chain saw sharpener

[Qweaver]

I see an add for a device that clips on the round end of a chainsaw blade and is pushed in to bring a abrasive stone in contact and sharpens the chain.  Will this work without destroying the chain? Or radically  shortening its life.

[LeeB]

They look like a total waste of money to me. I see no way they could possibly work.

[lxskllr]

It's bought as a system with a chain, and sharpener. I was contemplating getting my boss a saw for jul. He's a spaz, and won't concentrate on properly sharpening, so I was considering that system. Reading around, it got poor-mediocre reviews. That, and his inability to care for ICE, I decided to not get a saw.

[Old Greenhorn]

They look like a total waste of money to me. I see no way they could possibly work.

Oh I see how they could work BUT the chain won't last for shoot. They grind off the TOP of the chain, but don't do anything underneath the top plate. So the life of the chain will be dictated by the thickness of the top plate (about .050") they also do nothing on the sides that I can see. With a normal sharpening method you have about .250" to file away before the chain is done, roughly 10 times the material. So if you hit a rock with the side of the chain, they will do nothing to fix that. Sorry to say, but these are marketed to folks who are always looking for an easy way to buy a solution that will save them from having to learn something and apply some minor skill to a task. Those folks deserve to spend their money on this.  ;D ;D My Dad always said "Barnum was right!" (for those who may not be familiar: P.T. Barnum was the promoter behind Barnum and Bailey's Circus and he had said " A fool and his money are soon parted".)
Lxsklr, my suggestion to you for your boss is to get him, or have him buy, several chains and give him the phone number of a local resharpening guy where he can drop his chains off. That's what I did when I got busy.

[Bandmill Bandit]

Those sharpeners are an idea that is better left on the shop floor to be swept up and thrown in the scrap bin BEFORE you pick up the dirt/dust for the garbage. A friend bought one a couple of years ago thinking that for cutting recreational firewood it would save him time for the part of the "getting the firewood" that he hates. 

As a rule I help him with this task as I enjoy it and he is a more than a bit "huschlich" as my grandpa would call it and can be a harzard to him self with out some one to "direct" the operation and keep him doing things that he does well (running the splitter & NOT a saw) so as he is NOT tempted to drop a tree.

Last fall he did about 6 or so cuts bucking a decent 15" ish log with the new chain but couldn't get the same cut rate I was doing with pretty much the same saw. He sharpened and realized no real improvement. 

He said to me "well I guess that was a waste of money!" 

I said "yea those things are just very poorly designed. I'll fall and buck. Keith and Glen can use the axes and my small saw to clean off what limbs there are." His 15 year old and the 13 year old sons are good workers. 

We loaded the old 72 Ford he uses for fire wood with an old pickup box trailer. Both are 8' box with a 2 foot ply wood extension so about 2 ish cords each. The wood was fire kill pine and was pretty dry so was not a tough job.

He took the kit back to the dealer and they exchanged it for a new bar and chain and gave him a pack of files that is now resident in my shop along  with the saw. Pretty sure I will get the call inviting me for a week end of "recreational firewood processing" some time in September. The call will end with "oh, by the way can you bring your splitter too?"    

[Altamaha]

Deleted

[moodnacreek]

The thing to do is learn how to file by eye. Copy a new tooth, always have a new or like file in your file pocket, not in your tool box. Force yourself to learn and avoid all the excess baggage.

[maple flats]

I used to sharpen all by hand, using a file and did very well until I had an employee who liked cutting wood but was real bad at sharpening even though I showed him how multiple times. I then bought a Maxx sharpener. Then, I had him replace the chains with a new or resharpened one and had him hang the dull chains on a nail I put near the sharpener for used chains. That way I could do a proper job sharpening 5-10 chains at a time. Arthritis in both thumbs made it hard for me to do more than 1 chain by hand. I no longer have any employees, but I still use that sharpener.
The main thing with a well designed and sturdy sharpener is to try to remove the least necessary to get it sharp. As such I might need to adjust the setting a few times while doing a chain for a 20" cut bar so I don't remove too much. That works well for me.
I've read where others have bought cheap knock off sharpeners, they are not solid enough to do a good job, either learn to sharpen by hand or get a good sharpener (or hire it done. An issue with those who sharpen for hire is that they often look for the shortest tooth and set to that and grind them all that short)

[Bandmill Bandit]

I have said this more than once on this forum;

There is one sharpener the eliminates 99% of the issues of sharpening and gives you a better than new chain EVERY sharpen.

https://www.timberlinesharpener.com/

I did a minor upgrade that does improve stability on the bar a lot. When you get one PM and ill give you my mod. Other wise this sharpener is about as close as you will ever get to perfection.

The result is such that I have been able to reduce my sharpening about 40% both in time required to sharpen and longer sharp life between sharpenings
 

[Old Greenhorn]

I've read where others have bought cheap knock off sharpeners, they are not solid enough to do a good job, either learn to sharpen by hand or get a good sharpener (or hire it done. An issue with those who sharpen for hire is that they often look for the shortest tooth and set to that and grind them all that short)

Good points @maple flats . If I could afford a good grinder I might give it a try, but I have other priorities for my money right now and my hands still work fairly well. Your point abut hiring it out is also very true. When I was busy and would drop my chains off one day and pick them up the next I found I was only getting 4-5 sharpening's before they were shot. That's kind of ridiculous.

[lxskllr]

When I was busy and would drop my chains off one day and pick them up the next I found I was only getting 4-5 sharpening's before they were shot. That's kind of ridiculous.

I think a buddy of mine was paying ~$13/chain? Can't remember anymore, but even $8 which is the other figure in my head would be a ripoff, especially since they took a good chunk of the tooth off at a single time. I'd go broke doing one of my dirty jobs. I've have to show up with a few hundred $ in chains, then spend another $100 at the end of the day to have them all sharpened again.
That was how I got my start sharpening chains. He bought a guide, and some files, and I went at it. I did a terrible job  :^D  In my defense, his saw was the first I ever used, and I didn't use it that much, so I wasn't really familiar with... just about anything saw related. I knew where to place the cutty part, but that's about it  :^D  After getting my own saw, and practicing, I can now do a competent job, and I don't like guides. They seem to complicate the operation, and make everything more unwieldy.

[maple flats]

That is not the nature of a good quality sharpener, it's the user who takes a shortcut, maybe hoping to sell more new chains. I'm not sure how many sharpenings I get but the way I do it my guess is about 12-15+. Hard to keep track of because I have many chains and of different ages. As a rule, unless a chain hits something it should never hit, they get retired as they get down to the little line that is across each link or more often they rivets get worn too much. I know I get 12 or more on each, average.

[Old Greenhorn]

That is not the nature of a good quality sharpener, it's the user who takes a shortcut, maybe hoping to sell more new chains. I'm not sure how many sharpenings I get but the way I do it my guess is about 12-15+.

When I was busy and would drop my chains off one day and pick them up the next I found I was only getting 4-5 sharpening's before they were shot. That's kind of ridiculous.

I think a buddy of mine was paying ~$13/chain? Can't remember anymore, but even $8 which is the other figure in my head would be a ripoff, especially since they took a good chunk of the tooth off at a single time. I'd go broke doing one of my dirty jobs.

Maple, this was obvious to me when I realized what was happening. I started my career as a cutter grinder. Sloppy work. It's an 83 year old gentleman that was born, raised, and still lives on the same plot of land his family has had for generations. I thought patronizing him would help support his lifestyle. A lot of the local guys go to him for sharpening of various blades. He knows a bit about the local history and i tried to wean some information out of him, but it turns out he only knows his family history and a few stories he prefers to keep to himself. When I realized what was happening to my chains, I stopped going and did my own. If he had been a nicer fella with good stories to share and maybe a pot of coffee available, I may have stayed with him to this day. I think he charged $3.00 a chain or something like that which is quite reasonable, except when I calculate the cost of the chain verses the number of sharpenings, I realized my operating cost was getting too high.

Lxslkr, I can't imagine paying that amount to have a chain sharpened more than once. I'd get a file and what ever I needed and learn how to do it myself. If you are a savvy shopper you can find and 18" chain for $15. sometimes less. That is just sick. If somebody charged me that much I would ask them to hold a gun to my forehead so that it was clear I was being robbed.

Now having said all that, I just got in this week the Husqvarna roller sharpening guides. I have been wanting to try these for a year now, but was using square grind. Now I have some full chisel round ground on both saws and ordered these guides from Bailey's. I bought the .325 and 3/8 guides. I love these things. It's raining so I went out to the shop and sharpened both saws, they needed it. The .325 I am running is an Oregon chain and the guide fit right on and I was through the chain in no time. Looks good. The 3/8 did not fit well BUT I am trying out some Chinese chains and I think that is the issue here. Still I could make it fit and work. I don't like all the filing guides that I have seen (never bought or tried one I used more than once), frankly most of them are a pain to use, take forever, and don't do a good job. These I like a lot. Surprisingly quick and easy to use. Almost as fast as when I freehand a square filed chain. I encourage folks to give these a try, just make sure you get the right one for your chain. .325 and .325 Pixel are NOT the same chain as far as these are concerned.
Geez, we have more sharpening threads on this forum than I think anything else. Why is that? On a good note, I have finally figure out how to do a 'multi quote" for the first time after many attempts.  :D ;D

[Magicman]

My Timberline Chainsaw Sharpener came today but it will probably be Saturday before I have an opportunity to use it.  I am anxious.

[btulloh]

"Geez, we have more sharpening threads on this forum than I think anything else."

There are many, but 2-stroke oil discussions outnumber the sharpening threads 50 to 1.

[sawguy21]

I have tried that auto sharpening system, it works reasonably well for the weekend warrior but most who use saws on a regular basis will find it a waste of time and money. It requires a special chain which is not cheap and doesn't last.

[trapper]

My Timberline Chainsaw Sharpener came today but it will probably be Saturday before I have an opportunity to use it.  I am anxious.

mm looking for a report on it

[Magicman]

Yes Marv, I will give it a workout and report back here.

[Pclem]

 An issue with those who sharpen for hire is that they often look for the shortest tooth and set to that and grind them all that short)

Isn't that the only way to sharpen with a grinder? I do all my 404 chains on a grinder, and that's how I do it. Been sharpening a few chains for hire also lately. Is there a better way?

[motzingg]

"Geez, we have more sharpening threads on this forum than I think anything else."

There are many, but 2-stroke oil discussions outnumber the sharpening threads 50 to 1.

Haaaaaaa haha
good one! 
I just plunked down 34 bucks on amazon for the Pferd file doohicky.  I was pretty tempted last time i went to the stihl dealer, same thing but orange plastic made it 45 bucks... funny how standing in front of a wall of $600 chain saws makes a $45 sharpener look like a good value. Ha.   We'll see how it works, my general cheapness and leeryness about anything that smells like a gimmick has had me avoiding all fashion of sharpening aids, file holders, etc.  

[Qweaver]

I was skeptical an these messages tend to agree.  I'll just keep my file.

[motzingg]

I got the Pferd saw sharpener and as others have stated i'm very impressed. 

First of all- made in Germany and very nicely made, high quality nylon injection molded end pieces, the 'guide bars' are chrome or zinc plated ~1/4" solid square, and it holds 2 round files and one flat file together. 

The end snaps off and allows for very easy and quick field replacement of the files. 

It even comes in a nice vinyl pouch that hangs perfectly on the hook in my garage where i hang my extra bars, chans, and skwrench 

The thing i might like best about it is that i usually buy a 2 pack of files and this thing holds 2 files, so no more having a single file in a cardboard blister pack laying around... they should both get dull at the same time (they will last 2x as long as one file the way its designed) and you replace them both together. 

Using it is super simple and idiot proof, it glides really nicely on the chain.  Those big heavy steel bars that lay on top of the cutter teeth move smooth and keep it perfectly in position, all you have to do as a user is match the cut angle, which due to the way you hold the grips on the end cap, you naturally and ergonomically end up able to feel just right how to hold it. 


I was looking at this more as a gimmicky 'chain saw sharpener' but really its just a super well designed file holder, quality is excellent, for how much i use it this thing will probably get passed down to my kids, unless they are cutting down trees with lasers or something by then. 

[teakwood]

(they will last 2x as long as one file the way its designed)

I have noticed that the files doesn't last 2x as long as when you handfile.  when i handfile i roll the file when i make the stroke and IMO that is what gives better use of all the area the file has and that's why they stay sharp long. 
but a small price to pay for the best filing device ever made. 

[motzingg]

That is a good point, i need to look at it again but i'm pretty sure the holder indexes in 90 deg increments so when it gets dull you can pop the file out, turn it 90, and pop it back in. 

As to actual file life, we'll see after it gets some use.  I think my filing technique was so pith-poor before this, that i'll get better file life just by the fact that i'm not kludging my way around hacking at the saw blade. 

I noticed that 2 clean smooth full strokes are enough to touch up a pretty dull chain.  3 or 4 strokes max. 

doing it by hand i was lucky to get something sharp with 6-8 uneven strokes. plus its holding the chain down in the bar so it doesn't pull up and grab the file. 

[Magicman]

@trapper Finally today I had an opportunity to give my new Timberline Sharpener a test, but first I needed to build my "tailgate vice" that I have been thinking about.


 
Nothing more than a 2X8 with a cleat on the bottom and a couple of holes drilled for the stump vice and my hold down bracket with a wingnut underneath the 2X8.



It did an amazing job of securing the chainsaw while I was sharpening the chain.  


 
The chain on the saw had been sharpened many times with my Stihl (Pferd) handheld sharpener until the 13/64 files had become dull and I did not have any spares.  I resorted to sharpening this chain with a 7/32 file in an ordinary Oregon file holder, many times without anything to properly rest the saw on so this chain had been abused.  It was obvious that my eyes see or don't see the chain the same from side to side because all of the teeth on one side had a slightly different angle than the other side.  With the Timberline it is impossible for the sides to have a different tooth angle.

I put the 7/32 carbide in the Timberline and it took three times around to finally sharpen all of the teeth to the same angle and to the same length.  I made light cuts each time and gradually increased the cut depth.


 
Loose metal shaving are visible on the carbide as well as on the tool below the chain.  The tool did an amazing job of truing up this abused chain and leaving a razor edge on all of the teeth.


 
Here is the carbide cutter after sharpening the chain.  Yes, this is a sorta expensive tool but it puts a very precise cutting edge even on a very abused chain.

I got 13/64 carbides to sharpen Stihl chains as well as a 7/32 carbide for sharpening chains that have previously been sharpened with a 7/32 file.

Thanks @Bandmill Bandit for providing a link to this sharpening product.