenght systems are almost non-existant aroudn here, although I think processors behind bunchers, then frowarders might hold promise.
SteveB, what is the difference between the terms "full tree" and "tree length"? Is full tree just tree length with the limbs on?
Full tree or whole tree is more acurate meens just that. The tree is cut and skidded to landing with branches and crown. Tree lenght is tree cut limbed and topped, then skidded to landing.
Yup, that's my understanding of the terms as well. Whole tree also can include the stump and roots. Some time ago some university type did some experimenting with whole tree harvesting, which included stump and root extraction. Very expensive way to get fibre in my opinion. It really went against the grain, so to speak, because the university was teaching it's students of the day how to get wood out the cheapest. Since, I graduated they changed the faculty name at the local university to 'Forestry and Environmental Management'. More emphasis placed on environmentalism, although we had courses on ecology, soils, fire, stand dynamics, hydrology, meteorology.
You're all right.
Generally, in Canada, "logging method" refers to the form in which trees are moved to roadside/landing. Full tree = stem with limbs and tops skidded roadside for all processing, tree length = delimbed at the stump and entire stems skidded roadside, and cut-to-length = delimbed and bucked to log lengths at the stump for forwarders. As I understand, the U.S. definition of "whole tree" is what a canadian would refer to as "full-tree". As Swampdonkey explained, in Canada (and internationally) academics define "whole tree" as harvesting trees with stumps and all, and "complete tree" refers to the tree, stump AND major roots. I dont' think anyone in North America harvests stumps and roots on a large scale, although aboriginal people traditionally harvested several types of roots for tying things together, medicines, etc. I beleive there are places in scandinavia where stumps are harvested for energywood, and I imagine in a place like africa it'd be harvested for fuelwood, so I think that's where our textbook definitions came from (I could easily be wrong on this part).
5010 Iron Mule Forwarder. A load of pulpwood and sawlogs is carried out to the landing. Gothard timber harvest; 12/06.
Ron,
Can you fit 16' wood on those small size forwarders?
Also, do you have any experince with using large (18tonne) 8 wheel forwarders in selection cuts? I've worked with them alot before, but always on flatter ground and mostly in clearcuts. Now I'm working with more hilly ground and exclusively (95%) in selection and shelterwood cuts. Wondering if anyone has experince with these big machines in rougher partial harvests?
Yes you put the 16's on the bottom and stack some 8-12's on top to hold them. You just have to be carful not to ding up other trees on your way out.
Yes, we carry up to 17 feet if necessary, but with care. The shorter logs are placed on top as Reddog said.
We haven't had many 8 wheelers in the woods here. The smaller units are preferred in the selection harvests, esspecially by the land owner's for less tree and regeneration damage.
Tracked Processor. Processor cuts tree, delimbs it, cuts product lengths and piles them for forwarder removal to the landing/decking area. Gothard timber harvest, 12/06.
Forwarder Operator Unloads A Large Oak Log. Such large heavy logs can damage or break a forwarders boom if the operator is not careful. Gothard timber harvest; 12/06
The Valmet forwarder operator backs up to the landing/decking area and gently slides the large 8 foot oak log to the back of the bunk with the boom without lifting the log.
The operator then drops the large oak log off the back of the forwarder bunk in position on the landing/decking area.
The operator then drives the forwarder away from the landing/decking area dropping the large log on the ground beside some similar large oak logs unloaded the same way without any damage to the Valmet's boom.
Valmet Forwarder Assists Faller. The Valmet forwarder picks up the oak sawlog tree to assist the faller in bucking it in a heavy jack pine slash area. Gothard timber harvest; 12/06.
I really want one of those! I bet they cost a few dinero. . .
OWW,
Why don't you ask about how to built one. You never know. ;D
Farmerdoug
Quote from: David_c on December 07, 2006, 09:15:36 AM
Full tree or whole tree is more accurate means just that. The tree is cut and skidded to landing with branches and crown. Tree length is tree cut limbed and topped, then skidded to landing.
Our operations harvest and process full tree as we use the Peterson Pacific 5000 G Portable Chippers. We currently have 10 working for us and we estimate with the chipping of the tops and large diameter branches we are gaining approximately 12-17 % uplift on our utilization which in turn spills over onto our AAC. Also if the blocks are close enough to the mill (100 km radius) we will send in our hog procurement contractor to grind the hog fuel and haul it to the mill for power generation as our facility is 100 % run from hog fuel, plus the extra power is then pumped to the grid for distribution.
If I've followed the directions correctly my image should be here when I hit post.
I wonder what they do with this big guy during the rut?? This photo is attributed to an operation in Newfoundland.
Thanks for the help SD
Bill here's the code, you can hit the modify button in your post.
[img]https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10003/terre.jpg[/img]
Last winter this happened.
Now this winter we have this.
I'm pretty sure someone had some pretty mean explaining to do after this was all said and done with.
These pictures are attributed to logging operations in the central part of Ontario, say Bancroft-South River area or so I've been told.
What kind of a lame brainer would take a piece of heavy equipment out into that soup swamp. Any man with intelligence could see that wouldn't be a good idea.
I guess they don't float so well do they. I bet the owner was not the one who did it.
stonebroke
It's easy to look at that picture and wonder why anyone would venture into that area with equipment, but soft spots can sometimes be deceptive. I've seen guys with many years of experince get in a pickle in areas that didn't look bad at all before-hand (never seen anything in real life go out of sight quite this bad, other than the odd picture floating around the internet) A tracked machine like a buncher has a lot more flotation on their first pass through an area, and I've worked with them on ground that seems almost too soft to walk on. It's the forwarders, or especially wheeled skidders that usually get into the trouble on the multiple passes over wet trails. If the buncher's getting stuck you're prety much ... we lets just say good luck getting the wood out.
Did you ever get it out bill? :o :(
Well I guess you could also blame the guy doing the layout of the harvest. That would be considered wetland area and be buffered if the layout man was worth his weight. They normally running machinery through wetland and spring holes? ;)
Just another day in the woods...!!!
Are we having fun yet????
Muskeg & Tea Berrie swamps have a way of letting you down :o ::) in that part of the country. Don't freeze even in the coldest winters....Trappers will walk around them. ;D
He's back.Here's a piece of euipment he's added since he was here last Aug.
It's a John Deere grapple with a winch.It's not a big one,but this is what he wanted.He's been doing a real fine job with it.He's been going after the one's that are all over the lot.He's keeping one stand of white pine just in case we get a lot of snow again.He's ricking them up in the woods for the forwarder to pick up.Seems odd to see pine and hardwood mixed up in a pile.But that is what the forwarder is for,to sort out the logs at the landing.
They were able to fish both these machines out eventually. The one from last winter required them to corduroy the wet hole and using 4 excavators and a skidder they were finally able to get it out.
Sorry I don't have any photos of the extraction process.
What did they have to do to get them running again? I bet that was an involved process.
Stonebroke
HI ya ! Took these pictures of a new (to me) creature in the woods awhile back. ::)
/img]
[/img]
It also had a grapple attachment as well as a brush mower for trail and road maintenance.
/img]
Is that a JD, Stephen? Colors look like it.
Looks like a all-around do-everything machine...are those rubber tracks?
Hi ya! It was a cat. Rubber tracks. It was doing trials and I was just there to watch. The drivers seat was bidirectional which was neat. The trees were felled but the head was not a buncher style. The clam was then put on and the trees dragged to a modified porter with an inch-worm on the front bunk. I have seen big bunnies make deeper ruts. Stephen
What kills a lot of these machine ideas is the fact they cost more than I can get out of the wood if I cut every stick, and that's not the way I want to manage my woods. ;)
"Chaining" The Iron Mule. Chains are now needed on the Iron Mule forwarder so that it can negotiate the hills in the harvest area. The logging crew assists the "boss" laying on the cold ground under the mule with the task. Austin timber harvest, 1/07.
Iron Mule Forwarder Works On Hillside. Pulpwood is being loaded on the Iron Mule for forwarding to the landing. Chains on the front tires provides the traction needed on the snow covered slope. Austin timber harvest, 2/07.
Timberjack Forwarder. Unloading and sorting oak sawlogs at the landing. Austin timber harvest; 2/07.
Quote from: thecfarm on February 17, 2007, 04:42:51 PM
But that is what the forwarder is for,to sort out the logs at the landing.
All of my jobs have a variety of species of pulp along with red oak and maple sawlogs. I have found that it's easier to forward only one species at a time. It probably takes more driving thru the woods, but not more trips to the landing. But it saves a lot of time and trouble sorting at the landing. And it is much faster and a lot less trouble loading trucks with only one species in a pile.
Of course with a cut to length harvester, I try to keep each species piled separately in the woods. It just seems faster to keep the species sorted, rather than mixing and then resorting. Plus, I just hate to sort!
How does every else handle sorting?
I was hauling everything out in mixed loads but it was taking forever at the landing to sort it. Now I haul out one species of sawlogs and bolts per load and sort them at the landing. It saves a lot of time, handling, and moving to different piles. While loading in the woods I short stack the firewood so I can pick it up faster when I get back to it
Gary,this guy has been here 3 weeks and at least 20 trailer truck loads of white pine has been hauled out of here.This is really all that he is cutting unless a hardwood tree gets in his way.I've cut most of the hardwood that will make any good size logs.Out of the 20 and more loads,he hasn't cut enough hardwood to make a trailer load of pulp yet.That's what I meant by using the forwarder to sort logs.Wouldn't make sense to mix everything up and than sort it.He only has a few hardwood trees per each load of pine logs.Probaly knowing this guy he's pulling the small hardwood out first,than cuts the pine tree down.Once these pine goes down,it burys everything under the brush and you never see whats under it.This time he cutting alot of the scrub pine.Some crotch out 4 times,but are big at the butt for about 6-12 feet.
You sure have a lot of pine on that lot. Does Irving buy it?
Yes,swampdockey,your beloved Irving is buying it.They are begging for some pallet pine,just the stuff he is cutting.They cut out all the knots out,than dovetail it,and make a fortune on it.If they need it that bad,raise the price on it. :D :D :D Irving in Dixfield will not be buying any good pine in about 2 weeks.Everyone is being shut off.I've been selling to them for 15 years or whenever they bought the plant from Dixfield Lumber.I always felt I got a good price from them.They will buy anything which was good when I was doing the cutting.If a hardwood tree was in the way,I could sell them a few logs and not have it sitting aroung going bad.I hope to get a tour of the plant coming up this spring.He should be able to come back about 2 more times and that will be it for about 20 years.I will let the rest grow.Need some for my sawmill. ;D
Figured. ;D But, don't get too comfortable. They are just as likely to turn a 180 as bull in a ring. ;)
They were looking for pine in my area one time back in 1998 or so. But they got discouraged when it was explained that we might have 1 mature pine every 100 acres. They're 200 years too late, since it's mostly been cut and just the ones nobody wanted left standing. ;)
I just got the letter from Irving last week. Try Hancock Lumber, their specs are identical to Irvings and the prices are similar too! My biggest problem lately has been getting trailers down here in MA because they aren't sending any finished product down this way. They won't just send a trailer down empty.
Craig
I know about Hancock.In fact the logger I have use to sell to them,now he mostly deals with Irving.Just as well he is getting done,the scrub pine will buy us some time.I don't want him on mine land making any ruts.And he knows that.Mud season will be here soon.I would hate to tell him to leave.
They will usually forward only one species to the landing at a time, but then sort the species by products and lengths such as veneer, grade logs, scrag logs, pulpwood, pellet stock, firewood, etc.
This is what you don't want to see at your sawmill,hemlock shake
The straight line down the center is done by a chainsaw.Was bigger than 28 inches so it had to be split.The forwarder will split it the rest of the way.The other end of this 8 foot log looked a lot better.I would guess it's at least 70 years old,may even be up to 100.There were a few other trees,but the rest did not look like this.
Winching a white pine up to the skidder.
A 28 " (DBH) hemlock would be over 200 years up here.
This tree was only 24"at DBH.I counted 110 rings.I could of missed a few.I know that hemlock grow slow.I only guessed and I was a little low.Some of the rings almost tounched in most years.Good thing I had a pen with me to keep track.
What about the first 60 years, growing on top of one another, within an inch around the pith? ;D ;)
j/k They will do well if growing in good conditions. I don't doubt your ring count. ;)
4510 Iron Mule Forwarder. Waiting to start its forwarding job. Malmborg timber harvest, 2/07 & 3/07.
Ron, I noticed that the centers of the machine and the loader not the same. does the loader have to hang on the front half somewhere when turning the machine?
Can someone (PLEASE) let me borrow/give me ones of these. My skidder broke a drive U and did something to my transfer case so it chatters when pushed going down hill.
Ed,
The loader sits on top of the bunk load and just pivots with the machine when turning.
5010 Iron Mule Forwarder. This is a larger size iron mule forwarder recently seen along the roadside in Michigan's U.P. Note that the boom is pivoted and down on its opposite side.
I agree with Ed K,"Will someone please give me an iron Mule?" Hear small spoiled brat boy voice. Dosen'thave to be pretty,well painted,old derelick ,abandoned ,ugly as me,,,,,,well ,not quite that bad,would be perfect. If you could deliver it for free would be even better ;D ;D ;D
Dail,head down running for cover :D :D :D :D
Most of the early forwarders including Gafner's Iron Mules had the loader's mounted on the front half with the cab, some (not Gafner's) even had roof top mounted loaders. After Gafner was bought out by Valmet (Partek Forest Products) the 500 series and the 600 series Valmets had the loaders mounted on the front. Finally the Valmet 800 series machines had the loaders mounted on the bunk section where they belong.
Those early machines with the loader on the front were a pain for sure, but they are still very productive machines and many are still working daily in the woods. However if you have a lot of pulp wood to move, especially behind a harvester cutting 50-100 cords per day, you need a newer double bunk forwarder with six or eight wheels, mini joysticks, a loader with an extend a boom on the rear half, and an automatic transmission.
Yes, there are some older machines they are practically giving away. :D
Woodhauler's are often given a personal name by their owners. Her "Sexy Lady" is being loaded with pulpwood at the landing. Gothard timber harvest; 11/06.
Some other owner named woodhauler's recently noted at work were:
"Pine Marten"
"Shorty"
"Mad Dog"
"Hooter Patrol"
"Hog Tied"
"Big Wolf"
"Attitude"
"Carpenter"
Hooter patrol...That cracks me up,
But hey, anyone giving of their time to watch out over owl's is ok in my book. ;D
KevinH,
You crack me up. :D
Farmerdoug
good thread--but jeezz--took three nights to get thru it all!!!!!!! continue
John Deere 440-B Cable Skidder. This small cable skidder provides support for cabling trees out of wet areas and up hill sides where selectively cut trees can not be reached directly by the iron-mule forwarder. Malmborg timber harvest; 3/07.
That's a nice looking/clean 440 there. 8) :) ;) ;D
Wow!! :o
That early 70's machine looks brand new. I had one of those in the A-model many moons ago....
Yes, this logger takes exceptionally good care of his equipment. The best that I've seen with older equipment. The 4010 Iron Mule shown earlier is also his.
Just bought a 40A Tajfun 3pt winch. Pictures coming soon as I get it a little dirty ;D . It'll be easier pulling 7/16s cable than 3/4 plus it comes with 200' of cable I shouldn't be pulling the end off so much.
4510 Iron Mule Forwarder. The iron mule forwarder pulls a load of aspen pulpwood uphill on its way to the landing/decking area during a break in the weather. Malmborg timber harvest; 3/07.
Good luck pulling out 100 feet in a straight line through the woods. :D Looking forward to the pictures.That is a hyd winch,right?
thecfarm, no it doesn't have the hydraulics.When I went to look at the different sizes I found that the hydraulic ones still have a pto shaft to the winch and the price is almost double for the hydro-remote control. I started by looking for a fully hydraulic winch and couldn't find any that would pull more than 63' per min and theres no production in that.
1975 Model 5000 Iron Mule with a load of maple saw timber
Pic taken earlier when there was still snow and the tire chains were still on. The load is hardwood firewood.
Holy cow you've been busy!
Great pictures Greg, thanks for showing us. :)
Looks like you need to subcontract some sawing. ;) Wouldn't want them logs spoiling. :( Looks like some fine saw logs there. To bad I'm so far away or I'd be over with the trailer after some bass carving stock and some beech turning stock. I'd love to have a banister and spools made of beech. :) I never tried beech before but it has beautiful grain. 8)
I'm not sawin em ;D The maple and basswood grade logs go to Baumgarten's Mill in Tower, Mi. The maple sawbolts go to Robbins Flooring mill http://www.robbinsfloor.com/ in Millersburg, Mi. and the beech and other hardwood sawbolts go to Bunker's Mill in Vanderbilt, Mi. We cut quite a few beech this morning and talked about what nice logs they make but couldn't come up with any reason to saw any for our own use ;) ;D The plan is to run for another month then knock off for haying season, sawmill moving season, and barn repairing season then go back to the woods the end of August or so. That's the plan anyway ;) ;D
Iron Mule 4510 Forwarder. Packs a load of aspen sawlogs to the landing/decking area. Malmborg timber harvest; 3/07.
What price are the aspen sawlogs? We were getting 280 mfbm for aspen veneer at one time. Not sure of the price now. Had to be chalk white, but knots didn't matter.
125 bucks a cord for 10' logs with at least a 10" top.
One picture will probably suffice unless your trying to post 3 different ones. ;)
Ya ,goofed somehow was trying to post 3 different pics, had the before and after thing. Stephen
You can use the 'Modify' button in the original post and place the other photo names from your gallery. Use the code by copy and paste from here into your modify post above. ;)
Maybe these are the photos ???
[img]https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/12754/Thinning.jpg [/img]
[img]https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/12754/Fairview%201.jpg [/img]
Thanks SD :)
Iron Mule 4000 Forwarder. Parked at the landing/decking area and ready to start a days work. This is an older and "somewhat used" machine, but performed well on this timber harvest with no down time. I'll be closing the job out tomorrow. Anderson timber harvest; 3/07.
Quote from: Ron Scott on April 23, 2007, 06:55:18 PM
This is an older and "somewhat used" machine, but performed well on this timber harvest with no down time.
Yeah, looks like 'broken down bronco Bruce' ;D :D
This is an old Timber Jack with some beech logs.Logs was nothing to brag about,but better than pulp prices.Was about 15 minutes from my house.
This is the young guy helping out the old guy,John Deere 440G.
Iron Mule 4000 Forwarder. The "Old Girl" had her oil changed today and will now be moved out to another job. Her forwarded wood is now in waiting for the trucker.
Woodhauler "Fox #3" is preparing to leave with a load of oak sawlogs as the owner/driver climbs down off the loader. Anderson timber harvest; 3/07.
Logger's Pickup. Anderson timber harvest; 3/07
Logging in beetle killed spruce.
Head of Woods Operations
Here is our home built, excavator based, combo forwarder/harvester. Used only as forwarder for now, we will install a Patu stroke harvester on it next week. It has a huge lifting capacity and fast loading speed due to is rotating cab. On 1000 hrs test, we had no major problem. We want to start production of this machine in 2008. More details on the tests and pics in harvesting mode soon.
I finally got a picture of the new winch on a clearing job.
Can you resize so we can see it? ;)
Load of Oak Sawlogs. The Peterbuilt leaves the landing/decking area with a load of oak sawlogs. The 18 and 20 footers will be milled into crane decking material.
Austin timber harvest; 3/07.
I have never seen an axle setup like that. The first and fourth ones appear to be tags.
I down loaded a Hewett Packard photo program but I having problems making the photos to the 44 kb's when its small enough to be loaded into my folder it to blurry.
Guess I need to look for a different free photo fix prog.
Ed
Regards the pic.
Did ya follow the good Help guidelines?
Resize to 450 pixels longest side first.
Yer photo posted is way down to 99 pixels on the longest side. The file size then might take care of itself. Give it another good shot.
Hi folks, I am posting some photos of some harvesting work that I did on my farm this winter.
Kingdom Hill Farm Aspen Harvest 2007
Aspen stand prior to felling note red arrow indicates where hard hat is for reference (note windthrow in backround)
Aspen stand after felling red arrow is where hard hat was
and some shots of the skid trail after harvest
aspen pulp by road waiting for mud season to end and some 20-24inch dbh 16 foot aspen saw logs
I did most of the felling and skidding in 3-4 feet of heavy snow I did not take any pics while I was working because I was afraid that the camera would get smashed.
Nice , we did get a good load of that white stuff this winter , we have to meet up some day ... maybe later this summer when I get back from the Arctic , :)
Thanks Marcel, I ended up doing the side pixels to 450 then used another photo shop to crop it and it worked.
Nice set up you have there.I myself would like to see the front of the log up off the ground some.I have twitched out some good size ones with what I have and I've always have the front off the ground,not much at times.Now that I look at your winch I can see why.When my winch is raised like yours,my mast,the top pulley is a good 5 feet from the ground.
That was a posed picture. I usually have the butt up on the plate.I've found that I like this arrangement as there seems to be less pull on the cable and the butt can slide around on the plate when cornering.
Logger's Pickup; GMC Diesel. Note large tool box, forwarder and skidder fuel supply tank, extra chain saw, chainsaw fuel supply tanks, oil supply container, and small tool box. Malmborg timber harvest; 3/07
Yep, that's a logger's pickup, bent tailgate and all. :D
Most of the loggers here have gone to cargo trailers at the landings. Some are pretty well equiped with generators, welders, air compressors, fuel, hydraulic oil, spare hydraulic hoses, spare parts, etc.
Quote from: Gary_C on May 22, 2007, 09:42:42 PM
Yep, that's a logger's pickup, bent tailgate and all. :D
That's called a "Smileing" tailgate in the trade.. ;D
Hey Marcel,
Man the spring snow was tuff this year. I wound up working on the skidder through most of the winter (outside and on the snow) I did not start cutting untill the third week in March and by then we had a good 3-4 feet of very heavy snow. I got a set of ring chains for the front and the 440 would slowly chug through most of it but man it sure sucked fuel till I got the trail packed. All in all the three loads of pulp that I sold covered about 75%of what I spent on chains, parts, fuel and oil ::) The good news is that things should be ready for next year ;D.
Some more Woodhauler Names noted while on the road.
* Low Bidder II
* Heart Beat
* Slow Ride
* Snatcher
* Coca Cola Kid
* Big Red
* Golden Comet
* Dakota Shane
* Half Breed
Ponsee "Buffalo" Forwarder. New Page red pine timber harvest; 5/07.
Chipping Red Pine Tops. New Page red pine timber harvest; 5/07.
Ron, I feel we need to do something like this with a lot of our red pine plantations as soon as the crown begins to lift (lower limbs die off). 6' x 6' spacing is pretty close for pines after 25 years.
What do they do with those Red Pine chips Ron ?
Dumping a Load Of Chips. Chips are being dumped at the New Page pulp mill in Escanaba, Michigan. Chips are being used for boiler fuel at the mill, cogeneration plants, and for heating local schools depending upon the quality produced.
Looks like a pretty high dollar chipping operation! Do those drivers have the option of staying in the cab? :) One of my co-workers hauled grain for a while, dumping in Superior, Wisconsin. He had his wife along for a ride one day, they got to the dump and he gets out of the truck, thinking she will follow. She says she will just stay in the truck, so he tells her its a pretty extreme angle and she needs to get out. Well she makes a pretty big fuss so he let her stay. When she came back down she had her chips and coffee spilled all over her and her eyes were bugged out pretty good. They are divorced now
This was discussed on another thread where the chip truck had slipped backward on the ramp. No one should be allowed to stay in the truck.
Ponsee Delimber. Yes, this is a high dollar red pine timber harvest and chipping operation for biomass fuel. New Page red pine harvest; 5/07.
Loading Chip Hauler. New Page red pine harvest; 5/07.
That is a serious chip trailer :o Here that would be a B-train load.
Biomass Baling Machine. Red pine biomass is being baled and tied into bundles for transport and use as biofuel at the mill. New Page red pine harvest; 5/07.
[img]
Very interesting Ron.Any more pictures of that baler?I had read a few articles about this,but have not seen a machine like that one to bale the biomass.Do have pictures of the bales piles up,being hauled.How much does each one weigh?Biomass around here is not a big deal for a land onwer even though there is one plant about 15 minutes and another one about a hour away.Seems to be more up north.IP went though their woodlots around here and I don't think any went for biomass,all logs and pulp.How are they getting the bales out,with a forwarder?Who made that baler?
This is a John Deere machine. They were working in a partnership with the timber producer for the biomass operatrion part of the harvest and demonstration for the machine.
The bales were moved around by a forwarder stacked on site and then transported by truck to the mill site for cogeneration fuel. I believe they said that the pine bales weighed around 300 pounds.
Is that more efficient than just chipping them?
Stonebroke
The "slash bundler" machine allows for removal of addditional biomass fuel in the form of baled limbs, needles and tops which doesn't make for the "clean chips" normally required by the large boiler heating sytems, pellet manufacturing, etc. where less green needles, leaves etc. is acceeptable.
This operation had 3 biomass fuel source operations going on at one time in addition to harvesting the pine pulpwood. One chipper was chipping the smaller delimbed roundwood for "clean chips" another chipper was chipping and tops and limbs with needles, "dirty chips", and the "slash bundler" machine was bundling the left over small limbs and leftover woody debris.
This was a "full tree utilization" harvest but with about 1/3 of the small slash, woody debris, and fines retained on site for retention of soil productivity.
Slash Bundler. A bundle of red pine biomass leaves the machine. Also note processed bundles on the ground. New Page red pine harverst; 5/07.
Slash Bundler. A slash bundle is cut to bale size and dropped from the bundling machine to be forwarded to the landing/decking area. New Page red pine harvest; 5/07.
It's hard for me to see profit with the dirty chips, when I know from talking with local chippers that the profit is around $3 a ton for biomass in my kneck of the woods. Currently, there is one main chipper supplying the plant in Fort Fairfield, Maine at 200 loads a week and the marketing board had a small contract where an operator was sending 3 or 4 loads a week in. I think that small contract expired. Some of the stands the small operator was operating in would have been softwood sawlogs in 15 years and some were just pasture grown spruce or pulpwood potential sites. The purchase price of the fibre is fixed and the location of the next block is known well ahead for the large operator, he's on crown land. He also has access to a mountain of wood. For the small operator he has to haggle on price from every land owner for that fibre and go knocking on doors to find it.
My experience with red pine tells me it's not profitable in small diameter wood and we have no big demand for red pine pulp. Practically non existent. It's hit and miss at best. We have thousands of acres that are 2 to 50 year old plantations, most around 20 years old. Not quite big enough to do anything with, but needing thinning real soon and not with a brush saw. You can't even get near a red pine after 10 years with all those low, long reaching, branches. I'm going to thin a small section of red pine with brush saws and it's not going to be as easy as thinning spruce or hardwood. ::)
John Deere Grapple Skidder. A workhorse for tree length skidding on this red pine timber harvest. New Page red pine timber harvest; 5/07.
Chipping Red Pine Tops. The John Deere grapple skidder carries red pine tops to the chipper. Processed chips are then blown into the chip van.
Ron...I think that trailer need more axles under it :D :D :D.
Thanks Alot Mr Mom
I have to wonder why a chip trailer needs that many. ???
Maybe lotsa weight
Stonebroke
The chips must be very wet. ;)
It must be a real drag cornering with that trailer ;)
Quote from: OneWithWood on July 18, 2007, 10:15:36 AM
It must be a real drag cornering with that trailer ;)
Well not really .... there is
a switchs one can use in da dash to lift dem front and back drop axles . ;)
Flying some CATS into work. And a few trees going out also.
Flying Cats (http://youtube.com/watch?v=Ex_PJCPI49w)
http://www.youtube.com/v/Ex_PJCPI49w
Michigan allows a really high loaded truck weight here but a lower weight per axle than other states. That is why you will see so many axles on trucks here in Michigan.
Farmerdoug
Yes, that is why and the weigh master really checks out that axel weight.
Working at the marketing board I've seen as much as 45 tonne of green hardwood per load, a normal load would be around 34 tonne. Some of these little stream bridges out on country roads are only 20 tonne bridges. ::)
The whole truck isn't all on a short bridge at the same time ;) ;D ;D
It would be on the Shikatehawk. They gotta go around the other way I guess. No bridges there, 'cept down at the mouth where there is a heavier bridge on the 'Hawk'. Our bridge up on the farm, no it wouldn't span the whole bridge. But tater trucks are shorter and haul about 16 ton of taters during harvest, fertilizer the same during planting. ;D
Kubota L48 with Farmi winch. Small scale selective logging. I can harvest small quantities of logs with this setup without damaging the woodlot provided I wait for dry conditions. Here I am skidding full length, 40' to 48' stems. My skid trail allows this, but I will buck to length when it doesn't.
Dave
These were taken on Arrow Lake (Columbia River). The logs are decked then hauled down and dumped in the water as needed. The boom boat is busy organizing and securing the logs. Too far away to get a good picture of the tug but the ferry was held up over two hours while he passed with a huge boom. If he traveled any faster he would lose logs. A round trip with a truck would take a day.
Iron Mule Forwarder. The old Iron Mule is slow and steady carrying a load of aspen pulpwood along the hillside. Anderson timber harvest; 4/07.
Some more Woodhauler Truck Names noted while on the road.
"Guard Dog"
"Chip"
"Snapper"
"Miss Elizabeth"
"Fetchin Sticks"
"Bearly Making It"
"Spoiled Rotten"
"Road Runner"
"Tree Hugger"
"Black Foot"
Timberjack Forwarder. Sorting oak sawlogs at the roadside landing. Austin timber harvest; 5/07.
When I first found this thread, I read through the whole thing, it was a little smaller, only 63 pages I think. :D Now that it's back, I'm going to read it all over again. 8)
Dave
Quote from: Ron Scott on April 05, 2002, 03:00:58 PM
A good ending to this Thread as it dies for lack of interest! :'(
Anything but dead, eh?
Dave
Timberjack 380B Grapple Skidder. Pulls a grapple of aspen tree lengths out to the landing for delimbing and chipping. State, Wheeler Creek timber harvest; 8/07.
I noticed there are some pictures that are no longer visable. In particular, I was looking for one that was at the front of this thread. It was some kind of forwarder, and possible a harvester, with two axles on the front and two on the back. It was huge, just slightly larger than Rhode Island.
Dave
Dave, do you have a reply # for the post the missing pics are in, or maybe a link to the posts ???
Furby, I went back through the first 12 pages and I found these: #24-Ron Scott, #94-Jeff, #174-Ron Scott. I think there might have been about a dozen throughout the entire thread. I know Jeff kept finding folders full of photos, didn't know if there were any more missing.
Dave
#25 and #94 are off site links and serves as an example of what can happen if we allow them here.
They were used waaaaaaay back then, but we don't allow them now.
Basicly they are broken links.
#174 is a different issue.
If you right click on the red X and then click properties, it will tell you what the adress is for that item.
Try it on a forum pic and you'll get an idea of what it should look like.
Wow, holly Toledo. I was just looking at the number of posts in this thread. And Ron was worried way back that the thread would sink. Not in this crowd. ;D
Timberjack Grapple Skidder. Taking "a break" at the landing of the total tree chipping operation. State timber harvest; 8/07.
Quote from: SwampDonkey on October 20, 2007, 07:45:55 AM
Wow, holly Toledo. I was just looking at the number of posts in this thread. And Ron was worried way back that the thread would sink. Not in this crowd. ;D
Don't stop now Ron, this is one of my favourites. ;D
ron what size motor does that Timberjack have in it is it a 450? i have a 450 and it has a darn 453 detriot in it. it would never pull a bunch of wood with that size grapple.
I don't know the specific size engines on these, but they will grapple a "bunch" of aspen tree lenghts in a pull with no problem.
Aspen "Tree Length Bunch". One of the grapple skidders will move the "bunch" to the landing for chipping. State timber harvest; 9/07.
ron i have looked thru this forum alot. how do you get so many pitchures of equipment?
you have alot.
I'm a consulting forester and usually take photos when I'm out administering logging jobs, attending workshops, logging events etc.
Prentice 325 Delimber. Set up at the landing to delimb tree lengths prior to chipping. State timber harvest; 8/07.
The last pictures could have been in the B.C. interior. Very typical, except for the Freightliner cab over with the sleeper but a lot of guys are hungry right now.
Trelan Chipper 233. The chipping unit for this chipping operation. State timber harvest; 8/07
Finally got around to taking some pict's of a current job thats taken more than 2yrs to complete due to being very wet.
Foley lot 10/07. This was before cutting.
Then after, its not the exact same placing by 50 odd ft.
Here's the Taylor pulling a turn.
When we started this job 20mbf of beech were nice trees,2yrs later its all diseased.
Loaded Chip Van. Ready to leave the chipping area with a load of chips. State timber harvest; 8/07.
That critters got some tires under it.Around here they just use a regular 2 axle trailer.I have seen some special trailer boxes that dip down in front of the tires.If I ever have a camera by one that is parked I will take a picture.
I also noted the large amount of axles on that trailer, around here the max is 3, for a tri axle trailer with one having an airlift that you raise when empty
.
How do they make enough money to pay for the scuffed out tires on that thing when it is turning.
Use these chip vans around here. Built in town.
The Service & Support Vehicle. An important unit for every logging job. State timber harvest; 8/07.
A "true" clear cut. This was primarily an over mature aspen stand. All trees were removed and chipped. State timber harvest; 9/07.
4510 Iron mule Forwarder. Parked on the harvest area with a load to be forwarded to the landing while the operator takes his lunch break. Sheffer timber harvest; 10/07.
i love this post.. ;D i also like seeing how every other logger does things.
delbert
We seem to have lots of photos of equipment used to harvest, process, and transport wood but not a lot of shots of equipmnet used for silvicultural purposes.
This is the bracke (Bracke Kultivatorn) which I believe was designed and originally built in Sweden. It is a patch scarifier though the model used in parts of Canada had a seeding mechanism built into it just by the rear mattock wheels.
My experience using the seeder was that this design would have been better served if it were left on the shelf. The seeder plates were alway jamming up with the aluminum latex used to coat the seed, and slightest amount of humidity caused the seed to clump up.
This particular bracke is beginning used a patch scarifier this site will be hand planted next spring. In this instance the prime mover used is a John Deere 648G.
A few more "woodhauler names" noted while on the road.
"Logger's Limo"
"Got Wood"
"Sporting Wood"
I wanted to comment on what was used for scarification here on local private woodlots. That is the C&H plow. Unless you have dry ground your working on, this machine should never be allowed off the float. It will ruin a sensitive site in a hurry, then those rows fill with water like ditches. If you have a good dry site, it still is best to scarify in the fall and plant in spring so the loose air pockets get worked out by the natural elements (rain, snow, thawing). Still have to be careful of pockets of duff that got turned over, prone to drying out in the summer heat. On old fields we have good luck with plowing and then spray 2 or 3 years later.
Here's my service truck I just assembled from a 1991 chevy 3/4 ton 4/4 that I bought new in 1990. I had the cab freshened up, it's just like new, then put the boxes on. it has a fuel tank for loaders and such,air compressor all kinds of tools, jacks, saws, shovel, fire ext, big first aid kit, extra clothes, oils, grease and grease gun, ropes, chains and lots of other stuff you could need on a logging job. It will be so much nicer than crawling over and digging through all that stuff in the old pickup bed. :)
Looks like a dandy. Secure enough to keep the tool thieves out. ;)
That set up really does make the job easier. 8) I have wanted something like it but then I would have to go back to work to justify it.
Well done! Looks like a very good service vehicle with items available in time of need.
I currently run a 1270D doing mountain sides. I've got 7000hrs on it so its alittle more work. But come March 1st, I'll be getting my new 1470d. I can't wait. I've started posting stuff about it on my site...http://www.TheTreeHarvester.com.
Check it out.
i liked your pitchure of the head and sun set/rise. put it on as a background.
good job nice one you dont see many like that perfect
That's a nice looking harvester. Tell us more about your operation and the kind of wood you are cutting. What kind of forwarder is that you have?
Sometimes you have to use what you have. :D
Yea thats a FORD! 8)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zA9lJx7DaiA
Oh come on! At least get a Chev :D
But he'd need the Ford to drag the Chev out. ;) :D
Once upon a time I got my old Chevy stuck but it was OK because it took TWO Fords to pull it out. A full size Bronco and a Ranger. My Ford owning friends couldn't rib me about that one :) ;D
i had my john deere 648E skidder pull out my chevy tracker yesterday. ;D wasnt much a pull though.
I ended up replacing the clutch on my ford ranger clearing for my log cabin thats now 22 yrs old, the ranger lasted 10. I've had every brand up pickup, always liked the one I'm driving now ;D .
Toyota eh? yikes_smiley :D
GMC ;) . who knows what the next will be. Crummies I buy Crummies.
Iron Mule 4510 Forwarder.Forwarding aspen pulpwood; Sheffer timber harvest; 12/07
Ron,
A few questions about the Iron Mule if you please. Are the bunks long enough for 16 foot logs? Can you load spotted trailers with the boom on the Mule? Is there a winch aboard for getting unstuck?
Rick
Rick,
Here is a good thread with lots of Mule info.
https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php/topic,21155.40.html (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php/topic,21155.40.html)
Post 50 covers long logs.
Short answer to your questions are, Yes stack 12's or less on top to hold them, Yes you can load a trailer and No winch from the factory, I have not seen one with a winch.
Pretty much as Reddog said. We allow a maximum of a 17 foot log which they will carry on a topload. I haven't seen any with a winch either. Some have asked about the
articulation joint between the operator cab and the wood bunk. He is a photo of the 4510.
Reddog and Ron,
Thanks for the info.
Rick
Working in Deep Snow. Falling a hard maple in deep snow takes some extra effort. The sawyer must clean out to the base of the tree prior to starting his tree falling task in this selection harvest of northern hardwoods. Nixon timber harvest; 2/08.
No fun limbing out either, one min the bole was up to my knees next it was at my chest. Took me a min, just to get back up on top of the snow. Makes for a real long day >:( .
Winter Harvest. White ash sawlogs bucked to length with hard maple sawlogs laying in the background waiting to be picked up by the forwarder. The sawyer's saw oil and gas containers sit on the cut stump as he works on another tree nearby. Nixon timber harvest; 2/08.
How does the forwarder move amongst the saplings? Do you just pick the path of least damage?
Dave
Most of the time I run my 87 Toyota 4x4 4cyl 4 speed truck for most cuting jobs,like hauln out fire wood, hedge post,brush.And my tools 8)
The forwarder runs on existing trails and the paths of least resistence as you stated making effort to knock down the least amount of saplings and regeneration. Some future photos will show a Fabtek 344B forwarder at work.
RON:thanks for the mule center section pic.
I kinda think what Dave means.I had my lot cut.It's alot differant than what was posted.I had a lot of old white pine,not much small stuff growing around the trees,like in the picture.He also had a graple,cable skidder too.There was some spots where they would use the skidder to bring the logs to the forwarder.I saw quite a few places where they would pull up along side of a tree that was not bucked to lenght and pull it to him on the forwarder.This required a guy with a chainsaw to be there to buck the tree to log lenght.I should of taken a picture of that.Looked real odd to see a 3 by 80 foot path in the woods.A forwarder CAN do a nice job.Depends ALOT on the operator.You still need trails to get the wood out no matter what.But with a forwarder the logs are being carried out,not dragged out.Alot less damage is done to the ground with a forwarder.I have a steep hill that is the only way across the bog.This hill would of been at the bottom if they would of been skidding the logs.There is less barking up of trees too.My land is kinda of a challange,big rocks,small mounds of dirt,trees I wanted left.I saw one spot where they had to stop and back up the forwarder to save a few trees and go around a big rock.I would not let just a skidder crew on my land.I watched this guy cut for more than 20 years.I do have pictures in my gallery.
Well there is no blanket prescription as to what machine to use. The ground, local climate/season and the vegetation (trees and such)/available seed (good seed years) should dictate the proper system every time. Most of the time it's just $$ driven when you look out the door and see one lot after the other clear cut. ::)
For instance, a woodlot that was picked through for firewood often grows back with beech in the understory. You could carry the dang firewood wood out by hand or use a machine, still beech regen on some sites. Up here, beech is about as bad as having pin cherry because it all gets infected with disease. I've had instructions from some woodlot owners who want PCT done to cut every one of those %$%$ beech and save all the maple and birch that you can, even aspen is better than growing junk.
Another scenario is cutting hardwood using a type of selection. But, the understory is overtaken by fir that is 40-60 years old, hollow butted and 8-15 feet tall. The S maple and yellow birch may have been very poorly regenerating. Not too hard to age fir if it's intact on the stump and not rotten, whack some off the stump and count rings throughout your work area. Now, you gonna save old suppressed trees about the end of their life? What machine do you use and what type of harvest do you used to help get S maple and Y birch coming?
Fabtek 344B Forwarder. Works its way through a northern hardwood winter selection harvest. Nixon timber harvest;2/08.
Quote from: Ron Scott on March 08, 2008, 05:35:23 PM
Fabtek 344B Forwarder. Works its way through a northern hardwood winter selection harvest. Nixon timber harvest;2/08.
Looking good!
Yeah, that looks like a nice comfy way to get the logs out! ;D
Dave
Does that Fabtek have a squirt boom ??? That's a feature I'd like. It seems like the boom on Iron Mule is always just a little too short :) :)
No its not a squirt boom, but it has more reach than the iron mule. Its a bigger machine than the iron mule and can also handle the heavy snow and hills much better. Of course it carries a bigger payload also.
A good operator is key to operating it in selection hardwood thinnings so as to damage the least amount of regen and skinning of the better quality leave trees.
A person could spend hours going through this thread! Tim B.
actually around 18 and a half hours. Slow reader. ;D
:D :D :D
Fabtek 344B Forwarder. The forwarder operator provides assistance to the sawyer in getting the hard maple hanger safely down for bucking. He will then pick up the sawlog lengths for transport to the landing/decking area. Nixon timber harvest; 2/08.
Ron does the sawyer have a machine (skidder ) with him or does he rely on the forwarder for that. How small do they take the wood down to.
The forwarder picks up the cut-to-length sawlogs that the sawyers have bucked at the stump. We usually take the wood down to a 4 inch top, but on this sale sawlogs to an 8 inch top were removed. The landowner wanted the pulpwood and topwood left for his own firewood use.
Fabtek 344B Forwarder. Unloads sawlogs at the landing/decking area. Nixon timber harvest; 2/08.
Western Star Woodhauler. The Western Star woodhauler arrives at the landing/decking area for a load os sawlogs. Nixon timber harvest; 2/08.
The woodhauler turns around at the end of the landing while the Fabtech forwarder continues unloading its bunk of sawlogs.
The woodhauler moves into position to the log deck for loading while the Fabtech forwarder is moving around behind it.
The woodhauler prepares to start loading while the Fabtech moves to unload its sawlogs on the opposite deck.
I sure wood like to have a forwarder ;D it make for a easy day in the timber. how long of saw logs does it handel ?
I noticed orange & blue paint on one tree, is that the cut boundry?
Forwarders of this size bunk will carry 8-17 foot sawlogs. The shorter logs are placed on the bottom with the longer logs being placed on the topload.
The trees with the blue painted ring at breast height and stump mark are the trees to be cut. The orange spots are marks made by a timber purchaser while looking at the sale prior to bidding. Some timber buyers will place their own marks of another paint color on the trees while making their own volume cruise, designate veneer trees, etc.
Our cutting boundarys are marked with red painted line trees. A blue painted "W" on a tree is a wildlife tree not to be cut. A blue painted "X" on a tree is an unmerchantable tree that is not in the tally, but may be cut at the purchaser's option.
Western Star Woodhauler. It is loaded and the load chains are tightened. Plans are to move off 3 loads of sawlogs today. Nixon timber harvest; 2/08.
The Western Star is "ready to roll" with its sawlog load.
Daylight On The Landing. Nixon timber harvest; 2/08.
Logger's Pickup. One can easily recognize a logger's pick-up as it shows the tools and wear of the trade including the empty pop cans inside on the floor. ;) Sheffer timber harvest; 12/08.
I've never seen a loggers truck that didn't have a pail of hydraulic fluid in it. :-\
Dave
And a bent tailgate. :)
That tailgate has got many hours of use left in it yet? You should have seen ours at work last summer. Had it been clean one could have used if for a large salad bowl. :D
Quote from: Ron Scott on March 24, 2008, 07:51:24 PM
One can easily recognize a logger's pick-up as it shows ...................the empty pop cans inside on the floor. ;)
:D :D :D Yup,very true and the back of the pickup with cans and coffee cups at times. :D Oh, man the times I've gone for rides in a logger's pickup and the rubbish under my feet. ::)
Famous last words: "I told my son to keep this truck clean, but I can't do anything with'im." :D :D
My tailgate isn't bent but there is always hydraulic oil in there.
Craig
Quote from: Craig on March 25, 2008, 10:52:28 AM
My tailgate isn't bent but there is always hydraulic oil in there.
[
There is a very important little word you fogot to put in there between " bent but " . That little word would be
My tailgate isn't bent yet, but there is always hydraulic oil in there.
It's not as straight as it looks ;) ;D
Iron Mule and beech saw bolts
What happens when your back cut isn't level and you cut through the holding wood ;) ;D
Gas cans: check
Chainsaws: check
Fuel tank: check
Pail of hydraulic oil: check
Banana tailgate: hmmm, are you sure it's a logger's truck? Looks pretty straight to me. ;D
Dave
Basswood logs to be forwarded and a couple hangups. One was a natural blowdown. The other was fallen into it to dislodge it and after trying to pull it out with the Mule's loader it ended up 12' in the air. Had to cut the top out to get it back down and then it was like cutting ends off a teeter totter one at time ;) ;D You should never fall trees into others to get them to fall down ;) ;D This was actually the second one I'd fallen on it. I finally had to hook a chain to the orginal and pull it down with the Mule.
Collecting basswood logs
Mule and basswood saw logs
One of Everingham Enterprise's Western Stars. Mike's putting his cross chains on the pup.
Me, Jonsered 2186 and a hollow beech. Beats wearing a tie to work any day 8) 8) 8)
That truck's tailgate's been a real survivor 8) It's got a crease on the outside from the old straps breaking when I flipped a round bale out of the bed and has had enough bar, hydraulic and other oils spilled on it that it'll never rust ;D ;D
The inside of my pickup bed won't rust either. Did you know those rubber floor mats will grow about two feet when they are saturated with diesel?
Dave
That's an awesome beech Corley, even if it was hollow. ;)
Wish our beech was smooth. I don't know how you guys escape scale, because they like warmer, not colder climates. Maybe one saving grace is the females can't fly (I think that's true ::) ). Nature is interesting at times.
Nice basswood logs, your cutting those as if they were as thick as sugar maples in our woods. ;D
Who needs a tie me down, eh?
Beech scale is on it's way to us :( :'( :( It's been in the eastern half of the UP for a while and is in the NW tip of the LP now. The DNR attempted a control cut when it was first found in N Emmet County but it's since been found in other areas there also. So it's only a matter of time now. The theory is it came in from the UP on birds. The scales are assexual and are only mobile for a short while in the spring I believe. Birds and wind are their primary modes of transport. That's how I remember it but I haven't read the literature in a while ;) ;D I'd prefer to leave beech standing for wildlife mast and shelter but they're goners anyway and this harvest site is going to be sold and the owner wants everything merchantable taken out. Lots of firewood in one of these brutes. Solid ones go for hardwood saw bolts. This area was pretty thick with basswood and a few sugar maple. It's pretty thin of anything now :) :)
Dave, that mat musta been trying to climb out of the bed on its own eh eh
A little down hill cable yarding Westwood Timber Sale 3/26/08.
http://www.youtube.com:80/watch?v=7QKqbVPY3QM (http://www.youtube.com:80/watch?v=7QKqbVPY3QM)
I am harvesting mountain sides. It's quite a challenge, but I think I'm up for it. I run 1270D wheeled harvester, but we put tracks on it. I have a 1710D forwarder picking up behind me. These pics are from January 08. I traded these in, in April, and my new ones were delivered today. I'll put up some pics of the new one soon.
PHOTOS MUST BE IN YOUR FORESTRY FORUM GALLERY
See instructions here: Link (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=help)
Nice machines Bicboro. But hard on the dial-up. Should squeeze some bytes out of them and resize down to 450 per long side. Then upload them to your forum gallery. ;)
Do they do pre-commercial thinning on clearcut sites at a later date down there? Or just let it go wild?
Sale Closure.The timber harvest contract has been completed. The landing has been cleaned of all woody debris and graded. The iron mule forwarder is now driven onto the lowboy for transport to the next job. Sheffer timber harvest; 4/30/08.
Sale Closure. The landowner (wearing suspenders) and the logger (in black sweatshirt) discuss a "job well done" on the 80 acres as the iron mule forwarder is loaded on the lowboy and ready the be hauled off the job. Sheffer timber harvest; 4/30/08.
On its Way. The iron mule forwarder leaves the harvest area. It will be trucked home for a rest and maintenance and then on to the next job. Sheffer timber harvest; 4/30/08.
Ron, thats a nice wrap up for a good job. How long did this job take from the initial contact to you thru the bid, contract, job start and then finish?
Most of the state jobs I do here are 5 year contracts, and there are good tax reasons to hold a logging contract for at least a year before harvesting and on a sold as appraised job there are additional growth incentives to hold contracts as long as possible.
However, I know that most private landowners do not have the patience that the government has on logging jobs.
Gary, that's for sure. It's usually cut and run on woodlots here and you can see the results as most woodlots get liquidated in a harvest or so badly high graded that what gets left should be burnt. ::)
Gary,
Time frames on this job were as follows:
(1) September 22, 2005, landowner contacted me to look at their 80 acres of hardwoods and aspen. I met with the landowner and prepared a management prescription for their timber management. The landowner didn't want any activity on the property until after the October - December, 2005 deer seasons.
(2) January 6, 2006, the landowner contacted me and signed an Agreement To Prepare & Manage Private Land Timber Harvest.Work on the property was now authorized.
(3) February 4 - March 4, boundary lines were checked and marked, timber was selectively marked and cruised. Round trip travel was 110 miles.
(4) March 21, 2006, Timber Sale Proposal, Bib Sheet, Timber Sale Area Map, and sample Private Land Timber Contract were prepared for approval by the landowner.
(5) April 15, 2006, Timber sale was put out on bids for a May 2, 2006 bid opening.
(6) A number of producers looked at the sale but markets were now going "soft" and most were "backed up" with wood to be cut. There was one bid that was acceptable.
(7) The Harvest Contract was signed on May 16, 2006 with an expiration date of April 30, 2008.
8. September 12, 2007, the purchaser started the harvest with the intent to complete it in a short time frame. However with slow markets and backed up with wood on other sales they had to complete the job dragged out for 6 1/2 month until the very last day of the contract, April 30, 2008. This job was carried on longer than usual, mostly because of the poor markets.
I've found that logger's are never as timely as they say they will be. When they say tomorrow, it's usually two weeks from tomorrow. ;)
The producer was one of my better ones, but poor markets and the reasons you mentioned caused their late start-up and slow production. Once they started they were slow and consistent, but did a good job overall.
Over all from first meeting with the landowner until harvest completion it was just over 2 1/2 years. I usually allow enough time on my contracts so as to get the better producers and bidders and I inform the landowners of this though they may sometimes get inpatient.
Yeah, quite a while to complete. You can get a few producers to do a good job, but you have to watch most of them close. Some tend to high grade if not watched over, and some take a long while and you wonder how they pay the bills. Had one guy that took 3 years and the owner was a town. They had budgeted $45,000 a year from harvests from a 300 acre woodlot. $45,000 was close to the figure from the volume removed in those 3 years. It took 3 years and the owners were at a point where they were calling everyone involved thieves. That same lot had been badly high graded 10 years before. ::)
At the same time I looked after another lot that we harvested in the months of January-March over two years and collected the same amount of money on 80 acres. The job looked real good and you couldn't even see the skid paths after 3 years. Chalk full of regen. We had about 6 acres of clearings (I measured them), plus roads and the clearings where no bigger than 2 acres and down to less than 1 acre. It was areas of mature fir and aspen. Some of the aspen was veneer, most of the hardwood removed was small and low grade.
Well I've just recently joined this forum and I have really enjoyed reading this thread, especially seeing how you midwestern guys seem to put these 4 wheel forwarders to such effective use. Almost nobody runs machines like that out here. I just purchased a 1987 Franklin 132 forwarder from out in NW Illinois and had to pay to get it trucked all the way out here to Connecticut and can't wait to try it out once all the repairs are made on it. Maybe I can get some pics and add something to this thread.
Welcome to the Forum! You can't be too far from me, I'm just over the line in MA
Dave
Thanks Dave, I had never heard of Alford Mass and I just looked it up and you aren't very far from me at all. I truck quite a bit into Bob Beham's yard in Ashley Falls and hauled a lot of logs off of Mt. Washington this winter which looks very close to you. Its pretty funny I'd never heard of your town and I drove right by it dozens of times the last few months. If you ever need trucking or anything let me know.
I'm about ~20 minutes from Bob. He said he stops by the Forum once in a while.
Dave
WOW took a full week to get through that one, and that was just skimming through to look at all the purdy pictures. :D I especially liked the 3 pictures of the old log trucks,except for my saw and tractor all I run is old junk.. I mean antique equipment ;D
Hi all,
I'm new to this forum, I just dreamed that I was -25 years and could start with the gear that below link shows:
http://www.e-series.fi/revolution/index.htm
The younger has a pretty good start nowadays with excellent machines, I had a TJ404 with "open cab" and the blue heaven above my hard hat, free exhaust smoke in my face.
:)
wonder how much they cost?
Stonebroke
I want a couple of the simulators. They look like fun.
semologger
The real things would be much more fun.
Stonebroke
Quote from: semologger on June 04, 2008, 06:53:26 PM
I want a couple of the simulators. They look like fun.
we have four computers in our forestry class with both Harvester and Forwarder simulators on them. they are pretty cool because with the joysticks you buy for the software the controls are actually very similar if not the exact same as alot of Valmet equipment. the only things these lack is graphics. the graphics are utterly horrible, the limbs on the trees are just green triangles on the stem, and the white birch trees look like someone painted a spruce tree white.
Quote from: stonebroke on June 03, 2008, 04:33:16 PM
wonder how much they cost?
Stonebroke
Stonebroke, according to a Scandinavien Forestry News magazine price for the harvester 1470E is US$ 616,000 and the forwarder 1270E is US$ 450,000, Cheap ::)
I wonder how much wood you would have to cut ina average day to pay for that?
Almost like you are working for John Deere.
Stonebroke
Up here it means a lot more woodlots will suffer with the clear cut mentality pushed onto the operator to pay for them. It's more about finance sometimes than management. ::)
Quote from: stonebroke on June 11, 2008, 05:34:09 PM
.............Almost like you are working for John Deere.
.....
What does that comment mean? and directed at who? :)
Maybe they mean John Deere FINANCE Division..
It would only then cost around a million dollars to get some wood out and sell for nothing.
Here now you have to run 3 processors to make what at one time you made with one.
Lets also buy a tractor trailer and loader to have the complete package and haul our own wood. The cost per mile for fuel on the highway for that is only about $1.15 per mile around here.
It looks like fun tho sitting in there with no blackflies chewing you up... :D
Quote from: beenthere on June 11, 2008, 06:54:57 PM
Quote from: stonebroke on June 11, 2008, 05:34:09 PM
.............Almost like you are working for John Deere.
.....
What does that comment mean? and directed at who? :)
It means that you are working real hard just to pay the equipment off and you really don't make any money except for the equipment maker. It is common among us farmers.
Stonebroke
Thanks, now I "see"... 8) 8) :) :)
looks like a big mess, lots of springpoles to deal with.
What a nightmare to work in. Is a lot of that aspen? Seems like small root balls.
Yes, it is mostly aspen with areas of standing sawlog size aspen that should have been harvested several years ago. The landowner realizes that, but just didn't. We are going to harvest all of the aspen and downed red maple and oak in and around the blowdown and leave the intermixed standing red and white oak for wildlife. It should end up looking like a shelterwood cut.
There is also a small blowdown area of red pine plantation of pole size timber that we will try to have cleaned up also.
Yes, a mess and not the safest areas to work.
last week we also got a very bad wind storm. saddly,i lost a friend in it as he was running a log loader the storm hit.he saw a tree coming for the loader and tryed running for safety.he didn,t make it.he was going down the steps of the loader and got hit acrossed the back.he died right there.. :'(
delbert
What a sad incident.
YEP RON:that really bothered me.who would ever think that a tree would get ya as you ran a log loader.i can see a log getting away from ya,the loader busting,or falling off the loader..but,hit by a blow down?? i figured i,de post it so everybody else would know it can and has happened.. :'( i worked with kenny for several years on a logging job.
delbert
No ROPS on that log loader? Sorry to hear about it, but might have been safer lived by not jumping off, i.e. leaving the protection of the ROPS.
Sorry to hear about your friend Two Bears. We had a bad twister a few years back. We took on a 20 acre job. Mostly white oak and red oak. It didnt take long for us to get back to the pine thicket. I hated it i ran the skidder and had a guy running the saw. He knew what he was doing thank goodness. I was happy for that job to be done.
Most guys around here that did good on the jobs used a Bell cutter with a dangle head.
Hindsight is always 20/20.
Sorry to hear about Kenny.That was a freak accident.That is too bad something like that had to happen.
BEENTHERE:log loader cabs are mostly for comfort not stopping falling trees that inch square tubing and 1/8inch steel plate won,t stop much.it,s tough to stand your ground when a trees coming at you.it,s to bad he ran tho.if he had stayed in the loader he would still be here.but,like i said it,s tough to stand your ground if a trees coming at you.
CFARM:your right..talk about being in the wrong place at the wrong time.i,ve been thur tornato's(sp) 100 mph straightline winds,ect,ect,ect and i can say that storm was the most violent storm i,ve ever been thur.the wind went from about 10 mph to over 70 mph in a split second and it rained so hard i think a fish could have swam thur the air.the whole house shuttered when the wind first hit...it sounded like a big truck hit the house.
delbert
Mother Nature continues to show us "who is boss".
Yeah, just rotten luck. When your in panic mode you don't think too clear some times. Sad you lost your friend.
The center mount loaders we use up here don't have any kind of operator protection, just a seat. Slasher loaders that have cabs usually don't contain a ROPS, it's just to keep you out of the cold. Sorry to hear about your friend, twobears.
heres whats going to be on my crew
That's a nice looking tracked harvester. Is that one of those big Valmet heads on that machine?
Do you always use graple skidders rather than forwarders behind your harvesters?
Grapple skidder is quite commonly used with processors here Gary. I find that a skidder makes for a better catch of new regeneration. Often a processor will tear up advanced regen from a lot of operations I see. And some advanced regen is best torn up if it's 50 year old fir 4 feet tall. If the timing of the harvest is right the fir, spruce, sugar maple and yellow birch will come back thicker than dog hair. ;D
sorry thats what i want when im older im only 13
The only jobs here that use a grapple skidder behind a harvester are in steep terain where the danger of rollovers with a forwarder is just too high.
There is just no way to keep up with a harvester without a good forwarder and even then it's difficult. Even a forwarder is seldom used for long distances like over a half mile. When you have to haul farther than that, they usually fix the road up for the semi's and use intermediate landings.
Also on many of the jobs we get now there are multiple species and cut lengths to deal with and hauling small bundles is waay too time consuming and sorting is even worse.
Forwarders are common here now.Seems like if you have 2-3 guys a forwarder is used.When my lot was cut they used a forwarder and a grapple.I had a couple steep area that he wanted to use the skidder.Trees were to big for the havester or he would of used that.There are still some guys that cut alone that only have a skidder.
Quote from: Gary_C on August 09, 2008, 02:55:05 PM
That's a nice looking tracked harvester. Is that one of those big Valmet heads on that machine?
Do you always use graple skidders rather than forwarders behind your harvesters?
The head is a Logmax. I'm assuming a 7000. The harvester looks like a Tigercat 822.
Logmax heads are very productive units.
Quote from: thecfarm on August 10, 2008, 04:27:19 AM
Forwarders are common here now.Seems like if you have 2-3 guys a forwarder is used.When my lot was cut they used a forwarder and a grapple.I had a couple steep area that he wanted to use the skidder.Trees were to big for the havester or he would of used that.There are still some guys that cut alone that only have a skidder.
the only really mech logging around my area is for big companies that work directly for paper mills and the sort. mostly they just cut softwood for pulp and chip the tops and small trees. But the most common operations are usually just guy or 2 and a skidder.
How much do you drive around in ME,Zackman?I'm not talking up north.Just in our area.I see forwarders quite often cutting on small lots.I went with my Grandson's field trip,forwarder,grapple,even a three wheel havester,and chipper.I drove by a lot last year on the way to work and there was a forwarder cutting for a house lot.Was another on the way to my FIL house.I've been seeing them.Maybe they all work for the paper company.The guy that cut for me does a lot for IP or whatever it is now.
I do wonder how some was and can make decent money with all the high cost of equipment.At first I was not all that impressesd with a forwarder.But from what I've seen on other sites and on my lot,I'm very impressesd now.I have quite a hill to get up into my lot.With a skidder the top of the hill would of been at the bottom.The trails are so much better looking.I would like to have one just to haul rocks with.
Gary, delimber and slasher on the yard on a few operations. On sites with small hardwood it's all pulp and might be someone bucking logs, but the volumes here are low so the bucker would never really be flooded with wood. ;) On softwood ground, it would go tree length and probably a delimber on the yard. Talking private woodlots and career loggers, not small operators or weekend loggers. Yarding is usually less than 400 meters. Most private woodlots are between 250-400 meters wide, road up the middle or on the property line. ;)
Everybody down my way uses a buncher followed by a grapple skidder, except us small timers then its chainsaws cable skidders and some kind of loader. I have never seen a forwarder on a job site here.
Timberfaller3, I have a friend down there that lives in Juliette. He has a Ponsse Ergo harvester, another fellow has a Ponsse forwarder that works behind him. They are the only Ponsse machines in Georgia, I believe there are some John Deere cut to length operations though. The wood down there is ideal for the cut to length machines, but they aren't very well accepted.
Quote from: barbender on August 11, 2008, 09:26:21 PM
Timberfaller3, I have a friend down there that lives in Juliette. He has a Ponsse Ergo harvester, another fellow has a Ponsse forwarder that works behind him. They are the only Ponsse machines in Georgia, I believe there are some John Deere cut to length operations though. The wood down there is ideal for the cut to length machines, but they aren't very well accepted.
Your right about it not being accepted. But then again neither is most standard safety gear. If you find a one or two man operation up here in the hills besides me that uses so much as a hard hat, then you done something worth talking about. In my area there is still a good many 1940-1970 log trucks on the road and alot of home brewed equipment, now that ain't to say that the big companies don't use all the proper safety gear cause most of them do, but it's awful hard for OSHA to come down on one guy with a chainsaw for not wearing chaps especially when Georgia ain't an OSHA state.
anybody that runs a chainsaw without the proper safety equiptment is a fool! when,that chain cuts into you..you,ll wish you had chaps on..or if a tree hits you on the head you,ll wish you had a hard hat on.
i always ware safety equipment but,i know just whats it,s like to watch a chainsaw kickback and rip you apart.three years ago this coming tuesday,i got cut by a husky 272.i got cut pretty much from my left wrist to the inside of my elbow.it hit down by my wrist and twisted around my arm.when,it stopped the bar and chain was stuck in my arm and i had blood pouring out of me.i was a good 400 yards back from the landing and by myself.the other skidder op was 700/800 yards behind me and as lucky would have it the truck driver just showed up on the landing.
i pulled the saw out of my arm,tossed it on the ground and held my arm back together as best as i could.i had blood pouring thur my fingers in streams.i had to jump off the tree i was standing on.once,i got on the ground i leaned over and pushed my arm into my hip to put more pressure on it..i had blood running thur my fingers and down my chaps,it was running off the toe of my boot.i hit the landing and yelled to the truck driver.he looked but didn,t see me so i yelled again.. i,ve worked with him on and off for 20 years..i never seen him move so fast.. :o i also never saw him turn so white.
it has taken me two and a half years to recover and i,ll have a messedup left hand for the rest of my life.
now is not wearing the proper safety equipment worth it?? oooo,and don,t depend on that chain brake saving you..mine didn,t.it didn,t go off when the saw first kicked back and it didn,t even fire when the brake handle hit the side of my hand.
delbert
Exactly the reason I have chaps helmets boots gloves and eye/ear protection at all times, and being with the local fire/rescue department I have seen my share of chainsaw mishaps that range from very minor to dead when we got there.
a logger has to remember where he is.the hospital might be hours away.i,ve taken two trips.the first time i got hit in the face and busted my nose really baddly.we where on paper company land.it took 45 minutes to just get to the gate on town road.then,it took another hour plus to get to the hospital.
the time i sawed my arm i was just around the corner from my house and working on private land.the land owner keepplaying game on fixing the road into the landing and we could hardly get in and out..even,in a 4x4 pickup truck.things moved pretty fast that day but it still took awhile to reach the hospital.the log truck driver called 911 on his cell phone.i was really surprized he got a good enough signal...he did tho.once,he got the emt's on the way he took his sons pickup truck and drove me out to the town road.the emt's gpt there just a very minutes later.they checked me out and then drove me acrossed my little town to a feild so,a chopper could take me the rest of the way.i ended up in a hospital about 45 minutes away by road.but,it was about two hours from getting cut until i got in the hospital.
you only have so much blood and once part of it's drained out of you..your done.EVERY!! logger should not only wear chaps,hardhat,ect they also should learn first-aid.i think a person should also learn to deal with seeing blood,ect..alot of people can,t.when,my friend got killed i heard that the skidder op saw him first and he wouldn,t even go check on him.he waited for another guy to get out of the woods and had him check on my friend. thats NOT!! the way to handle a accident.if i had been that way i,de most likely be dead. it surely wasn,t pretty or fun to see that saw cut me apart but,i had to deal with it or die.
ok,enough of that..go get your chaps,hardhat,check your chain brake and get some first-aid training then be careful so you never have to use it,,
delbert
Don't forget a personal first aid kit on you as well. If you are pinned or injured really badly the kit in the skidder or in a truck on the landing won't do you much good.
Craig
CRAIG:you right.i know very few loggers around here that carry a first aid kit right on them.you should carry one plus,you should learn ways to use whats always around you..(your shirt,belt,hands,,ect,ect,ect.i had a licence from the state and i had to have a up to date first aid and cpr card to keep it.when,the time came to use it i was very glad i had it.
after,i got cut i had alot of time to think about my accident.i learned the military and hopitals use several products to stop bleeding.one is called clotstopper.i learned about that on the web.i printed the info and showed it to my doctor.he told me they had stuff like that also.the clotstopper cames in a MRE type package and is weather proof.a guy could tape it right inside his hardhat.you just open that package and sprinkle it on the wound to stop the flow of blood.
delbert
I carry a first aid kit in my brush saw harness as well as fire retardant ansil pack.
Hitachi 150 Tracked Harvester. This tracked processor is being used on a cut to length timber harvest. A Valmet 544X Forwarder works with the processor. Ewald timber harvest; 5/08.
Hitachi 150 Tracked Harvester. Cut to length harvesting; Ewald timber harvest; 5/08.
Valmet 544X Forwarder. The Valmet fowarder is used to support the Hitachi 150 tracked harvester in the "cut to length" timber harvest; Ewald timber harvest; 5/08.
Valmet 544X Forwarder. Wood processed by the tracked harvester is forwarded to the landing'decking area.
What kind of trees are those ?
Stonebroke
Those are aspen in the above photo . The timber sale was mostly aspen and red maple, and some black cherry.
So does it go mostly for pulp or do they saw those nice aspen?
Stonebroke
10 inches and up will go for sawlogs if straight and sound and the rest goes for pulpwood.
Kenworth Woodhauler. The Kenworth woodhauler picks up the sorted wood products decked along the access road. The wood deck in front are aspen sawlogs.
Kenworth Woodhauler at the landing. The Kenworth has been turned around at the end of the access road and is now being loaded with aspen pulpwood for transport to the Tenaco mill 40 miles away.
Timber Harvest Completed. This shows some of the thinning area a couple days after completion by the tracked harvester. The harvester does a good job on getting the slash down. Ewald timber harvest. 5/08
FT-153 Fabtech Tracked Harvester. The harvester arrives at the timber harvest area for unloading. This harvester replaces the Hitachi 150 tracked harvester seen on previous harvests as the timber producer upgrades to a newer and faster machine. Maturen storm damage timber harvest; 8/08.
Fabtech Tracked Harvester FT-153. The Fabtech unloads on the county gravel road to prepare the access into the harvest area. Maturen timber harvest; 8/08.
Fabtech FT-153 Tracked Harvester. The Fabtech harvester clears and widens the narrow winding two-track road into the storm damaged timber area as the first order of business to allow for truck access and hauling. Maturen timber ahrvest; 8/08.
Looking good...
ron i was curious you said
Quote from: Ron Scott on September 01, 2008, 06:49:09 PM
Fabtech FT-153 Tracked Harvester. The Fabtech harvester clears and widens the narrow winding two-track road into the storm damaged timber area as the first order of business to allow for truck access and hauling.
But do you bring in a dozer to build the roads afterwards to build the roads? if so dont the stump holes give ya problems?
We very seldon use a dozer since we have many existing two track roads that usually need minor improvement for timber hauling. In this case, there was already an existing winding two-track road with a firm base, but not wide enough and with curves theat were too sharp for the 100 foot wood hauler to negotate. (Our loggers are very particular with their semi's and don't want to dent them or get them dirty. ;) )
The Fabtech cut additional marked trees along the two track to widen and straighten it out for wood hauling. The valmet forwarder was then used to pull the stumps and fill the stump holes and pack the road in. The woodhauler then packed it in very well for a firm base.
When we left the harvest area the road was graded with the forwarder blade as neded and by dragging a tree top over it to smooth it out for two wheel drive vehicle use. We left the landowner with a good passable road that a pickup could hardly negotiate to begin with.
As what Ron said about the Trucks not getting messed up, some truckers here don't even like a road with green limbs over hanging and swatting the mirrors. And they will tell you right quick. ;)
If you ever had to pay to replace any of those chrome trim parts you would understand why...
FT-153 Fabtech Tracked Harvester. Cutting aspen products to length in a blowdown timber harvest. Maturen timber harvest; 7/08.
Ron
What is the aspen used for?
Is it all for pulp? OSB?
Thanks
Nick
It's (veneer quality aspen) often veneer product core wood. Take a sheet of birch plywood, you have that razor thin birch veneer outside and the core layers will sometimes be aspen. I can smell the stuff when ripping on the table saw. Has that asprin smell in the dust.
Aspen is used for all of the above, lumber, pulpwood, OSB, core stock, pellets, chipwood, etc. depending upon the quality and local markets.
Photos taken on Nighthawk Timber job in Brunswick township (east of Gogama, south of Timmins, west of Gowganda...sort of).
First is a truck being loaded with 8 foot jackpine pulp most likely going to Nairn Centre for chipping.
Second is piles of pulp wood and sawlogs at roadside waiting to be hauled
Third is the processor and a closer shot of the processing head
Are those seed trees in the background or what?
Stonebroke
Stonebroke
In the case of Nighthawk Timber (as well as any other Crown forest operators on the Timiskaming Forest) there is a legal requirement to leave living, dying or dead standing trees for wildlife purposes. Our rule set calls for a minimum of 25 trees/hectare (12/acre) well distributed across the cutover of which 6 must be large living with 2 being at least 12" dbh).
Additonally, there is also be a requirement to leave uncut patches to provide additional cover for wildlife but this depends on the total disturbance area (combination of new and old cuts).
Valmet 544x Forwarder. The Valmet forwarder works along with the Fabetech track processor. Here it picks up recently cut-to-lenght aspen wood products for carry to the landing/decking area. Maturen timber harverst; 7/08.
Well, I hope you have lots of big wood and good price. ;) :)
I should specify that I do contract work for Rottne Canada.
Rottne Canada is going to try and do a demo of the H20 soon. When they do, I'll take some pics.
Here is a picture of the machine in the shop:
Loading Directly From The Valmet Forwarder. The woodhauler is top-loaded directly from the valmet forwarder. Maturen timber harvest; 7/08.
A valmet 840 forwarder.
ill post more when i can resize my photos ;)
Hello John. Is that a coincidence with your last name?
Here is my Valmet 840:
Seems strange they are both the same models, but I know they are. Where was that one made?
yeah the name is probably cos i like valmet machines lol, it was made in sweden. used in the uk its a 1997 model a bit older than yours i suspect lol
this is my valmet 860 when i was working on a clear fell site in mid Wales.
Well Done! What type of harvester were you supporting?
lol there was three!! We had a Daewoo 225 with a Viking havesting head, Timberjack 1270C with a 758c head and also a (Silvatec Sliepner with a silvatec 560 head on demo). i have a photo of the silvatec.
John, nice forwarders and harvester. What lengths do you cut? I see you have two different lengths.
Do you have both an 840 and a 860?
I think all the black painted 840's here in the US were made in Gladstone, MI. and had Cummins engines but that could be wrong. My 840 was at least assembled in the US and had a Sisu 4 cylinder diesel and is a bit underpowered. The 840.2 had a 6 cylinder Sisu engine.
we cut too many different legnths gary lol in one of those pictures of the 860 i was loading fencing stakes at 5'6" then the second picture i was loading 10' saw logs. but we cut stakes 5'6", rails 12', bars 8', pulp/chip usually 8', different saw logs from 6' to 16'.yeah the sisu 6 cylinder is what was in our 860. we have a brand new 840.3 i dont have pictures of that one though and the 860. the 840 is capable to match to the 860. we had the bunk on the 840 extended so it can take two bays of 10' logs easily.
to be honest gary i have always been interested in what it would be like to work in the US on a harvesting site. Ive always been told by people ive worked with who have worked in canada and austraila that its the same as here only everything is much bigger lol.
How large of a cutting area are you working with the 3 harvesters? Are there additional forwarders being used also? It sounds like you have a good product mix to sort and market.
we only use two forwarders a new valmet 840.3 and the 860. thats enough to keep up with 3 harvestors i cant remember the actual size of the patch i just remember that there was approximatly 15 000 tonnes of standing timber to harvest ::)
i hope this helps give you some clue to the size of the patch ron. its a shot from before the we started the site. the patch both sides of the road was harvested.
http://www.flashearth.com/?lat=52.377658&lon=-3.435533&z=16.1&r=0&src=msl
http://www.youtube.com/v/3OisG3meFks&hl=en&
FABTEK 663 checking saw speed
All you need FabTek, is the Youtube URL as typed below. Html code doesn't work in the forum threads.
http://www.youtube.com/v/3OisG3meFks
FABTEK 663 checking saw speed
Quote from: John_valmet on October 23, 2008, 04:18:12 PM
to be honest gary i have always been interested in what it would be like to work in the US on a harvesting site. Ive always been told by people ive worked with who have worked in canada and austraila that its the same as here only everything is much bigger lol.
I am not so sure the jobs here are bigger. While we do have some 6-8000 cord jobs, it looks like you have the same size jobs there. We still have some 100+ cord jobs as the private woodlots are being more and more fragmented. And on many of those larger jobs, the loggers are still using big tracked feller bunchers along with big grapple skidders. Those jobs are not of much interest to a smaller cut to length operator, at least not to me.
yeah im not that interested in feller buncher - grapple skidding operations. infact i dont think in the uk we do anything like that to be honest. its more cut to length jobs. also skyline jobs too they were quite populor but less now because contractors tend to use harvesters and forwarders to do the skyline jobs. For cheaper rates than the skyline gangs. which i think is not very fair.
The soil types, landscape and management objectives will usually guide the method and equipment we allow to perform the harvest.
Our selection harvests will be "cut-to-length" with chainsaws, harveters and forwarders and our pine row thinnings and selections between rows and clear cuts or land clearings, and chipping operations may use feller bunchers and grapple skidders.
thats probably why there aint many if any feller bunchers work in the uk because the ground is too soft. i havent been on a site yet were our forwarders could go without band tracks or wheel chains.
This thread just needed bumped up. Lots of new guys around.
Am suprised to read more about cords,than millions of board feet in a sale.
Photo test.
[img width=500 --Photos MUST be in the Forestry Forum gallery!!!!!--.com/albums/v136/BigStick/NoUndercut.jpg[/img]
I'm surprised not to see m3. Not.
Sometimes even more surprised that the photo posting tutorial isn't noticed. But I can understand when there is a photo posting icon in the posting header. ;D
I guess when a guy is putting a minimum of 5 million boards a year on the ground,"cords" lose their luster.
My bad,for being desensitized..............
That's a lot of boards, 'bout 10000 cords.
I'm going in the field this afternoon. We have a Ponsee processor cutting hardwoods, and spruce/fir, so i will grab some pictures and videos if i get a chance.
Quote from: isawlogs on August 09, 2006, 10:57:14 AM
For those of you who ever wundered how they got the chips out of the trucks when they got to the mills ..
This was taken at the Tembec mill in Témiscamingue Québec . Both wear being unloaded at the same time . I work here been here for five years I used to haul chips for them before from Bancroft and Huntsville Ont.
Loaded Chip Van of Scotch Pine Chips is pulled up the steep hill on the access road after spring break-up. The John Deere 450E pulls while the 380 Timberjack grapple skidder pushes. Schirmer wood chip harvest; 4/08.
Scotch Pine Chip Harvest. The timberjack grabble skidder pulls the poorly formed Scotch pine trees to the chipper for processing and blowing into the chip van. Schirmer chip harvest; 6/09.
grew up pulp wood / short stick logging. Felled with Poulan straigt bars and bucked with bow bars. skidded with a 1952 D2 Cat with a sled that would hold two cord. Hauled to mill on an old two ton IH truck similar to the one in Tom's picture. Now I have moved up to a D6 Cat and John Deere wheel tractor for skidding, still fell and buck with chain saws and haul with a 1973 C-65 chevy truck and tandem trailer. 10 to 16 ft saw logs and ceder fence post is all I cut now.
Trelan 5600-L Chipper. Chipping Scotch pine; Schirmer chip harvest; 6/09
Welcome aboard tractorg25.
West Virginia Logging. My return to Richwood West Virginia after 31 years found logging to be quite active now in the Richwood area. While I was their during the early 1970's the Monongahela N.F. was under court injunction prohibiting clearcutting.
Here a log tuck travels down the main street of Richwood, West Virginia, the Gateway to the Monongahela National Forest, 6/09. I never saw this happen during my 4 years there. Only coal trucks .
Another log truck makes a turn from Oakford Avenue on to Main Stree in Richwood, W. Va., 6/09.
Columbia Mill Road Sign; Craigsville, W VA; 6/09
A wood hauler prepares to make a turn into the large Columbia hardwood plywood mill in Craigsville, W Va; 6/09.
Ron,
Is that a sawmill or veneer plant? As you probably know, they are the largest veneer manufacturer in the country I believe. They have a plant up in Presque Isle, Maine and send a buyer around the Maritimes and Quebec for veneer to scale. I know one fellow that works there and a former scaler as well. The fellow that works there now has worked under me at the Marketing Board.
It's quite a mill complex producing a number of wood products including hardwood plywood and fiber board. The Jeld-Wen Wood Fiber division is also located there in the Nicholas County Wood Products Park. It's the most wood producing activity that I've seen in awhile.
Here's some old iron...
1974 International S8 "Paylogger". Weight is about 20k. 3-53 Detroit, 23.1x26 tires, Gearmatic 119 winch. I bought this about 15 yrs ago. Used it full-time logging until 3 yrs ago. I now only log part-time, mostly in the winter months. This has been a good skidder and has used me well.
I use it sometimes to load big logs on my sawmill ...
IH quit making skidders in the early 80's I think. I have used JD's, Timberjacks, Tree Farmers and Franklins. I like this IH the most of all.
Dad had a late 60's Tree Farmer, gas engine. The only thing I seen him replace was the battery. He used to remove it when the machine was sitting idle for a few months. I was going to say he replaced the manifold, but all he did was repair it because I think parts were hard to find at the time. Never sold it until he was ready to sell the farm. Dad used to cut all his own wood on the farm for fuel and for mill sales. There was places far off the fields he never even got to. "Why go way over there? Lots of wood right here." I tried to convince him to cut some huge aspen at the end, close to the field to, but he was all done farm'n. :D :D :D
There was a small grove of large toothed aspen that grew back since a cut in 1994, and in 2007 those trees were already 8" dbh. Fastest growing native tree I've seen around here, it will out pace trembling by far.
Saw this harvester sitting out by the road in Southern Maryland along 301. No one was around so I didn't get any information. It says BELL on it. looks like a fun ride.
Here's a front view. Looks like George Lucas would like one for his movies :)
Weekend_Sawyer
Here is a tube video of one.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lrKoxnUx2vQ
And another. This one shows a grapple on a boom.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pzI46UA-J_8&feature=related
That is one wild vehicle. I like it!
Tripp
That thing looks like it would turn on a dime and give you eight cents in change. :)
It also looks like a accident waiting to happen.
Excellent piece of equipment for clearing really dense stands of young pines. The first thinning on my dads place was done with a bell three wheeler with a shear head. he could get in some tight spots and didn't tear up a lot of stuff. Frasseling skidder was bigger than he was. They are not real common. Don't seem to work good in the hills (like a Z-turn mower on a sideslope) and a back weight disadvantage for larger trees.
Don
A 3 wheeled Bell feller buncher was used to salvage the many acres of burned over jack pine after the Mack Lake Fire of May 1980 on the Mio District of the Huron National Forest. It did a good job on the flat burned over areas, but I haven't seen one at work since.
Quote from: Weekend_Sawyer on August 03, 2009, 09:06:34 PM
Saw this harvester sitting out by the road in Southern Maryland along 301. No one was around so I didn't get any information. It says BELL on it. looks like a fun ride.
Here's a front view. Looks like George Lucas would like one for his movies :)
Gday This is a great thred its taken me nearly 12 months to read it Its a BELL Super T fellerbuncher ;)Have have been built in africa since the mid 60s and where built in NZ also and under licence buy Morbark in the US untill the mid 90s you can still get new ones from Bell in Africa they where pretty popular here they come in the Super T ,120 and 220 teli loggers like in the second clip ;) they are Easy to drive and a 1000lb counterweight helps on the rear ;)
Il add some pics of my own and dads from the 80s when i cget them scaned ;)
Chris
Manufacture of Forest Products is active in Craigsville, W VA, 6/09
Colunbia Veneer Mill Log Yard. A result of all the logging truck traffic makes for a full log yard. Craigsville, W VA, 6/09.
Ron, I'll have to drive up to the Columbia yard in Presque Isle, Maine and see what's up. I was just up by there last weekend to, but not over in the Industrial Park. We could see it from the Route 1A coming down from Caribou, actually I could pick out the airport. The folks and I came over from Perth, NB to shop and went back over the line at Bridgewater by my place (below the wind mills).
That pine wood that bell is cutting is what i like. You guys can have all the oak trees. I would like to have that saw head on my hydroax seen inthe first video. Mine just having the shear makes it a bit slower putting the wood down. But then again the Skidder still cant keep up with me now. Also i hated shelling out the money to replace those Teeth on the saws. Ive only had to buy 2 blades for my cutter in 10 years.
The bell in weekends post has a chainsaw bar that comes out and cuts the tree once you have gotton ahold of it. You cant carry the trees around with that one like in the video. You still directional fall the trees then pull them around.
The only thing I dislike about a shear is fiber damage esp when they get misaligned I've seen it so bad that 2-4 ft deductions were made on logs
Chico
They probably stopped using shears here 20 years ago. There was a lot of prototyping here in the 80's and many things came and went. Most everything now has a chain on the felling head, sometimes a slasher on the yard. Not a whole lot of delimbers, leaves huge piles of brush on roadside that takes away forest acreage until it is rotted away. They don't burn slash here anymore. I see them some on woodlots and sure is an eye sore to see all that roadside slash or worst strung in rows or piles in the landowner's field.
Ya the fiber damage is the only thing i hate about my shear. The places we sell to have cut off lines so they but the ends off Around 5 inches or so. I am in the process of setting in a post yard for the type of pine trees seen in the video. Will be useing a buck saw to cut to length. I Will be butting off the ends of the the trees at the mill before i make post out of them. I hate having The extra mess but its wood and money for me.
As far as the delimbers go we use ours and spread the slash out in the rows left behind after cutting and skidding. I dont like to see a pile of slash no taller than 2 foot or the landowner cant get over in a 4 wheeler. My skidder driver dont like it when i come back through and see a pile left in a row thats to high for my standards and make him go find it and flatten it out.
I have some pics from the last few years in the woods, thought I'd post them and bring this subject back up top
Here's some of a loblolly thinning in central Georgia. My friend Jake moved down there from MN and bought a Ponsse Ergo processor.
I think Loblolly kind off smells like lemon.
Now, here's some from Northern MN where I've been hauling the last couple of winters
This is the Jarden woodyard in Cloquet, my truck being unloaded.
This is my oldest daughter, Kiara, and Ron, one of the loggers I hauled for. About 8 months after this Ron was ran over by this skidder and severely injured, was within an inch of his life. But he pulled through and is back out in the woods again.
This is a TJ 1270 working a black spruce clear cut
I'll get a few more up later
Nice photos! Can you tell us more about Ron's accident with his skidder?
A rock or something had scraped off an inspection cover underneath the machine. Later, a stick made its way through the hole and jammed up a linkage. Ron got out, WITHOUT shutting down the machine, and tried to remove the stick. When he pulled on it, it pulled the machine into gear and it went right over the top of him. Now Ron and his partner, also named Ron, have a time limit of I believe 10 minutes. If you haven't returned to the landing within 10 minutes the other guy comes looking for you. So, Ron went to find Ron and found him laying in a hole and the skidder up against a tree. He was able to call 911, let me tell you they were in the middle of nowhere too. They ended up airlifting him to Duluth, when they were putting him in the chopper he was still responsive but couldn't see because his blood pressure was so low. Partner Ron figured that was the last time he would see him alive. But they got him to the hospital and he made it through that first night, I think they put around 16 pints of blood in him before they finally got the bleeding stopped. His liver had been ruptured, broken pelvis, tore up his colon, in short he was in real bad shape. But by the grace of God Ron made a quick recovery, from being in a cast for his pelvis where he couldn't even get up, to a wheelchair, to a walker, and finally a cane. If I remember right, the accident happened the end of September 08, he was back in the woods (with cane) running his feller/buncher and slasher mid Feb 09, so like 4 1/2 months later. Pretty amazing recovery, considering he had to relearn how to walk and the extent of his injuries. Good lesson to everybody about being in a rush, Ron knew better, he was finishing up a job and looking at getting ready to move equipment etc. I really didn't think he would make it through that first night, I know my family and a lot of others spent a lot of time praying for Ron, just that he would live- we weren't even thinking about walking or working again at that point. The Docs said that if he would of had one thing against his health, smoking for instance, he wouldn't have made it. It was that close. Everytime one of us that know Ron go to do something risky, this incident pops into our heads and we step back and THINK. Sorry this has gotten so long, the moral of my story is be safe, there is nothing so pressing that it means chancing not going home to your family at night.
This ASV has a grapple that was taken off an old pulp loader attached. This set-up was used on the landing to sort and stack.
This is a common view for a wood hauler in Minnesota that Gary C will recognize- sitting in line at Sappi Fine Paper in Cloquet, MN. These trucks are being unloaded into the woodroom, which basically eats the wood as fast as the Liebherr crane can throw it in. It takes a good crane operator about 3 minutes to unload a rail trailer, probably 4 with a bunk trailer.
This is Sappi's Scanlon woodyard, I don't remember how much wood they pile up there in the winter, seems like it was around 10,000 cords, in addition to the Cloquet woodyard, which is probably around the same capacity. The sequence for getting unloaded with the centermount loader is 1. Run the loader straight up in the air, as you see in the pic. 2.When the loader finishes the front half of the trailer, you get out of the truck, reach up for the pedal on the loader that controls your swing and spin the loader around to the back so the crane operator can reach all of the wood. This is because all of your hydraulics etc stick out the back of the operator platform. So you have to spin it around so the crane doesn't risk hitting all of that with their grapple. 3. Say "thank you" on the radio, pull up to the sweepdown area, set the loader down, sweep the trailer off, get in and scale out.
A bucket of wood soaring into the Sappi woodroom. That is about 1 cord of wood in the bucket. Thats all of my pics for tonight, I'll see if I can find more or try to take more of the CTL operation I'm hauling for now.
440 John Deere Cable Skidder Working in Ponderosa Pine & Tending Slash PilesLink Belt 1600 Excavator, Fitted With PATU 410 Processor (Stroke) Working in Ponderosa PinePeterbilt Log Truck Loaded with Ponderosa Pine, Black Hills So. Dak.
I was going to ask if that was in the hills, nice pics. I work with a fella that logged out there for quite a few years- his name is Wally Houtari.
Quote from: barbender on January 02, 2010, 09:25:09 PM
This is a common view for a wood hauler in Minnesota that Gary C will recognize- sitting in line at Sappi Fine Paper in Cloquet, MN. These trucks are being unloaded into the woodroom, which basically eats the wood as fast as the Liebherr crane can throw it in. It takes a good crane operator about 3 minutes to unload a rail trailer, probably 4 with a bunk trailer.
Nice pictures. That scene is not so familiar any more as Sappi has been so stingy with their quota.
But don't you have it backwards? You should be down in Georgia in the winter, not here in the Frozen North. Especially since it's 30 some below zero this morning. :o
Quote from: Bobus2003 on January 03, 2010, 03:15:43 AM
440 John Deere Cable Skidder Working in Ponderosa Pine & Tending Slash Piles
Link Belt 1600 Excavator, Fitted With PATU 410 Processor (Stroke) Working in Ponderosa Pine
Peterbilt Log Truck Loaded with Ponderosa Pine, Black Hills So. Dak.
I didn't know the Black Hills grew such nice timber.
Stonebroke
There is some real nice timber in the black hills, from what I have seen out there. Beautiful country, it has a character all its own. Gary, I'm thinking you have it right , what am I doing up here when it's -30 :o. I just talked to Jake, he said it is cold there too. Only 30°, I reminded him that is 60° warmer than here. :) They have their own struggles down there though, it's been so wet they can't get any wood out.
The Hills have there areas of Really nice wood.. I'm working a 160 Acre tract that hasn't been touched in over 70 years.. and I'm pulling some really dandy wood.. Plus right now the USFS is Pushing alot of sales too try and get ahead of the Pine Beetle outbreak so tracts that wern't too be done for another 5-10 years are getting done now
NewPage in Duluth, MN. You can see the bridge that crosses from MN into WI in the background.
This the best thread on here. Thanks all
Thank you. We appreciate your interest and contributions to the thread. ;)
how do you guys get that frozen pulp to stay on those rail trailers? DOT would just freak out if they saw that here.
They have a piece of square stock about 1/2" by 1/2" welded on top of the main frame rail that kind of bites into the wood, it's actually more secure on top of a rail trailer than a flatbed, because the wood is only touching those two points whereas it can kind of slide across a flatbed. Of course, the crib trailers probably hold the load the most securely, but it ends up being a taller load. You can defineately feel the difference. The other nice thing about a rail trailer is if you start to flip over, the load will just fall off instead of flipping the truck. Or so I've heard :D
Quote from: 240b on January 05, 2010, 09:03:26 PM
how do you guys get that frozen pulp to stay on those rail trailers? DOT would just freak out if they saw that here.
Well, the MNDOT doesn't think they do, and they have ONE picture to prove it. And they trot that same one picture out every chance they get to harass all pulp haulers.
They did make two changes in the new tiedown regulations for crossways haulers (rail trailers) a couple of years ago. One is you have a center hold down for your straps to go over and the other is that you have to uniformly crown the top of each section so the strap touches every log on the top of the load. No more going down the road with a long rail trailer with the straps flapping in the breeze in the center of the load.
That crown on the top is also for multi bunk trailers unless you have front and back barriers to prevent escape of any log. If you do have end gates and the bunks are close together, you do not need tie downs. If you don't have front and back endgates and your loads are being stick scaled, you are destined to be in conflict between your stick scaler who can't measure any higher than the outside log and the DOT that says you have to crown the load and give away the crown to the mill. ;D
Actually I think there has been a change to more bunk trailers and less rail trailers. With a crib trailer you can throw the logs in and go. No more throwing straps.
back when we had 4' wood there was always a few sticks by every big frost heave. everything is long now. 12' to 48' don't miss 4' wood
i remember my pap tellinme that they cut 5' peices and loaded it by hand . started w a bow saw till he go the money for a chainsaw lcs 26 homelite . there one still inteh basement actually .
This is my equipment. I also have a home made farmi style winch but don't have pictures at this time
Gary- the trucks I'm running now are both pulling crib trailers with the end barriers, it is nice not having to chain down.
This is at Savanna Pallets in McGregor, Mn. One of their yard trucks is unloading me.
This is out at the landing on a northern hardwoods harvest- red oak, soft maple, white birch, aspen, and a little basswood. The John Deere forwarder is loading the truck with birch pallet bolts.
Gary, do you ever bring any wood up to savanna?
Here a couple of links to some skidder safety videos. They are kinda old but thought ya'll might enjoy them.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nEleTqx1gSc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YFc4qYgbhhw&feature=channel
Hey Tom,
Boy,wouldn't some of those old shortwood guys with Homelite 55s n bow blades,and a coupla bigsticks like ta get in those rows of loblollys in Barbender's first coupla pics??? Ooooopps,I'll show my age if I ain't kerful
The Amish Cutters are on the job. Schirmer hardwood sale; 1/10
Their transportation to the sale area is parked for the day.
The horse is taken care of and fed during the work day for the trip home.
Do the Amish skid with horses?
Stonebroke
Two amish guys skidd with horses in this area but most have skidders
No, not on this job. They just come to the job in their horse drawn buggy. They have contracted the forwarding with a couple loggers that I referred them to. They are also now carching rides to the job with one of the loggers who picks them up at their mill each morning. Some of the hills on the access road and more snow has been making it a little difficult for their horse and buggy travel.
Is that allowed? Or they just can't own a motorized vehicle?
I don't know for sure, but they are good at catching rides with others. ;)
amish can ride in a vehicle jsut not on sundays. they can run equipment to. the very strtict ones wont jsut jump on the boss has to say u "have to ;) " run that but the ones i work around jsut do what has to be done. acutally an amish bought my dads 440 C but the guy that worked for them " bought " it . he told us that he was jsut helpin this kid buy the skidder and my dad looked at him and said i dont care whos buyin it as long as the moneys in my hand . theres acutally ppl around here that make a living haulin the amish around . the mill i used to cut for has a big computerized sawmill and an ol amish guy ran the headsaw. theyre not as stupid as you might think
the amish here use some power equipment and they never refuse a ride.
Tree Farmer Forwarder C5D. Forwarding oak sawlogs, pulpwood, and firewood for the Amish cutters. Schirmer hardwood sale, 1/10.
nice porter,i owned one like it sweet!! single bunk,barko 40 loader,deutz,23.1/26 tires,very tough reliable machine 8)
Does any one still use mechanical shears? I found a Barko 775a for sale pretty cheap with a shear on it. I talked to the service rep at Barko and he said they are pretty much obsolete, because of the damage they do to the log. How far up the trunk is ruined by one of these sheers?
The amount of damage from a sheer head depends on species, season, temperature, site, yada yada. But I've seen splitting up to 9-10 feet. Remember generally your best log is the butt log, and an inch at the bottom is worth a foot at the top.
Haven't seen any used here for the past 10+ years.
Wouldn't that be a plus for firewood trees?
Stonebroke
It could be if firewood was all that you were producing, but you would not want to devalue your higher valued wood products of grade logs, pulpwood, etc. by damaging or splitting the wood.
Bucking Oak Sawlogs. This young sawyer bucks oak sawlogs which will be forwarded by his father with the Iron Mule. Schirmer hardwood sale, 1/10.
i cut with a jonsered 2171 mostly poplar sawlogs, skid with the tractor(soon to be replaced with a c5 treefarmer) and load with my 110 prentice
i worked for a company for 18 years we used new 860 tigercats tracked machines.and rotine 8 wheel drive porters.good set up.we cut alot of wood.
More Wood Hauler Names noted on the road:
- Shade Tree
- Quick Man
- Road Runner
- Timber Taz
- Low Fat
- Hooter Patrol
Hahn Harvester:
How does that work ? Never seen anything like that before.
Its a whole tree wood processing unit, Has a 5th wheel Pin so it can be towed to the job with a Semi, once there its can move its self around the job... There are a few differnt versions of the above machine:
http://www.hahnmachinery.com/htl300.html
And a Short Wood Version:
http://www.hahnmachinery.com/hsw110C.html
4510 Iron Mule Forwarder, unloading oak sawlogs, pulpwood, and firewood on the landing. Schirmer hardwood sale 1/10.
Woodhauler. Trucking hardwood sawlogs at the end of a winter's day
over 1 1/2 miles of snow covered wood's access road. Schirmer hardwood sale, 1/10.
I think a lot of folks would mess themselves if they got to ride in a woodhauler on some of our woods roads around here. Even a lot of OTR drivers. "You're driving a truck in THERE?!?" They tend to get a little hairy with the icy hills, corners, and tight spots. It's what makes hauling wood interesting though, it gets a little boring cruising down the highway.
The day before, this woodhauler went off the road on the icy curve just beyond where the picture was taken. The driver just missed a large black cherry tree and it was lucky that he only ended up on flat ground in a a red pine plantation of small trees. He was stuck pretty good though and had to call out the skidders for some help. More lost time on the last load at the end of the day.
How about an oops like this?
That's not good. ;) Tell us the story.
I wish I knew what happened, Cause ya don't see that everyday. I'm just glad it wasn't my equipment or sale
Apparently the block layout/planning crew needs to be spoken to...
Quote from: Bobus2003 on June 27, 2010, 08:51:52 PM
How about an oops like this?
It was an accident somewhat similar to this that outlawed leaving open holes from digging for gravel along woods roads here. A Feller Buncher ended up submerged on it's roof after going across an unmarked open pit hole in the winter. If memory serves me right the operator actually drowned.
it looks like he found a creek.
delbert
Quote from: Jamie_C on July 03, 2010, 05:13:00 PM
Quote from: Bobus2003 on June 27, 2010, 08:51:52 PM
How about an oops like this?
It was an accident somewhat similar to this that outlawed leaving open holes from digging for gravel along woods roads here. A Feller Buncher ended up submerged on it's roof after going across an unmarked open pit hole in the winter. If memory serves me right the operator actually drowned.
i have a pic of that somewhere.
Maybe Gary C was driving it :)
HahnHarvesters have been around here for at least 30 years. They usually had 2 operators, 1 for delimbing & 1 for either cutting or shearing. "Piece of advice" I've never seen anyone upgrade after owning one of these. It's kind of like the Ponsse curse. It will either make you rich or destroy you within 2 yrs.
Quote from: barbender on July 09, 2010, 09:45:25 PM
Maybe Gary C was driving it :)
Naw, if it was me, I'd have got all the wheels under water. No sense in going in part way.
Something like this:
Quote from: deutz4 on July 10, 2010, 01:09:24 AM
It's kind of like the Ponsse curse. It will either make you rich or destroy you within 2 yrs.
What's this all about?
Nice parking job, Gary!
Makes it easy to get in and out of :D
Holy crap.. I think ya may have found some thin ice
John Deere 440B Cable Skidder. This small skidder is used to pull tree lengths from steep hill sides and wet areas not accessable by the iron mule forwarder in the short wood harvest operation.
Schirmer hardwood sale, 3/10.
Ow Ron, that was a shock. I wasn't ready for that picture with the white stuff in August and I'll probably see to much of that this winter as I have a lot of jobs to finish by spring.
Don't even want to think about it now. :) :)
With the heat and high humidity here lately, the "white stuff" looks good. At least for the wood's work. ;)
Bring on the frosty mornings :) :)
You can have my share.
New Product. A local Amish sawmill is now cutting red pine into these cants which are sold to a buyer to be cut into fencing slats.
Cedar Stumps. The Amish are very good in wood utilization. These cedar stumps will be used for table basis in there table making shop at their sawmill.
Those are cool Ron, do you know how they get them so clean? Pressure washer maybe?
Yes, they pressure wash them.
The Pettibone 501 Master Mountain Goat Speed Skidder, what a name, eh? Picked it up last winter.
Western Star Wood Hauler. Loading out pulpwood on the single lead only. The "pup trailer" is not being used due the long, sandy, and hilly seasonal access road. Schirmer hardwood sale, 10/10.
1270D Timberjack Harvester. Harvesting Red Pine in the Manistee National Forest, 9/10
That looks like a nice job compared to the ones I get here in MN. This is what I get.
How was your job set up? Row thin, logger select to some DBH, or marked sale? Got any more? :D
Row thinned every 3rd row and selectively marked in between rows to 90-120 sq. ft basal area. This stand was in a real need of thinning. Yes, the Huron-Manistee NF's have a lot of red pine stands like this in need of their first and second thinnings. The Superior and Chippewa NF's in your area should have similar stands. Many are from the successful reforestation efforts of the CCC's.
1010D John Deere Forwarder. The 1010D forwarder supports the 1270D Timberjack processor. Manistee NF red pine harvest, 9/10.
Thank you for the pictures Ron. :)
Talk about some beautiful pine forests. :)
That pile of wood in the last pic has got to be the smallest diameter pile of pine I have ever seen, is that pulp? Looks like its all 3" dia/ or less :o can't kick about utilization of that job, looks like it really did need thinning normal 1st thinning is every other row but that stand couldn't have taken it.
Yes, we try for maximum utilization depending upon markets. The small topwood will go for pulpwood or sold to the Amish for fence posts and specialty products. I suspect that is where their market is for these wood decks.
The stand was in dier need of thinning and the USFS finally got to it. We usually don't do every every other row here, usually every 3rd row with selection removal between rows. Sometimes we will do two rows and leave too rows. We are concerned about preventing wind throw, retaining moisture content within the stand, moving the stand towards quality poles in the second thinning, etc.
That is great if they are able to utilize that small stuff for posts i've never heard of that. All the first thinnings I have ever done in my area have been every other row, 2nd thinnings approx. every other tree all geared toward producing poles. The plantations around here are a lot more mature on the average most were planted by the ccc's and there is a lot of it. The picture I show of the standing wood is just down the road from my house a couple miles I thinned it about 10 years ago and it was 3rd thinning there was some very nice poles. Back in the early 90s' a big mill opened up in northern wi for tree length wood and we thinned a lot of these stands for the 2nd time shipping it tree length. We lost a big chunk of it in a windstorm june of 2007 that is the other picture I show, just down the road from my home. The f-5 tornado went right through the middle of two very expansive areas of this mature pole timber with a path 1 mile wide+. After all the years of watching this be carefully nurtured and managed now I get to see the whole process start over, they haven't begun planting yet but most sites have been cleaned up and prepped for planting everything that was planted anyway.
Back to the Hardwoods. The
4510 Iron Mule Forwarder operator sorts and decks oak pulpwood/firewood and aspen pulpwood at the landing. Schirmer Hardwood Sale, 10/10
Nice looking 'Mule Ron, my brother and I bought a model 4501 (smaller version) from Ison Equip, in Monico Wisc, back in the day, ( I think it was 1982?) we paid about $45K for it back then. The nice thing about the 'mule, is that they were so easy on fuel, ours had the 3 cyl. Perkins, and they could snake around real well for a forwarder.
Mad Murdock ...how'd you end up out West. I grew up about 25 miles from Monico, WI and knew the Ison family. I ran a Iron Mule 5510 I guess it was back in the day ...and a Tree Farmer, and a Franklin... Great place to log. Loved logging in the winter up there.
Northwoods1 .... that picture you posted of the tornado damage, is that by chance up on Hwy 64 between Hwy 55 and Hwy 32? Just curious.
Logdog, I ended up here via the Great Land (Alaska), after kicking around in the Alaskan Bush a few years(Kotzebue, Nome, Aniak, Bethel), my wife and I moved back to the big village (Fairbanks), where she greew up, and when she heard that I had been offered a job in the stataes, she said" why aren't we on our way yet?"!? So in 1997 we moved to Oregon, for the glory of aviation, and one thing after another, we find ourselves on a 40 acre tree farm in the Oregon Coast range, watching these awesome douglas fir grow to the sky, not to mention, it is a pretty good place to raise some young uns' in the ways of the wood. My dad's family moved to Forest Co. from Eastern KY back around 1919, and my Grandad owned and operated as a General merchant, and they had a sawmill Near Nashville, on Co Rd. B. A lot of the folks buried in the old Forest Home cemetary there are my relation. I did most of my logging in Vilas Co. as we grew up near Eagle River. My uncle had the sawmill in Eagle River for decades, until it burned down in the 50's, and the old woodland business there on Hwy 45 where the mill yard was, stayed in operation until it my cousin shut the doors on the place maybe 15 years ago. My Dad had contracts with all of the big timber co's like LP, Thilmany, Champion Intl. Badger Paper, P&G, Mosinee Paper, Menasha Corp, Consolidated etc. etc. As kid I knew alot of the people in the timber industry in that region, and my brothers and I cut our teeth logging at an early age. I guess my dad thought it was a good way to keep 6 boys busy in the summer, peeling popple, and cutting firewood in the late summer, to save on heating bills for the winter.(We used to go throught about a truckload of firewood a season), and we got the express priviledge of cutting, splitting, and stacking it all. It was great character building time for us, we all stayed out of trouble, and at the urging of my dad, none of us stayed in the woods professionally, at least not for too long. But once in the woods, it's hard to boil it out of yer blood, I have always kept a foot in the woods, one way or another, even though my day job involves fixing helicopters. The Northwoods are a great place to be from, my problem is, I have to admit, after chasing the snow from Northern Wisc, and the UP, to Alaska, when we came down to Oregon, and figured out that we didn't have to spend 4 months shoveling it, rather we can watch it run off the front porch most of the time, we kind of got soft, and decided that it is nice to visit the snow, (only an hour away to get to it in the cascades), then when we are done, we can leave it behind, and go home. How the heck did you get to Lousianna? I did some work there for a few weeks out of Abbyville, and Pine Island, when we worked doing seismic support for oil exploration in that area several years back. It was neat visiting, but the swamp never grew on me too much. There is some nice timber in that country though.
Quote from: LOGDOG on October 25, 2010, 10:48:23 PM
Mad Murdock ...how'd you end up out West. I grew up about 25 miles from Monico, WI and knew the Ison family. I ran a Iron Mule 5510 I guess it was back in the day ...and a Tree Farmer, and a Franklin... Great place to log. Loved logging in the winter up there.
Northwoods1 .... that picture you posted of the tornado damage, is that by chance up on Hwy 64 between Hwy 55 and Hwy 32? Just curious.
I haven't sat in an iron mule for a long time, but sure have skidded a lot of wood with them over the years, out of all the different makes I've run I liked the franklins best, hard to get by without the roof mount loader after you get used to having it :). Which direction were you from Monico? Yes that is where that picture of the storm damage was taken. This was about mile 20 of the 40 mile long continuous path. Might be hard for some to make out what there looking at but just in that shot there are tens of thousands of chords of wood down you can see how one big pine area of r.pine plantation is laid down showing the rotation of the tornado. Just a couple miles off the photo to the right there was a large federal sale with a crew working way back off the road cutting the day the tornado went through. It was a 2man/machine mechanized processor crew and they were directly in the middle of the path as the storm went through. The processor operator told me he was cutting and the wind picked up a little bit. Then it got a little windier, then he said all the windows in the machine fogged up almost instantly and the debris started flying he just put his head down between his knees and waited. It was over in less than a minute but imagine how weird it would be to be in a situation like that, way out in the middle of the woods 1 minute and then literally couple minutes later not be able to see a single tree standing for as far as you could see just all downed trees! Talk about timber harvest methods and equipment :D it was like a logging convention around here after that for a good long while. Just in that pic alone there had to be at least 12 different crew working for close to 2 years just cleaning up tipper over wood no standing trees. I worked for over 1 year on just an 80 acre area of Exc+ red oak and large white pine to the upper left in the photo.
Quote from: mad murdock on October 26, 2010, 02:52:30 AM
, my problem is, I have to admit, after chasing the snow from Northern Wisc, and the UP, to Alaska, when we came down to Oregon, and figured out that we didn't have to spend 4 months shoveling it, rather we can watch it run off the front porch most of the time, we kind of got soft, and decided that it is nice to visit the snow, (only an hour away to get to it in the cascades), then when we are done, we can leave it behind, and go home.
You didn't get softer you got smarter :D I just can't hardly take the cold anymore myself. I mean, if it's below zero I ain't going out and cutting wood! Unless its in from a heated cab! Oregon sure sound nice!
MM & Northwoods1 ... A lot of what you described fits my life growing up right down to cutting and splitting the firewood for the winter. I know right where Cty B is in the town of Nashville. I grew up in Pearson which is about 8 miles Southeast. Do you remember a restaurant called "Hill's Still" ... about a mile up the road from there. My folks still live up that way. I don't get back much. I know what you mean about getting soft once you're out of the snow and the cold. It's a rare thing to see snow in our parts down in LA. What brought me here? ...My wife. She's from here. It looks like we have our property sold though so we're looking at our options. Actually looking hard at the NW. I'll be looking for some land to do a 1031 Exchange into so I don't get killed on taxes.
Yep, my Great Grandpa worked in the logging camps down on the Wolf River. He used to have a cabin on the river down by Cty A near what was Michelor's Bar if that rings a bell. I heard the property that the cabin was on recently sold and was disappointed that none of my family had told me about it or done anything to try and buy it. I think I probably would have bought it just for nostalgia if nothing else. It's a great spot on the Wolf River too. Did a lot of trout fishing there over the years.
NW ... I'm with you, those Franklins are Cadillacs with the roof mount loaders. The one I ran was brand spanking new. You know, in the event of a bad storm, sitting in a processor probably isn't a bad place to be... as solid as they're built with thick plexiglass and steel around you. What a show that would be to watch huh? I heard it was ugly though. Lot of big deer up those woods on Hwy 64. ;D
Quote from: LOGDOG on October 26, 2010, 08:24:19 AM
MM & Northwoods1 ... A lot of what you described fits my life growing up right down to cutting and splitting the firewood for the winter. I know right where Cty B is in the town of Nashville. I grew up in Pearson which is about 8 miles Southeast. Do you remember a restaurant called "Hill's Still" ... about a mile up the road from there.
Yep, my Great Grandpa worked in the logging camps down on the Wolf River. He used to have a cabin on the river down by Cty A near what was Michelor's Bar if that rings a bell. I heard the property that the cabin was on recently sold and was disappointed that none of my family had told me about it or done anything to try and buy it. I think I probably would have bought it just for nostalgia if nothing else. It's a great spot on the Wolf River too. Did a lot of trout fishing there over the years.
My family/grandfather worked the camps around here also. They floated a lot of timber down that river I have a collection of vintage photos of that era very neat stuff, the wolf was a very fast river I've got one pic of a big jam down by the Dalles. Pics of the drivers taking bateaus through the dales pretty hairy water! Was up canoeing up near where you mentioned just a couple weeks ago. Put in by Lily. We had a lot of rain last few weeks so river was high(real high for this time of year!). Took my girlfriend who I hadn't canoed with before and was hesitant, but I thought she could handle the water it can get pretty fast in places, what a beautiful trip it was :) ... I live just East of Langlade and I also have a small farm a little further east on the South Branch of the Oconto, very good trout fishing there only 1 fish over 20" and the browns can run a fair amount larger than that!
Hey, this thread is supposed to be timber harvest methods and equipment, not a cheesehead reunion :D
Well Barbender, bringing it back on topic, I know what you all mean about them Franklins, After we ran the tires off that Iron Mule, My brother got tired of fixing the planetaries (It was from constant overloading the machine) on the 4501, he traded up to a 132 pack a back, with the roof mounted hawk loader. That was a sweet skidding machine! Nice cab, tons of power, and a truck loader on top of the cab, a little over 3 skidder loads and you had a truckload out. Production went from an honest 18-20 cord a day to every day a 30 cord day, and more if you were in good wood. We had a JD 450C w/ a Morbark shearhead on it, you could lay down usually 4 truckloads of wood a day with that machine as well. That was about as mechanized as we got. We could've gotten bigger, but eventually we all went the way of the 4 winds, and the rest as they say is "history". There sure are some nice machines out there now for woods work, I just wonder how a guy can afford them with wood prices the way they are. Makes the old iron worth alot more today in my book, you don't have to spend your whole day working for the bank.
I'm just ribbing you guys, I enjoy hearing about your experiences in the north woods.
i figured as much B B :D Did have some good times "growing up under a tree", as my wife tells my kids, "your dad was born under a tree"! "and raised by his'self". As far as timber harvest methods go though, I do like the way they do things in this country, cutting longer lengths, and hauling them that way to the mill. Makes for better production at the end of the day for sure.
Northwoods ... I'd love to see those river pics with them floating the logs down the river if you ever get the chance to scan them. Sometimes I think I was born in the wrong era. Then again, those guys were tough scrappers and I probably couldn't have cut it.
I've caught many a trout out of the Wolf River. Never fished the Oconto, although I've heard it's good.
You guys feel free to stay in touch via PM that way we're not hijacking the thread. ;D
MM ...did that 450C you ran the shear head on have a front end loader that allowed you to get some lift on it and tilt the sheer head? I remember we used to run a shear head on a Case 1150 with the front end loader. Used the grapple skidder to forward it up to the slasher if we were in pine.
I don't know how they get the numbers to work on the new machines either. Volume is the ticket I guess. So long as you have the contracts and the wood to fill them and can stay working the payments get made. Working in the woods taught me real quick that I needed to get book smart sooner than later and pursue something else for my primary income. That said, my heart's still in the woods. Always will be.
Go ahead and hijack, I'm enjoying all this except that I've never got to fish trout over in Wisconsin so I'm getting a little jealous ::) Pics of large trout hooked on beautiful rivers are always welcome, too!
Quote from: LOGDOG on October 26, 2010, 10:13:42 PM
MM ...did that 450C you ran the shear head on have a front end loader that allowed you to get some lift on it and tilt the sheer head? I remember we used to run a shear head on a Case 1150 with the front end loader. Used the grapple skidder to forward it up to the slasher if we were in pine.
LogDog, that is what it was, had a 4 in 1 bucket that would interchange with the shear head. It made a pretty stable snipper, though not near as fast as a rubber tire machine (Hydro-Ax), but it was pretty versitile, being able to have the use of the bucket now and again. There was an old guy in Ashland way back in the day, who had an old WWII sherman tank modified with a shear head that he used in the woods for years.
The
440B John Deere Cable Skidder is used to pull tree lengths off the steep slope areas to be cut into product lenghts for pick up by the Iron Mule forwarder.
Schirmer Hardwood sale 10/10.
That looks like a really well maintained 440. Nice machine.
Yes, this operator takes excellent care of his equipment. He owns the Iron Mule also. He had two Iron mules, both in great shape, but sold one of them.
i would like to have a 5510 iron mule
85 pages and still going strong! I've been reading and following this thread and I find it very interesting and informative. I'm learning a lot about the machines that are used on a daily bases in the forestry industry.
I would like to say a big thanks to Ron and others for keeping this thread going and posting all the pics. :) :)
I'm slowly working my way through this thread-- about 10 pages a night. Wow.
Timberline 3800 Boom Delimber w/leveling Cab Working Ponderosa Pine, Black Hills SD
Quote from: Okrafarmer on October 31, 2010, 01:45:19 PM
Quote from: sawguy21 on October 31, 2010, 01:26:10 PM
:o We wouldn't be allowed in the bush in those conditions.
That looks normal for Maine. The land heals itself. These are the conditions skidders are built for. If they didn't have to contend with these conditions, they would look a lot tamer.
How forestry equipment is designed and built and what conditions it can operate under, and managing/harvesting timber land in a sustainable manner are two different things. Just because a skidder can drive through wet ground up to the axles making ruts 2' deep with #20,000 of wood on its back is no excuse or justification for doing it. Acceptable damage standards on logging jobs varies everywhere. Up here loggers have to operate under guidlines... BMPs, or best management practices in order to have contracts with many mills. Loggers are required to have training on the hows and whys of BMPs'. True enough the land heals itself but that is still not justification for damaging it unnecessarily. That is why we have people who are foresters who determine the best way to prevent damage to land/timber and promote things like management of timber, protecting watersheds, improving land for recreation or wildlife habitat. How they go about harvesting the swamps of the southern U.S. really can't be compared to how forests are managed in other parts of the country.
Quote from: treefarmer87 on October 31, 2010, 02:38:25 PM
heres the cutter
What the ?????? , do you have any info on these pics like who, what where, when? I've never seen or heard anything about a machine like you showing and the pics look like there taken somewhere right up by me, I wonder what year?
Quote from: Okrafarmer on November 01, 2010, 08:27:28 AM
You're absolutely right. It's all about what's acceptable for the given circumstances. The free market means that if there is a demand for lighter impact logging, it will be supplied by the loggers.
No not really that is not what I was saying. What constitutes sustainable forestry managment practices has nothing to do with the free market or what loggers or landowners want. If a landowner wants to ruin there land through unwise timber harvesting method, maybe to make a buck, that does not make it acceptable or sustainable forestry. The entire challenge of sustainable forestry practices, the way I see it, is to figure out how to be able to incorporate them and still be able to make $$ in the free market not the other way around :)
Quote from: treefarmer87 on November 01, 2010, 08:58:34 AM
its in michigan in the 60s try this http://www.heavyequipmentforums.com/showthread.php?t=12720
I find that to be some very interesting equipment :) , this was such an innovative time up here in the forest products industry people were just beginning to figure out the potential of mechanization. My neighbor has sitting in his shed the very 1st Timbco ever made and that was right around the time Case was experimenting with a shear head on a tracked excavator. I really can't believe how far it has come since then, that 1st timbco spawned todays timber pro machines. I can remember when they first got that machine up and running and cutting on some of there large sales here, they really thought they were on to something :o and they were!
Quote from: thecfarm on November 01, 2010, 09:23:34 AM
I know of one guy that guy fined for cutting in a brook like that back in the 80's.I remember reading about it in the paper.Still see some butcher jobs around,or at least in my eyes.I've been told before that I'm to fussy with my woodlot. ::) Most jobs are very well done.Even back in the 80's and 90's too.There are still are few around that will holler,"Well you got to get the wood out" A nice,neat job can be done without destroying the land the tress grow on.Just takes more time to do it.And of course time is money.
I saw a very sad situation this past summer. Long time friend of mine called me and said he was having 40 acres of timber land logged which was located up near Florence WI. He is an absentee landowner and lives 300 or so miles away. He got a forester from up in the U.P. to set up and administrate the job. He called me because he was concerned about the cords coming up short it had been estimated at 1300 cords total aspen. When I got out to the job I couldn't beleive what I saw. =To access the timber the logger had tried to cross a black ash swamp by laying down timber mats for 150 yards, (totally unnecessary he could have went around this swamp if he would have walked the job and looked for the path of least resistance) The mats were all floating there and they had things royally screwed up. The job should have been a winter only job and they came in and started april of the wettest year on record here. They had things so rutted up I have never seen anything like it before in all my years of logging. To top it off they had all the timber cut, the wettest area skidded and totally rutted, trails up hills with springs running out of the ground right down 2' deep ruts, and a small creek only 150 yards away the whole 40 acres wide running in to a large creek just off the propery line. All the soil was washing off the hills down in to the creek. And they ended up pulling out because it was too wet and leaving 70% of the wood to be skidded all of it cut. I got on the phone with the forester and I found that he hadn't even been out to the job since marking the property lines even though he had told my friend he had been and was monitoring things. My friend had not received any money down, which the contract stated he would have, and that they would not haul anything from the job without it being payed for, which they had done. I simply told him things better be corrected and in a hurry. The contract had only a $1000 performance bond which wouldn't nearly cover repair of the damage they had done or how much they devalued the land. My friend is still working things out on that job. I take a lot of pride in doing a nice neat job. Staying out of the mud and not doing that kind of damage is a matter of sheduling jobs correctly for conditions.
That's one of the few Ponsse Fox's in the states there Ron, isn't it? Ponsse just had one up here demoing it.
Ya gotta have lots of lights and run those Ponsee's 20 hours a day just to make the payments on them :-\
This actually was a Ponsee demonstration. Ponsee bought the lowland timber sale so as to have their own demonstration area and operator/service training for their machines. They were giving this demonstration at a Michigan SAF meeting.
The machine with tracks works very well in lowland areas. Yes, at a "1/2 million $ purchase price", they have to run constantly. There was a logger coming to look at it for possible purchase however. Ponsee's are starting to get popular here over some of the other historical brands.
Quote from: Corley5 on November 07, 2010, 09:18:43 AM
Ya gotta have lots of lights and run those Ponsee's 20 hours a day just to make the payments on them :-\
I think I'll pass for now, my mama warned me not to get caught up in any ponsee schemes.
Ponsee Fox Harvester. Harvesting spruce pulpwood in a lowland area, Grayling, MI 11/10. It is powered by a quiet Mercedes Benz 4 cylinder engine.
thats $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ high dollar
Wonder how it'd perform/hold up in gnarly, knotty northern hardwood ??? :-\ :)
i have a 150 keto on a valmet. you be surprised at the hardwood it will limb. a 3" limb dosent even slow it down...4" back up an hit it a couple times
do the processors break down much?
its been pretty good. did buy a reman computer for it. 2500 bucks and it comes with a dent in the screen screws missing and the battery is flat. but it dose work fine for 2 months then throws code short cirkit-cable bk. call the dis. in quebec says he will look into it . that was in june....2 weeks ago i hear from him "the display is fine must be somethind else"..........anybody on here ever deal with quadco???
Quote from: treefarmer87 on November 08, 2010, 07:55:02 PM
do the processors break down much?
I know many guys UP here break the feed wheels often trying to ram large hardwoods through to delimb them. Often times in the process they chew the logs up (which can knock them down in scale and grade) and where the limbs are sheared off it can cause fiber pull and such .
Quote from: treefarmer87 on November 08, 2010, 07:55:02 PM
do the processors break down much?
My Patu 410 Has tendancy to Shake the Processor Board loose after 30-40hrs or limbing (Stroke) so it has a bit of abuse thrown at it..
keto dose not use feed wheels. it has tracks there are times they will slip. most of the time they dont. there are lots of vids of them on youtube
A well trained operator is certainly needed in these high priced technical machines.
Do processors break down a lot? Yes, but it depends on the abuse they recieve. You can't take someone that is used to hammering through the woods in a skidder and just throw them in a CTL machine, they will destroy it in short order. But even with a good operator that doesn't abuse the machine, they are high maintainence machines.
.
I found some short film clips of some classic forwarders on Youtube.
Stornalle was considered a great forwarder back in the days. They still have a great reputation for being able to work in rocky terrain where everything else gets stuck.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MqNd-SUhhZM&feature=related
Skogsboxer was a common logging tractor back then. They are still sought after in Sweden.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xp97W0QPvpI
Both were based on the strongly built Volvo BM 350 farm tractors. The motor was a three cylinder slow running thing giving about 60hp. They were manufactured in the 1960-ies.
I like the throaty sound those tractors have. Reminds me of my little John Deere 450C when he's under load. Pretty backdrop with all the snow too.
The
Ponsee Fox Harvester makes it turn on the lowland cutting strip. 11/10
Ponsee Fox Harvester, H6 Harvester Head
A Ponsse Sales Rep points out the features of the Ponsse H6 harvester head.
The Ponsse H6 Harvester Head has a cutting diameter of 25 inches.
just a moment - I ll try again soon
that is a cool harvester
Tree Farmers were manufactured by CanCar. My C4D forwarder which is newer than an 1986 has CanCar on the ID plate.
i just finished reading all 87 pages of this great thread. heres a pic of my dads tractor we use to load logs.
It is often asked if the chains should be put on the front or the back tires. Here the chains are being put on the front tires of the
440B JD Cable skidder. Schirmer hardwood sale, 3/10.
nice skidder
I do love those little 440's
I like having the front chained up if only one set is available, why does he not have the sid ecovers on the engin , where they off to check a few things , I would never take to the bush with out them in place , there is just too much to go wrong with a limb going in there :o :o It sure don't take long for a limb to find the chain and climb into the pump ::) :o :-X
He must have taken the side covers off while putting the chains on for some reason. This guy is very particular and careful with his equipment so he wouldn't run without them. ;)
My 440 Doesn't have factory Engine Covers.. I have a Home-made set, but they tend to make it over-heat.. Did the 440 have Engine covers from the factory? I have never seen one with them
Bobus2003
As far as I know they did.
I saw that the machine was really clean and not abused from the pics, one reason for asking, for a machine that old it sure stands proud. :)
Quote from: Bobus2003 on November 29, 2010, 09:59:59 PM
My 440 Doesn't have factory Engine Covers.. I have a Home-made set, but they tend to make it over-heat.. Did the 440 have Engine covers from the factory? I have never seen one with them
if for some reason you have a pusher fan you must have the side covers with the holes in them. some of the b's had pusher fans.
The owners manual lists side covers as an option.
My skidder did not have side covers when I got it but it had the hinges. I once had a limb break off the oil pressure sending unit. I saw what I thought was a black thread coming out of the engine and going up toward the sky. A couple of seconds later I realized what it was and I shut down the skidder. I did not damage the engine but I had to spend the rest of the day bagging black snow to clean up all of the oil. I lost about 3/4 of a gallon of oil in a few seconds. I now have side covers.
Quote from: snowstorm on November 30, 2010, 06:22:31 AM
Quote from: Bobus2003 on November 29, 2010, 09:59:59 PM
My 440 Doesn't have factory Engine Covers.. I have a Home-made set, but they tend to make it over-heat.. Did the 440 have Engine covers from the factory? I have never seen one with them
if for some reason you have a pusher fan you must have the side covers with the holes in them. some of the b's had pusher fans.
I Actually have both, Pusher and Puller fans for my 440.. My dad used to change the fans for winter/summer use.. The side Covers i have have holes, but maybe just not enough holes or maybe they need to be bigger.. :-\
Other photos of this machine in the thread shows a black engine cover.
I sure liked those fans that had the blades that you could adjust to suck or blow, depending on the season. Just reach in, push down and twist the blades to whichever position you wanted.
I like this thread to stay near the top, so I'll throw up a pic of my equipment on a little clearing job I did.
That's a nice Minnesota winter picture. Too bad we all have to switch to our black and white cameras in the winter. It's the law you know. :D :D
i like this thread also. it is neat to see all the logging equipment.
this is my unloader at the mill. pc
here's how i get to where i m logging at.
this picture was at the end of a day of logging black walnut at the silvey farm, seneca, mo. pc
Quote from: Gary_C on December 13, 2010, 04:04:39 PM
That's a nice Minnesota winter picture. Too bad we all have to switch to our black and white cameras in the winter. It's the law you know. :D :D
Gary, that's a color picture, it's just a black and white day :: :)
i like your truck paul case :)
it kinda reminds me of banjo pickers and his kinda reminds me of yours! ;D ;D pc
Some more woodhauler truck names noted.
`Chip
`Steady Teddy
`Husky's Headache
`I Love My Money
`Hoodlum
`Road Runner
`The Ripper
`Money Pit
`Late For Dinner
`Big Ben
Quote from: Ron Scott on December 23, 2010, 09:38:23 AM
Some more woodhauler truck names noted.
`Chip
`Steady Teddy
`Husky's Headache
`I Love My Money
`Hoodlum
`Road Runner
`The Ripper
`Money Pit
`Late For Dinner
`Big Ben
- dog & pup - a neighbors Mack
- the old warhorse - another neighbors International
Quote from: northwoods1 on December 23, 2010, 10:16:17 AM
Quote from: Ron Scott on December 23, 2010, 09:38:23 AM
Some more woodhauler truck names noted.
`Chip
`Steady Teddy
`Husky's Headache
`I Love My Money
`Hoodlum
`Road Runner
`The Ripper
`Money Pit
`Late For Dinner
`Big Ben
- dog & pup - a neighbors Mack
- the old warhorse - another neighbors International
I recall seeing quite a few different names when I was a scaler at the mill. The only one that I recall, and northwoods1 is probably familiar with, is "The Hairlip Duck", which naturally calls out "Mac, Mac" instead of "Quack, quack".
Clark
I remember 'Old Snort' an International with a 6-53. Never any question who was coming down the hill above the house. Jim is retired now and kinda hard of hearing. :D
Amish Horse Logging. With the recent heavy snows and the delay of their contracted producer getting back to work after the firearm deer season and the recent heavy snows, the Amish brought their team of Belgem work horses in to the job to do the skidding in the interim and to keep things moving in the woods.
They are also waiting for the access road to get all plowed out for trucking. They are working 1 1/2 miles back in from a seasonal access road and one of their truckers refuses to haul until conditions get better. Hopefully all will get back to normal soon.
Schirmer hardwood sale, 12/10.
Neat pics, Ron
Wow Ron,
I always enjoy your pictures but seeing those two animals working is great don't see much of that around here.
Matt
Those are great pictures, hope you get a chance to take some more :)
We have lots of Amish up around these parts and it never ceases to amaze me how expert they are with horses. I was married to a large animal veterinarian for many years and got a chance to visit many farms it was something I always looked forward too :)
paul, how are your standards attached to your flatbed?
fiat AD 10 dozer, 110hp, 12 ton
fiat 415c crawler, 45hp
fiat 480 4wd tractor, 55hp.
Quote from: timberfaller390 on December 31, 2010, 10:41:08 PM
paul, how are your standards attached to your flatbed?
just bolted down thru the 1/8'' steel floor with 2- 1/2'' bolts each bunk.those bunks are 4'' tube uprights sandwiched at the bottom by 2 pieces of 3/8''x4x4 angle iron. they would almost stand alone. i always bind loads of logs all the way to the truck frame. i made the bunks this way so i could drop them off and use the truck to pull a gooseneck trailer. i thought i might have trouble with the bolt holes ripping out but i have hauled logs on that truck that way for 10 years or more and no troubles. the average load of 10' logs on my truck scales out about 500 to 600 ft. pc
I have basically the same setup. My bunks look like yours but fit down in the stake pockets.
Thanks Ron for posting the pics of the Amish boys skidding with the team. Do they fell and buck the timber as well? Do they do that with axe and misery whip? or do they use mechanized help (chainsaw)? When I was 13, I worked with a logger who skidded with a horse, myabe I mused on that in another post. That horse could drag out about 6 cord of wood a day, working him for 6 hours or so, giving him breaks every 1-1/2 to 2 hours. Good hayburners are a real asset in the woods.
Quote from: mad murdock on January 01, 2011, 11:29:33 PM
Thanks Ron for posting the pics of the Amish boys skidding with the team. Do they fell and buck the timber as well? Do they do that with axe and misery whip? or do they use mechanized help (chainsaw)? When I was 13, I worked with a logger who skidded with a horse, myabe I mused on that in another post. That horse could drag out about 6 cord of wood a day, working him for 6 hours or so, giving him breaks every 1-1/2 to 2 hours. Good hayburners are a real asset in the woods.
I'd like to see more pics of anyone logging with horses I find that really interesting. There are a few people still doing it around these parts. Down the road from me just a little ways the U.S. forest service had a black of jackpine they wanted clear cut. But the understory was beautiful hardwood, mostly all oak. I don't know why that stuff comes up so good under jackpine must be the right amount of shade. But they specified it had to be horse logged to save the understory and did they ever do a nice job. That is the only time I have ever heard of a federal job requiring horse logging but it was the perfect thing in that situation :)
The Amish horse loggers delimb the tree and then horse skid it tree length to the landing where they buck it up with a chainsaw. They then sort and deck the sawlogs and pulpwood on the landing with a their skid steer. They use mechanized equipment for work but personal travel is by horse unless thy can hitch a vehicle ride with someone, which they are good at. :D
They also want to get back to mechanized skidding and forwarding again as they are complaining that the horse skidding is too slow. ;) I don't mind though as long as they do good work.
The Amish are using the 576 XP Husky chainsaw on this job.
is it common practice for that area, to snake logs out with cable skidders ,or is the prefered method forwarders, I always thought a small skidder, with a good operator would be the best ,{other than horses} I also realise that the cable skidder, is only as good as its operator, I have been watching some U tube clips, of skidder operators its amazing some of these people call themselves operators :o
Most of our selective hardwood thinnings are done with small forwarders with a cable skidder allowed to pull tree lengths off hill sides and from wet areas where the forwarders can't access. These are cut to length jobs where the product is cut at the stump.
Cable and grapple skidders are allowed on clear cut jobs and pine row thinnings with selection between rows. It all depends upon the objectives of the harvest and the operating plan what tree removal method is allowed is permitted.
"Poor operators" are not allowed to continue working on any job, they are soon replaced. ;)
thanks ron , around here it is very hilly .to downright rough, all cable skidding there are people that can"t even stand to watch us work, :o goodday
Very nice! I'm a big fan of the Kubota compact excavators. 8)
I just sold a job yesterday of mixed aspen, hardwoods, and pine which has the objectives to improve the area for deer and grouse. This a selective harvest of the hardwoods and pine with total removal of the aspen which covers a good part of the area.
This job will be a highly mechanized job allowing tree length skidding with grapples, hot saw felling, slasher, chipping, etc.
I'll post some photos of activities in a few weeks once the job gets going.
Amish Cutter looks over the situation before falling the marked red oak tree. Schirmer hardwood thinning, 11/10.
He's taken his escape route and watches as the tree falls.
Quote from: NB sawdust on January 03, 2011, 10:28:49 PM
Thought I would post a few pics of what we have been up to around here .This is some of the equipment at work . Two man operation ,myself and the owner .We geared up the patu harvester on a 161 kubota excavator, and I must say it is a great rig! Small but mighty....beats a power saw for production in medium to small timber... and it's warm in there!!!Harvested this nice stand of spruce in the pics below... dropped every tree and ctl with no issue at all. The forwarder is/was a c4 can car/tree farmer that has been converted to a single bunk forwarder.More to come later......
Couldn't agree more on the Patu head on a small machine.. I love my Patu 410SH on my 1600 Link Belt
Aspen Pulpwood. Awaiting pick up by the Iron Mule forwarder. Schirmer hardwood sale, 11/10.
The aspen pulpwood is picked up by the Iron Mule forwarder for transport to the landing. Schirmer hardwood sale, 11/10.
The
Western Star Woodhauler arrives at the landing to take out a load of aspen pulpwood. Only a single lead is used with no pup due to the long and difficult access road with steep hills to climb in and out of the timber harvest area. Schirmer hardwood sale, 11/10.
Quote from: Ron Scott on January 17, 2011, 09:00:13 PM
The aspen pulpwood is picked up by the Iron Mule forwarder for transport to the landing. Schirmer hardwood sale, 11/10.
That sure looks like a nice woodlot. So much regeneration in there. Really looks like it has been well managed.
It's a very nice property, 585 acres with 3 private lakes and a landowner's cabin. We have been working the entire area. Proper timber management has greatly improved it and the landowner is well pleased.
The Western Star leaves the landing with a load of aspen pulpwood, Schirmer hardwood sale, 11/10.
Jan 2009
2004 John Deere 990 with 430 loader and 351 farmi winch. my father and i were working together. mostly he would cut and i would skid. the skidding was the slow step of the operation and i could move the tractor faster and make it pull more. i was probly a little harder on it, but i just used it to its potential, didnt thrash on it.
typically we would punch a road the the back of a woodlot and work towards the front. that way we were falling trees into the open and didnt have to run over the brush. important when you have ag tires and no belly pan. i did once have to replace the fan cause a stick got in the engine compartment. plastic fans dont make good chippers, FYI.
Question for Ron Scott and others
What is typical daily production for a small iron mule? Will it load a trailer with stakes?
Quote from: Rick Alger on January 28, 2011, 09:08:58 AM
Question for Ron Scott and others
What is typical daily production for a small iron mule? Will it load a trailer with stakes?
I will start with the easy one. Loading a trailer.
Yes you can load a high bunk trailer with one. But it will give a kink in the neck as the seat doesn't swivel far enough to give a good view of the loader or the pile based on which side you have it on. And you need to be real close to the trailer as the reach is limited at that height. Leaving you almost working blind on the far side. And again this varies by model as some of the later Mules had more reach. But I don't know of any that the seat turned all the way to face the loader.
A lot of variables in production. Terrain is a big one.
Mules haul between 1.5 and 3 pulp cords depending on the model and bunk configuration. Takes around 15 to 45 minutes to load and unload plus travel time. Big difference in times if loading behind a buncher or a hand crew and saw logs to pulp.
Ron, do you guys always still have green leaves in november? ???
Rick,
Pretty much what Reddog stated on the Iron Mule's production and truck loading. The Mule usually just decks the wood at the landing and the self loader trucks load themselves more efficiently while the Mule keeps on forwarding to the landing/decking area.
Barbender,
This was an odd November. No real cold temperatures or snow until December. A lot of tree leaves stayed green and on the trees longer than usual. Not the norm, however.
Oh wow! I thought you posted the wrong date, I was being a little bit of a smart aleck :) I don't think I've ever seen green leaves up here past mid October.
Reddog and Ron,
Thanks for the info.
It's a long truck haul out. Several landing/decking areas are set up along this 1 1/2 mile two track access road which will now need to be plowed out again after last nights heavy snow storm. Schirmer Hardwoods Sale, 11/10.
have i said....
thanks for this thread? i really enjoy all the pics
a big thank you .. pc
Your thanks is appreciated. I like it when others post their methods and equipment here as well.
Neat pictures Ron. :)
Beautifal country too.
A short video of a plantation pine second thinning in north central Louisiana. These trees are all volunteer in what 20 years ago was a pasture. It all went for pulp. Deere feller buncher, deere grapple skidder,(never seen a cable skidder in this part of the country) 2 prentice knucklebooms loaders, one with a slasher/de-limber, 2 double bunk log trucks.
All operated by the owners and families, 4th generation loggers.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oxvGz1lAWbM
nice vid, that prentice is a nice machine 8)
Neat vid thanks.
Is that SYP and what do they use the pulp for?
Norm, yeah that's loblolly aka syp. Goes to the local paper mill. We have over 100 acres of timber that size. Hopefully next cutting will be some sawlogs. Right now, pulp pays better, nobody wants to pay anything for sawlogs.
Piney, are there large patches of pine forest getting eaten by the beetles, or is it patchy? I would guess with the hurricanes of late years and them beetles marching in, it has put a glut on the pine log market. Same as in BC, a lot goes to China now. And the pine logs probably degrade fairly quick with stain, maybe the sawmills are not too wild over denim pine.
Just guesses from afar way up north. ;)
SD the beetle population has about run it's course. Seldom see any beetle killed pine any more. Most of the katrina and Rita logs have been turned into lumber by small bandmill operators. The big mills have never bought logs from a dead tree. What has killed the log market here is a total collapse of the housing industry. Plus our state legislature enacted very restrictive building codes statewide after katrina. Big commercial mills are either shut down or only running 2 or 3 shifts a week. The small one or 2 man bandmill operations are thriving, but it's all specialty stuff, species the big guys don't want, barn boards, beams, extra long stuff, blocking, pallets etc.
Piney, yes I see. The industry is hurting all over.
really good pics! nice c4.
Corley
Thats one dang tidy looking TF Forwarder you have there ;) ;D 8) 8) what year is it Mate ???
Regards Chris
A former TF dealer told me it was an 86 or newer or newer than an 86. I forget which ;D I sent an an e-mail to Franklin/Tree Farmer with the serial # asking what year it is and never heard back from them. I assume it's one of the last true Tree Farmers before the Franklin takeover/merger.
franklin is actually out of business.
i think they went out in 2006 :'(
I heard that they stopped production but didn't actually go out of business ??? Website still looks good :) But no one answers e-mails :-\
http://www.franklin-treefarmer.com/index.htm
What an interesting read! Took me days to get through. :P
Ron, by any chance, did you take close up's of the log arch used by the amish horse loggers?
Thanks. Venice
At present, I don't have any close up photos of the Amish horse arch other than what have been pictured. I may be able to get some in a week or so when I check the job again or when i'm at their mill. The horses have been moved off the job now since all the wood has been cut and they only have hauling to do.
Red Oak Sawlogs & Pulpwood. Cut to length products wait to be forwarded to the landing. Schirmer hardwood sale, 11/10.
Note the
split sawlog. A good log can be damaged during falling and bucking. Falling this tree across the two track road and its uneven ground caused the sawlog to split and lose of value when cut to length. In this case, the mill owner's son split the log so it was taken to the mill for a salvage cut.
4835 STX SkidSteer. The Amish use one of their skid steers to work the landing/decking area and sort their wood products for hauling. Schirmer hardwood sale, 12/10.
cut some walnut today and got another photo of the truck and trailer.
pc
Quote from: Ron Scott on February 21, 2011, 09:01:12 PM
Note the split sawlog. A good log can be damaged during falling and bucking. Falling this tree across the two track road and its uneven ground caused the sawlog to split and lose of value when cut to length. In this case, the mill owner's son split the log so it was taken to the mill for a salvage cut.
I don't think it split because he dropped it across the road, but when he bucked that log off one end was resting on the ground and the weight of the tree was being supported by it. Then it looks like he made a small cut into the top of the log down to the depth of the split and then began sawing up from underneath and he did not cut fast enough which caused the log to split. With red oak like that you need a big saw to be able to power through the log and not give it a chance to split. Another way to prevent that is to ring the tree and cut down into the log a couple inches all the way around before you begin making the up cut that will help immensely but you may still get some pull out if you saw is not powerful enough.
Quote from: paul case on March 11, 2011, 10:38:20 PM
cut some walnut today and got another photo of the truck and trailer.
pc
Nice looking logs Paul :) you going to saw those up yourself?
Judging from the first picture you have no rear suspension travel :D
not sawing these myself. they will be sold in a semi truck load lot.
the right rear suspension is mashed down to the block or almost. it seems a little more soft than the left side,but has no broken leaves or anything else that i can see. it does come back about 6'' to 8'' when empty. pc
i like the log body,toolbox and head gate on that truck, nice logs too :)
those log bunks are stout. i cut them off a log bed that was on that truck when i bought it. they are 4'' sq tube 3/8'' wall uprights sandwiched between 2- 4'' angles 3/8'' thick. the bunks will come off by just taking 4 bolts out and it has a 10' steel flatbed with a gooseneck hitch. the front rack is 2x2 tube with 1/2'' rod across it. i have laid big logs on it by accident and it dont give a bit. the toolbox i bought at auction for $5. my 660 w/ 25'' bar will fit in it. its pretty handy.
i kinda think you can build it heavy enough that it wont break or bend out of shape, or you can do it light and redo it and redo it. build it to last a lifetime or spend your lifetime fixing it. pc
you are exactly right, you wont ever have to worry about it
Nice looking ash. I had a whole acre of mature black ash that the beavers flooded after surrounding stands were harvested. I wouldn't say they were all as nice as those, but they had some decent sizes up to 14" inches or so. These would be not real old, but at least 80 years old because a fire went through about 1908. Found some charcoal in cedar stumps in the area and grandmother knew it burned when she was young, born 1900. The areal view of my woodlot shows them still alive back in 2000.
Beavers kill a lot of ash around here too. It seems that flooded stuff usually has the bark fall off of it, and then it will stand there for a long time. I love getting that stuff for firewood, it's nice and dry and so hard you can feel every chainsaw tooth hit it. In a regular ash stand, when a tree dies the bark stays on and it rots right away. Donk, this stand looked to be about 70 years old, there where big burned Cedar stumps throughout the stand here too.
nice logs, there isnt much ash around here. if you run across it they dont give you much money for it
We can get a good dollar from the flooring plant and from the tool handle plant.
saw this @ the local tire shop today getting a new set of 30.5s
they do exist, or is that bobby goodson's? pc
there is a guy here that has a all chipping operation named ricky allen. i think its either his or tapscott bros logging. i believe he bought it in NC.
Doesn't look like its been used for a little bit judging by the rust on the Clam
I saw it sitting next to a large tract of small pine on my way to augusta lumber co. it says 640C on the front panels. then the next day it was @ the tire shop, they are putting 4 new ones on the back :o$$$. wonder how much the machine cost?
Nice! :)
Dave, how do you rank? ;) :D
nice job! good pics
I agree- Very nice looking work!
nice work and some nice looking logs too. makes me a little jealous. sometimes here we cant find a straight tree. pc
Ran a skidder today :D No witnesses thank goodness. I had no idea, still don't I'm sure! Timberjack 480B with a hydraulic grapple. I left a trail of trees that I could follow all the way back to the place I picked em up. Never piloted anything articulated, could not see what I was carrying and did not realize that you have to keep tightening the grapple as the load rolls around in there. I have always thought that the back end of an ambulance was a rough ride... nope, smooth as silk. I was driving on real nice smooth frozen ground and thought the seatbelt was going to pull me in half.
Skidder operators have my utmost respect.
sawdust
Quote from: sawdust on April 04, 2011, 11:49:43 PM
Ran a skidder today :D No witnesses thank goodness. I had no idea, still don't I'm sure! Timberjack 480B with a hydraulic grapple. I left a trail of trees that I could follow all the way back to the place I picked em up. sawdust
That doesn't make the forester happy. ;)
The one grapple machine I ran for but a few minutes had a detent on the grapple control that applies a small amount of hydraulic pressure to the the grapple so that you don't have to hold it or constantly squeeze the grapple. I think most of them are set up that way.
John Deere 548D Grapple Skidder. Schirmer hardwood sale, 1/11.
The Amish logging crew take a lunch break around the fire with the skidder parked to break the wind.
Interesting Idea with the tire on the grapple..
FMC Track Skidder (Cable Type)
Yes i to like the tire idea. Might have to try that one. Grapple skidders are all ive ever run. Prob why my pants size are a little to big now days.
nice FMC bobus2003 8) i have seen a couple skidders with the tire like that. what is it for?
Quote from: treefarmer87 on April 11, 2011, 06:52:44 PM
nice FMC bobus2003 8) i have seen a couple skidders with the tire like that. what is it for?
to keep the graple from banging headed in empty
thats a good idea, saves wear n' tear
Its alot cheaper than putting brake pads in. Always old tires laying around
Bobus2003, where is the FMC working?
Quote from: woodtroll on April 14, 2011, 03:08:20 PM
Bobus2003, where is the FMC working?
We've got it 13 miles south of Deadwood on Killoern Springs Rd
I will need to swing up that way and check it out.
Is it on a Fed job?
Yea its on Fed Land.. Hopin for some warm weather so we can start pullin wood again..
The Amish use one of their skidsteers to sort and deck products at the landing. Schirmer hardwood sale, 1/11.
I like the pictures, do the amish have there own mill ? I grew up just east of there, I know alot of the amish from northern mi. , figured I might even know who these folks are , some of the younger ones I don't know but might know there parents its been about 20 years since I moved out of the area but we still go back every year or so northern mi. is a beutiful place 8)
Yes, they own their own Sawmill and a table factory.
Tree Length Logging. The Amish loggers tree length oak to the landing with a grapple skidder that they rented to finish the job after their contracted producer failed to finish the job. Schirmer hardwood sale, 1/11.
Where the operators earn their pay and value their machines. ;)
Backing Up the John Deer 548D Grapple Skidder For A Pull of Oak, Schirmer Hardwood Sale, 1/11.
Should try it when that hill is covered in granite boulders. :D :D
^^^Then it would be like this neck of the woods. haha
It's not a problem here in farm country, but Deersdale, McAdam, Napadogan, Northpole is one big boulder field. :D :D
no thanks on the boulders, shallow topsoil on top of slippery clay and gravel is challenging enough. Non tilt machine tops out at about 25deg slope. I have a tiltbase Timbco 445B fellerbuncher and D7 grapple coming in to work the steep parts. The Koehring will then have a working holiday as processor only on the edge of the landing.
DTR
Amish Cutter delimbs red oak, Schirmer hardwood sale 1/11.
Ready to Start Another Job. The 843K John Deere Feller Buncher and 748H John Deere Grapple Skidder are on the job and ready to start the timber harvest. Holcomb/Allen timber harvest, 4/11.
the k series and h series machines are super nice :)
Yes, they can get some work done. ;)
I love pictures! Especially of tractors!
Is this Gentz equipment ron?
I really hope my boss can get rid of his 450C TJ (I hate it) and get his 748...
No, it's Jason Lutke's equipment.
The 843K John Deere Feller Buncher starts work on the aspen removal, Holcomb/Allen timber harvest, 4/11.
treefarmer pullin poplar centeral Maine
1973 chevy c65 366 gas with prentice Loader with rotobec bucket this was our future Log truck but can't keep the brakes working stupid hydrolics makes a good log sorter
nice rigs i used to have a c65, good truck :) nice lil prentice G loader too. i have a buddy that has one with the loader mounted all the way on back with a unit. you would be suprised at the logs he picks up :o
yea the loader works good for $1500 for truck and loader. it would work awsome it didn't have that barge anchor on the end of it that rotobec is extremely heavy we just bought a 1986 ford f800 with a 8.2L detroit AIR brakes 5/2 speed for $600 to put that loader on to haulour wood to the mill with. I will post pics of it soon and our old home built skidder
thats a good deal :)
that is a f model prentice. wich came out earlier then the g. i have one of them on a working antique 67 diamond reo log truck. the g models you swing with the seat, and on the f, just the boom swings.
thanks old tj I didn't know what modal it was the ID plate is all smashed up I knew it was old it has been around by the looks of it but it works good
i didnt know they made a F? is it smaller than the G? i want to put a cab on my H, will a cab from a G fit on a H?
Mine only has a 15-16ft reach
they are/were strong loaders. i seen alot of guys cut up that model and put them as a replacement loader for there forwarder, easy to do cause the loader and valve bank are seperate. parts are still easily available from prentice. that one still has the original seat and seat pedestl....... 8) dont see many of them. take care of that one!!!!
yeah the seat hinge is worn out so i will have to replace it and the platform needs repair other than that it's a solid loader
this was our skidder for 12 years 1943 chevy g506 army truck the log arch used to be a power trailer that my grand dad made to go behind the modal B in the pic added a branden winch a 3spd tranny and ran it off the pto then put it on that truck. it was a great investment buying that treefarmer I broke 4 fingers over the years trying to steer that thing through the woods had manual steering
heres a pic of our future log truck
I also own a thomas 2411 bandsaw mill I bought new 2 years ago
Work At The Landing/Decking Area. The grapple skidder skids the tree length aspen to the slasher. The slasher cuts the aspen products and piles the tops on the opposite side for chipping. Holcomb/Allen timber harvest, 4/11.
How long have they been working that sale? Certainly looks like they aren't goofing around with the piles they've got there. Is that customary to have so much wood piled or are things tightening up in your area Ron?
I suspect that hasn't been piled down too long, maybe 3 days. With 3 or 4 trucks going it soon gets cleared out. ;D
Correct with Michigan trucks hauling 20+ cord a load that pile is gone in a hurry.
i havent been around a loader like that much. does he have to get a truck to hook on and move him or does he unload the logs he has for weight and move the trailer mounted loader with the loader? pc
This job was started on February 18th, but they didn't work most of April due to spring breakup, wet weather etc. They moved back in on May 19th and job is now done with all the wood hauled except for the aspen. The mill taking the aspen has shut down for a couple weeks, so they need to wait until then to haul the aspen.
This is a high production operation, so it doesn't take them long to do a harvest when they get on it.
Quote from: paul case on May 22, 2011, 09:15:32 AM
i havent been around a loader like that much. does he have to get a truck to hook on and move him or does he unload the logs he has for weight and move the trailer mounted loader with the loader? pc
?
A truck hooks on to the fifth wheel to move it any distance from job to job, but the unit has a seperate engine to self propel itself short distances and relocate itself around the landing etc.
looks to be self propelled. front wheels are turned a bit. with a 5th wheel pin on it so it back a truck into it and go. usually a hydr motor drives the transmission and a hydr ram in place of the streeing box all powered my the crane. at one time it was a truck
Quote from: snowstorm on May 23, 2011, 07:50:28 PM
looks to be self propelled. front wheels are turned a bit. with a 5th wheel pin on it so it back a truck into it and go. usually a hydr motor drives the transmission and a hydr ram in place of the streeing box all powered my the crane. at one time it was a truck
Thats the way our old Timberline Delimber is.. 6x6 drive, Hydraulic motors at each wheel, 5th wheel pin for distance moves.. Though she will move down the highway at about 20mph
Most slashers around here are mounted on old 6x6 military frames. As stated they have a hydraulic motor mounted to the transmission input in place of the factory diesel motor. This allows them to move from place to place in the woods all from the loader cab.
Then for distance moves there is a 5th wheel pin for a semi tractor to back under and move them on down the road.
i have only seen 1 other loader like this and that was on tv, bobby goodsons all terrian logging ''swamp loggers''. they moved it to a spot with a truck. i think i saw them move it back an forth some with the boom.
inquiring minds want to know. i read that somewhere. pc
Lots of them in the woods up here.
Nothing new or unique, just some pine plantation thinning...this stand is 25 and finally getting it's first thinning. Because we are a water utility, we tend to work on a longer rotation than most industrial operations
Bunching from the rows close to the deck
Stacking logs...This particular logger is able to take the bottom log (sometimes 2) and run them through his mill for smaller dimensioned products. It takes what would normally be a pulpwood thinning and turns it into chip-n-saw or even sawtimber prices.
Pretty good growth but should have been thinned quite a few years ago based on those rings :)
Everything is pulled tree length to the deck then delimbed...slash is carried back onto the skid trails
They are cutting mostly 10-12 footers from the butt log, sometimes 16 if they can.
You're exactly right, JD 648. Prentice 120 loader and a Hydro-Ax 511 round out the other equipment. They let me drive the JD the other day and pull some wood to the deck...that was a good time :)
Logger's Supply Vehicle, Holcomb/Allen timber harvest; 4/11.
they do alot of plantation thinning here too. good pics VT_Forestry smiley_thumbsup
Tree Length Logging, Aspen. Holcomb/Allen timber harvest, 4/11
Feller Bunched aspen trees await skidding by the John Deere Grapple skidder.
The John Deere Grapple Skidder makes the pickup and skids the tree lengths to the landing for processing by the slasher and chipper.
nice pics ron :)
The photo's contained within this topic (not to mention the text) could just about teach a non-logger the basic operations of logging even though that person knew nothing whatsoever before.
Thanks!
nice setup :) that is ALOT of wood :o
yep neat to see that set up.
i guess those are the saw logs on the right and the tops are on the left? if so what do you saw out of logs like the second one up on the pile? pc
I wouldn't call those "sawlogs". "Bolts" maybe.... and barely at that. A lot of pallet wood comes from "bolts". Short stock. Some of the high grade aspen/ white poplar is sorted out for things like solid core doors too. I used to mill a bunch of that up in WI.
Aspen can get pretty big at times. On our lot we had lots 20-36" dbh that were cut. One mill required a special ticket for over sized aspen, stuff over 24" on the but.
The decked aspen that can be seen in the photo will be going as pulpwood. The tops will be chipped.
i bet that log will make toilet paper just fine. ;D just wondering. thanks. pc
I so wish we had a Pulp mill here.. So much wood gets wasted because of Size or Crook. Even if i could do post and pole out of the tops I could greatly reduce waste.. but USFS and the Sawmill say no.. So i end up with huge slash piles
One of my friends is in the firewood business on the side. He hates waste and uses a special jig to cut off 18 inch sections from the slash in a CTR saw on his loader. He has it set up where he can back a trailer under the saw.
Another View of the Landing/Decking Area. Aspen and mixed hardwood sawlogs and pulpwood are decked on the left awaiting trucking and the Top wood is decked on the right awaiting chipping and trucking. Holcomb/Allen timber harvest, 4/11.
The company I work for at my day job brought these back to the mill today for some PM between jobs
Whos are those woody?
Lacy's Eddies brother
i thought he had a 490 prentice skidder? that is quite a pair :) they are nice
The 490 was a loaner while the Tigercat was in the shop
O OK :) I saw them working on the gravel road off 622 with the prentice. it looked like a good skidder, but i bet he likes the tigercat better :)
The prentice is much faster but the tigercat pulls a little more at one time. So I guess it is dependent on how your crew is geared
Chipping the Top Wood and Loading the Chip Van; Holcomb/Allen timber harvest, 5/11.
look @ all those axles on the truck and trailer
Quote from: treefarmer87 on June 22, 2011, 04:10:07 PM
look @ all those axles on the truck and trailer
Most the chip trucks the saw mills run here have 5 axle trailers and 4 axle trucks.. Makes for heavy payloads without overloading during weight restrictions
wow! never seen anything like that around here :o
How much can they Gross on a truck like that?
Our chips trucks were running around 105,000 lbs gross
Won't see anything like that on our highways either. How does it turn without scrubbing the tires?
Nothing like that here either. During 80% weight restrictions in the spring you aren't likely to get a truck out of the woods roads to begin with. They turn to slime in some areas. Our trailers are just as big, just not the x's. The trailers have more air flow in the load to.
Looking back through this post I figured you guys would get a chuckle out of this one. 1993 K1500. "The heartbeat of America". Maybe some day ill get a skidding winch on the tractor.
Gday
All those axles and you can only gross in at 105000lbs 47.6 ton :o :) :) :) :) Down her we can gross in at roughly 39 ton or 89000lbs I think on mechanical suspension and abit more than that on full air with a bogie drive semi pulling a triaxle trailer ;) and then you get into bogie tri tri B double and at 60 ton/132000 lb ;) gross
Bobus whats your cutoff diameter for sawlogs sounds like your leaving a fair bit in the bush Mate ???
Regards Chris
That truck should be able to gross over 130k if i remember right. Maybe more because it has 2 pusher axles on what looks to be a 9' spread.
An 11 axle michigan log truck is legal at 164k gross.
They scrub the tires pretty good when making sharp turns.
Quote from: Meadows Miller on June 23, 2011, 08:47:11 AM
Gday
All those axles and you can only gross in at 105000lbs 47.6 ton :o :) :) :) :) Down her we can gross in at roughly 39 ton or 89000lbs I think on mechanical suspension and abit more than that on full air with a bogie drive semi pulling a triaxle trailer ;) and then you get into bogie tri tri B double and at 60 ton/132000 lb ;) gross
Bobus whats your cutoff diameter for sawlogs sounds like your leaving a fair bit in the bush Mate ???
Regards Chris
7" Top for sawlogs
Serco Slasher Feeds the Chipper. The topwood piles are fed to the nearby chipper and the chips are blown into the waiting chip van to be hauled to the nearby co-generation plant for fuel wood.
The topwood is chipped and hauled to the local cogen plant while the aspen pulpwood awaits trucking during a 2 week mill shut down. The John Deere grapple skidder remains parked on the landing. Holcomb/Allen timber harvest, 5/11.
The mill has opened back up after its shut down. The decked pulpwood is now being loaded out. Holcomb/Allen timber harvest, 5/11.
Valmet 644 Forwarder. The forwarder of the logger working on the 80 acres just over the line from the timber harvest we were doing, 5/11.
thats a good pic ron. that is a nice machine
The landing and decking area where all the tree length slashing, chipping, and hauling took place has been cleaned up, and the timber sale contract is getting ready for closure. The landowners are quite happy with the work and will plant the area with wildlife trees and shrubs. Holcomb/Allen timber harvest, 7/11
Nice clean job Ron. :)
I always thought that if wood was cut it should be taken and used, but some loggers like to leave their left overs, all too common. Not a lot of waste, but usually some "nubbins" left about. It'll all make soil I suppose. ;)
Many of the landowner's management objectives can be obtained through a well planned timber harvest. One of this landowner's objectives was to improve deer management on the property. One of management directions was to plant wildlife shrubs, and food plots on the property.
In this case the logger prepared the landing/decking area for planting and seeding prior to closure of the timber harvest contract.
The landowner has 30 apple trees ready for planting on the landing/decking area along with planned wildlife food plot seedings.
Tree length skidding over an area of hydric soil during periods of heavy rain caused some rutting which will need correction before the timber harvest is closed. The area had been previously rutted and torn up by ORV travel on the existing trail. Holcomb/Allen timber harvest, 6/11.
The rains have ended and after a drying period, a dozer is brought in and the rutted area is repaired. The original rutted ORV trail is now filled and graded into an environmentally suited trail road as an improvement to the landowner's property. The timber harvest is now completed and the contract can now be closed. Holcomb/Allen timber harvest, 6/11.
looks good, around here the usually leave ruts like that :(
I would kick someone right in the ~%&@ if they left the ruts. Should be in the contract not to leave it like that. I would start to haul rocks and fill the ruts up on my land while they was still logging.
Nice cleanup, but sad to say, it's not something practiced too often here. On crown it's rutted pretty bad too in places. Makes for a nice surprise sometimes when grown over and your walking along with a brush saw and drop into them ditches. ::)
1952 Model Feller
1952 Model Buncher
1952 Model Feller Operating 1980 Iron Mule 5000F with Hood 418 Loader
Pretty Green Foliage Crushed by 1952 Model Feller's Felling
Hickory and White Ash Piled by 1952 Model Feller/Buncher
nice pics, beautiful woodlot too :)
Looks like the Ole strip cutting days, i cut and piled many thou's of cords back in the 60's. We had a Hill Lake dray behind a 03 Oliver cat. This is where you need a good pick Axe for piling it up, i could cut and pile 10 cords a day in Aspen when i was 16 yrs old.
I didn't think there were any Lumberjacks left, quietrangr you sure qualify as one.
Back in the 60's and 70's the the Feds payed us to disk-up and plant Clover on all our landing sites.
Aspen Regeneration. Quick aspen regeneration within 1 month of the aspen timber harvest. Holcomb/Allen timber harvest, 6/11.
It grows quick!
Large tooth (big tooth) is the fastest growing commercial tree up north here. They look like quaking aspen in the photo, but they grow real fast to. I think in Michigan I read that aspen grows most per acre a year than any tree (native to Michigan).
Wood hauler on its way to the mill, 6/11.
Wood hauler makes the turn onto the mill's route, 6/11.
Not a bad looking load of logs at all !!! :) Man that rig has a lot of tires to deal with :-\
How many bd feet is legal to haul? And how much do they usually haul? I can't imagine log haulers there are any different than log haulers here, hence the two part question ;)
How many bdft/ton?
The age old question.
But how much weight can you haul with all the axles?
I have often thought that a multi-axle truck from Wisconsin in western SD would allow some major weight to be hauled, but in the same way alot of your net would be lost due to the weight of the extra axles so it prolly wouldn't pan out very well.
In Michigan an 11 axle truck is legal to 164,000lbs. That works out to about 20-22 cord and 8500-9000 bdft of logs in my experience. That will change a little if they are all random length logs or all 8 footers.
I've bought as much as 11,000 feet of logs off one truck, and stick scaled 24 cord off a truck. Both trucks didn't have loaders on them so it allows them a little more room for wood.
A Wisconsin truck is good for 1/2 the weight of a Michigan truck. When we load trucks that are destined for Wi they get about 9 cord of wood or 4000bdft. If basswood we put 5000 bdft on, if red oak or yellow birch we put 3700 or so on.
They look to be stacked a lot higher than the local trucks are allowed.
May be to do with our roads of course.
They changed the regulations and now have a longer trailer with 2 sets of bunks / logs and one set on the truck. All up weight is the same, but the load is longer and lower. Safer on the winding roads.
Ian
Mississippi allows loggers with forest permit to 84,000 lbs, otherwise 80,000. Typical load is 26 to 28 ton of wood. I use 7 - 8 ton per 1000BF as a estimated yield of SYP or cypress. I have never seen a pup trailer or self-loader in my area, all are 18-wheeler type. SYP Chip-n-saw, SYP and hardwood pulp is hauled tree length and saw logs are usually 12' and 16'. All are loaded on landing with knuckleboom loader.
I've seen a lot of the numbers when working at a marketing board, you get all the scale slips whether it's weight or stick scaled. The average load of 8' hardwood was 34 metric tonnes. That's with a self loader on the trailer, which was very common up until few years ago. In the spring before restriction on weight, I've seen as much as 44 metric tonnes on a scale slip with no loader. A metric tonne is 200 lb heavier than an American ton. We used 2.5 green metric tonnes per cord based on a cunit of solid wood (100 ft3, 56 lb/ft3 hard maple, beech, yellow birch). I know the 2.5 conversion is close because I've bought stove wood that way and it measured out very close. I have a spot in the basement that holds exactly 6 cords, and I can get 2 more cords along another wall and around the corners with adjoining walls. But I only put 7.5 down.
Wwsjr you mentioning not seeing any self loaders in MS. Theres a DM Mack running around Belmont with a self loader set up. You may know him Andy Barnett. He used the have a white Rmodel Mack with a bunk on the back later set up as a trailer.
In Michigan its sort of uncommon to see a log truck without a loader on it. I only know of a few trucks without loaders, and most of them have a sister truck with a loader so that one truck can load two. Around here you would be hard pressed to find many loggers that would even load your truck for you.
There are a few contract haulers around my area, but most trucks and trailers are owned and operated by the loggers themself or a spin-off company owned by the logger. A couple of the loggers I know use two loaders on the landing and if bad road conditions use an old pull-out truck. Drop trailers, hook up to road truck. They operate similar to Bobby Goodson on "Swamp Loggers"
The self loader on a truck fits a system where wood is brought to roadside and stacked. Then, at a later time, the self loading trucks come and get the wood. This is a common system where the wood can be stored on the roadside without degrade.
In the Southern US, 99% of the logging is "hot logging". The wood is processed on logging decks and loaded directly on trucks. Wood stored on the roadside would not keep with the heat and humidity. There is more than one way to skin a cat, but sometimes environmental conditions have a say.
I think one of the reasons there is no self loaders on public lands is wood theft. Real easy to go out on a weekend to pick over someone's piles for firewood or logs and not a soul around. Also poachers of figured maple.
I'd say we have about 70% self loaders up here.
they are handy, i dont know why more people dont have them here, i like the one smvwoody has, it is set up nice. there is a 1900 intl. that has a pto on it. i could put a small prentice loader on it, but i think im going to try to get a grapple skidder, or prehauler :)
Quote from: treefarmer87 on September 17, 2011, 12:21:39 PM
they are handy, i dont know why more people dont have them here, i like the one smvwoody has, it is set up nice. there is a 1900 intl. that has a pto on it. i could put a small prentice loader on it, but i think im going to try to get a grapple skidder, or prehauler :)
you must have missed it there is a bell 3 wheeler with a dangle saw on criags list maine either 9 or 10k. i think it was at poulin tractor in scowhegan
I havent seen that one yet :)
I can only think of one truck in the Black Hills that doesn't have a Loader on it.. But if the truck doesn't have a loader they don't get loaded
There are all kinds of scenarios you could run through that either works best. It just depends on your business. I know several guys that load their truck with a forwarder or slasher or even have a dedicated loader truck with 5 trucks or more on the road hauling. Then there is a log truck driver that just hauls wood for others so he uses a loader on his truck, unhooks next week and pulls a produce trailer. ;)
99% are self loaders here.
When we used to have more custom haulers, we had a higher percentage of self loaders.
Now there are more logging outfits that have their own trucks pulling crib trailers. Our hauls are getting so long, it adds up quick hauling that extra almost 2 cords that a loader weighs. 100 mile hauls to the mill one way are not uncommon anymore, and it seems like it keeps getting longer as markets disappear. But, even a huge operator like Reiger up here is running all center mounts because it makes the logistics much simpler. A woods crew can roll in, hammer up 500 cords on the landing and move on before the trucks even touch the job.
Here is how we help trees grow after the harvest in the PNW. A very informational vid from a very good timberland owner. Their head forester is a super nice guy too.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g1UTmizwtR8&feature=player_embedded#!
This tree farm has units that I have seen 60"+ leader growth on Douglas Fir reprod in one growing season. Pretty amazing thing to see! My hat is off to all you foresters out there! Keep up the good job 8) 8) 8)
That sure brings back some memories. ;D Thanks
Good video of helicopter spray project.
Thanks Ron. I cannot take credit for the video, I did not tape it. We have other videos and pics on the Co.'s new website. I don't get to the woods with the crews, I spend most of my time in the shop fixing the aircraft and other things. I have been in the woods a bit this past week though, we are dialing in a new DGPS guidance system that we have put together ourselves, rather than spend the bocou $$ on a turn key system for the aerial platform. It is working better than any system that I have seen IMO, is much more scalable, and a much better value than others as well. We have in the past donre a lot of aerial fertilization, but the last 2 years with the sky high fert prices, timber companies are not ponying up the cash to do much, if the market were to stay stronger (timber market), they would begin to spend more. Luckily for us they have returned to a more normal cycle for release and site prep, since the cutting has stepped up markedly with the good export market of late.
Wow, fertilizing forests. I didn't think anyone did that. I didn't think the economics paid off like thinning does. We found you got maybe 3 years of growth spurt with aerial fertilizing, versus 25 years with thinning. ;) I'm not debating it, but some folks must see benefits that we haven't back east.
Fertilization is not at all uncommon in the South. My company has a major forest fertilization program backed up by decades of research. Even though fertilization pays out under most timber price scenarios, the biggest return for the silvicultural dollars spent is weed/vegetation control. Apparently, this is true for the PNW as well.
Gday Treefarmer there is a bogie drive W model Kenworth up in PA with a 120 prentice on truckpaper.com Mate for $8 or 9 k Mate ;)
thanks ill take a look at it :)
it has a hood 7000 loader still good loader
Quote from: WDH on October 02, 2011, 06:53:46 AM
Fertilization is not at all uncommon in the South. My company has a major forest fertilization program backed up by decades of research. Even though fertilization pays out under most timber price scenarios, the biggest return for the silvicultural dollars spent is weed/vegetation control. Apparently, this is true for the PNW as well.
Most REIT's and private timber co's will fertilize within 5-7 years of harvest, and sometimes mid growth, after the first thinining, as it can speed up growth in a given period of time and increase the yield at harvest up to 25% in volume, especially the fert application 5-7 years prior to final commercial harvest. We have fertilized as far east as Montana in the past, as it will increase yield volume at harvest by 10-15%, under forest practice rules, they would take the 10-15% increase at the time they fertilized, by being allowed to increase the cut the same year the fertilizer was applied on areas that were under harvest in the same year, since the increase in volume is a documented result of fertilizing.
Quote from: HuZzEy on October 02, 2011, 12:10:29 PM
it has a hood 7000 loader still good loader
Quote from: treefarmer87 on October 02, 2011, 11:04:37 AM
thanks ill take a look at it :)
No Problem Mate ;) ;D
Welcome to the forum Huzzey ;) ;D 8) And yeah I can get it wrong from time to time I look at alot of gear Mate :) ;) :D :D ;D
Mad_Murdock, that was what we concluded to. Within 3-5 years of harvest was beneficial to dominant trees mostly. We found there was delay in codominant growth increase and the suppressed trees, which were low quality anyway, were further suppressed. But we found that most of the nitrate was gone with heavy rainfall events and carried to streams.
Quote from: Ron Scott on December 23, 2010, 09:38:23 AM
Some more woodhauler truck names noted.
this has been the best topic so i wanted to bring it back TTT
& here are a few local truck names:
Crazy Dave
Awful
Bud Man
Bug Barber
Got Wood?
Pa's Pad When Ma's Mad
Indian Outlaw
Slimer
I had crazy Dave and Bud man haul wood. Crazy Dave was a circus and Bud Man was on time and relaxed.
Quote from: hillsidevt on November 17, 2011, 07:44:24 PM
Quote from: Ron Scott on December 23, 2010, 09:38:23 AM
Some more woodhauler truck names noted.
this has been the best topic so i wanted to bring it back TTT
& here are a few local truck names:
Crazy Dave
Awful
Know both Crazy Dave and Awful, both live in my town.
i'm not far from you, in ryegate.
Here is our 1975ish TJ230D pulling some firewood. The trees got uprooted in a tropical storm this past summer.
Good looking vintage TJ230D.
i guess the last one didnt come out i'll try it again
nice pics, that 340 is a rare machine. smiley_thumbsup
Nice photos with a good looking 340D at work.
I didn't even know JD made a 340. What year is yours, and what was the last year they made them? That would be a nice size machine for sure.
Quote from: Emajsh on September 01, 2012, 11:21:48 AM
i havent seen anything posted here for a while so i thought i would post a few pictures, hopefully i do it right!
Nice pix! I have never seen a JD 340 in person. Are they physically smaller than a 440?
Thanks guys, i guess they are pretty rare machines. They only made them for a few years, 84 and 85 i believe. I dont know the specifics about the differences between the 340 and 440. I do know that the 340D is a non Turbo and for some reason you could buy it without a blade or a rear log plate and you could get it with different narrower tires. What the advantage would be to have a skidder without a blade or a rear plate for your logs is beyond me, but luckily mine has both and the regular 18.4-26 tires
There is a kid's book called "Logging Machines in the Forest" that I used to get out of the library when I was a kid. I remember seeing a picture of a 340 in there, and it had no blade. I was amused at the time. Maybe JD was just trying to sell a base line skidder with no frills for the most bottom dollar. I don't know.
Seeing this topic back up top reminded me I have pics from last winter I needed to upload. Here it's daylight in the swamp.
The Ponsse Buffalo forwarder on the landing.
On the landing with a load of black spruce, I must have been tightening a hose or something. Somewhere between 5-6 cords on the machine, it depends on how much you heap it up.
Here, if you look carefully in the middle of the photo you can see the critter that snuck up about 100' behind me out of curiosity, I guess. I'm glad we finally have a hunting season for them this year, I like having wolves around but they are getting a bit too comfortable around people, IMO.
Well my laptop battery is going dead and I have to hit the sack, I have a ton of pictures from the windstorm this summer that I still have to upload.
Nice photos of early morning hours and Ponsee Buffalo at work.
barbender good pic, i cleaned up blow down on Co. 9 from the dam out to Hwy 2 back in the 80's. I can't remember what yr the big blow came across Winnie, it blew down many 1000's of cords, Co. 9 was blocked a couple days. It blew down 3' White pine an Norway log trees.
I just ran in to a 1985 340 JD, they want $25,000. for it.
Heres a pic of my boy running my C5-D, that arm had that bend when i bought the skidder, this is 26 yrs ago.
These are vintage pictures, this is me on the S8 IH decking Aspen poles, 30 yrs ago
This is the Co. truck pulling off the job, he has about 15 cds of Birch saw bolts on, 6 more cords then he can haul legal. Its all back roads to Bigfork and late evening, so why not over load.
Good pics, LJ48. I remember the blowdown on c.r.9, if I remember right that storm totally flattened that area where the recent storm kind of jumped around and hit pockets really hard. I still remember the sign the forestry put out there, "windstorm damage, watch for a new forest appearing soon" :) Now it's all 30-40' tall forest. I guess the forestry was right :)
Very nice photos. We have the greatest view from our offfice windows, don't we?
Lj, we had a trucker hauling for us a few years ago who hauled in an evening load of tamarack pulp like that. Crossed the scales over 205000.
205,000 lbs ??
How many axles under that 100 ton load?
Quote from: 1270d on September 04, 2012, 07:51:41 PM
Very nice photos. We have the greatest view from our offfice windows, don't we?
Lj, we had a trucker hauling for us a few years ago who hauled in an evening load of tamarack pulp like that. Crossed the scales over 205000.
Back in 1995 i loaded a load of studwood spruce/fir on a 3 axle bws trailer behind a 500hp mack tractor, 160,000 pounds! Guy hauled it from jackson maine to canada! Went across the border in jackman maine! Around 140 miles one way!
Quote from: 1270d on September 04, 2012, 07:51:41 PM
Very nice photos. We have the greatest view from our offfice windows, don't we?
Lj, we had a trucker hauling for us a few years ago who hauled in an evening load of tamarack pulp like that. Crossed the scales over 205000.
I too have seen a few loads of wood between 205,000 and 210,000 cross the scales in the dark of night. That's on an 11 axle "Michigan Truck"... Only 40,000 overweight :D
That kind of weight is crazy, have any of you ever pullled a load that heavy? I've had a couple #120,000 + loads on, you know you have a load behind you, even with 500hp.
never pulled a load over a 100K lb but have seen a few loads of logs that scaled right at the 200 to 215 K. Some of the oilfield hauling you see in this country dont even get scaled cause there isn't a scale that you can get the rigs on to even weigh em.
Quote from: barbender on September 04, 2012, 11:07:55 PM
That kind of weight is crazy, have any of you ever pulled a load that heavy? I've had a couple #120,000 + loads on, you know you have a load behind you, even with 500hp.
I have grossed in 108000 with my tri axle self loader truck back in the day! HAVE the biggest loads hauled into several mills! 8600bf of saw logs! Hauled 8000bf on a regular occurrence!
Talked to my brother last night. He is mostly hauling loggin and oil feild equipment now but he said that 100K mark is the norm now for log trucks up north. said he saw one about a week ago where the jeeped tractor had a set of tandem steering axels and triple drivers pulling a trailer with 2 center axels and a triple rear.
He figured they were using a heavy pipe/drill stem hauler to bring out logs to the plup mill from the lease and road clearing and said it looked to be about a load and a half on a regular tri axel trailer rig.
He was going to see if he could get a picture if he caught them on the his haul in there today with the other mud tank.
Quote from: lumberjack48 on September 04, 2012, 05:36:29 PM
This is the Co. truck pulling off the job, he has about 15 cds of Birch saw bolts on, 6 more cords then he can haul legal. Its all back roads to Bigfork and late evening, so why not over load.
I've never seen logs loaded across the truck like that around here( Perpendicular to the trailer.). Is that a regional thing or is it the old way or what? Seems it would make unloading easier.
Regional, it's a lakes states thing. I'd guess about 95% of our wood is cut 100", and about 75% of that is hauled crossways. If I remember right, a good crane operator at Sappi could unload a rail trailer with 14 cords of aspen on it in under 3 minutes, it would take 1 minute longer with bunk trailers. Doesn't sound like much but when the trucks are backed up bumper to bumper all day it adds up.
Quote from: Mark Wentzell on September 05, 2012, 03:11:54 PM
Quote from: lumberjack48 on September 04, 2012, 05:36:29 PM
This is the Co. truck pulling off the job, he has about 15 cds of Birch saw bolts on, 6 more cords then he can haul legal. Its all back roads to Bigfork and late evening, so why not over load.
I've never seen logs loaded across the truck like that around here( Perpendicular to the trailer.). Is that a regional thing or is it the old way or what? Seems it would make unloading easier.
Mark, saw bolts are 100" long same as pulp, he'll be about 30,000 over with the load.
The truck has 6 axles counting the front, the truck is way over built to, heavy rig empty.
Thanks guys. Always learning. :P
Yeah 95% here is 100" wood loaded crossways on the truck and pup. Only time to load them lengthwise is when you have random length logs to haul. But even then I know a few truckers that haul 10' and 12' logs sideways on the truck, then just offset them so the majority sticks out the passenger side.... In no way shape or form is it legal but some do it because they hate trying to load a few long logs lengthwise and having to splice them in with the rest of the 8' logs.
Wow, never heard of hauling randoms sideways. Not on the public roadways anyhow. 9 ft wood I have. Looks normal if its loaded well.
We had another truck driver crack up a freeze road with ahuge loade of 8 8 sawlogs. There was no way to fit another stick on the under the loader on the truck and the pup was humped up. This was 90% frozen hard maple. I can't imagine what that must have weighed.
Very few local truckers carry wood crossways. It used to be quite popular as most pulp mills only accepted 8' wood. Now most of our pulp is cut random length. Much easier to work with.
It was great to see this thread again. Probably my favorite.
In the bottom picture the piles are quite messy. Sure hard to pile wood evenly when the bark is peeling off. I do normally take a lot of pride in putting up a neat pile.
i have to be careful, this story may be about you! my dad saw a guy pull into line in jay when the trucks were backed up out the gate. this was probly 15 years ago. unloaded a triaxle load of wood into that little pull of on the right as you leave the mill. came back twice more that day and threw half the first load on each trip. had the loader heaped right up, but there was no overhead obstacles between the wood and the destination.
Quote from: Woodhauler on September 05, 2012, 08:20:15 AM
Quote from: barbender on September 04, 2012, 11:07:55 PM
That kind of weight is crazy, have any of you ever pulled a load that heavy? I've had a couple #120,000 + loads on, you know you have a load behind you, even with 500hp.
I have grossed in 108000 with my tri axle self loader truck back in the day! HAVE the biggest loads hauled into several mills! 8600bf of saw logs! Hauled 8000bf on a regular occurrence!
The guy that use to truck for me would load his truck like in lumberjack picture. He would kinda have to throw the wood up towards the cab. This was with a loader up by the cab.He was real good at it. This way he would not have to move his stakes.Now I see most load thier trucks with the wood stacked the same way the truck is going,than cross ways than another tier like the first one.The cross ways one is probably only 6 feet wide. this is all 8 foot pulp.
Quote from: barbender on September 04, 2012, 11:07:55 PM
That kind of weight is crazy, have any of you ever pullled a load that heavy? I've had a couple #120,000 + loads on, you know you have a load behind you, even with 500hp.
Hauled our crane to Williston ND (355 miles) Grossed out at 141,000 lbs It was a pull but the ole 550hp CAT did well
That's a long haul being that heavy, Bobus. There's plenty of steep grades too. Hwy 85? All I know is 500 hp and an 18 speed kind of spoils a guy ;)
Got a little ahead of myself and clicked post before I typed a description. That pic above is after a decent afternoon of skidding. Gave the machine a workout, is was a 20 min skid one way out of a hollow so real hard to be productive but the size and quality of the timber makes it worthwhile.
Heres a few more from that job:
Pretty nice stick. thats a 660 with 24in bar for reference. I try to peel the root flares off, makes it a lot easier to debark and saw without all that extra wood on it.
The ground is pretty steep but pics dont do it justice. I laid this one across the hill to keep it from splitting at the crotch and it took a pretty good run down the hill in the process.
Thats the first 'bench' where I can still turn the skidder around, much above that and its not worth the risk. The job is pretty tough, the timber lays above the road but not all the way to the top so there are no roads to go up and then come down over.
End up going to get a lot of it with this, the sawmills 550G. I was never a big dowzer fan, but i am coming around. Pretty amazing what you can do as your skill and confidence builds.
Pretty tall stuff to, I laid this one up the hill and turned around to take a pic where I topped it.
An interesting find, its a rifle slug that was in my backcut. Odds of splitting it in half are slim, but I suppose its better I found it with a chainsaw than the mill finding it with the 8inch band headrig!
Heres a what not to do! This was a job from last winter, as a favor to the farmer we were cutting and shoving over some nasty leaners that were hanging into the hay field. It was one of the colder days and this little black birches hinge didnt hold. I should have known better and it would have hurt being a bigger tree, but being as it was small its sort of laughable now.
Cherry sale summer 2011, the boss making sure I am doing it right.
I love my job and love to work, but its nice to get away and leave it all behind once in awhile. My wife and I love the outdoors and the northern mountains. Heres the adirondacks, summer 2011
Nice!
Quote from: PAFaller on September 08, 2012, 11:04:47 AM
Cherry sale summer 2011, the boss making sure I am doing it right.
Looks like he's a nightmare to work for. :D
Good pictures. I see you don't run chains in the summer.
The rings stay on in the front. My front tires are still in good shape overall without any big cuts but the tread is worn to nothing. I run the studs in the winter or in the rocks, but those double diamonds just fill full of mud. Had to take them off when I did a big clearing job and was up to the axles. I dont like running in mud that deep, but when there is an excavator right behind you grubbing its not as big a deal.
Quote from: PAFaller on September 09, 2012, 08:32:03 AM
The rings stay on in the front. My front tires are still in good shape overall without any big cuts but the tread is worn to nothing. I run the studs in the winter or in the rocks, but those double diamonds just fill full of mud. Had to take them off when I did a big clearing job and was up to the axles. I dont like running in mud that deep, but when there is an excavator right behind you grubbing its not as big a deal.
What you just described is called routine logging in Maine, any time but winter. In winter of course, you hope to be able to stay on top of frozen ground for the most part. They dragged bottom logging my dad's place in September of '91.
I missed the front chains in the picture.
Okrafarmer,sorry not all of Maine was like your Dad's place. :( I look at ALOT of logging jobs in Maine. Some I spend some time looking and some I leave very quickly.
If the guy I had cut my land started to make ruts even 6 inches deep,I would kick him off my land so quick he wouldn't even know what happened. I told him I have to get my tractor through the woods. And I told him I would kick him off my land too.He used alot of my trails too.I HATE ruts. My land is good land and I want to keep it that way. I went to check on one job of his while he was cutting. As I was walking up to him he was putting a bunch of brush and limbs in a soft spot so when the forwarder came through it would not sink in. That is one reason why I let him on my land. I have seen deep ruts on some land and I cross that logger off my list.
People may be more sensitive to it these days. My dad didn't like the ruts, but he knew it was part of the price of admission, especially on his soil type. His solution was to buy a D-6 and fix the road a couple years later. He also used the D-6 to clear the stumps out of the clear cut area and build a pond. All things he had wanted to do anyway. His 2-ton John Deere tractor made ruts too. The same logger logged off a much bigger section of land a mile down the road, a year or so later, and I saw the road they came out of, they were dragging bottom there too. Not much you can do about it sometimes. On another piece of land nearby, they logged it and the ruts weren't too deep because it was better soil and it was fairly dry when they logged it. That piece got bulldozed out and reclaimed for hay field, which is what it was before the trees grew back up in it.
Maine has many different soil types, even within the space of a mile, multiple soil types can often be found. We lived in one of the glacial deposit areas, and the soil types were especially spotty. The bulk of our land was minarda clay, which is particularly messy. I got Dad's D-4 stuck in it twice. The guy who bought Dad's D-4 from him sank it up to the hood the day he drove it off the truck. :o I remember our next door neighbor with his Oliver 77 stuck up to the axles in his front yard, our other neighbor's Allis WD-45 sat stuck in the mud for over a year. Our road was discontinued past our house, but as a logging road, continued through to the next town. Dad pulled at least a dozen lost souls' cars, vans, and 4X4 trucks out of the mud on that road over the years. "Stuck-in-the-mud" was almost one word in the local vernacular.
This morning's view, the fall colors are getting here.
Ponsse Ergo working blowdown in one of the hardest hit areas from our July 3rd windstorm.
We had this huge area of blowdown, and now it is this dry in the sand country
Some more blowdown, this is aspen on the NE shore of Ball Club lake
Another landing shot, sometimes we will team up two or even three forwarders to get a job hammered out
Nature shot, this hawk followed the machine around the whole time I was on this job, must have thought I was going to rustle up some grub for him
That looks like a mess. I had a hawk that would follow me around too.especailly when I got too close to his or her nest. Than the hawk would get too close to me. :o
Quote from: barbender on September 08, 2012, 10:30:27 AM
That's a long haul being that heavy, Bobus. There's plenty of steep grades too. Hwy 85? All I know is 500 hp and an 18 speed kind of spoils a guy ;)
Yeah its a Good Haul, Can't wait too be Done Working Up there. The Oil traffic Sucks.. Hardest part on hwy 85 is the Climb out of the Little Missouri River south of Watford City.. It would be differnt driving if i didn't have a 18spd, and 550hp
We're still working blowdown, it keeps me close to home is the good part about it.
This is a Red Pine plantation a I thinned about 5 years ago, it is about 50% on the ground, 25% bent, and 25% undamaged.
What an awful mess :).
Lots of money lost with that storm. that is too bad. Is this a land owner lot or a company? Acres? Nice and ALOT safer to do all that from a cab.
We've been cutting all small private lots, these landowners have really taken a beating on the stumpage. This sale was $5/cd on the aspen. The dangle head processor is the only way to fly in this stuff, IMO. It would be a death trap to try and cut by hand, and a hot saw doesn't work very well in it either.
Wow, I remember getting $42 a cord on the landing for aspen back in 1998. And thinking how that was a pitifully poor return on my time for cutting it. I guess you're talking about what the landowner gets, $5 / a cord. What would be normal price these days to pay a land owner for good standing aspen?
$20-$30/cord for aspen prior to it being blown down. Most of these sales have been $10/cord, this one was administered by the MN DNR because of a conservation easement, they dropped the stumpage in half because the Doctor that owns the property needed the access road to his cabin on the property cleared out by the duck opener ::)
That's more like it. So what would the landing price be (or millside price, whichever you would know more easily) ? For comparing, then to now. Back then I think it was $42 landing, $50 mill price.
You would have a tough time getting much more than $50/cord on the landing now in this area (for aspen pulp) unless you have a coveted UPM Blandin contract, that keeps the haul short. Otherwise the haul distance gets to be over 100 miles to the other paper mills, pushing trucking rates well over $30/cord. $80-$85/cord delivered on the aspen pulp, do the math and you can see why you don't want large equipment payments ::) I logged my place about 6 years ago, I was getting $102/cord delivered for my aspen, and it only cost about $15/cord to get it there. We still had local (23 miles) OSB mills, and they were all hungry for wood. Three of those OSB mills shut down that spring, never to open again. The good old days ::)
When I was a kid in Maine in the '80's, it was still the hey-day of logging up there. Didn't matter what you wanted to do, saw-logs, firewood, pulp, veneer, tree-length, 4-foot pulp, bolt-wood, bio-mass, selective cut, clear-cut, skidders, forwarders, bulldozers, jitterbugs, conversion trucks, wheelers, semi's, farm tractors, power trailers, bombardiers, pulp trains, furniture, fencing, post and beam, you name it. Chainsaw:resident ratio, around 2:1. Skidder:resident ratio, around 1:20. Wood meant money. Lots of money. You could make an honest living. If you were industrious, you could make a killing. If you were ingenious, you could make a fortune.
Now. . . . .
:'(
looks like a late 60s early 70s franklin 132 in really good shape like you said :)
Quote from: Okrafarmer on September 29, 2012, 10:34:20 PM
When I was a kid in Maine in the '80's, it was still the hey-day of logging up there. Didn't matter what you wanted to do, saw-logs, firewood, pulp, veneer, tree-length, 4-foot pulp, bolt-wood, bio-mass, selective cut, clear-cut, skidders, forwarders, bulldozers, jitterbugs, conversion trucks, wheelers, semi's, farm tractors, power trailers, bombardiers, pulp trains, furniture, fencing, post and beam, you name it. Chainsaw:resident ratio, around 2:1. Skidder:resident ratio, around 1:20. Wood meant money. Lots of money. You could make an honest living. If you were industrious, you could make a killing. If you were ingenious, you could make a fortune.
Now. . . . .
:'(
Around here in the 60s and 70s, everybody or anybody could get a job logging. Every little town had one or two timber buyers, i even had-em come out to the house. Most of the farmers logged over the winter months.
1980 the logging industry here took a dive, after that logging was just a dog-eat-dog job.
barbender i have cut many thousands of cords of that kind of blow down with a saw an cable skidder in the 80s. That was one of my nick names [blown down Nelson] in the 60s an 70s it was [Easy-Money]
Blow Down Nelson...I like that :D It's dangerous stuff, everything is loaded.
Great thread took me a while to get through the whole thing. Alot of great pics from members.
Heres a red pine skid on a job a few weeks ago. 10" dbh was about the average tree size. 8" and over went to the local amish for tounge and groove paneling. 5"-7" was sold to a local fence post company and will be peeled and treated. 2"-4" was sent to pennsylvania for furniture making. The 2"-4" was the money maker on the job since they can not be processer cut furniture makers are having a hard time finding them and are paying top dollar.
whodathunkit! 2-4" diameter material being the money maker!
whats your machine keen? C5D?
Its a c5d with a deutz 5 cylinder. It does pretty good for us, for what it is. I had a few loggers and truckers see my pile of 2"-4" stuff and say " Your getting a pretty good pile of pulp wood" and have them say that they are getting roughly $60 a cord for it. When I say im getting $250 a cord on the landing there jaw drops. Being a low production chainsaw crew we really have to shop for the right market to be able to make a decent profit.
I just saw a craigslist ad looking for that same stuff, keen. Same problem, feed roller tracks don't look very good on your log furniture ::)
Would they take it if it was cut with a stroke processor? Like a little tapio or something like it?
Keen, that is EXACTLY the proper way to log. It sounds like you are making money.
Im not sure on a stroke processor 1270d, never thought of that. Its a good idea. I have never seen wood in person cut by one. Does it just remove some of the bark as it slides? I wouldn't think a little scrape here and there on the wood would be a big deal. Where about in the UP are you? I was up there two weeks ago and fished the carp river and the black river. I'm from mid michigan(gladwin).
I ve never run a stroker but I don't think there would be a whole lot of bark disturbance. If the knives were kept nice and sharp I think they would limb really clean also. I live about a quarter of a mile from the carp. Definately one of the smaller sections of the river though
If he knifes are sharp, and the machines running good Stroke Processors don't disturb much.. They scrap some bark of (in many cases very nicely without touching the wood) but they do sometimes gouge the wood..
Nice looking skid behind that C5D keen. I agree that we all have to aggressively market our products and services in the hopes of finding those "niche" markets. Be careful though how often you spread the word about really good markets as there are those who would be more than willing to fill the market for a bit less.
Cheers
Ken
This is a Clark skidder. I don't see many of these in my area.
I have no idea the year. This is just a guy with a skidder and a chainsaw. This was a real small job. I doubt even 4 acres. It's between 2 roads and one side has a house on it and the other side was cut off a few years ago.
I knew a guy in Burnham, Maine, who had a Clark Ranger for a while. Back in the late '80's, early '90's maybe.
I used to see them many years ago. Now, down here, you very rarely see a cable skidder of any type anymore.
They were a common sight here.
Heres a few pics of the job we're cutting now. Getting pretty close to getting it completed, if the weather would only cooperate. There will be around 500 cd of aspen, once that is cut we will start on the ash.
Counted a 110 rings on the tree to the right, it was solid all the way up. Don't find to many aspen that size in these parts.
Sure like how these trees cord up, had to shave some bark off this one to get the 8 foot choker around it.
This was Tuesday, trying to beat the thaw. The truck in front is loading logs. The truck in the rear is loading pulp.
The ash on this job site keep me up at night :o Some board footage in these babys!
Had some hard rain here last night and today, dreading to see what things look like when I get there monday moring. Hopefully the rest of guys are getting though the weather, sure makes it tough.
keen,that tree makes that skidder look small. A tree that size takes alot down with it when it falls. I wonder why the trees did not get cut before. Looks like alot of small stuff coming up around it on your last picture. I see you have just about as much snow as I do.
Keen, what happened to the orignal arch on your c5? i see a deere arch now? you are cutting some great logs, good job :) bogue, that is the cleanest pine job i have seen. where is the slash?
It's a big mud hole now. Raining all week and still more to come.
Here is something you have not seen before...
Bogue nice looking work there, whats the pine sold and used for there? Yeah, thecfarm not much snow this year. Its pretty much all gone now, 60 degrees today :-\ Treefarmer87 the deere arch was on it when I bought it. It was originally a grapple/cable, the guys I got it from were working on alot of slopes and put the arch on it. Maybe it will get a paint job this summer so it doesn't look like a mut.
I cut a lot of Aspen like that around here, i liked cutting it at -10 to -20, no limbing, come out like high line poles. When its 60 degrees they don't slide very easy and pick dirt up.
That looks like a big White Ash your standing by, cut a few Black Ash that big.
Nice size row cut pine, i cut many thousands of cds of that here in the Chippewa National Forest
FABTEK all i want is the cash that machine is worth.
That's the new improved fabtek in escanaba right now? Heard about it. You must be the engineer that refined it?
I think it will work. There is definately a market for fixed heads here and Deere was missing out.
Do you own this head and market through deere, or sell it to them?
keen, i would like to have a grapple and arch to convert mine to a grapple skidder. all the ones i have found are way too big for my c6
Keen, this is the first cutting of these trees. We are just thinning for chip and saw.
is the skidder a 648H?
Yes, Tree farmer
There is a very good small log market in that area. The Company I worked for has a small log sawmill in Holden. Are these logs going to Holden or Bogalusa?
Bogalusa
That is nice mill. I have been there several times.
nice equipment there. Thats my kind of work in the pines. I like seeing the green grass. not much green around here.
Yarder side just outside of South Bend, WA. Stroker clearing the chute/ processing and shovel sorting and loading. Tank mount Madill yarder.
Cougar Mountain in foothills of the Olympic Mountains, South Western part of Olympic Peninsula. 171 or 172 Madill yarder; can't remember which. Smaller Kobelco shovel sorting/loading and Kobelco with Waratah clearing chute and processing. Kenworth T-800 "long logger", 4 Axle truck with 2 axle long log trailer, and pup. Gross 88,000 but should have a permit allowing more since it has the pup.
Looking over the edge where the processor is at. Bottom end was shovel logged wher it meets the old clearcut.
At the above unit looking East toward the head end of the Wishkah river and farther East the Wynoochee river, my stompin grounds.
Up the Wishkah river. About 2 miles as the crow flies from the pic above. Cat yoader loading, Komatsu sorting, and Komatsu with Waratah processing. Next pic is another Komatsu shovel swingin in turns on a lower bench to the landing.
Timber King buncher just to the right of the above shovel.
New Deere near the last two jobs. On what I call the Donut Hole. Old train turn around with a knob in the middle. Originally set up to be downhill logged but the op worked the shovel to the top and slid em over the edge. Had a Yoder on this job as well. Jewell conversion.
Out of Forks, WA. Dahlgren Logging. I believe this is one of their two Berger Marc VI yarders. Tallest production Yarders ever made. 130ft tubes and hang out around 9000ft. Dahlgrens own the only two in existence. Check out the Flying Cats vid on Youtube.
Different Dahlgren side south of Forks. Madill 3800C with 624C Waratah.
All of these were taken in the summer of 20011. I was interning for a timber comany doing log quality and logging compliance. I worked all the way from the Strait of Juan de Fuca to the Columbia.
Hope everyone enjoys.
Wes
Nice pictures OlympicY, thank's.
OlympicYJ,enjoyed and than some. Thanks for the logging pictures and pictures of the the lay out of the land. That Deere shows how steep that hill is. Just a whole different way to log and the language is different too.
X2 ;)
My daughter has lived in western Wa and now Portland, Or for the last 20 years. When ever we go out I marvel at the logging operations out there compared to here. The size of the timber, the steepness, the equipment, and methods are all so interesting but I have never been able to get as close as your pictures show so thanks for posting.
In 1993 she lived in Marblemount and they were logging a mountain side south of Rt 20 with helicopters, Even from miles away it looked like a big operation.
Beautiful pictures, OlympicYJ. Enjoyed watching the Flying cats on youtube.
Thanks guys. Yea so maybe a little background on me first so you guys get a fel for who I am lol. I grew up on a farm, my old man is not a logger, just a retired heavy equipment mechanic that has done some logging and worked on some big jobs in WA and Ak. I unfortunately don't have pics of our Treefarmer or TD-6. I'm a year and half from my BS in Forestry but have a technical forestry degree already. In those pics I was interning for one of the major landholders on the Peninsula as their first ever operations intern. I'll be working up on the Upper end of the Peninsula this summer so good chance I'll be around Dahlgren's some more. First rate loggers. I'm gonna venture a guess but the tower in my pic is not the Marc VI but a diffent Berger yarder of theirs.
Background on the flying cat's vid. Like I said Dahlgren's own the two largest production yarders in the world. There are non factory yarders that are bigger but they weren't built by a yarder manufacturer. One is in working operation the other is in their boneyard, for parts I'm assuming. The video is on Merril & Ring's Pyist tree farm. There were acess issues and the timber value was not worth it to Heli log. So they flew those cats out to the back end of the unit and logged 80 acres with the cats hauling to the tail tree and yarding from there. They were hangin out around 4000 feet.
The pic showing the new Deere doesn't do the hill justice. I'm guessing it was around 25%. He was popping Helmock stumps like picking up a golfball on the green.
Olympic, thanks for the pictures.
In this one: "Timber King buncher just to the right of the above shovel."
Is that a giant old growth stump I see?
A couple of photos from the other day. I'm currently working on a Red Spruce commercial thinning. This tree was an older White Pine left from a previous harvest that had the top blown out of it this summer. It was a little over 30" diameter at the base.
The saw is an MS441 with a 28" Oregon Power Match bar (I typically use a 20" bar, put this one on just for fun) and the tractor is a Kioti DS4510 with a Farmi 501 winch.
Great pictures guys. :) That 130' yarder must be a sight to behold! :o
Quote from: clww on January 22, 2013, 08:01:52 PM
Great pictures guys. :) That 130' yarder must be a sight to behold! :o
Oh yes indeed. Hopefully I'll be gettin nice and close to it this summer. Did you check out the video?
The saw is an MS441 with a 28" Oregon Power Match bar (I typically use a 20" bar, put this one on just for fun) and the tractor is a Kioti DS4510 with a Farmi 501 winch.
[/quote]
How does that tractor work for pulling out trees that size? Just curious. I got a small kubota l2800hst 4wd and i'd be lucky to pull out 1 tree that size in the snow.
-Matt
It doesn't seem to put much of a strain on it. So far it will pull anything I hook up. I've been very impressed.
Looks great Ryan! Keep it up!
Quote from: Okrafarmer on January 22, 2013, 07:09:30 PM
Olympic, thanks for the pictures.
In this one: "Timber King buncher just to the right of the above shovel."
Is that a giant old growth stump I see?
Sorry for the late reply. Yes that would be an Oldgrowth stump.
From Chuck Ray's Blog. Looks like a great setup.
http://gowood.blogspot.com/2013/01/mid-winter-firewood-blues.html
Have seen that posted and had the thought that Quebecnewf possibly could use such a system to conquer the water transportation and get his logs out... maybe even in better logging conditions.
Wonder what the investment in equipment would be.
I dig his Iron Horse. :)
Ryan, I have the same tractor and have also been impressed by what it can pull. It also has good lifting capacity on the loader, which is why I bought it over the Kubota. The only thing I would like is a middle gear range between the high and low. I think the DK series has that. The Kiotis are quite a bit heavier than the Kubota L series.
Nick
that's a really neat video ron, thanks for the link. i really like small setups like that. seems like that young man has his system down pat! 8)
Just wondering, does anyone here have trouble with popping tires on small tractors like that while skidding? I've been told it's a terrible idea to run a farm tractor through the woods with "farm" tires and that tracks or a real skidder is the way to go. For those who skid with a tractor, what tires do you use? Do you have trouble with your tires?
I haven't really been up to beat with this thread so I'm sorry if I interrupted anything.
Juniperboss, I have never popped a tire on my tractor, but I am a lot more careful than I would be if I had a skidder. The bigger issue for me is protecting the engine parts from branches getting in. I hope to improve the guards around it in the near future.
Nick
I only cut on my land,that makes a big difference. I can take my time,because I get all the money. I run 8 ply tires and never had a problem. But I don't run over my brush much,I cut most of it into 2-3 feet long pieces. Any small stumps gets cut real low to the ground. My small tractor is 40hp by the way. My skid roads are very clean and some what smooth. Any improvements I make I get to use for years.
The cutter measures for a final sawlog cut from the black cherry top and then makes the cut.
LC timber sale 2012.
Nice cherry!
Can't a guy cut the hole top in to, 1', 2', 3' pieces, what ever it takes to get a straight piece down to 3 or 4 inches. Then saw it in to 1x1's, 1x2's, what ever it will make, there would be a lot of pieces of Cherry in that top.
I'm just thinking out of the box
The remaining topwood down to 4 inches was removed as pulpwood and firewood.
This logger works with his wife and his iron mule forwarder. She also falls and bucks the sawlog trees. They produce for a major Lower Michigan sawmill. LC timber sale, 10/2012.
Thats where the money stays on the table, man and wife team. When you wake up in the morning you know where your helps is. If their not there, you have a big problem. :o
My wife ran skidder, fell, bucked up and limbed, i think you call this mill rights.
I sure hope they pay better then the Co. we worked for.
Two sons work with their father in the logging operation. The sons do the felling and bucking while dad does the forwarding and product sorting at the landing. Samfilippo timber sale 2/13.
Hey Ron good pics. Its a great thread you started. Nice to see some local logging. Looks like a beech in the upper photo? Cut some beech not to long ago. The mills I checked with didn't want any or wanted to pay pallet prices so it ended up going in the pallet pile and to the amish.
Not a softwood tree in sight. No small trees either.
Its always good to see handfelling and working with chainsaws :)
This is the same way my father and me and my two brothers did it in the 60's. It involves a lot of labor, lifting and piling, compared to cable skidding. When we got a cable skidder, one guy run skidder, one fell and one bucked up. Then my father used the short wood dray to sort and pile on the landing.
Quote from: Ron Scott on February 15, 2013, 06:16:34 PM
Two sons work with their father in the logging operation. The sons do the felling and bucking while dad does the forwarding and product sorting at the landing. Samfilippo timber sale 2/13.
This threesome was very productive and didn't take much time to stop and talk. The boys had to keep right on cutting as the dad kept right up to them with his Fabtek 344B forwarder. ;)They are now done with the cutting and we are just waiting to get all the wood hauled off so we can close out the timber sale probably next week.
Love this thread. Been reading through it all again. Heres a couple from the past week.
The TJ 610 with a load of 8' studwood
The old TJ 225 pushing up some poplar. We use a powersaw and the skidder to cut and yard the bigger ugly trees that the harvester has a hard time with.
Two trucks loading poplar last week. The TJ 608 harvester sitting idle at the landing getting some fuel and grease.
I love this thread too. As I say this thread will keep you busy for a while. I would like to see more pictures added to this thread.
ken, how big is that 610? looks like the newer 230 forwarders? I like this thread too.
the 610 replaced the older 230 machine, they gave it about 1/16" more cab room then the old 230's so needed to give it a new model number ... lol
they look like a nice machine :)
Quote from: Jamie_C on March 03, 2013, 12:27:01 PM
the 610 replaced the older 230 machine, they gave it about 1/16" more cab room then the old 230's so needed to give it a new model number ... lol
you mean its a tight fit?
They are tough machines and pretty basic but the design doesn't lend itself to operator comfort
Quote from: snowstorm on March 03, 2013, 12:40:31 PM
Quote from: Jamie_C on March 03, 2013, 12:27:01 PM
the 610 replaced the older 230 machine, they gave it about 1/16" more cab room then the old 230's so needed to give it a new model number ... lol
you mean its a tight fit?
I believe a Real Estate Agent would call it "cozy" ... lol
If you aren't careful turning the seat around you will smash your kneecaps off on the parking brake lever, plus if you want to bring anything into the cab with you that is bigger than your shadow then you could be out of luck .. lol
No place to put your lunch?
The 610 does not the most spacious cab but overall this machine (my first forwarder)has treated me very well and works every day. The load is a little better than 4 cord. There are times that I would like a forwarder with a larger cab and automatic tranny but Rome wasn't built in a day and my funds were limited when I was searching for equipment.
a load of grade oak to go to Lindsey Hardwoods in Farmville, Va.
On the smaller side of things, here's a minute long video showing my little skid steer pulling out white pine. You can see how narrow the skid road is as well as thinned and unthinned sections of the tract. The flag line is wetlands setback and the blue trees are slated for removal.
http://youtu.be/OSr9Dqant0o
Here are a couple photos of the yard as well.
This was one of the first loads of saw logs to go out.
You can see from the treeline in the background that the tract was thinning out by this load. I was bringing the trailer load of fir to a different mill with my one ton because there wasn't a full wheeler load of it and I wasn't going to leave it on the landing...
Very typical set up of a logging truck in Maine.
What was you using that long bar for? don't see any trees there that you needed it for? The bar looks 4 feet long. :D
I don't use that saw, I just carry it around and put it in photos to make me look tough...
No, it's only a 28" bar -sitting on some of the smaller spruce and fir logs makes it look bigger.
There was a lot of really wonky (mostly pulp) 24-32" pine on that lot. I didn't like getting on the bad side of the tree, so the long bar was helpful in not having to cut from both sides on each big tree. Even with that bar though, I had to work both sides on some of 'em.
Jed
I got a 28 incher too. I guess I need to put it on a pile of small wood too. ;D Have not used it for years.
That tandem truck would be extremely overweight here in NB even without road restrictions which were put in place this morning :(.
Quote from: Ken on March 04, 2013, 06:08:19 PM
That tandem truck would be extremely overweight here in NB even without road restrictions which were put in place this morning :(.
Looks like a nice legal load to me Ken! ;D
Quote from: Ken on March 04, 2013, 06:08:19 PM
That tandem truck would be extremely overweight here in NB even without road restrictions which were put in place this morning :(.
Here in NS a load like that would likely be a fine of over $1000 if you got caught and depending on which mill you might even be told not to come back. Back when Mactara was still operating if you weighed in heavy 3 times the truck got suspended from delivering for awhile, if it kept happening even the wood producer would get penalised.
Looks like two typical loads to me.
Its all good until you get busted. Have plenty of trucks that haul for me that have gotten 1000+ dollar tickets plus having to unload logs on the side of the road someplace to get under legal weight, then having to come back for those logs on another trip making you lose even more money. 164k is the max gross legal weight here but I've seen plenty of trucks scale out at over 200k, good friend of mine has been trucking for about 50 years and said he used to run overweight all the time thinking he was making more money, after a few tickets, and the increased wear and tear on tires, brakes, axles, bearings, suspension, frames, etc he said he found that running legal weight he actually finished the year with more money in his pocket.
You would not make it far here with a load like that, or the configuration of the truck.
there's not only the wear on the truck that one needs to take into acount, the roads take a beating from all the extra weight and that cost hurts everybody, not only the owner operator.
In and around the city of Charlottetown we have 3 police forces, municipal,RCMP, and DOT. When moving wood on truck or trailer the one thing they all look for is tie down straps. Two every eight feet. The three inch strap seems to please them all. Some you ratchet with a bar , some have a handle.
The guys that are saying that is not a legal size load and truck not legal either,got pictures of trucks in you area that are legal?
I'm not trying to beat a dead horse, ;D but I see loads and trucks like that every day. I have no idea the weight he's hauling,but if I stood on the cornor where the paper mill is,I could take 100 pictures just like that. The state roads are not posted for weight so the wood can be moved. Some guys will save a job on a state road.
The morning I hauled this load did not know it would be my last. The Mill is gone .
I'm trying to figure all this out. :D Is that all you can haul to be legal? Or was that all you had cut?
Just because you could take a picture of 100 of them doesn't necessarily mean its legal. Like I said I know plenty of guys that scale out at over 200k and do it almost everyday. Seen a load or two at over 250,000lbs (that's almost 100k overweight, or the weight of a normal semi/van trailer combo).
Is it legal? No.
Are they getting away with it for now? Yes.
Are they tempting fate? Yes.
Are they putting extra load on the truck? Yes
Are they putting extra strain on our already crappy roads? Yes
Stephen-
What do you mean the mill is gone? For the season? For ever?
No expect with trucking.just saying that's the way it is done without 10 axles under it as you guys do it. These trucks are being weighted beside the road,every so often too. If they was overloaded those weight guys would be all over them after a while.
Here is a load that if I remember correctly scaled out at 250,000lbs. That's close to 100k over weight. He hauled many loads like that off a job and got away with it. Legal? Heck no. But he got away with it. At least in Michigan there are lots more trucks on the road than there are DOT guys, so your odds of getting away with it are pretty good. But every now and then the DOT guys will get a bug in their behind and will sit right outside a mill and stop just about every truck. Word travels fast on the CB and the trucks stop showing up.
WOW!! Like to see the trucks in your area. That truck looks longer than the trucks here. Nice looking logs. What kind?
Red Oak.
Before our road restrictions went on yesterday a 3 axle trailer such as ours can be licensed for 49 500kgs (109 000lbs). Most roads except for the major highways put on a max 80% limit for the next couple of months. Some of the major highways are still 100%. The load pictured below weighed in at a little over 52 000kgs (114 000lbs). That is what we generally try to haul. Overweight by a little bit nearly every trip down the road but not enough to draw too much attention.
I only know of one tandem truck locally with a loader at the back of the cab. I'm not sure what he can license for but I suspect only about 6 cord of softwood. Most tandem trucks also pull a pup trailer.
is that small red heart fir studwood?
What an awesome load of wood ChevytaHOE5674! That would have been a nice looking load of wood to have on a truck at Logging Congress up there. Looks like a Western Star?
Quote from: snowstorm on March 05, 2013, 07:43:25 PM
is that small red heart fir studwood?
That load is spruce/fir pulp going to a newly reopened OSB mill.
Cheers
Ken
Cfarm here the definition of legal pretty much boils down to, will you be stopped and if so fined ? Years ago I was told that for the most part that is pretty much determined by "visual impression" and by the reputation of the truck. With a little effort you can get by. I have never been stopped or fined so that has led me to believe that it works. But to keep it in perspective I have never tried to cross the Provincial scales off Island. Different truck specs allow for more weight. For example they look for trucks with a heavier front. Here they check to see if you have two steering cylinders on the front axle. Then with bigger tires you can have more weight on the front axle. Woodhauler or snowstorm could give you a better answer than I. As Ron has said to stay in business and make a living it has to be market driven. Then you have to get your product to the buyer.
Jed, the stud mill shut down a couple of years ago and dismantled. At one time pulpwood used to be barged over to Newfoundland. Wood harvested here is hauled to NB, NS and to Main. There is a mill that plans to reopen in NS and wood is being bought and stock piled in a pit here. It is my understanding that it will be hauled to NS when the ferry starts up in the spring.
Years ago when we were hauling tree length spruce to a mill in Main the trucker phoned around 2 pm said the load was refused. Told him to pull in behind the big Irving truck stop and stay there till he saw a lot of traffic going by indicating a shift change at the mill. Then beat it back to the mill. Sure enough load gone. :D
Stephen,
Guess you gotta do what it takes- good story. Too bad there's no mills on PEI, but a mill in NS is better than Newfoundland!
Well Jed the word that still sends shivers is "temporary closures". Back then as a wood producer it was hard to know what to do. Before the age of the internet, decisions were based on pretty limited information. When a mill shut the gate it was on to the next. As production overtakes demand things get bad in what seems like a heartbeat. Specs go up and prices down. Lots of good folks lost gear,homes and with the added financial stress some lost families. Things seem to have stabilized . We can only hope for better days.
Enjoyed your video, are the hydraulic filters still stuck out and vulnerable . That would work good on urban lots. When you get that skidder up and running I think you will find it works well on those sites.
Stephen, it seems to be the ebb and flow of all things. I speak as much from family stories as I do from my own life. I'm not seasoned enough to feel like I can say that from experience, but my family has been on the same piece of land for going on 250 years now. It's taken some sacrifice to keep our little piece intact... but I'm getting off topic from the thread.
Just delivered the head, crank, and block back to the shop from the machinists for the 440D. Should start putting the pieces back together tomorrow. The hoses on the ASV are still exposed. I switch between that bucket and a grapple that has the same issue. Ripped the hoses off with a branch last year. But yeah, it's good for small lots, backyards, etc. I do quite a few small jobs- hazard tree removal, pulling firewood for landowners off their land, etc. If I can charge by the hour, then I know I can do okay.
For a lad of your age you seem to have a pretty broad skill set. What I have enjoyed most over the years is site reclamation projects. This can be done for yourself or developers. Removal of derelict structures, tires out of streams, maybe a bridge, walking trails, habitat enhancement and general woodlot improvement. With what you have and a log loader on a trailer I think you would be good to go. Somehow add in some computer apps and digital photography. You thought you could get off topic. 8) 8) :D
Nice looking job Ryan D. How much volume was removed and what type of equipment was used? Whereabouts in NS? Always love to do those types of jobs when the economics allow.
Cheers
Ken
Hey Ryan D its not hard to tell that you take pride in everything you do keep up the good work and where abouts in Nova Scotia is that, im from Pictou County.
Quote from: Ken on March 07, 2013, 07:48:45 PM
Nice looking job Ryan D. How much volume was removed and what type of equipment was used? Whereabouts in NS? Always love to do those types of jobs when the economics allow.
Cheers
Ken
We averaged around 10cords/acre of mostly studwood. The road clearing did put that average up a bit. I had funding for the commercial thinning and we also did some crop tree pruning which helped out with the economics. The woodlot is in Lunenburg and we did all of the skidding with my Kioti DS4510 and Farmi 501 winch. It isapretty slow setup and I'm going to buy a forwarding trailer sometime soon. We mostly do PCT work though, the logging is just a way to stay busy in the winter. I enjoy it the most though.
How many hp is that Kioti again? A forwarder trailer is nice to have. looks good. ;D
45hp tractor. I'm just waiting for silviculture season to start and I am going to pull the trigger on a Metavic 1150 trailer.
This is a video of me cutting some trees on my WHIP cut. I am wedging back leaning trees using some GOL techniques. This was Friday morning.http://youtu.be/J8LFMQMasTI (http://youtu.be/J8LFMQMasTI)
Good video, and thanks for posting it.
Looks like great weather for cutting some trees. If we had less snow, this would be a good day to be out.
But I don't enjoy climbing up on deep snow much at all. :) It is like one long, long stairway.
I only plowed the driveway 2 times this year. It has been cold though and the place I am cutting tends to get wet. It is frozen solid this year 8)
Nice job grassfed
Thanks beenthere and Peter. Here is a shorter 4x speed version. Its kind of funny with the music my wife suggested. ;D http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlJjjvxBiSw&feature=share&list=UUym4bgf95og-g7FdNER2CBg (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlJjjvxBiSw&feature=share&list=UUym4bgf95og-g7FdNER2CBg)
Me a couple saws the skidder and loader.
240b, where was this picture taken? looks like a lot of areas here in PA. What are you running for a loader?
picture is at home in central vt my loader is a '95 180d the 240 is a '95 also..
Very nice looking "Jack" but where's the door? Although I worked without a door for many years after getting one it was hard to do without.
Nice bunch of hardwood logs as well. We seldom get to cut quality hwd logs on private land here.
Cheers
Ken
Have you ever had any problems running rings on the rear of your machine? Not to get this thread off topic, but I was told by a few people that running rings on the back in real rough ground was hard on the no spins in the axles, seeing as there is quite a lot of weight on them with a big hitch sucked up tight. I like that loader alot, been thinking that will be my next purchase. I think the convenience of being able to sort would be great, even if it doesnt ultimately add to the production. Real nice looking setup for sure.
Ken, the door came off because the beech regen was so thick I couldn't get it open (or closed) most of the time in that stand,but yes the door is usually on. I don't think I would want an open cab again, I had one for years. I do cut a bunch of junk also. this was last summer on the same property, nice stuff, huh.
PAFaller, never had a problem with the rings on the back, the rear end has a diff lock, not a no-spin,which might not like all that traction. The skidder will not steer on steep frozen ground with ring chains on the front. (If the tires were loaded it would probably work,just not enough psi to force the caulks into the ice. Locally, the ground we have is a lot like WV.
Good to know. Not sure exactly where you are in VT but Ive seen a lot of the state, my wife has family up around the Randolph area. We usually try to get up there and see our nieces at least once in the summer, and Ive attended the expo in Essex Junction 2 or 3 times. Are the markets holding pretty steady up there?
International Skidder S7C
Looked like it was just being used for firewood.
Quote from: thecfarm on April 19, 2013, 09:49:33 PM
International Skidder S7C
Looked like it was just being used for firewood.
Is that a 'chip' outta that plow (I'm sure it's not a 'plow' ::))? And the tire chain is missing a link or two. Seems that sucker has been used hard. :o :)
JM
Yes,John,that is a chunk out of the blade. good eye on the missing linK. He had a bunch of D rings holding things together. But I see he had the winch covered on it.
240b, I really like your loader and skidder
That cut out in the blade isnt uncommon. It may have been done on purpose, many guys cutting softwood in the winter would run the limbs off the trees with their skidders, at least the top and 2 sides anyways. Back when that machine was brand new most of the wood was still cut with chainsaws and yarded with cable machines. As mechanization took over you dont see that as much anymore, most big crews have stroke delimbers or pull thrus on the landing loaders. Or have graduated to CTL technology and the processors do it all.
The guy that cuts for me is trying out a new JD 1510E 8 wheel forwarder, 6 cly.
This pictures has no tracks on it. They came and put tracks on it.
This is showing the cab swings with the boom.
I went for a ride in it today.That is quite the unit.
is it new? or the almost new one that milton cat had?
1110e looks like
I thought it was a 510E. That was on the side. I forgot where he got it from. I pretty sure it was brand new. I looked at real hard on Saturday and not a scratch on it,the bunks looked like they was never used.
Edit,I forgot the "1" should be 1510E.
And now the old stuff,a Timber Jack
JD does make an 810e but it has 4 cyl. The crane is mounted on the cab half of the machine. There is also 10 11 1210 e. 1110 is the smallest with a six cyl. Maybe its one off or something new
I went back through my pictures before I downsized them,it is a 1510E,for sure. I forgot the "1" I will go back and fix the past posts. ;D And you know the worse part,I have it as 1510E in my gallery. Somehow from the gallery to post I forgot the "1".
That's a pretty good size machine. Very nice.
The guy with the new JD forwarder has this Cat havester with a fixed head on it. He has another havester,but I can not remember what kind it is.
The sawdust is a flying
Cat's Fabtek :)
He does have a Fabtec forwarder. The JD might take it's place.
This logger is a real nice guy. He was cutting here and I asked if he was going to cut any cedar to kinda push it off to the side and I would get it with my tractor. He did better than that,he brought it right down to the sawmill. I went up to see the new JD forwarder and I was in riding inside and I mentioned the dead white pine that was cut with the harvester. They are going to forward it out for the land owner to burn for firewood.
thecfarm
Prolly a lot easier to move it out, than to "push it off to the side" where it still can be in the way.
Were the pics taken in your timber?
None of these on my land. Some would not bother with bringing it out. The ceder was not in one area. So it was"pushed off to the side" to be picked up at a later time. It was all brought out in one load.
Just like the dead wood I mentioned. there would be a live trees and a dead one. He picked up the live trees and left the dead ones. I suppose he will go back and pick the dead stuff up all at one time,the same way he did the cedar.
Quote from: beenthere on April 25, 2013, 10:47:59 AM
thecfarm
Prolly a lot easier to move it out, than to "push it off to the side" where it still can be in the way.
Were the pics taken in your timber?
is prolly like an ex ;) ;D ;D just pokeing a little fun :)
I saw this while driving down the road.
Valmet 546 haverster
the only thing i can see is about all the new machines is you have to be a computer wiz to work on it. i would like to see them last like the old timberjack you posted. but they will be in scrap yard while the timberjack prob be around still.
Quote from: semologger on May 11, 2013, 10:59:37 AM
the only thing i can see is about all the new machines is you have to be a computer wiz to work on it. i would like to see them last like the old timberjack you posted. but they will be in scrap yard while the timberjack prob be around still.
computer wiz yes you have to be. will they not last no. i looked at a 911 valmet a while ago that had 36,000 hrs on it in real nice shape
Quotelooked at a 911 valmet a while ago that had 36,000 hrs on it in real nice shape
If I calculated right that would be 4 years 1 month and 10 days +- without ever turning the machine off.
Quote from: semologger on May 11, 2013, 10:59:37 AM
the only thing i can see is about all the new machines is you have to be a computer wiz to work on it. i would like to see them last like the old timberjack you posted. but they will be in scrap yard while the timberjack prob be around still.
Any machine can last a long time given proper maintenance and care. The more modern harvesting machinery has only been around for the last 25 years or so. I would bet that the well maintained units will be operational for many years to come. My harvester (unknown hours) and porter (29000 hours) are both 15+ years old and chug along every day. Harvesting machines are just big hunks of iron with motors, hydraulic systems and some sort of drive train. Replacing parts on them is no different than repairing old skidders.
At one time I thought that skidders were the only way to harvest wood. My body began to tell me otherwise after 20+ years of conventional harvest work. Although we still use a skidder for some work I suspect it will never be my primary piece of harvesting gear ever again.
More efficient machines make our industries more competitive. I don't see too many farmers still sitting on a stool beside a cow pulling teats in order to fill their milk quota.
Cheers
Ken
Thanks for posting all those pictures, German logger. I always enjoy seeing how things are done in other areas.
German Logger
Thanks for sharing the pictures. I too enjoy seeing how things are done elsewhere. I do have a question though. What is the machine in the 2 pictures before the last one? It looks like a skidder with a crane. Some sort of clambunk perhaps? I thought I have seen most forest machines in action but that one is a mystery! :P
Cheers
Ken
Nice pictures. ;D
@ ken
You are right, it is a skidder. It´s a Franklin skidded with a crane. In Germany the most skidders are modified with a crane cause the normal grapple skidders are senseless in Germany. We havn´t got enough space for them in the forest´s so we have to use cranes. If i can find a pic of the back of the skidder I´ll post it here. You´ll see than how it works.
You guys sure have some cool toys over there. Ive watched some videos of older 240 Timberjacks with the big butt plate and two winches. Always thought that would be kinda handy to have, you could either sort out your skids or at least work off both sides of a trail without kinking the cables every which way. If you dont mind my asking, what brands of conventional type skidders can you still get in Europe?
Quote from: PAFaller on May 17, 2013, 10:20:42 PM
You guys sure have some cool toys over there. Ive watched some videos of older 240 Timberjacks with the big butt plate and two winches. Always thought that would be kinda handy to have, you could either sort out your skids or at least work off both sides of a trail without kinking the cables every which way. If you dont mind my asking, what brands of conventional type skidders can you still get in Europe?
There are still a few like Franklin, John Deere, Camox, Noe, LKT, HSM, Ritter, Welte and a few more I guess. Most of them come with a crane or get one before delivery. Even though cranes are very common over here HSM , one famous german brand placed a special crane- less type on the market last year: http://www.hsm-forest.net/hsm-805-s.html .
Nice job stacking and thanks for the pictures.
Nice looking piles ;)
I could look at those photos all day long.
In the third pic of the forwarder piling wood it looks like a masons line(string) strung out where the front edge on the pile to be. wow thats planning.
Good eye 240b. :o Now that you mention it,the fifth picture I see some too.
And I use to to enjoy seeing pictures of Southern logging.
I just saw the string line, too. I guess it makes me not feel so bad, I usually get to make my piles on stumps and dozer spoil piles from punching the road in ::)
The line is my cheap trick to make nice looking piles :) Sometimes it´s very usefull and it only takes a few minutes to set it up. Of course I don´t do this for every little pile since I´m also able to do without... :D
Neat, straight piles are impressive, regardless how you get them that way. Good job.
I like to take pride in my piles as well but they never look that neat. Great job the truckers must love you.
Nice stack, wow. Mine are always crooked and leaning. :D. Nice equipment, I love seeing what you have over there.
I'm guilty of painting a dashed line once in a while. I usually put more effort into it when I'm forwarding a job on my own- we often have two or more forwarders on the same job, all piling in the same piles. Then there is no sense in being that much neater than the other guy, I would just get frustrated ::)
Crossover Vehicle from Chuck Ray's Blog.
http://gowood.blogspot.com/2013/05/canadian-conversion-logging-vehicle.html
i just bought a 511 ex hydro axe and was debating on buying a track machine with a processing head. but i bought mine for 20 and didnt think i would be able to find a cutter in that price range. a guy in the woods does pretty good just topping. i can finish up with the knuckle boom and delimber what he dont get
Quote from: german.logger93 on May 16, 2013, 08:18:23 AM
Hey guys,
I´ve got some pics from Germany for you..
(photos deleted for brevity)
German.logger93, what brands are those farm tractors? Some of them look like John Deere and others like Case, Valmet, or Fendt. I can't read the names on them.
Quote from: Okrafarmer on June 07, 2013, 08:47:13 AM
Quote from: german.logger93 on May 16, 2013, 08:18:23 AM
Hey guys,
I´ve got some pics from Germany for you..
(photos deleted for brevity)
German.logger93, what brands are those farm tractors? Some of them look like John Deere and others like Case, Valmet, or Fendt. I can't read the names on them.
Looks like a Case IH and a couple Steyrs?..
Yes, could be Steyrs. Forgot about them and several other European luxury tractors we don't see too often over here. :-*
Still want a Lamborghini tractor for my birthday. . . .
This was something a little different for us...had a crew come in with a whole-tree chipper for a first thinning on some loblolly pine. Pretty neat operation to watch.
This is a picture of one of the decks they cleared to make room for the chipper (there are a total of 10 different stands in this contract - 218 acres)
They are running 2 feller bunchers and 2 skidders on this job - this is a Tigercat 822 tracked buncher, don't see them running too often in this part of the state
Skidder pulling wood to the chipper
My kind of logging deck! (Well, it's a tool trailer, but still :) )
And of course, a logging job isn't complete without a small breakdown. Ok, a pretty big breakdown...
The whole swing bearing came apart??? Whew, glad I don't have to be involved.
Quote from: 1270d on June 25, 2013, 05:29:26 PM
The whole swing bearing came apart??? Whew, glad I don't have to be involved.
I'll bet the operator got quite a rush. I was standing beside a truck a few years back when the remaining bolts on a swing bearing broke and threw the loader operator quite a distance when the tower toppled. He wasn't hurt but it sure shocked him.
Quote from: VT_Forestry on June 25, 2013, 02:39:09 PM
This was something a little different for us...had a crew come in with a whole-tree chipper for a first thinning on some loblolly pine. Pretty neat operation to watch.
VT Forestry Do you get a lot of tree damage due to loose bark this time of year or is that not as much of an issue where you are? During this time of year it is nearly impossible to due a thinning without scarring many of the leave trees
They are running 2 feller bunchers and 2 skidders on this job - this is a Tigercat 822 tracked buncher, don't see them running too often in this part of the state
There are several of those 822 Tigercats in this area. Most are running CTL heads. Very compact machine. Thanks for the pics
Cheers
Ken
I suspect you would find that crews maintainence regimen to be lacking a bit :o
For sale. Used Peterson tree length chipper. Cab and crane sold separately.
Quote from: 1270d on June 25, 2013, 08:26:35 PM
For sale. Used Peterson tree length chipper. Cab and crane sold separately.
:D :D :D
(I was slow on that one !! )
Quote from: barbender on June 25, 2013, 06:49:32 PM
I suspect you would find that crews maintainence regimen to be lacking a bit :o
Oddly enough, they seem pretty good on their maintenance - I guess when things are gonna break, they're gonna break!
Quote from: 1270d on June 25, 2013, 08:26:35 PM
For sale. Used Peterson tree length chipper. Cab and crane sold separately.
:D :D :D :D
Quote
I'll bet the operator got quite a rush. I was standing beside a truck a few years back when the remaining bolts on a swing bearing broke and threw the loader operator quite a distance when the tower toppled. He wasn't hurt but it sure shocked him.
He was pretty shook up. The other guys were giving him a hard time, said when he came out of the window he looked like a squirrel flying out of a knothole in a tree when it's getting cut down - I guess he wasn't sticking around long enough to try and use the door...with 1050HP of chipping power running wide open, I can't much blame him ;D
Quote from: barbender on June 25, 2013, 06:49:32 PM
I suspect you would find that crews maintainence regimen to be lacking a bit :o
I suspect that they will be checking the bolts on the loader bearing a lot more often after this, funny he couldn't feel the loader moving on the bolts ... the cab should have had noticeable movement long before all the bolts let go
Thirteen years ago I had to jump out of the way of a dump truck body that broke and fell over sideways under load. I jumped for cover and landed on my right shoulder, which I have had trouble with before that time, and ever since. My boots got covered up with gooey fermented corn silage. Thank God, nobody got hurt.
This is a typical Maine truck,in my area, hauling 16 foot pulp heading for New Page in Framington,ME.
We have the same trucks around my neck of the woods.
I wish we could move our wood 16', all of our mills are set up for 100" wood. This means you get to load a forwarder twice, basically, one bunk at a time ::) It would sure be faster handling long wood. About the only long wood we move is pine saw logs.
All the pulp wood around here is cut 21'.
That's typical for here as well. That one would look good in my yard. ;D
All semi log trucks in my area. I saw one 10-wheel a month or so ago. Pine and hardwood pulpwood is hauled tree length down to 3" I think. Pine chip-and-saw 27' down to 10" top. Pine and hardwood sawlogs look to be primarily 12' and 16', two bunks on each trailer. I think some hardwood is cut to 10' for crosstie mills. 84,000 lbs gross with forest permit.
you should have taken a pic of the other side of the truck. unless they replaced the hood the left fender got ripped off when the truck was just a couple months old.
It's like half of a "real" log truck.... haha :D
There still is a short truck or two set up like that around here. But 99 % of the pulp wood is on TT as tree length. Some are self loaders, so shorter stuff there. At one time it was all 100" around here, even in Maine markets we had. Now most want random length, or tree length. ;D We even have oversized loads that are not highway legal. Real high and wide. I'm telling you they really sway back and forth on the road. Rock a bye baby........... :D
Maine372,George never told me about that one. The only one I know of was when Justin was coming out of the woods on a steep hill last winter and almost made it to the top and he lost traction and went backwards. George takes good care of his trucks and equipment. If something happens,it gets fixed and replaced. The left side looks just as good as the right side.
These are some pictures of my own small crew operating in SC.
Hydro AX 411B
Oak Saw logs
Hardwood and Pine Pulp :)
Timberjack Making big pulls ;D
so are you telling us you are making the head for barko now? fill us in
I believe I saw that in escanaba last weekend isn't the barko equipment repainted Puma equipment?
I saw it too ;D The head does look Fabtekish ;) :)
Quote from: CTL logger on September 13, 2013, 06:07:25 PM
I believe I saw that in escanaba last weekend isn't the barko equipment repainted Puma equipment?
it sure is
So is the head for sale to other manufacturers as well. Like john Deere? I heard there was trouble with the measuring system on the one you mounted on the Deere.
will it be another 6 months before we get the rest of the story?
is doing cot to length with a processor and forwarder much faster than tree length logging. i use a felller buncher skidder and a loader with a pull thru delimber. i would like to go to do all cut to length out in the woods. rather than tree length but dont think i can afford to make the change over. that would cost alot of money i dont have. also how well do the processors do in oak. i know of one timbco in my area and they use a 525 cat skidder to skid with.
CTL is slower than a buncher job almost all of the time. Some advantages of ctl are less ground disturbance and the ability to leave an better stand because of maneuverability. For pure production though a hot saw, grapple combo take the prize
Quote from: 1270d on September 15, 2013, 08:12:34 AM
CTL is slower than a buncher job almost all of the time. Some advantages of ctl are less ground disturbance and the ability to leave an better stand because of maneuverability. For pure production though a hot saw, grapple combo take the prize
X2, another thing is that CTL equipment can often still work in conditions that shut conventional equipment down.
We have very few stands that wouldn't just be clear cut out right, so you have to be in nice stands to be able to justify it. And the wood has to be more valuable than pulp prices. They work here rain or shine. I've seen them aloud to destroy roads in wet conditions on public land to keep the wood flowing. We often get on a thinning block in the fall and some block is up for logging on the way in, so much for the road. Just think of the ruts on the land. We find them, when thinning, every one. ::)
thanks for the info very useful
That's unfortunate swamp donkey. It doesn't do very well for our reputation. The job I am currently cutting has a maximum rutting depth of eight inches, any more and we are shut down, or made to fix damage. I try my best to lay good mat down in trails, but it is difficult when thinning to 80 ft2.
Quote from: snowstorm on September 13, 2013, 08:17:22 PM
Quote from: CTL logger on September 13, 2013, 06:07:25 PM
I believe I saw that in escanaba last weekend isn't the barko equipment repainted Puma equipment?
it sure is
The two roller head on the machine is new. The machine itself has been tweaked. The measuring system on the yellow four roller has been sorted out, and the first one is sold, and headed to Vermont.
Quote from: FABTEK on September 18, 2013, 08:11:35 AM
Quote from: snowstorm on September 13, 2013, 08:17:22 PM
Quote from: CTL logger on September 13, 2013, 06:07:25 PM
I believe I saw that in escanaba last weekend isn't the barko equipment repainted Puma equipment?
it sure is
The two roller head on the machine is new. The machine itself has been tweaked. The measuring system on the yellow four roller has been sorted out, and the first one is sold, and headed to Vermont.
now its getting interesting. lets hear more
The pictured Barko harvester is a new design. It's essentially nothing like the Puma. Took some video of the machine running. I'll try to get it uploaded soon. My videos are never all that impressive, as they are usually taken during the first few hours of the machine's life.
Here's a little CTL work-
...and more- here's the machine at the end of the woods road, the road was "slashed in" as it's called up here. I threw a bunch of tops, limbs, and a few whole trees across the trail to keep vehicles out, as per the forester's request.
Thank you- I can't spend too much time tidying my piles, I try to make them so they are easy for the trucks to load out of. I hauled out of enough scrappy piles when I drove truck ;) I make them as neat as I can, as fast as I can :)
Aspen and white spruce pulpwood-
Job finished, last look back 8) I've been driving almost 2 hours one way for this one.
I don't know what the problem is, I keep posting the same pictures ::)
Are these the ones,
Pulpwood picture
Last look
Several truckloads in them piles. Nice big landings make life convenient. I'm some glad our pulpwood does not all have to be 8' anymore. Most of ours is cut 16'. I too would be very happy to see a job done that requires a 2 hr one way drive.
Yes, it's surprising how much wood is sitting in a pile. Even what looks like a small pile. ;D
Nice pictures barbender, looks like a nice clean jobsite. If I could stack that good maybe my trucker would give me a better deal :D
This was a job from this summer, our conventional crew cut this block (you can see the tree length piles in the background). They hand bucked the red pine logs and I forwarded them to the landing since I was on the same job. Pine markets are such in our area that logs don't pay as well as stud bolts, so if it is less than the 20" Max diameter that Potlatch accepts, it gets cut to 100" and sent to them. So all of these are over 20", 12-20' long. Poston, eat your heart out ;D
A few more- conventional landing, JD limber, JD 748 skidder, and a Cat skidder, I don't remember the model.
The Cat grabbing a small bunch as I forward wood out behind him, it's fairly unusual for us to work next to each other like this.
Not all days are nice piles and big landings :(
It's not a big deal blowing a hydraulic line on the crane, but I sure dread the ones under the cab in the belly pan. It was about 95° that day, I know that won't get any sympathy from the southern members, but that's too hot for people that spend half the year below freezing ::)
Too hot to be messing with hydraulics. What a sweaty job...
At least you were smart enough to scrounge up a hunk of cardboard to lie on while crawling around underneath. Nothing like wallowing around in hot oil soaked sand. ;D
Your right Piney, once my clothes get "hydraulic mud" on them they usually go in the garbage ::) So, it is nice to have something to lay on. That particular hose was the main supply line going to the valve block that feeds the crane functions, probably about 10 gallons sprayed out in the belly pan. I really hate losing toxic fluids on the ground like that, but there is really way to recover it when it happens that quickly :(
my JD 350b and international 504 with primero trailer
That looks like a nice set up, EricR. Do you cut for yourself, firewood or a sawmill?
I like the looks of your setup, too, EricR. :)
It would be tough to beat for low impact work ;)
I like it. And then some. What year is the tractor? Hp?
I currently am logging with a John deere 550a and use my cat skidd steer loader to load with I got 2 straight trucks a 600 and a 700 ford I am a small operation here in the Appalachian mountains of ky looking to get a bigger jd 700h dozer
A nice load of red oak
My new toy just signed the papers today
I like that truck,year.motor? And the logs.
It's a 79 f700 with a 3208 cat motor great little truck I love my old fords the logs where red oak some old growth timber I have another ford 600 I will post a pic of it
Pic of my ford f600 gasser
Almost a pair. :D Not many trucks like that around here now. years ago the farmers use to put wooden stakes in thier small dump trucks and haul pulp. I can't remember the last time I saw a single axle truck hauling logs.
That's all I haul with my self I have had better service out of the old f series than any other truck I have owned I have had the orange f600 sense 89 I also have a 91 ford f450 dump truck I haul short stuff on sometimes
Don't even think about crossing our scales with those loads on a two axle truck. :o I remember dad needing help to cut oak lumber down to a manageable size, I always tried to find something else to do. :D
Nice to see there is still a few small guys left . I have hauled many a loads on my old single axle ford over the years .
Another CTL landing
A load of hardwood sawlogs leaves the landing for the sawmill from a winter 2013 timber harvest.
That's a nice load of logs :o
Has he got enough axles? That is a nice load.
Wow , I would hate to put a new set of tires all around on that rig $$$$$
Quote from: shortlogger on October 14, 2013, 04:24:02 PM
Wow , I would hate to put a new set of tires all around on that rig $$$$$
I think someone says that every time a picture of a Michigan truck is posted :D
My new office. Timberjack 450C
Our little tree farmer C5
The tractor trailer my pop hauls logs with. I'll have to get a pic of the peterbuilt log truck soon.
First peterbuilt log truck with 124 Prentice loader
those 450s were good machines. I had a 460 for a short time and we wont go there
Nice looking trucks
Woody
Was that Pete built in Clearfield Pennsylvania by Hubbler Bros?
I believe it was. The other Pete he drives I know for sure did. Just picked it up from there about a month or so ago.
I thought it looked like their work. the shape of the standards and the Hydra head board gave it away.
I grew up with those guys. they build great trucks
Is the new truck on their truck of the month web site?
Woody
Not that I'm aware of...
Fabtek 344B Forwarder. Works a hardwood selection harvest this past winter January, 2013.
Ron - What species of tree is it that the forwarder is loading? I presume the one on the ground is from the same tree...my guess is beech but since my experience with them is very limited it's a WAG at best.
Clark
Yes, American Beech.
Those are nice looking trucks. I really like that Pete with the Prentice loader.
That forwarder really caught my eye. I have never seen a short one like that around here.
You guys may have long trucks,but short forwarders. :D
Nice pic Ron. I like those fabteks. I see Jason Lutke has a 344b for sale right now.
John Deere 1270E Processor. Getting ready to start a CTL pine and aspen harvest. A Ponsee Elk forwarder will be picking up the CTL wood behind the processor. Dunn Timber harvest, September 2013.
The
Ponsee Elk Forwarder follows the John Deere processor in the CTL pine and aspen harvest. Dunn timber harvest, September 2013.
My little log truck. Mixed hardwood Evans job aug2013
My 1964 c4 treefarmer pulling a 42 inch red oak
You may have a little truck,but that loader looks big. ;D
Oak matts are placed across the wetland on the access and forwarder route to prevent excessive rutting and ponding by the CTL harvesting equipment.
Quote from: Ron Scott on October 26, 2013, 06:16:07 PM
Oak matts are placed across the wetland on the access and forwarder route to prevent excessive rutting and ponding by the CTL harvesting equipment.
Ron, are those mats 'tied' together (spikes, webbing, other?) or the cants just laid side by side? And are they left to rot after the job?
JM
Those look to be pipeline style mats that are 4' x 16' and 8" thick, and bolted together with 4 long bolts. Yes, you usually save them for the next job as they are not cheap. look up "pipeline mat" and you will see companies that specialize in producing, selling, and renting them.
What Stumpjumper said. I was out the other day retrieving some with a grapple skidder, some areas we put them in with the skidder because our forwarders can only lift the mats right next to the machine, they are heavy.
We are having a power line upgrade. I see them things 3 deep in places. :o I see truck loads of them things now. And stacked by the roads waiting to be hauled under the power lines. When all this is done,I would think those could be bought cheap.
They use to make them out of hemlock in this area. I was talking to a logger and he was selling hardwood,maple, to a place in New Vineyard,ME that makes them.
Yes, they are the type mats used for pipelines and power lines. They are carried out to the job site on logging truck or flat bed, placed by the forwarder and then retrieved when the job is done for use elsehere. The are bolted or cabeled together in 6 x 20-22 foot oak plank sections.
A good time to get them is when the power or gas line company's are done with their use of them. They often give them away for the taking.
Good to know, thank you guys. I've seen those on powerlines as well Ray, just couldn't tell if those were the same thing that Ron posted...they are a bit 'rougher' than I had seen. ;D
The John Deere 1270E processor works a CTL harvest in a red pine plantation. Bougrand timber harvest, October 2013.
Various CTL products such as 22 foot hops poles (becoming popular with the increasing brew makers), small sawlogs, and pulpwood are cut and placed for the following forwarder to pick up and forward to the landing.
Those are some straight logs.
Nice looking red pine stand Ron. Tell us more about the 22 foot hops poles. I've never heard about that product here. Are the volumes needed significant?
Gary
I grew some hops this summer. Did not do much last year,first planting,but they grew this year. We did not havest the fruit.
The "hops poles" were a new product for me also. I wasn't aware of this market until this red pine producer had a market for them and started cutting them. I'm not that familiar with the growing of hops but I guess they need long poles up to 22 feet. With all the micro beer brewerys going in around here I guess that there is more demand for hops and the long pine poles necessary to grow them.
Googled "Hops growing" and several pics shown of the "pole" stand that the hops grow up.
one for instance
http://brewutah.blogspot.com/2011/01/start-hops-co-op.html
Appears to be a product that could withstand some hop-pole butt treatment with a preservative before it goes into the ground. Looks to be some real expensive layout that is involved.
There is a small hop yard where I used to work. Similar setup. Rows of poles with cables strung between them. They used locust poles.
That's a nice stand of pine Ron. I've never had an opportunity to work in planted pine. I'm guessing a stand like that would lend to high production even in a partial cut.
I had a guy call me a year or so ago wanting long black locust poles for something like that. I think he said he was growing grapes or something. I didn't have anything but I was curious why used light/telephone poles wouldn't work? They would be a lot cheaper. Around here you can usually get them for free and they are still in ok shape.
In the link BT posted, it looks like they are using pressure treated poles.
I had to pick up some mats today, sorry for more of my fuzzy through the windshield photos ::) This was an area on a haul road that had a swamp "flowage" through it.
These things are heavy, you have to crowd right up next to the machine to lift them, even then the crane just barely lifts them over.
In WA state we had allot of hop poles made out of alder, Alnus rubra. I don't know of any alder hop pole markets now; but back when my dad was in high school, mid 60's, him and my uncle cut some but they were mostly doing plug poles for paper rolls. The hop poles went to Eastern WA mostly around Yakima. They used to grow lots of hops and still do but don't know how much anymore.
Quote from: Tom on March 27, 2002, 05:49:22 PM
I've heard snowbird farmers talking about cutting their trees in the winter like this picture shows. Then they say they go back in the spring and cut the 10 or 12 foot butt cut. :D
HEEE, Heeeeeeeee......... :laugh:
That reminds me of what my Dad used to say if we didn't tramp down or clean out the snow around the butt before falling (felling): "When are you going to come back and get that cord?"
The
John Deere 1270 Processor lays down various products in this CTL red pine thinning. A
Ponsee Gazelle Forwarder will follow and remove the cut wood to
the landing for trucking.
Ron do you now what the pre and post harvest volumes were and let us know the age of the stand?
I'm surprised they would be able to thin a red pine plantation with stems that size. all the rp plantations around here that I've seen don't have the crown size to even respond to a thinning when they reach that size. That stand looks really good though.
What is the red pine used for? We've got a bunch of it here on the farm. Other than 50 poles sold in the '90's for a log cabin restoration, we've never found a viable market, or use on the farm, for it.
Ken,
This is a 63 year old red pine stand. It was previously thinned about 13 years ago by removing every third row. Prior to this second thinning, the stand contained 12,500 trees at an average of .083 cords/tree for a 1,038 cords total volume. The basal area averaged 190-200 sq. ft.basal area.
The second thinning by a selection harvest took the basal area down to an avearge basal area of 90 sq. ft. 3,184 trees were removed for 265 cords harvested. Approximately
25 % of the trees were removed in this second thinning. It was primarily a thinning "from below" removing the worst first.
Dave,
Red pine is used for sawlogs and structural wood in the housing industry, cabin logs, utility poles, landscaping timbers, hops poles as in this harvest, pulpwood, etc. There is a good red pine market in this area.
The Gazelle Ponsee Forwarder moves the red pine products for sorting at the landing. Bougrand timber harvest 10/13.
Time to bring this thread back up to the top
We are building a roadway through a 33 year old stand that was pre-commercially thinned in 1993. Predominately balsam fir with some red maple and white birch. Locally there are thousands of acres that will soon be available for harvest work again. Although the piece size will be small these stands will be nice to work in due to their uniformity.
The new roadway will be slightly more than a mile with 3 turnouts and 4 pipe installations. We pile the grubbings to one side of the roadway, dig a trench for road bed material and then fill in the trench with the grubbings.
One of the pipe installations required a no grub zone so we had to use a gravel truck to move enough material to cross this wet area.
Cheers
Ken
Neat project, Ken ;)
Good photo documentation.
Great looking road! Are you building the road to access a future harvest site? or were you hired just to build the road?
Quote from: redneck on November 27, 2013, 04:07:39 PM
Great looking road! Are you building the road to access a future harvest site? or were you hired just to build the road?
redneck We are also cutting a bit more than a 1000 cord off the block at this time. The company that owns it plans to wait another 5-10 years before harvesting the remainder.
240b Nice pics except that second to last one. It looks like it was a wet mitten day. We sure don't get that quality of maple around here.
Where abouts are you located?
Been a while since I've been on here, kept overly busy this past year building a business and specialty equipment. Bought some beasts of the forest. Tigercat 630B, Tigercat 635, JD 648GII and a JD 748E... the 635:
Nice to hear from u again bobus , are logging or buying and selling equipment? If you need any help with those tigercats, let me know I may be of assistance. They are well build but different from the rest.
Don't see to many of them rigs in my area.
Nor here.
Quote from: kiko on December 29, 2013, 04:10:35 AM
Nice to hear from u again bobus , are logging or buying and selling equipment? If you need any help with those tigercats, let me know I may be of assistance. They are well build but different from the rest.
Still working for a utility construction company building all terrain cranes and diggers (pics of the completed rigs too come) and working hard at upgrading from the one man, saw and 440 to a fully mechanized operation. Got a boom delimber found, and maybe a Timbco, still figuring on a skidder. Just unsure what to get (working with those Tigercats was a game changer)
Nice to see Bobus2003 back ,hope you can make a go of things that skidder is a neat-o beast,long ways since the old stroke head and cable skidder good work :new_year: :new_year:
Why not get a knuckle boom, loader and delimiter, so much less maintain ace and expense of a stroker. Skilled operator meet mill specs around here without the auto measure day in day out. Even top size. That big skidder would work a stroke delimiter silly. I have seen those 635 bring 13 to 15 ton per turn, but they don't get around good picking up they wood, they need a small skidder dry decking at the main skid road. True story A customer of mine half cut a track of same age wood with conventional delimbing equipment the other half was processed with a brand name harvester and the conventional crew cut out more logs than the harvester. It was a bet and they flipped for which half got processed with what. More logs on the conventional side , maybe. Operation skill me thinks. I do under stand southern logging is different and the methods are different. So there is the disclaimer for feeling the processor or stroker is a waste of time and money, cause they are around here.
Kiko, that 635 came out of Southern Georgia.. Its not a machine that can/could be used here very well. Most our timber sales are too small with leave trees to close. I bought it and had it shipped up here and we outfitted it with a 27' pressure drill.
I know what your saying about a boom delimber, especially after watching an operation in Florida/Georgia this summer, but the limbs we have on the P-Pine would tear up a knuckle boom and limber where the Timberline booms were built for these trees. My biggest problem currently is what brand of skidder to go after. I've ran many Deeres and really liked them so I thought a 648/748 would be good, but after seeing and running the Tigercat 630B I think one of them would be a big producer compared to the Deeres unless it was a 848..
Did you remove any of the grapple boom parts to fit the drill? If so I might be interested in purchasing those parts from you employer if they are so inclined.
Kiko, PM Sent
I thought I'd put some pictures on here from some of our harvesting labs this fall.
First off is a john deere 700 series buncher working in a mixedwood clearcut.
Whole trees were taken to roadside by an 848h grapple skidder.
A 2054 processor delimbed and bucked at roadside. Not sure what Warratah head was on this machine. (Sorry for the Picture quality, it was a bright day)
The logs were then sorted by a loader (No picture for that). There were 5 or 6 different products being cut here. The smaller diameter stems were being chipped for hog fuel or pulp chips.
Quote from: Mark Wentzell on January 02, 2014, 07:29:26 PM
The smaller diameter stems were being chipped for hog fuel or pulp chips.
Showing my ignorance here but what is "hog fuel"? Great pics/write-up, Mark.
Hog fuel likely (or can sometimes) mean it is being shipped to someone running a co-gen system, and burning the chipped (hogged) wood for heat and/or electricity.
Sometimes the chipper is referred to as the "hog".
Quote from: JohnM on January 03, 2014, 09:43:08 AM
Quote from: Mark Wentzell on January 02, 2014, 07:29:26 PM
The smaller diameter stems were being chipped for hog fuel or pulp chips.
Showing my ignorance here but what is "hog fuel"? Great pics/write-up, Mark.
Hog fuel is basically the same as pulp chips except the bark, branches and leaves/needles are chipped as well. Like beenthere said it's used in cogen plants or burned for heat.
Next few are from a "commercial thinning" in a mixed stand of spruce and fir. There were two different methods used here, the first was a short wood system utilizing a kioti forester manufactured by payeur distributions out of quebec.
The forester is a stock kioti tractor attached to a metavic forwarding trailer. The tractor has full rops canopy, belly plates, protection for the engine and a hydraulic winch.
I bet those horses and a man that knows how to use a chainsaw can make a place look like no one has been there.
I always enjoy seeing the low impact and especially horse logging. The 848 and monster processor were pretty cool too I guess ;) Keep it coming.
logs layed out to be scaled and sold
Great pictures of those ponies, Mark! :)
Quote from: barbender on January 04, 2014, 01:43:54 AM
I always enjoy seeing the low impact and especially horse logging. The 848 and monster processor were pretty cool too I guess ;) Keep it coming.
There's definitely applications for both. A lot of landowners like the horses and the tractor for how low impact they are. Both methods are also not that bad production wise, the forester put up about 10 cords for the day. And that was with a bunch of people all trying to learn how to run it, in really crappy wood. The horses put up less wood but I think we were slowing them down :D
Yeah, quit petting the work horses :D
test
ha! it worked, I may have this figured out.
treeslayer,are those logs you cut? What kind and where are the logs going to be used for.
nope, can't do it again
Quote from: thecfarm on January 05, 2014, 01:33:54 PM
treeslayer,are those logs you cut? What kind and where are the logs going to be used for.
yes sir, yellow pine going to the mill. they will make large timbers from those. 12x12 and such. pics is kinda tricky here, just tryin show y'all what I do.
Slayer your pics always have nice sticks.
I just upload pics into my gallery, then copy and paste the link in the pic description into my post. Found its the easiest way on a smartphone.
Those are some serious looking pines from the Eastern Shore. 8)
thanks guys, I have been fortunate to be in nice timber for a while. the big boys with cutters and delimbers don't really like to do selections so I do mostly stay in oversize. copy n paste, gotta try that.
Quote from: clww on January 05, 2014, 06:51:35 PM
Those are some serious looking pines from the Eastern Shore. 8)
yep, n you got some down yer way.....or ya did, I ain't been down there in a while. you ain't real far really.
Nice! 8) What will the timbers be used for? That's my kind of truckload.
Treeslayer.. man those are some sweet looking logs.. I'll take a load of 8 to 12 footers.. your probably headed in my direction anyway! ;D
Those are beautiful logs!
Dave, I have no clue but they pay better for the fat ones lol.
Ken, no pine goin yer way all hardwood goes north. we got little choice on pine now as only one mill left local.
thanks Barbender, we cut off at 52' now because of new length rules.
Most of the pine logs up here go for power poles, Bell Pole is the name of the outfit that gets most of the logs. A few go for log homes, a lot less than there used to be after the housing crash. And I've never seen a load of logs like treeslayer's up here :o They look like perfect cylinders.
We usually cut ours at 16.5', unless it's a special order. We did a trailer load in November of some really clear pine trunks. I cut them all at 41' length, filling that trailer with only seven trees. :) On the small end, they had to be at least 16", and any size on the butt. Not sure where these were sold or what kind of $$$ they fetched.
Basically, our pine markets are anything less than 20" is cut 100" for the Potlatch stud mill. A lot of beautiful logs are cut up 100" and sent there because they pay as much or more than log buyers, it's a hassle free wide open market, and they pay promptly. Oversize logs arr cut from 10'-20', with 16's being most common. When I referred to "logs" in my previous post what I meant was tree length. Either way, we have a lot of nice pine timber cut into 8' 2x4 because that's where the money is.
This is a question for the guys with small operations like the guys who are one or two man crew who just have a skidder and some chainsaws. How do you get your skidder to the job. That might be a dump question just wondering. I have towed a timberjack 225 on a big gooseneck trailer with my f250. I know that was to much for a f250. But now we use the log truck with a home made trailer to haul the skidder around.
My taylor weighs 20k so I hire a dropdeck @ $80. an hr.
Yep same here I hire out the trucking to move my TJ240. I wish I could find someone local at 80/hr. THe cheapest I can find is 100/hr. Adds up quick.
I have a guy with international dump truck and a 9tone tag along.
I haul a TJ 350 for a guy with my truck and trailer. It's a 10 ton trailer with removable log bunks. When he bought the skidder, he hauled it from Minnesota to Missouri with a one ton dually and a gooseneck.
Haul my JD440 and 550G dozer on a 20k lbs GN flatbed with my F350.
Bobus2003 what year f350 do you have.
A couple pics from our latest job.
Tree length cedar merchandised to a 4" top. Longest ones are 35'
Spruce logs heading out the trail
Cable skidder and power saw used for larger hardwood
That's nice Cedar, Ken ;)
Nice cedar. Mine's all rotten in the middle that size.
Quote from: missouriboy on January 07, 2014, 07:19:06 PM
Bobus2003 what year f350 do you have.
Currently a 2012 Reg Cab, used to use a 06 Crew cab, and a '99 F250 before that, pushed the limits of the F250 though.
Bobus2003 whats the specs on your trailer. I am looking for one but don't know what I should get.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QL-cWCBLe08&feature=share&list=UUw9S4v_O3CXuYGlH19iMkTA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s3niyYpWsCc&list=UUw9S4v_O3CXuYGlH19iMkTA&feature=share&index=1
Quote from: missouriboy on January 11, 2014, 04:18:59 PM
Bobus2003 whats the specs on your trailer. I am looking for one but don't know what I shouuld get.
I have Longhorn 32'+4' gooseneck, 20k lbs rated, tandem Dexter 10k Oil Bath axles running duals.. and a Longhorn 20'+4' gooseneck, same specs
Don't know what beavertails or tilt decks are running around these parts but to move a big shovel on a lowboy (4 axle truck, 2 axle jeep, 2 or 3 axle trailer with a 2 axle booster) you're looking at about $600 a move. Why most loggers with allot of iron usually invest in a lowboy. They pay themselves off real quick. Especially if you run a hayrack when not moving machinery or you have one of the quick change 5th wheels or move for other outfits.
Ron, have a DC70d my self just wondering where this one is located. I'm in northern wi. Have you seen many with processing heads on them the one I got has a 2 roller Fortec on it, a1300 model I believe.
Pettibone Master 12D Cable Skidder
That beast looks very experienced. ;D
A few pics of the current job we are on. Harvester working in an area heavy dominated by cedar and spruce.
Porter cleaning up area. Notice the larger hardwood logs and pulpwood that was cut with a powersaw as they were quite large for the harvester to deal with.
Load of tree length cedar. Notice that this trucker has his self loader attached to the side of his trailer. Only set-up I have ever seen like that.
Couple of loads of hardwood pulp headed to the mill that is less than 20 miles away. Harvester is headed to the fuel trailer.
Looks good. I have never seen a self loader on the side like that. Could you please get a picture on the other side?
I've never heard of a loader mounted that way, either.
I've never seen a side mount either, but it looks like an innovative way to solve a problem.
??? That load would get him pulled over here.
I think it is all white cedar, I don't know if you can fit enough on to be overweight.
I've seen sideloaders before on B trains for 8 ft pulp an d they were detachable.They would leave them at the site too reduce weight.That was 15 years ago,haven't seen one since,probably more trouble than they were worth I'm thinking.
Folks
Only way he can load shortwood or treelength and take the loader with the load. It is also the first time that I have seen such a setup
Al
I'd also like to see a pic of the other side I'm curious about how its mounted?
I'll try to get a pic today of the side mounted loader if he shows like he is supposed to. Our truck had the front differential blow apart last Thursday so our landings are getting full.
Quote from: sawguy21 on February 02, 2014, 10:49:34 PM
??? That load would get him pulled over here.
That load only weighed slightly more than 45 tonnes (100K lbs). We are allowed 49.5 tonnes on many roads around here.
Here are a couple of pics of the loader set up on the side of the trailer. That set up allows him to haul 2 1/2 bunks of random length wood or tree length. The load of hardwood he was putting on in the pictures would weigh about 55 tonnes when finished which is quite a bit overweight but it's only a few miles to the mill.
Now I see. Interesting. That is one of those things that I put the brakes on driving down the road,turn quick into driveway,or whatever,and I have to go back and check that, I tell the wife, I have to check this thing out. ;D
I think every one should get a OC3 so i don't feel alone
Got a picture of it,so I know what I am looking for to buy? ;D
Quote from: thecfarm on February 06, 2014, 04:10:35 PM
Got a picture of it,so I know what I am looking for to buy? ;D
you must be the only one who doesn't know because i am sure every one else knows. but i guess just cause you are a Mainer
Maybe I was the only one to ask too. ;)
Quote from: Big timber little dozer on February 06, 2014, 07:42:00 PM
Quote from: thecfarm on February 06, 2014, 04:10:35 PM
Got a picture of it,so I know what I am looking for to buy? ;D
you must be the only one who doesn't know because i am sure every one else knows. but i guess just cause you are a Mainer
Just when you're most sure of something, someone will prove you wrong. :D
What the heck is an OC3?
OC3??? No one has heard of it for being such common knowledge ::)
Ooops doubled that up, just meant to edit original post.
Moderator can delete this if possible. SORRY! :)
Quote from: redprospector on February 06, 2014, 10:48:02 PM
Quote from: Big timber little dozer on February 06, 2014, 07:42:00 PM
Quote from: thecfarm on February 06, 2014, 04:10:35 PM
Got a picture of it,so I know what I am looking for to buy? ;D
you must be the only one who doesn't know because i am sure every one else knows. but i guess just cause you are a Mainer
Just when you're most sure of something, someone will prove you wrong. :D
What the heck is an OC3?
I don't know for sure, but just a guess that it's a small Oliver crawler tractor? OC3= Oliver Crawler 3? Google turns up some results for that anyways...
Oliver oc3 stands for oliver cletac 3 or it it stands for oversized log carrier :P ;D
here's a pettibone skidder.
I like that 'bone, logman. I think if the FEL had a quick connect system, it would be slick. But can you imagine trying to sneak through a thinning with that on? I bet they get quite light on the back end if you pick up a good load ???
Got back in my forwarder today after about a month off, moved into a nice little Red pine sale.
The big pile is 8' pine saw bolts, the small pile in front of the machine is 12' and 16' logs, and there are random length poles (or house logs, I don't know, I just put em on the landing ::)) behind the machine.
Quote from: redprospector on February 06, 2014, 10:48:02 PM
Quote from: Big timber little dozer on February 06, 2014, 07:42:00 PM
Quote from: thecfarm on February 06, 2014, 04:10:35 PM
Got a picture of it,so I know what I am looking for to buy? ;D
you must be the only one who doesn't know because i am sure every one else knows. but i guess just cause you are a Mainer
Just when you're most sure of something, someone will prove you wrong. :D
What the heck is an OC3?
OC-3's are actually quite popular in Maine. They are about the size of a smaller skidsteer, weigh 1.5 - 2 tons soaking wet, were made from about 1950-1960ish, and were made in large numbers. They came in several widths-- narrower ones work better for sneaking though the woods. Wider ones were used for cultivating row crops, and in some cases were used with very wide track shoes for crawling on top of deep snow for special applications such as working the sugar bush, grooming ski slopes, or taking hay to ranch cattle after snow storms. Some people would simply bolt a long 2X4 to each track shoe for extra flotation in snow. The OC-3 replaced the Cletrac model HG after Oliver bought Cletrac in 1944. The HG was made for a few more years, then replaced by the OC-3. The HG and OC-3 looked nearly identical, in fact many of the parts interchange, and there are nearly as many differences between an early HG and a late HG as there are between an HG and an OC-3.
Quote from: barbender on June 17, 2014, 11:09:10 PM
Got back in my forwarder today after about a month off, moved into a nice little Red pine sale.
Nice dry landing to work on and tidy 8' pile. I could use a dry landing. Has the bark already tightened on the pine or was it cut earlier and just being forwarded now?
Ken- no, the bark hasn't tightened yet. This wood was just cut last week, and yes, it is a nice dry landing. It has been really wet here, we had a wet spring and the rain just keeps coming down >:( There is actually some major flooding 100 miles to the north on the MN/Ontario border on the Rainy River.
This is a picture of my "pole skidder" ::) This is the first time I have had to move poles with the forwarder. It works about as good as you can imagine, not very much fun on this hilly job.
The bark definitely has NOT tightened up on the Aspen we're in. It's hard to make a pile 2 sticks high with this stuff, it is so slippery >:(
I feel your pain. Started running forwarder for a friend of mine 2 weeks ago now. The bark won't stay on the aspen to save your life, then its been raining every other day so the decks of logs just slip and slide all over the place. Can't keep the aspen in a pile over about 6 feet high before it just slides every which direction like somebody put a grenade in the deck.
Poplar and balsam fir seem to be the worst to deal with when the bark is slipping. We cut our poplar random length so it is a little better.
I started cutting a small patch of Scots Pine today. It's bark is slipping and is so slippery the measuring wheel on the processer can't always get traction.
Need to remember to take a camera to work one of these days. Snapped these with my cellphone Friday of the processor working its magic on some 20+ inch aspen trees on a narrow little ridge that we are cutting.
who are you skidding for Chevy?
Friend of mine has had a log truck for a while and now just bought the logging equipment and we are cutting for Plum Creek. Company name is MSP trucking.
Big step up from just a log truck, that processor looks pretty new $$$ :o
Like to bring this thread up once in a while. We just finished a job and here is a pic of the new harvester waiting for its second float drive. This time only 4 miles up the road. This jobsite was alongside a public road which is always nice.
Sharp machine, Ken ;) I forgot, what are you running for a forwarder?
Quote from: barbender on August 12, 2014, 11:05:02 PM
Sharp machine, Ken ;) I forgot, what are you running for a forwarder?
Old Timberjack 610. Although it still works great at 30K+ hours it will now be the weak link in the operation. Will have to look for a replacement before long.
Ken, sometime between 2000-3000 hrs we started to get some hairline cracks on the frame welds and feedwheel arms on our H480C . Top knife also cracked along the bottom. Not major issues but just thought Id pass it along so you can watch for anything. I have around 3800 hrs on it now.
what kind of wood are you in SPforestry? Seems like we had 5000 or so hours before any cracks showed up on our 480. Both roll frames had broken by 8000. never had a knife break. Mostly cutting hardwood, some very large.
Ken, when I used to haul wood, the one crew I hauled for ran a 703 like yours, I don't know which head it had but it stayed in large aspen most of the time. They had a Ponsse Buffalo King paired with it to keep up. I think they had a fair number of 100 cord days with that 703 ;)
Cut plenty of big spruce and HW but lately it's been smaller spruce and fir.
Quote from: barbender on August 14, 2014, 11:27:51 PM
Ken, when I used to haul wood, the one crew I hauled for ran a 703 like yours, I think they had a fair number of 100 cord days with that 703 ;)
There will be no 100 cord days in this mess
At least everything appears to be laying in one direction.
Maybe 30 a day?
Wonder if it would be faster to have someone cut them off the stumps with a saw and than u run behind and process. It's not really big wood. Give me a full days head start though. Lol
Quote from: chester_tree _farmah on August 17, 2014, 09:52:59 AM
Wonder if it would be faster to have someone cut them off the stumps with a saw and than u run behind and process. It's not really big wood. Give me a full days head start though. Lol
The easiest way to cut them off is with a dangle head like Ken's. You don't want to have to cut them by hand. I always thought one of the Bell dangle head fellers would work dandy for pre bunching in blow down, when our crews do it with a hot saw feller it has to have a skidder working right with it. Then another skidder pulling the bunched piles, or a processor working the piles. We typically just use 1 CTL crew and keep it simple ;)
This is an old field site so the trees are shallow rooted. Most of them were solid so they did not break instead the stump partially uprooted. Really hard to get the stump cut low and not ruin too many chains. Many of the trees and stumps can be pulled up off the ground before cutting the stump off. This site is averaging 0.15 m3/tree of mostly (80%) 8' studwood and the remainder pulp. Averaged 9 m3/hr yesterday. Should easily average 13-15 on a site like this if it was still standing.
Cheers
That's pretty decent wood Ken ... since we went back to work in May we have averaged 0.09m3 per tree
Hello everybody! This is my first post here but have been following along with your adventures for quite a while now.
Just wanted to share pics of my new skidder... It is a 1950s FWD Corp "Blue Ox" straight frame skidder with International 6cyl gas engine, 5spd transmission with hi/low transfer case and a Carco winch.
I saved it from the scrapyard and it is going to get a new lease on life. Wish me luck!!! :)
I'm a wishing.
Welcome and good luck. Age is just a number. At least that is what I tell this cute little thing at the corner store I stop at. HA..
Seriously. I was out working on the farm the other day and heard an unmistakeable sound. A putt putt John Deere Tractor. At least thats what we used to call them. Sounds like each time it hits is the last. The farm across the hollow used to have one and may still have. They still used it in the 70s and I guess still do sometimes. Once you hear one working you will never forget the sound.
That Blue Ox skidder is certainly an interesting piece with it's ROPS. ;D Let us know how it works out.
Yes, good luck with it. Keep us posted on its progress.
how has the 622 been? what are the faults? Do you process all roadside, or in the woods behind a buncher.
Thanks for the pics. Ron, the John Deere E series forwarders are quite common here. Wish one was in my budget.
Jamie_C I bet that bad boy loves fuel. What do you burn/hr?
1270d ... we process at the stump behind a pair of Tigercat 870 bunchers, only trouble with the head so far has been the computer module that controls the bottom knife. Currently it is jury rigged by being wired to open and close with the feed wheel arms, it's a pain in really limby/crooked wood but I deal with it ... boss doesn't want to fix it properly
Ken, actually for a machine that tips the scales at about 27 tonnes with the head the old girl sips fuel. It has the Mercedes engine, we can get four shifts out of a tank of fuel (957 litre tank capacity) .. I figure average fuel consumption is around 20 liters an hour.
I'm new to the forum, but have been full time producing for 35 yrs. spent the last week reading this thread, enjoyed it very much, I'm for central lower MI and know a lot of the operators that Ron Scott posted. On pages 23 & 25 there are pictures of a Hydro-Ax with a boom and processor head, that was ours and here is the story behind it.
Our Hydro-Ax dealer was Doyle Equipment and at that time they were getting a lot of used machines on trade without a good market for them. So Joe Doyle and I came up with the idea of mounting a boom and processor on a 511, Hydro-Ax had done this before in the 1980's with a model 6200 which was a boomed carrier with a 16 inch buncher head on it. This concept never took off however Hydro-Ax did get the bugs worked out of them before they were discontinued.
So they mounted a new Serco loader, reinforced the mast and main boom, then put a new LogMax 5000 on it. All the tires were loaded for better stability, the pumps were changed to accommodate the boom and processor. I bought the machine as an experimental unit, it had great speed and power but lacked good stability and needed an extend a boom. Overall it gave us good service and in decent wood averaged 250 cords per week.
I sold it in 2005 along with TJ 1010 forwarder and bought new chip vans, our main operation is flail chips for PCA in Filer City, MI
I will try to get some pictures of our equipment on the forum ( still learning )
Thanks for reading sorry about being so long.
Mike Cook
M Cook,welcome to the forum. Thanks for the story of the Hydro-Ax.
A load of mixed hardwoods pulpwood is about ready to leave the landing. Hintz timber sale 8/2014.
I just never get over those Michigan trucks :o
I dont know how they afford the rubber. How many cord or tons are on that truck ?
Quote from: BargeMonkey on September 06, 2014, 09:05:23 AM
I dont know how they afford the rubber.
I was thinking the same thing when I saw those pics. Man, that's a bunch of tires!
Legal weight is around 50 tons/20 cord of wood depending on the setup of the truck. Most guys run more than that. Our truck normally hauls 25 cord and our hired trucker claims he can haul close to 30 cord depending on destination.
It does cost a lot more to own and operate Michigan trucks, we currently have one self loader that can gross 164k and can legally haul 112k. We also run 5 chip vans that are 135 cubit yards capacity with 6 & 7 axles under them legal to haul 96k. We are allowed 11 axles total, with anywhere from usually 3-5 air lift axles to be able to corner.
It is very expensive to purchase these trucks and trailers, also maintenance is very costly, the mills in this state expect us to haul our wood to them cheap because we are allowed to haul so much weight on a single load. They don't seem to care what our costs are.
The other diffulculty with our trucks is it takes a lot of iron to get them out of the woods when the roads are mudded out, also you need good drivers who are familer with hauling heavy weight, the wrong guy can tear up a lot of drive line.
Pulling the bridge panels out.
1/2 done. The panels where 6x30 and 5-6 tons each. Approach to bridge was graded, seeded and mulch 75' from each end with 2 water bars.
Long slow drag out.
The woodlot im working on now.
New bar for the slasher.
Barge Monkey, that was not a nice name to call her, :D :D
5 or 6 ton for those panels :o What are they made off , I beams ? But sure is a nice way to cross a waterway.
Quote from: Southside logger on September 09, 2014, 10:38:10 PM
Barge Monkey, that was not a nice name to call her, :D :D
She decided she was coming to "help" me in the woods today, lets just say her future as a weekend skidder operator doesnt look too good. :o
The panels are 10" thick, steel frame with solid HW beams filling the panels. I have a JRB coupler and forks for the 644H loader, and she knows it when you pick one of these panels. My barko loader will pick them but its not pretty.
Slow going by myself, finish this lot up next time I get home. Will NEVER buy wood thru this forester again. Back to the boat early Saturday, just in time to bring the boat back out.
Barge monkey
Good looking 450 jack, I used to have a 480c, we're still running a 560 & 660 jacks. We bought a couple of 848's after deere bought out Timberjack, but they haven't held up as well as the 60 series TJ's. We're still running them but are switching to Cats, we got a 545c that we are real happy with and also have a new 535d ordered that we're excited to get later this fall.
Mike Cook
Mike,
For some reason Cat skidders are rare around here, I know of 1 508 and a 518, southworth our local dealer hasnt had the greatest reputation, but Nortrax isnt far behind them. That 450C came out of northern NH, she runs good but I think she has been around the block a few times. Im happy so far with it, im actually thinking of buying a 380C I see for sale because of how nice she pulls. I park all my stuff for the time im gone, more of an expensive hobby than an actual job but its something to do, cant sit on the couch and collect welfare like the Obama crowd. :D
The load I dropped to the mill this morning, 3970bft. Not to bad, brought ok money.
Slowly getting some wood back in the yard, shipped a bunch of firewood already and it hasnt even started yet, will sell every stick I have this year.
Where I find the time to read the FF most of the time. :D
BargeMonkey,
There aren't very many cat skidders here either, but cat is aggressively going after the forest industry and are doing extensive redesign and engineering on their equipment lines. Cat also bought out Prentice and have improved that equipment also. We currently are running a Prentice 2384 that was built by cat and also a 573c buncher, both machines are doing well and are much better built than the previous models.
Looks like you have a nice operation that allows you to enjoy cutting wood without all the pressure to put out everything that is possible every week.
Mike Cook
I bought my slasher from Southworth, and they keep stopping in, I just cant justify a super new machine. Cat owns alot more than most people realize, between acquiring Blount, who owned prentice and fabtek, they also bought a company called "united railway", who owns EMD. In the marine world you have 3 choices for tug engines, MTU = junk, EMD, or Cat, I bet they control 80%+ of the market. All my stuff is paid for, I hustle but its been getting extremely aggravating lately, finding help just isnt possible. Back to the real job saturday, paid to sit and watch gauges, break other people's stones, drink coffee.
BargeMonkey
I hear you about help, in 35 yrs of logging I've never seen anything like the labor force we have today. We run 18-20 employees, between guys taking different jobs and drug testing I only have 5 guys left that have been with me more than a year! In our area the biggest competition for labor is welfare, they give them housing, food, and money for doing nothing.
What brand of slasher do you have, we run a Barko 160b and a 2384 Prentice both with Siiro Slashers mounted on big john self propelled carriers. My first slasher was a Barko 130 with a S&L 44 slasher, I bought it in 1982, can't tell you how much they have improved since then.
Mike Cook
I just read in a mag cat is coming out with a 555D. That should be interesting. Cat has tried getting us to buy a skidder also but they were much heavier then our 648h.
Firewoodjoe
Your right about the 555d, it's not much bigger than the 545d, they both use a lot of the same components. They are a little heavier than the deere's but I feel they are better built and have surpassed deere in both engine and skidder design. I have a new 535d ordered and was given a tour of the cat factory in LaGrange, Georgia. They have spent a lot of money and listened to I put from loggers on machine design, when they come out you should take a look.
I'm not to far from you (Harrison) when I get mine this fall get a hold of me and you can come down and try it out if you like.
Mike Cook
I'll prolly see it at your shop. We're always driving by. Thanks for the invite too.
Looking forward to meeting you
Mike Cook
Did she move anything?
That bar looks totally fixable. I've actually been amazed how much the abuse and hydraulic pressing the bars can take to get straightened out and still remain usable.
Ive pressed this one quite a few times, has a few good cracks and this time it busted 1/2 the rivets in the tip. Take it off when I get home and try. Bought a rail tool from Baileys that works great on the 3/4 bars. Im impressed with how much abuse my slasher bar takes, and how much wood it chews thru in between sharpening.
One of 3 Tigercat 870's with Hornet heads that are on our crew ... two of them run double shift and one is kept as a spare and is only ran a few shifts a week, primarily when one of the others breaks down.
The hornet is purely a "shortwood processor right ? A mechanical stop on the end, and a processor with rollers ?
They are roll feed, no computer to speak of. Length measurement is done by paint marks on the head and by running the tree out until it hits the butt plate. Very crude compared to any of the newer heads but in the right wood they can really shine. They weigh somewhere around 10,000 lbs so need a big carrier to handle them.
BargeMonkey, what rail tool did you get?
Those big hornet heads really shine in the hardwoods that would destroy most dangle heads. There used to be a number of them in the hardwood areas of northern NB. Not sure about now.
Quote from: jwilly3879 on September 16, 2014, 06:00:50 PM
BargeMonkey, what rail tool did you get?
Baileys had a rail straightener, fixed everything from 3/8, .404 and 3/4, I cant seen to find it again. It has a handle and a heavy strike plate, gets those tweaked spots out of bars. We have had a bar grinder for 15yrs plus, thats how you get life out of bars. 150-200 cord from a .404 processor bar. Looks like a coke bottle when you throw it away.
Yoder Job 2014
Delimber and slasher
skidder
Loader & loggers truck
I always been thinking of a grapple boom like that. Does yours swing to to side as well ? And did you build this ?
Looks like an Esco swing grapple?
It is an esco, it was on the machine when I bought it. Honestly don't know what I would do without it. Comes in real handy reaching around obstacles or bunching logs. Have to be careful pulling large hitches on tight turns. Or getting boom on downhill side while lifting a log. All four tires have fluid in them so that helps
8) 8) I want one too
Got to the woods today, trying to knock this lot out.
This came in the mail, they must like my picture. :D
I hate when this thread goes dormant so will bump it back to the top. I should not have mentioned that last week was my best. This one not so much. This is how the week started and it did not get much better.
Yikes !! Is there a matching new sneaker for the other side too ?
That rubber looks like some serious $$$$ to me.
I know one day it will me my turn again ;D
A brand new 30.5... ouch. :o
M Cook
I hear you on finding good help.. We would like to get another processor but just can't find anyone that can take care of the machine and get production..
I'm Duane's kid Brian ( Leonard forest products) and I wish we were getting what the UP guys were for our pulp that would sure help.. At least log prices are coming up..
Figured I would post some pictures from today,
had 8 of these like that today, cleaning up the wood on the edges of this woodlot, about 3 good days left.
I bought that 3120xp about 1yr ago, first time im using it and im kinda impressed. Wont carry it to far but she gets the job done. :D
the 2 sticks of hemlock sitting on my loader are around 200-220yrs old, the rings are so tight its hard to tell, its a shame they are full of shake.
not a bad pile of wood for 3 very long days... 7 in the morning till 7pm.. :D thank god its going to be "tugboat monday" soon
How many guys are you working with ? That's a lot of equipment to run for one guy. ;)
8)Uhm... ive had 1 guy help me the last 2 days to skid. Other than that im the only one, i normally dont have much help. Cut a bit, skid, slash. Repeat. :D the help just isnt out there, and the cost of comp in NY just makes me more determined to not hire anyone. My stuff gets parked while im gone on the boat, got a whopping 600 hrs on my Timbco in 3.5 yrs. :D
Lumberjack
This labor situation is costing everyone money, the markets are the best they have been in years and the help isn't out there to take advantage of it. I have more than enough equipment to run a second flail chip crew but don't have enough people to run it full-time. Meanwhile the markets are putting pressure on us to do more.
Things never stay the same for a long time, so when the economy slows down there'll be lots of help but probably won't need it. Such is the wood business, where else can a person have so much fun.
Mike Cook
Bargemonkey, if my piles looked like yours the truck drivers would get together and lynch me ;D
Quote from: barbender on October 12, 2014, 11:14:36 AM
Bargemonkey, if my piles looked like yours the truck drivers would get together and lynch me ;D
Normally I would truck some out before it becomes a mess, and this header is on a postage stamp. The sawmill is only 3 miles up the road and I have to go over the landowners lawn so I only wanna go when its super dry.
barge monkey that soft maple looks good the hearts anyway ;D if that was by me they would have holes half the size of the tree ;D where do you sell your soft wood what mill is up the road from you how long are you on the boat for this time
Quote from: BargeMonkey on October 12, 2014, 01:15:34 PM
Quote from: barbender on October 12, 2014, 11:14:36 AM
Bargemonkey, if my piles looked like yours the truck drivers would get together and lynch me ;D
Normally I would truck some out before it becomes a mess, and this header is on a postage stamp. The sawmill is only 3 miles up the road and I have to go over the landowners lawn so I only wanna go when its super dry.
I'm just ribbing you, you can pile your wood any way you want ;)
M Cook
I don't know how Chris Muma and Lutke find the help...
And ur right it sure would be a lot better if the markets would stay this good forever.
What do you get per pulp cord for oak firewood?
Lumber tick
Chris, Shawn, and Jason struggle to find good help also.
We don't sell any 8 ft firewood only cut and split, prices for 8 ft oak firewood is $90 & up for green and $100 & up for seasoned around here. Chris told me in September that Shawn and him were not taking any more orders because they were already booked through April of next year.
Mike Cook
Quote from: coxy on October 12, 2014, 06:30:19 PM
barge monkey that soft maple looks good the hearts anyway ;D if that was by me they would have holes half the size of the tree ;D where do you sell your soft wood what mill is up the road from you how long are you on the boat for this time
The firewood on this job didnt turn out to bad, the logs where kinda so so. Our sawmill is about 3 miles up the road from the job, we saw 99% of the softwood we cut, or ship the hemlock for pulp. The mill im selling to now for good logs is about 15 miles away. Go back for 7-10 days this time, hard to get much done on short trips home.
M Cook
We are getting 100 for green oak and 120 for seasoned.. 90 for mixed hardwood.
We are just putting people on a list got a good 40 orders right now.. Crazy how people wait till last minute
Lumbertick
I think we could see even higher prices before spring, there isn't going to be enough firewood for the demand. The last time I remember anything like this was the early eighties, that was when Leonard Forest got started hauling firewood 24/7. Hope it will continue but odds are it won't, gotta get all you can while you can.
Mike Cook
M Cook
Ya we still have a ton of those old customers..
We have turned down over half of them we don't go any further down then birch run now.
You buy alit of ur own sales or just so a lot for pca?
We buy all our own wood, were also hauling to DPI in Alpena. A couple times a year we chip plantation aspen for PCA on their land.
Mike Cook
M Cook
I see you guys must get pretty good money per ton out of those clean chips?
Lumbertick
We get more than pulpwood prices and can produce a lot more tons, but it is an expensive investment.
We are closely monitored on bark content and chip size, and need to feed decent wood to chipper so we don't pull any scrag logs.
Someday when you have time get a hold of me and I'll take you out to job and show you what we're doing, right now we're around 10 miles from Tobie's mill. Tobie has my number.
Mike Cook
M Cook
Sounds good.. I would like to see one of those work
Daylight on the landing, on a large UPM aspen sale (company land). Unfortunately, the harvester operator will find a flat tire waiting for him this morning.
Now thats a nice neat pile of wood. ;)
Yup it's gotta be somebody's pile who knows how to run a forwarder. 8)
The truckers must love coming to your job 8)
I try to keep it as neat as I can and still keep hustling. I used to haul wood and I know first hand how it stinks when the landing isn't right and the piles are messy. Plus, the truckers get paid by the load and I get paid by the hour. I figure if I make a mess just to up production a bit, I'm lowering their hourly wage to do it. Maybe it's that Golden Rule thing ;)
Barbender
How much production do you average per hour with that Ponsse is decent wood
Well, it depends on the skid length a lot for forwarder production. If I get this machine heaped good, it's 7 cords a load. Right now the skid is almost 1/2 mile, I top the load off with big wood and pile it as high as I can, it has to be close to 8 cords then. At that, I get one load an hour. Last night a I was tired of the long skid, so I moved wood that was right on the landing and piled as much in 3 hours as I had in 10 on the long skid. Overall, I try to have an average of a load per hour I work, that includes time spent on maintenance, greasing, etc- if I have 50 hours on my paycheck I want 50 loads on the landing. The processor is probably getting 10-12 cords an hour in this wood- good production.
Does he cut them down or you guys got a buncher in front of processor?
No buncher, we never use that method. The numbers for the processor are in good quality aspen, 10"-12" dbh, 6-7 sticks and flat ground.
Quote from: barbender on October 15, 2014, 09:05:38 PM
I try to keep it as neat as I can and still keep hustling.
Everybody on this site can appreciate the nice pile of wood but only those who have piled wood with a loader can appreciate the expertise of the operator who piled it. Great job.
Quote from: barbender on October 16, 2014, 02:21:47 PM
No buncher, we never use that method. The numbers for the processor are in good quality aspen, 10"-12" dbh, 6-7 stocks and flat ground.
Wow 10-12 cords/hour. I need to get better
I run a fabtek 133 and I average 8 cords in hour in good aspen and 10 cord an hour in red pine... Hardwood averages 6-7 per hour and I cut it down with processor... We tryed running a shear in front of it but didn't really help.. Only time it is good to run a shear in front of a processor is if you are going to chip
Thanks for the compliments, Ken. Now on the production numbers, there's a few poor areas on this sale where I doubt they cut 5 cords an hour, probably closer to 3. Small wood, and lots of brush. That stuff kills my production too, I only got 8 loads out today in 9 hours. A long skid with small brushy wood >:( The outfit I work for has some darn good processor operators no doubt, I have worked behind one (in a Ponsse Bear) that was keeping 2 of us in forwarders busy, in medium to large aspen. Around 140 cords a day. That's not every day, but we got in a groove where he was cutting 80-90 cords per day with just me following him, and he wasn't pushing hard. I know that because he was parked with his feet kicked up a lot ::) I wasn't going to call him on it cause I knew I would just be working longer days to keep up :) This operator was also on a Red pine final felling where he had 2 forwarders AND a skidder pulling poles out :o Understand, that's not everyday either, that's the job everyone talks about for 5 years afterward ;) As a forwarder operator, I know when I'm getting moved to different sales what to expect by wood types- decent aspen clear cuts will be getting put on the ground at anywhere from 70-100 cords a day, first entry red pine thinnings 30-60, winter black spruce 30-40.
100 cord in 1 day stacked on the header would be like the high point in my logging career. :D 1/2 a load of saw logs, 16-24 cord of firewood, some logs for us and maybe some pulp is about all I ever get in 1 day.
Quote from: BargeMonkey on October 16, 2014, 11:56:51 PM
100 cord in 1 day stacked on the header would be like the high point in my logging career. :D 1/2 a load of saw logs, 16-24 cord of firewood, some logs for us and maybe some pulp is about all I ever get in 1 day.
I hear you, but I bet if you went and got the million dollars and bought a new CTL team and were cutting the same wood, your pile would be just as big or bigger at the end of the day. Production is a very relative concept. If I'm hand falling and cable skidding by myself, I'm quite proud of 10 cords ;)
I gotcha. I wasnt breaking your stones, more of pointing out that region and wood type have alot to do for production. If I had to keep 90-100+ cord to the header every day I would be out of business pretty quick, not a lack of wood, I dont think you could move fast enough. Your seeing a touch more CTL around here but cable skidders are still 100-1 vs forwarders, i will admit it does do a cleaner job. I see a new 644K MH and a 100' stacker coming before anymore wood equipment unfortunately. ;)
Fellow who buys white cedar locally has this trailer/loader rig. He hauls up to 750 bf.
That's nice looking cedar. That grapple is unusual, I've never seen one quite like that. Is it a factory unit, or something he fabbed up? Bargemonkey, I didn't think you were busting my stones ;) I'm just pointing out, in my case, it's more the equipment and wood than the skill of the operator- trying to be humble here ;D I'd say my production is better than average, but we have a few forwarder operators that can walk away from me. It drives me nuts because it's not for lack of effort on my part. So my point was, in the same circumstances, I'm sure Bargemonkey logging would have piles of wood on the "header" that were just as big ;) I didn't take your comments as a dig at all.
Quote from: barbender on October 18, 2014, 09:00:30 AM
That's nice looking cedar. That grapple is unusual, I've never seen one quite like that. Is it a factory unit, or something he fabbed up?
Yup, I've got some nice cedar. May as well log it before the woodpeckers ventilate it!
He can handle 22 ft logs on his mill. He needs 9.5 inches s.e.d. - he squares the cedar for log houses.
The loader has "CHARGO" printed on it. The rig is made somewhere in Quebec. I'll get the name of the industry from him. It has 4 initials - something along the lines of BMJP Industries...or something like that.
A really awesome videl I found on YT, shouing how it was done "back in the day" in the PNW. Those old steam donks could really move the logs, and fast!! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I0K5XwmGmuw
that is some nice looking cedar kodiakmac, cedar was what i cut when i first started logging, cut it all winter and dropped 15lbs and well lets just say i need to start cutting cedar again hahaha
kev
Great video thanks for sharing
Start learning to run it tomorrow
8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8)
1270D where are you cutting at?
Too bad the Scorpion doesn't have space for a passenger as I'd love to take a ride in it.
On his lap ;D I didn't know you were getting a Scorpion, 1270d. Is it a Scorpion King? I haven't worked around ours yet.
It is the king model yes.
Our operator has been pretty happy with his Scorpion. A couple of things he didn't like- one, he said it turns like a John Deere and two, the fact that you have to back out of strip looking over your shoulder. Both things you should be used to ;)
Quote from: kculler on October 20, 2014, 07:03:12 PM
that is some nice looking cedar kodiakmac, cedar was what i cut when i first started logging, cut it all winter and dropped 15lbs and well lets just say i need to start cutting cedar again hahaha
kev
I had 4 trees that were 9.5 inches or above at the 48 foot mark. I measured the tallest on the ground and it was 83 feet 9 inches - and there is a good two feet of stump. It had a bit of dry rot in the centre at the butt end for the first 3 and a half feet. That's pretty good cedar for around these parts.
You U.P. Loggers must make more money then us in the lower half of the state... We'll I know you do you guys get almost double what we get for your pulp wood.. That machine looks mean what's the price tag? I heard somewhere around $700,000 before they came out
1270d That is a sweet looking ride/office. What size head do you have and does it have a top saw to deal with the hardwood in the background?
this is H7 head with no top saw. Tried it for the first time today, very nice to operate.
Cutting a first thin red pine plantation currently. Snapped a few pictures today in front of a deck of bolts.
Chevy, is that a Caribou model forwarder? What is your load capacity?
1270d, I'm looking forward to more reports on the Scorpion King. I'm waiting for the forwarder to come out that matches ??? What would they call it though? Seems it has to be something from the animal kingdom ::)
Ken, I don't think a top saw is available on any Ponsse head smaller than an H8, which is the head that is run on the Bear model. Our Bear has doesn't have a top saw, I heard we demo'd a head with one. They must not have found it to give much of a boost, cause we didn't keep it ::) I think they would be slick in hardwood, and the big aspen we cut (technically hardwood, I know). To be honest, most of our guys are so production minded that anything that slows the head down gets hacked into pieces and left, not the best use of resources I know, but that's how it is.When I ran processor for a friend, with no top saw, I would end up having to drop a stem and spin the head around to measure a stick because the top knife was hitting a crotch or whatever. It would have been nice to just push a button. I was just watching some videos of a 703 in hardwood with a topsaw, it looked real slick. Does your head have one?
Yeah its a Caribou leveled off its about 4 cord, if I really heap it up I can get close to 5 on there. Only really heap it up if I'm close to the landing or along the road.
Piled high ;)
thats a loaf!
;D I don't usually mound it that high, but this is a loooong skid so I want every load to count. The weight is fine for the machine's capacity, however today I had an overload issue- unfortunately it was in the cab. I broke my seat :o I'm getting too portly for my porter, maybe?
Break the mounting bolts or what?
No, right where the pivot points mount to the frame. They are built too light, or I am built too heavy ;D How is that Scorpion treating you, 1270d? You're going to have to change your handle :)
whats in a name? that which we call a rose by any other name would smell as sweet. :D
Definitely liking the scorpion a lot. not seeing the crane is huge, and the head is awsome. rolls through crooked hardwood very well. Also very powerful. The machine is very comfortable as well, very little jostling etc.
The crane handles quite a bit like the Deere so that helps me too.
you dont worry about breaking a hose and having the crane land on the cab
1270d
What do you average per hour with the scorpion in hardwood?
I've only run it for two days. Wont have any averages for a while.
What about the 1270?
I'm asking because I run a fabtek 133 a And we are thinking about getting a dangle head machine.. The salesman will tell you anything you wanna hear... Just trying to see what the guys that run them say..
what kind of wood and ground are you in?
Down here pretty flat ground and the wood is not to bad i would say average hardwood tree is 7 sticks
We cut 60 percent hardwood the rest popal and red pine
Thats the last pile I had down below, all stacked up in the yard, rained thurs and sat at the mill cutting firewood.
another day of pounding out firewood. With him and I we average 6-8 cord a day including delivery.
The header has a 6" layer of thick slime on it.
Added a bit more to it today, have about 60 trees to go for monday and then move out while the weather holds, im hauling across the guys lawn.
The soon to be "new wife" and I this morning. We have been engaged for almost a year, and had the wedding planned for July 25th. We scheduled engagement pictures 2 months ago, and about 2 weeks ago she got some very very bad news at the doctors, so tomorrow at 1pm we are getting married up at my parents lake. Oh boy. ;)
Very very bad news does that sound good. :( Good luck to her.
Sorry to hear about the bad news man. Sucks. :-(
I'm happy for you getting married, but man getting bad news from the Doc is never good :( We'very had our fair share the last few years with my wife, the poor woman can't seem to catch a break. That is a beautiful picture of the two of you ;)
Never good to get bad news :(. Wish you all the best.
This is about as much as I can heap this old girl up before I spend more time picking up fallen logs then getting wood to the landing.
Now thats a loaded forwarder :D
Thanks guys, yeah its always something. She kept putting off her visit to the "female" doctor and when she went they found something, did 2x ultrasounds and then some tests, at 33 she is going for a full hysterectomy. Her insurance is so bad, they started giving her a hard time, I came home tues and she was in the chair crying, I said enough and called the town judge at 7pm. Did it today, all went well except for the rain. :D
Wish you all the best and hope things gonna turn to the good.
Congratulations! and great pictures.
Nice load, chevy!
Finally finished up the job, the cable skidder fits so much nicer, and what was left was scattered.
There wasnt a stick there last Monday. Thurs was a washout, couldnt haul any out because of the landowners yard. Truck it all out when I get back off the boat next week.
BM, that first picture is sure pretty! A nice skid and a nice background ;) The second picture, I see a family of beavers must have snuck in and built a lodge while you were out on the boat ;D
I had a few better ones but for some reason it wont load them. There is a large power line that runs thru our town, thats one of the flatter sections, about 1 mile from there is a gorge you cant walk into, I logged that off 2 winters ago, had to winch my 450G backwards to get up out, stump to stump.
Ive got a pet partridge on this job, comes within 1' of you all day long just being nosy, runs right up to the skidder, I hope he makes it. Pheasants everywhere, could have gotten 2x of them right off the skidder yesterday. Need to get moved off this job, the landowner is a pain in the @ss anyway, and he didnt quite understand the volume of wood he sold when this went to bid, so thats caused some tension, the forester had to come down, made for a few heated conversations. next guy who cuts this has some great wood, ive walked around 200+ cherry over 24" DBH.
I've heard of the tame partridge before, I've never had one follow me though. I must look to shifty :)
There he is. You cant get away from him.
Try and truck the rest of the wood tomorrow, but cant get moved before I go back to the boat.
I want a pet partridge ;D How is it pronounced in New York? Part-tridge (MN pronunciation) Paht-ridge (Maine) or something in between?
Don't be "grousing" about how to pronounce it ;D.
:D :D
Don't get your feathers all ruffled up about it. ;D
Ya it's paht-ridge in Maine. But I just callem road chickens or dinner lol. But if I had one follow me around all day I wouldn't be able too eat it
Here in Maine their called Spruce Partridge. They have a little yellow in their feathers. They are protected buy the law (No shoot). I've had them peck at my feet when cutting firewood. they're just protecting their area. The closer you get to their nest the more aggressive they get.
David
This one hasnt been aggressive, just nosy. Follows you about 100ft around the woodpile. The released about 100 pheasants right next door a few weeks ago, they are everywhere. Tried to get one with the log truck today. ;)
We have spruce grouse here too, in addition to the ruffed grouse. Actually they are more common a bit farther north, in the big spruce swamps.
We have 2 flocks of turkeys on the farm, just wandering around. Its great, the elk attract everything, they think its "safe". ;)
Got in the log truck at 0700 this morning, and trucked till dark. 8 loads today, and probably 3 tomorrow, get the loader yanked out, grade up and go.
The picture kinda sucks, but theres 4 loads of pulp and 4 loads of saw logs sitting there. Truck the saw logs friday, needed to get out of this job before it gets wet again.
Thats what I got off this last job, and about 30 cord in another pile on the side. Been thru a pile like that already this year. I have 2.5 more just like it. My competition has basically no firewood put up. Im going to laugh myself to the bank come January. :D
smiley_thumbsup smiley_thumbsup smiley_thumbsup
Nice looks good!
Never had any wild game come up except a doe and her two fawns last winter. Could come with in 30 ft of them turn the tractor and back-up to a log, get off and hook-up, then get back on and skid out. They just stood and watched me. If I were hunting then you would never see them.
Started in at 0700 again this morning, finished at dark just in time to get wet. :D
Getting graded up. I will take that G series dozer over the J series dozers's we have any day of the week.
We got that finished just as it started raining, im so glad to be done there.
I got a suprise phone call when I got home, "be back to the boat by 0700" which screws up my plans of trucking logs and moving stuff tomorrow. Only 96 hrs off this time. >:( but im way to cheap to turn down free money. ;D
Looks good! Must be nice too be done there! Off too the MT next?
That's a really nice looking cleanup job, Bargemonkey! What do you like about the G model dozers? My dozer experience is pretty limited, I'm just curious about the differences between the series.
Yeah, off to the MT to finally get this woodlot wrapped up. Not where I wanna be.
That G dozer has a complete deere factory woods package, added weights in the front, just a nice machine. Im a powershift fan, the J's are single lever hydro, great for dirt work but im just not a fan with one in the woods.
Nice! What kind of old truck is that?
REO?
its is a FWD still has the original wakasha in it but does use quite a bit of oil ;)
Is the loader on it a F model prentice
Very cool FWD and that yard looks spiffy Barge Monkey.
I like that truck, reminds me of the movie "Duel".
I like seeing iron like that. smiley_clapping
Quote from: Maine logger88 on November 08, 2014, 10:32:26 AM
Is the loader on it a F model prentice
I don't think its a F model. I have seen one before and its smaller. The boom is only 15ft long. It will still lift a good sized log... as long as the motor stays runnin :D
Sent a couple loads today figured I'd snap a couple pics. First one is loading a load of oak tops a guy is buying for firewood.
And a load of logs.
Nice load of logs. Just missing a few axles and a Pup Trailer for Michigan ;) How much can you scale on a setup like that?
Thanks! Of oak legal only 3500 too 4000. Softwood probably 5000 I'm not 100 percent sure I'm not used too sending tri axle loads usually I cut trailer loads for my father and grandfather but there both busy doing earthwork
U r pretty darn close for not being sure. :-) Nice load. That truck bed looks longer than typical but maybe it is just the angle of the pic. R they all 8's?
Is that international Scale or Doyle? Whats the GVW of a Tri-axle in Maine?
Quote from: eichenberg93 on November 10, 2014, 07:21:22 PM
Is that international Scale or Doyle? Whats the GVW of a Tri-axle in Maine?
international rule....75900lbs
It's 9's and 10's front and rear and 8's on sideways. It's a 26ft body!
Maine logger88,where are 8-9-10 load going and for what? Most places don't like many 8's. 9's is diffeant too.
Thats a nice load of wood, now we all know who's got the money around here. ;) unless im shipping to bailies or a buyer, the mill im dealing with wants nothing over 12' with trim now. Works out better for me. I like the idea of stacking the 8's sideways, my bunks just arent set up for it. Have you worn that Clark out yet ?
They like oak and hardwood sawlogs 8' and 10' and veneer oak is 9' and 10' pine spruce and hemlock they don't like short tho.
No I haven't wore the Clark out yet but it is wearing me out lol
Yah da veneer they want 9'6 10'6 and 11'6 deer and da high value HW day take 8 all da day long up in da nort here. :-)
Might as well post another pic I guess here's a load of hemlock from today.
Quote from: Maine logger88 on November 11, 2014, 05:16:30 PM
Might as well post another pic I guess here's a load of hemlock from today.
Garys getting brave!
Yeah it's a good size load but the hemlock on this lot hasn't been weighing up very heavy
That going to Chester Forest Products?
It's going too Farmington chip plant who chips it for New Paige. I have sold some too Chester before it's been a few years tho. I believe they also chip for New Paige don't they?
Not sure but they process a lot of hemlock. They buy studwood, tree length saw grade and pulp. Bit of a treck from down there but they list what they r paying in this New Brunswick price list. The 8' pays decent but is labor intensive but u end up with a load of pulp from the tops if u cut enough.
http://www.ysc.nb.ca/PRICELIST.html
Yeah there good guys too deal with it's just quite a hike up there is the only reason I don't sell them more. I cut most of my hemlock and pine pulp 8ft it's not bad if you push it up even and cut a bunch up at once. The lot I'm on now is ED Bessey land and they wanted it too go to Farmington so that's where we are sending it which is fine by me
I got digging thru the computer tonight and found some pictures i thought where gone, figured i would post them. :D
Thats the beast i started out with, actually worked good. Was kind of a pain to move being so high and wide. Had an expandable under carriage if you wanted too.
The day she went on the trailer down the road. I should have kept it and added a heal and grapple on it. Simple to work on. Had 1750hr original when i sold it. Had sat in a barn for 20yrs.
Ive got a couple good Irene photos. That was my garage and backyard. Thank you FEMA for all your help. :D sore subject.
My neighbors house.
One of the better looking roads.
Friend of mine wanted that oak butt for a table, he just got it finished and i have to get pictures.
Quote from: Maine logger88 on November 11, 2014, 10:01:42 PM
Yeah there good guys too deal with it's just quite a hike up there is the only reason I don't sell them more. I cut most of my hemlock and pine pulp 8ft it's not bad if you push it up even and cut a bunch up at once. The lot I'm on now is ED Bessey land and they wanted it too go to Farmington so that's where we are sending it which is fine by me
Does he still have a log yard?
That's a cool old machine bargemonkey! Do you have the pic of when the guy flipped it? Man that's bad! Was that a river by there house that was overflowing or just runoff that made a river?
Chester they have a yard in Ellsworth and a yard in Newport. The oak logs and HW pulp is going too the Newport yard. They also have some contracts at the mills and have a huge amount of land around the area
Yeah I heard about him and was looking for his Newport yard to compare some prices but it sounded like he had closed it. That was about a year ago. Sounds like HC Haynes up this way.
Somewhere ive got a picture of the tracks pointed for the sky, have to find it. Took a 330C and 325C cat excavator's to stand her back up.
That was a tiny creek in back of the house. Used to be 100ft behind the garage. Got the garage. My house. Alot of people lost everything. I spent a few months in that forwarder picking up storm debris.
People that had nothing to start with collected big from fema, but if you had house insurance it became a blame game of who would do something. The town had just recently dumped a few 100yds of material over the bank which funneled the water towards me and the neighbor. I bought the house when i was 19, my parents didnt want me blowing my boat checks, after almost 2yrs of fighting and lawyers i calmly put the keys in the mail and walked away. :(
No it's still going they actually just put in a new yard it's a lot nicer than there old one. I can pm you the # too the main office in hinkley if you ever want too get prices from them.
Wow that's terrible too lose your house like that. How long ago was that?
Some decent pine
Quote from: 1270d on November 13, 2014, 05:36:56 PM
Some decent pine
how is the ponsse working out? fill us in
Some nice looking stuff! How much snow do you have up there?
That is a nice looking picture. If you had to buy one would you stay away from a 6 wheeler and go 8 ? Is a 1010B to small for mt country ? My 230 just doesnt have the snot or stability for around here.
Quote from: snowstorm on November 13, 2014, 06:16:09 PM
Quote from: 1270d on November 13, 2014, 05:36:56 PM
Some decent pine
how is the ponsse working out? fill us in
its a real nice machine. One of the best parts about it is being able to customize the controls however you like There has to be a hundred different control options and you can put them on any button you like, in any order, at any time. The leveling/stabilization system works very well. Well enough you dont notice it working....ever.
Quote from: Maine logger88 on November 13, 2014, 06:28:05 PM
Some nice looking stuff! How much snow do you have up there?
Theres mayber 12 to 14 inches on the job. about 15 miles away in one of the snow belts 42 inches was recorded
Quote from: BargeMonkey on November 13, 2014, 09:05:23 PM
That is a nice looking picture. If you had to buy one would you stay away from a 6 wheeler and go 8 ? Is a 1010B to small for mt country ? My 230 just doesnt have the snot or stability for around here.
If your only working harder ground a six wheel is great. eight if you need the extra traction or flotation. The 1010s are great forwarders. There is a 1010d just out of the picture on the right, its been a real good machine with plenty of power. The john deere powered ones have excellent power, cant speak to the other engines.
It's been a while since I posted any picture. Here is a few of the cuts we did this year.
Some good size hard maple. Nice mature woods with no under brush to deal with.
Harvesting some ash for my amish neighbor. In my area the amish are not allowed to use chainsaws so we do a lot of cutting for them. Sure was nice to get to the job site in less than a minute.
Laying out some strips of aspen. Trying to keep them lined up as good as possible so the forwarder can get loaded quick. The aspen on this job has been running around 50 cord of acre. Good production wood.
The old tree farmer earning its keep. The logs are cut at 7ft and sent to the local amish for pallet wood. Hoping to have processor marks on the logs soon. The wife said once I pay a few things off I can pull the trigger.
What are the long logs on the trailer for? Are they long just for convenience, or are they for a special product?
The long logs will be marked and bucked for veneer at the mill. Saves us some bucking and decision making.
Keen. That's nice looking maple logs.
It was some nice timber. This is the landowner in the pic, retired detective heck of a nice guy. Nice woods with little under growth makes our job easy, wish I could stay in gravy patches like that all the time.
Nice looking stuff!
Thanks for sharing. Is that a Hood loader on that porter ?
if I had h maple like that my buyer would think I was cutting on the state :D that looks like it should be a 5 dollar or more a foot log is that ash or aspen in the saw pic nice looking trees thanks for sharing
Quote from: coxy on November 17, 2014, 05:42:04 AM
if I had h maple like that my buyer would think I was cutting on the state :D
Isnt that the truth. I know where some cherry sits on the state that would blow your mind. About 50 trees on top of the knob in a 2 acre spot. Smallest is maybe 28 dbh. Problem is its 3x the stump value and a fancy ankle bracelet. ;)
Some nice logs. Its always nice to cut with no Brush. How many cord can you get on the forwarder?
Yep lopet, its a hood loader on the porter. Its been a good machine got a good deal on it and put a little time in it getting it running good.
Coxy your right on the maple price. Small hearted veneer on large logs like that can bring 3-8 dollars a foot. It amazes me what trees like that can sell for. The pic with the saw is aspen, the saw has a 24" bar on it. That's a good sized healthy aspen for our area.
Sounds like some whoppers BargeMonkey, its always good to see some bigguns still standing.
Eichenber93 the clear ground makes up for all the time spent cutting around thorn apple and otamolive trees lol. The forwarder will hold two cord of 8 footers.
You got enough rubber under that load? ;D
How do I get this image to rotate 90 degrees.... I tried the crop and rotate, and save... I uploaded from a phone, but am posting now from a computer... When I view it in my album it brings up the large picture correctly when I click on crop and rotate.
Ha, not sure why it looks right now, so well try again... Yoder Job 2014. I about 90 acres timber, I am about 1/2 done. Will take me a while.
Swing boom in action.. had to cut the log in two, to get by a few trees without skinning them up.
High stump along skid road on right is due to old barb wire fence. Seems like a fair number of trees on this job have had fence in them, and if they are mertchantable I will go ahead and cut because they will never be good veneer trees with the metal stain in them.
damage and tops... the trees you see bent over or scarred are elm trees, and are generally cut in a tsi situation.... The have come in under the shade of the oaks as they seem to be more tolerant of shade. What is not shown is a small red oak about 30 foot high to the left of the picture that did not get squished. The tops make good brush piles for wildlife, and the amish landowner and neighbors will cut many of them up for firewood.
All the green leaves = The enemy of the woods.... Amur Honeysuckle.... aka bush honeysuckle. This will eventually take over much of our eastern woodlots...This spot is not too bad..yet. others in his wood lot I had to make a path with the skidder or duck under all of it to get to the trees to harvest. The landowner I am cutting on has no plans to control this invaisve, and this farm is next to my dads, which we have painstakingly worked to rid the woods of this invaisve. We are trying to convince him to at least do some controled burns or let the kids loose with some loppers.
small red oak I left... you can tell by the top it was suppressed. My experience suggest these types of "leave" trees will either die or be surpassed by another tree in about 10 to 20 years...What do the foresters think... I thought about cutting it and letting it stump sprout.
A few leave trees. One on the right most would cut around 22 inches or so, but i had a small group opening just outside pict and wanted to leave for seed. The red oak right here seemed to be doing well and I suspect those two trees will be about 25 to 30 inches in about 20 - 30 years when this farmers son has a harvest done. A clump of post oak in the background.
Need to get some pics of the log piles next....
The one woodlot you dont wanna cut when the weather turns bad. Steep. Rocky. 1 mile skid. Want to get in and get out.
Thats looking N/E, skid road goes up another 400 ft at a wicked graded then your staring DOWN on Windham Mt. There is some ok timber, alot of it is ice damaged and wind twisted.
Some decent looking stuff! That 450 should work good on a long skid like that
Started this CTL northern hardwoods job just before the heavy snows came in. Working in some step hills, so don't know if our logger can get the job done this winter with the excessive early heavy snow. Also since the transmission on his Timberjack forwarder went out yesterday and they are working on it in the woods today under less than favorable weather conditions. The "low points" of being a logger. ;)
Hitch after hitch. Roads are so narrow if you slip 1 wheel off your done. ive been getting 9-10 good ones to a drag, she handles it fine just a pain turning corners.
Theres a pile of wood sitting there now, finishing slashing in the morning. When i say MONTHS cutting HM, BC, and RO on this lot, theres alot there there. :D :D :D
Now those are some nice sized hitches! Looks like the jack pulls good!
Following the truck out tonight after work
Nice drag, Bargemonkey! 8)
Quote from: Ron Scott on November 20, 2014, 03:13:14 PM
Also since the transmission on his Timberjack forwarder went out yesterday and they are working on it in the woods today under less than favorable weather conditions. The "low points" of being a logger. ;)
Have done my fair share of in woods mechanic work. Not much fun. We just got done doing 2 weeks of repair and maintenance to my old Timberjack forwarder. Clutch, brakes, hydraulic pump, hoses, welding, etc, etc. We did however have a shop to work in.
Nice hitch BargeMonkey. Doesn't take many of those trips to load a truck.
Thanks, i think its time for small fenders. Had 6 tonight coming out, i figure there was 1500mbft and 2-3 cords. Its all downhill, about 1.5 miles to the back of the lot.
Soft maple right on the skidroad. It twists like that for about 40', we have a buyer who looks for those for furniture.
Keep pounding them out.
I took about 20 skidder pictures today but they wont load for some reason. Way up on top of the mountain.
Not bad for 2 days, still had about 30 to slash but it got too dark to see the logs clearly. Parked everything and hit it hard when i get home again.
Nice pics BM. I ve never seen a twister like that. What do think is causing something like that ?
Uhm, WIND. :D this is way up on the mountain, just a horrible place to be 364 days out of the year, alot of the stuff im cutting the tops are all broken from some bad ice storms. Ive had a few like this, they are around if you look. Special wood like that can bring 30-50 a running ft depending. My parents sawed some for the new house just like that, looks awesome. They will keep a 1"-1.5" slab with that twist and use it on "rustic" furniture. We cant keep pine slabs, wood from the "Catskill" imported to the "Adirondack's" for the people with more money than brains. :D
Quote from: lopet on November 21, 2014, 10:43:38 PM
Nice pics BM. I ve never seen a twister like that. What do think is causing something like that ?
Got to be global warming. :D
I don't know to much about other places but here in Maine they either cut it tree length Nd take it out on trailers that are 4 feet wider on either side than the truck or they do cut to length logging with processors and forwarders.
Finally got her moved this morning, told the driver to let me know how it went, this is what i got. :D ive been having a horrible time getting pictures to load on the FF lately, maybe 1/5 of them take. No rhyme or reason to it. ???
I was having a bugger of a time with loading pictures off of my Samsung S5, it turns out they were too big. I resize them first, and they always load now.
1270d it's good to see that you're using the Ponsee Scorpion. I've followed their product development, but haven't talked to anyone who's worked it yet. How's the operator liking it?
I am the operator, and I love it.
Pulled some hemlock in the snow today. About the perfect amount to make the roads nice but not be hard walking. Too bad it's gonna warm up tomorrow and Monday.
The old Clark is getting it done ML88...
Yeah it's been doing the job got one more load to pull then this job is finished then I can take a couple days and fix my Jack then save up and then on to the Deere gotta have them up and going soon got a couple decent lots to cut this winter
Dont you hate cutting wood at one place for too long ? The closer you get to being done the better the feeling. :D
Quote from: BargeMonkey on November 30, 2014, 10:12:43 AM
Dont you hate cutting wood at one place for too long ? The closer you get to being done the better the feeling. :D
Yup ;D 8)
I know what you guys are saying, I think I have been on this job for at least two months. I think we've cut over 3000 cords already, and maybe another 1000 to go.
Here's a landing shot the other morning, my machine is warming up. The other operator is more on the ball and is piling his first load already.
This is how much more capacity the Buffalo King forwarder has over the standard Buffalo. We each loaded 2 bunks on a crib trailer, and I had this much left.
Nice looking timber everyone, Keen probably the nicest hard maple I have ever seen thanks for scharing all the pictures.
Quote from: BargeMonkey on November 30, 2014, 10:12:43 AM
Dont you hate cutting wood at one place for too long ? The closer you get to being done the better the feeling. :D
Yup I do it's nice to get the big lots but I have been here since mid august and I'm ready to get on to the next one! Looks good barbender I like seeing big piles of wood! Is there one or two prossesors cutting ahead of you?
Just one, with two operators that are alternating long days, they must be in the machine 12 hours each day.
So it doesn't stop for long then! With two operators how much are they cutting per day?
I'm having a hard time explaining this, operator A comes in Monday and works a 12 hour day. On Tuesday operator B comes in and works a 12 hour day. So the machi e is working 12 hours a day, not 24. At that, I have seen them get into a poor patch and cut 60 cords a day, and other days they are getting well over 100 cords. I am moving 70-80 cords per day, and managed to fall over 1000 cords behind them so they are putting out the wood. Yes that is right, 1000 cords- the second forwarder has been with me for 8 days, together we are landing about 150 cords a day. We're still 3 days cutting behind :o
O gotcha. That's some good production numbers!
Nothing better than a running feller for a birthday present 8)
Morbark Wolverine cutting Some Popple
Well then happy b day eichenberg 93. You must have your brake problem solved, it looks like she's chopping.
And still going strong 8)
That is really something, I am impressed. ;D
lets see if all the new computer junk is still around in 74years :D
Quote from: coxy on December 10, 2014, 07:20:44 AM
lets see if all the new computer junk is still around in 74years :D
exactly ;)
The computers will have taken over in 74 years and we will be their slaves. Oh, wait, we already are their slaves. :D
I see the date on those photos is September 12. The white fungus on those logs would really concern me that time of year.
:D :D
I was wondering if anyone would see that. If that's the case its been one cold September ;D
This is a crib trailer I'm loading out, that's one forwarder load of black spruce on the trailer. Spruce is a light wood, I don't remember how much it weighs offhand but not much over 4000 pounds per cord. I can barely fit a legal load (88,000 lbs.) on this trailer, the uprights are a bit short.
Our conventional crew cut everything on this sale except for 700 cords of black spruce. I'm picking up black spruce with the forwarder while the slasher works in the background.
A few more from this black spruce sale-
Some nice black spruce, this stuff is much larger than average. Some of these sticks are probably 14-16" dbh
Black spruce pile, marked with the contract processor operator's initials so he gets paid for it
My crane folded up for greasing
Are you still working on this big job ? That's some nice spruce.
Like your stake extensions.
I am always dreaming of one of those picker uppers. Maybe some day, but it won't be such a fancy one. ;D
This is a new job I've been on for a week. 750 cords or so of cut to length wood. I'd guess there was 1500-2000 that the conventional crew cut. From the pics I've seen of your operation, lopet, a "picker upper" would work great for you ;)
Well its been 2 wks, and im guessing if im lucky it will only be another 4-6wks. The wife isnt too happy but she likes the paychecks. No woodlot in my future. Figured i would throw a few pictures on.
Thats what 35,000 gross tons looks like. 160' wide. 790' feet long. Not huge for down south but large for up here with only a 3000hp boat.
The joke show known as the Tappan Zee Bridge. Dropping all the material off there now too.
Nice pictures of something that I will never see. I've been across the Tappan Zee Bridge a few times.
What is it that you are hauling BM
cool pics. Where are you at ? I used to pilot and navigate, with a much smaller ticket. Left it all behind in 1999. Rob
Crushed stone and aggregate, a little sand sometimes. Im the chief engineer on the big pushboat they have, running from Poughkeepsie to NYC basically every day. About 4.5 mil tons this year, or 3\4 of the stone NYC uses. Figured i would throw a few pictures up, something different. my equipment sits on the job covered in snow, my relief quit and i told them i would stay. The new wife isnt used to this, she has gotten used to 1-2 wks at a time, she isnt liking this. We are putting in a gas station\ country store at home, the price of stuff is thru the roof so im just going to sit here and stack cash for as long as i can. it will take more than 6-8 wks to break me, did 178 straight once. :D
178 :o You're an animal! You have to make sure it doesn't break her though ;)
My regular machine was broke down today so i was running the spare processor, a Tigercat 860 with a Hornet Head
Sometimes you gotta go where the money is. Keep the pictures coming BM. Got one of the push boat ?
If you dont mind me asking jamie who do you work for ive heard those hornet heads are almost bullet proof
I work for E & R Langille, there are 3 Hornets on our crew, 2 run daily and 1 is a spare ... all on 860/870 carriers.
They are a near bulletproof head, can put a lot of wood through them.
haha i kind of figured jamie thats why i asked
Personally , I'm interested in the machinery space...Pics ? Rob
Quote from: BargeMonkey on December 16, 2014, 09:28:07 AM
The joke show known as the Tappan Zee Bridge. Dropping all the material off there now too.
I read somewhere that Ne York State brought in one of the worlds largest floating cranes to make the replacement go faster.
Bruce
BTW - Spend 210 days submerged one year.
Quote from: redneck logger on December 16, 2014, 06:57:53 PM
haha i kind of figured jamie thats why i asked
They are only a "short wood head" right ? looks like a bundle of hose. :D
Quote from: submarinesailor on December 16, 2014, 09:36:13 PM
Quote from: BargeMonkey on December 16, 2014, 09:28:07 AM
The joke show known as the Tappan Zee Bridge. Dropping all the material off there now too.
I read somewhere that Ne York State brought in one of the worlds largest floating cranes to make the replacement go faster.
Bruce
BTW - Spend 210 days submerged one year.
Ive worked with 2 ex-submariners, something about being under for 200+ days days something to your brain. :D my newest deckhand is fresh off a flight deck, good kid.
There is the "left coast lifter". Was built for a bridge job out there, now sitting here. I wouldnt have wanted to be on the boat towing it over. :D
Thats the "quantum of the seas" maiden entrance into NYC a couple weeks ago. Something nice to look at @0630 on crew change morning.
The mate took that picture a few yrs ago, one of the nicer ones. Ive got some others in my gallery. Things are changing out here, and not for the good.
In what way Barge Monkey?
Quote from: Southside logger on December 16, 2014, 11:25:19 PM
In what way Barge Monkey?
Its a double edged sword,
The USCG and the maritime schools are getting closer to finally restricting this industry to the "grad children". The workboats historically where "hawsepipe" guys, father then son, family friends, it was a close industry. Due to the dead U.S flagged ship industry it isnt that way anymore. Not saying its completely for the bad but its changed things. My family was on the tugs out of NYC in 1903 when we came over from Sweden / Norway.
The companys are doing more with less. less people, more hours, more paperwork. Im looking at another 4+ wks of classes in the next 18 months just to keep up with the requirements. Very few guys stay anywhere any amount of time, 1\2 of the tug companies in NY are gone from when i started 13yrs ago. The guys in the gulf are sweating it right now, they chased the high paying OSV jobs, have been makeing crazy money, now stuff is slowing down and boats are being stacked. Like anything it goes in a cycle, i saw the good times in 05-07, then the bottom fell out in 08. Basically it comes down to you looking out for YOU, alot of these guys will be handing out baskets at walmart in a few yrs because they allowed themselves to become complacent.
Enjoyed your forestry pics BargeMonkey, and I'm enjoying the tug pics as well. It's definitely not easy on the wife when she's used to 1-2 weeks, but it makes seeing you that much better when you finally do get home.
BargeMonkey. After you load or pick-up loaded barges how long does it take to push them down to NYC? Do you have to bunk on the tug and how's the food?
There was a link on here awhile back about life in the timber camps in the early 1900's. Thought it funny that a worker would quit one camp and go to another sometimes for less money if they had a better cook.
We turn a trip in 24-26hrs. Thats making up a light tow of 7-9-15 empty barges, head up the river, grab a loaded tow and back down to the city. It 60 up, 60 back. We work the deckhands like savages, i help out what i can. We dont eat to bad, no actual designated cook on this boat.
Ive seen guys quit to get on a newer boat and to get the holidays off. Its still a weird, unique industry, there are some laws on the books that will make you scratch your head.
If i am overseas, stuck, no money, cant get home, i walk down to the first US flagged vessel i see, coming back, and by law they have to take me onboard, in the capacity of my ticket or its some astronomical fine.
Ive worked with the guy who owns this website, does a great job. Www.tugboatinformation.com
Somehow the wife got her wish and im going home monday for 1 week, :D
Sounds like the wife has more authority than you think. lol lol lol lol lol lol lol
I heard on the radio this morning that a couple of floating concrete silos filled with aggregate at the Tappan Zee bridge collapsed yesterday. Was that some of your material?
They are mixing concrete on a large portable batch plant on the west side of the bridge, yeah i would imagine its stuff we have brought down.
Quote from: Jamie_C on December 16, 2014, 05:57:20 PM
My regular machine was broke down today so i was running the spare processor, a Tigercat 860 with a Hornet Head
Those heads are basic, but tough. I think they went under the name Target as well!?
Sounds like a good combo for the carrier/head. Hard to believe of someone having a spare harvester, but definitely a good idea if you can swing it.
Hey BM your pics reminded me of the times I had a ride on a push boat. Single heated barge of hot asphalt from Baton Rouge down the mighty Mississippi and across the gulf to Tampa. They pushed until they got to the gulf then they decoupled the barge and towed it with about 100 yds rope about 4" in diameter if I remember right. One thing I definitely remember was that the boat could not stop going down stream w/o beaching up on the bank which we had to do one time because the product lab test showed bad. We were a couple hrs down river. It was early 70's. It was an ESSO barge with two 750 hp Cats. A couple had blown up. Company I worked for was hired by ESSO to figure out why since Cat said it was ESSO's fault. We put pressure and temperature sensors all over those engines with recorders and alarms. I had about a half dozen trips across. Engines ran perfect.
Youve been to "redstick" :D Baton Rouge in cajun. Thats mile marker 242-246 i believe, end of the road for a larger vessel, made a trip from redstick once, to, San juan, Savanah, Norfolk, Albany, Portland, then back to Baton Rouge. Wasnt a fun adventure. Had a good fire @ 0200 about 30 miles off the D.R with no one coming to save us getting our brains beaten in pushing 100kbbl of blue super high test aviation gasoline. Fun times. I worked black oil 1 season on the G.L's for a company out of MI, dont miss that. Most people dont realize you can get your butt kicked sailing out of Cleveland. They have a strip club on the Cayahoga in Cleveland with a lighthouse on it, like a magnet for us sailor types. :D
Another load of black spruce, ready to head for the mill. This truck is light, about 29K empty, and can legally run 88K. That figures out to about 15 cords, IF I can fit it all on ::)
Do you load the trailers while they wait, or are they spotted for you to load?
I load them while they wait. These are contracted trucks, all of our company trucks have center mount loaders. We do have a crib trailer I've loaded maybe twice, our drivers will hook up to it if they for some reason can't operate their center mount. Anyways, if it's a short skid, it all comes directly out of the woods onto the truck. If it's a long skid, I bring one skid out and load the rest out of the pile. I get a truck loaded in 35-45 minutes, with a load on the machine and the remainder out of the pile (with spruce) It's kind of a pain because you are trying to fit every stick you can to get enough weight on. Also, if I am loading out of the pile, that's time not spent skidding and it does affect the load count at the end of the day.
I like watching those whole tree chip jobs run. What kind of saw heads/skidders are you running? Was a bit north of you on a GFP chip job a few years ago. The guy running the buncher there was a pro.
We're running a prentice 2670 and a new Cat 573c for bunchers, a Cat 545c, 2 848 JD, 1 660 TH and a new 535d Cats kidder on order. Our chipper is a Morbark 2755 flailchipharvestor, running next to a prentice 2384 loader with a Hanfab 60 in slasher. Our chip fans are 6 axle 50 ft, averaging about 37 tons in aspen, we put out 10-12 loads per day.
Mike Cook
You have got to be happy to see off road under 3$
1270d
Yes I am, chip operations produce a lot of wood but burn a lot of fuel. We better enjoy these prices while we can. I have 2 guys bunching wood, 1 is new the other has been doing it for over 10 years, I keep him in a new machine most weeks he lays down 800-1000 cords of wood, it still amazes me after all these years.
Merry Christmas,
Mike Cook
Mike,
Nice pictures, I see your chip vans on the road quite a bit over this way.
I like seeing all the tires under those MI trailers.
A decent pine I cut yesterday I couldn't get the skidder close enough to push so had to do it the old fashion way
That's a nice white pine. How did it cut out?
Put a stamp on that thing and send it to Alford. :D I cut a bunch of nice looking pine last winter only to find a big hole in that end. :(
Quote from: 1270d on December 28, 2014, 10:19:00 AM
That's a nice white pine. How did it cut out?
It only had2 16' logs and a 12' log then about 4 sticks of 8' pulp it got real crooked at 45'
Quote from: Dave Shepard on December 28, 2014, 10:27:27 AM
Put a stamp on that thing and send it to Alford. :D I cut a bunch of nice looking pine last winter only to find a big hole in that end. :(
I would but I couldn't afford that many stamps lol! Yeah it always sucks when there's a hole in the end of a nice looking stick
at least you have a good saw :D :D :D 71-72 or 66 nice pine
It's a 66 that I ground the transfers on its been a good saw I have two just alike time to buy another getting to be that time of year I like to start off winter with at least one new saw
I have started the winter off with 2 the first one got mushed :D :D
O really that always sucks. What did you get 66s?
ed is that yours that's neat ;D
Quote from: coxy on January 05, 2015, 03:53:39 PM
ed is that yours that's neat ;D
And nice woods..!! ;D
It belongs to my boss at the highway garage.He just installed the Tajfun winch this fall.Before it had the winch that came on the front of the duce and half.I'll get a pic of the way he set up the winch when it warms a little.
Just messing with uploading vids from phone.
http://youtu.be/Pnda0Y_0PsQ
Thats a fail. Uploaded private some how dont know how to change it on ipad.
Edit. Figured it out
Grabbed a few pics (mobile phone so please forgive the quality) on the last load out for 2014.
First we get to leave home:
thats the front "lawn" at home so it can be difficult at times, depending on how the fish are biting.
Then we drive up the mountain:
The road is barely wide enough for two cars to pass each other. Make one a truck and it can be a case of slow down and creep past each other or at times someone gets to back up to a wide spot. Going up isn't such a problem but coming down can be a bit "intesting" at times, and downright terrifying at others. Running the jinker with full length logs we put a pilot vehicle out front for the 15 odd miles of the range road proper. Today we's only on clean up duty - shorts and the last few full logs that it wasn't worth sending a tractor trailer rig up for.
The current block is a mix of "eucalypts". There's rose gum, red mahogany, Turpentine, and Bloodwood in this block. The harvest zone has around 4000 acres of workable ground and we'll take off somewhere around 3000 tonnes of sawlog over the next few years. The plan is to utilise this block for our annual "wet season" logs - we get rain like Alaska gets snow, and what logs we have in the mill yard at the end of December usually have to carry us through to early May.
This block was last cut about 40 or so years back so what we're getting is a mix of regrowth and larger logs that were deliberately left last time. In turn we leave a % of the larger timber for the next crew - the aim of this is to harvest on a 40 year cycle and have a mix of log sizes. What doesnt really show in this picture is the length of them - a lot of those logs will give 2 "tree length" logs at 45 foot each. 90' to the first branch isn't uncommon in a rose gum block. We don't take anyhting under 18" dbh as a general rule, and a fair percentage of these will be hitting 36" dbh.
Logs are cut exclusively with a chainsaw, and the length issue means it takes a fair degree of skill to get them on the ground cleanly, and sometimes a lot of winching and blocks when things dont go according to plan. Then they get pulled to the ramp by skidder or sometimes the dozer, then loaded with a wheel loader. The heavy gear has gone home for the wet when these pictures were taken so all thats left to load is the JCB. It is nominally a 2.5t machine but the counterweight has been expanded and she'll handle closer to 4t.
Logs are broken for loading on the little truck as required, which is determined by either the max length I think I can get away with or the lift capacity of the gear. I run overlength and overweight a lot in the body truck - no onboard scales and the reality is that Australian hardwoods weigh heavy. About 1.5 times the density of red oak, to give you guys a frame of reference.
Last of the logs on the ramp:
Then back down the hill to home with the jakes echoing off those rock walls all the way down. You mightn't be able to see me coming but you'd have to be deaf not to hear it. Up the coast to the mill and unload.
Reminding ourselves that we better get the waterpump back into the yard loader soon because this "short log" caper is a little bit tough on the 2t forklift. :D
Last load of logs for 2014 "in".
Probably around the 12t mark on that load. Mind the wet appears to be late and if it doesn't rain in the next week we might just throw a skidder on and go back and get some more. 8)
Thanks for the pictures and how things are down in your part of the world.
nice pics that poor little kitty cat >:( in the one pic it looks there was a fire or is that how the first 5ft of the tree looks standing they look burnt :)
Quote from: coxy on January 07, 2015, 06:56:40 AM
nice pics that poor little kitty cat >:( in the one pic it looks there was a fire or is that how the first 5ft of the tree looks standing they look burnt :)
Fire is part of the cycle in eucalypt woodlands. Mostly they need to burn every couple of years, the hard shells on the seed pods require the heat to crack open so they can grow. Doesn't hurt the live trees at all - they have thick bark either full length or in a "stocking " at the base to protect the tree - and it helps to clear out competing weeds etc also. The major problem that arises is when they don't burn regularly, excessive fuel loads can make for fires that are uncontrolablely hot.
Working after a burn is nicer... we might have to suck a bit of ash with the dust but we can actually see where we're going in there. Dead logs are very slow to burn, particularly turpentine which is one of the most fire retardant timbers in the world. There's old stumps and trees on the ground that might be 100 years old in there and all they have is some charring.
thanks for the info do you have a pic of a turpentine tree never heard of one ;D
The Reo is gone but not forgoten... 8)
Resting
Rear view
Landing
Skidding
In the yard
Out the back window
Another hitch
:new_year:
Puffergas,thanks alot!!
Building a pile-
I like to lay out the wood the length of where the pile will be, it makes it easier to build the pile straight.
Then I take my "bucket" (lake states term for grapple) and tap things straight. Keeping the bucket half open kind of works like a plumb bob and helps me keep the face of the pile vertical.
Then you just keep adding on and going up ;)
When you have that one piled up, start another row, if you have room-
I thought this scene was pretty, this is a mature stand of second growth Red pine after a fresh snowfall. Unfortunately that's not what we're cutting, it was just where my machine was parked ::)
You always have some pretty neat piles barbender. Keep up the good work. ;) The truckers must really like you.
nice piling Barbender. Ive been cutting some black spruce if the buncher breaks down. Pushed a stick down 22 ft yesterday ;D
Barbender,
Those are some plumb nice piles.
Too nice ;) ;D
Looks nice! We call them buckets around here too
Quote from: 1270d on January 09, 2015, 06:47:02 PM
nice piling Barbender. Ive been cutting some black spruce if the buncher breaks down. Pushed a stick down 22 ft yesterday ;D
yup 22ft you remembered that i pushed one down 21'6" last winter
I spoiled my trucker too,but not that much ;D .You didn't run a string did you ;) .
Quote from: snowstorm on January 09, 2015, 08:40:06 PM
Quote from: 1270d on January 09, 2015, 06:47:02 PM
nice piling Barbender. Ive been cutting some black spruce if the buncher breaks down. Pushed a stick down 22 ft yesterday ;D
yup 22ft you remembered that i pushed one down 21'6" last winter
Be careful snowstorm, someplace I have photos of a tracked processor that went down just as far in February one year. One big hole had to be dug to get her out.
Quote from: Ed_K on January 09, 2015, 08:40:28 PM
I spoiled my trucker too,but not that much ;D .You didn't run a string did you ;) .
A string is ok, but using a theodolite is pushing it. :D
Quote from: snowstorm on January 09, 2015, 08:40:06 PM
Quote from: 1270d on January 09, 2015, 06:47:02 PM
nice piling Barbender. Ive been cutting some black spruce if the buncher breaks down. Pushed a stick down 22 ft yesterday ;D
yup 22ft you remembered that i pushed one down 21'6" last winter
:laugh: whats your deepest bog? they do get a bit spooky at times.
I would like to see Barbender's sticker stacks ;D.
No stringlines or anything- I did spend many years on an asphalt paving crew where I had to make people's driveways look nice. Curves, straight lines, all had to be done by eye because you don't use forms with asphalt. So, I probably go about things with a different perspective ::) I think I may leave real loggers shaking their heads :D
1270d, this particular region we are working is somewhat unique, the spruce tracts are basically wet sand instead of actual bogs. Frequently, Jack pine is interspersed with the spruce, and it can be a real bugger to tell them apart if the processor operator isn't helping you out.
WDH, I've made some nice looking lumber piles, and some I sure wouldn't want Red oaks lumber to see ;D One of my prouder moments was when last summer, I had my 14 and 12 year old daughters sticker some white oak decking, unsupervised, and when I inpected their work I found that I wouldn't have done it nicer myself. I did heap some praise on them for that ;)
Quote from: 1270d on January 09, 2015, 10:46:06 PM
Quote from: snowstorm on January 09, 2015, 08:40:06 PM
Quote from: 1270d on January 09, 2015, 06:47:02 PM
nice piling Barbender. Ive been cutting some black spruce if the buncher breaks down. Pushed a stick down 22 ft yesterday ;D
yup 22ft you remembered that i pushed one down 21'6" last winter
:laugh: whats your deepest bog? they do get a bit spooky at times.
that was it. it gets you to thinking how fast would this machine sink. on the other side of the same swamp a tracked machine went down. part of the cab sticking out
Are you enjoying the rottne? Happy with the switch from valmet?
Quote from: 1270d on January 10, 2015, 07:15:37 PM
Are you enjoying the rottne? Happy with the switch from valmet?
night an day difference. the valmet was cheap at the time and the keto head had pretty low hrs on it. it was a 546.pretty simple to work on. rottne bigger cab air ride heated seat. more hp hy stat piston pumps. one thing i dont like it dosent have a lot of swing power. its ok most of the time. temp at -5 i shut the pumps off turn the key its running. no either. i like that iveco motor
Well done on the decking, very professional to show case the decked wood on the landing. One never knows when the media will be taking pictures. ;)
Am I the only one foolish enough to sell 4' wood? A local greenhouse heats 2 outdoor boilers and uses about 150 cord/year. He pays well although it is a lot of work on our end. Been a client of mine for the past 3 years.
we used to here. i hauled a lot of it. 4ft sp that was slashed wasnt all that bad. and it was stick scale
I used to have a couple of guys with out door boilers, but only about 15 cord each. One got a little lazy and put up a feed bin and now burns either corn or pellets, where ever he gets the better deal. The other guy sold the property, never heard who bought it. In my case it was a lot of manual labor and I don't miss that part.
I mean, it all depends what your setup is. I assume you buck the logs on the landing with your processor and load and unload with your grapple loader then I think it can't be that bad.
I would probably hang on to a customer like that, then you never know if logging will slow down again. Just my 2 cents.
There used to be pallet mills in the area that bought 38", 42", 46", 50", and 72". They're all closed now. Fifties were my favorite. We loaded them by hand. I had a loader tractor but it was faster by hand. To be young and foolish again ;) I've had inquiries about long wood for boilers but won't do anything longer that 22".
I remember cutting 4' pulp which they would load on trailers here in Yarmouth and ship across to maine by ferry :) be nice if US market was still a option.
Boise,in Rumford Maine only took 4 foot back in '93. I think they use to stick scale it too?
Some reason I'm thinkin it went from bar harbour to bucksport , but not sure
Quote from: huskyxp on January 13, 2015, 09:54:32 PM
Some reason I'm thinkin it went from bar harbour to bucksport , but not sure
yes you are right. the mill was st regis later champion then ip then verso now closed. the mill also owned several thousand ac around yarmouth
do they still own the land if so what do they do with it
Been cutting some hemlock the last couple days it's smaller stuff but I need to clean up this corner of the lot
Quote from: Maine logger88 on January 14, 2015, 05:49:17 PM
Been cutting some hemlock the last couple days it's smaller stuff but I need to clean up this corner of the lot
Really nice looking piles, where you cutting.
David
Thank you. I am cutting in Belmont
Looking good, nice and tidy.
first pics look like cherry yes nice piles
Quote from: coxy on January 14, 2015, 04:21:17 PM
do they still own the land if so what do they do with it
when it was champion they owned it. then when they sold to the IP they sold the land . this is what i was told and he worked for the mill so he should know
Nice looking landing, Mainecutter ;) (Or whatever you folks call it up there-header?)
Thank you. We call it a yard in this area. Different meaning than door yard btw lol! Tho I have put my yard in a dooryard before haha!
Quote from: Maine logger88 on January 16, 2015, 07:25:42 PM
Thank you. We call it a yard in this area. Different meaning than door yard btw lol! Tho I have put my yard in a dooryard before haha!
Yeah, you Mainiacs already helped with the interpretation of "dooryard" and "dustpan" ;)
Here that would be called a yard. Logs are skidded out and loaded at the landing.
Quote from: coxy on January 07, 2015, 06:59:37 PM
thanks for the info do you have a pic of a turpentine tree never heard of one ;D
stump from a turpentine tree felled before the mid fiftys when a forest fire burned through this place. I fetched it in from out back, thought it looked a bit more appealing than a pt 4x4 for the street numbers. this area was known for stills, turpentine and moonshine. turpentine ended years ago, moonshine not so much.
link with pics from the good ole days http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turpentine
Cut some nice pines today. This is about a cord shy of the whole tree
Another load on the way to the road
Nice looking pine! About how many ft to a load?
I think about 3000 ft on the forwarder is a big load. The bottom log in the first pic scaled 1100 Scribner.
Wow that's a nice tree! 8)
Finally got the camera to work.
Getting warmed up for the morning.
Would these make sawlogs?
One of the hemlock pile.
One of the cordwood pile.
It's slow going but I'm having fun and making a little $.
Looks good thanks for sharing the pics! What brand of skidder is that?
Nice piles Ed. Did you switch skidders ? Thought you had a old Tj.
Quote from: Ron Scott on March 30, 2002, 04:59:17 PM
Kevin,
Excellent picture. It's hard to find a chain saw on some of the jobs here anymore. I sure endorse them for still doing some of the better quality work.
How about expaining some of your "colorful" clothing and its purpose, i.e. the Kevlar boots etc.
You ain't kiddin, lots of tennis shoe logging going on. My neighbor is an independant log trucker, he's got a Hood 7000 loader and a pup trailer, and he told me he only trucks for the little guys with just a skidder and a chainsaw.
1972 Taylor model 112 gearamatic 19 winch 18.4-34 tires, I've had it since 2000.
Sorry, must have something mixed up. ;D
Some hemlock we cut the last 3 days
Quote from: Maine logger88 on January 26, 2015, 10:40:42 PM
Some hemlock we cut the last 3 days
You work some nice lots over there, ML. I drive by a yard on 131 in Swanville that is a pretty good size operation from what I can see, a lot of wood coming out of it at least. I'd take pics of it but feel weird asking to photo their job so I can put it on the web. :D
Yeah I have been lucky for the most part! If it's the same outfit I'm thinking of then that guy is a nice guy his name is Bernard.
Quote from: Maine logger88 on January 27, 2015, 12:14:02 AM
If it's the same outfit I'm thinking of then that guy is a nice guy his name is Bernard.
We're (the crew I'm on) building a house just down the road from the yard, can hear his fellerbuncher all day. ;D He's got a big grapple skidder and a delimber in in the yard. I've seen a number of nice loads drive by over the last few weeks, including several really nice loads of saw logs that I wish were being dropped off beside my Lucas. >:( ;) :D Assume those were headed to Robbins.
Cold day with lots of fresh snow in central NB. Three large storms in the past couple of weeks and another on its way. Started the harvester on a new block yesterday. The block was precommercially thinned around 25 years ago. Small diameter wood but lots of it.
tulip poplar
I don't run into much of it around here. I do like sawing it on the mill. :)
Those are some mighty nice poplars, treeslayer! Diameter average? ???
Quote from: clww on February 04, 2015, 09:03:13 PM
Those are some mighty nice poplars, treeslayer! Diameter average? ???
never messured, 36" bar wouldn't go thru any of them. ima have trouble getting the big ones out lol
nice wood poplars are they heavy or light
Does tulip poplar stay sound when it gets big? I've only sawn eight trees off of one of the properties we had logged where I used to work, so I don't have a lot of experience with it.
coxy, they can be either but as a rule, large ones are heavy like any kind of tree. also depends on the ground and water.......dry sites tend to yield lighter stems.
Dave, they can have holes, i have cut them 7' wide but just a shell. biggest sound one i have cut was about 6' wide and it had a little hole bout the size of a baseball. that don't hurt it though. as above, ground and water have alot to do with it.
You're not kidding water has a lot to do with it. I cut into one last year with my Fabtek - must have been 15 gallons or more of water that came gushing out of the cut and began spraying all over the head - I thought I blew a main feed hose on the head so I killed the hydraulic feed lever and when that did not stem the flow to speak I killed the engine thinking I was about to pump my hydraulic tank dry. The water was still running and I was scratching my head trying to figure out what to do and if the tree was going to topple over. Took a minute of looking a the head to figure out what was actually happening. When I got it down the center had a big hole but nothing above so it was storing water in there. Quite the lesson.
ha ha ha, try that hand falling lol. get a stinky bath. sweet gum and some types of red oak are the worst.
........ or soft maple. Done that, been there and you look like you are sprayed on with hydraulic fluid. :D :D
The tree maybe thought, if you cut me down , i am gonna give it to you ! :D
The John Deere 550D Crawler is left on the job to open and grade the access roads and plow snow as needed. Dull/Kellogg Timber Harvest 2015
The Timberjack 209A Cable Skidder pulls tree lengths off the steep hillsides being worked.
Tree lengths are then cut to length for forwarding to the landing.
The Valmet 546 Forwarder carries the cut lengths to the landing.
Looks like a slick operation! I've still been fighting the snow...
Always enjoy your pictures Ron Scott. Very nice looking woods. Maine logger88 those woods also look very nice. I bet the jack is doing more winching of trees than dragging them through all that snow.
Here is my view for the next few weeks. Small diameter wood, mostly balsam fir in old thinnings. The tree in the head shows two trees that merged into one at about 10 feet. Don't see that too often.
Yeah it's definatly doing a lot of winching which isn't super productive. Not bad softwood must be pretty decent tons per acre? How does deep snow affect CTL bad good or not make a difference?
The deeper the snow gets, the harder it is on our CTL jobs, especially on the steeper terrain, as it just gets harder to get around in the snow. One job had to shut down for now mainly because of the snow conditions and steepness of the slopes remaining to log. They will finish up after the snow leaves.
The conditions on another area we're logging are still pretty good since the snow isn't too deep yet and the slopes aren't as long and steep and they have better equipment for handling the conditions.
I just saw the guy that cut my land,CTL,he still going strong. Yes,it's harder,but the job has to be done.
Timberjack 209A Cable Skidder works tree lengths from the hills. Dull/Kellogg Timber Harvest 2015.
The Valmet 546 Double Bunk Forwarder carries the CTL pieces to the landing for product sorting. The landing is near a well traveled county road so it it cabled off to prevent passerby's from entering into the sale area and removing pieces from the wood deck for firewood, especially on weekends when the loggers usually aren't there.
never new they made a 290 tj whats the difference in the 290 to the 240
Not sure other than that's what the operator said it was. It's an older one that has been recently rebuilt. I'll have to check it out closer the next time I'm there.
The 546 Valmet cleans the skid route from the overnight snow during its first morning run. Dull/Kellogg timber harvest 2015.
A mixed load of hardwoods is forwarded to the landing.
Fell off the oak while I was limbing it and went right too my waist 20" on the saw the bartip is just touching the ground
Had a bunch of decent sticks like this
The Timberjack Cable Skidder pulls tree lengths to flat ground for hand cutter to cut hardwood products to length (CTL); Dull/Kellogg timber harvest 2015
Hardwood sawlogs cut to length waiting to be forwarded to the landing/decking area.
those h maple shur are nice 8)
Timberjack 230A Forwarder works a northern hardwoods timber sale. This job has now shut down due to the deep snow with about 60 trees yet to reach and remove from the steep slope areas. Riehl Timber Harvest, November, 2014.
I have a bog that would treat you the same way. ::) It never freezes.
didn't some one say in another post that forwarders was the only way to go cause they didn't leave ruts :D :D
Quote from: coxy on February 14, 2015, 06:39:37 PM
didn't some one say in another post that forwarders was the only way to go cause they didn't leave ruts :D :D
Yes I think iv'e seen that somewhere as well ;D ::)
creating frog habitat!
If you need bog frozen it needs to be ripped up pretty good and left rutted and lumpy, then mixed and ripped up again.
Quote from: 1270d on February 14, 2015, 06:58:35 PM
creating frog habitat!
If you need bog frozen it needs to be ripped up pretty good and left rutted and lumpy, then mixed and ripped up again.
:D :D :D 8) 8)
1270d,well I guess they got the ripped up pretty good and left rutted and lumpy part done once. Wonder it they will go back and do it again? :D
Ron, I wish we had more high quality hardwood stands like in your pictures, because I would really like to have an operation like that- hand falling, cable skidder, and small forwarder. I'm starting to get a bit "portly" sitting in a "porter" all day on northern MN pulpwood harvests :)
Chevy, I've not fallen through with the forwarder yet where I couldn't get myself out. The frame lock overide switch is your friend in those situations. It is pretty tough to get out without assistance once you lose the front end of the machine though.
Oddly enough I had been driving over that spot with the processor for almost a week and it seemed hard as rock (like I said nights were well below zero). Ground just decided that it didn't want to hold up the empty forwarder. haha
Wouldn't have been too bad except the blade was hung up on a stump that was up on a little mound.
Its always impresses me where you could skid with a Caribou. I broke through the mat on a swamp strip with our 346 Fabtek totally empty. The other operator (in a fully loaded Caribou) went around me, off the mat, and pulled me out. Fabtek is a boat anchor in wet/soft ground though.
Some recognition to the loggers during these cold work days.
http://gowood.blogspot.com/2015/02/loggers-work-while-rest-of-us-stay.html
Chuck Ray's Blog
Wow, quite a bit of scrap iron in this video. But hats off to those guys, who maneuver this big loads.
I liked those Ron.
Idaho Woodhauler near Idaho Falls on its way to the mill yesterday.
Coxy,
This is a 209D Timberjack Cable Skidder, not a 290 as the operator was calling it. I checked the tag on it. Its an early vintage machine and still going strong.
Shickshinny pa mixed hardwood 2014.
the shickshinny tract. Large red oak. (Truck is used off road for forwarding purposes)
Them are dandy red oak GA Jones
Nice!!
Barbender my forwarder guy got himself stuck again today. I hopped in and tried the frame lock override with the boom swung over to the side and I was able to walk it right out. Thanks for the tip.
Cool! I'm glad it worked for you, it's got me out of quite a few pinches ;)
Quote from: Ron Scott on February 20, 2015, 01:22:08 PM
Coxy,
This is a 209D Timberjack Cable Skidder, not a 290 as the operator was calling it. I checked the tag on it. Its an early vintage machine and still going strong.
im all about old iron she is a dandy ;D the nice part of old iron is just about every penny is profit :) is the steering on the dash or over on the right hand side where the batteries are
I'm looking at buying one like this how do you like it
The sawmill owner must like it since he has been running it as his primary and only cable skidder for the past 20 years that I know of. He just overhauled it last summer. I'll check the steering location on it for sure my next time on the job.
A cold morning at the landing. The loggers aren't working today with the equipment parked waiting a warmer morning start up. Dull/Kellogg timber harvest, 2/18/15
ron your part of the country looks a bit like ours with the hills and valleys good pics ;D
We are logging the property of two landowners who have their homes on neighboring hilltops for their landscapes view. This makes for some tricky operations planning.
One of the landowners hilltop homes. Dull/Kellogg timber harvest 2/18/15
Selection cutting in hill country hardwoods.
Forwarder trail route down hill terrain to one of the landings.
how many ac are you cutting
146.80 MBF and 97.10 Cords on 31 acres.
Wake up Ponsses, there's daylight in the swamp ;)
leten daylight in to swamp. that saying came from maine. wayyyy back when
www.youtube.com/watch?v=43fIX5oAK1M
1270D Let's see a video of that scorpion working!
You'll be running out of trees soon. :)
Coxy,
The steering lever on the 209 D Timberjack is a lever in the center of the machine. Serial # 779756
CTL Logging on a hilltop. Dull/Kellogg timber harvest, 3/15
thanks ron on some of the other/older ones it was on the side by the batteries don't think I could get the hang of it ;D
CTL harvest on hilltop. The 209D Timberjack cable skidder pulls the cut tree lengths from the side slopes to the hilltop with its winch where they are cut to product lengths to be forwarded to the landing. Dull/Kellogg timber harvest, 3/15.
Thanks for the pics Ron Scott. I noticed the guys wearing chaps instead of safety pants. Chaps are not very common around here. Are they commonly worn in your area? Beautiful tall hwd timber in your area.
looks a little steep ;) could you please send me that dead beech cut in 20in chunks and split 1 time in half thanks :D :D :D :D 8) 8) 8) 8)
Ken,
They wear both chaps and safety pants here depending upon one's preference. Chaps are usually used more during the winter weather for comfort and fit with the heavier cloths worn underneath for warmth.
Coxy,
Yes, the area is a series of steep rolling slopes. Access to each slope area is slow and a a specific challenge.The dead beech is being left as a "wildlife tree", ;)
These two old timberjacks have a combined hour meter reading of 68000+ hours and are working daily. Tough machines
I don't see anybody with a big grin in his face. Those machines have paid for them self more than once. smiley_thumbsup
Thats a good looking picture. :D how does the 4bt run in your 230 ? My 230 has a 353 and semi gutless and ive pondered either swapping or just wait till i upgrade. Will that 1010 climb a decent hill loaded ?
I like to make sure each one gets a hug before it gets the 395 / 3120 treatment. You cut and skid 12 of these a day alone and you know it. :D
:o For a moment I thought that tree fell on him.
Nice tree! I cut some pine today nothing huge but added up decent
That's the stuff I like for timbers. Big enough to get the timber, small enough to not produce a lot of side lumber. :)
Yeah it's actually my favorite size stuff to cut 3 or 4 trees to the thousand easy to cut and limb and grades well!
Let's see if I can figure out how to link to a video-
Pine on the landing: http://youtu.be/NZkDQ9ixfIQ
I hope you all enjoy the Pow-wow music as much as me :D I have two radio stations on this job, classical MPR and KOJB "the Eagle", I was leaning towards my native heritage ;D
Barbender - Is this some of the pine along Hwy 46 they have marked?
88.5 was always my go to station when someone wanted to listen to country, which I do not listen to. Compromise with classical!
Clark
Clark,
We are about 1/4 mile off of 46, out of sight from the road. There are multiple cutting blocks though, and I haven't looked them all over.
Not so sure about the tune's.. :D :D But you are a very talented operator barbender ;) DanG nice work 8)
It's an acquired taste ;D
great operating, like an extension of your body. I can see what you mean about the music! I think it was kinda cool, and if I was running something all day I'd listen to it too.
Sounded a bit like rain dance music ;D.
Thanks barbender. I would sure love to get a chance to work in timber like that
Quote from: WDH on March 21, 2015, 09:12:59 PM
Sounded a bit like rain dance music ;D.
I didn't think of that, WDH! :D Ken, this stuff is a treat, especially for the processors. This pine forest is part of what is known as the "Avenue of the Pines" on Hwy 46, it is all pine that was planted by the CCC in the 30's. Here's another video from out in the woods, my wife said she would have done a better job filming if she would've known I was posting the video here :) I have been driving 60-90 minutes one way to work for the last 9 months, so it is really nice to be close to home, I can have the family stop out and visit ;)
3-20: http://youtu.be/NF6-VddYaT0
There ya go barbender the last video would be more my choice of tune's. :D But after watching the other one again I can see where the tribal music would catch on.... and for sure would get a rythym going. Again great operating, really a joy to watch, thank's.
. The thing is, so il logger, it's all the same radio station. It actually suits me pretty good, they play everything from classic country to alternative, 80's British invasion synth pop to reggae- plus the pow-wow music (not to mention the KOJB Ojibwe Phrase of the Day) :D I like listening to Christian radio stations, and even classic rock, but when you sit there for 10-12 hours a day you get pretty sick of hearing the same songs over and over. So when I get in the area, I tune in to "the Eagle" because you never know what will come out of the speakers :D
Looks good barbender nice stuff! Very smooth!
Nice video barbender. I love seeing you guys at work. Thanks for posting. A couple of those grapple fulls would be a load for me :D
gg
Yes Barbender, very nice, thank you for posting. Smoooooth comes to mind for sure. That appears to be a very stable porter but man that double acting extenda boom now that is "sweet".
Nice video Barbender and those pictures look all too familiar except I've got a Valmet.
But I have to ask, what no sorts for bolts?
Gary, it's all bolts ;) I've landed about 200 cords, and I have a pile of pulp that's about 5 cords. It's pretty much bolts to the top of the tree. We are sorting a few 10' and 12' logs, I've set out about 4 truck loads. We're only sorting logs out of stuff greater than 15" diameter.
Stephen, this is a stable forwarder. I ran it for a month this winter with no frame lock, I wouldn't really notice unless I reached way out to the side with with no wood in the bunks. The sliding crane is nice- to be honest, the way these machines are configured you need the extensions. You can barely reach the ground without the extension because of theh height of the bunks.
g man, yeah, 2 grapples would about do it ;D I love running forwarder, but sometimes I miss getting to fire up the old cable skidder and actually touch a tree with my hands :D
Quote from: barbender on March 21, 2015, 10:23:58 PM
...This pine forest is part of what is known as the "Avenue of the Pines" on Hwy 46, it is all pine that was planted by the CCC in the 30's...
I'm pretty sure large portions of the "Avenue of Pines" were natural origin after a fire in the 1870-1880's. Maybe the block you are cutting was planted by the CCC? I'm not sure. I do know that they have a 7 acre chunk devoted to a long-term growing stock study and that spot (and surrounding areas) are fire origin and nearing 150 years old. Unfortunately they were not managed in any way until they were 70 years old so the largest trees are only ~28" DBH.
It would be interesting to know how many rings the stumps have on them...if you're not busy!
Clark
You know, Clark, that's very interesting. I don't know why I was assuming the CCC planted this stuff. The thought did cross my mind that the wood is pretty big for being 80 years old. Now you have me wondering- I will have to count some rings tomorrow ;)
Well @Clark (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=6815), you were right on the money. I counted the rings on one log, 135+ :o It was hard to count some, there is a fire scar from the first 20 years, and the last 20 or so are really tight, so it could easily be 145-150. Before you brought this up, I was looking at a photo online of the Avenue of Pines online that looked to be from the 40's and the trees were quite large (makes sense if they were already 80 years old instead of 10 ::) ) Fascinating stuff, at least to me anyways ;)
Thanks for taking the time and counting. I've wondered how much of that pine is actually that old. I'd guess a lot of it is that old. It seems odd to have a stand of pure red pine that was naturally regenerated. I guess the birch and jack pine that came up with it died out 50-75 years ago.
You're not the first to think the CCC planted it. I heard a gov't employee (who should have known better) claim the same thing! Naturally they were claiming it was "bad" because it was "artificially" planted by man.
Also, please tell me this isn't for their climate change experiment...
Clark
I don't know what the purpose of this harvest is, Clark. Now that I know how old this stuff is, I'm surprised they are harvesting it. I don't know what BA we are thinning to, but there are a fair amount of mini-clearcut/wildlife openings (or whatever their purpose is), if that adds any insight. On another note, I heard on the radio the other day that one of the agencies, I don't remember if it was the USFS or MNDNR, was doing some experimental patch clearcuts in black ash stands and replanting swamp white oak- trying to head off EAB and or climate change.
Quote from: barbender on March 23, 2015, 09:20:00 PM
It was hard to count some, there is a fire scar from the first 20 years, and the last 20 or so are really tight,
There's your reason. It looks like those largest diameters you are harvesting are not large enough for the age of those trees.
Quote from: Gary_C on March 24, 2015, 01:54:05 PM
Quote from: barbender on March 23, 2015, 09:20:00 PM
It was hard to count some, there is a fire scar from the first 20 years, and the last 20 or so are really tight,
There's your reason. It looks like those largest diameters you are harvesting are not large enough for the age of those trees.
You lost me with that...
Quote from: Southside logger on March 24, 2015, 03:24:10 PM
You lost me with that...
If you have 130-150 year old red pine, you should see a lot larger diameters than I'm seeing in the videos. Plus if the outer rings are very tight, it's time for a thinning.
Most likely the forester for the job has taken some bore samples and seen those tight rings and decided the stand either needed a thinning or a final harvest. So I suspect they are looking for some diameter growth with another thinning as it's unlikely they could get approval for a final harvest.
is the tighter growth ring better/stronger for lumber :-\
Gary - I'm pretty sure this is part of the Cutfoot Sioux Experimental forest. "Normal" management is out the window, this timber is more for ideas to be explored and regimes to be tested. Final harvest, I'm sure, only rarely applies here.
Clark
They will just die of old age and fall down and become beetle food. Nature does not care.
I'd hate to cut them all down, I know that. But I was looking at another block today that looked like it had a beetle kill in it.
Considering that most of the experts claim red pine won't respond to release after the age of 100 or that it won't live past 150 and they have shown on the Cutfoot Experimental Forest that neither of those claims are true, I too would hate to seem them all go. Plus, where else in North America do you have several thousand (well, at least 1K) acres of red pine over 100 years old? Granted, it would be awesome to see more silviculture practiced but we've got what they have arranged.
@barbender (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=1286) - I'm going to start another topic on the study you heard about. It's pretty interesting and since you live close to it I'd like to give you more details without having it buried in this thread.
Clark
Like @Clark (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=6815) said, this timber covers a very large area. You drive through it for about 6 miles on highway 46, and that's just the part the highway goes through. It is truly beautiful.
Gary, my point was that I don't know why the USFS is doing this harvest. Typical timber management practices may not apply, it could have been for toad habitat or something ::). They don't operate the way the other forestry agencies do.
Still a wee bit of snow here in the bush. I just started a small job on the south end of a large field and alongside a public road.. The harvesting head is 4 1/2 feet tall for reference. There are spots where it completely disappears when I reach for the butt of the tree.
Wow Ken! >:( We are snow free here, I think you guys out east got your portion, plus ours- and maybe someone else's too.
I measured over 5ft of snow in my field yesterday. Gonna be a while yet before I can get back to work.
Hey @coxy (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=14170), I forgot to reply to your question- yes, this slow grown pine would make some fine lumber, it is more stable than fast grown red pine. I'd really like to quartersaw some of it, I like the look of vertical grain pine.
no problem :)
Thinning some hardwoods. Mostly red oak in this clip.
http://youtu.be/8YsouCY7794
1270 is that a go pro camera? All the wood looks small. I still want to try working side by each to see how the two machines compare
How are you liking the Scorpion after a winter in it, 1270d? It's a Scorpion King, right? Does yours have an H6 or H7 head?
Video is with my phone. This job is mostly pulp poles, not much diameter to it.
Barbender, it is a scorpion king, with the h7. It has just over 900 hours on the meter now, and I like it more every week. There has been a few problems here and there, but the service dept has been great.
By the looks of the video, you've settled right into it ;)
Thanks for the video 1270d. That H7 has some good delimbing power. I was looking at a Scorpion here at a local dealership. Looks like a nice machine to work in.
Nice video! You guys must have good wood prices to pay for a machine like that thinning wood that size! You'd be hard pressed to pay fuel cuttin that round here let alone payin insurance/operator/forwarding/stumpage/breakdowns etc...
1270D
Where's your job located in the UP?
The landing and decking area during spring break-up. Road restrictions are on and trucking is restricted. The sawlogs and pulpwood will be decked until the trucking restrictions are lifted. Dull/Kellogg timber harvest, 3/15.
High Lead on a tank hull; perhaps an M48 or M60.
Not mine; it's located on what I believe is Stimson' land, above Tillamook Oregon.
It has been parked in the same spot for at least 2 years.
That's cool I like to see yarders!
Ron how much weight do you think gets lost in a pile of pulp like that from sitting maybe 2 weeks nice looking logs looks to be mostly hard maple
I got caught once with a load in the spring. The know it all guy up the road was having a fit that I was going to loose money on weight. ::) Guess he thought it would pay to put it in the back of a pick up and haul it 2 miles to a unposted road. ::) I had all ready cut 2 loads,almost made it with the last load. Some of us have to work at another job to support the ones that can stand around all day and tell others how it needs to be done.
Coxy
Yes, that is mostly all hard maple sitting on the landing. There would not be to much weight loss/cord for a 2 week sit on the landing at present weather conditions. It would depend upon the relative humidity around the site, but if weather is dry during the period it might average about 3.8#/cord/day weight loss on the hard maple pulpwood or a 53.5# loss/cord for a 2 week period.
Quote from: Ron Scott on March 30, 2015, 07:25:38 PM
1270D
Where's your job located in the UP?
Central UP in Marquette county
Spring break up is a good time for a needed oil change on the forwarder. Dull/Kellogg timber harvest, 3/15
Tree lengths are CTL along the forwarder's route to be forwarded to the landing when the oil change is done.
Ron your roads seem to be staying in great shape.
They're still frozen pretty well and the soil is a major factor.
A "plugged" landing- I was running out of room with no trucking for a few days. It's hard to tell in the picture, as a lot of the wood is "double ranked", but there is between 400 and 500 cords piled up here.
Barbender. Awesome picture! How tall are those piles?
Thats a good looking picture. :D
Chep, some of the piles are getting up around 20'. I typically try not to pile that high, as it can be dangerous for the truckers. Sometimes we run out of landing room though, and the only way to go is up.
Your truckers will appreciate the work waiting for them. :(
Quote from: chep on April 02, 2015, 11:48:44 PM
Barbender. Awesome picture! How tall are those piles?
x2 Very cool pic, BB.
Nice looking piles as usual!
The 209D Timberjack pulls tree lengths off the hillside for CTL products. Dull/Kellogg timber harvest, 2/15.
My Father would say,That tree on the left is so crooked it would not make straight smoke. :)
Quote from: thecfarm on April 03, 2015, 08:11:32 PM
My Father would say,That tree on the left is so crooked it would not make straight smoke. :)
Haha my grandfather always says that lol!
Thanks for the compliments, guys ;) Ron, I really like that cable skidder/forwarder system, that has to be about the lowest impact way of doing things, and for getting the best value out of sawtimber.
Barbender,
Looks like Brazil.
Quite a ways from Brazil, WDH ;) This is a sale in what is called the "Cutfoot experimental forest), 150 year old Red pine (I learned that on here, I thought the CCC planted it ::)) It is a beautiful forest, I count it a privelege to have had the opportunity to work in it. My picture came out a little squished, I like to use the panoramic function on my phone camera for landing pictures, usually it works good but I had to keep resizing this one to get it to load.
I'll see if this one is a bit less compressed-
looks like a big pile of birch to is it logs or pulp
Pulp on the end you can see in the pic, pallet bolts on the other end.
Nice example of hard/smart working in these pics!
Almost everything looks the same as what I see out here in Oregon; the log length, the weather (or geography), and species of trees being the three exceptions.
Q: Are those logs in these pic mostly 8'6" long?
Most of us out here need a number of 21' bunk logs in the decks where quality cuts produce shorter logs. The timber companies usually produce 40' ers.
95% of what we cut is 100", there were some 12',18', and 20' logs on this job. It typically pays more to just cut them 100" and send them for stud bolts, but the stud mill has a 19" max size. It seems like a shame to cut nice logs for stud bolts, to me, but that's the market we have.
The main reason to cut them into saw bolts is you get payed by the cord, makes it hard for the mill to steal. When its cut into logs you get payed by the BF, you lose about 30%, this all depends on which mill your taking it to.
I cut many thousands of cords that was planted by the CCC boys in the Chippewa National Forest. They did some pretty crocked farming in some places.
I agree, LJ48- Potlatch pays by weight, so it's a simple number conversion. Some of the mills that buy logs, their prices aren't that good in the first place, then the scale is stingy, and it takes them a month to pay. So we hack them 100" and be done with it.
barbender - Are you responsible for the piles you can see from Hwy 46? If so, you did a mighty good job of piling them high!
Clark
Nope Clark, the block I was on was not visible from the highway. We had 5 forwarders on that job, I don't know which of our guys worked the block right off of the highway. You were up my way, I take it? ;)
Went to see the family for Easter, Hwy 46 is not optional for that drive!
It's good to see that pine getting used for something. I think that stuff has needed thinning for many moons.
Clark
Our loggers have a very good firewood market for the "crooked hardwood" sections also so they will be going up in smoke. ;)
Moving to a new job.
BM must be nice to not have any snow ;D
Wish my loader looked like that.
The Timberjack 209D is parked by a hard maple sawlog tree marked for cutting while the cutter is working a hillside for the cable skidder's work. Dull/Kellogg timber harvest, 3/2015
Quote from: jwilly3879 on April 08, 2015, 07:21:45 AM
Wish my loader looked like that.
If you knew what i paid you would fall out of your chair and shake on the floor. She is a good machine, probably look into a 437C when i get another big skidder, my 440D has all she wants to yank that around.
That maple looks like it was damaged in a previous harvest.
Looks good guys!
yes, much of the hardwoods that we are now cutting were damaged some in a previous tree length logging operation 12-15 + years ago.
Dressing up a road we tore up in the muddy conditions-
had some more snow this morning
I hate April snow >:(
From yesterday. Using a tractor to remove poorest quality trees from a previously high graded lot.
A little video
https://youtu.be/UivrQ7PfEtw
Yesterday was probably my last day for a while. Trails were still frozen solid but 60 degrees today and the rest of the week.
gg
Yes,that stuff you posted pictures of look kinda rough. :( That one in the video looked good.
Can anyone tell me how to upload a pic on here still new to this
thecfarm has prolly done it a couple of hundred times. Just wait for him.
Jeff also has posted some picture tutoring videos, but I can't find them anymore.
g_man Out of the one in the picture you could easy make a " natural barber chair " :D
Go to the Home page and scroll down to Posting photos. It is not difficult, even I can do it. ;D
Thanks G_man,
I'm learning a lot from your posts; safe and productive timber-harvest practices!
That one tree that formed an "S" looks like a place where a cougar might be found napping etc. ;D
Got an opportunity for a nice spring breakup job less than 5 minutes from home. Very nice wood although a very long yard to get it roadside.
Here are a couple loads of spruce.
Oh and did I mention roadside. I love piling on the side of the pavement this time of year. That is firewood in the foreground and background with logs and random length pulpwood in the center.
Wow Ken! That really is "roadside"! ;) You must pile it from the side opposite the road, they don't let you right on the asphalt, do they?
Most if not all counties here won't let you deck on a county road right of way. Cool pics :) 8) 8)
lumberjack101,welcome to the forum. This will get you started. :)
https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php/topic,61788.0.html
Logs on the landing waiting to be hauled as soon as road restrictions are lifted. The weather still isn't cooperating with cold rain yesterday and snow today. April 2015.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xI7E1GakiSk
made a video processing behind the buncher today. mix of maple and balsam pulp.
Nice. You seem to know what the machine is capable to do and what not, like the way you're cutting up those crotches.
Thanks, I think I could watch that all day. Appreciate hearing the sounds of the machine (and not music ;D )
I'm jealous of that unobstructed view and the speed of that H7 head.
https://youtu.be/cKYl4Y8b2Zg (https://youtu.be/cKYl4Y8b2Zg)
Good videos featuring different machines.
Here is another clip from our current job. This hill side is too steep to run the forwarders up, so the buncher "hands" the wood up closer to the top, from a flat area part way down the hill.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TXAArwRqVps
doesn't look like much money is going to be made there ;D but gota do what ya gota do 8) thanks for the pics like watching your kind of logging out there
It isn't productive, but was the best way to get that spot. Took a half hour in a three week job.
A half hour of lower than average production in three weeks. Is that what you guys are talking about. :o
I wish i could say that from me. ;D
A new "thingamajig"
When skidding a large log with a pulley on the log, I needed/wanted something with a bell/hook so the end of the cable could attach to the slots on winch; the local logging supply store built this mini-New England Style choker.
I can also rig a 2" clevis onto the end link and run it to stationary anchor point.
Works good!
Looks good straightgrain. It is those special little accessories that help make things go easy.
You probably realize it is better to connect the fixed end of the cable to a fixed object like a stump rather than to your tractor when using a pulley or snatch block on the log. If you connect to the tractor you double the force pulling your tractor back just like you double the force on the log. You have two cables pulling your tractor back. If you hitch to a stump the tractor gets 1/2 and the stump gets 1/2 of the pull on the log which is double the cable tension.
Just thought I would mention it in case you didn't already realize this. Sometimes you have no choice but the tractor.
gg
Straightgrain,can you get a picture of the "thingamajig" ;D in use?
Anything to make it easier.
Good point g_man; I seen the dynamic effects on the tractor, and I will permanently put your suggestion into my toolbox of repertoire (had to look up that word ;D).
The pulley really helps when skidding big logs towards a deck and I approach a rise that the tractor can't pull both; I drop the log, motor to the top, drop the winch and skid it up...learning a lot from you guyz.
Will get some pics; have a couple trees to drop today.
I needed my thingamajig today, this 28" x 21 foot log was so heavy, a block was needed to move it up the hill and onto the loading pad.
Once the winch settled-in, the tractor stayed-put, and the log moved fairly easy.
Some tight rings on that fir! Will make some real nice boards.
Yesser, it was a heavy bugger; the 32" bar was "beaver-tailing" at the hinge.
Here is a look at the stump, while standing on the butt.
Quick vid of a Barko 240 running a Skidmore CF-18 in some mixed hardwood.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i5wyY_G1jec&feature=youtu.be
Quote from: FABTEK on May 25, 2015, 05:00:37 PM
https://youtu.be/i5wyY_G1jec
looks like it works real well. i was hoping to see one at the bangor show..there wasnt any
New is Nice! ;)
Fabtek what head does that machine have on it
Name change??
It looks pretty but the payment and woodpile it has to cut to keep afloat scare me. :D
Quote from: BargeMonkey on May 27, 2015, 02:32:46 AM
It looks pretty but the payment and woodpile it has to cut to keep afloat scare me. :D
X3 :D
Quote from: lumbertick on May 26, 2015, 07:56:14 PM
Fabtek what head does that machine have on it
I would say it is a Waratah 622B. John Deere completely redesigned their harvesting carriers and skidders and that is a pic of the new 803 JD. The local dealer is having a Open House next week to showcase the new machines. I may go for a burger but my buying days are over for a while.
Spring grading the haul road/drive this weekend with my tractor, rear blade, and homemade grading scraper
gg
Nice work and good job on the box grader. smiley_thumbsup
Did you use 1/4 " thick on the sides and rear ?
Thanks. 3/8" mild steel plate. 2 1/2 X 2 1/2 X 1/4 sq tube.
gg
Looks like some mighty fine road material you have there.
Just saw this on Vermont CL. Looks neat. Gearmatic 9 doesn't work.
Anyone know about them?
I have never seen one before even a pic before just now but my grandfather always talks about an international track skidder that my great uncle had back in the late 60s I'll ask him about it again and get some info. I know he hauled wood for him back then. Thanks for sharing the pic I've always been curious what they looked like!
Quote from: jwilly3879 on June 08, 2015, 09:20:03 PM
Just saw this on Vermont CL. Looks neat. Gearmatic 9 doesn't work.
Anyone know about them?
I can tell you all about them!! Ran on from when I was in 3rd grade up till high school! Di d this every school vacation! Dad bought it brand new, had a diesel motor. Pulled lots of wood, tracks was a bear once you lost one off. Had to use the winch to pull it back on.
What was the process to put the track back on using the winch? I am just wondering how in the world a guy could pull it off, I have done it on a dozer but that is a different animal
Quote from: so il logger on June 09, 2015, 02:19:14 AM
What was the process to put the track back on using the winch? I am just wondering how in the world a guy could pull it off, I have done it on a dozer but that is a different animal
I would lose one off a couple times a month, man handle it so its back under the front wheel and middle wheel and over the top as much as possible then hook winch into top and winch tight and back up slow. Man this brings back memorys! Would like to have on for old timesake!
Quote from: thecfarm on June 08, 2015, 09:13:39 PM
Looks like some mighty fine road material you have there.
The road is about 20 years old. Actually it is just the natural dirt and 3/4" crushed rock I put in the mud holes little by little the first 3 or 4 years. Now it packs hard and stays pretty good.
Quote from: Woodhauler on June 09, 2015, 05:38:06 AM
Quote from: so il logger on June 09, 2015, 02:19:14 AM
What was the process to put the track back on using the winch? I am just wondering how in the world a guy could pull it off, I have done it on a dozer but that is a different animal
I would lose one off a couple times a month, man handle it so its back under the front wheel and middle wheel and over the top as much as possible then hook winch into top and winch tight and back up slow. Man this brings back memorys! Would like to have on for old timesake!
That makes sense, I bet it was a workout though :)
g man,
That grader/scraper is a nice piece of work.Good job.
Mick
Well done on the road work. The roads are usually an issue on most logging jobs.
Timberjack 380C Grapple Skidder, Riehl timber harvest, 6/15
Getting the slash down to improve traction on the hillsides, improve area aesthetics, and to get the "fines" from the woody debris into the ground for soil improvement.
Nice little Red pine tract
One forwarder load-
I really dislike working around these-
I just dropped a big black oak across a set of the thing you don't like. I had been cutting on my pipe line and when I got to dads power line I didn't give it another thought. I couldn't have made a better hit if I had really worked at hitting it. Compleetly square across the lines with plenty of extra tree to make sure. I cut a log from between the brances to try and recoup my losses. The electric company sent two trucks and six guys to fix it. I would have felt a bit better if the tree would have at least been walnut :D.
cheers
gww
Did the power company bill you?
It only happenned a few days ago but I am sure they will.
gww
Ouch. Sorry to hear that. I've heard that can be big money😟
If They don't charge me, it was still stupid of me. If they charge me based on how stupid, I may not be able to afford it. Time will tell. I come close one other time in my life with a giant yard walnut and scraped the wires hard even after cabling and wedging the tree. It was deader then a door nail and headed that way, if I had did nothing it would have took out the wires eventually. I did something and got lucky. This one was a strait enough tree that it could of probly been put anywhere and it went where I picked. I still can't believe I didn't even think of the lines. There are many times I wonder how I stayed alive this long. Oh well, another old saying, "I'ld rather be lucky then good".
gww
your suppose to pull the roots and all then call the power co and tell them that a tree fell over on the wires :D :D :-X :-X :-X :-X :-X :-X :-X :-X
I had a tree get away from the harvester a couple winters ago and take down a line. I had the machine in the road cutting trees throwing them back into the woods ;) It's a dead end and it was the middle of winter. The temp that day was 15 degrees. The tree was a triple trunk sugar maple and I couldn't get a good grip on it. I thought I had it but the bark slipped and it went over the side of the head and hit the power line behind me. It didn't break the line but it sure stretched it and made it sag. After being sure the tree wasn't touching the line I grabbed it and ran it into sticks and threw the brush over the bank. It wasn't twenty minutes and the power company was there. By that time we had the logs moved and were down the road a bit. The lineman stretched the line back up and replaced the fuse in the transformer. It did knock out power to 6 houses. No words were spoken. We just all went about our business ;D 8) 8) 8) I was sweating it for a bit ;D
Corley, been there, done that :D I wasn't going to lie if they came and asked if I was the responsible party, but I wasn't calling them, either ;D
Years ago I had one the wind caught and it took down the lines. When I called it in they had already had 17 calls about it, it was Soap Opera time. Besides that the lines landed on the truck which had lunch and coffee in it with sparks jumping all around.
Had one faller get a power line. It cost his employer $300.00 by the power company. When he did it a second time, he was relieved of his job.
I will be very surprized if I get by with only a three hundred dollar bill. My cousen clears power line easments. He droped one on a line and they fired him. However they also rehird him and have just promoted him. Just saying.
Cheers
gww
We took out the power to a community a few years back on one of the coldest days of the winter. I immediately called the local power commission and they were appreciative that I contacted them as soon as it happened. No charge. Locals were unimpressed though.
Woodhauler "Night Train" participates in 4th of July parade.
Nice looking truck
The Fabtek CTL harvester is working the flat ground near the landing/decking area as the job nears completion., 6/2015.
Sawlogs being unloaded at one of the local Amish mills.
The active landing/decking area before closure of the timber harvest.
The landing/decking area is cleaned up and graded upon closure of the timber harvest.
Nice looking soil Ron,
And a real professional looking job!
Ron
How does the big wheeled equiptment handle traction and incliment weather compared to the tracked equiptment?
Thanks
gww
The rubber tired equipment handles the terrain well though chains are needed during the deep snow season and when working excessive hill terrain. Having good rubber on the tires helps a lot. ;) The tracked machines may be more versatile overall but with a little less speed and more ground impact.
Ron
Thank you for the responce.
gww
Quote from: Ron Scott on July 12, 2015, 10:56:17 PM
The rubber tired equipment handles the terrain well though chains are needed during the deep snow season and when working excessive hill terrain. Having good rubber on the tires helps a lot. ;) The tracked machines may be more versatile overall but with a little less speed and more ground impact.
Do you ever run chains on the wheeled (rubber tired) equipment year round? I am finding that our tractor ag tires are getting beat up in the woods by rocks, ledge, etc. Thinking about running chains year round. Others have cautioned against this due to possibility of chains picking up & slinging exposed branches, slash, etc, that would otherwise be under snow in winter. But I am thinking more & more that the chains will protect the rubber in woods & tough terrain.
Thoughts???
I run chains on the landini yr round, I replaced the rear tires with nokia forestry tires last fall (@$3000.) and the farm tires still had good tread after 10 yrs. Chains are definatly cheaper.
I run chains all the way around all year on my skidders and wouldn't have it any other way
Used chains year round with the farm tractor and doodlebug.. 😉
I run them year round to ice chains thinking of putting bear paws on just for the summer any thoughts on that
Ice chains on the back and rings on the front all year.
Some days are better than others in this racket. Noticed something wonky in the bogeys early this morning so took them off machine. Hard days work. Now to strip them down and find/fix the problem.
Oh my :-\ That looks bad :-\
Quote from: Corley5 on July 21, 2015, 09:00:27 PM
Oh my :-\ That looks bad :-\
X2, what's up with it that you had to tear the whole diff out?
They never brake in the shop. :o
they look like gear driven naf rears. my valmet has chain drive naf that says valmet on it. my rottne has gear drive naf that says rottne on it. what dose wonky sound like???crash bang ? or scrunich?
Not a good working situation. Hope it turns out better than it looks.
Quote from: barbender on July 21, 2015, 10:25:41 PM
X2, what's up with it that you had to tear the whole diff out?
[/quote]
I seem to have gotten off very lucky. When travelling back in the trail Tuesday am I noticed one side of the bogies jumping a bit. I stopped, got the other operator and had him try it while I was on the back of machine. When he tried it the bogies on the opposite side would not spin. We then unhooked the driveshaft and assisted the machine to roadside with the harvester and tore it down.
When we stripped it apart yesterday morning the all components looked great 8). There was however a huge build up of pressure in the differential. We believe that one of the brake cylinders was leaking by and the vent plug was not releasing all the pressure thereby causing the brakes to lock on. It may have been overkill to tear it apart but now I know what the inside looks like and can have confidence that it should last a long time. Far too often I have seen machinery run too long when something was not right and consequently ended up with larger issues. Hopefully start putting it back in machine tomorrow.
Those brake cans are notorious for leaking hydraulic fluid into the differential and overfilling it. We draw straws to see who has to pop the plug to check the oil level, because a lot of times there is pressure built up and you get a shower of gear lube/hydraulic oil >:( You seem like a head first kinda guy, Ken!
Looks like that area was just cut a couple years ago? Or just skidding through a previous cut?
Good observation! The lower valley area that we are primarily skidding through was high graded
10-12 years ago. We are now harvesting much of the hillside timber that was previously left.
Hardwood sawlogs are being decked along a seasonal access road, The seasonal road is elevated above the lower landing/decking area where the trucker will park along the road side and load the logs. All wood should be hauled this week and the timber harvest contract will be closed. Riehl timber harvest, 7/2015.
The Valmet 646 Forwarder picks up the hardwood sawlogs, pulpwood, and firewood products behind the processor, August 2015.
Thanks for the pictures Ron. That hardwood looks quite rugged for that wheeled harvester and dangle head. Certainly not what they are designed for but with an experienced operator can be quite efficient.
Who's 1170E is that
The 1270E processor is owned by Housler Sawmill, Inc., Mesick, Mi. and is doing an excellent job on this northern hardwoods harvest. Yes, it helps that the operator has been to school in Finland on its use and has over 20,000 hours in working such machines.
Cut to Length harvest with the John Deere 1270E Processor, 8/2015
View of the inside of the cab of the John Deere 1270E Processor showing computer screen, map and specs. file of timber sale, etc. ,8/15
Cutting Head. With the skilled operator, the machine was able to cut up to 20" hardwoods quite well. A hand cutter and forwarder followed up for cutting the larger diameter hardwoods.
Did you get to take it for a drive Ron?
Very short one with tutoring. ;)
The 270 is supposed to be a great hardwood head.
Yes, I was very surprised as to how it handled the large hardwoods with ease. Very few trees were left for the followup hand-cutter. Much less than i thought there might be.
Very cool.
The Valmet 646 Forwarder works behind the John Deere Processor which has now finished its work and is being moved on to another job site. 8/15
How much production did he get a day in that stand?
He did 260.35 MBF in17.5 operating days so he averaged 14.9 MBF/day with some minor down times and terrain issues of hills and wet areas.
here is a short clip processing a couple of hard maple the other morning. Sometimes its easier to zip em with the saw.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=saAXbFqdNLk
Looks good, 1270d ;) Most anyone can keep a head zipping in clean softwood, but an operator that can keep things moving in limby hardwood knows what he's doing ;) That head tilt function looks handy.
Just before the ring and pinion went in our harvester I was processing a bit of bigger black spruce and cedar and it was a real treat to cut compared to the rough hardwood I've been cutting since early last winter.
I really like that H7 head. Boss keeps talking about trading the current Ergo in on a later model with the C5 crane and H7 head. After watching your videos I really wish he would.
Quote from: 1270d on September 04, 2015, 09:27:33 PM
here is a short clip processing a couple of hard maple the other morning. Sometimes its easier to zip em with the saw.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=saAXbFqdNLk
you can tilt the head part way and use the saw? mine the has to be all the way up or down
Yes. Ponsse calls it proportional tilt. Works like a charm. One button for tilt up, one for tilt down. Hold a button till your desired angle then release and it stays there. Tap a button to go back to floating tilt.
The 480 head could do this, but not as easily. There was a function button to enter proportional mode, then set tilt angle.
The first harvester I ran was a Logman 801, with an AFM 60L. It had the same tilt function as the Ponsse.
That's quite a machine, but at this point in my life I can't even imagine having to run in the dark just to make payments. I've grown too used to watching the sun come up with my wife at the breakfast table.
Quote from: 1270d on September 05, 2015, 10:02:28 AM
Yes. Ponsse calls it proportional tilt. Works like a charm. One button for tilt up, one for tilt down. Hold a button till your desired angle then release and it stays there. Tap a button to go back to floating tilt.
The 480 head could do this, but not as easily. There was a function button to enter proportional mode, then set tilt angle.
My 480 head has a button to set the tilt angle for cutting leaning trees, etc but when I hit the saw button it automatically dumps. I must ask the dealer technician if there is a setting that will allow it to stay up which would work great for cutting some hardwood limbs.
Quote from: Jhenderson on September 05, 2015, 06:38:16 PM
That's quite a machine, but at this point in my life I can't even imagine having to run in the dark just to make payments. I've grown too used to watching the sun come up with my wife at the breakfast table.
Running in the dark UP here this time of year might just mean you started cutting at 7am... haha. Couple more weeks and its lights on until 8am or later.
ken, if i remember correctly, holding your head open function the entire time you tilt will keep it in position without dumping. I was real used to propping the 480 saw box against things and then pushing the head into position for cutting limbs. easier than JD's tilt rigamarole.
We get cutting around six, tahoe is right, sometimes lights on still at close to nine (in the winter) Right now i like the lights till around 730. We don't work crazy hours. Ten hour days is average. I have met some who have slept in the machines or the truck.
the sun comes up late out your way but when dose the sun go down? here in november it will be dark by a little after 4pm
Maybe 5 or 530 on around the shortest days
You have to remember that he UP is at the far western end of the eastern time zone. Things get funny with that. Maine is on the other end of it so comparing time of day for events is somewhat silly. The UP probably has a little more daylight during the winter than Maine but for practical purposes we all receive the same # of hours during the winter.
Clark
Forwarding CTL northern hardwoods to the landing, 8/15.
Quote from: Clark on September 06, 2015, 05:32:05 PM
You have to remember that he UP is at the far western end of the eastern time zone.
Clark
Not really ;D Some of us western counties are on the far eastern side of the central time zone. ;)
Just like Ken's pictures from a few pages back except we were able to get the machine steam cleaned and into shop to work on it.
And a few teeth missing off the ring gear will cause you all sorts of issues.
Any luck finding parts?
Yeah after a few trips to Rhinelander I was able to drag home 3 differentials as they call them (which is the axle housing from brake to brake and weighs overs 1k lbs). The best one that was supposed to work ended up having a different gear ratio, one ended up not having a ring gear in it at all, luckily the third unit was usable so my brakes and boggies are getting bolted to it and hopefully into the machine in the next day or two. Hopefully be cutting wood by Thursday.
A gear set is still at least another week away from Finland... Hopefully we won't end up needing it.
No more pulling loaded log trucks around for this harvester. haha
We always use the forwarders for pushing/pulling trucks, if for no other reason than the boss wants the processors out cutting wood. I like to keep about half a load of wood on the forwarder when I'm pushing, it gives a lot more traction.
No way our old worn out Caribou is going to pull a 160,000 lbs truck around. It has all it can do to move itself. ha
Using a Dresser TD7G dozer to convert an old skid trail made by a cable skidder during a heavy harvest 20 years ago into a tractor road for lighter footprint TSI harvest activities.
gg
Good use in planning for use of the area's infrastructure developed from previous harvest operations and improving upon it for the access needs in the area's ongoing forest management.
:(
Quote from: chevytaHOE5674 on September 07, 2015, 10:43:04 PM
No way our old worn out Caribou is going to pull a 160,000 lbs truck around. It has all it can do to move itself. ha
I forgot you have the big trucks to push :o The heaviest ours can run (legally ::)) is #102,500, in the winter, on a 6 axle rig. I've had to push trucks up some fair sized sand hills with the ol' Buffalo king, and it's not uncommon for me to drop the blade and roll out a big stump that I get sick of bouncing over, either. The standard Buffalos have nearly as much power. We've never had any Caribou machines, there was an Elk in the fleet when I started, it had a reputation for being gutless. There were a few Wisent models around before I came to work here too, but they all got sent down the road as well. From what I gather about the Elk, it was kind of a toss up what was weaker- the engine, or the hydrostatic transmission. It really struggled on hills, to the point that guys would have to haul half loads. The local Ponsse guys even got authorization from the factory in Finland to bump the pressures up on the tranny, to help the poor thing out a bit. I did have to replace a valve on the Buffalo king when I got it because it didn't want to climb hills or push stumps. The Ponsse tech came out, we replaced some parts and reset some pressures, now I can have all the wood I can fit on and climb any hill I've came across (or spin out) I will say, the Buffalo king isn't a lot of fun in first entry pine thins though.
Do you guys (Corley and 1270) have blades on your Caribous? I just ask because I only pull trucks if absolutely necessary, 99% of the time I push them with the blade.
g man, that TD 7 looks like a nice machine ;)
We don't have it anymore, but the caribou had a blade. A small one.
Our Caribou has a small blade on it, good for pushing around loose dirt, no way your pushing much of a stump out. haha
I don't have a Caribou ;) ;D 8)
Sorry Corley ;)
We use our blades on our fabtek skidders everyday. Been doing CTL for 7 years now never had a dozer on the job yet.
That looks like a very clean and neat job, forwarders are the way to go if you can run them.
Sorting the cut hardwoods into their various product piles for hauling makes for good marketing of the different forest products, 8/15.
Some pine logs on a job I just started
Processing Northern Hardwoods with the 1270E john Deere, 8/15.
Quote from: Maine logger88 on September 14, 2015, 09:38:27 PM
Some pine logs on a job I just started
Hmmm at first I thought that was a Clark lurking in the shadows. :) What r u getting for pine logs down there logger88? Thinking about cutting some. B mostly 2 and 3s and pallet.
No it's my 540 I have used a Clark a few different lots tho! I've been averaging 315 ish after trucking Which isn't to bad
I've got a nice block to work on over the next few weeks. There is however nearly a km of road to build in order to access it. Time to beef up the excavator bucket so called in someone better on a welder than me. It's getting pretty thin so adding some wear bars and hard surfacing other areas. Notice the fully stocked service trailer I picked up a few weeks back. Great addition to my operation
That shop trailer will be real handy to have.
Having a portable shop trailer would be so handy, I just worry about getting ripped off or it burning. :o lately if things aren't glued down around here you would show up in the morning to an empty trailer. Is any of your road work subsidized or does the cost fall on you for 100% of it ?
Roadside Timber Harvest, 9/15.
This is a small property area along a gravel county road where the hardwood timber was selectively cut and skidded to the roadside where the truck loaded it up for transport to the mill. One truck load was about the total amount of the harvest.
Ron: whats 9/15 or 8/15 means?
Probably month and day... Sept. 15 for example.
Quote from: Ron Scott on September 21, 2015, 06:01:44 PM
Roadside Timber Harvest, 9/15.
This is a small property area along a gravel county road where the hardwood timber was selectively cut and skidded to the roadside where the truck loaded it up for transport to the mill. One truck load was about the total amount of the harvest.
Wow Ron - how did that work out? I mean it wouldn't seem one load would be worth moving equipment for? Was it mostly veneer?
That's the size job we looked for. 👍
ohhh I forgot it was in Michigan. One truck with 32 wheels. ;D
Late summer in southern new england 9/15 processing ash fire wood and sorting out logs.
87 132 franklin forwarder
81 timberjack 230 super E
91 f superduty
Brute splitter/convory
I have the twin to that F-Super Duty. Same year, color and all. Slow as the dickens but will pull anything.
That forwarder saves alot of work and your back in the FW piles, she looks good, and that 4.5 is the engine to have.
Teakwood,
Yes, 9/15 or 8/15 are just the month and year of the activity. I like to keep track of the activities by month and year so that I post current items, and yes a small road side timber harvest needs to have some veneer and very good quality timber to make it worthwhile for anyone to make a commercial harvest of it.
Thanks. I feel like a dumba.., i could a have figured that out by myself.
Nice pics
Laying down the Wood, 8/15.
Not sure if it really counts but here's my daily driver. Company I work for clears power line right aways. There's a mower that'll follow behind me chipping up everything that I trim down
Nice morning over the river.
We just finished a thinning on top of this hill. A bit thick, but there are some nice views through the trees. This overlooks an area that our company has been cutting in for 30+ years. (Lots longer than I've been cutting)
Quote from: SFires on October 09, 2015, 07:55:02 PM
Not sure if it really counts but here's my daily driver. Company I work for clears power line right aways. There's a mower that'll follow behind me chipping up everything that I trim down
Sure that will count.
Jaeraff ? Deutz diesel ? Hydrostatic drive ?
Just curious, if I am not mistaken it's powered only with a 80 Hp motor. I take it with all that weight it's not moving fast or probably doesn't have to.
What really interests me is the drive system. Is there a hydraulic motor on each differential , or is there just one on the transfer case ?
Btw , mowers count too. :)
Kershaw SkyTrim.
1270d, any trout in that river? Nice pics.
Most of the ground we harvest in north central MN is relatively flat or rolling, but occasionally we get into some decent hills.
It's always a challenge to get the pesrpective of hills in a picture, but this one got steeper the farther I went up, until I finally lost traction. I didn't have any tracks or chains on the machine at the time, which reduces traction some. Actually, I think chains all the way around, versus tracks, would give the most traction for hills.
Quote from: barbender on October 10, 2015, 09:40:21 AM
1270d, any trout in that river? Nice pics.
I think probably too close to the head waters of this particular river for trout. Might be but more than likely just chubs.
Also agree that chains provide better traction for hill climbing than tracks. CTL stuff doesn't climb that well, but you sure can go down a hill that most other machines won't.
I just saw a CL ad in WI for a Valmet rubber tire harvester that looked like it was converted to 4 D4 dozer undercarriages- I think that thing could go cut places that you could never get to to pick up. Unless of course, you had a forwarder set up the same ;D
A friend of mine just moved out to Oregon to set up a new Ponsse shop in Colberg. He said they are setting up some of the machines with an aftermarket drive integated winch system for really steep slopes. These machines are cutting slopes that previously were only accessible with cable logging systems. He told me he was riding on the bench seat in a harvester the other day, trying to troubleshoot something, while working a slope somewhere in the area of 35° (I don't remember what that would be in % of slope, 45° is 50% I think). Anyhow, he said it was no fun at all :)
45° is 100% slope
27° is near 50%
90° is infinite % ;D
that syncro winch system, or whatever its called is supposed to be 100+G's. the nicest softwood in the world out there sounds like, so i guess it must pay.
Firewood is decked in the pile on the right and noted with pink flagging ribbon to earmark it so that it is not removed by the trucker. This firewood deck will be about 20 full cords which is to be left as compensation to the private landowner who let us cross 1/2 mile of his property to get to the timber harvest area on other adjoining private lands to the south of his property. He also let us stage the landing/decking area on his property for pickup by the trucker. His only request was that we provide him with about 15-20 cords of firewood and be done prior to September 7th, Labor Day so as not to interfere with his upcoming hunting seasons on the property. We finished in plenty of time and all parties were satisfied with a a job well done, 9/20/15.
Did somebody say slope??
its a Kershaw skytrim I believe it 105 hp with a hydrostatic drive and noits not the fastest machine in the forest barely 13 mph in high gear but she'll slooooowwwwwlllllyyyyy crawl about anywhere I wanna go. tomorrow ill try to take a couple pics of some mowers. got a pic of a special mower id like to show but it wont load
Interesting machine, how high can it reach? How big can you trim with it?
its got a 60' boom that sits roughly 10' off the ground so all total 70' tomorrow ill get some pics of the boom stretched out. ill also try to get some with the cab layed over that's pretty neat to see too. its got a 24" blade but minus the gear box it only gives me a 10" cut ill try to get a couple pics of it too. tomorrow ill be back in my machine and not this new fangeled contraption that ive had to drive the past couple days
As you're right at it, can you take a picture or two of the hydraulic drive ? It almost looks like the whole unit is sitting on a stretched skidder frame with a transfercase.
Just wondering if the hydro motor is mounted right to the tc. :) Just curious.
no problem ill just go pic crazy if that's ok with you guys
thats what we like here, lots of pics of forestry equipment! there is no such thing as too much pictures! :D :D
OK first let me apologize I didn't get to take as many pics as I wanted. I had to babysit a new mower hand we hired and he thought it'd be a good ideal to mow up an oil pipe and then drop a power line on me. Great day. Lol
can you run/cut with the cab at a tilt
Yes sir I sure can. She'll run any way I set her. That how I can make some of the more awkward cuts I have to make sometimes. She'll even run down the highway that way as long as there's clearance for the boom. Hopefully tomorrow I'll be back with MY crew and not having to babysit this other crew. I miss MY machines :(
SFires
Really enjoy the pics of your machine.
Some words along with your pics will go a long way to making them even more interesting. ;)
Myrtle pulling some fifty footers.
Demo'd Barko's new 260W harvester with a Southstar QS500 head. Here's a short video of Barko's demo operator cutting a 20+ inch hard maple.
https://youtu.be/Mq5R4dI4HLs
Learned something nifty today. :laugh:
Quote from: mooseherderIf you take out the s from the https the video should show in your post instead of a link.
with the s: (https://youtu.be/Mq5R4dI4HLs)
without the s:
http://youtu.be/Mq5R4dI4HLs
Quote from: mooseherderI learned that tip from Furby. ;)
Thanks both. I've been trying to figure that one out for quite a while.
Behold...30hp of fury! She's got more guts than she has ballast. The bigger logs are at the limit with some brake steering needed to turn sometimes due to front end loft. 1/4 mile + skids to my firewood yard (thankfully, mostly downhill)
https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/34187/IMAG0270.jpg
https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/34187/IMG_20140927_124419700.jpg
https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/34187/IMG_20151004_153031340.
https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/34187/IMG_20141018_133041925.jpg
Made a quick video this morning processing some hard maple. Sorting pulp, bolts and saw logs. http://youtu.be/TYc9Axm32jg
Removing the "s" works like a charm, thanks for the tip.
Seven fifties, two forties.
Wow, nice load! Is it white pine?
Nice wood!
So, I needed some type of brush attachment and I don't have the money for a grapple, a third function valve, or even a good set of debris forks...so I bought a 2nd set of used fork lift blades.
The "on/off" opening at the bottom-front of the Titan carriage was too wide for the blades to keep in the inner-most or center location, so I welded some 1/4" flat stock on both sides of the opening to provide keeper support for both blades. I also welded a snatched hook on the inside-center of the carriage since I had the welder out....and the Titan warranty recently expired ;D
The only draw-backs I can see are the width of the blades and the loss of @ 115 pounds of the available 970 LB factory lifting capacity.
Will try them out on slash piles this week end
Quote from: brendonv on October 27, 2015, 07:01:58 PM
Nice wood!
Yeah, it's pretty good stuff. Hard to find.
Straightgrain,I betcha that will work pretty good. Too bad you could not get one "finger" hooked up to hyds. That would keep the brush in place on rough land.
Quote from: Straightgrain on October 27, 2015, 07:06:48 PM
The only draw-backs I can see are the width of the blades and the loss of @ 115 pounds of the available 970 LB factory lifting capacity.
Will try them out on slash piles this week end
Nice work. That will be way better than doing it by hand. You will never see the lose of lift capacity with brush I don't think. But then again it is western brush so it is probably big ;D
Sometimes I move brush/slash with my winch. I lay out a long chain/choker and pile the slash on it. A huge pile. Bring the choker up over the top and winch it up to the tractor. Drag it off to the burn or debris area where I can push it around with the bucket. Still a lot of hand work and you loose some on the drag.
gg
Quote from: thecfarm on October 27, 2015, 07:23:13 PM
Straightgrain,I betcha that will work pretty good. Too bad you could not get one "finger" hooked up to hyds. That would keep the brush in place on rough land.
Thanks for the evals; scooting large heap of slash to the treatment areas is the best I can do, without that 3rd function.
If "things...." settle-down in 2017, I'll go off the deep-end and get a 3rd function valve and a grapple.
Dave,
Are those fifty and forty foot white pine going into poles or cabin logs?
Ron, they are being cut into 10" x10" and 12" x12". They are for a barn we are building at work. We got three cut this morning before it started to pour. About an hour each with two of us working.
It's good that you had a project already planned for their use. Continue the pictures of their use in the barn construction.
That mill seems to be getting longer every time I see it. :)
It's probably done growing. For now. :D
Quote from: Dave Shepard on October 28, 2015, 01:36:18 PM
Ron, they are being cut into 10" x10" and 12" x12". They are for a barn we are building at work. We got three cut this morning before it started to pour. About an hour each with two of us working.
Nice looking beam.....beautiful actually.
Brush mower chipping up some brush
lets move this one back up
Thanks for the interest!
Another thread got started and I see postings in that one about what are you currectly cutting. This thread is a great one,because it's all in one long thread. A nice way to see how others get the wood out in other states. Love those MI trucks!!!!
Nice to see this back for 2016, I always enjoyed this thread or what ever the technical name is.. 😊
This is a short video of our stuff. I'm in the loader and it's throttled down some.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HL0FCQ7QcGQ
wish my landing was frozen like that ;D
That's 2 years ago. We haven't worked in 3 weeks, JR messed up his back working as a carpenter while the 540 he runs was broken down. He has been out of work for almost 2 weeks.
that stinks hope he starts felling better I know all about back trouble they want to do another surgery on me and I wont do it till I cant move anymore
79 international s8a
Using a small tractor and winch to remove the fir from around some larger white pine.
gg
So the large pine stays, or you're just making room to drop her ?
What is it going to be used for ?
The good pine stays. The worst junk I cut which I am lucky to get a log out of. The rest goes to the neighbor OWB or lays and rots.
The fir goes to a saw mill 7 miles away for spruce/fir lumber. Here is an old picture of a typical load.
Most has stump rot which is another reason I am cutting it.
gg
I like large pine. ;D
Here are two pictures from the Ponsse 2016 calendar. Both pictures are from Europe and I think the first is from Italy. Not a place for timid drivers.
a cliff hanger electricuted-smiley electricuted-smiley
Not for the timid for sure and some experience required, ;)
from the cab in the same location. The buncher almost took a little ride over the edge in a different spot, quite a bit lower down. Something about steel tracks and rock not providing much traction...
Yowzer! :o .
Putting a lot of faith into a piece of machinery.
And the operators have a few hours under their belt. ;)
Figured I would post a couple pictures to this thread to keep it alive.
Got her fired up today, never used a stroke delimber before but I've got a fair amount of hemlock to cut. Im a sucker for the older iron that still keeps working and was paid for when it got off the trailer. :D
That delimber would look really nice with a new coat of paint. Neat and handy machine! Work safe!
will it limb hemlock??
New job and waiting for the loader to get towed over, makes it so much easier than this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=up1S38r3NwU&feature=youtu.be
Put some new delimbing knives on the harvester Saturday afternoon. The new ones are longer with a different curve, should be better for picking from the ground.
how expensive are they are they easy to install
Not sure on the price but they are relatively easy to install. One short pin for each knife and then the cylinder.
My 208.
You guys are going to laugh, but right now I use a simple Kubota, but hope to upgrade soon to a small bulldozer.
I must have pictures of mine 40hp in this thread somewheres. My Father and me hauled out ALOT of white pine well over 3 feet across with that poor tractor. No pictures of that operation. I was always going to take pictures,but never did. ::) That was before I hit the digital age too.
You will be surprised how many log like that on here.
Well you would be surprised how many #3 white pine logs go through our Thomas Bandsaw mill. We tell the truck driver, if they scale at #3's; haul them back and we'll make boards out of them ourselves!!
We have used everything here, from horses to feller-bunchers, but over all have just used tractor the most. On a short twitch and good ground I can get out 12 cord in two days and burn 7 gallons of diesel doing so. That is not bad. However, there are locations on my land that have yet to see a chainsaw only because I can't get back that far/in the wet areas with my little tractor too. I hope to change that with a dozer.
Here is one such area. Do you think it needs a wee bit of thinning? :D
Yes,I have some areas that still look like that. I have had my land logged 3 times so far. Hard to keep up with the trees with one chainsaw and one tractor. As you well know.
I have a OWB and I burn ALOT of dead wood in that. But still there is no way to keep up with what is dieing and what needs to be cut.
For me it is going around the edges of the fields. It seems like by the time I get aound them all, it is time to go back. When I took over the farm in 2008, some of the fields had 50 feet of space from the rock wall to the first row of corn. One field I have is exactly 1 mile in circumference around it. Do the math on that and you come up with 7 acres I was losing! That is a lot.
The USDA gave me grief, says it is wildlife habitat, but Mylanta, I think they got plenty of places to perch besides 7 acres of prime farmland. My Forefathers worked hard with axe, oxen and matches to make this a field, the least I can do is try and keep it cut back to the rock walls they built!
One thing I do too is go around and bat down the upper branches with an excavator. All it takes is one long limb jutting out into the fields and the boys, as they roll along with tractors now encased in glass, to swerve out around it, and soon you have sapling encroachment again!
I have fields too,but not that big. It's a never ending job. I need to trim around them this year. I only did enough last year to get the mower through the limbs. Than its the boundary lines that need to be kept clean. I won't even mention the rocks I dig out of the field. Than I am claiming back an old pasture. Rough and rocks are the keywords with that project. I am trying to cut some trees so I can see into the field as I come up the road. I bought back 7 acres of the farm and cut off the corner of that grown up field so I could see the corner of the field and keep track of the deer down there. But I enjoy it all. Wish I could just retire early and work here every day.
Oh I know the feeling!
I work 80 miles away at BIW and absolutely HATE it. We have 1600 people applying for 9 jobs and I want OUT. Sure wish I could make it farming and logging, but it is so hard to give up that weekly paycheck which is really a security blanket.
I have cleared back some land myself; 12 acres so far with another 20 planned. It is a little easier for me probably because I can justify it with sheep. It is more work because they require a little work every day, rather than a lot of work on a single day like logging, but when ten of them grow to full size in 5 months instead of taking 35 years or more to grow to marketable size, the cost per acre is a lot better.
I'll never cut all my wood off for Agriculture, just some places that make better sense too. Here the Amish are really driving up the value of tillable land. In 1992 we planted fields into trees because no one wanted to farm them and paper mills were going gang busters. Now it has swung the opposite way. No paper mills left and everyone wants fields. That is a long way of saying, you can't rent fields anymore so a lot of farmers like me are clearing land.
I don't think I have the appropriate equipment for the end of this job. Should have bought a buncher and chipper. Can't really complain though as the remainder of the winters job was pretty good. Finished cutting this morning and the forwarder finished this afternoon. Time to idle for a few weeks.
Add a couple pictures from the last week.
Starting to get a pile.
Lots of ugly hw. Maybe 5% makes a log, it was high-grade 25yrs ago and it shows.
There's that fuel carrier I had talked about, it's all lagged down and fixed now, that was the trial run so it was just strapped in. Works great so I'm not fighting to get fuel to my loader. Got the big hand pump, not pleasant to pump so it discourages theft.
Barge at least if you get the skidder started at -20 the fuel in the tank should be nice and warm from the fan for the other toys
Lots of nice iron and great jobs! Thanks for posting and work safe!
Ditto! Well done!
Coxy- had never thought about that but I bet it would warm up fuel, she does move alot of air, at least get something out of the 40-55gal of fuel she drinks every day.
1 jack helping another jack. :D. I caught a stick in the center and it didn't end well. 1 of the cab jack hoses was bad, so lifted the cab and replaced 4 hoses yesterday.
Had a guy on FB tell me that "you can't get any wood" with a grapple skidder. Yes sometimes cable is the only way to go, but working behind a buncher you will curse all day long with cable getting bunches. I tried to buy a semi-clean 640D with a 400 winch last week but the guy won't haggle at all. :D
Head back to the boat next week, I doubt this arrives before I leave. 1600hrs, leslie equipment guarding package, she is fast.
Haven't been on much, get home and crash. Trying to pound out this woodlot, only about 30% done so far.
Nice shots barge! That's a serious hitch on there!
Snapped this photo yesterday hard to tell but 600 ft and a pulp twig all the old girl wanted.
Another good one for the clark 664
About a truck and a half there yesterday, shipped one load out today. One of these days Ill get a photo or video of the walking deck trailers these logs go out on.
those walking floor trailers are neat the only thing they are a pita to load with the bars going a crossed the top and have to load from the back we did 3 one day the one old guy showed us how to do it (the last guy ) the other 2 all they did was complain how we were doing it that was the first time I ever saw them trailers and how they worked
A chipping operation set up on the same road we are still trucking out of. Had to wait a bit for them to finish loading today before I could get by. A Tigercat 845 buncher, a couple of 748 Deere skidders and a Morbark flail chipper on this job. This outfit does not take long to cut a block.
Scenes from spring breakup
Load ready to go, that's probably around 18 cords of black spruce-
And today, starting a really nice pine thinning on sandy ground. Over half of what is cut is going for poles, it takes a very nice stand of wood for that
Quote from: barbender on March 23, 2016, 09:11:01 PM
And today, starting a really nice pine thinning on sandy ground. Over half of what is cut is going for poles, it takes a very nice stand of wood for that
Holy! Is this state or federal ground?
Clark
This is a state sale, right next door to the state nursery/research station at Bedoura so it has recieved a fair amount of grooming I think ;) This area has lots of well managed plantations, red, white and jack pine of varying age classes. It looks kind of like a pine garden :D
Those poles are straight, I was using the panoramic function on my camera and it makes them look crooked :)
You guys put up nice piles of wood. :D.
A change in scale. A little TSI job did last season. I put a tractor road in last July
Cut the fir and some firewood late December
This is what it looked like last week
gg
Everybody does things different as long as we make $ most the time
Quote from: killamplanes on March 24, 2016, 12:47:51 PM
Everybody does things different as long as we make $ most the time
Isn't that the truth! I love seeing all the different ways we go about getting the wood out.
G man, I love doing the type of work that you are. I wish I could be out with a saw in my hands more- I did get to drop 3 :o ;D trees today, I love felling timber. If I could make a living around here doing small scale harvests with a focus on TSI, I'd be all over it.
View down a strip
Poles and bolts on the landing
on the poles how many limbs are you guys allowed on the bud whorl all of the red pine around here has 5 limbs and they wont buy it I cleared about 2a of red pine for a house site some of the r pine was 20in dbh and straight as an arrow shame to let it rot away the 2 soft wood mills are packed solid
g-man: nice lot, nice load! Have been doing the same--just fun being out in the woods at this time of year without 3' of snow to wade through. This Winter sure has been different. All the best, Rob.
Every time I get on a pole job, I start thinking about this video- https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fi7Fl76EyxI
This is a very efficient forwarder operator- in Europe, I think they are very methodical compared to us in North America. They actually put operators through schooling before they ever get in a machine. My boss, I had only talked to him on the phone, he told me where the job was and where to find the keys on the machine :) At any rate, I'm wondering if any of you other CTL operations handle poles much, and have any of you made an attachment like this operator has on his back bunk for skidding poles? I'll probably weld something up today, but I'm curious how others deal with poles with a forwarder. I'll just say, the way we do it works great until you have to turn :)
Coxy, the pole buyer pre-marks the poles on the sale, with the length written on them. So we don't sort them ourselves, although I did quiz the pole cruiser as to what he's looking for. Mainly, the straightness, minimum diameter, branch whorls aren't an issue except for diagonal knots.
I have never cut poles. That does look like a pretty simple and effective way to forward them out. Looks like it allows another pivot point for turning. Seems like there could only be one row on that rack or the next ones would slide off. How many can you carry at a time barbender, three or four? This guy looks like he could get eight or ten on.
1270, if the landing is set up so I don't have to turn, I can put on 10 on that are size that are on this job (32', 37', and 42'). I guess I could fit mor, but I try not to push it as it puts all the weight on the back bunk, not to mention the strain put on the machine if you have to turn. If we get into big ones I might only skid 4. It all depends on how much turning I have to do. When I have long ones (47, 52,57, and 62' I don't think I've gotten into any longer) and turns, I sometimes just fill the "basement" with pulp or bolts, just so the poles can pivot and not bind up in the bottom of the bunks. This is one of those situations where the mechanic and I keep talking about slapping one of these together, but then I get the job done and we forget about it until the next pole job comes up, 6 months later ::) On this job however, I am having a heck of a time because the strips are laid out perpindicular to the woods road, and it is so tight I can't make the corner without poles on. I have to come out, stop and back up. So it is starting to get very tedious, and even the skidding plate won't completely solve my dilemma.
Last winter I cut some 40' aspen poles for a guys timber frame house. Forwarding them out was a real treat, basically we did did like you are talking filling the bottom of the bunk with some pulp and then putting the poles on top of them off the back. Trouble was it was winter time and we had some terrain to contend with so it seems like the forwarder guy was forever readjusting them or loosing them off the back.
Boss joked if we got into a job where we had to do that often he would go buy a cheap grapple skidder to move them around.
If we have a really big job with poles, we will have a grapple skidder on the job. This is just a 400 cord sale, and it's a long ways from our shop. So I'm forwarding them. I actually like skidding poles, it's just this landing is not set up for them at all.
how far is a long way from the shop ;D
The old method. :) Thinning hardwood and feeding the deer on some high ground.
Is the black spruce cut into 2bys at a mill?
There is no market here for small spruce or fir at this time. No spruce fir pulp market. Just sawlog and studwood. Some take whole tree but it has to be good stuff.
Quote from: coxy on March 26, 2016, 09:55:45 PM
how far is a long way from the shop ;D
About 100 miles ;)
Quote from: Peter Drouin on March 28, 2016, 06:25:25 PM
Is the black spruce cut into 2bys at a mill?
Peter, I didn't know if you were asking me or Chester, but the Potlatch stud mill will happily take black spruce stud bolts down to 5 1/2". Sometimes we sort them, sometimes not. It depends on how full UPM is on wood, but usually when we are in black spruce (winter) UPM is trying to get ahold of all the spruce they can. BTW, ine of Potlatch's foresters told me if they could run their mill on just spruce, they would love it. It goes through the mill faster and is cheaper to dry. However, probably 75% of their volume is red pine, with the remainder made up of jack pine, spruce, balsam, and white pine.
My apologies sir.
Quote from: chester_tree _farmah on March 28, 2016, 10:07:04 PM
My apologies sir.
No apologies needed, he might have been asking you!
My apologies, I should have asked in a better way. My ? was out there asking all who knew.
I like to see / hear what's out there. I'm always looking for markets for wood.
Older pic from a job with some nice aspen a few years ago. Ponsse S10 Caribou loading.
Nice piles, looks like a forwarder load or more in each one!
Again, some great timber harvesting photos.
I didn't think the newer eq broke down :) :) :)
Sorry, Ken $$$ >:( I finally finished my spring breakup pole sale, my landings turned into a real mess. Although this is sandy ground, the frost coming out has the ground saturated. In addition, we got a fair amount of rain one night. The one day, 4 trucks got sent out for poles. It was fortunate I was still on the job, because the first truck was stuck (with the big front mount loader and all the bunks on his trailer, he said he weighs 45,000 :o). Typically I am already gone when the pole haulers show up, so they were lucky this time. They come from over 200 miles away, and they wouldn't have been able to get loaded. As it was, we got them set up in a wide spot, and I would skid the poles out to the loader truck. Then a bunk would back in, he would load those poles on. Then they would move ahead so I could skid more. Kind of a cluster ut we got them all loaded and on their way.
The loader truck put a load on at the landing, and then I pulled him out. You will notice the chain attached to his front end ;D
When a landing turns to slop, I do my best to dress it up when I get done. It's a challenge with the tiny blade on the forwarder. It always feels good to get a job finished, but a muddy job always looks best in the rear view mirror ;)
Is that Red Pine barbender?
Yes it is, Peter. That is the only species that they take for poles (from our area). I think the max length we get around here would be around 75', so for longer poles they get Red cedar from the west coast.
Quote from: coxy on April 01, 2016, 06:58:13 AM
I didn't think the newer eq broke down :) :) :)
Coxy That old forwarder has over 38000 hours on it so it deserves a bit of work now and then.
Barbender I would love to get an opportunity to work in a red pine stand like that. Very few stands of red pine in this part of the world.
A couple pics from last winter.
Togetherness ;D
Removing cylinder from Franklin with Tree Farmer :) It's good to have an extra machine
Ready for re install.
Partial load of hardwood pulp from last winter.
Quote from: barbender on April 01, 2016, 11:52:27 AM
Sorry, Ken $$$ >:( I finally finished my spring breakup pole sale, my landings turned into a real mess. Although this is sandy ground, the frost coming out has the ground saturated. In addition, we got a fair amount of rain one night. The one day, 4 trucks got sent out for poles. It was fortunate I was still on the job, because the first truck was stuck (with the big front mount loader and all the bunks on his trailer, he said he weighs 45,000 :o). Typically I am already gone when the pole haulers show up, so they were lucky this time. They come from over 200 miles away, and they wouldn't have been able to get loaded. As it was, we got them set up in a wide spot, and I would skid the poles out to the loader truck. Then a bunk would back in, he would load those poles on. Then they would move ahead so I could skid more. Kind of a cluster ut we got them all loaded and on their way.
The loader truck put a load on at the landing, and then I pulled him out. You will notice the chain attached to his front end ;D
When a landing turns to slop, I do my best to dress it up when I get done. It's a challenge with the tiny blade on the forwarder. It always feels good to get a job finished, but a muddy job always looks best in the rear view mirror ;)
Hi Barbender,
Quick kudos and thumbs up and smiley faces and all that internets stuff to you.
I've spent a lifetime in the forest sector and am spending my semi-retirement advising the national and provincial wood sector here in Canada. Now all that and a couple of bucks will buy you a cup of coffee, but the reason is to let you know that from what I've seen of your work and ethics, you're a great example of how to do it right. Great job all around!!!!
Barbender has been to best logging practice class .
Gee, thanks guys! I just try to do it the way I would want it if it was my property, and leave things so the boss doesn't have to haul out a dozer to fix a mess I left etc. Ken, you would have loved processing this Red pine. It probably had the best form of any I have worked in. I think it was around 400 cords total, and only about 80 was bolts and pulp. The rest made poles. It seems like usually those numbers are flip flopped ;)
I'm always impressed with the CTL pictures you guys post. Everything always looks clean and efficient.
How about some pics of your C4D forwarder Corly? :)
Nice Tree Farmer. Looks about the same color I painted my stuff. ::)
Corley, with those single bunk machines, do you have to set the blade down for stability when running the crane?
Thank you sir. Very nice machine!
She's tippy loading and unloading without the blade down ;) ;D It's got a pretty high center of gravity. The 132 Franklin is much more stable.
Very nice looking machine, those CTL jobs always look good. Forwarder is beyond handy sometimes.
Nice machines Corley! Yeah the Franklin roof mounts are great machines. My headache rack is a touch taller. Takes some gettin used to loading and unloading. Especially big logs.
Nice! Does anyone run duels on these forwarders( for stability)?
New machine showed up today. Ponsse ergo, 8 wheel, H8 head. Now I gotta learn how to run the dang thing.
sure is purty! Have to change name to gottaergo now.
Is that the C44+ boom? Don't see too many of that style, most have the C5 sliding style. That H8 is a monster of a head, not as fast as a H7 but has lots of power. Would love to be running that.
Did you stay with the Ergo to get that H8 head? Or was it too long a wait for a Scorpion?
I know another guy that wanted a H8 head on a Scorpion and Ponsse said no.
Quote from: timberlinetree on April 03, 2016, 06:15:15 AM
Nice! Does anyone run duels on these forwarders( for stability)?
On my 6 wheel machines, I mostly run tracks on the bogeys year around for both flotation and weight (stability). Other guys that don't run tracks sometimes use fluid in the bogey tires for stability but that can cause some rutting and compaction.
It also depends on the size of the bogey tires on the 6 wheelers. Some guys run 600's for bogeys for better navigation between the rows in pine stands. The guys that run the narrower tires are more likely to use fluid in the tires. I run 700's and tracks but lately have been running without tracks on the forwarder because I've had to run down some county roads sometimes.
Quote from: Gary_C on April 08, 2016, 01:40:19 AM
I know another guy that wanted a H8 head on a Scorpion and Ponsse said no.
Yeah only the H7 head on the Scorpion King. As the salesman told me the Scorpion is really just to lure the John Deere 1270 guys over to Ponsse as the rotating cab/boom is the style they are used to and were asking for. The Ergo is still the workhorse of the fleet.
Yeah we wanted the H8 head, because we cut a lot of hardwood. We went with the c44+ Because it's the only crane that will work with the ergo-h8 combo. That head is pretty dang fast as well as powerful.
wannaergo,that will move some wood. I see you got some new snow.
Nice, If you have time can you get a closer pic of the head?
My c50 scorpion boom is the same as the c44+ with the exception of the over the cab wishbone (I think). I'm hoping after a few years of production the boom proves out enough to order the h8/scorpion combo.
We just got a new Ergo 8 wheel, with an H7. It's still sitting in the Ponsse yard, it's too wet to get in the woods ::)
JP Skidmore CF-22 installed on a Timberpro TN 725C for Jacobs Logging in Antigo, WI
Didn't barko have some kind of rights to that head?
Quote from: wannaergo on April 16, 2016, 08:05:32 PM
Didn't barko have some kind of rights to that head?
That was the CF-18.
Oh gotcha. If I was to run another fixed head, I would absolutely go with the cf-22. Looks like a great head. I was talking to the barko salesman, and if it's as fast in the woods as it is on paper, it's pretty impressive. I just don't have any interest in going back to fixed.
How are you liking that H8 dangle head, wannergo?
CF/22 WoW. That's nice. 8) 8)
Quote from: barbender on April 16, 2016, 10:32:13 PM
How are you liking that H8 dangle head, wannergo?
We got shut down a few days after it showed up, so I only have maybe 15-20 hours on it, but I sure enjoyed them. The head is super fast, powerful, and the machine is smooth. I'm getting a little bit antsy sitting at home and not cutting wood. Hopefully be back to work in a week. Good thing we haven't paid for it yet. :D
I see some deeres are getting skidmores also.
I just looked again to be sure. Ones on YouTube with a cf-20. It's a 4 roller much like the fabtec style
New TL725. Should be working within a week.
Is that a bar saw head, 1270? Do you guys bunch all of your wood?
Yes sir, 32 inch barsaw. Pretty much all the wood is bunched anymore. I still cut soft ground and miscellaneous other stuff with the harvester, but pretty much all chasing the buncher.
First day back cutting
https://youtu.be/Tfc6sWjRBZ4
What is the advantage of the barsaw head, vs. a hot saw? More control? Just curious. One of our contract guys just picked up an older buncher and is trying that method out. Other than that, we have a few state Red pine final felling clearcuts where it is specified in the contract "full tree skidding only". It basically wipes out all the underbrush and opens up the soil. The state figures they are getting their site prep for replanting for free, and I can't argue with them. Some of those will be bunched, pulled in with a skidder to the landing, and processed by a CTL harvester. Other than that, we pretty much just fall with the harvesters.
Very nice video! I would love to have that clear view in a Scorpion but then I think of all the wood that needs to be cut to pay for one and just keep on with my Ergo.
In that 12 minute video I believe that I couldnt have hand felled and bucked those in an 8 hour day and u might have used 5 gallons od 2 dollar fuel :D
Quote from: killamplanes on April 20, 2016, 11:25:28 PM
...and u might have used 5 gallons od 2 dollar fuel :D
Not sure on the Scorpion, but the Ergo I run uses 2~4 gallons per hour. So in that 12 minutes he probably used around 1/2 gallon of fuel.
Quote from: barbender on April 20, 2016, 10:48:37 PM
What is the advantage of the barsaw head, vs. a hot saw? More control? Just curious. One of our contract guys just picked up an older buncher and is trying that method out. Other than that, we have a few state Red pine final felling clearcuts where it is specified in the contract "full tree skidding only". It basically wipes out all the underbrush and opens up the soil. The state figures they are getting their site prep for replanting for free, and I can't argue with them. Some of those will be bunched, pulled in with a skidder to the landing, and processed by a CTL harvester. Other than that, we pretty much just fall with the harvesters.
Often we work in Rocky rough ground and he will prep the skid trails to speed up the forwarders. Digging and pulling stumps etc. Also one cut for bigger trees. Using the head to lift up the machine to turn. Other contractors have harvesters fall the wood that the hot saw can't efficiently get to, we can get it all with this machine. Except swamps...
The new machine is plumbed for a hot saw or bar saw. If it seems like a big advantage down the road we can swap.
Great video !! Thanks for posting. I love seeing how it is done. Makes my tractor and winch look silly though .....
gg
That one stick looked a little long. ..
Love the pictures and videos. Thanks for posting Those TimberPros look awesome but they have not made an impact around here. I would also love to operate a Scorpion. The extra window room must be nice.
I have no experience operating the Timberpros. But I do know one thing about them- when they punch through soft ground, it ain't just a little :o There's been more than one around here working frozen swamps that went down so far the top of the cab was below ground height ::) I got to forward a job where the Timberpro had drove out in the swamp, sunk about 2 feet, and backed right out and called us to come cut it with CTL equipment. I skidded the whole job right past his ruts, until I finally fell through on my last load :D That's the worst I've ever fell through, I actually had to throw my load off to get out.
1270, what would you rate as the more beneficial aspect of the Scorpion harvester- the visibility, or the self leveling?
Quote from: barbender on April 21, 2016, 10:12:01 PM
1270, what would you rate as the more beneficial aspect of the Scorpion harvester- the visibility, or the self leveling?
I would say the visibility. The leveling and active suspension is great, but you couldn't utilize it fully without the visibility. It's a well designed package.
A forwarder operator's favorite time of year, when the aspen bark is slipping.
Yep bark really started slipping today. Easier to find the eab trees that way. Not that it matters anymore other than justifying our actions.
Aspen and Basswood bark are terrible not only for the forwarder man but the processor guy and the trucker. Sometimes it wants to wad up under the measuring wheel on the processor throwing your lengths off and the forwarder and trucker have to mix a little dirt in to keep the logs from sliding all over the place.
But at least your working. We are still waiting on restrictions to go off so we can get back to work.
A nice sunrise with our new Timberpro
1270d,you have a great day
I always dreamed about being in the woods when the sun rises. Sometimes still do. :)
Nice pictures.
Not cutting much great. Few 1-2 log pasture oaks and fw.
When the going get tough, you start pulling cable. :D skid is so long from the back its worth while.
A "little" pond we have been doing just up the road.
Finally got my free antique squared away, move
it about 3 miles down the road when I get home. Working alone and this should speed things up.
The bank asked if I had some wood ahead. They kick and scream to finance forestry equipment but did the rough math on almost 800 cord stacked right now ahead.
Good times ;)
Assuming you mean the slippery bark you're almost sounding a women , good means bad or no means yes and so on. ;D
Or did you bend some thing ? :)
Running machinery and dealing with women are just the same....
when you hear something grinding, just smile and nod. And then fix it fast.
740 Timberjack Feller Buncher used on a salvage job of white ash infected with the emerald ash bore. This area of northern hardwoods was selectively harvested about 12 years ago before the white ash infestation, but the small white ash logs and pole size ash trees that became infected with the emerald ash bore are now being removed. Spring 2016.
The guys from Timberpro stopped by our job to take some film of our buncher. Here it is!
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=jHZgawrlKU8
neat video do you have much trouble jumping the tracks
Every manufacturer has jumped on the drone videos, love seeing that machine work. Why did you guys go barsaw in smaller stuff ? Got to ask, 4/5 of the bunchers around here are barsaw but it's because of stuff 24" up. New timberpro is 480-525???
Cool video; thanks!
Machine and technique.
What are some of the reasons to harvest trees of that size & that scope (clear cutting)?
Will that area be replanted with a different (more profitable) species?
A parking lot?
Is that simply the size needed?
Thanks again.
Quote from: coxy on May 20, 2016, 07:23:05 AM
neat video do you have much trouble jumping the tracks
Only when the UC gets pretty worn.
Quote from: BargeMonkey on May 20, 2016, 07:42:14 AM
Every manufacturer has jumped on the drone videos, love seeing that machine work. Why did you guys go barsaw in smaller stuff ? Got to ask, 4/5 of the bunchers around here are barsaw but it's because of stuff 24" up. New timberpro is 480-525???
This particular job is real small wood, not typical. Usually we work in decent sized hardwood on rocky hilly terrain. The head gets used a lot for uprooting trees and moving dirt to make better skid trails. We may buy a disc saw head too if these type stands become more common.
You pretty much take whatever job you can get during breakup
Quote from: Straightgrain on May 20, 2016, 10:09:01 AM
Cool video; thanks!
Machine and technique.
What are some of the reasons to harvest trees of that size & that scope (clear cutting)?
Will that area be replanted with a different (more profitable) species?
A parking lot?
Is that simply the size needed?
Thanks again.
This is 50-60 yr old aspen with balsam fir mixed in. The aspen is not growing well and is poor quality so it is going.
Aspen stands are usually managed by clear cutting and it will regenerate quickly from the existing root system..
Quote from: 1270d on May 20, 2016, 07:24:31 PM
Quote from: Straightgrain on May 20, 2016, 10:09:01 AM
Cool video; thanks!
Machine and technique.
What are some of the reasons to harvest trees of that size & that scope (clear cutting)?
Will that area be replanted with a different (more profitable) species?
A parking lot?
Is that simply the size needed?
Thanks again.
This is 50-60 yr old aspen with balsam fir mixed in. The aspen is not growing well and is poor quality so it is going.
Aspen stands are usually managed by clear cutting and it will regenerate quickly from the existing root system..
Thanks, I'm in awe of that machine and the way it is being utilized.
Nice video, 1270 ;) I can see where being able to dump stumps would be a huge advantage for forwarding. I was bouncing over some big hardwood stumps on a sidehill today, thinking "I wish a barsaw buncher would've gotten rid of those for me" ;D I end up getting frustrated and pushing them out with the forwarder blade sometimes.
I have a friend jumping into the mechanical game right now, trying to show him the light on a disc saw for cutting bigger HW behind a cable skidder. :D A barsaw head is slower, but you can do so much more, I routinely cut a road, yank stumps and move a few rocks that would require a dozer with the head. The timberpro's are so nice. Another semi local guy I know bought a new 725B, 300hp and longer track is nice. I think the tigercat barsaw with the lowen wrist is the barsaw head to have. :D.
Quote from: 1270d on May 20, 2016, 05:49:38 AM
The guys from Timberpro stopped by our job to take some film of our buncher.
Don't think I've seen a buncher with a barsaw around here. A disc would sure make short work of that poplar and fir.
How's the Ergo handling that big head, now that you have some time in it? One of our guys just went from a Bear (early model, I think it was the first one in North America) to a new Ergo 8w with an H7 head. He said the Ergo actually has more power. The Bear had seen a LOT of wood though ;D I think Ponsse is going to totally refurbish that machine-new head, crane, pumps.
It throws it around great! I wouldn't mind a little more boom power for horsing around big wood, but for the most part I'm thrilled with it. I found out today that it actually has h7 feed motors in it. It's super fast, and the power is impressive. That head builds up momentum right quick.
Doesn't like the big hardwood but any of the smaller stuff it chews it right up. Having trouble loading pictures, I'm cutting 2 jobs right now, on another small private road mowing down hemlock on certain days. Trying to get done on this one, about 1/2 done now.
Hey, that looks like a pretty big landing...er, header, for you ;)
Quote from: BargeMonkey on June 05, 2016, 12:15:37 AM
Doesn't like the big hardwood but any of the smaller stuff it chews it right up. Having trouble loading pictures, I'm cutting 2 jobs right now, on another small private road mowing down hemlock on certain days. Trying to get done on this one, about 1/2 done now.
Your OPTEMPO is amazing; driving a barge, logging on two jobs. Much to be respected about hard working people.
Quote from: Straightgrain on June 05, 2016, 10:43:59 AM
Quote from: BargeMonkey on June 05, 2016, 12:15:37 AM
Doesn't like the big hardwood but any of the smaller stuff it chews it right up. Having trouble loading pictures, I'm cutting 2 jobs right now, on another small private road mowing down hemlock on certain days. Trying to get done on this one, about 1/2 done now.
Your OPTEMPO is amazing; driving a barge, logging on two jobs. Much to be respected about hard working people.
Its called "indentured servitude". :D :D :D. I should be home drinking beer and chasing woman the 2-4wks im off the boat, instead I just got in from 13hrs in the woods. But I enjoy it. Finally got some newer pics to load.
"Barbender", there was a "small" clearing there when I started, kind of hard to stack 800-1000 cord in one little spot. ;D
That's yesterday afternoon. Behind the delimber is another wall from today. Kind of looks like the same picture over and over, there is 12X stacks running along the big stack now. People come up and have never seen that much wood in 1 spot before.
I need another grapple skidder, can't feed the limber fast enough.
TSI work. It pays so I don't care. Cutting some hemlock down in the hole. I've got 150Kft of monster oak to cut right next door, whatever to keep them happy.
We have 8 fulltime guys right now. My other home, wrenching on screens and greasing and fueling equipment. Gravel/stone/material is big business down here. Anyway back to the grind tomorrow.
You're one busy person! ;) Great wood production.
A little downhill work today in the Scorpion. These won't climb like a tracked machine, but they can go down hills that make your stomach flip.
Looks familiar :D. Today was going down a hill and I just about had my feet on the dash to stay in the seat.
Never a good day when this happens... >:(
We all get those days, it's just part of the game. :D
Do those boogies float ? Or can you apply pressure to the one side and limb out of the woods ?
They float. That tire has had a bad bad sidewall for 2 years it was just a matter of time until it blew. I swung the boom off to the side and took some weight off it and drove it out. Then swung the boom farther over and unlocked the frame to get the tire up off the ground. Off was easy we will see about getting it back on tomorrow.
Yep, a flat tire is kind of a "groan" event :(
wonder how they would be foam filled :-\
I'd imagine the ride would be rougher than heck. They are filled with calcium chloride but that still allows them to flex over rocks, stumps, logs, etc.
Who does your tire service? All of my tires are dry, but I've heard a lot of ponsse guys run the juice for extra stability. We also almost always have Pomps come change them in the woods.
We sorta do our own tire service. I took it off and took it to Whitetail tire down in Ewen, and had a new used tire mounted up. Came back and tossed it on and away we went this afternoon. The loaded tires make a huge difference in stability when reaching off to the sides.
Have never worked far enough west to deal with whitetail. R&r in lanse a time or two. The scorpion has the active stabilization and is rock steady. I'd be afraid it would be a lead balloon in swamps if the rubber was loaded.
This old girl doesn't have any fancy pants active stabilization :D, just the oscillation joint frame lock. But on hills reaching out to the sides with the frame locked the whole machine will get a little light from time to time. On a steep downhill If I reach the boom straight out and grab onto a decent sized tree the cab end of the machine will come off the ground if I'm not careful.
As far as weight all 4 boggy tires loaded up only adds like 4800lbs to the overall machine which still puts the machine under 49K which I think is what the scorpion weighs? Being an 8 wheeler your machine will float a lot better, the 6w Ergo sinks like a lead balloon under the cab in a hurry.
R&R in Lanse? Was that the place in the old ford dealership there on the hill going out of town?
Yes, was in the Ford dealer. They closed over a year ago I think. mine weighs around 55 k all tracked up. Only thing I've been wishing for lately is balanced bogies. We have been in some hills and the regular ones aren't nearly as good for climbing.
I'm not a fan of hammering a woodlot, I do everything I can to make sure that there is good wood left and a future for 15+yrs from now when my kid can come back and cut it. The guy who cut these 20+yrs ago didn't think that way. Cut the very best and ran, lots of small junk wood, alot of scarred wood, landowners basically told me to make it look good.
I don't know how I went without one of these. :D :D :D. It's not really that slow, spent some time and went thru it, now I won't part with it. Below 24" on the stump it doesn't care. 460 literally can't shovel me wood fast enough. Can't give firewood away right now.
I rarely get to cut alot of good wood. Little bit here and there but alot of pulp and garbage. I will say stacking the brush in a few spots in the woods makes it so clean. It's almost scary now seeing how much ground and wood you can cut in 1 day. Be back in the cab by 7am. :D
I know what you mean with harvesting poor stands. We do a lot of stand restructuring and aesthetic improvement with stands that were "hammered" and high graded in the past. We are more landscapers than loggers. ;)
Here is a shot of my ScorpionKing all ready to load up heading to a new job. It's the only harvester that folds up like this. Kind of a pain compared to some.
The head had a bolt on guard over the top knife and this rests on the machine steps, which are bolted in place.
That is a bad looking machine. :D alot of hrs on it already ?
About 3200 now. It's a sweet ride for sure.
The last two afternoons I used the TD7G to convert a rough old skid trail into a trail I can run my tractor and winch on. With a small dozer it can be challenging to find enough dirt to straighten out what the skidders left on rocky hillsides. Every big rock you push up either has to be buried or you need to find more dirt which brings up more rocks to fill the hole. These are my roads so to me it is worth the time. It is fun work and I have to concentrate so much I forget that it is hot out.
Nice work g_man. My oh my your woods looks just like mine. This past spring I used a Cat 308 with a thumb to groom and layout new trails here (another post thread). I too expressed how hard it is to scrape up a shovel full to drop into the holes after the rocks were either removed or moved around to get it smooth.
The final trail smoothing was a ton of work, but totally worth it.
Bet your glad you don't live across the conn. river they have BIG rocks. I worked on some rds in the green mountain Nat. forest in the early 80, we would find open spots between trees on upper hill sides to get material for fills.
The truck is getting a little help getting over the hill on a greasy morning. I am so glad to have the harvester moved to a flat area with short yarding trails for a little while. We have been working nasty side hills all summer. The valley behind the landing is where these nice spruce logs came from. Most of the block is tolerant hardwood but there are some dandy spruce. The block has not been touched for many decades.
A good load. Hills can be a real pain to work. Some special knowledge and skills are needed.
just wondering how come you don't put chains on :-\ or is it easyer to push it out
Around here if the road is kind of loose all chains really do is let you dig down farther faster. Pushing is quick and easy.
coxy if there are rocks in the road you will be repairing chains every time you put them on .
This woodhauler makes time down the highway with a load of red pine saw bolts probably headed for an Amish sawmill.
Fighting rain, hills, and ruts has been the norm in northern MN this summer. It could be worse, we're not flooder or anything like folks are dealing with other places.
A little deceptive rut fixing with the bucket
Like it never even happened ;D These little boogers come ride with me sometimes, our 3 youngest. It's one of the little blessings being able to bring the kids out with me
And finally, after slogging through mud and lots of bad terrain, with the accompanying poor production, it's nice to get a job like this. Red pine clear cut, very good production. 2 Ponsse Buffalo Kings, about 650 cords on the landing in 3 days.The only downside is for the landowner, this plantation got wiped out by a windstorm >:(
I love your OCD stacking. :)
The challenge is to be neat and FAST ;) To be honest, we have more of an emphasis on the fast part, but I do my best to keep things as neat as I can while keeping the crane a-swingin' ;) I've had like 5 truck drivers say "thanks for the neat piles" in 4 years so I must be doing something right :) :D
Quote from: barbender on August 20, 2016, 11:26:14 PM
The challenge is to be neat and FAST ;) To be honest, we have more of an emphasis on the fast part, but I do my best to keep things as neat as I can while keeping the crane a-swingin' ;) I've had like 5 truck drivers say "thanks for the neat piles" in 4 years so I must be doing something right :) :D
you gotta stop putting these pictures of perfect wood piles on here. this is what i hear ...why dont your piles look like barbenders.......
I believe in neat piles also. Then we have trucks picking it up without having to call. I was told once by a trucker that I must sit a the bar and practice pilling straw's up when I'm not Logging. :D I always figure it's worth taking pride in your work. Even when fixing Eq,if it involves wielding I'll intial it & put the year,if there's room. I'm still seeing things my Dad fixed 40 years ago 8)
I'll share a secret with you guys- the camera makes things appear neater than they really are ;) The big pile on the far side of the hayfield was put up by the other operator, he tends to trend more to the "fast" than the "neat" :D The main thing I try to accomplish when making piles is that the trucks can reach everything and load with a minimum of fuss; they get paid by the load, I get paid by the hour. I try to keep the sticks laying level and parallel, I am less concerned with them being perfecly flush on the ends. Within 6" is close enough. Another area I can help them out is keeping as much brush and dirt out of the piles as possible. I could go faster if I just closed the bucket on the wood with no concern with what comes up with it- and some guys do. I figure forwarding in of itself is a pretty simple job, it's how you deal with all the little issues that come up that can make you stand out ;)
I've had one small flat area since June. Getting a little tired of nasty sidehills. I'm having to use the excavator on some of these trails in order to make it accessible for the forwarder. My road into this block comes off the Route 8 hwy at the top of the pictures
Pictures never do the hills justice. I'm thinking that is very steep though.
What a nice view that's making. I guess if you can look out there while eating lunch that would count as a fringe benefit. :)
Always nice to have a good view on a job, that is nice looking country.
Still on the same job, slow progress and waiting out log prices.
I knew one of these days I would get the pleasure of working on that boom chain, didn't realize it broke till it spit the whole thing out the back. Miserable job getting it back together.
Maintenance. :D dust is so bad everything needed a bath again. We have 2 water wagons and the little one works great for the washer.
The guy didn't have a big enough excavator. :D basically shut down cutting wood and driving truck when I'm home lately.
barge we had a 400 in the blue stone quarry one time that thing was a monster the one so called operator ripped the bucket to shreds trying to get the top rock off the boss just smiled and said they better get another bucket here asap about 8-9 years ago I was some place over by Tannersville and they where doing some digging in the river from a flood I think I saw the biggest excavator I ever saw in person that thing was huge it had double dipper rams and doudle jib boom rams one track looked to be about 4ft wide
That's a new 490 Komatsu with all the emissions crap, eats 100gal a day on economy mode in 6hrs just loading trucks. The tunnel they are digging is something to see, they lower a 135 kobelco zero in to load the rock pail and it looks like an ant. When we where doing the mass excavation part of it they had a new 375E Cat with a 5yd pail, they had 10-12 trucks hauling to keep up. I remember when a 690-790 was a big machine. It's nice work down there but the rock is rough, just lined another box last weekend with 450 hardox. Your "buddy" still have that limber he dragged down from Maine ?
ya :D :D :D :D :D :D
Quote from: BargeMonkey on August 25, 2016, 12:52:35 AM
eats 100gal a day on economy mode in 6hrs just loading trucks.
100 gallons?????? What is the EPA thinking? Sure it burns cleaner, but an older would not burn half that!
Exactly, with the piles of empty DEF containers around and all the extra resources used to make these ridiculous emissions systems. There probably is no environmental benefit at the end of the day.
The good news is that John Deere has fire extinguisher port holes all over the engine compartment.. 😉
Quote from: Loghauler86 on August 25, 2016, 09:28:57 PM
Exactly, with the piles of empty DEF containers around and all the extra resources used to make these ridiculous emissions systems. There probably is no environmental benefit at the end of the day.
Burning 3x more fuel to get the same job done, is not worth it. I don't care how clean it burns. Now we just hand over 3x more money to the oil company's in stead of keeping it. Seems to me the oil company's probably paid the EPA to do all this emission stuff to so they can make more money. Don't get me wrong, I believe pollution is bad, but honestly I have been doing a lot of research on "climate change" and I do not believe it's man made...
If interested watch this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1xMuE9brkc
The universe we live in is a NET ZERO SYSTEM. NO one is EVER gona change that!
Quote from: Bandmill Bandit on August 26, 2016, 08:53:12 AM
The universe we live in is a NET ZERO SYSTEM. NO one is EVER gona change that!
What do you mean by NET ZERO?
No finer a view than from the cockpit of Timberjack One.
That is a good view. You have nice trees - I have nice rocks :D
Maybe we need a view from the cockpit thread.
gg
Quote from: danbuendgen on August 26, 2016, 04:00:16 PM
Quote from: Bandmill Bandit on August 26, 2016, 08:53:12 AM
The universe we live in is a NET ZERO SYSTEM. NO one is EVER gona change that!
What do you mean by NET ZERO?
in the grand sceme/system(s) of the universe, ALL inputs are equal to ALL universal outputs. It is a zero sum game. NO exceptions. No environmental policy is, by any well meaning bone head, that is to dense too understand that fact, is EVER going to change it.
Only humans are capable of believing that they are, at best, greater than this universal fact and worst equal to it, not realizing that they are indeed only a minuscule part of it. The rest of the creatures and living things know this within their being.
It is tantamount to a creature pushing the wet rope of life and pulling the aluminum chain of death at the same time. The end result is ultimately death to the human in the middle at about the same time he realizes that the NET result of the action he is attempting to establish is about to balance out at a ZERO.
Quote from: g_man on September 06, 2016, 07:42:20 AM
That is a good view. You have nice trees - I have nice rocks :D
Maybe we need a view from the cockpit thread.
gg
if you could get them rocks to NY I know a guy that will buy them for trout habitat for the rivers they look like the right size :) :)
Quote from: g_man on September 06, 2016, 07:42:20 AM
That is a good view. You have nice trees - I have nice rocks :D
Maybe we need a view from the cockpit thread.
gg
G_man, I like that tread idea and I could use a lot of those nice rocks. We have some but nothing like that. How about a rock thread. ðÃ...¸ËÅ"ââ,¬Â°
Hmmmm, my smiley faces don't work any more. 😥
A rock thread??
Ha ha ha !!!!
That looks like our back pasture last year about two hours after my wife warned me not to wreck it!!
"You better fill the holes afterwards!" she said
"But I'm sick of sharpening the mower" I said
"Fill them" she said
"Yes dear" I said
There's still holes
Quote from: Puffergas on September 06, 2016, 09:25:55 PM
Quote from: g_man on September 06, 2016, 07:42:20 AM
That is a good view. You have nice trees - I have nice rocks :D
Maybe we need a view from the cockpit thread.
gg
G_man, I like that tread idea and I could use a lot of those nice rocks. We have some but nothing like that. How about a rock thread. ðÃ...¸ËÅ"ââ,¬Â°
they hacked your smiley faces :D :) ;D
It's not always fun and games. This was the first thing project last Monday. Operator backed up on the large hemlock stump while swinging the boom to the side. First time I've had to deal with that project. Looks much worse than it was.
I've came close to that a few times, Ken. Hasn't happened yet, but I know any day it could be me- I have seen daylight under the bogies more than once :o
Last winter I got a phone call to come help with the same situation. My boss/forwarder operator was trying to swing and drive and did the same thing.
It looks like both machines were empty?
Ours was. That Caribou we had was very tippy and swinging and driving empty was a big no-no.
you guys have all the fun :)
One of the nice things about the BuffaloKing I run is the stability- it is incredibly stable, especially with the tracks on. I've lifted the back a few times when empty, but that was with the extensions all the way out, just not paying attention. The problem is, the natural reaction when the back starts tipping is to reverse what you are doing (reaching out). Don't do that, just reach out and touch the ground, if need be, and it will set back down. Guys get scared and try to draw the crane back in, the back tips far enough that you lose your crane swing, causing the crane to swing to gravity, and over it goes. I'm afraid when I go over, it will be with a load on, on a side hill, from a high stump, and it's going to hurt :o
So this happened a couple weeks ago. No one was injured but it was quite a project to put back on its feet.
We had to hire a couple of hoes to help. They had to tack about 3.5 miles back to our location.
The two hoes couldn't quite get it on their own and a push with tje forwarder was needed to put it over the rest of the way. Another hour or so carefully working the oil out of the top side of the engine and it was running again. One more day was spent repairing bent metal and replacing an electrical panel and she's back in business.
Ughh! That's just they way it goes in hills though, glad no one was hurt, especially while getting it back upright. Cables and chains make me really nervous. What does the Timber Pro weigh?
Weighs about 68k. One cable gave out on us but he was able to slack it before it snapped all the way
glade no one was hurt but wouldn't it be easer next time to crawl under it and look for leaks than on its side ;) :D must have been a different ride
Doesn't make the boss happy. ;)
I hate it when that happens....
Did the boss do it again? That makes it easier :D What's the specefics on the "new to you" forwarder?
Yeah the boss did it again. Was fully loaded and trying to reposition to grab one last pile of wood on a steep hillside, backed up the last foot to the wood and up onto a stump on the high side and over she went.
The "new" machine is an 03 Buffalo, with like 17k hours on it. Just through the shop with all kinds of work done including all new paint/body panels/windows. They always say "the first scratch and dent are the hardest", well he put the 1st and 20th on at the same time.
Makes for a change in the work day. Always better when the boss does it. I've seen some very irate bosses and equipment owners in these situations. ;)
My contingency plan if I ever flop the machine is to just get in the truck and go, send a text message from the road saying what happened and don't worry about sending my last weeks paycheck. hahaha :D :D
I put a forwarder on its lid one time. I got on a side hill with a full load and over it went. I just shut it off and walked out of the woods. Made it home for lunch. My buddy brought his skidder over and between his Franklin and my John Deere we got it back on its feet. I let the oil settle for three days before I started it again. I only lost one quart of motor oil and one gallon of hydraulic oil. That wasn't bad. It may have been a quart low in the engine anyway.
I have never put a skidder on its roof, or even its side.
Quote from: chevytaHOE5674 on September 21, 2016, 02:29:34 PM
Yeah the boss did it again. Was fully loaded and trying to reposition to grab one last pile of wood on a steep hillside, backed up the last foot to the wood and up onto a stump on the high side and over she went.
The "new" machine is an 03 Buffalo, with like 17k hours on it. Just through the shop with all kinds of work done including all new paint/body panels/windows. They always say "the first scratch and dent are the hardest", well he put the 1st and 20th on at the same time.
I can just imagine how that makes YOU feel :) ......It wasn't me !!!......
Gives you a lot more wiggle room for future negotiations. ;)
I know my first time it left a brown spot where it should not have been :-X :D :) ;D
Just a picture I took yesterday morning. Plan to start cutting some fir and pulling it up here tomorrow morning.
gg
Fall colors are starting to show here in the central UP.
The fall colors make for nice photos.
my hydro ax I just got.
Looks like a nice machine. 511 Hyro Ax with a 20 inch shear head? I have a 311 with a 16 inch HS Ax Head. Would like to get the bigger machine eventually.
I had a 10 acre loblolly pine plantation, 30 years of age, clearcut because of root rot and bark beetle mortality. Harvest was done by Hill Logging, one of the very best that I have ever dealt with. This stand yielded 36 semi loads on the 10 acres. This crew had a tigercat fellerbuncher, one tigercat skidder, a John Deere processor, and a tigercat loader. Took them 2 1/2 days. They averaged 14 loads per day. Average diameter of the logs was about 15".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tWj3rbcdPEE
There are some great machines out there now, but most are limited to 30 % slopes or a little more.
In the Big Mountains it is still pretty much chainsaws and cable shows.
Quote from: 1270d on September 10, 2016, 09:57:29 PM
The two hoes couldn't quite get it on their own and a push with tje forwarder was needed to put it over the rest of the way. Another hour or so carefully working the oil out of the top side of the engine and it was running again. One more day was spent repairing bent metal and replacing an electrical panel and she's back in business.
1270d,
When you worked the oil out of the top end did you pull the injectors to do so? The reason I ask is I put an ASV 60 directly on its roof today. I was able to get it back sunny side up after about 6 hours but I'm concerned that oil got into the cylinders. Any tips are appreciated.
Quote from: newoodguy78 on November 26, 2016, 01:44:36 AM
Quote from: 1270d on September 10, 2016, 09:57:29 PM
The two hoes couldn't quite get it on their own and a push with tje forwarder was needed to put it over the rest of the way. Another hour or so carefully working the oil out of the top side of the engine and it was running again. One more day was spent repairing bent metal and replacing an electrical panel and she's back in business.
1270d,
When you worked the oil out of the top end did you pull the injectors to do so? The reason I ask is I put an ASV 60 directly on its roof today. I was able to get it back sunny side up after about 6 hours but I'm concerned that oil got into the cylinders. Any tips are appreciated.
No we didn't. Decided to risk it. Just bump the starter, and I mean just touch it, until you have made a couple revolutions on the engine. As soon as it would come up against the oil in the cylinder(s) we would stop and let it sit for a half hour or so. Then bump the key again.
If your engine is not too worn it should be pretty dry after six hours.
Once it would turn over freely we had a piece of wood ready to block the intake in case of runaway.
If your injectors are easy to access I would pull them. Ours were not, buried pretty good on the back side of the engine under plenty of other stuff..
Don't get greedy or you could crack a piston, or bend a rod.
Or shoot a rod right out the side of the block, I've seen that.
Thanks for the advice. The machine only has 1400 hours on it, so it's tight. I'm gonna tackle into pulling either the injectors or glow plugs. I don't dare risk anything. I checked the oil this morning and it's only down a bit., but don't want to assume anything. It's amazing how little physical damage it did. I must have pulled the lever to raise the loader as I was performing the back flip and they took the brunt of the impact. It was one of those rides that was a split second long but left way too long to think of the possible outcome.
Our engine had about 500 hrs on it at that point. Turn it over by hand to be safe.
When we flipped our forwarder upright we let it sit overnight then rolled the motor over by hand a few times to make sure it wasn't locked up. Hit the key and away she went.
Good luck Newoodguy78 with the restart.
It was moving day for me. We had to move earlier this week to cut out a roadway for a winter cut we have to do. Moved back to the ongoing job today. Roads were very slippery this morning. Float driver had to be very cautious.
Well I got it started with no issues. I pulled the glow plugs,spun it over by hand Then cranked it over with the starter. Once I got the glow plugs back in and changed the oil it fired right up smoked for a second or two and cleared right up. The only thing I found that didn't work was the light on the back of the cab. The lack of damage is absolutely amazing, it went directly over backwards and onto its roof. It didn't even scratch any paint. 8) 8) 8)
Thanks again for any and all advice and good luck that was sent. It's always nice to get advice from people who have the t-shirt so to speak.
Glad that you got going again without any further issues from the incident.
Very glad there was no damage must have had a guardian angel on that one.
Prentice 210D Slasher starts a new job cutting products in a hardwood thinning; 4/17.
Ron that is a very uniform looking pile of logs there. My clearcut is going to average a greater DBH but they wont be nearly as uniform, all over in terms of size of logs. Yours looks...almost perfect. Is that all one species?
Yes, it's mostly all beech with a few hard maple.
Not much slashing happening anymore it seems like. Are there many guys running tree length down that way Ron?
Plenty of slashing going on up in this country still. We have 2, plus a few contract cutters sith conventional crews. That's just our outfit, I don't know what the breakdown is percentage-wise, but I'd guess 60-75% of MN timber is still cut tree length and slashed. We're kinda the opposite, probably 80% of our volume is CTL.
Still know quite a few buncher/slasher crews over this way.
It pays if you have some nice but logs and good price . Local mills pay not much more than pulp price for hardwood logs ($230/mbf). Our better prices for hardwood were in the Maine market with the veneer.
No, not as much tree length skidding and slasher work here like there use to be especially if grade logs are involved. Most is CTL and landowners prefer harvesters and rubber tired forwarding over tree length logging.
This job happened to be in a subdivision development with lot site clearings with mostly low grade sawlogs and pulpwood being removed so a slasher is being used.
I attended the Interior Logging Association show in Vernon, BC this afternoon, the equipment display was impressive to say the least.
Some of the equipment was huge like this feller/buncher.
This is not a good picture of a huge machine that at first I couldn't identify, it is a portable chipper.
One of the biggest grapple skidders I have ever seen.
This is a neat machine, a cab forward grapple forwarder. With the cab up the drive motors and hoses are readily accessible.
Beautiful iron. Biggest thing about any of them is the payment!
They need to move a lot of wood to make these pay for themselves. The fellow I was with is a trucker with a lot of low bed experience, he didn't want to think about moving some of these pieces into the bush. ;D
Looks like banker's bait. 😀
I new a guy years back that got a new jd540 and ran it a year and a half and never made a payment on it never worked around his home town always 1-2 hours away I think the only reason he got snagged was the truck broke down while he was moving it at night and the cops came along :D
The "Repo Man" is also known to work at night. ;)
Some big timber tracts are regularly needed to support their ownership. ;)
https://youtu.be/uKgsLaGyPgA (https://youtu.be/uKgsLaGyPgA)
Video taken this week of a JP Skidmore CF-22 cutting in Lower Michigan.
some would say pine limbs easy it dosent. the pasture pine you have dosent look much different than what we have here
Good video of the Skidmore.
I got a new office today😊
2017 fresh off the boat Ponsse Buffalo King. Actually, we've had it for almost two weeks but just finally got it out in the woods today. Between some service on my prior machine and setting up the computer etc. on the new one, I only got about 40 cords out with it today. I'm loving it, here's to a hundred cords tomorrow!😁
Working view-
Driving view, yes that is an oven on the right of the console, in case I want to make cookies or something😂
Finally, two of Ponsse's technicians from the local Grand Rapids, MN shop. We had to replace the rotator on my old machine, I just took this picture for the scale of these SG420 grapples we've started running. I talked the boss into trying one this winter, I liked it a bunch so we got the same one on the new machine. They are quite large, as you can see😊
Quote from: barbender on June 22, 2017, 10:09:45 PM
I got a new office today😊
Again ? :o And with a oven, I am so jealous 8)
Now you better make your boss some money !
Ahhh, that new Ponsse smell.
Nice new wheels! I suppose you have an assistant to run the oven, coffee machine and computer? Did it come with a new hat too or did the boss keep the hat? :D
If you are going to be picking up 100 cords tomorrow, I guess you will have to miss the big show and dinner at Crandon tomorrow. You got a better deal than a dinner anyway. Dinners don't last as long as that new machine will.
Nope, Gary, I won't be making it to Crandon. I can probably bring one of my kids to tend to the oven, etc. and I got 2 hats- I was wearing a John Deere hat today, the Ponsse guys made me forfeit it for an extra Ponsse hat😁
You are going to be tired tonight if you do pick up 100 cords of that peckerwood like I see in the bunk in one picture. Looks a little like Birch but not sure.
100 cords a day of birch would be miserable, but this sale is 85% aspen. I ended up having to go to town for 3 1/2 hours, so only 70 cords today. I'm really loving this new machine. It's an improvement in every area, not a night and day difference but across the board. A little smoother, a little more powerful, a little faster hydraulics, a little quieter, and on and on I could go.
That's an impressive piece of iron for sure. Glad that you like it.
Is that really an oven? Or did you just get one over on me? :D
Well, I haven't tried it out yet, but yes. It has a switch on it to either heat or cool, I'll try to give a review in the future😊
The grey box won't cook anything barbender. It will keep cold stuff cold or warm stuff warm though. I took mine out after not too long. There is an actual oven option though. It is a lot smaller, little black box.
It has the little black box, too ;) My Grandad cut pulp with horses, he said 3 cords was a good day for one man. It's incredible to me how hard people had it not that long ago (or right now, in other areas of the world) and how spoiled I am, spending my days in luxury.
good luck with it do you feel any older ;D
Yes ;D
Well happy b day barbender!
PC
Thanks, Paul!
You've got to like that. ;)
So you want to be a logger. It will be fun they said.
Haven't seen this thread in a couple weeks so thought I would add a couple pictures from today. Of course the big d-link hook on the harvester was buried in the mud so had to dig it out before we hook the forwarder onto it. Actually came out pretty easy after we jammed a bunch of studwood under the tracks.
I have a wet hole like that on my land.
after all this rain ill have a 200a mud hole ;D
Ugh. Thumbs down👎
Quote from: coxy on July 13, 2017, 10:08:37 PM
after all this rain ill have a 200a mud hole ;D
EXACTLY !!!!
gg
Ken, some people think playing in the mud is fun! ;D
not me it takes to long to fix the mess ;D
Man.. That sinkhole looks like a whole dang case of the mondays.
Did the boss do it or the operator ? ;D
Anyways, glad you got her out without busting anything.
Quote from: lopet on July 14, 2017, 10:51:10 PM
Did the boss do it or the operator ? ;D
Anyways, glad you got her out without busting anything.
I actually had started the strip and although it was soft in there I thought it was doable. When my operator walked the machine back in he didn't even get to where I finished and sunk. He has the honour of getting a harvester of mine stuck for the first time. Just another day
Know what you're saying, sometimes a ground only takes one passing but no second one. How do I know that ;D
We just got a new forwarder. Been waiting about 6 months, and the deal finally went through. We didn't tell our operator it was coming until the Lowboy pulled onto the job. He was quite pleased. It's a rottne F15 and seems to be a pretty nice rig so far.
A great surprise for the operator . ;) Where in the the U.P. will it be working?
wannaergo,
You probably just made that guys weekend!
Quote from: Ron Scott on July 28, 2017, 11:32:21 AM
A great surprise for the operator . ;) What are of the U.P. will it be working in?
We are usually right around the central to western UP. Around the michigamme area is where most of our work is.
I'm only up to page 82 in this thread (thanks Ron Scott for starting this!) so apologies if this has been posted in here before:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I0K5XwmGmuw
Allison Logging - Coastal Logging in the early 20th Century
If anybody relied on me to carry an axe and climb up to top a tree at over 120 ft, they'd still be living in a rock house or a hole in the ground.
(Back to reading).
They wouldn't find me up there either. ;D Thanks for that, a great video. It was a very hard and dangerous way to make a living, lots of ways to get hurt or killed. Did you notice the guy chopping fuel for the yarder? I sure wouldn't argue with him after a few beers.
Hey Sawguy
The wisdom and treachery that comes with grey hair is a part of a relationship the goes with the pith and vinegar of youth for the greatest success that is possible. One without the other doesnt even get half the job done.
FABTEK 133 with new 2-Roller conversion cutting in Cedar River, MI.
https://youtu.be/4S8575jqO00 (https://youtu.be/4S8575jqO00)
What market is there for the small "top" wood?
JLeBouton
Nooooo! It's the last page. Need more pictures of equipment I'll otherwise never see, much less operate.
Amazing thread and thanks to all who took time to share photos, videos and descriptions of these operations! The whole range is covered.
Quote from: Peter Drouin on August 28, 2017, 09:04:55 PM
What market is there for the small "top" wood?
JLeBouton
Hardwood pulp or sometimes firewood.
Unloading fir peelers at Canoe Forest Products plywood plant near Salmon Arm BC. Quite something to see this beast lift. The plant is on the edge of Shuswap Lake, logs are also boomed down from the north and east arms then trucked from here to area mills. I would like to have been closer but didn't have the required ppe so took a quick pic then scurried back to the truck.
They have another crane to load the log trucks. Unfortunately somebody wasn't paying attention and towed it out a little too far, it sank and pulled the newly repowered tug down with it. The pilot got out but likely had to look for a new employer. ;D Both were recovered but the tug has yet to return from repair in Vancouver, a smaller one is in service meaning smaller booms. Some loads are now being trucked around the lake, an 11 hour trip on a good day.
Is that a derrick? The yellow boom on the left is fixed, aband d the one on the right pivots around it?
Yes
Has the price for peelers going up after all those fires ? I guess I know the answer, but how much ?
Last price I saw was over $428US/thousand for softwood. Very profitable but logs are limited due to the fires, BC lost an estimated four year supply.
I kinda meant for you locals. Arn't you selling in m3 to the mill ? So is that more than $ 100 per m3 ?
I have no idea what the mills pay for logs
Video shot yesterday near Stevens Point, WI showing a Fabtek 133 with 2-roller conversion. The owners report an increase in production of at least 3 cords per hour over their 4-roller set up. Between eliminating the maintenance associated with the 4-rollers, and the increased production, their only regret is not making the switch sooner.
Fabtek 133 2-Roller
Barko 240 CF-18
https://youtu.be/YC9UCCwx_3M (https://youtu.be/YC9UCCwx_3M)
Good video of the FT-133 at work in a second thinning. Nice pine stand with good regeneration.
Nice video
When did Brian get rid of his 1270?
Some oldies
https://youtu.be/BvV4rh_mm60
https://youtu.be/g7N-QjxuiIM
Any of you guys ever been in the woods with one of these?
https://youtu.be/sbz-ufmsmSA
I've seen that video before somewhere with the 350. Hard to believe that little thing'll haul such a load!
Nice! A bulldozer with a grapple crane, that would be handy for me
Makes me cringe seeing that loader/dozer combo with absolutely no protection for the operator. I've seen the main vertical shaft break completely off on those Gafners.
If I get in trouble for this but it fits https://forestryequipmentsales.com/282/Enviromax/149/Enviromax-Forwarder.html
Quote from: Pclem on January 25, 2018, 01:29:55 PM
I've seen that video before somewhere with the 350. Hard to believe that little thing'll haul such a load!
It makes me wonder why ive never been able to find a forestry trailer behind a dozer. Ive seen quite a few videos over the years of 4wd farm tractors struggling to get half loads up a hill or thru a swampy patch. Badly sunken in or having to unload the whole trailer, move a few feet then reload several times. The soil gets wrecked. Im curious why no one seems to use a crawler on swamp pads for the power unit. Id think the volume or logs per trip, increased stability and not getting stuck as much would offset the slower speed and have a kinder footprint. Am i wrong?
I stole this picture from a tractor forum. This is a rig a guy over in Down East Maine uses. He has a tractor for the trailer also plus a skidder. He says the Dozer/Trailer combo is the best way to go for him.
gg
Nice setup. Has he ever pulled the trailer with the skidder?
I have a JD RotoBoom. Originally the boom was mounted on the cat (I think). The plan is to mount it on the 3pt hitch of the Steiger and pull the trailer.
Puffergas that I want to see . I have wanted to put one on my 9600 Ford .
The John Deere 350 and Gafner loader were popular units for logging the cedar swamps and jack pine areas of the eastern UP during the early 1960's. Also with no protective canopies.
g_man,not a bad setup. But I don't have a dozer. BUT I sure could use one. BUT using one would only found more rocks to haul into the bog. Getting a bigger forwarder trailer would enable to haul more rocks too. What a vicious circle. ;D
Quote from: thecfarm on January 28, 2018, 08:08:30 PM
Getting a bigger forwarder trailer would enable to haul more rocks too. What a vicious circle. ;D
Then you need a bigger tractor and and and....... :D
Don't you wanna leave any rocks to the next guy ? :)
Or just a forwarder with the right tracks
I really doubt I will run out of rocks. :( And if I did, I could call a blasting crew and that would keep me going for a while. :D Got some biggies sticking out of the ground.
Quote from: Corley5 on January 25, 2018, 08:26:22 PM
Makes me cringe seeing that loader/dozer combo with absolutely no protection for the operator. I've seen the main vertical shaft break completely off on those Gafners.
my dad logged with an old jd 1010 dozer for 20years with no ROPS then there was about 10 years with out a dozer then got a 350 with ROPS the first week he said I cant believe I never got killed with that 1010
Quote from: mike_belben on January 26, 2018, 08:09:28 AM
Quote from: Pclem on January 25, 2018, 01:29:55 PM
I've seen that video before somewhere with the 350. Hard to believe that little thing'll haul such a load!
It makes me wonder why ive never been able to find a forestry trailer behind a dozer. Ive seen quite a few videos over the years of 4wd farm tractors struggling to get half loads up a hill or thru a swampy patch. Badly sunken in or having to unload the whole trailer, move a few feet then reload several times. The soil gets wrecked. Im curious why no one seems to use a crawler on swamp pads for the power unit. Id think the volume or logs per trip, increased stability and not getting stuck as much would offset the slower speed and have a kinder footprint. Am i wrong?
Or pickup a lamtrac https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YvarzmWp3I or Fecon or cmi. Undercarriage on all those are designed for the woods. Trouble is they are weighted to offset the a heavy front end but I bet you enterprising folks could put a trailer forward and use the hydraulics to drive the crane. Then disconnect the whole system when you wanted to put the mulching head back on.
Speaking of forestry undercarriages.. How are the best ones set up? To oscillate somehow? Any particular machine i can study thats got a great reputation for woods agility?
there was one like that around here a guy was using to log part time with but it didn't hold up he made an arch for it it was a neat looking little thing
Never posted a picture of my bell so here it is
And a pic of moving it and my 225 last week
I just bought this 240A grapple today needs a little tinkering before I put it in the woods
Nice collection
Is that an Esco grapple? Looks like the one on Myrtle.
Myrtle before rebuilding.
Thanks mike! Dave I believe it is a esco
I don't see many of those Bells around here.
I have seen the Orange ones around. Those was around about 30 years ago. Last one I saw was about 10 years back. Grandson had a field day with a logging company and they had one there.
Good luck with the grapple skidder.
Gett'n ready ~
Good to see an old Prentice getting ready. Those were built not far from me in Prentice, WI. They were sold to CAT forest products in 2007. Got to haul their machines on flatbed a few times.
This was back in spring of 2011, it ended up going to Louisiana as I recall. Unloading it took some work, they had to attach the cab and run the machine to lower the outriggers onto old skidder tires. That lifted the machine enough that I was able to drive my trailer out from underneath it.
Nice stepdeck. Are those 17.5?
Quote from: Bay Beagle on January 30, 2018, 01:21:37 PM
Gett'n ready ~
a little body puddy and some sand paper and she almost road ready :D
Mike, it was the company's step deck, a Chaparral. And if you mean wheels, I don't remember. Looking online their listed as 22.5's.
Man they look tiny.
Quote from: coxy on January 30, 2018, 03:36:11 PM
Quote from: Bay Beagle on January 30, 2018, 01:21:37 PM
Gett'n ready ~
a little body puddy and some sand paper and she almost road ready :D
Just don't try to get past the scales. Man that is ugly. :D
Quote from: Dave Shepard on January 29, 2018, 10:38:37 PM
Is that an Esco grapple? Looks like the one on Myrtle.
Myrtle before rebuilding.
Young also built grapples like that, also a heads up for you guys with Esco grapples they no longer do forestry grapples.
Quote from: mike_belben on January 30, 2018, 02:12:19 PM
Nice stepdeck. Are those 17.5?
I don't remember the size but they are the small ones. That is a low pro stepdeck with a deck height of 34 to 36".
Resonator, I have no idea who you are but I can say without a doubt that I have been hooked to that same trailer. I quit in 2013 and went back in the woods.
If my memory is correct a 519 is a yellow 210.
There is three different sizes of 17.5 tires, maybe even 4. I have the small ones on a stepdeck, bad mistake and I doubt I would ever buy another stepdeck with 17.5 tires at all, but might would try the larger ones.
Hey Grandpa, very good chance we were at the same place, I'll send you a PM.
That's a nice stick! What is that skidder?
There was some really nice wood on that job. The skidder was a gafner mini skidder a little bigger than a Garrett 10. Sold it and just got a old c4b long frame.
Franks Logging out of Peshtigo WI with their TimberPro TN725C with JP Skidmore CF-22 in oak.
How many of the Skidmore heads have the bottom knife/arm been put on?
Quote from: Skeans1 on February 27, 2018, 05:47:07 PM
How many of the Skidmore heads have the bottom knife/arm been put on?
Between the CF-22s and modified CF-18s, probably 5 or 6 with lower thumb.
The firm Haas from germany takes new John Deere forestry machines and make them even better, the have some cool videos!
HAAS Traction aid cable winch JD1110E - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEcXjUvvMCA)
HAAS Traction aid rope winch JD Harvester (Front & Rear) - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J0j5GoN_eMc)
A very good video but sadly in german: Haas makes every wish and tough you have a reality. This guy wanted the traction winch and bogie lifts in the front and back individually usable as he explains/shows at 4.02min
The machines come with remote winching and remote driving
Kombiforwarder JD 1110E HAAS - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fbeBDbpZLS0)
The dancing forwarder. :D :D
Pretty impressive how they can climb those hills.
Does anything have to done to engine and hydraulic oil intakes to be sure the systems aren't starved of oil operating in these extemes ???
There's a set of Alpine winches on some Ponsse's out here and so far they haven't had an issue. The videos really don't do justice vs seeing the guys drop a Tigercat 870 or 855 off 90% or steeper ground. If you guys want to see the original steep ground machine look up a Washington/Allied feller buncher far as I know of all the ones built there's only one left out at camp 18.
Climb Max - this was filmed a while back.
Be interesting to see the cost figures of a tracked feller buncher/ felling head machine operating with a traction winch excavator/ bulldozer against the cost of just operating the Climbmax with winch, blade , dry sump engine etc
Would also like to see a Climbmax operating with a tiger cat or south star felling head or duxson felling head. http://www.duxson.co.nz/fellinghead
Safer Tree Harvesting with ClimbMAX - YouTube (https://youtu.be/omp_BV30B_A)
Not sure there's a climbmax not too far from me and lots of the Tractionline & Summit & a Falcon out here. One thing I can see with the extra machine is you have a good anchor point vs trying to anchor to an old growth stump which I wouldn't trust with my life, also some places are changing the slope rules which will require a leveler to tether.
No tilt base on the climbmax
, i can just imagine how tired that is for the operator and machine.
It doesn't make that much of a difference with a leveler or not the slopes are steeper then what they are designed to level out for. Most of these leveling machines are made to walk up a steep slope so once you're leveled out and spin on the hill you quit going up, heading down they don't tilt as far back especially with the road tiller or single bar grousers the guys add on 10" tall.
Good Lord thats a lotta tilt.
I think i wouldn't have the balls/stupidity to be in such a slope
neat toys but way to many moving parts for this poor logger to fix :D
Quote from: teakwood on February 28, 2018, 06:31:06 PM
The firm Haas from germany takes new John Deere forestry machines and make them even better, the have some cool videos!
HAAS Traction aid cable winch JD1110E - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEcXjUvvMCA)
HAAS Traction aid rope winch JD Harvester (Front & Rear) - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J0j5GoN_eMc)
A very good video but sadly in german: Haas makes every wish and tough you have a reality. This guy wanted the traction winch and bogie lifts in the front and back individually usable as he explains/shows at 4.02min
The machines come with remote winching and remote driving
Kombiforwarder JD 1110E HAAS - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fbeBDbpZLS0)
I have only two thoughts on those....
1) Nope
2) No way
I'm man enough to admit there's better men than me :D :D :D :D
Me thinks those trees can stay, I'll cut somewhere else :o
looks like the hills we have here except for we have ledge rock not to bad i just don't trust cable that much if it broke what a ride he would have :D :D 8)
Ron I seen that. It looks like there clearing all the pine out of the hardwood. Looked like a small strip on the south side of 55.
ok wanted to ask this before but keep forgetting after the thinning like in the second pic the remaining trees are/look far apart what keeps them from blowing over wouldn't it be better to just clear cut it or do guys go back if they blow over and clean them up one other thing how many knots are in your bud whorl we have 5 and they wont buy them for poles i think only 3 is aloud but could be wrong
I'd like to try one of those smaller forwarders, all I've gotten to run are Buffalo and BuffaloKing models.
Coxy, that pine looks excessively thinned, we don't take them down that far for the reason you stated.
Barbender once your used to the Buffalo its painful to go back to the little machines. The small crane won't lift what you want it to, the bunk fills in a hurry, the small tires ride rougher and you get hung up easier, and the little 4cyl motor is wound like a cheap watch getting a full load moving uphill. Hahaha
Looks like a thin we did for one of the local governments 100 fir an acre and if there was an oak clear out a 50' to 75' circle around them this included the fun of making snags with down wood piles.
Chevy, we used to have an Elk model. That machine was almost identical in size to a Buffalo, but with a 4 cylinder engine. I never ran it, but by all accounts it was pathetic. Not only did the engine lack power, the drive system was really weak. It could not climb hills at all, I guess. This new BuffaloKing really impresses me with it's hill climbing ability, I can climb hills that the processors spin out on😊 Anyhow, I just wanted to try one of those dinky machines for the fun of it, I'm not giving back the big machine😁
Firewoodjoe,
Yes, the job is just east of the Caberfae Ski Area road and south of H-55. The heavy thinning is in the small stretch along the highway road right-of-way probably as designated by MDOT and the USFS landscape architect. The timber access road angles into the red pine stand and a block of National Forest timber to the south.
To you guys that think the pine will blow over. Yes it will if not done properly. Most pine is thinned 3 or more times over many years. The root system recoups and it's generally fine. Then they used to cut telephone poles from the remainder final cut but I don't see many poles cut like I used to.
I am a small scale guy. I use chain saws, a 47 hp kubota tractor, logging winch and trailer. I leave about 50 percent of the forest standing and have great luck with keeping wildlife in the area. Here is video of some crazy pictures I have taken.
https://youtu.be/a43NQ2dJdBQ (https://youtu.be/a43NQ2dJdBQ)
I used skidders and forwards but I am just doing small scale logging for myself with a kubota tractor and logging winch, logging trailer. It's not to bad if the going is good but man I would love to have one of those smaller track machines. This is my smaller operations.
https://youtu.be/uhx0dGFBpBM (https://youtu.be/uhx0dGFBpBM)
so, how bad do you want a small tracked machine.....
And how small are you talking? A mini? A 490/120 size machine? 45k lbs weight?
how about 5k lollollol
Copy of Bombardier SW48 Tracked Skidder - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yV8csqrRl7I)
Hermann has moved to %100 shovel logging now using madill 3800's
Quote from: pinefeller on April 15, 2018, 10:52:05 AM
how about 5k lollollol
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yV8csqrRl7I)
I can see now how you can flip that thing.
Btw we old timer would like to listen to the sound of a diesel not such terrible music. smiley_thumbsdown smiley_thumbsdown :D :D
Quote from: quilbilly on April 15, 2018, 12:42:15 PM
Hermann has moved to %100 shovel logging now using madill 3800's
Wonder how long till they dig out the old Washington Buncher to hang off a line.
The mainliner's access with its pup is difficult across the hilly terrain to the timber landing and decking area of the logging job in back so the forwarder operator loads the unhooked pup on the county road side.
The loaded woodhauler comes out of the logging area to hook up its pup on the county road side for a full load of logs to be taken to a down state sawmill.
Aspen clearcut on north side of one of my deer blinds. December 2018
John Deere 1010 forwarder works on aspen clearcut on east side of my deer blind. December 2018. A large doe was taken here just before the cutting began.
Should be really good hunting when those root sprouts spring up. Looks good !!
gg
Agreed. Now that the acorns and grasses are going, deer all over my tiny woods eating bud tips and sprouts.
The days of change are here less guys on the ground especially setting chokers, other then the Tigercat machines all the other stuff is built in SW Washington.
https://youtu.be/gVgCaKomkYo (https://youtu.be/gVgCaKomkYo)
I do some small scale logging with my KUBOTA L4740 tractor, a logging winch, logging trailer and sometimes even my atv. Here is a quick video. My small scale logging harvest methods. (https://youtu.be/uhx0dGFBpBM)
The 1010 John Deere forwarder operator loads aspen pulpwood and sawlogs from the aspen clearcut and mats the aspen slash to prevent rutting over the wet soil as he works out to the landing and decking area in a nearby corn field.
Ron does that get replanted or does it just come back through nature if nature about how long before it will be cut again
It will all be natural regeneration to mostly aspen and will be harvested in another 60-80 years.
I cut one aspen tree here and another 100 comes back. :o
Great habitat for deer and ruffed grouse. fudd-smiley
The white bark Poplar (part of the Aspen tree group) in my area will send hundreds of "clone" sprouts up from the roots around the stump, and grow like a weed. You would have to push the tree over, and uproot the stump, to prevent regrowth. I clear cut a small Poplar patch on my land four years ago, and the saplings are already at least 8' - 10' tall.
On a small scale,10 trees,I cut a bowl into the stumps of the aspen trees. I fill the bowl full of rock salt and water. I keep a bucket of salt by the stumps and carry water as needed. I keep the stump filled up with whatever is needed. I check them weekly. Works on beech too. Deer like the salt too. ;D
Water the salt with vinegar and youll really kill em.
Never heard of vinegar. Will the deer like it. :D :D :D :D
😂😂😂 There are so many aspen sprouts most areas around here, I don't know how you would kill them off other than round up. Or, like the Forest Service had us do on one timber sale- thin the Aspen so there is room for shade tolerant hardwoods to come up underneath, and let the aspen grow old and die. It won't regen underneath itself because it is very shade intolerant. I'm curious to see how that one turns out. I wonder sometimes if the reason that WI and MI have so many more hardwoods than MN, is because those states got logged first. Maybe came up and aspen, it got old and died and succesional hardwoods took over. Whereas in MN, once things grew back to aspen, there was a market for it- so we cut it down. Then it grew back to Aspen, and we cut it down. Then it...you see where I'm going with this😁
In Wisconsin the paper industry made Poplar very popular.
Quote from: Resonator on January 06, 2019, 09:54:58 PM
The white bark Poplar (part of the Aspen tree group) in my area will send hundreds of "clone" sprouts up from the roots around the stump, and grow like a weed. You would have to push the tree over, and uproot the stump, to prevent regrowth. I clear cut a small Poplar patch on my land four years ago, and the saplings are already at least 8' - 10' tall.
we had stump sprouts on Yellow Poplar, a magnolia family member, hit 8' in 1 summer after late winter harvest. Forest mulchers will take both right on out though.
Some landowner's don't like the aspen clearcuts not realizing that that's how its managed productively as an intolerant species and they will then again complain that the regeneration in to thick after the harvest. After a few years they are amazed by their new growth forest. ;)
The John Deere 1270 C Harvester works a plantation salvage thinning of wind blown red and white pine in hilly terrain during the seasons first snow. Dunn Timber Salvage Harvest, December 2018.
The John Deere 1270C Harvester reaches out to process wind blown pine on a hill side with its 11.7m (38 ft.) boom. December 2018 salvage thinning.
The John Deere Harvester cuts the salvaged pine into 100 inch lengths and piles it for pickup by the forwarder. Wind blown salvage thinning, December 2018.
Nice pictures Ron.
Another area of windblown timber from the August 2018 storm is salvaged by a 1270B Timberjack Harvester. American beech is decked awaiting removal. January 2019.
Nice beech. All the beech I have that size I can run my arm up into.
I was cutting some about that size and I was cutting my notch. Went to the backside and started cutting.All at once something started to come of of the tree as a liquid. :o I shut the saw off,thinking my saw has sprung a leak. ::) I never had that happen. There was a limb that had broke off and that was water in the hollow part of the tree.
All the beech I have have bumps all over it,caused by cankers, beech bark disease.
Beech makes excellent firewood.
Yes it does. That's what I was doing with it. I was on my Father's land,and we hauled it out on a trailer. Had to load it 4 foot. No way some of that beech was going to be loaded on a trailer. I went into the woods with 3-4 iron wedges and a sledge hammer. Sometimes I would have all 3 wedges buried into that wood. I finally did convince him to haul it out in longer lengths.
Big beech down here tends to be hollow. The hardwood cruisers beat it with a cruising stick to listen and hear if it is hollow. At least the old hardwood cruisers did.
Not sure if the Millennials beat on beech :).
I'm sure not a "Millennial", but I beat on the beeches (all second growth) that are in my wood. Most all of them are hollow, and those Beeches are dangerous to fell......
They are also good to leave some as den, snag, cavity, and mast trees for wildlife.
Theres a 400 acre lease a short hike behind me that the neighbors and i all hunt. Just one hollar past my buddies ridgetop stands is a steep creek cut bank about 30feet tall with bedding above it and a MONSTER beach tree in the bottom that theyve not noticed. The wall funnels deer into a narrow tract to get down to the tree and i cant wait to set up over there to drag out the bucks my pals drool over. Just to be a turd. ;D
A Timber Harvester is recommended for safety and efficiency to produce a good product mix in the salvage of wind blown timber. A Timberjack harvester is being used in this January 2019 cleanup after an August 2018 wind storm.
doesn't look like you got much snow
No, not much snow at all yet this winter. Had about 6 inches at the most, but rains in between has decreased that. Cold weather now. Was below zero all day today and 8 below now. Snowmobilers and cross country skiers are hurting.
we got about 10in out of the storm last night thats the most we have had got some back in November but that got rained away to late in the year for this crap im ready for spring
Weve had like 1/4" of snow and thats plenty for me. Other than tracking deer it serves me no purpose.
Picture taken just last Friday when we had our 6 inches of snow so far. More unsightly blow down of plantation red pine on National Forest land along the heavily traveled road to the Caberfae Ski Area. There is still a lot of patch work timber salvage work to be done on private and public lands in the area.
Ron isn't that a sighn the row pine is being thinned to much to early. I see a lot of thin pin that takes it hard in bad weather in our area. Mid/northern mi like u. It's to bad a lot of dollars lost due to shake.
Some storms, it doesn't matter. We had a big storm in 2012, it didn't matter how well stocked a site was- it all got flattened.
Quote from: Firewoodjoe on January 21, 2019, 07:41:18 AM
Ron isn't that a sighn the row pine is being thinned to much to early. I see a lot of thin pin that takes it hard in bad weather in our area. Mid/northern mi like u. It's to bad a lot of dollars lost due to shake.
I believe it is now known that shake is really bacterial in nature. I am curious about the pine thinning strategy, in the south they would have been thinned a long time ago. Was it just planted too densely to begin with?
On Forest Service land, at least up here, it's almost a given that pine plantations are not thinned early enough. The result is tall, spindly trees that don't hold up well to storms when they are thinned. Thinning early (25-30 years old for red pine) and then consistently will yield larger pine that are more wind firm.
As bartender points out, it doesn't matter how wind firm the trees are in some storms. It's all coming down.
Clark
One sign of an over thinned stand is when they are all bent over instead of broken.
I understand there is some storms and it doesn't matter. And I agree they're not thinned soon enough resulting in over thinning latter because they're not wind strong causing them to blow over in a slightly above average storm. Just my observation these days it seems I see a lot of bent up or broken red pine.
These red pine stands had been recently marked for their second commercial thinning, but they were blown down by the heavy August 2018 storm before they could be harvested. Now they are a patch work of salvage operations with a years work or more of clean up ahead.
Around us there is almost 0 market for pine pulp therefor no one will invest money to thin with no payback for years .
This is sure impressive how far they are hanging out.
https://youtu.be/gGLnFeVsroE (https://youtu.be/gGLnFeVsroE)
There's markets, Gearbox- they just don't pay anything😊
@Skeans1 (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=37446) it sure is impressive. How the heck do they manage to get that cable anchored over there? Fly it in a helicopter or use a skidder or excavator?
@Skeans1 (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=37446) ,don't see much of that type of logging around here. Grapple on that "thing" that rides on that cable? How can operator see what it's doing,camera??
Quote from: thecfarm on January 22, 2019, 02:17:27 PM
@Skeans1 (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=37446) ,don't see much of that type of logging around here. Grapple on that "thing" that rides on that cable? How can operator see what it's doing,camera??
That's what's called a grapple carriage with a camera on it, the main reason most of the guys have gone to that style of carriage is to get guys off the ground.
Quote from: nativewolf on January 22, 2019, 08:39:08 AM
@Skeans1 (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=37446) it sure is impressive. How the heck do they manage to get that cable anchored over there? Fly it in a helicopter or use a skidder or excavator?
Helicopter or with hay wire just like a main skyline.
Guys are still cheap in appalachia.
It's not the labor that kills it's the insurance, if you take the same sized yarder or tower with the big carriage Grapple carriage would out produce some choker setters. With a standard carriage or butt rigging you need two guys in the brush most of the time three, one guy chasing on the landing, then a guy running yarder how much labor is that?
Where i live?
$30/hr cash for all 3.
Quote from: mike_belben on January 22, 2019, 04:58:24 PM
Where i live?
$30/hr cash for all 3.
guys with that sized operation re doing it by books , so osha regs met, workmans comp is 100% of salary, etc. 3 guys gets to over $100/hr fast.
Not sure if it's the same machine as Skeans Posted, but this is a local manufacturer of that sort of gear, with some specs. The remote unit has a little 7.5 hp diesel for hydraulic power, and electrical for the cameras, lights and radio link. Cameras appear to be standard wireless security cameras that transmit back to the operator via wifi.
Hawkeye - EMS (http://emsnewzealand.co.nz/hawkeye/)
And a BIG safety advantage of not having boots on the ground setting chokers as logs are being yarded around them. So if a log hangs up and flicks around, or drops from a grapple, it's only a nuisance, not clobbering someone working nearby.
Latest work is a remote operated feller buncher that they can send down those hills on a cable, and operate from a nice remote cab up on the hill. If something goes wrong on the business end up the rope, no one gets hurt.
Quote from: nativewolf on January 22, 2019, 05:05:52 PM
Quote from: mike_belben on January 22, 2019, 04:58:24 PM
Where i live?
$30/hr cash for all 3.
guys with that sized operation re doing it by books , so osha regs met, workmans comp is 100% of salary, etc. 3 guys gets to over $100/hr fast.
I know. But there has nothing to do with here, and my initial comment was guys here are cheap. And im stickin to it.
No license no insurance no problem!
Mike pretty soon you are going to be a business magnate there.
Quote from: mike_belben on January 22, 2019, 07:35:50 PM
Quote from: nativewolf on January 22, 2019, 05:05:52 PM
Quote from: mike_belben on January 22, 2019, 04:58:24 PM
Where i live?
$30/hr cash for all 3.
guys with that sized operation re doing it by books , so osha regs met, workmans comp is 100% of salary, etc. 3 guys gets to over $100/hr fast.
I know. But there has nothing to do with here, and my initial comment was guys here are cheap. And im stickin to it.
No license no insurance no problem!
That's great till you get a visit from the state at a job or you're doing company work, most of the guys doing this stuff are doing are working for one or the other.
Quote from: nativewolf on January 22, 2019, 08:39:08 AM
@Skeans1 (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=37446) it sure is impressive. How the heck do they manage to get that cable anchored over there? Fly it in a helicopter or use a skidder or excavator?
Looked like the Valmet? was the mobile tailhold
Use an industrial drone (dji matrice 600 and others) to tow out a thin dyneema rope then haul out the haywire, then cable.
Prototype Winch and Drone for Yarder Setup April 17, 2016 - YouTube (https://youtu.be/qj7uJw1MSQc)
That was great @Riwaka (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=27844) . Drone service, Amazon has nothing on that logging crew.
Quote from: Skeans1 on January 21, 2019, 11:13:16 PM
This is sure impressive how far they are hanging out.
https://youtu.be/gGLnFeVsroE (https://youtu.be/gGLnFeVsroE)
We were on a job that was hanging out just a bit further and steeper. Had to be a mile+ and steep ground. They logged with a little tiny madill 071. Wish I had some video of the old stuff our local guys did with the big skagits.
@Skeans1 (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=37446) Thanks for the info
Quote from: nativewolf on January 22, 2019, 07:46:57 PM
Mike pretty soon you are going to be a business magnate there.
From what I've read about Mike, he'd like that. I don't know if there's a special distinction between a "Business Magnate" and a regular one- but if the Business kind attracts Iron and Steel like a regular one, Mike would be very successful with all that extra material to work with. I heard that Magnates stick to Iron and Steel.....
Quote from: olcowhand on January 23, 2019, 05:33:19 PM
Quote from: nativewolf on January 22, 2019, 07:46:57 PM
Mike pretty soon you are going to be a business magnate there.
From what I've read about Mike, he'd like that. I don't know if there's a special distinction between a "Business Magnate" and a regular one- but if the Business kind attracts Iron and Steel like a regular one, Mike would be very successful with all that extra material to work with. I heard that Magnates stick to Iron and Steel.....
:D
For more info on mountain logging, check Youtube: "West Coast Logging Alex Esgate". He has good videos showing how skyline logging works, and the equipment they use.
Quote from: quilbilly on January 23, 2019, 10:14:18 AM
Quote from: Skeans1 on January 21, 2019, 11:13:16 PM
This is sure impressive how far they are hanging out.
https://youtu.be/gGLnFeVsroE (https://youtu.be/gGLnFeVsroE)
We were on a job that was hanging out just a bit further and steeper. Had to be a mile+ and steep ground. They logged with a little tiny madill 071. Wish I had some video of the old stuff our local guys did with the big skagits.
A buddy's dad use to run a big old skagit he's told us and showed us the pictures of flying out the older D8's a mile they were impressive machines for their day. Or seeing pictures from the mountain doing the salvage of the old growth having to use the line shovels and the yarders to load the timber.
I'll never keep up with you guys but I enjoy harvesting with this set up.
I bet they start up easy, maybe put out a little methane gas. run on hay and grass. A little attitude now and then.
Quote from: doc henderson on January 27, 2019, 07:49:56 PM
I bet they start up easy, maybe put out a little methane gas. run on hay and grass. A little attitude now and then.
The mare was sure giving attitude today. We harvest our own hay in the summer. SLow, but efficient.
The best part is,if you need to go forward a foot you don't have to get back on and wonder if that was enough.
dustyjay- I'm reminded of an old cartoon comparing horse farming with monstrous agribusiness..."That poor guy has to quit when the sun goes down!"... The money quote...KJV Ecclesiastes 4:6 "Better is an handful with quietness, than both the hands full with travail and vexation of spirit."
Scott B.
What vintage and reach?
Quote from: dustyjay on January 27, 2019, 07:22:09 PM
I'll never keep up with you guys but I enjoy harvesting with this set up.
Reminds me of me and my father years ago. Dad had this theory. It's not how much money you make it's how much you enjoy your work and how much money you have left in the bank on Friday. He had horses and old trucks. Big machines cost lots of money and although they can make good money if you keep them going many went bankrupt. Big money.. lots of pressure and no time to enjoy your work.
Your method doesn't cost anything and most likely one of the most enjoyable ways to log. Dad and I got a lot of satisfaction from it. It's been 45 years and I still work in the wood doing small scale logging mostly firewood. I have a kubtoa tractor with a logging winch and power saws. I keep it simple. https://lostcaper.ca/dad-the-man-the-myth-the-legend/(opens in a new tab) (https://lostcaper.ca/dad-the-man-the-myth-the-legend/(opens%20in%20a%20new%20tab))
Yesterday was the end of the winter Sp/Fir season for me. My method is to get 1000 BF on the landing then make two 500 BF trips to the log yard 6 miles away.
This is the last load.
The mill I used to use closed last year. They would take down to 10 footers. The log yard min length is 12 foot. Makes me wish I had a longer truck. Makes steering interesting when the haul road is icy.
gg
Your woods look like mine,as in snow.
g-man: nice looking stacks--bet you like that grapple!
Unless we get another big freeze, like you g-man, I am done in the woods 'till summer. No problem: my log deck is chocka-block full so I'll be sawing (ash, oak, WP, hemlock--over 100 logs); my landing zone is full with full-length (50' - 75'--lots of dead ash from the "yellows" as my forester call it) so I'll be bucking up and sorting cordwood (mostly) from saw logs, chainsawing rounds and hand splitting rounds into cordwood (gotta stay in shape ;)
All the best, Rob.
Looks like that 440 is working out nicely for you Rob !!!
gg
Looking Good!
Salvage of a large area of windblown timber from the destructive August 2018 windstorm has started along State Highway 55 west of Cadillac, MI. The timber salvage changes the landscape appearance while greatly improving the area's aesthetics, March 2019.
Ron that area took it hard. It's to bad how much standing timber we lost.
Yes, hopefully most of the downed timber can and will be salvaged.
John Deere 700H Crawler and Forwarder parked at the landing of the timber salvage operation, March 2019. The 700H crawler was used to open the snowed in access routes into the windblown timber.
The salvaged timber logging/decking area with a John Deere slasher and harvester parked on site during the afternoon thaw. The logging is done during the early morning frozen ground conditions and then stopped during the early afternoon warm ups so as not to "mud up" the operation. March 2019.
Great hand tools help me with my small scale firewood operation. Man there is some big outfits and fancy equipment but I have a tractor with a winch and logging trailer. Great logging hand tools are a great help to my operation. I have a Kubota l4740 and a wallenstine fx 6500 as well. I also use a logging trailer. Usually I winch the tree to the road then buck up the wood into firewood length peaces. It works pretty good. I find good hand tools are a great help. Good birch hooks, peaveys, etc. Here is a video of my logging hand tools.
Great hand tools I use for my small scale logging operati (https://youtu.be/ahWSFJ1jH10)on
This large commercial timber operator uses a lot of John Deere armor of the largest size for large volume production on this large acreage of wind blown salvage timber, March 2019.
Have to move a lot of trees to pay for that, But I bet it does it well. :)
Quote from: Ron Scott on March 28, 2019, 01:02:47 PM
This large commercial timber operator uses a lot of John Deere armor of the largest size for large volume production on this large acreage of wind blown salvage timber, March 2019.
1210? Or 1510?
1210E
A few from this spring. We're getting some time off this spring for a change, which is alright by me👍
A small sale we cut right off of a highway
A nice second entry red pine thinning
A nice little landing, I tried to put the wood up really neatly because it has to sit until the road restrictions come off. One of the most embarrassing things you can have happen as a forwarder operator is having your end of winter piles fall over because you left too much snow under them. No this has not happened to me😊
Ponsse BuffaloKing forwarder and Ergo harvester all done with this one. Waiting for the lowboy to take them in for spring maintenance.
And finally, another outfit that was working down the road. They are running a JD rubber tire buncher in front of a JD track harvester and a JD forwarder. The forwarder's piles are atrocious, IMO😁
Those some nice looking piles there!! Maybe someday mine will be that nice. I'm usually somewhere in between your piles and the last picture. Never had any fall over YET :D
Barbender, you make nice piles.
Those are beautiful piles. I've had one spring pile tip over. It was a small pile of saw logs, and when I made it, the snowbanks were 6 feet tall, and when the trucker went to grab them, they were almost gone.
Neat piles often reflect on the expected quality and perception of a good logging job. The landing/decking area is usually the first part of a logging job seen by the passerby. ;)
The landing/decking area grows with salvaged timber from the August 2018 wind storm. The timber is sorted into product species and lengths for the best market prices. March 2019.
This small independent logger has been in business for a number of years and has a waiting list of clients in the local area. He uses the simplest of equipment in his operations. Here is a short bunk woodhauler and loader on the landing of one of his current tree length hardwood timber harvests, 9/19.
This logger also uses a 450E John Deere crawler with a grapple on this tree length hardwood harvest operation. 9/19.
You don't see a crawler set up like that every day. Pretty neat.
gg
The 5625sx loading on the landing.
Small Scale CTL ? Thinning produces pole sized fire wood.
gg
Loading onto a small trailer,you can hardly tell you have been there. We use to bring out four foot wood like that.
Quote from: Ron Scott on September 07, 2019, 03:10:35 PM
This small independent logger has been in business for a number of years and has a waiting list of clients in the local area. He uses the simplest of equipment in his operations. Here is a short bunk woodhauler and loader on the landing of one of his current tree length hardwood timber harvests, 9/19.
Interesting, I have never seen a coe with a tri drive let alone that lift axle. The loader is a neat setup.
The 125E skidding tree length. After seeing the above dozer with a grapple I'm thinking about a log arch with a grapple. Looks like an old grapple is difficult to find.
@Puffergas (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=9539)
You might try Young Industries since Esco is pretty much out of business they were the two big players in building the grapple arches.
@Skeans1 (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=37446)
Did they or anybody make a trailer type log cart with a grapple? I don't want to attache it to the dozer just pin it to the hitch. On a budget so it would need to be 3/4 wore out.
At one time wheel arches were used out here but they were the big boys nothing you'd pull with that size of cat. Isn't the whole point of a grapple not needing to exit the machine to set the grapple or in this case I'm imagining a cable grapple?
Might be able to run the controls from the seat of the cat. No winch on the cat.
One issue I can for see is how will all that weight transfer on the hitch? Normally you don't want to use a grapple on a rear final or standard style final cat it applies all the weight onto the final when pulling a turn the best style is a track skidder where the final drive is the high drive style but centered.
I think the tongue of the cart would be lifting up on the cat hitch making the weight on the drive sprocket a bit less. Assuming the weight of the log was too the rear of the cart axle. I was thinking about using a truck axle or a trailer axle from a 40' trailer.
This is a rig I saw in a logging museum near Klamath, OR. An old Cat 30 dozer, one of the earliest Cats, and log arch. Looks to me like the Cat had a winch and they got the log in tight over the arch tracks to keep the tongue weight fairly neutral.
gg
Interesting unit. I can remember when most all the logging was done with cats on the Michigan National Forests back in the early 1960's. Most with open seats, no armor, etc.
Only Bigfoot could reach that high to grab the cable. ;D
I got a book from the local library once that had an extensive section on dozers and logging arches, it was very interesting with tons of great pictures. I wish I could remember the title of it.
@barbender (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=1286),Endless Tracks In The woods by James A. Young and Jerry D. Budy will keep a man looking and reading for hours.
@barbender (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=1286)
@g_man (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=11065)
@Ron Scott (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=2)
@Puffergas (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=9539)
@thecfarm (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=436)
If you ever get the chance to make it out here Camp 18 has tons of those arches still in working condition, even with those you can still stand a cat up on her back end.
I'd like to see it!
You buying lunch at the restaurant? :D :D
@thecfarm (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=436)
The food is pretty good but the coolest part to me is that iron museum that they have outside, where else are you going to see a Washington/Allied Feller Buncher I think of the less then 50 built there's only one maybe two still cutting and then this one.
The 114 unloading some logs at the yard.
Just a tough as nails machine, walks all over a newer 648G3.
@SW Oh Logger (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=27772)
@BargeMonkey (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=24634)
Here's an idea for you guys
https://youtu.be/eGToBy1VFyA (https://youtu.be/eGToBy1VFyA)
Came across this neat landing/decking area along a heavily traveled roadway into a popular winter sports area. This logger will attract new clients with "neatness".
Equipment still in use by the small independent operator; a 5510 Iron Mule Forwarder and a John Deere Cable Skidder on an early 2020 timber harvest.
I think I'd really enjoy operating that way, Ron. A small forwarder and a cable skidder, and hand falling. The problem up here is I don't think we have enough of the type of timber that would make it viable.
This one is operating on National Forest land along a major snowmobile trail which is a designated National Recreation Trail in an area of blow down timber. It is a "light on the land" CTL operation on and along the trail under USFS management.
The cable skidder is primarily being used to pull the tree lengths off of the slopes and out of wetland areas where they are then cut into wood product lengths for removal to the landing/decking area with the forwarder for product sorting.
There is still a need for these small independent operators here, but they are becoming fewer and fewer.
Hate to see this one forgotten.
As to those machines on side hill like that. You never worked on the back side of the South Ridge Road. Up on top of the ridge is flat like your pasture for miles north-south-west. Down over toward the Miramachi river is a big drop, road at the bottom. They worked for their pay in there. Irving contractors. :D :D
The coastal areas of OR, WA and northern CA and BC have typically been clear cut in the past, often with cable logging shows due to steep slopes. Typically called the "West Side", the country west of the Cascade Crest, it is also the area known as Ecopopia. There are more liberal minded people living there. There has been resistance to clear cut logging on the West Side in the last 30 years or so. They have little fire danger and do not seem to recognize the need for logging and thinning like more fire prone areas.
I met with some professors at the U of Washington this summer in the field. We talked about some "new harvest methods". They are mostly derivatives of shelterwood methods. Some seed trees are left after logging. They can be harvested in a step wise fashion to promote more uneven aged stands. I believe this is how we are going to sell the public on logging on the West Side in the future. We also need to make them understand growth rates and carbon sequestration in managed forests compared to the mess that we have now.