Anyone have any comments about the ms362? I use an 026 pro and the 201 with good results. I was curious about the new carb i.e. reliability and the power to weight.
Thanks
Rusty
We're getting one here at work this week I believe. I'll let ya know how it goes, but can't help you on the longterm part of it.
Happy with mine so far.
mines ok,but my old 044 outcuts it, and is better balanced.
the 362 is a little underpowered IMHO, but it starts well,and seems to run ok.
make sure you grease the clutch bearing before using,the dealers dont tell you they are shipped dry.
I've had a 362 for a couple years now and I think its a nice all around saw. Mine pulls through virgin growth oak nicely with a 20, but bogs a bit with a 24. At a glance the air filtration system in the 362 C-M appears to be superior.
Too clumcy really, for a 60cc saw - but there are worse ones out there...
Pay no attention to SawTroll , he hates Stihl :D
I've got a 261C and 441C and both have been great and anything in reviews I've seen to do with the 362 has been mostly good . I would not be concerned with buying one but I already have a couple 60cc Husky saws .
Quote from: nitehawk55 on September 26, 2015, 08:53:46 PM
Pay no attention to SawTroll , he hates Stihl :D
.....
No, I only "hate" the badly designed ones, as I do with any brand.
I love the MS361, but that's a totally different design - lighter, neater and "peppier".
Quote from: SawTroll on September 26, 2015, 10:25:26 PM
Quote from: nitehawk55 on September 26, 2015, 08:53:46 PM
Pay no attention to SawTroll , he hates Stihl :D
.....
No, I only "hate" the badly designed ones, as I do with any brand.
I love the MS361, but that's a totally different design - lighter, neater and "peppier".
I can't believe I'm seeing Niko say he loves a Stihl!!!
Quote from: skipster on September 20, 2015, 05:40:20 AM
mines ok,but my old 044 outcuts it, and is better balanced.
the 362 is a little underpowered IMHO, but it starts well,and seems to run ok.
make sure you grease the clutch bearing before using,the dealers dont tell you they are shipped dry.
Do ya think the dealers know the bearing is dry?
yep.
their answer to my query about this was " the bearing is lubricated in the factory,and doesnt need any further grease before using.
I've seen 4 brand new saws now,with totally dry clutch bearings.
One had done about 8 hours work,and you could see wear on the shaft already.
That dry bearing isn't dry from the factory. In reality it needs very little grease. When using the saw once the clutch engages that bearing doesn't turn, its locked in place. The only time it is being used is at idle when chain isn't engaged. So a 1000 hours of use at WOT would wear it none at all. Lot of people let them idle a lot and that could wear it over time. You really shouldn't let any saw or two stroke engine idle much, it builds up carbon.
Not sure I follow how does it not turn at all at wot? It makes sense to me that it doesn't, because it's a chintzy little bearing and if it was turning at wot that thing wouldn't last long at all. Just curious on the mechanics of it.
Quote from: 4x4American on September 28, 2015, 07:41:22 AM
Not sure I follow how does it not turn at all at wot? It makes sense to me that it doesn't, because it's a chintzy little bearing and if it was turning at wot that thing wouldn't last long at all. Just curious on the mechanics of it.
I never thought about it before but Texas is wright. Once the clutch locks up the crank and the clutch turn at the same rpm. If it didn't that bearing would need a lot more lubrication to survive.
Well if it didnt lock up that bearing might last half an hour at best. 4x4 if you look at any chainsaw clutch you can spin clutch by hand. But when you give it throttle the clutch shoes expand and grab the clutch housing. At that point the clutch turns at what ever speed the saw is running. The bearing never spins again till the clutch shoes release.
One of the hardest things on that bearing is to start a saw on fast idle with the chain brake on and leave it on fast idle too long, then it has the chain and clutch pulling hard on that bearing. Steve
Stihl felt that grease draws dirt which is a whole other problem .
Hawk thats actually a very good point, it often surprises me that any saw can last for years. They live in an incredibly hostile environment. I try to get point across to my customers to keep their saw sharp. Dull means a lot more fine dust to get every where. But some people wont listen.
Ahhh I get it now, never really thought about it thanks boys.
Yes fine sawdust brings fine sand and dirt grit along with it.
But a sharp chip making chain will still bring in grit.
Like the bar's sprocket nose you grease it every tank full to purge out the moisture and dirt or don't do it at all to prevent the grease from attracting dirt.
I only greased the nose daily on in the winter to prevent melted snow from freezing at the end of the day. Didn't bother with the clutch bearing.
My experience I only put a light film of grease on the drum bearing with my finger whenever I change the sprocket rim.
I just picked up an MS362 with a 20" bar and I'm curious about the greasing recommendations discussed in this thread. What's the recommendation then? Does the clutch bearing and the bar nose sprocket need to be greased? I'm not even sure my bar has the inlet hole to add grease to the bar nose sprocket. I'm going to check it when I get home. I've read the OM and do not see anything about greasing anything in that. Also, what does "WOT" mean?
WOT
Wide Open Throttle
Nose sprocket doesn't need grease. Clutch bearing... very little when changing chain.
I would say grease the clutch bearing when you change the rim sprocket not every time you change the chain. That'll end up with too much grease on it imo.
I didn't make myself clear.. but meant to do the grease the FIRST time the chain was changed on a new saw.
I agree, every time would be too much. And just a very thin film of grease too.
Ok thanks for the clarification!!!
Quote from: 4x4American on September 30, 2015, 10:47:28 AM
I would say grease the clutch bearing when you change the rim sprocket not every time you change the chain. That'll end up with too much grease on it imo.
The plastic caged clutch bearings is a weak point on the 362 (and the 261). Keep spares, and change it at the first hint of trouble. That way you hopefully avoid more extensive damage.
I change that needle bearing every time i change sprocket drum. Its 5 bucks and I don't want that drum getting up against parts and getting hot. On polymer housing its a death blow. Guy brought one in shop still under warranty, left it sitting idling with brake on. He idled it up because he was afraid it would die, well with brake on those shoes sat rubbed on drum till it cooked whole side of the saw. he yelled at me and threatened to take me outside because I wouldn't fix it under warranty.
What are the part numbers for those bearings you recommend having extras of for the MS362 and MS251 saws? Also, Texas-Jim, what do you mean he cooked the whole side of the saw? I'm not trying to be antagonistic at all I'm seriously just curious because I'm so new to this, and I have a serious investment in these saws and I guess I'm just kind of concerned that you can't have these $500 to $800 saws idle for a bit with the chain brake on or it will damage the saw enough to void the warranty? I'll never use the chain brake then I guess.
Easy easy woodsdog2015! Use the chain brake, just don't let it idle extensively with it on. When I'm clearing land or falling trees I idle the saws quite a bit, many folks do, without major problems. Most times I don't have the chain brake on when it's idling btu sometimes it does. I am an advocate of the chain brake, it's a handy little tool that helps keeps your limbs intact. Think that's worth a little $5 bearing that can be changed in 5 min? That little bearing can be had at any Stihl dealer. I think for pro saws they're all the same but not 100% on that one just ask for the plastic needle roller bearing.
Now answer me this Stihl mechanics, what about the quickstop versions? Them things anytime they're running and set down on the ground the chain brake is on.
:D It just seems like these things are made to use not pamper but what do I know ??? I agree with you though 4x4 the bearing is a modest investment but it seems a little ridiculous with the price they charge for these things that it comes down to a $5 part.. that's my point.
Dont get me wrong, i love the brake, its a great invention on chainsaws. But the saw should be idle adjusted to where the chain will not turn when idling. If it does turn and you engage the brake there is a great source of heat generation. If you cant get your saw to idle low enough it needs be repaired. You have two pieces of steel rubbing together and they get hot and get hot fast. When i said it cooked the saw, remember the stihls have polymer housing. Well the non pro saws all have polymer ones. That heat generated is high enough to melt to the point of failure the engine housing. I have one at work i will take pic on Friday so you can see,
Texas-Jim, understood about the polymer housing, I'd love to see the pics. But the MS362 is a pro saw right? Also, nobody supplied the part numbers for the needle bearings to have extras on hand as recommended. I would like to pick them up for my MS251 and MS362. Thanks!
Yes 362 is pro saw, but theres plenty of stuff under there to be damaged by heat, including crank shaft seals. I think its # 9512 003 3061 but I'm not at work so i could be wrong but ill look tomorrow. i think the 251 uses a different one, But i will be happy get you both numbers and post them when i get home.
Awesome Texas Jim thanks for your help!
one other niggle about the 362 i have is that here in australia,the dealers equip them with a cheaper laminated bar. Pretty ordinary on a pro saw IMHO,particularily at the prices we have to pay out here.
Skipster,
Probably the dealers do that to increase their profit margin. If they are supposed to charge $749 for a MS362 which includes the bar, an extra chain, a scrench, and a bar scabbard and the bar they give you is a cheaper one and they sell the higher probar individually, they're making more off of two customers now instead of one. I don't know I don't have a problem with my dealer its a great shop and he does things for no charge so I'm not complaining at all. My point is that a pro saw should not be as fragile as a non pro saw. If you're paying more for more saw it should be for durability as well.
That's one of the main reasons for buying a pro saw- durability. And more power...they don't make a 90cc homeowner saw lol
As long as you're attentive you should be fine. I like to walk with the chain brake on, and most times the saw is idling. But I'm not walking long distances. The brake being on with it idling for 30 seconds doesn't seem to bother. Of course it's a different story when your operator presence lever doesn't work. Then you tend to be a bit more careful. A stick or twig hits that throttle and off she goes, and you better hope the same stick didn't trip you when you were walking to get the saw now you're falling face first on a spinning chain with no one around for miles and no cell service. lol Good way to bleed to death!
[/size]Often times when I'm dropping a tree and she's past the point of no return, and it's my time to get away. I pull the saw out and in the same motion apply the chain brake. So that when I'm getting outta there, I'm not worrying about a spinning chain. And the saw is idling. I've been nicked three times by a spinning chain in these particular situations where I'm getting outta there, so I pretty regularly do it now. Sometimes these sorta things happen. [size=78%]
woodsdog those needle bearing numbers are MS 251 is 9512 933 2260 and the MS 362 is 9512 933 2380. I also installed new Partsmart on my home comp so if any one needs numbers ill be happy give them. The old media cat is no longer supported and most wont work now.
Skipster you can get either bar you want, just ask for it. but to be honest theres no difference in wear between the two bars and a lot of extra weight.
Thanks much Texas-Jim! 8)
Texas-Jim are you a Stihl Dealer or do you work for a dealership? Thanks again for your help.
Quote from: Texas-Jim on October 01, 2015, 10:32:55 AM
Yes 362 is pro saw, but theres plenty of stuff under there to be damaged by heat, including crank shaft seals. I think its # 9512 003 3061 but I'm not at work so i could be wrong but ill look tomorrow. i think the 251 uses a different one, But i will be happy get you both numbers and post them when i get home.
The inboard clutch does of course aggravate the problem with plastic caged bearings, as it locks more heat in the area in question. The combination is a bad one, and it is hard to understand how they could do such a thing....
Great, I just paid a lot a money for an inheritantly faulty design? I was using the MS251 this am bucking some cherry that the power company took down last year about this time for firewood and that saw works great but the nose sprocket always seems to bind. I have to take it down, clean out the rails and the oiler holes seem to plug up quickly...Its not like I use my saws and put them away I usually take everything down at the end of the day and clean the sprocket area, bar, rails, oil inlet holes etc. and I just sawed maybe a face cord or so and I had to break the saw down and clean everything up because its starts to bind. Is that your experiences?
Yah, you better quick sell it based on Sawtroll's comment... :D :D
When you clean out the rails, make sure to pull the derbis away from the sprocket nose. I blow mine out with compressed air. I rarely have a problem with the sprocket nose binding up, if it is, I replace it. You can drill out your oiler holes a little bit wider too, many folks do that. I don't usually have so much problems as you are having with my Stihls. I don't know if Sawtroll has run these 362s very much but I have plenty of tanks through mine and I have had nothing but good experiences with it. Remember, the dealer sees the worst case scenarios alot of the time. I idle mine with the chain brake on plenty, and don't have a problem. Don't get worked up about it, and remember, it's still under factory warranty, you can't go wrong. They hold their value, if you wish to sell it in say 6 months, which I highly doubt you'll want to, you'll prolly be able to get $250 less than you paid for it. But I don't know your area. Around here used saws are spendy.
Sawtroll as long as the saw is turning the chain theres no real build up of heat that only happens with brake on. Is it a bad design, in my experience no. Its simple to repair, simple to replace sprockets, I'm not saying it couldn't be better but its not a bad design by any means. I have lot of people fuss about the bearing but its designed to be sacrificial. It forces the user to replace it at intervals, and its lot cheaper than a crank shaft.
woodsdog I work for a ranch and home store, I'm a mechanic and have been near 40 years. We are going to start handling Echo soon. I like them they are good saws as well. We already sell Stihl, Husqvarna, and the one saw i hate Poulan.
4x4 never be afraid idle a saw with brake on, just make sure idle is low enough its no trying pull the chain and theres no worries. But you bring saw in where that has happened, its not covered under warranty. Warranty covers defects in material and workmanship, it does not cover miss use by the user. Stihl has a very good warranty but no company can afford warranty something that is beyond their control. Its like a string trimmer, if you pull the guard off of it, you pull warranty off at same time. I spend a lot of time educating customers on maintenance just so it helps them.
I ain't never been skeered of nothin!
Don't get me wrong my MS251 bucked some huge maple and it is a very light and nimble saw with a lot of power for its size. My brother in law bought the venerable MS250 at the same time last December and he likes his a lot too but you can tell the MS251 has more power. I cleaned the bar nose sprocket out pretty good yesterday morning and there was still a lot of debris in there so that's whats causing it to bind. I think its partially my fault as when I was bucking that bigger stuff I plunged in a several times to expand my cutting radius with the 18" bar and I think that probably didn't help. I'm like the stihl saws so far I guess I'm just hoping for use it and put it away durability that just cannot happen with any mechanical equipment that gets hard use.
if you open up the muffler on your 251 youll notice an increase in power. If u grease the sprocket nose it will attract crud. Once you start greasing you gotta keep at it. I just hit mine with some wd40 or similar after i blow it out with compressed air. Works fine. Never binds up. If
I'm with 4x4, i don't grease it either. If you keep bar channel clean it gets all the oil in needs. Mufflers are tuned to create a certain harmonic. That actually keeps fuel inside the cylinder to some degree. At some point both ports are open so fresh fuel is pushed out of the exhaust. That was the idea behind stratified engines, to stop that. But when you create that harmonic to slow fuel loss it takes power away, so if you have less power then how is a saw more efficient?
More flow = more go I figure.