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Reverse Roll Quarter Sawing

Started by YellowHammer, December 27, 2016, 01:02:45 AM

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WV Sawmiller

YH,

   Thanks for the advice. I will keep that in mind. Earlier you had posted it was normally not worth the effort to saw less than 24" diameter logs into quartersawn and this  experiment verifies that IMHO. I just needed to practice on my logs and that was about as big as I had to work with. It showed the procedure works fine and I now have a better understanding and more confidence about the clamping. Even on pretty small whittled down cants the clamps held.
Howard Green
WM LT35HDG25(2015) , 2011 4WD F150 Ford Lariat PU, Kawasaki 650 ATV, Stihl 440 Chainsaw, homemade logging arch (w/custom built rear log dolly), JD 750 w/4' wide Bushhog brand FEL

Dad always said "You can shear a sheep a bunch of times but you can only skin him once

MAF143

I have read this thread a while back and have been wanting to try it.  

A few weeks ago we had a large Pin Oak blow down over by the old horse stables and it just missed the corner of the building.  It is 4' dbh but was hollow and snapped off.  It's a very limby tree but I was able to get a couple of 5' sections of trunk about 15" diameter out of it to play with on the mill.  I was able to try the reverse roll method on it and got some interesting looking boards.  I know the Pin Oak isn't like the White Oak, but for my first experiment I didn't want to jump in with both feet.

Overall I viewed this as a successful experiment and am looking forward to trying some larger Red and White Oak later when I get a chance.  Our mill is totally manual so I don't think I want to get too ambitious.  I did get a nice slab and I think it will end up as a live edge coffee table with live edge legs if I can get it dried successfully.



 



 



Always having a great day!
Husky 357 self ported, MS 250 MM, MS 362  MM, HM-126, Ferguson TO-35, '04 F-250 wood cuttin' truck, splitter, Woodland Mills Grindlux 4000 sharpener, Vogelzang Ponderosa keeping us warm

YellowHammer

You got some very nice looking boards, some with full fleck, on difficult logs that had lots of grain change.  This is why the RRQS method is superior to conventional blind quartersawing.  There are several boards in the pictures where the grain slope changed drastically, enough to go from partial fleck, to full width fleck, back to partial fleck, all on the same board.  Very good technique.  When you can get the full fleck in the middle of the board and partial fleck on either end, it means you bulls eyed the rays.  If using the conventional techniques that board could have been a miss with only slight fleck in the center with no fleck on the ends.

If you want to get adventurous, when you have logs with such drastic slope and fleck changes, you can make slight toe board adjustments, changing the axial angle of the cant, without adjusting anything else, and take a very shallow skim cut, and actually drive the full fleck to where you want it on the board.  It's a very cool technique, and we did it in one of the logs at the Sycamore Project this year.  I had a photo, can't find it, but we changed the angle of the cant just a degree or two and went from minor fleck to brilliant fleck on a shallow "prospecting" or correction cut and used the new angle to saw out the rest of the cant.

Great work on your first try.    
 
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

MAF143

I had some time last evening to toss the second Pin Oak log on the mill.  This one is about 5' long and still only 16" diameter.  This one was a little trickier to find the pith since both ends were crotchy, the bottom end with 1 large limb and the top kind of splitting 3 ways.  I rolled it around and finally cut it on my best guess to open it up.

I got lucky, I found some good grain and was able to stay with it for the most part.  This was very fun to be able to open up a log that was destined for firewood and get some cool looking boards out of it.  Now to get it dried and figure out what to do with it...  These are kinda small boards and I'll have to figure out how to show them off in some crafty projects.  I didn't make a large slab from this log.  I was more experimenting with thinner slices to see how to stay with the grain.

Thanks to YH and the rest of you here that share all this knowledge so the rest of us can learn some useful skills and techniques.  I'm an eager rookie... LOL

Here are some pix of the second log.  I threw these on the truck and drove over to a woodworking buddy's house to show them off.  I'm amazed that I was able to pull this off...



 

 

 

 

 

 

 
Always having a great day!
Husky 357 self ported, MS 250 MM, MS 362  MM, HM-126, Ferguson TO-35, '04 F-250 wood cuttin' truck, splitter, Woodland Mills Grindlux 4000 sharpener, Vogelzang Ponderosa keeping us warm

YellowHammer

You got some full width fleck on this one.  Good job.  RRQS is actually fun, because it's not a bling sawing technique, but actually lets you stay in control.
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

Brad_bb

Anything someone can design, I can sure figure out how to fix!
If I say it\\\\\\\'s going to take so long, multiply that by at least 3!

YellowHammer

Autocorrect got me.  I meant "not a blind" sawing technique.  
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

WDH

Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5-111, Kubota L2501, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

Bruno of NH

Bling is good when it turns to ching in your pocket 
Lt 40 wide with 38hp gas and command controls , F350 4x4 dump and lot of contracting tools

WDH

See?  I told you that bling was better.  Bruno, now you have the capability to make lots of bling ;D. 
Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5-111, Kubota L2501, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

doc henderson

so a new term for the dictionary!?  "bling sawing: when RRQS and you get a lot of fleck"
Timber king 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.  2007 Chevy 3500HD dually, home built log splitter 18 horse 28 gpm with 5 inch cylinder and 32 inch split range with conveyor powered by a 12 volt tarp motor

Southside

I was thinking the same thing - it IS a bling technique. 
Franklin buncher and skidder
JD Processor
Woodmizer LT Super 70 and LT35 sawmill, KD250 kiln, BMS 250 sharpener and setter
Riehl Edger
Woodmaster 725 and 4000 planner and moulder
Enough cows to ensure there is no spare time.
White Oak Meadows

YellowHammer

Quote from: doc henderson on June 30, 2019, 10:10:53 AM
so a new term for the dictionary!?  "bling sawing: when RRQS and you get a lot of fleck"

I like it. 8) I stand re-corrected on my original auto correct.  :D  

RRQS, the "Bling" Technique.

Takes firewood and turns it into bling.

However, we need to get an Administrator to add RRQS to the dictionary also. @WDH 
do you know of any? :D You know I'm always good for providing a steak dinner for trade. :D :D :D    I'm not above food bribery!
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

WDH

OK, you came up with the technique so you write the definition and I will add it to the Dictionary. 
Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5-111, Kubota L2501, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

doc henderson

we should prob add the phonetic description north and south.  bling, and ba ling.   :) :) :).  sadly we have no accent in Ks.  @WDH   @YellowHammer   @Southside    @Magicman    ;)
Timber king 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.  2007 Chevy 3500HD dually, home built log splitter 18 horse 28 gpm with 5 inch cylinder and 32 inch split range with conveyor powered by a 12 volt tarp motor

YellowHammer

In Alabamian, it's pronouned, "blang".  :D

As in: "Don't mah new truck have a lot of blang on er?  I had'ta paid extry fer it."

Accent? What Accent?  It's Everybody else what talks funny.  

Now I got to think about a definition.  Where did I put those Vitamin B pills....

Hey Alexa, what is..?
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

doc henderson

well, @YellowHammer the elder, in Latin , i believe it is "blingus maximus"  or in Alablatin  "blangus maximus".  or in the deep south "ba lingus maximus"
Timber king 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.  2007 Chevy 3500HD dually, home built log splitter 18 horse 28 gpm with 5 inch cylinder and 32 inch split range with conveyor powered by a 12 volt tarp motor

YellowHammer

Yeah, them fellers down south of me have a tendency to drawl.  Caint hardly understand them. 
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

Southside

It's not just south of you. I was in West Virginia years back with my girlfriend now wife and we went to eat at Shoneys. I ordered a Mtn Dew and the girl asked me if I "wanted any ICE with that", well her drawl was so deep what I heard made me think "boy she is friendly, and in front of my girlfriend no less" the look on my face said it all. Cyrillie spoke up and said "Ice, you want Ice"? After the waitress left Cyrillie looked right at me and said she knew exactly what I was thinking... Oops.   ::)
Franklin buncher and skidder
JD Processor
Woodmizer LT Super 70 and LT35 sawmill, KD250 kiln, BMS 250 sharpener and setter
Riehl Edger
Woodmaster 725 and 4000 planner and moulder
Enough cows to ensure there is no spare time.
White Oak Meadows

doc henderson

@Southside , I have no doubt, despite having been made an honest man, that you continue to be a pain in the ICE.!!!  that is a compliment coming from me!   :D :D :D :D 8) 8) 8) :) :) :) smiley_beertoast
Timber king 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.  2007 Chevy 3500HD dually, home built log splitter 18 horse 28 gpm with 5 inch cylinder and 32 inch split range with conveyor powered by a 12 volt tarp motor

terrifictimbersllc

DJ Hoover, Terrific Timbers LLC,  Mystic CT Woodmizer Million Board Foot Club member. 2019 LT70 Super Wide 55 Yanmar,  LogRite fetching arch, WM BMS250 sharpener/BMT250 setter.  2001 F350 7.3L PSD 6 spd manual ZF 4x4 Crew Cab Long Bed

WDH

Ever since the Sycamore Project, Southside has been fixated on ash :).  Maybe its a Southern Thing that he has?
Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5-111, Kubota L2501, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

MAF143

Started out about rolling, now it's all about ASH...  conversations tend to go there...  :laugh:   :-*
Always having a great day!
Husky 357 self ported, MS 250 MM, MS 362  MM, HM-126, Ferguson TO-35, '04 F-250 wood cuttin' truck, splitter, Woodland Mills Grindlux 4000 sharpener, Vogelzang Ponderosa keeping us warm

Magicman

Quote from: WDH on July 01, 2019, 07:41:23 AMEver since the Sycamore Project, Southside has been fixated on ash
Yup, now he is wanting Ash in his Mtn Dew.  :o
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

Darrel

When I left for church yesterday morning, this was a fine upstanding thread. But somehow the whole thing went south.  :laugh:

Maybe I'm starting to understand why the Britts put the "R" in "Arsh"
Helps avoid making an arsh out of yourself.   say_what
1992 LT40HD

If I don't pick myself up by my own bootstraps, nobody else will.

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