Im curently work in the excavating business and cut wood in the winter to keep busy, last year I cut a load of veneer and logs and around 90 full cords of hardwood which was all sold to my uncle who has a firewood business. He sold almost 200 full cords of cut and split fire wood last year but is looking into different career ventures in a different area. He has a hud-son processor and conveyer that is now 4 years old and a 12k lb dump trailer he offered to sell me. I'v been thinking about jumping into it feet first as it would deversify my current business but at the same time dont want to over- extend myself. How many of you have gone into the processing buisiness and would you do it again? Also whats the thoughts on buying a used processor its probably had a total of 350 full cords through it.
Also what seems to be the most economical way to load a processor, this one has the live deck, i was thinking either a skid steer with grapple or a mini excavator with hyd thumb
I know a fellow who has a hud-son processor. He uses a dump trailer to deliver and added a clam to a full size backhoe for loading. He tries to not handle anything by hand and pre sells his wood so when the trailer is full he will deliver it. He also told me he tries to get a certain amount of the firewood pre paid for as well. If you pre pay in the fall for delivery in the spring, early summer he gives you a very good price. He then uses this money to buy his logs and plans on making his profit on the other sales.
any other opinions on the hud-son processor?
I run a bundled firewood business in Indiana. We also sell cords of firewood in the winter as well. I try my best to let others do the back breaking work of cutting and splitting the logs, however they elect do it. I have found if you shop around you can find others that will wholesale you wood for darn close to what it would cost you to process it yourself in terms of equipment, fuel, labor...etc, sometimes even cheaper.
went and looked at it yesterday and it is actually a built rite, seems to be a nicely built machine and in very good shape, just have to get the wifes ok now... :D
well, im officiallly in the fire wood business, 8) bought the whole business, builtrite processor, conveyer, 12k lb dump trailer and skidsteer
Good luck to ya.Buying tree lenght wood?
xalexjx - congratulations on the new equipment! Where abouts in NY are you located?
Congrats on getting the business. Be smart and save for the rainy day that will eventually come. Good luck and let us know how you're doing!
Quote from: thecfarm on May 14, 2014, 08:16:08 AM
Good luck to ya.Buying tree lenght wood?
cutting off investment properties right now, but will be buying it right off the stump later this summer.
Quote from: Jason_AliceMae Farms on May 14, 2014, 10:36:09 AM
xalexjx - congratulations on the new equipment! Where abouts in NY are you located?
Newcomb, about an hour north of Lake George.
Spent a few hours processing some wood, 8)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/29397/IMG_0538.jpg)
xalexjx,
I stacked 3 face cords of 16" firewood then conveyed it into my 12' dump trailer and took a picture of it. I only sell my wood by the trailer load. I tell customers its approximately 3 face cords give or take. I also am able to sort through some of the punkier wood and throw it aside in a pile. Once customers see that I try to sort some of the lesser firewood then no one seems to have a problem with my system. I never ever handle firewood except loading it on the log deck. I also bag firewood into mesh bags on a pallet and have been able to sell those in the late winter/early spring when people run out of wood and also sell the pallets to summertime people that have cottages/camping etc. I can load a mesh bag onto their truck or trailer, or they can load into their vehicle. I purchased a few of the mesh bags at the escanaba logging show a few years ago, and made a 42" by 48" frame to set on the pallet out of an old dog pen. Once I saw the amount of bagged wood I could do I got a regular frame and more bags. Just another wood option for customers.
thanks for the advice, do you have the pic of the trailer with the wood in it? That was firewood i processed for my uncle who i bought the business from for his personal use, hoping to not handle the wood by hand at all so put it in the tandem or dump trailer right off the conveyer for now. Although at some point im going to pour a cement slab with jersey barries around the outside so i can stock pile wood then scoop it with a front end loader so the dump truck isnt held up to process wood. Still have lots of bugs to work out but I have a pretty good list of wood I already have sold.
xalexjx,
I dont know how to get a picture on here. Maybe I can get my son to take a picture and have my neighbor put it on. I took a picture of the 3 face cords stacked on the ground, then conveyed into the trailer. After all the horror stories around here about people getting shorted or worse not showing up with wood after a down payment, I dont have much trouble with the amount of wood in the trailer. Up in Canada some of those firewood guys spend spring, summer, and fall just bagging their wood. They can hand load into their trailer, or just sell by the bag. We have a logger that purchased a processor and he has 2 big 3 sided cement bins that he processes into. Each scoop of his loader is approximately 1 face cord so he sells by the bucket or he has a larger dump truck that will handle 6 face cords. My eventual goal is to have a quonset type hut and a couple of cement bins like the logger and use a loader. Hardest part for me is getting the wood at the right price. If the business keeps growing I will look for a truck with a grapple and figure out a way to deliver pallets of eco bricks and pallets of wood pellets and even my firewood pallets. Last winter I would load a pallet of eco bricks and 3 bags of firewood (hand thrown in around the eco bricks and I would get 450 bucks a dump trailer. Way better than 225.00 for all firewood and all in 1 trip. If I get anything else figured out on deliveries etc. I will try to get a picture on here. good luck again,,,,,,ed
Not to get nosey, but does it cost you to get your wood? The man I worked for as a kid sold firewood. He told me he didn't pay for the wood he cut up. It came from land owners that wanted the trees cleared.
Quote from: jargo432 on May 16, 2014, 07:04:44 AM
Not to get nosey, but does it cost you to get your wood? The man I worked for as a kid sold firewood. He told me he didn't pay for the wood he cut up. It came from land owners that wanted the trees cleared.
Well the wood i'm using right now is on my own property but it still has a cost to cut it and skid it out never mind buying the property or taxes. But if I buy it right off the stump its between $8-$14 a cord and that can vary quite a bit. If I have to buy wood and have it trucked to here its between 85-100 a full cord, but that wont happen unless im in a pinch to keep a customer.
xalexjx,
The price I paid last year was 70 a pulp cord, that logger went to 90 this spring, the other logger was 80 and went to 100. I cant make money at those prices, it was hard enough at 70, so I am concentrating more on eco bricks and wood pellets. I am betting after the winter we all had that the prices jump is about the same % more or less around the country.
Quote from: xalexjxBut if I buy it right off the stump its between $8-$14 a cord and that can vary quite a bit. If I have to buy wood and have it trucked to here its between 85-100 a full cord, but that wont happen unless im in a pinch to keep a customer.
Have you figured out your actual cost per cord on the landing, after stumpage, machine time/wear, your time, fuel, etc, etc?
And also the approximate time per cord to chop, limb, skid and buck, given the equipment you have at present?
Wondering what the actual price differential is, when all is said and done.
North River Energy
I found it is cheaper for me to buy it by the pulp cord, I dont have much equipment, we took a 29 hp new holland tractor in the woods with forks and my 12' dump trailer. I tried every way I could and we couldnt come close enough to keep doing it that way. He is young too, and I am going on ancient so that might have something to do with it.
Quote from: North River Energy on May 16, 2014, 09:43:43 PM
Quote from: xalexjxBut if I buy it right off the stump its between $8-$14 a cord and that can vary quite a bit. If I have to buy wood and have it trucked to here its between 85-100 a full cord, but that wont happen unless im in a pinch to keep a customer.
Have you figured out your actual cost per cord on the landing, after stumpage, machine time/wear, your time, fuel, etc, etc?
And also the approximate time per cord to chop, limb, skid and buck, given the equipment you have at present?
Wondering what the actual price differential is, when all is said and done.
I can buy wood off the stump much cheaper then buying it as pulp wood. Before just getting into the firewood I already had an established logging business. I was buying it off the stump and selling it for $67 a cord with a trucker picking it up and delivering it 8 miles one way for 90 a cord. I was making good money doing that, my c5 tree farmer is good on fuel and pretty low maintenance. Plus any of the saw logs or veneer are the bread and butter when cutting my own wood.
I buy pulp hauled in. Mostly because I get it a little cheaper because I log for them. And its way faster to process. I couldn't sell the wood I do nights and weekend if I had to cut it on the stump. I figure I'm about $35 or so a face cord (if the pulp is straight and adds up right) when it's sitting in my dump truck. Not counting my wage or break downs or truck lic and ins. There's guys here selling it for $90 plus delivery (about $30 a cord) for 100". That's crazy. And they get $65-$70 at the mill
xalexjx,
I didn't ask my question very well. My bad.
I realize that you already have a viable logging operation, and that firewood production will supplement that work.
I am looking for the actual calculated costs per hour to 'move' one cord of wood (standing @$12-14) to where your Built-Rite is parked.
If I understand correctly, you can put a cord on your landing and make money selling that cord @ 67.
How does that 67 break down in terms of profit/loss?
At the moment I buy log length. At some point I might want to get involved in the harvesting, and if I do, will likely start with a small skidder (c4, c5, 230, etc).
That decision will need some numbers.
firewood joe,
If your anywhere near kalkaska area cutting have your company contact me and maybe I can purchase 20 pulp cords. I also have customers that purchase 10 pulp at a time and I go process it for them. I imagine I can get 100 to 200 pulp cords to process mobile when I get a customer base built up in the area. This has been a good posting for me. A lot of questions and info.
They won't sell any right now. Between the pulp mill me and their use they won't take any orders till late summer. If we have it then. It's been good and we have no issues selling it. Plus we don't have a oak sale anytime soon.
usually on a good day my self and a cutter can put out between 8-16 cords on the header, depending on the size of wood, length of drag and the terrain working on.
so say i pull out 10 cords in a day
140 stumpage
120 fuel, chainsaw gas bar oil ect. (more then covers it)
180 for a contract cutter for a day
_______
440 operating costs for a day plus buying wood
(never mind the saw logs and veneer set aside)
where im going to make out good is when I can process right on the header because trucking is one of the biggest killers. For me to buy cord wood delivered it comes out to around 90 bucks a cord. So still to get the wood for under 50 a cord doesnt work out too bad, plus my time. Im selling it cut and split for 85 a f/c and have more orders then I can handle by myself.
When we had hardwood it was $65/cord on the landing on your truck, 100" wood. Our trucker was selling it locally for $95. On the last job we had a friend with a processor setup on the landing so he saved the trucking, we made out the same except the straight stuff could be cut 20' which saved some work.
Congregations on the wood biz! We have had our built rite for some 15 yrs and is still pumping out the wood :). Best of luck!
Thanks, xalexj.
So of the 10 cord per day, do you find that you generally come out with a general ratio of sawlogs/veneer to firewood? (obviously that will vary based on site etc, but...)
Also, what do you figure your time is worth in the daily expense breakdown ( not specific, just approximate).
And, have you reached a solid number for hourly production on the Built-Rite?
(Starting with full live deck, ending in the stockpile).
Quote from: North River Energy on May 25, 2014, 09:08:45 AM
Thanks, xalexj.
So of the 10 cord per day, do you find that you generally come out with a general ratio of sawlogs/veneer to firewood? (obviously that will vary based on site etc, but...)
Also, what do you figure your time is worth in the daily expense breakdown ( not specific, just approximate).
And, have you reached a solid number for hourly production on the Built-Rite?
(Starting with full live deck, ending in the stockpile).
The lot I'm cutting now iv seen little to no saw logs or veneer, real poor qaulity stuff. Good for firewood or pulp and thats about it. I can run the skidder and hire a contract cutter for less then $450 a day. So for 10 cords minus the stumpage I end up with about 350 or so in my pocket. As for the built-rite production it is almost 100% dependent on the wood but on average the stuff im running across it I can do 4 face cord an hour bymyself very easy. With a helper to load logs and nice wood I can do that in 30-40 mins. So far so good, more wood sold then I can keep up with, working some little bugs out in the processor with small hyd leaks but nothing major. Son about 100 face cord so far and have more then that already sold
Quote from: Busy Beaver Lumber on March 26, 2014, 06:56:36 PM
I run a bundled firewood business in Indiana. We also sell cords of firewood in the winter as well. I try my best to let others do the back breaking work of cutting and splitting the logs, however they elect do it. I have found if you shop around you can find others that will wholesale you wood for darn close to what it would cost you to process it yourself in terms of equipment, fuel, labor...etc, sometimes even cheaper.
You are right there I get some great deals in the summer time some of the guys need a case of beer or carton of cigs.
Quote from: glassman_48 on May 15, 2014, 05:43:20 PM
xalexjx,
I stacked 3 face cords of 16" firewood then conveyed it into my 12' dump trailer and took a picture of it. I only sell my wood by the trailer load. I tell customers its approximately 3 face cords give or take. I also am able to sort through some of the punkier wood and throw it aside in a pile. Once customers see that I try to sort some of the lesser firewood then no one seems to have a problem with my system. I never ever handle firewood except loading it on the log deck. I also bag firewood into mesh bags on a pallet and have been able to sell those in the late winter/early spring when people run out of wood and also sell the pallets to summertime people that have cottages/camping etc. I can load a mesh bag onto their truck or trailer, or they can load into their vehicle. I purchased a few of the mesh bags at the escanaba logging show a few years ago, and made a 42" by 48" frame to set on the pallet out of an old dog pen. Once I saw the amount of bagged wood I could do I got a regular frame and more bags. Just another wood option for customers.
I been using Dino bags but they cost so I have to keep them.
firewood business is going good, almost to busy to do as a side business with cutting my own wood plus another full time job. Just over 100 full cords so far and the end is no wheres in site. My goal was to sell 200 face cords this year but im way past that now. Been buying 16' logs now. Just not enough time in the day, need to put someone to work for me full time. dadgum you, Charlie! Been using the dump trailer behind my pick-up which works good but a 550 with dump bed would be much easier and make it a two person process to keep the processor going while I deliver.
xalex,
Glad to hear your so busy, I am in the same boat, I have my full time glass business so when we have a "slow day" there I run to my log site and process wood and deliver it in my dump trailer. I am guessing at the end of the day between your age and my age you still have a lil git up and go left while my mine got up and went somewhere and I cant seem to find it ;D
xalexjx,
before hiring a full time person, what about getting some part time help just to see if you actually need the full time help? Sometimes I have found that a few hours of help a couple of times a week is all that is needed to get back to a desired level. It will save you the headache of full-time employee issues (taxes, insurance, etc.) and get you the extra help you need.