Frozen logs

Bruno of NH · December 26, 2019, 03:58:57 PM

I have always had a hard time to mill frozen hardwood.
Member 4x4 told me to try the frost notch bands.
Put some frozen hard maple on the mill this afternoon.
They cut great nice and flat.
I'm sold on them in the hardwood.
Anyone having a tough go in the frozen hardwood should give them a go.
4x4 said they didn't work good in softwood on his mill.
I'm going to try them.

moodnacreek · December 26, 2019, 05:32:20 PM

Sawing frozen logs has a lot to do with how wet they where when they froze. Maple is all sap to begin with and when frozen or half frozen it will separate the men from the boys. Other wood is only wet on the outside and all the trouble is with the jacket boards. [the center cant cuts like in warm weather] If you can saw frozen hard maple you are doing very good.

Andries · December 26, 2019, 08:24:45 PM

Quote from: Bruno of NH on December 26, 2019, 03:58:57 PMMember 4x4 told me to try the frost notch bands.
...
They cut great nice and flat.

Bruno; I've been using 4 degree Kasco bands on frozen elm, ash and oak.
They work pretty well, but I'm always open to new ideas . . .
What are 'frost notch' bands? A brand, or profile, or ?
Thanks.

moodnacreek · December 26, 2019, 09:21:30 PM

On the circle saw you use a tooth with a protrusion that stops the swirl of sawdust in the gullet. Another and better method is the frost shank that puts this protrusion farther down in the gullet. This allows the use of cheaper teeth but carbide teeth cannot be used . Before these methods where available you where instructed to use old short narrow teeth kept very sharp with perfect corners. A thin kerf was wanted so the sawdust couldn't get alongside of the saw plate. [where it would refreeze and guide the saw off line] And this is the problem. I'm sure Bruno can explain the tooth style he is using on the bandsaw that stops the swirl and changes the shape of the chips [saw dust]

gmmills · December 26, 2019, 09:30:13 PM

Bruno, Were you using the Munkfors, deck duster, frost notch profile or the Advantage frost notch profile? There are significant differences in both profiles. I know the last time I spoke to 4x4, he had tried both profiles. I think he found the Advantage profile to perform better in his application.

Andries · December 26, 2019, 09:32:46 PM

Quote from: moodnacreek on December 26, 2019, 09:21:30 PM
On the circle saw ... so the sawdust couldn't get alongside of the saw plate. [where it would refreeze and guide the saw off line] And this is the problem.

Ah, ok.
Thanks moodna, that makes sense for the circle saw.
I've often wondered how sawyers in your part of the world deal with partially frozen logs.
Sunny side up would be thawed out. The part of the log in the shade would be like the dark side of the moon - frozen solid.
That kind of frustration would lead to . . .. #%$@!
So sawdust extraction is the key.

Bruno of NH · December 26, 2019, 10:48:55 PM

I got them from DW bands in Pa
There is a notch in the tooth just below the tip.
They have another design but only comes in a wider band.
I run 1.25 these are .050
I will get a picture
Hard maple can be a tough saw sometimes in the summer.

gmmills · December 26, 2019, 11:11:53 PM

The notch being up near the tip is indicative of the Munkfors deck duster profile. Had a local mill owner running this profile on his grade re-saw in tough sawing conditions. He was using 2" .055's. These blades out performed a conventional profile when sawing frozen species of hardwoods native to our region. He also bought them from DW Bands.

Bruno of NH · December 29, 2019, 10:51:55 AM

I'm still running the same band on clean maple logs.
It's still cutting flat and true.
I want to try them in spruce.
I have some to cut coming up.
They are not a fast band like the 747 but if I can cut nice lumber all winter , I will use them till spring and then go back to 747's and 4° as needed.
I can't see a makers Mark on the bands.
I do have to invert them before putting on the lt40 wide.
My plan is to mill all winter on the days it doesn't snow to bad and not colder than -10.

PAmizerman · December 30, 2019, 08:51:24 PM

Anyone have luck with these on frozen hemlock?

Bruno of NH · December 31, 2019, 07:21:11 AM

PA
I will let you know
I'm going to try them

Bruno of NH · January 06, 2020, 11:53:27 AM

Pictures of the frost notch bands 171" × 1.25 × .050

ladylake · January 06, 2020, 12:14:27 PM

How do you sharpen them? Steve

Nebraska · January 06, 2020, 12:58:35 PM

Resembles a "chipsweep" profile I believe Lennox makes.

Bruno of NH · January 06, 2020, 01:11:45 PM

Steve,
I haven't yet
I think DW bands will
I need to check

moosehunter · January 06, 2020, 03:41:24 PM

Last winter I had some trouble with frozen hemlock. Waves at the knots. I went through all of my normal checks and adjustments with no improvement. As a last resort switched from 7° to 4°. Problem solved. Glad I had some 4s in the shed.

mh

GAB · January 06, 2020, 03:56:45 PM

Quote from: Bruno of NH on January 06, 2020, 11:53:27 AM
Pictures of the frost notch bands 171" × 1.25 × .50

Jim:
In both reply #6 and #11 you wrote "bands 171" × 1.25 × .50"
Are you sure about the .50?
GAB

Bruno of NH · January 06, 2020, 05:34:42 PM

GAB,
That's what they told me when I ordered them

GAB · January 06, 2020, 07:14:35 PM

Quote from: Bruno of NH on January 06, 2020, 05:34:42 PM
GAB,
That's what they told me when I ordered them

Jim:
I believe it is said that way, however it is written 171" × 1.25" × .050".
I doubt that your blades are 1/2" thick.
GAB

Stephen1 · January 06, 2020, 08:34:58 PM

Interesting profile, I had a customer ask me to sharpen his blades that looked like that.
He had bought a Clarke mill and the blades came with the mill. I told him to go buy some WM blades and I woul sharpen them for him.

gmmills · January 06, 2020, 10:51:37 PM

No issue with sharpening this blade profile. CBN wheels are available directly from DW Bands. This is a close up view of the Munkfors profile. This certainly looks identical to the profile that Bruno is using.