Hey everyone, I've been a long time reader of the FF but finally just signed up. I recently bought an old farm in Northern Maine (176acres), from what I hear it hasn't been farmed since the 1950s so there is a lot brush that is taking over my fields. It grows like a Weed and everytime I go up there it seems like I have less and less field. I've been told the locals call it Moose Brush, but I don't know how accurate that name is, they also say the only way to get ride of it is to dig it up. Has anyone else had this problem and is there an easier way of getting ride of it, because there is alot of it and it would take years to dig it all up. The stems of the bush are red. So thanks for reading and any help would be greatly appreciated.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/18089/Bush.jpg)
Bear,welcome to the forum.I'm surprised I don't have it on my land if it's that much of a bother.I would kinda doubt digging it up would rid of it,unless you dig up 100 yards all the way around it.Leave one little root and it would come right back.Than you would have to dispose of what you dug up.Have to burn it to get rid of it,I would think.Dump it some place else and it would grow there.From the way you are talking Round Up would cost a lot to use.I usually spend at least $100 on Round Up to keep the bushes and poison ivy down here each year.I've have not found one bush,on my land,that I could not kill if I kept mowing it every 2-3 weeks with a lawn mower.From the way I read this,you are not living there.I would at least bush hog it to keep it from growing more.Must be someone up there with a bush hog for hire.Good luck.
By the way,I suppose this has some trees on it.Thinking about a sawmill?
Sounds a bit like red osier dogwood to me. I've got the same problem ,bush hogging doesn't kill it, it just sets it back then comes back bushier :-\. Round-up, then find a local farmer to till and put down a cover crop.
Maybe he would do it for free if you allow him to take off the hay for free (for a couple years).
Sounds like you found a slice of heaven 8) ;D.
More pics please :)
Steve
thecfarmer- I'm actually buying a bush hog this weekend and heading up there to cut them back alittle at least try and keep them from spreading more. I'm definitly thinking of a sawmill, i've been researching them and I think i'm going to start out with the LT15, so i've started the special savings acount so hopefully next summer i'll be able to afford one. Thanks for the help
Wannabeonetoo- I'll try the round up when i headup there and see what happens. I'm heading up there this coming week to do some work to my cabin, and do some bush hogging. So i'll post some more pictures when i return. Thanks your the help to.
Bear,
Those herbacides usually work best when the plant is in a strong growing period.
If the plants are still green, it may not be too late to cut them, and paint high concentration Round-Up on the cut stumps (as soon as possible after they are cut). If they haven't gone totally dormant already, this is usually very effective in preventing resprouting. In fact, the best time of year to do this is usually August to early October here in the Champlain Valley of Vermont. The plants are sending their energy stores back into their roots for the winter, and they send the roundup right on down there too. (You can extend the early October time frame by a bit for species which stay active longer... like the Buckthorn that is taking over my woods.)
This method is very effective against plants which might otherwise resprout and come back even stronger. It is pretty DanG labor intensive, however.
Since brush is a woody type plant round up is not intended to kill it. You can juice roundup up by adding amonium sulfate so the plant takes it in better. Out here, in the spring if you catch the new growth it will generally kill it but you have to douse it and use alot of roundup.
Ive had better luck with Ortho Brush-B-Gone. Not sure how expensive it would be on a large scale.
Quote from: Left Coast Chris on October 11, 2008, 02:42:30 PM
Since brush is a woody type plant round up is not intended to kill it.
Buckthorn is a woody plant (it's a small tree). I've used the technique I described with good success (brush Round-up on the freshly cut stump, during the August - early/mid October time frame). In fact, that is one of the more effective ways of killing it. You do need to use high concentrations: some people recommend 25% glyphosphate concentration. I've found that works OK, but prefer to be in the 30-40% range. If I'm going to put all that labor into it, I don't want to have to go back and hit the suckers later. Using the hardware store 2% solution is a complete waste of time... you might as well just be watering the cut stump. Even the 18% "concentrate" solution the hardware stores sometimes sell is marginal for this use -- you'll have to go back through and re-treat a fair amount of the buckthorn.
I've stayed away from other chemicals. Round Up is about as benign as they come. Basically no effect on mammals, no special protective gear required when applying it, breaks down very quickly on contact with soil. I'm reluctant to get into other stuff that is more hazardous. I've got a very healthy amphibian population that I don't want to destroy (they are VERY sensitive to a lot chemicals), not to mention other wildlife... and oh yeah, two little kids...
Now if I could just get my wife interested in helping out. The process goes a LOT faster with two people working together. One cuts the saplings with a brush saw, or larger trees with the chainsaw the other comes through with the roundup and hits the cut stumps. Working alone you have to keep going back to find where the $#@% I left the roundup, then where's the DanG brushsaw. I spend as much time finding, putting on and taking off equipment as I do cutting and treating.
John Mc
Hi Bear and welcome, I arn't sure of the weed but if your fences are good, you could always give goats a go, we have 600 managing the brush and scrub on our 700 acres, apart from African Lovegrass which we are spraying now the goats do a great job, while returning an an income, even with the Lovegrass they eat the seed head giving us time to get to most of it.
Like others have posted Roundup/Glysophate 360 should do the Job, Roudup is getting costly again >:( have a look at any of the Metosolphuron 600's(Brush Off, Brushkiller etc) or maybe Grazon Extra, these other chemicals will leave you some grass and not totally Neuc everything like Roundup and may provide some residual control.
Hi Bear, welcome on board. Now your a neighbor. :D I know the Presque Isle area.
Looks like red osier dogwood, like wannabeoneto suggested. It grows on any abandoned field, don't matter if it's well drained or marginal ground it seems. I don't know if you have talked to any Christmas tree growers up here to see what they use on it. I know round-up will injure it, but I never yet seen it kill it out. The best way to keep it away is to keep the fields worked. When the dogwood moves in soon you'll get a whole host of other woody shrubs like alder and willow, sumac, hawthorn and choke cherry, then the forest will come back usually starting out with aspen and spruce and some sites ash and black cherry. Depends how far north you are, some of those trees species might not grow there. Well, I guess you can use them to make wreaths or basket weaving if worse comes of it. :D A lot of abandoned lands in northern Maine are also in Soil Conservation Programs. It's too late to spray that roundup now. You might as well be spraying soap. ::)
Hi Bear,
Welcome to FF! We are an hour up north of Presque Isle so we're in the same climate zone. Oh....oh....deja vu.... that was a nightmare for us about a decade ago >:(, & the problem lasted for a good many years until my husband had it with those pesky red bushes! We didn't accurately key them at the time :P, but I believe Swamp Donkey has pin pointed the correct description of those as red osier dogwood. It's a long story as to how he tried to get rid of these persistantly growing species of red dogwood, and bush-hogging them didn't nip them in the bud either, pun intended! :-\ The following year their cut stems sent off more sprouts or off shoots (sorry Swamp Donkey, not sure about the correct terms here). They multiplied! We had an endless supply of that stuff & could have supplied an art craft chain store with lots of red branches but after much soaking of the vines to bend them into position I gave up on that idea. I was so frustrated I think I threw away the red wreath! We 've paid farmers to bush hog & harrow this property. I don't believe he ever tried to eradicate using chemicals because of the wild animals & the bird population that was here. Finally, after years of enduring this hardship in the autumn, my husband had the bright idea to go with a spruce tree program promoted in our state where we paid a small portion of the cost. That was the best investment we ever did! I think having this large field planted in spruce has been the most energy saving, money saving, & time efficient way to go about solving that problem that had persisted for many years! Thankfully, we don't have to hassle with the overbearing red bush problem anymore. A plus is that the spruce bud smell is so good in the spring, even our neighbors have favorably commented about it. ;D BowSaw cuts down a few to make way for select trees to grow in their girth area, he chops the other discarded spruce for the wood pile. We have the best smelling cord of wood around! :D Our forester resides in Presque Isle & he would advise you as to which type of tree species to select that would grow on your soil type, & you may also consider what kind of tree you would like to be sawing in your future milling operation. Will you be sawing lumber for building houses, buildings, railroad ties, lumber for furniture, or whatever else there is a demand for? Hope this is helpful to you. :)
Mrs. BowSaw
Hey Bear,
Welcome to the forum, it sounds like WildDog hit the nail on the head with the goats. I'd say look in your local paper for brush goats if you already have some fencing, then let them loose in the fields. The only thing is they're master escape artists so you definately need good fencing. You would wanna contain them to fairly small areas though and move them around throughout the seasons, if you just let them roam around your 176 acres they will pick and choose what they want, but if you contain them then they'll graze down every last bit of brush and shrubery, leaving the grasses alone. at this point though you would be better off waiting till spring time of next year so it may not be a good option for you. anyways welcome again.
Quote from: Left Coast Chris on October 11, 2008, 02:42:30 PM
Since brush is a woody type plant round up is not intended to kill it. You can juice roundup up by adding amonium sulfate so the plant takes it in better. Out here, in the spring if you catch the new growth it will generally kill it but you have to douse it and use alot of roundup.
Ive had better luck with Ortho Brush-B-Gone. Not sure how expensive it would be on a large scale.
Roundup does a good job on many woody plants, especially as a basal spray after the plants are cut (40% solution, as John Mc noted). However, I usually use Garlon for woody stuff, which contains triclopyr, the same active ingredient as Brush-B-Gon. I also mix in a little 2,4-D which enhances its effectiveness.
Welcome to the forum bear !! as SD said we're neighbors 8)
I get my Round Up Ultra from a friend / salesman that works for Cavendish Farms who sells fertilizers and spray chemicals to the local farmers in this area (northern Aroostook). I live 50 miles north of Presque Isle... I've used Round Up Ultra very successfully on all of the "woody" trees up in these parts... The red oozier dies the first year I apply it, I spray it with a 2 gallon garden sprayer ( only round up is used in that sprayer) while the bush / bushes are actively growing. I've also used it with great success on the nasty hawthorn bushes as well as hazel nut bushes ...
If you want the ph # for my friend send me a PM and I'll hook ya up with him...
I've seen good results from Garlon as well. People brush a mix of Garlon and diesel on the truncks of buckthorn saplings around here and it tends to kill it with high success. It works even without cutting the stem on saplings, just do a basal bark treatment. On more mature buckthorn, it may not be as effective (perhaps because the bark is thicker?)
The only problem with Garlon is, I believe you need a license to buy and apply it here in Vermont (no such restriction on RoundUp/glyphosphate).
John Mc
Just wait until January it'll go back to Texas....
Oh....I see...different bush..
;^)
Good point John Mc - Garlon does not require a license here in Georgia, but laws vary from state to state. You'll have to check into your local regulations.
zopi - :D :D :D
Zopi - you play nice. Remember, he is still your Commander and Chief.
Bruce
Hey everyone thanks for all the replies I did a couple of test areas with diffrent ideas people have thrown out there. Hopefully its not to late into the season for it to be affective. But i guess we'll see what happens in the spring time. I'll keep everyone posted. Pics to come soon.
Thanks Again,
Bear
Quote from: submarinesailor on October 16, 2008, 05:34:17 PM
Zopi - you play nice. Remember, he is still your Commander and Chief.
Bruce
Yeah..uh-huh....Was it George Washington who said, "When we assume the mantle of 'soldier'
we do not set aside that of citizen..
Play nice he says...nowhere in my fitrep does it mention "Nice."
If all that fails maybe I can arrange for a Daisy Cutter. <GRIN>
Hey guys just thought i would put some pictures up of the land and the cabin I'm building.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/18089/Housefromhill.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/18089/landoverhill.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/18089/Bushhogontractor.jpg)
Couldn't think of too many places any better to build a nice camp Bear. You got a great spot. 8)
That is quite the cabin.Looks good.My wife would like the porch. I suppose you can see the field through the opening of the woods?
Yeah that picture is alittle deceiving this is the view from the front porch
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/18089/Viewfromfrontporch2.jpg)
Bear,
that "cabin" your building looks incredible, sure seems like you got your own slice of heaven up there! It looks like there are some saw horses on the porch, does that mean your still working on the inside or is it pretty much finished? thanks for sharing...
Piston
Very Nice Bear ;)
Do you have electricity on site ???
Well the Cabin is a work in progress, the outside is 95% done just need to do the porch roof across the side of the house. The inside is livable with a hot water heater, toilet, and a coil stove. The next big thing for the inside with be the tongue and groove for the ceiling. Once that's up we can do the bathroom on the main level and Kitchen. We do have eletric at the house that was a fun and expensive job. A 1/4 mile access way 30ft wide was cut throw one of the pine grooves. A week of cutting down pine and skidding the big stuff out with my Jeep. It almost made me wish i had put the cabin closer to the road instead of in the middle of the property but now that its done I wouldn't have done it any diffrent even after putting the Half mile driveway in. It was a good thing the property had a gravel bank on it.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/18089/Picture033.jpg)
This is my father loading the dump trailer with the gravel
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/18089/Picture004-1.jpg)
Nice looking place. :)
So talking to a friend at work he told me about what his father did with his Bush Hog he took little nozzles and inserted them into the top of his deck spraying in to the cutting area. He then took a tank and a small electric pump hooked up to a toggle switch. When he would run over brush he wanted killed he'd turn it on and while it was cutting it was also coating everything in the herbicide. Has anyone ever done this, how well does it work?
The herbicide will coat everything under the rotary cutter (brush hog). So wouldn't it kill it all, rather than be specific to the stump of the brush he wanted to kill?
Also, seems it would take a lot more spray, to get the right dose on the stump, whilst coating everything else in the area under the cutter.
Just seems a bit inefficient to me. Maybe others will think more of the idea, or know that it works good.
I've heard of similar ideas on hand-held brush cutters with blades for cutting....run a herbicide onto the blade. But also heard that it flings the herbicide all over the place...and very little on the top of the stump which remains under the blade after cutting.
Bear..nice place but you can make the pics bigger and easier to see. :) :) :)