got the logs bucked to length and now ready for it to begin.
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12'ers
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eight and ten foot'ers,
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Wes, making the best of the scale, a good day, and a soon to be pile of lumber.
Nice whack of logs! Are you planning a timberframe, or ???
Quote from: drobertson on April 22, 2014, 09:33:19 PM
got the logs bucked to length and now ready for it to begin.
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12'ers
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eight and ten foot'ers,
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Wes, making the best of the scale, a good day, and a soon to be pile of lumber.
[/quote
Sweet . I want some pine like those. What are they? Yellow , Loblolly ect.
Looking good. That has to be my favorite sized logs to saw. 8)
We went off the weight scale on these, 35 tons, estimated bdft'd 5868, Not sure on the final tally, but well over 6000bdft. This is just the floor joist, ridge trusses, and outside studs. More on this job as it unfolds. A fun project, with some pretty nice pine to work with. It is more of the lighter color SYP that has a tighter ring growth.
There are so many variables I have seen with pine, that knowing the exact species would be hard for me to say.
There was more sweep in these than I would prefer, but much of it was managed while bucking to lengths.
Nice pile of saw logs, David.
I'm looking forward to seeing this project unfold. popcorn_smiley
Got a good start today, no pics, but a good start, had to pick up chicks from the farm store, and hunt some turkey birds as well. as of now, running around a 15% over run. Custom cutting can get into total scale if arrangements are not made ahead of time. In this case, minimal slabs, 4" and up on lumber, whether 1x's or 2x's
Deck loaded, slabs gone, the morning will be a good one, Lord willing,
Sounds like you are off to a good start. :)
Lots of folks coming in this week end, kind of a production killer, but so far half way through the 12' 2x8's with misc side lumber,
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And yes I know there is a mess, had to make a hole, and for those how are all about close stickers, this pile will be gone tomorrow,
Quote from: drobertson on April 26, 2014, 08:19:19 PM
Lots of folks coming in this week end, kind of a production killer, but so far half way through the 12' 2x8's with misc side lumber,
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And yes I know there is a mess, had to make a hole, and for those how are all about close stickers, this pile will be gone tomorrow,
are these for your house?
Yes, these will be the floor joist. I have yet to saw out the studs and ridge trusses. Plus a pile of flooring, sheeting and roofing. This will be a green lumber built cabin 24x32. With inside cedar walls and knotty pine walls. Changes will occur, but such is usually the case as it goes.
looking great david! please post pics as your project progresses (trying saying that 3x fast) 8) i love a good building project!
david, that will be a great project! that's about the same size we built last fall. 24x 36 story and a half. we are not much more than in the dry but I will finish as I can. if you need any help I would be willing to come down that way!
David,
Nice looking lumber.
Quote from: drobertson on April 26, 2014, 08:47:22 PM
Yes, these will be the floor joist. I have yet to saw out the studs and ridge trusses. Plus a pile of flooring, sheeting and roofing. This will be a green lumber built cabin 24x32. With inside cedar walls and knotty pine walls. Changes will occur, but such is usually the case as it goes.
are you letting lumber air dry at all or are you building now? Do you put the shell up and let dry before finishing inside? I have never known anyone to build with green lumber. I might need to do it someday. thanks Jim
Jim, my bad on a previous post, these are not for me. Sorry bout that, and they will be building soon as concrete is poured. I've heard many stories of how to build with green lumber, not sure really what's correct, but the several I have sawed for say go up quick and get them nailed down. I'm excited about this on because I will be able to watch the progress and see the lasting results.
Quote from: drobertson on April 27, 2014, 07:22:29 AM
Jim, my bad on a previous post, these are not for me. Sorry bout that, and they will be building soon as concrete is poured. I've heard many stories of how to build with green lumber, not sure really what's correct, but the several I have sawed for say go up quick and get them nailed down. I'm excited about this on because I will be able to watch the progress and see the lasting results.
\
If its close to you maybe you can get some pics and quiz the builders about green lumber. My next build I am going to use all local materials and see how cheap I can build a house. Just for fun. I built a 20x30 cabin 2 yrs ago for 7000.00. I think I can do one for less since I did buy some lumber for it.
we built our house with green oak and hickory. we allowed for the shrinkage as best we could,nailed it down good and crossed our fingers. we are going on 6 months and no problems. we built the shell and loosely stuffed fiberglass bats in so the wood can still get air and dry. I would do it again if I neede to.
finally got the floor joist sawed out, lots of distractions going on, but none the less moving on to the ridge trusses tomorrow,
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two extras for good measure,
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side lumber, 2x6's a few 2x4's and 1x's
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and we can't forget the lonely abused stickers, this was half of the batch,
Of the 32 12' logs 17 are gone of the 32 we started with,
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Just about forgot the slabs, going to some good ole boys that raise and train horses,
nice looking lumber david
you need more stickers, your lumber will dry flatter and straighter with stickers closer together, a minium of 7 sticks on 12 ' lumber. my thoughts :)
thanks, and no doubt about that, these guys are about to grab and go, more than likely they will be flat stacked when they take them off the trailer, a morning job of framing for them,
Quote from: drobertson on April 28, 2014, 07:43:51 PM
thanks, and no doubt about that, these guys are about to grab and go, more than likely they will be flat stacked when they take them off the trailer, a morning job of framing for them,
Nice looking stack of lumber. I wonder how they are keeping the floor joist from sagging?
Quote from: ozarkgem on April 28, 2014, 08:07:16 PM
Quote from: drobertson on April 28, 2014, 07:43:51 PM
thanks, and no doubt about that, these guys are about to grab and go, more than likely they will be flat stacked when they take them off the trailer, a morning job of framing for them,
Nice looking stack of lumber. I wonder how they are keeping the floor joist from sagging?
[/quote}
they are digging footers and piers, I'm not a builder per say, but it is all figured in I'm sure, Had a little change up today, but nothing that will affect my end of the project, Just means a few more boards,
Awesome job David, that is some nice looking lumber. Also, I love the slab rack. I may have to have one of those built. I design steam lines and can usually get my hands on sticks of 4 and 6 inch steel pipe. My problem is that I don't have a welder to fabricate myself.
Dave C
I don't want to alarm you, but in reply #18, 3rd picture down,
I believe there's a bear hiding behind your stack. :D
Quote from: ddcuning on April 28, 2014, 09:40:21 PM
Awesome job David, that is some nice looking lumber. Also, I love the slab rack. I may have to have one of those built. I design steam lines and can usually get my hands on sticks of 4 and 6 inch steel pipe. My problem is that I don't have a welder to fabricate myself.
Dave C
Dave, if you will supply the steel, I will supply the fabrication equipment and skills and we can build a few racks together. Send me an e-mail if this is of interest.
Still working on it, in between a few short jobs, got the joist done, the trusses done and now the outside studs, with a lil over 500 feet of sheeting,
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And as you would have it! a Cheese head from Wisconsin! needing trailer decking for some trailers, in the works,
love sawing,
Nice PLANkS there David!
thanks Dave. this project has taken a lil turn, not bad, just a turn, getting a good lumber scale from the logs for sure, almost unbelievable really. Have to say it is 1/4" air, but still nice boards, tree length logs and managing the use is a challenge, as is for most folks. there is a limit to their budget, I am trying to obtain the max for them and make it right at the same time. It's fun and challenging at the same time. Good pine is a pleasure to work with for sure,
You can always tell when you are sawing nice logs when the slab rack looks like that. 8)
More studs for the wall, and siding, nice pine to work with,
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yea, it is leaning, lots of rain, the last two days,
Dave
any idea how much they saved over buying at the lumber yard? Certainly got much better lumber. Did you saw the whole house?
I will, other than the treated sill plates, and misc. necessary treated in vital areas. We are waiting for this part to be completed, then proceed on, really bumping on the over cut, 1/4" on thickness for full 2" other than this full cut. By the ton, we are off ,(over) by 1200 ft scale, with a scaled amount of 3275 to go. It is looking good for Wes, but more will be needed for sure, how much depends on the logs, and behavior. I never ran the numbers on lumber yard cost, but well below on this one for sure, good friends, just the way it works out here,
That is a very nice/neat whack of sawn lumber, as were the others. :)
Are you flat sawing it or you flipping it every time and grade sawing. I am in the process myself getting my logs staged and ready to cut
Not sure, flat sawing, and flipping, bow is always an issue, heart centered the best the log will produce.
nice looking pile but, you still need more stickers :) i know it sounds like a stuck record. more stickers will help keep the lumber flatter and straighter.
Steve, not a stuck record, and I agree, and wish I had done differently now, for their benefit. It was to go faster, but rain has been an issue, hind site is always 20/20. the stacks are holding their own, and banded, nothing is perfect, but measures should be taken for sure. Still have two bundles for the log cabin that was to be gone an restacked from over two months now. I KNOW better, it is just a killer when it happens. A good reminder for those who think plans are going good, then are delayed, prepare for the worse, and best, is a good tactic, thanks,
The bright side is that Loblolly Pine is somewhat forgiving in that it is not as prone to do bad things when "long stickered" as some other species.
Lynn, I have been monitoring these stacks, and agree with you, however, It was to go much quicker than it has, but as most know, Murphy's law is always in effect. building with green lumber is an art, and should be done by those who know the craft. these guys do, just affected by weather and work load. they said all is good, so, this has to be good with me, payment has been made, just hate to see it laying, even angled like the last pic shows, probably will fix tomorrow, just because,
Weather, and work loads for these boys have been a killer, but, the concrete is in, looks like a few more possible good days ahead, they have lots more timber to mark, but are getting closer to the build.
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It should not be long now, but, Murphy always has something to say about that,
Looks like your doing a great job. Not sure what you meant about the 1/4" over? Are you sawing at 5/4 and 7/4 or 9/4?
the dimensions of the 2x's are 1-3/4" by full 8" the wall studs are 1-3/4" by 5-5/8"
They finally got time to get going on the cabin. they got the joist in and are starting the sub floor now.
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that's it so far, tomorrow should show more progress. I'm happy for Wes, young man doing it from scratch,
Sure wish they'd stagger the joints on that subfloor...
Quote from: PC-Urban-Sawyer on August 09, 2014, 07:26:09 PM
Sure wish they'd stagger the joints on that subfloor...
I knew something was "off", good catch PC. Nice progress none-the-less.
Is this house project for you? Or are you supplying the materials for someone else's house (or is it a cabin)?
I'm not following well on who "they" is, but glad to see the pics and some progress.
Also surprised to see the sheathing boards being butted on one joist. Maybe covering that with plywood or some other panel?
Well to answer a few of the questions, the original plan was to go on a 45 degree with the sub-boards. A lesson learned here. 8' was used and the numbers did not work out well, too much waste on the end cuts in regards to making the reach to the next joist. 12' would have worked out perfectly. This is Wes's first build, going by books and advice from a builder. It's not going to be a 250K Colorado cabin, but a modest dwelling with a sound foundation. The finish floor will be 3/4" cabin grade, oak,t&g, They who I refer to have become quite good friends and times co-workers in the timber. They have a TSI business and contract mainly through the MDC, with private landowners filling in. Willy the father grew up in these parts and since has lived from Alaska to the hills of Tenn. He has seen, lived and help build cabin old cabins most his life. So, that's about it, I know it will finish off nicely, and Lord willing, I will continue to show the progress as it unfolds. Thanks for sharing your thought as well, I have sawn for many of folks, but very few close friends on this level, seeing the lumbers reaction in progress has been a great education, and there to this point has been very little waste.
I think a 250k cabin in some parts of CO is known as the outhouse. :D
Got it.
QuoteThe finish floor will be 3/4" cabin grade, oak,t&g,
Will that also go down perpendicular to the joists and parallel with the sheathing boards?
I believe that is a negative, I have not seen the entire plan, not much cad going on, or any other detailed plans, just build as you go, kinda sorta, some sketching and the like. In time we will see this come to completion. The plumbing and electrical and heating has been thought out. The main objective at this point is drying it in and then regroup. The basic floor plan is intact, but there is always room for revisions once dried in. It will have a loft incorporated into the plan.
Quote from: beenthere on August 09, 2014, 09:10:31 PMWill that also go down perpendicular to the joists and parallel with the sheathing boards?
I understand the question and personally would not do it any other way. Matter of fact, that is exactly what I did on my Cabin Addition. The subfloor and flooring both are perpendicular to the floor joist and parallel with each other. I also staggered the subflooring and flooring as PC noted.
In my opinion, to do it otherwise would invite some sagging between the joist as well as possible squeaking.
Hind site 20/20, I suppose, they are happy and pleased, I suppose that accounts for a lot.
Quote from: drobertson on August 09, 2014, 10:17:43 PM
they are happy and pleased, I suppose that accounts for a lot.
That's what counts. Keep the pics coming - fun to watch, thanks!
And in no way did I intend to be derogatory. I did mine my way and I respect and admire the fortitude of others.
any constructive criticism is never taken as derogatory here, I too have much to learn. And will take full blame for the layout decision. It was based on a limited budget, with limited log footage to work with. Had I run the numbers I would have seen this one coming. I almost always, literally, give better advice. we went with random with for maximum footage. The variances in board with are in 1" increments. between 4 and 8"'s . I should have known better and shot for what I have done many times in the past. Pick a number, in this case it should've been 7-1/2- 8"'s and made them all the same. Allowing for misc 4's and 6's to fill any last minute voids or later use. The random width is what cause all the issues from the get go. On top of the 8' length. As I said this will be chalked up in the memory, and hopefully not happen again. It only takes a few sketches and some number crunching to get the numbers required. The positive side is, there has been little waste due to mis cuts and drying issues. So. On to the next part of the build. thanks for the friendly reminders on offsetting joints, a lesson learned by a pretty uneducated individual. david
You do good work . Have fun and do what you want, And good luck :D :D :D ;)
This is going on today,
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Stud wall raising time is always exciting. It's progress that is very obvious. 8)
You bet it is! And to both me and Wes, the numbers figured on what's remaining, figuring an over cut, this dry in is going to be real close, the waste has been so minimal it would blow your mind, slow is not always such a bad thing? Good planning and adjusting is critical when dealing with a limited supply. This one will be close.
was wondering why the pieces are cut out of the studs toward the outside of the walls. Is this for plumbing piping or electical just has me wondering that is all.
duke
Quote from: duke on August 18, 2014, 12:26:53 AM
was wondering why the pieces are cut out of the studs toward the outside of the walls. Is this for plumbing piping or electical just has me wondering that is all.
duke
Due to the vertical inside walls, there was a need for nailers. Rather than single individual nailing blocks between the studs, a longer one will lay across. This also makes for easier installation of insulation.
say_what
that is a good idea! I wish I had thought of that. now I have a bunch of boards to toenail in before I put up my interior wall covering.
It was not my idea, but I liked it. You can still lay the insulation in full length and make slits in the insulation to accommodate for wiring.
That is a very good idea for purlings. smiley_thumbsup
Moving along, between travel and jobs, good news the lumber has behaved quite well!
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Another minor change in plans, but it will be a good one! a should be a double decker open air 8'x12' outside screened in porch. Lumber has done well, very straight and consistent.
In Missouri do you have to get your SYP graded? Sure wish we didn't have to......I have never thought outside the box with just planking the subfloor, I've always had it on my mind that you just had to suck up the cost of that expensive avantech OSB. I may apply this to my future T.F. build.
Thanks for sharing the progress!
looking good! were you able to source your logs locally. not terribly far from you but I can only think of a couple pine trees anywhere near this area. as far as the grading. unless your in an area that requires building inspections it wouldn't have to be graded.
Quote from: hunz on October 12, 2014, 08:17:50 PM
In Missouri do you have to get your SYP graded? Sure wish we didn't have to......I have never thought outside the box with just planking the subfloor, I've always had it on my mind that you just had to suck up the cost of that expensive avantech OSB. I may apply this to my future T.F. build.
Thanks for sharing the progress!
One of my issues with my cabin build next year. I did not want to pay a ton on ply for the sub floor and then have to lay flooring on top of that. I found an engineer that would work with me and he specified that I lay it on a 45 with so many nails per width, etc. Also, I'm ONLY putting down a sub-floor (2" T&G) to make it more rustic. The 45 angle gave me the necessary seismic rating and will add interest to the building.
hunz, no codes out here, but good measures for adequate building. Some of the osb has been priced for around 10-12 bucks a sheet, but it was not an option for these guys. the price was comparable for this low grade sub floor. As I mentioned, they will put down a cabin grade oak flooring. They are very happy with how it's going, which really is the most important. The cost has been low, a GND, if you will, (good neighbor discount) but, neighbors should stick together in my view. Money is not everything, (wife does not need to see this) but she is on the same page. They have been working a three story cabin using lumber yard stock and even the contractor has commented on the quality and constancy. We are good friends and neighbors, just glad to be able to be part of this young man's new home.
Yes, 45 degree is preferred, but the waste is a concern. They have done a few over the years with good success. I am not a builder, but am glad to have them happy! this is a limited budget dwelling, and maximizing the logs is at the forefront of the saw job.
The floor joists on the main floor run the short way and the loft the long way. To make the building stiff, the engineer said to run the boards on the main floor as shown. I don't think I will have too much waste. I figure I'll cut the planks long enough for the angle (about 17') and as I get down to the corners, the cut-offs will be used a little closer to the corners where shorter is needed.
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So the question is, should the back of the loft floor boards be continuous in length (25')? I suppose I can make them all 25's and cut them down if they start to bow a little to use on the front part of the loft where it is only 12-13'.
Not sure if I understand, support walls are in place, so although I believe what the theory is on structure integrity, just a very hard one to do when planning a building? Keeping the cost down, I may have misunderstood the last post.
Sorry, didn't mean to confuse with the OP - this is just my experience and what I have to do. What baffled me is the main floor is sitting on the concrete block foundation. (actually, ICFs). With the floor joists running between them (short way), that seems to me to be a VERY stout construction. However, the engineer felt differently - so the 45° angle... Here is with the foundation and beams/posts/braces.
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All exterior braces are required to have Simpson tie plates. The good news is, (besides doing it without any ply panels of any sort) I passed my seismic with flying colors! Structure movement is less than half of the allowable limit.
Wow! way more elaborate then this construction for sure. this cabin is a stick built old fashion style, not timber framed at all. And No drawings like this to go by for certain. It would be nice some day to work on such a project. thanks for the insight, not much else to say,, kinda at a lose for words,,
IJohnsaw, Does that come with a finish drawing as well? I always loved the "A" frame homes up in the Seirra range.
Sean P.
Quote from: blade69001 on October 15, 2014, 07:56:36 AM
IJohnsaw, Does that come with a finish drawing as well? I always loved the "A" frame homes up in the Seirra range.
Sean P.
You ask, you shall receive :D
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I've got all the "drawings". I designed (with plenty of help from here) and drew in SketchUp. Not really an A frame - I'm not quite that high up (5,800') and only get 14' of snow. Go another 30 minutes up the road (1,200' more) and they get twice that!
Making a little more progress as fall begin to set in. Plan is moving right along steady as she goes. Best part is Wes is very happy, and the boards are behaving quite well.
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i don't think i'd be working on stairs, get that baby enclosed so the floor boards and framing dont get completly soaked with water :) good looking project
No doubt, they are trying! had to get the second decking on in order for the trusses to go up, this stuff has really held up,,
It's looking great!
This has been a slower going than everyone had intended, but building out of the back pocket coupled with work schedules and weather has its share of set backs, but things are moving along.
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I like tho project. Tell them I said great job.
Well, this project is about to wear my buddy Wes out, he has been pretty much on his own for most of it, with help coming here and there from a few friends. Weather and work schedules can just be a killer, along with finances. There has been changes along the way, but why not if something is seen a person would like to add. After all it's his, so maybe in the next week or so the metal will go up. I'm pretty sure Wes is all for this! The dormer was added on the eastern side, he had a few rouge trusses that would've posed an issue with the metal roofing, so he took it out and added the widow, I kinda like the idea of a dormer,
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Looks awesome, Do you have a basement?
No basement on Wes's build, just a two foot stem wall, with pillars in the center, with beams for the supports. you might be able to see them in the side shot of the build.
He has got it looking great.
I like to see a house being built. Get all doors 3 feet wide. Much easier moving in the furniture.
What is going to be holding the ridge up? I see a few 2x4s now, but will there eventually be a load bearing wall in place there? With out some collar ties on the rafters, it looks really scary right now!
Yes there will be collar ties, as well as a 4' wall and the 12/12 side. To be honest, I've not seen a complete plan, so I am as anxious as anyone to see it through, right now we are needing more pine logs and the getting is getting harder, It seems that most loggers are into the oak at present due to the price oak is bringing.
Looking good, some ceiling joist in the upper level, would tie those walls together and stiffen it all up, with a few cross braces nailed in the upper ceiling. That will tie every thing into one strong built! :D
Yep! Right now it looks like a four bar linkage (great at falling down). He needs some triangles up there! That 12/12 section looks like it wants to push that upstairs wall, right off the house!
Austin
Quote from: dablack on January 06, 2015, 08:48:33 AM
Yep! Right now it looks like a four bar linkage (great at falling down). He needs some triangles up there! That 12/12 section looks like it wants to push that upstairs wall, right off the house!
Austin
Post #82, last pic on that post shows the tie in of the truss,, I suppose it could shear,, but if that happens,, well there are worse conditions on the outside to deal with ;D these are locked in on the top plate with solid fits. The open feature of the upper loft will have supports, and as a side note, measurements have been taken, just inside 1/4" square on all checks,, so If the Lord will this to come down, then I suppose it will ;D
First off, I really like diy builds and I think your friends are doing a great job.
I saw how the rafters were tied to the top plates and that is a great fit. I'm not worried at all about the 12/12 pitch sliding off the floor or the 6/12 pitch sliding off the vertical wall.
I am worried about that verticle wall getting pushed out by those rafters. Roof rafters want to push walls out. By code, you need a rafter tie in the lower 1/3 of the rafters. This design can't comply with that requirement. To make it "better", I would put a pony wall under where the 12/12 pitch rafters are mated end to end. Somehow tie both rafters (upper and lower) to that pony wall with hurricane ties. Then I would put some rafter ties as low as possible. Really if it were mine, I would cut plywood triangles and put them on each side of the rafters at the peak. I don't always build to code either but I do try and meet the intent. I will be glad to draw up my suggestions if wanted. I will also be glad to just cheer them on. I know all about building with a limited cash budget.
Well, the 12/12 pitch side will have a 4' inside wall making cubby hole storage shorting the span a bit. collar ties will be employed. And for another note, not sure of codes, but one that has built many by codes as well as much more complicated, who is a close friend with the sawyer and builder, is supervising the build in a humble manner. So, again, not much lack on confidence on the structures' integrity, but maybe quite a bit on the photos and commentary? ;D So in fashion with this forum, I thank all for comments and critics on it, I surly don't know building, but pretty confident on sawing, and have had thumbs up through and through with the boards presented for the build, and still am amazed at the lack of waste, which I attribute to the WMZ mill and maybe just a little experience at reading logs and reaction that comes from the logs. thanks, there really is no end to what we can learn when an open mind is employed.
With the 4' wall and collar ties, I'm sure it will be very stout. If I came across as rude, it was not my intent. I have seen houses without good bracing go down without much of a fight. When it comes to something as valuable as a building, I would hate it if something happened later and I had not said anything.
From what you have explained, it looks like everything is well in hand and my concerns were unfounded. With the collar ties and pony wall, I would let my kids play up there all day! I have enjoyed watching it go up, please continue to post pictures.
Austin