OldJarheads Milling Thread...

[Peter Drouin]

By the hr , starts when I'm on the job till I leave ½hr off for lunch,

Logs brought here, to cut, The time starts when they drive in to unload them. then starts when I cut the logs in a day or two later.

And if by the bf ,I never scale the logs only the lumber. 

[OlJarhead]

Tahnks guys....

Here's another one:  Umbrella.  Did you just get a patio umbrella and install it somewhere?  It was HOT and the sun was beating down a couple days...and I have another job ;)

[Magicman]

I am probably anal about taking all these things home every night from some secure locations but it is the way I do business.

All of my tools go home with me too.  Even from a secure location.


  
I use the tractor umbrella from Gimplers.

[Bandmill Bandit]

The way I have my tools and equipment set up in the truck bed the only thing the comes off the truck is my shorty cant hook and it sits against my hydraulic box and my truck gets parked off the end of the mill about 10 to 15  yards.

I rarely saw by the BF and I never scale logs for billing purposes.

BF rate generally apply to the lumber I sell and the BF the client leaves the yard with is what he pays for.   

[Jim_Rogers]

Magicman rides every day.
I walk with my mill so I can slide the lumber and slabs off the cant.
I put my umbrella into the upright tube above the engine so it covers the engine and me.
There are picture here if you do a search for umbrella and my name you'll see how it do it.
I take my tools home each day.
I tally as I cut. When it hits the pile I write it down on my clipboard tally sheet.
Total at desk at home in evenings.

I do measure the log but don't scale it. I let the computer do it in the evening.

Keeping track of filling out a cut list is a little time consuming but you need to do that to get the customer his lumber he needs.

My morning set up on the job is not much. But I would include it in my time, when I saw by the hour.

Jim Rogers

[WV Sawmiller]

Jim,

   You mention tallying as you cut. Do you cut standard widths or random? Most of what I cut is random width hardwoods so I would have to measure each board instead of just putting a tick mark in a column.

[Brucer]

From your perspective: you want to recover the operating expenses for your mill, and earn some money for your hours, and earn something to cover your fixed expenses such as depreciation, insurance, etc.

From the customers' perspective: they expect to pay for the wood you produce.

The problem is one of perception. The customers will wonder why they are paying you to maintain the mill when you aren't producing any wood for them. You wonder why you should not be paid for your time, even if it's maintenance work.

I solved this problem by charging $75 per hour, as recorded on the hour meter. I will probably up it to $85 per hour this season. The customers see they are paying you for sawing. You collect enough money in a days sawing to cover all your time and expenses.

As for setup time, I arrive on site, carry my cant hook and box of milling tools to the mill, check the oil, and start the engine. While the engine is warming up, I take the tools are normally use (tape, square, wire brush, crayon). Then I load up the log that's waiting by the mill and start sawing. 10 minutes max.

Keep in mind -- I have a spare fuel tank that I can swap over (and it doesn't matter if my gas engine runs out of fuel, different story with a diesel). No need to top it up in the morning. I leave a sharp blade on the mill overnight. I inspect the mill for loose bolts and bent pieces while I brush it off at the end of the day. Anything that needs fixing gets done before I leave, unless it's major. The blade lube tank gets topped up at the end of the day.

Starting up quickly in the morning and spending a little time cleaning up at the end of the day leaves a better impression than doing it the other way around. It shouldn't matter, but psychologically it makes a difference.

[Ricker]

l agree with Brucer. I charge by the hour when the customer has poor quality logs such as small diameter or crooked ugly stuff. The hourly rate is based on how many bf I could saw if I were sawing good quality logs. Time starts when I load the log on the mill. When you saw by the bf who pays for the time you use when you are doing maintaince. It is a matter of perspective.

[Jim_Rogers]

Jim,

   You mention tallying as you cut. Do you cut standard widths or random? Most of what I cut is random width hardwoods so I would have to measure each board instead of just putting a tick mark in a column.

When I was cutting hardwoods for a flooring company, he wanted the widest pieces I could get from his logs. But I never did partial inches. I would saw on the full inch in width. But I would saw odd widths instead of all evens like softwood. So my tally sheet would have 4s, 5s, 6, 7s, 8s, 9s on up. And then I'd just do a tick mark on that row.
It really didn't make much sense to me, because he would dry the lumber in his home made kiln chamber in his barn. Then send it out to a millwork company to have it planed and tongue and grooved. It would come back in standard flooring widths. So at some time that place had to "trim" off all the wider ones to their standard widths, so that they could run it through their four side machine.

Jim Rogers

[Bandmill Bandit]

Marty;

Don't you think it would be a really good idea to have a Woodmizer umbrella for a Woodmizer?

Make it so it will mount on the seat or on the console.

I'd be all over that like orange on a Woodmizer.

My system works pretty good with a patio umbrella but it could be just a bit bigger. I like MM's umbrella set up too but it needs an orange Woodmizer tarp with Woodmizer stamped on it in nice big letters

[WV Sawmiller]

Marty;

Don't you think it would be a really good idea to have a Woodmizer umbrella for a Woodmizer?

Make it so it will mount on the seat or on the console.

I'd be all over that like orange on a Woodmizer.

My system works pretty good with a patio umbrella but it could be just a bit bigger. I like MM's umbrella set up too but it needs an orange Woodmizer tarp with Woodmizer stamped on it in nice big letters

For those of us who don't have the fancy ride along models I have a prototype shown below. WM will have to produce them in WM Orange. I guess the other sponsors can produce them in their colors. Or the FF can produce them in all colors and let the buyer select the color needed to match his mill.



 


 
For the safety conscious members it can be attached to your hard hat.


 
On cloudy days when not needed you can quickly remove it from your hard hat with no tools required.

[Chuck White]

I copied my umbrella mount from Forum Member, Red Clay Hound.

The mount is on the sawhead mast, just behind the operators console!

[Brucer]

Many years ago a guy brought me a beach umbrella that had a broken mount on the bottom. I stuck it down the vertical mast closest to the control panel and it worked great -- until a heavy wind came along and lift it up out of the mast. The thing then floated sideways right out over the highway that ran below the mill. I never heard any squealing brakes so I guess it didn't do any harm.

[Jim_Rogers]

Many years ago a guy brought me a beach umbrella that had a broken mount on the bottom. I stuck it down the vertical mast closest to the control panel and it worked great -- until a heavy wind came along and lift it up out of the mast. The thing then floated sideways right out over the highway that ran below the mill. I never heard any squealing brakes so I guess it didn't do any harm.

That happened to me as well, that is that the umbrella floated away on a stiff uplifting wind. So I got it back from my yard and secured it to the top rail between the two upright tubes with a bungy cord. Now it can't fly away.

Jim Rogers

[OlJarhead]

A few more pics I found that the customer took


Milling 2x4's


Hard at it with a decent sized pine.


Small 20 footer on the deck


110 year old pine ready for the mill.  She counted the rings.

[Magicman]

I am not familiar with your SimpleSet, but practice and you will find the starting height measurement for splitting the cant.  That way you will not have to make that trim cut.  Your method insured accuracy, just had to make one more cut.


 
I do not have a closeup picture but my "cheatsheet" is attached to the left side of my Setworks cover.  It gives me the starting point for many different thicknesses so that I reach my bottom targeted board/cant at the correct cutting height. 

But Accuset equipped sawyers have it easy.   :-\

[OlJarhead]

Simple Set allows just two depths.  So for example if you want to cut 2x's and 4x's (to split cants into 3 or 4 beams to make 2x4's out of for example) you set the simple set to 2 1/8 and 4 1/8 *for full cut* and that's it.  If you then want to split a cant 3 ways you need to add 1/4" to the total.  So for 3 cants each 4 1/8" wide you'd have to have a cant that is 12 7/8" deep.

[Jim_Rogers]

(4", then 8 1/8" then 12 1/4")
I use this one all the time making full dimension 2x4's
Jim Rogers

[OlJarhead]

Possibly the next job.  7 logs is actually 15 and some (most) will need to get bucked up into shorter stuff.  Nothing very big but positioning isn't optimal and the mill will probably have to backed into the site perpendicular to the logs.

Customer doesn't seem to have a tractor to move the logs either so it will have to be done with cant hooks or 4x4's.  The logs are uphill from the site the mill will probably go so it may not be too hard to turn them to the mill.

Either way, if they want them done I think 2 days will likely get it done.

[Peter Drouin]

All by the hr I hope.

[OlJarhead]

All by the hr I hope.

Oh absolutely!

[Magicman]

Check your tongue weight.  Several times I have backed or pulled into a site, disconnected, and swung the sawmill around by hand.  It may not work for this site, but there will be a time when it may be the best setup option.  That trick will also work if you need to turn around on a narrow road.  My tongue in the tow mode weighs less than 100 lbs.

[OlJarhead]

Yup, did that on the old mill once or twice and can see it being done with this one.

This site is slightly uphill from the road, about 40 yards or so, and just about the right amount of room to pull in to the left perpendicular to the logs, back up and pull down so you can back in, again perpendicular.  Pulling straight in so more or less parallel is doable but there is some water running down the hill.  Not much but enough to make it muddy and not ideal.  Best bet is to move the logs me thinks.

Not much room to maneuver but there could be.  They just need a tractor in there to clean up some brush from an old burn pile and I could turn around but that's the problem:  no tractor.

[WV Sawmiller]

Check your tongue weight.  Several times I have backed or pulled into a site, disconnected, and swung the sawmill around by hand.  It may not work for this site, but there will be a time when it may be the best setup option.  That trick will also work if you need to turn around on a narrow road.  My tongue in the tow mode weighs less than 100 lbs.

Did that back in November at a job just down the road. Sawing site was the bend of a narrow mountain road with no good place to turn the mill around while connected to the truck. Had a couple of big young helpers so just dropped the mill and went up and turned my truck around, just had room to get the truck by it pointed downhill. We spun the mill around in the road by hand to point the arms toward the logs and had a truck above and below it. If the log was not lined up with the mill we pulled it with whichever truck was pointed in the right direction. You do what you have to do to get the job done.

[Magicman]

My last two setups have been on very uneven ground requiring two 2X10's under the side support wheel.  Both repeat customers but you never know what might be next.