Just the Facts, the Crown virus.

[doc henderson]

several of the EUA drugs are "free"  but you have to pay for the administration and pharmacy fees.

[kantuckid]

Like the old story- there are no free rides... 
As a taxpayer, even in retirement with zero income from wages, I do pay for it all.
Some guy from the EU on the NYT's today was going on about how the vaccines are all "free" over there and distribution is equitable, etc., etc..  Like there's no income taxes in the rest of the world? :D
I love my country, happy to stay here and pay my taxes, well sort of on the taxes.
 I never would have guessed that I'd work my ass off 6 & 7 days a week when younger for less money than I now pay in Fed taxes for no work at all.   

[doc henderson]

yes that was the reason for the ""s.   .  It is faster that the government (we who pay taxes) pays for the development and distribution, and no one is excluded due to ability to pay.

[firefighter ontheside]

Another one of my guys is now down with Covid too.  That makes 6 out of our total force of 30 down with covid right now.  Several had it a few weeks ago.  Won't be long and we'll have herd immunity.

[Nebraska]

Sounds like you have a pretty good start on that ffos. Hopefully it's the last of it before you guys get your turn at vaccine which should be soon.

[Texas Ranger]

Local drug store/grocery store casually opened a list for the corona virus.  They are supposed to receive an allotment in 2-3 weeks.  word of mouth got me to the store and signed myself and wife up.  Apparently we are some where below 50 on the list.  Called all my old friends here and told them about the list.

Hopefully it will work.

[firefighter ontheside]

I think it works.  Cindy got the vaccine last night and she hasn't gotten covid yet.  Lol.

[WV Sawmiller]

   Well, my mom seems to be responding well. I talked with her again tonight and she just sounds tired. She seems to have a decent appetite and said the food was good but too salty as her doctor has her on a low salt diet. I suspect the dietician has her records and they have taken that into consideration. It still sounds like she has a couple more days there.

  My younger brother was tested after a confusing day and being sent him then told to come back. He is positive and called from he Brewton Ala ER and sounds like they will admit him tonight. He is high risk as he weighs over 450 lbs and many medical issues. He drove himself to the hospital so I guess his wife will take him anything she can that he needs tomorrow and get tested herself. Of course she can't go see him but I guess if she has the virus too maybe they can share a room. I will be very surprised if my SIL mom does not end up with it. She went in today for other problems but was negative and only dehydrated. The old lady is 95 and her daughter, my SIL, has other health risks too. We will see if they can pull out of this.

EDIT/UPDATE: My brother just called back and said the ER said his breathing was okay so they sent him home with some cold medicine and  with some Tylenol for body aches (which he says he won't take) so evidently they decided admission not warranted. Hopefully that is a good sign. Sounds better than him being in the horsepistol.

  On the earlier postings I like the idea of the special teams going around giving the vaccines. That looks to me like the most accurate and fastest way to get the most people vaccinated. Yes, they are tons of people who can give injections but the worst thing would be if they accidently mishandle and damage the vaccine then inject something that will not work giving the patient a false sense of security putting them and others at risk. Also if that happens a good vaccine might get a bad rep and others might be reluctant to take it.

 I worked all over the world and got medicines in some  real dumps in remote pharmacies in Africa, MidEast and South America and survived them all. The hardest place I ever lived and worked to get treatment or medicine was Norway. Great country, great medical care but with socialized medicine you just about had to go to see the doctor to get an aspirin. There were very few OTC medicines available. They were very concerned about antibiotic abuse and you had to be on death's door to get them. In Saudi, Africa or South America I would go tell the "Chemist" or Framacia what I wanted and they'd give it to be. It might be killing a fly with a sledge hammer but by granny when I hit that fly he did not get up and buzz me again. You did have to read the contra indications and be careful as they did not ask you about allergies or such. "You say you have these symptoms? Take this pill."

[Ianab]

The freezers for the Pfizer vaccine arrived in NZ today. 
Covid-19: Ultra-cold vaccine freezers arrive in Auckland | Stuff.co.nz

Going to be well into next year before the vaccine arrives, but I can understand it being sent to places where people are currently dying as a higher priority. 

From what I have read the Pfizer vaccine needs ~ -70C for long term storage, but will keep for maybe a week in a regular clinic freezer, then a day once it's thawed out to administer. So that's workable in terms of distribution. Needs a bit of planning and co-ordination, but nothing impossible. 

I think the speed of the operation is going to be limited as much by the productions and distribution side of things, not the number of staff on the ground. There are factors like how to make enough of the toughened glass vials that can handle the low temps (normal glass will shatter) 

NZ plan is to distribute to normal Drs and Clinics who are going to be responsible for arranging their own patients getting the shots.   

[kantuckid]

Local drug store/grocery store casually opened a list for the corona virus.  They are supposed to receive an allotment in 2-3 weeks.  word of mouth got me to the store and signed myself and wife up.  Apparently we are some where below 50 on the list.  Called all my old friends here and told them about the list.

Hopefully it will work.

IMO, based on news items, Texas has one of the more logical vaccine plans as far as first providers, vulnerable seniors, etc.. 
It does seem rather odd though to have the "list" being done word of mouth? We all know there are seniors who get lost in the shuffle if they don't have kids or neighbors as is common. Even in my own family, I had an aunt in CA who had little contact with her own kids, my Uncle died long before she did and mostly little contact with the real world. Sadly, lots of people get lost in old age. lets hope there's a plan to locate them. Many are said to be afraid to leave their homes right now.

[firefighter ontheside]

No doubt you're right Kantuckid.  Information about who can get it and when has been slow to disseminate.  I think that's partly because those who should know don't know/haven't been informed.  My local county health department was completely left out of the loop.  Good news is that they just announced that they will be having vaccine within a month and expect to be giving shots before end of January.  I don't know who will be eligible at that point.  Will it be for first responders and elderly?  Will it be for anyone who wants it?  As discussed earlier my dad is 77 and mom 70.  Dad will be eligible the same time I am as a first responder.  Will I be able to take my dad with me when I get it?  I'm kind of glad that my mill is down.  I'm imagining a time table that has me and dad getting at least our first shots, if not the second dose before I get the mill up and running again.  To work with dad without having to wear a mask would be great.  Of course, I may have to take him fishing before that.  I haven't gone fishing with him in over a year.  That hasn't happened since I was able to go fishing.

[dougtrr2]

Does anyone know how the accounting for the second dose will be handled?  If the company is producing X number of doses per day at some point when the second dose is due, the daily production would go toward second doses and there would be a large reduction in first doses available.  Or will production be ramped up to cover it by that point?  I haven't seen any discussion of the logistics of that issue.

Doug in SW IA

[thecfarm]

I wonder if the ones with log term conditions, like me with COPD, be up on the list to get it before others?

[kantuckid]

Does anyone know how the accounting for the second dose will be handled?  If the company is producing X number of doses per day at some point when the second dose is due, the daily production would go toward second doses and there would be a large reduction in first doses available.  Or will production be ramped up to cover it by that point?  I haven't seen any discussion of the logistics of that issue.

Doug in SW IA

The Navy Admiral, asst HHS sec, Brett Giror, MD who we see on the news now and then- older guy with gray hair- said recently that they hold the 2nd doses in readiness to match/meet the needs to whats already been injected.
FWIW, he was on Martha Mc Callum last nite and It truly pleased me to see him call attention to and talk down some political rumor material that's been out in the so-called news cycles. He really has his stuff together IMO and talks facts. .

[azmtnman]

The freezers for the Pfizer vaccine arrived in NZ today.
Covid-19: Ultra-cold vaccine freezers arrive in Auckland | Stuff.co.nz

From what I have read the Pfizer vaccine needs ~ -70C for long term storage, but will keep for maybe a week in a regular clinic freezer, then a day once it's thawed out to administer. So that's workable in terms of distribution.

-70C is -95F!!! I've been wondering about the units used to store it. I did refrigeration for 20 years in a previous life. Anything that cold is a tall order and not a typical or mass produced unit--at least not in the U.S. 

[Ljohnsaw]

Anything that cold is a tall order and not a typical or mass produced unit--at least not in the U.S.

I worked with a guy for a few years that his previous employer was a bio-tech pharma group.  He was the facility manager and would get alarms whenever the bank of freezers would deviate from there extreme set points.  He had a big bank of backup generators, tested regularly, ready and waiting for power disruptions.  Huge sums of money invested on what was in the freezers.

[doc henderson]

the folks that got Pfizer dose 1 , is supposed to get Pfizer for the second dose, and that is accounted for as 2 doses allocated.  yes some folks without a doc, may fall through the cracks, but should be able to report to a clinic and get on the list.

[Bandmill Bandit]

I just read an article on the CBC news web site, Reporting that there are now 2 more virulent strains of the virus. One In England and a second in South Africa. 

Will the vaccines cover them? So far the scientists are saying they "generally satisfied" that the one in England will be covered, BUT they don't have enough data yet to unequivocally declare that as a factual statement.

The one in South Africa? ZREO data as it is only a couple of days since discovery. 

It is highly possible that the vaccines may be a moot point UNLESS the vaccines can be Tweaked and deployed faster that the emerging evolution of this virus.

This is scary beyond any war and yet could be a cause of war on top of it all. 

There are prediction rumors floating around that this could wipe out a 1/3 or more of the population on the planet. Weather that is based on worst case scientific modeling OR someone's interpretation biblical prophecy in Revelation, I have no idea.

What I know is that it is ugly and it going to get a HELL of a lot worse before it gets better, IF it gets better!        

       

[Magicman]

-70C is -95F!!! I've been wondering about the units used to store it.

I suspect that they are using dry ice and that happens to be the temperature with a bit of lee-way.  Just a convenient and sorta economical way to ship and store.

[kantuckid]

Anything that cold is a tall order and not a typical or mass produced unit--at least not in the U.S.

I worked with a guy for a few years that his previous employer was a bio-tech pharma group.  He was the facility manager and would get alarms whenever the bank of freezers would deviate from there extreme set points.  He had a big bank of backup generators, tested regularly, ready and waiting for power disruptions.  Huge sums of money invested on what was in the freezers.

One of my cohearts in vo-tech school taught artificial insemination-a very common practice that uses liquid nitrogen for extreme cold to store bull serum. That's been around for years- it would seem to me the real challenge beyond having the vaccine itself would be the shear immensity of the overall event logistically not just knowing how to keep stuff cold but rather on such a scale.
Yes they've showed the dry ice on TV news over and over. Even groceries  stores out west sell dry ice for customers to get food home. We used to buy it to make mysterious punch bowls too. 

[azmtnman]

I wondered about dry ice. We have to use it out here as @Kantuckid says to get frozen stuff home from the 4 hour drive from the nearest big metropolitan area. 
I saw Ianab news article where they were "delivering the freezers." 
Dry ice is solidified carbon dioxide and can be dangerous in enclosed spaces as it "melts" and would need good ventilation. I suppose a standard deep freeze with dry ice in it would suffice and slow the "melting" process. 
I'm just curious as I sometimes overlook the simple solution. 

[firefighter ontheside]

I read that for now, they are saving half of the doses received for use as the second dose.  When supply becomes more regular they will consider using all doses as first doses, knowing they will receive more by the time 3 or 4 weeks have passed since first dose.  

Dry ice is being used to keep the stuff cold in transit, but it is not what keeps the refrigeration units cold.  They have units that can achieve the cold needed.  I don't know how they do so compared to regular freezers, but I'm sure it is similar, but on a bigger scale.  

[alan gage]

Picked up a scratchy throat on Monday and decided to play it safe. Got tested early Tuesday morning and did some work on the house feeling pretty good. By Tuesday night my scratchy throat was about gone but my nose was starting to plug and I began to feel more like I was sick.

Wednesday i was slower and achier. At lunch it seemed i was loosing my taste. Very lethargic wednesday afternoon, started to pick up a cough, and felt like a pretty good fever when I went to bed. Slept pretty bad.

Today (thurs) the fever seems to be gone but cough is a little worse. Taste and smell all but gone. Very achy and lethargic. 

Figured it was a foregone conclusion but results came back today and I'm negative. Think I'll continue to isolate just in case the test was wrong.

When I got my test I'd had symptoms for nearly 24 hours (scratchy throat) so I'm assuming the test should have picked up covid if I have it, correct?

Alan

[Ianab]

The freezers have been specially made in advance ( part of the warp speed operation) Someone was smart enough realise that they would be needed to distribute the vaccine. I think they are being set up in the main cities, and stocks can be dispatched from there to local clinics, packed with dry ice etc .

[firefighter ontheside]

 @alan gage thats the best course of action if you can do it.  It's possible to test negative when symptoms are nil or slight.  It's also possible that you have something else like flu or just a cold.  It's getting ridiculous.  We just had another guy test positive.  Good thing for us is that he hasn't been at work in over a week.  We are up to 7 current positives out of 30 guys.  One of which is out on disability.  The only good news is that the other one who was on disability comes back to work tomorrow.