Peavey-cant hook ???

[Jeff]

The reason you don't see them on axes and malls is for the cushion that wood provides due to impact. You don't chop with a canthook.

On logrite canthooks and peaveys, the handles are really secondary to the perfected hook geometry. The hooks bite so well, you better have a strong handle.  Again, there are some of you that sit back and say, Ah he's just pumping them up because they are a sponsor. To that, I'll tell them to their face "You don't know jack".   I worked in the sawmill and the woods my entire life. I've broken several tools with wooden handles. Mostly because when they get used every single day, they tend to get weakened by the elements. I'm a guy who has had a set of double blackeyes due to a woodhandled canthook letting go. I bought the first logrite tool, a hookaroon as a fluke. MY back was out at a logging show, and I needed a cane. I bought it because it was the perfect length.  When I took it back to the mill, it ended up getting fought over, on who was going to use it by the tailers on the green chain. They all had wooden ones up until that point. I bought another one just so there was no messing around. We broke a handle on the canthook we kept back by the debarker. Probably the 10th one we had in 20 years. They get used constantly adjusting big logs that didn't want to go down the conveyors. They break.  We replaced that one with a logrite. in 2006, just before I left the mill.  I ran into one of the guys that still works there the other day, and we were talking about the forum, and the sponsors we have now, and he mentioned that they are still using that logrite canthook.

[loggah]

I have used the logrite a few times and i just didn't like it. I agree they are rugged and work,now if they made one with a nice tapered handle like i like i would buy one !! My brother has one at his bandmill.

[mesquite buckeye]

The reason you don't see them on axes and malls is for the cushion that wood provides due to impact. You don't chop with a canthook.

On logrite canthooks and peaveys, the handles are really secondary to the perfected hook geometry. The hooks bite so well, you better have a strong handle.  Again, there are some of you that sit back and say, Ah he's just pumping them up because they are a sponsor. To that, I'll tell them to their face "You don't know jack".   I worked in the sawmill and the woods my entire life. I've broken several tools with wooden handles. Mostly because when they get used every single day, they tend to get weakened by the elements. I'm a guy who has had a set of double blackeyes due to a woodhandled canthook letting go. I bought the first logrite tool, a hookaroon as a fluke. MY back was out at a logging show, and I needed a cane. I bought it because it was the perfect length.  When I took it back to the mill, it ended up getting fought over, on who was going to use it by the tailers on the green chain. They all had wooden ones up until that point. I bought another one just so there was no messing around. We broke a handle on the canthook we kept back by the debarker. Probably the 10th one we had in 20 years. They get used constantly adjusting big logs that didn't want to go down the conveyors. They break.  We replaced that one with a logrite. in 2006, just before I left the mill.  I ran into one of the guys that still works there the other day, and we were talking about the forum, and the sponsors we have now, and he mentioned that they are still using that logrite canthook.

Hey Jeff.

I would like to say one thing that is nice about wooden handled tools, compared to steel. There is a feel to the wood, that if you pay attention to, will help you both not break the handle or hurt yourself. When the wood starts to bend appreciably, you are overstressing the tool.

Any peavey or cant hook can let go of a log either from tearout, bad bite, or bark letting go. If you are hitting yourself in the face or anywhere else, you are applying force incorrectly. After getting popped enough times, I have altered my body positioning so that if the hook lets go, it won't hit my body. Same idea as pointing a knife away from yourself when cutting.

That said, I am going to try one of the logrite peaveys just to see......

;D 8) 8) 8)

[Jeff]

B.

One more thing that can be fact checked. I don't believe in logrite tools because they are a sponsor. They are a sponsor because I believe in logrite tools.  Kevin came to me years ago, and his words, not mine "begged" to become a sponsor. I think you should be able to find that quote with a search here. But since that day, Logrite Tools has been a loyal sponsor of the Forestry Forum and has a big part along with our other sponsors, is the reason we are still here, everyday, for all of you.

mesquite buckeye, Logrite tools are not steel handled. Do you have one? If not, you are in no position to critique or compare.

Also.

If you are hitting yourself in the face or anywhere else, you are applying force incorrectly.

You don't know what the heck you are talking about, if you are referring to me hitting myself in the face. Have you ever worked in a commercial sawmill operation? You were not there, and you don't know the details, or have any idea of why we had to use canthooks on the debarker the way they were used.  You are telling me that having a wooden handle fail is operator error? Could be, in my case it was not. I've been hit twice. The other time was when the end of a far log hit the debarker head, hitting the next log inline that I was trying to pry up to let the first log go that was being held by the second log in the same conveyor. The first log slapped the second log, jerking the handle out of my hands and slapping me in the gourd. You can tell the log it was applying the wrong force if you like.

[mesquite buckeye]

B.

One more thing that can be fact checked. I don't believe in logrite tools because they are a sponsor. They are a sponsor because I believe in logrite tools.  Kevin came to me years ago, and his words, not mine "begged" to become a sponsor. I think you should be able to find that quote with a search here. But since that day, Logrite Tools has been a loyal sponsor of the Forestry Forum and has a big part along with our other sponsors, is the reason we are still here, everyday, for all of you.

mesquite buckeye, Logrite tools are not steel handled. Do you have one? If not, you are in no position to critique or compare.

Also.

If you are hitting yourself in the face or anywhere else, you are applying force incorrectly.

You don't know what the heck you are talking about, if you are referring to me hitting myself in the face. Have you ever worked in a commercial sawmill operation? You were not there, and you don't know the details, or have any idea of why we had to use canthooks on the debarker the way they were used.  You are telling me that having a wooden handle fail is operator error? Could be, in my case it was not. I've been hit twice. The other time was when the end of a far log hit the debarker head, hitting the next log inline that I was trying to pry up to let the first log go that was being held by the second log in the same conveyor. The first log slapped the second log, jerking the handle out of my hands and slapping me in the gourd. You can tell the log it was applying the wrong force if you like.

Wow.

Didn't mean to start a war. smiley_argue01

I have been running a mill  for many years. It is not a big commercial mill, just a woodmizer.

Clearly, it has nothing to do with the tool if the log goes flying. I'm just talking about using the tool for adjusting or turning logs. I don't think it matters which tool you are using if that happens. Clearly, you can get killed at an operating mill and it doesn't have to be your fault. I've heard the stories of guys falling into the hog....

Anyway, having not seen the log rite tools, I don't know how they are constructed......

Have a good day anyway.

[mad murdock]

I have not used a logrite tool to date, but I can say that they deserve thier spot at the top IMO, they see the value in a good product and keep it going.  Case in point, Blue Creeper!  I am a mechanic for my day job, and I first bought the Rust Reaper penetrant.  Blue Creeper now, I am grateful to Logrite for taking on the product and keeping it out there. It is the best penetrant I have ever seen or used, bar none.  I am sure that their logging tools have just as much or more thought that has gone into their engineering design and manufacture.  I know that there will come a time when I will need new forestry tools, and I will be looking to Logrite for sourcing those needs when the time comes.

[SwampDonkey]

I don't want to bash anyone and really don't care what others use for tools. Some people are set in their old ways, and others are set in new ways. ;D

I've worked with wooden handled peaveys on log yards. The handles always came up broke. But also, as sure as the world spins, if you set a peavey down the hired help would run over it even if the yard was 10 acres big. :D My uncle used wooden handled peaveys and axes, all hop-hornbeam handles and his uncle was always replacing with new wooden handles. He would always tell my uncle that he didn't know how to use either right. The truth is, he did know how to use them. They were for work, and they were always failing when needed to get a task done. Sure they last awhile, and then snap. It's a pain to have to replace handles all the time. The reason I'll never buy a wooden handled hammer again. I've got 3 or 4 hammer heads in a box. But I bought a full steel hammer 20 years ago and I go get my steel hammer. I'm not going to fix any of those other hammers. ;D

Sure you can hang your peavies and hooks on the barn wall to enjoy, and watch nostalgic videos of the old timers using push poles on log drives. That's all fine and dandy. However, I doubt much they used many peavies while cat walking on flows of logs. Now that would be interesting. My grandfather log drived and a peavey was not used on water. What they used here was a black spruce pole with a spike on the end. It would be long and light weight (once dry) and strong.

I've had to move a  large 24" x 12 ' (about 800 lb) spruce out of my path before, thankfully down hill, so I could get to a work area. I had a Logrite to do it. A wooden handled peavey wouldn't have the strength or the leverage. 

[JohnM]

On the statue of Paul Bunyon in Bangor (which they made about 1/16 scale, by the way  :laugh: ) he is carrying an axe and a peavey.

Here ya go, Okra.  Only had to go Brewer but couldn't resist crossing the bridge for a photo op. ;D  That's as close as I could get, they've got the whole place fenced off while they build the new auditorium.  That's part of it in the background.  They opted to go with a dome this time as opposed to an inverted roof like the last time. :


 

JM

[Jeff]

No war on my part, just the appropriate, honest and experienced response to your post. I do get a bit excitable on this issue, because it has come up before. Always, the person arguing for the wood handled tools do not have everyday, day in and day out experience with both. Everyone that has logrite tools, and uses them regularly, knows how vastly superior they are to everything that was previously available. It also seems, that because I own the place, that my position on Logrite is always dismissed as protecting or fluffing up a sponsor. That really is not fair to me, so yea, I get a bit excitable.  That's no reason to say there is a war.  I also felt the need to defend myself when you said I got hit in the face because I was using the tool in the wrong way.

I'll also add, that the type of aluminum handles that LogRite uses, so have give to them, without bending. Not unlike a wooden handle. When you get to the point where a Logrite tool is flexing, it is still way within its limits, and far past the limits of a wooden handle. 

[mesquite buckeye]

I don't want to bash anyone and really don't care what others use for tools. Some people are set in their old ways, and others are set in new ways. ;D

I've worked with wooden handled peaveys on log yards. The handles always came up broke. But also, as sure as the world spins, if you set a peavey down the hired help would run over it even if the yard was 10 acres big. :D My uncle used wooden handled peaveys and axes, all hop-hornbeam handles and his uncle was always replacing with new wooden handles. He would always tell my uncle that he didn't know how to use either right. The truth is, he did know how to use them. They were for work, and they were always failing when needed to get a task done. Sure they last awhile, and then snap. It's a pain to have to replace handles all the time. The reason I'll never buy a wooden handled hammer again. I've got 3 or 4 hammer heads in a box. But I bought a full steel hammer 20 years ago and I go get my steel hammer. I'm not going to fix any of those other hammers. ;D

Sure you can hang your peavies and hooks on the barn wall to enjoy, and watch nostalgic videos of the old timers using push poles on log drives. That's all fine and dandy. However, I doubt much they used many peavies while cat walking on flows of logs. Now that would be interesting. My grandfather log drived and a peavey was not used on water. What they used here was a black spruce pole with a spike on the end. It would be long and light weight (once dry) and strong.

I've had to move a  large 24" x 12 ' (about 800 lb) spruce out of my path before, thankfully down hill, so I could get to a work area. I had a Logrite to do it. A wooden handled peavey wouldn't have the strength or the leverage. 

We sure stirred up the hornets with this one. :D :D :D

I think in all this there is a major philosophical difference about what tools are and aren't for.

With my upbringing, if you broke a tool, it meant that afterword you would have to figure out how to get a job done without it. Maybe it is just depression think, but I think there is more to it than that. I remember growing up seeing different farmers tool sheds. You would see lots of them filled with broken tools, rusty tools, abused and bent tools. Then you would see the tools of somebody who really took care of his tools. 20 year old wooden handles, polished from work, little or no rust on the steel, and so on. This really impressed me. They all got the job done, there is just a difference in the attitude and tool bill.

Sometimes there is no choice but to use whatever tool is at hand to improvise a solution to a problem. Granted, and the tool may have to be sacrificed to solve the problem.

Usually there is a choice, however.

An axe is not a bolt cutter.

A peavey isn't a pry bar.

A screwdriver isn't a chisel.

and so on.  Just some thoughts
Tools will last indefinitely if not abused.

[Jeff]

I can think of at least a half dozen towns in Michigan that huge Huge Paul Bunyan Statues as well as Babe in at least one.  We arranged a rescue party for Paul a few years ago when we had feared he had been taken hostage in Saint Ignace.

[Jeff]

A peavey is a prybar. They were designed with the ability to pry. They are meant to pry logs.

[mesquite buckeye]

No war on my part, just the appropriate, honest and experienced response to your post. I do get a bit excitable on this issue, because it has come up before. Always, the person arguing for the wood handled tools do not have everyday, day in and day out experience with both. Everyone that has logrite tools, and uses them regularly, knows how vastly superior they are to everything that was previously available. It also seems, that because I own the place, that my position on Logrite is always dismissed as protecting or fluffing up a sponsor. That really is not fair to me, so yea, I get a bit excitable.  That's no reason to say there is a war.  I also felt the need to defend myself when you said I got hit in the face because I was using the tool in the wrong way.

I'll also add, that the type of aluminum handles that LogRite uses, so have give to them, without bending. Not unlike a wooden handle. When you get to the point where a Logrite tool is flexing, it is still way within its limits, and far past the limits of a wooden handle.

So opened up an old wound. Sorry for that. Not my intent.

The Log Rite stuff sounds really good and I intend to try one. I'm sure they can be destroyed by abuse too, no? Just more force needed to do it.

I didn't think you were a shameless promoter. I see lots of comments from people who just love these products. Sounds like a really good and innovative company.

[Jeff]

I'm sure they can be destroyed by abuse too, no?

Certainly.
What they have going for them, is that what you might consider abuse to a wood handled tool, is still within the allowable working limits of the LogRites.   You can have tools, good tools, and better tools. The logrite is the Better Tool.  You might never stick a wood handled canthook under a big log and try to pry it up to but a shim under it on a bandmill, but never think twice about using a logrite to do that very thing.

[mesquite buckeye]

A peavey is a prybar. They were designed with the ability to pry. They are meant to pry logs.

Agreed, but I wouldn't try to lift a conex with one. ;D

[beenthere]

loggah
True Temper was buttoned up shortly after Wilkinson Sword UK bought them out. WS was apparently on a mission to wipe out competition.

[mesquite buckeye]

I'm sure they can be destroyed by abuse too, no?

Certainly.
What they have going for them, is that what you might consider abuse to a wood handled tool, is still within the allowable working limits of the LogRites.   You can have tools, good tools, and better tools. The logrite is the Better Tool.  You might never stick a wood handled canthook under a big log and try to pry it up to but a shim under it on a bandmill, but never think twice about using a logrite to do that very thing.

Understood, and a good point. Do you know the difference in force they will take,  roughly (2X.3X...?)??

[beenthere]

The logrite handles are made to spec, whereas the wood handles cannot be made to an exact (or even close) spec as there is too much variability between and within species as well as trees of a single species. Straightness of grain is but one variable within a tree, as is density and growth rates. All affect bending strength and toughness.
So a bit fruitless to say 2x, 3x for a comparison.

[Jeff]

Beenthere, who knows his stuff, (retired from forest products lab)  said it better than I could.

My answer was, I'm just a happy consumer, not the manufacturer. I'm 300 lbs, over 6 foot and have never bent mine while trying to lift (actually push down and pry up) something I was not strong enough to lift. I was the weak point. I've used mine to lever up a boat and boat trailer to change a tire, when we didn't have a jack, I've used it for all kinds of things.

[mesquite buckeye]

Beenthere, who knows his stuff, (retired from forest products lab)  said it better than I could.

My answer was, I'm just a happy consumer, not the manufacturer. I'm 300 lbs, over 6 foot and have never bent mine while trying to lift (actually push down and pry up) something I was not strong enough to lift. I was the weak point. I've used mine to lever up a boat and boat trailer to change a tire, when we didn't have a jack, I've used it for all kinds of things.

Thanks. Sounds relatively indestructible with reasonable use.

[thurlow]

An axe is not a bolt cutter.

A peavey isn't a pry bar.

A screwdriver isn't a chisel.

and so on.  Just some thoughts
Tools will last indefinitely if not abused.

I suppose next you'll be telling us that your wife doesn't think a table knife can be used as a screwdriver.   ;D

[POSTON WIDEHEAD]

I'm the guy who  uses his wood shop chisels for screw drivers and cleaning bricks.  :D
I've used my Logrite cant hook for moving things I don't even want to talk about for fear of hearing, "ARE YOU CRAZY!"   :D
Short story long.....I could not have done some of the things I do without the handle Logrite uses.
It's just my personal preference, wooden handle don't suit me. 

[mesquite buckeye]

An axe is not a bolt cutter.

A peavey isn't a pry bar.

A screwdriver isn't a chisel.

and so on.  Just some thoughts
Tools will last indefinitely if not abused.

I suppose next you'll be telling us that your wife doesn't think a table knife can be used as a screwdriver.   ;D

Not without me growling at her..... ;D :

8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8)

After I finish the dishes, she finds things for me to fix........ :-[

[Nomad]

     My comments on the peavey/canthook/LogRite issue.  I prefer a peavey unless I'm just turning a cant on the mill.  Then I'd rather use a canthook.
     As to LogRite...  (Keep in mind I'm just a monkey here with no sponsors and no axe to grind.)
     I've been bending a wrench for a living for about 40 years.  And I've bent a lot of 'em.  I've been working with logging tools just about as long.  Up until a few years ago they were all wood handled.
     I collect old woodworking tools and they don't sit on shelves; they all get used.  Many are mostly or all wood.  But I no longer own a wooden handled peavey or canthook.
     I've got half a dozen or so and every one is a LogRite.  I work with 'em every day and I just don't have time for second rate tools.  I don't doubt some traditional wooden handled tools are just as good!  I simply haven't found one yet, and don't intend to go out of my way looking for one.

[bandmiller2]

Only problem with Logrite is their so pilferable.I keep mine in the truck cab with my chainsaw and metal detector.It helps if you spray paint the handle an odd ugly pattern. Frank C.