Shop Lighting

[Tom K]

I'm in the finishing stages of my wood workshop and have a lighting question.

In my planning prior to wiring I did a photometric plan based on 50 foot candles (FC) and came out with a lighting layout that I followed and picked out a fixture to match. Before I ordered the fixture I found a discrepancy in the manufacturers info and realized what they were calling a 5,000 lumen fixture is actually only 4,000 lumen, which would give me 40 FC instead of 50 FC. This made me dive back down the hole of how much light is enough, and how much is too much.

I see recommendations for anywhere from 40-100 FC, or 35-150 lumen/sf for shop areas. I checked my current work area and it's only around 10 FC, or 10 lumen/sf. It's not bad but I'm not sure I need 5-10x that amount of light. I'm looking at 2 fixtures, a 4,000 lumen non dimmable and a 5,600 lumen dimmable, the lower output fixture is half the price. Both fixtures I'm looking at are surface mounted 4' strip, wrap around LED's with adjustable light temperatures 3500-5000k.

So, how many foot candle, or lumen/sf do you have in your general wood shop and are you happy with it?

Edit - I had Lumen and Lux switched in my notes.

[btulloh]

I'm in the planning process for shop lighting too.  I've seen the figure 50-150 lumens/sq ft which is a lot different than what you're seeing. Hmmm . . . Maybe someone here can shed some light on the subject. 

Curious about your fixtures that can vary color temp. That could be a good thing but I haven't seen something like that in my limited searching. Can you post a link?

[Tom K]

After I posted I notice I had LUX figures instead of lumen/sf, I fixed that now. Lux is lumen per square meter.

Foot candle numbers are pretty close to the same as lumen/SF

A lot of the wrap around fixtures are adjustable. Lumen level will vary with light color.

C-Lite LED Wrap Light | Wattage and CCT Selectable | C-WR-B-SCCT Series | Up to 5300 Lumens | 120-277V | White

[doc henderson]

so my shop is old enough that I had fixtures for incandescent lighting.  i bought 300 watt bulbs and have 4 switches/circuits to handle the amps.  I have 4 rows of 7 lights for a total of 28 in my wood shop.  it is 34 x 50 feet.  i then went to 400w equiv. compact fluorescent and that was nice to use less energy.  i could have used 1 switch and circuit for the whole shop.  As those started to fail, I now have the hoockie medium based LEDs with four adjustable wings.  I got "daylight" at about 5000 lumens.  small amp draw and very bight.  came to about 15 bucks a light.  hope they last a while.  you have to learn to not look at them directly.  or you see spots.  with 28 sources of light, not a problem with shadows on my work.  I have a 4 foot light bar above my little paint booth.  each circuit has 12 g wire and 20 amp breakers for the record.  

[firefighter ontheside]

When putting new flood lights on the front of a firehouse years ago, I found out that you couldn't compare the lumens from an led fixture to that from a halogen bulb because the led shines all of  its light down where the halogen shines light up on part of the fixture.  That light gets wasted, but still is counted in total lumens.

[Tom K]

Yes, each type of fixture will throw a slightly different light path. Using the right inputs for a photometric plan takes all of that into consideration, along with reflectivity of the walls, ceiling, floor, and work area height.

Thanks for you input Doc. Using Doc's numbers it looks like he was originally at 74 lumen/sf (4500 lumen per 300w bulb x 28 = 126,000 lumen / 1700 sf = 74.11 lumen/sf) With the all new 5000 lumen bulbs he would be at 82 lumen/sf. That's more then I was planning on. 

So Doc, would you say that would be the minimum light level you would want? Too much? Or not enough?

On a side not, Doc would have went from 8400w (70 amps) of power draw with the original lights down to 1260w (10.5 amps) of draw with the new LED bulbs.

[doc henderson]

It is plenty, and not sure you can have too much.  new comers comment on it and at night it looks like a lit up crash site, minus the crash till your eyes adjust. i like no shadows on my work when trying to read a tape or cut something.  yes i feel silly with fours light switches, and even more so as i wired in 3 ways switches to the two door, 25 feet apart.  I really only go in and out of the main door, and the French doors in the middle are for loading and unloading directly into the center  of the shop.  have to train your self not to look up although true of any bulb, but these are bright.  i do have two switches on a single 20 amp braker now.  If you know 3 ways, I wasted some wire going four circuits to the panel and 4 lined between the switches and then for lines of wire going to each line of lights.  now a single switch or 2 three-ways would work.  after you figure out 3 way switches, i guess you just feel obligated to use them.  

[Ljohnsaw]

I hate shadows and belong to the camp you ca never have too much! :D  My work space is 18x26 split into three level in my "crawl space".  First level the ceiling is about 10', middle about 8' and the top is about 6'6".

So I initially installed two rows of three twin bulb 4' florescent fixtures.  Yeah, it was great!  But, in the winter they would take a while to light or sometimes not. :-\

So I took them down and put up at least two old style porcelain single bulb fixtures for each 4' fluorescent.  On the first level with the high ceiling over my metal lathe, I put two twin bulb outdoor flood fixtures.  Initially I loaded them with GE "energy savers" 90 watt incandescent.  With the availability of cheap LED bulbs, they have 100w equivalents in bright white.  Nice!  I have no idea what the total light output is, but it's plenty!

[Old Greenhorn]

You brought to mind a story I had forgotten. I worked for a company that bought a warehouse across town. It was a blank building and we spent a year on interior construction. The boss GC'd and designed it. Mezzanines, clean rooms, new 480 power lots of fancy new tech. He got the best of everything including state of the art lighting. When we finally moved in and got settled, a lot of the guys were complaining that ot was too bright and they were all getting headaches. Everybody wore a hat with a brim to shield their eyes. Finally they called in a lighting engineer and he said they were the wrong lights and way too bright. Ripped them all out and replaced. No problems or complaints after that, but a rough first couple of months. One of the guys kept sunscreen in his tool box as a joke and would offer it to visitors. :D

[doc henderson]

well there is always someone!   :D :D :D

[Old Greenhorn]

The boss was right proud of those lights but after a while even he was going home with a headache every night and his eyes started bothering him a lot. The prior building was kind of darkish and he was trying to fix that and he did but nearly made everyone fo blind. :D

[peakbagger]

I was touring a large beverage distributor warehouse. Every LED light is on an occupancy sensor. The warehouse is pitch black until you step through the door, the lights then light up above your head and then they follow you through the building turning on and turning off as you go. Its kind of creepy initially but we got used to it. The plant engineer can also remotely address sections of the building and adjust the overall light levels, he had a daytime setting and a nighttime setting.

[Tom King]

With good reviews from people I trust on a woodworking forum, I bought these to put up in the mechanic shop.  Sorry, I haven't had a chance to get them up yet, so can't really comment on how good they are.

It seems little sense to buy tube lights of any kind any more.  

Barrina LED Shop Light, 4FT 40W 5000LM 5000K, Daylight White, V Shape, Clear Cover, Hight Output, Linkable Shop Lights, T8 LED Tube Lights, LED Garage Light 4 Foot with Plug (Pack of 10) - - Amazon.com

[Don P]

It looks like I got the 2200 lumen version of those at the same 5000k color temp. They work fine, it is a bright white. I have wondered what is considered "correct" for color.

[21incher]

My shop is small and I have 20 of the porcelain fixtures with 1600lm LED bulbs that have a 90+ CRI. Then I have fluorescent fixtures over my table saw and workbench. All tools have a swing arm lamp with a high CRI 1600lm led. Then I have 4 large LED video spotlights over my bench for making videos that have a color range from 2000 to 6000 and are dimmable they also adjust the color temp to work with my camera and remove the color problems leds create in videos. Also some big LED video panels that can be used at any machine to reduce shadows. As you get older and cataracts you appreciate more light and the higher CRI rated bulbs are the closest to incandescent color temperature. I have those 4 panel flex lights in my pole barn and the quality of light from mine is terrible for working.

[rusticretreater]

In my current 17' x 25' 2 car garage, I have two 7000 lumen led panels and two old florescent fixtures.  Its pretty bright and I have no real issues.

I am currently wiring my garage/workshop, a 30x40 metal building with 12 foot legs and open arch trusses.  There are braces at 45 degrees at each end of the truss.  The building will be made into two 20x30 halves by building an internal wall.  In each shop I will be hanging 7000 lumen panels on the braces creating 45 degree angles of light from both sides with an 18000 lumen light centered above, giving 32,000 lumens.  That works out to 53.3 lumens per sqft.

The lights in the garage area will be offset towards the center wall, hopefully allowing them to shine under hoods of cars somewhat.  In the workshop area, the lights will be centered in the workspace.  I also have some halogen work lights on stands.  I hope that will be good enough.

[Tom K]

Thanks for all the input guys. Luckily I'm still young-ish so lighting levels don't affect me that much.....yet. 

I do have 3 circuits wired in, a 3 way to both man doors with a hand full of general purpose lights, a block on the "work" end, and another block on the wood storage end. 

Some of the lights I've been looking at are also linkable so it would be somewhat easy to add more later. 

I should stop out to the cabinet shop at work and check what those light levels are just for a reference. 

Most building uses are pretty prescriptive on lighting levels, it surprised me how much it varied for wood shops.

[btulloh]

When I work with walnut or some dark jungle wood the lights get dimmer.  Hmmm . . .  

[Walnut Beast]

The lamp that makes up the majority of T5 lighting sales is the 54-watt T5HO, which produces 5,000 lumens. T5HO lamps emit more lumens per lamp than T8s or T12s. In fact, one T5HO lamp emits the light output of two T8 lamps.  

To get absolutely great lighting I would put 150,000 lumens in a 33X 50 ' area 

[Walnut Beast]

I have High output T 5 lights that are 5,000 lumens each in fixtures of six bulbs. One fixture is 30,000 lumens. They are and have been absolutely trouble free. Flip a switch on at any temperature and instant bright light. I have 10 fixtures of 6 bulbs that are open with a mirror back for a total of 300,000 lumens. Like all EPA stuff they are phasing these out. So stock up or they are making a direct LED replacement that's compatible T5 HO fixtures. One note if you have lower ceilings and all white in the shop that makes for brighter light

[kantuckid]

When I relighted my shop from the old fat tubes to a newer fixture and tube choice I considered LED's and went with T-8's as I like their light best. My newer, used old tubes we use up in our basement. White shop surfaces with lots of windows gives me light I like.
 ADV.com my motorcycle place has LED threads with hundreds of posts if you have a few idle days to read about LED's :D
Those huge numbers of life hours they are supposed to have-read up on that notion. The testing that leads to the fantastical numbers has not been done as you'd think. 

[Tom K]

Yeah, I find it amusing that a light is rated for 100,000 hours. That's 11 years at 24hrs a day, there has to be a whole lot of "theoretical" in that testing. 

I'm slightly limited in my light choice as I want them to be a surface mounted fixture, and to fit between the ribs of the liner panel in the ceiling. I'm still looking at fixtures, but it seems like around 6000+/- lumen is about max for that type of fixture. I'm also limited in mounting height since my ceiling is only 11'-4", most of the higher output fixture required a higher mounting height.

[Larry]

The more sources of light one has the less shadows.  One of my better ideas was using white corrugated tin for my ceiling.  It really reflects the light.

When I converted to LED's about 6 years ago I tried different ones.  I ended up liking the daylight 5,500K and higher bulbs the best.  I also tried clear and frosted bulbs, settled on frosted as the clear are too bright when looking at them directly.  My shop is really bright but I've noticed the light dimming slightly over the years.  Partly because a few of the individual LED's in a bulb die, and I suppose the light intensity decreases over the years.  I also need to wipe dust off the bulbs about once a year.  Surprising how much difference this makes.

Energy cost's are something to consider.  When I converted from fluorescent to LED's my electric bill dropped $20 a month.  The reduced cost paid for my conversion in a couple of years.

Even though I have great lighting I still put in task lighting over most of the machines and bench's.

You can look up shop lighting articles in the Fine Woodworking index online and maybe read a few for free.  Most are dated being before LED's.

[Walnut Beast]

Larry is right on the money of the best light spectrum. Mine are 6500k.  
Like I said a T5 54 watt High Output are going to be tough to match at 5,000 lumens per bulb. You put one of those low profile fixtures with mirror back of six bulbs I guarantee you won't be thinking about light problems. 

[Crusarius]

I do not understand how you guys can tolerate the blue light of 5000k+ temperatures. I prefer the 4000k it gives a much more "white" light and frosted bulbs is the only way to go. I would not even consider unfrosted after working in a building that had them. they were terrible.

If you need to fit in between trusses or floor joists look at some LED panels. they really are the nicest thing I want