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Long term lumber storage

Started by Husky546, May 14, 2020, 09:48:23 PM

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Husky546

Hey guys I'm new to the form (long time reader first time poster) and I'm looking for some advice in regards to longer term lumber storage.

So in 2018 my grandpas hunting land got partially logged off. This is a place I have lots of good memories with him and learned a lot from him. He died several years back and the logger who ended up with the contract knew my grandpa well. As a result I was given a large number of the bigger spruce trees on the property to mill.

My plan was to build a house next year but finances just arnt there. Realistically I'm probably looking at the 5-8 year range before I'm ready to build.

I know my situation isn't ideal but it's the boat I'm in and I really would like to use the wood I milled from my grandpas land to build with. (Kind of a way of keeping him with me).

So my question is in regards to longer term lumber storage. The wood has been stacked outside since august 2018 in an area that is wide open and gets lots of wind. The moisture content is getting very close to be able to plane down and build with it i were ready.

My thought is now that the wood is dry I could and probably should move it inside. At my current house I have a large pole shed with a concrete slab.

So as of now my plan is to move the lumber into the pole shed and use a bunch of 4x4 posts to keep the milled lumber off the slab. Also wouldn't plane it until I'm ready to build.

Anyone have knowledge on storing lumber like this or how long lumber in a covered building is good for? I also don't want to go into building a house with floor joists that arnt any good because they are too old.

Thanks for the help

nopoint

I recently aquired some lumber that has been stored in an open shed on stickers since 1982. Besides getting dirty and dusty no issues. This was a three sided shed so plenty of air movement.

Husky546

Mine is enclosed with no windows. I do have two big garage doors on the front that are open most of the time. I would even consider getting some fans and just let them run non stop for air flow. 

The only concern I have is sometimes when it rains the cement is damp not standing water but wet. 

I don't think it's coming from the roof leaking because everything in the shed is dry except the cement. I even have some drywall scraps in a pile and there is zero sign of water on that. 

So I really am at a loss as to why the cement gets damp but it's enough to concern me. 

With that being said the pole shed itself is 30 years old and I'm fairly confident I'd I took it apart I could use the Perlins and rafters again they are solid as can be. 

Don P

The damp is most likely happening when the slab is cool, below dew point, and you have high humidity. It is acting just like a glass of iced tea sweating on a humid day. Airflow would help warm the slab to current conditions and help whisk the moisture away.

If the wood stays dry it is fine for a very long time, I've reused wood that is well over a century old. The wooden tools from King Tut's tomb still looked fine, I don't think pyramids sweat much :D

Husky546

That's very true. Any suggestions for  my slab? It can be super muggy out and it's fine. Only ever an issue when it rains. 

But I guess if I had a super super bad moisture problem i would think it would show up by degrading some of the wood the shed itself is built of right

longtime lurker

 

 

The Shigir Idol is the oldest known wooden artifact in the world. Carbon dating puts it at 11,500 years old, around the end of the last ice age.

That's how long wood could last. The rest is about storage innit? 
The quickest way to make a million dollars with a sawmill is to start with two million.

Ianab

Quote from: longtime lurker on May 15, 2020, 03:40:44 AMThe Shigir Idol is the oldest known wooden artifact in the world. Carbon dating puts it at 11,500 years old, around the end of the last ice age. That's how long wood could last. The rest is about storage innit?


I've got a small clock made from wood that's carbon dated at 40,000 years old. If you want wood to last, bury it in a peat swamp. Wood decays when conditions suit the fungus / bacteria / insects that break it down. If it's too dry / cold / oxygen deprived / borate coated etc, it can last a LONG time. 
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

Trapper John

The only problem I could forsee is if the moisture from the concrete floor could wick past your bottom stickers and degrade your bottom boards.  That is why the wilderness survival books recommended at least two flat rocks stacked underneath the sills at any given location so that this wicking action would be eliminated.  Maybe use pressure treated wood for the bottom stickers (bunks) and keep them a little taller for better air flow.

scsmith42

I'd solve the slab problem by placing clear plastic sheeting on top of it before putting your lumber in place.

If it's fully air dried, you don't need to have it stickered in your barn.
Peterson 10" WPF with 65' of track
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and a mix of log handling heavy equipment.

farmfromkansas

I would cover the top as well, in case  you have a drip like my pole shed has.
Most everything I enjoy doing turns out to be work

Husky546

Well I have 4x4s cut to keep it off the slab itself and I plan on keeping it stickered With some time over the top but I'm really liking the idea of the plastic sheeting on the ground with a couple fans going to keep air moving 

doc henderson

put the sheeting down and try to determine if moisture shows up, is it under the plastic or on top.  on top is condensation or a drip.  under is moisture coming up from the ground saturation when raining.  if it is the second, look to see if there is standing water around the shed, and work on drainage and consider guttering ect.  if you dead stack it and wrap in plastic, you can monitor the MC and or see if the plastic has moisture inside.  if it does, may need to open the ends and stick a box fan blowing into the one end.  just some other ideas.  It may dry some more in the shed, so leaving it stickered is not a bad idea.  you can get a remote temp and humidity monitor.  if it is closed in, that damp concrete may keep the humidity fairly high in the shed.
Timber king 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.  2007 Chevy 3500HD dually, home built log splitter 18 horse 28 gpm with 5 inch cylinder and 32 inch split range with conveyor powered by a 12 volt tarp motor

Don P

Doc makes a good point. The usual test is to duct tape a square of plastic to the slab and check it a few days later to see if there is moisture under the plastic. That will tell you whether it is a humidity issue or a drainage problem. It won't hurt a thing to borate the wood as you restack it and put fans on it till that dries.

Husky546

I'm thinking it has to be coming through the slab. When it rains the concrete is wet. But my workbench truck and all the other junk I have in there is full of dust and isn't wet at all. As far as drainage I'm on a gravel oat and the shed has a good overhang so I'm fairly convinced this is my issue. 

I didn't build the shed but based on some of the remodeling I did on my house it wouldn't shock me if the original owner also didn't know how to pour a slab correctly. Assuming the moisture is coming through the slab will stacking my wood on 4x4 on top of plastic with a fan be adequate to keep things under control? Obviously I do plan on monitoring the moisture content in the wood and making a new plan of if conditions are bad 

Don P

If the wood framing in the shed isn't going south I'd say you should be ok. Like you said just keep an eye on it :).

Randy88

I have lumber stacked inside yet that was sawed by my grandpa back in the early 70's and not to be a smart a## but lumber my house was built out of is under the house roof itself which dates back to 1850's and its still good as the day it was sawed.

If it were mine, I'd lay down some larger beams first to spacer it up off the cement floor some more then stack the lumber on that framework.     If the lumber is dry and inside, stickered and stacked, your fine.     If the cement is just sweating, I'd not even bother with anything laid down to cover the cement, unless your planning for storage like 30 years plus.  The lumber will be the moisture content of whatever the air is in your area, no different that the lumber the shed itself is built out of.      Like Don said, I'd treat the boards for bugs before putting them into storage, but other than that, your good to go.

farmfromkansas

Think the thing to be learned here, is when you build another building, put some plastic down before you pour the slab.
Most everything I enjoy doing turns out to be work

YellowHammer

I'd just broom on a couple coats of either commercial grade concrete sealer, or even some commercial epoxy concrete paint.  I did it with my building, using the clear commercial sealer and it's a very effective moisture seal.  The first coat gets sucked into the concrete, the second coat lays on top, and it's done.  

YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

doc henderson

will make it easier to sweep and or blow away dust and debris.
Timber king 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.  2007 Chevy 3500HD dually, home built log splitter 18 horse 28 gpm with 5 inch cylinder and 32 inch split range with conveyor powered by a 12 volt tarp motor

KenMac

Quote from: YellowHammer on May 24, 2020, 11:25:23 AM
I'd just broom on a couple coats of either commercial grade concrete sealer, or even some commercial epoxy concrete paint.  I did it with my building, using the clear commercial sealer and it's a very effective moisture seal.  The first coat gets sucked into the concrete, the second coat lays on top, and it's done.  
I don't know if you are referring to sealer that is applied after concrete is dry or the kind you apply while wet. I didn't know the latter was available until yesterday when I saw a friend's  new slab. Water was beading on it like a freshly waxed car. It supposedly slows curing and makes the slab stronger.
Cook's AC3667t, Cat Claw sharpener, Dual tooth setter, and Band Roller, Kubota B26 TLB, Takeuchi TB260C

doc henderson

the stuff that goes on wet is referred to as cure and is a water based wax emulsion.  the stuff that goes on later is a sealer and is to slow water penetration, defer staining, ect.  help the concrete not degrade in freeze/thaw with saturation by water.  concrete is porous so anything to make it slick is nice for sweeping, like epoxy.
Timber king 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.  2007 Chevy 3500HD dually, home built log splitter 18 horse 28 gpm with 5 inch cylinder and 32 inch split range with conveyor powered by a 12 volt tarp motor

luap




I have stored lumber in an unheated pole barn just as you are proposing. Stickers on the floor and the first layer of wood was made up of low quality boards. No treatment or covering of the concrete. Some of that wood has been there for over ten years. A year ago I pulled it all out as I was looking for a few select boards and put the rest all back. What I expected to use shortly I dead stacked on top with no stickers as it was plenty dry. One of the long term consequences of owning a mill and only cutting for yourself. 

luap

In addition to my previous comment I would like to add that I have noticed for long term air drying of wood that any lumber with wain on it seems to be where any bug infestations takes place. I assume it is the presence of the sapwood. So those boards are not worth keeping or they need to be edged before storing.

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