Just the Facts, the Crown virus.

[SwampDonkey]

We, speaking for myself, just cannot stop living based on germs and viruses even though our politicians are hard at work trying to force new mandates as this virus thing heats up even more.

Aside from a vaccine, mask wearing in public, distancing and extra hygiene I'm not doing anything else any different than I ever have. Only thing mandates have stopped for me personally is crossing borders for day trips. I never did much shopping in the US, probably never spent more than $40 a trip and most not even that. Just something we always did for something to do sake. Might have a meal at Brookside Restaurant, but don't really miss it. Good cook'n right here at the house. :D
This pandemic hasn't affected work for me at all, I work in the boonies with the moose, partridge and red squirrels. They don't tend to carry much of concern. :D

[wisconsitom]

SwampDonkey said "This pandemic hasn't affected work for me at all, I work in the boonies" to which I can add, pretty much same here, although I can only hope to see a moose.

But it turns out that at least here in Wisconsin, white-tailed deer appear to be almost universally infected with covid!  I rarely go hug deer though and I bet you don't either, my New Brunswickian friend!

[doc henderson]

@wisconsitom are the deer dying from it, or are the conservation people testing live deer, or just those that are harvested.  where are you getting data?  thanks

[Dan_Shade]

Re: covid in deer

I haven't seen any details on mortalities, but I I've seen several articles discussing Covid in deer 


Link to NPR article

[Claybraker]

@doc henderson I think that was blue tongue in cheek. Down here deer are dying from gun shot wounds. One of the local processors had to close because the 150 deer brought in Saturday exceeded their capacity. City folks look at you like you're speaking latin when you mention longissimus dorsi or psoas major.  Almost as funny to watch them at the deer cooler as trying to back a trailer at the boat launch.

[SwampDonkey]

First I've heard about it to. I went looking and there is one study at least posted in here:

SARS-CoV-2 exposure in wild white-tailed deer

Supplemental

SARS-COV-2 in Animals

[doc henderson]

looks like a 30 to 40% (range 7 to 68%) sero positive deer for covid sars 2. of those exposed, so I wondered how they arrived at a 100% rate.  thanks.

[SwampDonkey]

We are outside the native range up this way and the population is quite sparse. White tails first showed up here around 1910 I believe and that comes from research by Gerry Parker for his books written about guiding and hunting big game up here. He was a research biologist and currently Scientist Emeritus with Canadian Wildlife Service in Sackville, NB.

[wisconsitom]

Maybe I was a little over dramatic.  I can't remember where I have been seeing this reportage, nor do I really know what actual percentage of herd infected to be.

But it's early days on this.  I doubt it's been accurately characterized yet.  It does appear however that deer are at the least, carriers of the virus.

[doc henderson]

fair enough!  thanks. Doc.

[kantuckid]

Sort of testing the waters here :
 Molnupiravir the new pill suggested to handle the omicron virus costs ~ $700 per treatment in non-3rd world markets. Only a couple days previous to this new pills FDA vote and approval by a narrow margin-my wife & I got an email from our KY teacher retirement folks about Medicare costs going up, in their words, "more dollars than ever in the program's history"-it's 14.5%. They go on to explain that the increase is likely to cover the costs for both various new covid treatments combined with medical procedures that were put off during the early down covid medical period of no or few services. Our retirement place has two FT pharmacist's so they have a professional viewpoint, no doubt. Given that our plan includes a paid for Medicare Supplemental while we retirees pay our part of Medicare Plan B from out SS or out of pocket it's newsworthy for us. I am one of the extremely rare teacher retirement people who get any SS at all, so the vast majority nationwide pay out of pocket for Plan B if a retired government worker, like teachers, etc.. 

Maybe I can do a "Go fund me" thing here on this health thread if it comes down to the covid pill?  :-\

[SwampDonkey]

Got notice last week on health insurance increase of 4.3%, that's on par with most years and last year was no increase which was a surprise. Up here a lot of the plans are partially covered by medicare from government, so less risk to insurance company.

[Walnut Beast]

FACT!!   The traveler that brought Omnicron was fully vaccinated CDC says 

[SwampDonkey]

Not sure about 'the' traveller, maybe it was the first case found in the US? Umm, what is the mandate on travel?? Usually you have to be vaccinated on air travel, so when you're just testing vaccinated travellers, what you going to expect? :D Your 'test' of vaccinated vs unvaccinated is already botched. The two found last weekend in Ottawa were vaccinated, had a PCR test before boarding and not detected until the required test in Canada as a follow up requirement. Again, you can not come here on an airline unless vaccinated.

So far I have heard only mild cases in vaccinated patents. The 'thinking' without enough data, is this is very infectious, but not as deadly. Be 2 or 3 weeks before that is 'backed up' with data. So far the vaccine is helping fight the infection. No point is screaming a vaccinated person got infected anymore, vaccines are still helping reduce severity in most patients. There are still folks who are vaccinated getting severely ill, those are the % whose immune system can't handle the virus well. So none of the vaccines gave you 100 % chance of protection and then with time the 'theoretical' protection rate has declined and no one knew how long. That message was repeated a billion times by doctors, 'we don't know for how long'. Because you can't start at zero info and make up the numbers for 1 , 5 or 10 years from now.

[Walnut Beast]

Some of the top scientists are saying the mass multiple vaccinations world wide may have some serious problems and that it may be promoting mutations. Israel is the second highest vaccinated and their cases are really up 🤔

[kantuckid]

Well, the newest mass hysteria is upon us? : In the several newspapers I read today omicron is THE topic. That in spite of the fact that the South Africa lady doc says there are only 4 mild cases there so far. In my more local newspaper, an editorial from a local university public health professor is all over this omicron thing advocating all the things we should be doing to curtail this virus variant-all that stuff we've heard before. Same guy says like any virus it will go on and on and on mutating. So: whats really new?

I see human nature kicking in (as if it hasn't happened) and we'll either get more fearsome & worried, or turn off the stuff all together.  

Cute but scarry (to me) TV news from AU showing the roadblocks from two covid quarantine camp escapees being sought after. 
Report was followed by saying the Canadian regs saying the un-vaccinated can no longer board a plane or train. In the USA if that happens... 8) 

[doc henderson]

We are peaking again with delta and the nurse shortage.  I got called in to work yesterday.  we have been on diversion for a week, and no place in our state or a contiguous state to transfer to.  We did send one patient to Tulsa 3 days ago.  The omicron "is what it is" and will get here in a few months prob.  9 out of 10 folks needed to be in the hospital are not vaccinated.  even the people we sent home to return for monoclonal infusion, were nearly all unimmunized.

[Paul_H]

It seems crazy firing healthcare workers for not wanting the jab. It's happening here in Canada too and may get worse unless others in the industry speak up especially knowing that the vaccinated can spread infection as good as anyone. Lots of capable healthcare workers sidelined,makes no sense unles the system is intentionally being broken.

[LeeB]

No idea if it's related to omicron, but the number of spam calls I'm receiving has exploded since it was announced.

[SwampDonkey]

Back before COVID the dismantling of infrastructure and thus ICU beds has been going on since 2000, both in the USA and Canada and rural centres are the first targets. And continues during these times. Is there any wonder they are worried about overwhelming the system.

Here's a video, and take it for what it's worth, but it's pretty close to reality no matter what side of the fence you stand on. Yeah, there might be a few jabs in the gut but gives some perspective. Sobering.

US Closing Hospitals At Record Pace During Pandemic - YouTube

[SwampDonkey]

No idea if it's related to omicron, but the number of spam calls I'm receiving has exploded since it was announced.

Over the last 3 years, 9 out of 10 calls I get is spam and scam. Someone is still looking for a Joanie in all that time, that's my favorite one. :D The phone companies know who they are. How couldn't they? They run the darn network. The 'no idea who they are' doesn't fly.

[SwampDonkey]

Report was followed by saying the Canadian regs saying the un-vaccinated can no longer board a plane or train. In the USA if that happens... 8)

That was coming into effect anyway before omicron, there was a transition period since October 30th. I'm sure some other stuff has been tweaked a bit since though.
COVID-19 Boarding flights and trains in Canada ? Travel.gc.ca

You have had to be fully vaccinated to enter into the country by plane for some time.

[doc henderson]

very interesting.  most hospitals have boards, and they try to change staff and physical plant use to meet community demands.  bigger one's plan to be the tertiary care destination with neonatal and burn unit specialties.  The clog in the ICU occurs when a pandemic shows up and large percentages of the population gets sick all at once.  We do not discriminate against covid or car accident victim.  The problem is the numbers of sick, and with covid and are often in the icu on a vent for over 2 weeks then often do not recover.  no choice is made to care for one over the other, but you run out of rooms, staff, and equipment.  Small rural health clinics and hospitals only stay open with government subsidy.  The "free" clinic behind us gets a 5-million-dollar grant to expand about every 3 years.  I watched part of the video, and it seems he feels someone is doing this on purpose.  Most are decisions made locally by the board to best serve the community or region.  When a ship was sent to NY after they begged for ventilators, then they barely utilized the beds.  tough decisions.  We take the best care of people we can, but there are limits beyond our control.  It is not Christmas, or using your parents credit card, there are costs and limits to what can be done.  Mitigation and the vaccine are part of the big plan.  I do not agree with mandates, but I do agree with getting vaccinated.  It is like the guy that goes out driving around in a flood and now is stuck and needs rescued.  apologize all you want, but others have now put their lives at risk to save you.  We also try to save the life of the guy holding a family at gun point after they are taken down by police.  And the impossible meth addict that comes in for the 40th time threatening all the staff and disrupting the care of everyone else.  I do not know how the vaccine and the newest virus will pan out, but we keep showing up for work.

[wisconsitom]

My 92 year-old mom had to go to the hospital yesterday, here in this medium-sized city.  Broken hip, return of cancer....I think she would qualify for a bed.

Too bad all the beds are filled with covid patients.  She had to hang out in the ER overnight.  This same hospital is sending patients to Kenosha, a hundred and a half miles away.

This is an anecdote, a factual one.

[Paul_H]

   Mitigation and the vaccine are part of the big plan.  I do not agree with mandates, but I do agree with getting vaccinated.  It is like the guy that goes out driving around in a flood and now is stuck and needs rescued.  apologize all you want, but others have now put their lives at risk to save you.  We also try to save the life of the guy holding a family at gun point after they are taken down by police.  And the impossible meth addict that comes in for the 40th time threatening all the staff and disrupting the care of everyone else.  I do not know how the vaccine and the newest virus will pan out, but we keep showing up for work.

No it's not like that. Your last statement says it ,you don't know if the vaccines will work.You don't agree with mandates but take it anyway because it's part of the big plan. There doesn't seem to be a proper control group in this massive experiment and I have not heard any real alternative to this unconstitutional mandate.
Some are pushing for doctor assisted suicide or termination of pregnancies but it's somehow important to these same people that we don't die of covid.  They say we will clog up a system that is short handed because of concerned doctors and nurses that have lost their jobs because they object to the big untested plan.
It's been talked about before here that millions went to work in 2020 unprotected by any ppe because of shortages and did it gladly to make sure Dr's and nurses were protected. Millions of people put their lives on the line everyday in hundreds of different industries,(oil&gas,logging,mining,driving taxi,711 clerks) for a paycheck quietly in the pursuit of happiness under the constitution.