I am thinking of building a power feed for the carriage on my homemade mill but don't have a clue what type of motor I should be looking for that will work.
I don't know what type of 12 volt motor could handle being run constantly without burning out. I had thought maybe a winch motor but I don't know if it would last.
E-bay... Tarp motor. 12v
I went with wheelchair motors. 24v is easier to find.
I assume you mean a tarp motor like off a dump truck? What would you use for speed control, a PWM control?
Go to E-bay and just type in tarp motor. It's one of your only choice for a 12v
gear motor. I don't know the rpm but I watched them run at our local junkyard
and the rmp look about right. Google says 60 RPM
Then do a search for
DC 10-50V 60A Motor Speed Control PWM HHO RC Controller 12V 24V 48V 3000W
Of course a gear motor isn't your only option. Wood-Mizer uses a 12VDC motor with v-belt pulleys to do the speed reduction.
I don't see how you could use a motor with out some kind of gear reduction..
The carriage does not move very fast.
I used a 12 volt 2500lb winch and a pwm. I cut a section of the winch spool out in the center until it was about 1.5"wide and added a 3"diameter chunk of delrin plastic to increase the diameter so the travel speed would be faster. I use the pwm to regulate the speed going forward cutting. The return speed(reverse) is full speed. You can change your full speed by changing the diameter of the delrin you put on the spool. I would say mine with the 3" is around 80 to 100 feet per minute.
3"
I used a 12v steering motor $40.00 for a 08 Chevy Cobalt works good with a $9.00 speed controller on forward speed only
Quote from: Kbeitz on July 09, 2017, 08:36:59 PM
I don't see how you could use a motor with out some kind of gear reduction..
The carriage does not move very fast.
"... Wood-Mizer uses a 12VDC motor with v-belt pulleys to do the speed reduction."
Quote from: ssspeciale on July 09, 2017, 09:10:41 PM
I used a 12 volt 2500lb winch and a pwm. I cut a section of the winch spool out in the center until it was about 1.5"wide and added a 3"diameter chunk of delrin plastic to increase the diameter so the travel speed would be faster. I use the pwm to regulate the speed going forward cutting. The return speed(reverse) is full speed. You can change your full speed by changing the diameter of the delrin you put on the spool. I would say mine with the 3" is around 80 to 100 feet per minute.
3"
When you are using it all day does the winch over heat? I had thought of something like that but didn't know if it would be up to the task without burning out, I also wasn't sure if it could be controlled with a pwm controller.
Quote from: larrydown60 on July 09, 2017, 09:23:29 PM
I used a 12v steering motor $40.00 for a 08 Chevy Cobalt works good with a $9.00 speed controller on forward speed only
does that require a pwm or a stepper motor controller? I looked at pictures of it and can't tell if it is a gear motor or a stepper motor.
Quote from: Ga Mtn Man on July 09, 2017, 05:56:19 PM
Of course a gear motor isn't your only option. Wood-Mizer uses a 12VDC motor with v-belt pulleys to do the speed reduction.
I think I would prefer a gear motor over v belts to slow it down, unless there is a benefit I'm not seeing to using v belts.
I guess if I was doing it I would look at whats available through surpluscenter.com.
PC
Stepper motor controllers can only be used on stepper motors.
One of the reasons I used wheelchair motors is the low amps they draw.
Winch motors are high powered motors that draw high amps.
You best have a real good charging system if your going to use one.
The controller would also be very expensive for high amp motors.
Wheelchair motors are geared to turn a 12" wheel at walking speed.
That works out great for the carriage speed. Used wheelchair motors
are sold cheap on E-bay and if you have a junkyard around most of
them have old electric wheelchairs in them. I see about one a month
come in to our local yard. Another neat thing about the wheelchair
gear box is that they have a quick disconnect leaver. For raising the
carriage a wheelchair motor connected to a worm gear winch works
great.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/39553/5_to_1_sprocket_gearing~1.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1499742320)
Quote from: larrydown60 on July 09, 2017, 09:23:29 PM
I used a 12v steering motor $40.00 for a 08 Chevy Cobalt works good with a $9.00 speed controller on forward speed only
Any pictures of how you have it rigged up?
I'm using wheel chair motors and it's control still. I have to have both motors hooked up for the system to work and I used two lawn mower batteries to power it up. Been wanting to drop to one motor the way K has posted. Just haven't had the time to do it yet. :(
When you are using it all day does the winch over heat? I had thought of something like that but didn't know if it would be up to the task without burning out, I also wasn't sure if it could be controlled with a pwm controller.
It has been on the mill for about a year so far without any problems. I doesn't get hot I don't think its working hard enough to cause any problems. The whole set up only cost about $110. I used the cable that came on the winch($50) instead of a chain. I also bought 2 pulleys with bearings for a garage door cable and a turnbuckle. I used a drum switch(ebay) for fwd/rev and the pwm (ebay) and the wire that came with the winch. All the parts cost about $70. It runs off the battery that starts the mill engine (25 hp Honda).no issues with the engine keeping the system charged.
Joe Hillman I am not sure what you mean? I am using a speed controler on forward speed only. I burned up the first controller because it was only 20 amp rated I ordered a 40 amp one it should be here by Friday.
fish fighter, I will post more pics tomorrow of how it is wired up there are pics of the motor with gears and chain setup, if you need special pics just tell me what you want to see and I will post them
Thanks Larry. You said you paid $40 for that motor. Was that new or a used motor?
With the wheelchair motors, I been very happy with it. Guess I really need to take the time to swap it over with the controller like K has posted.
Forget low volt electric go hydraulic and add a log turner too. Frank C.
I'm with Frank, put on a 6 hp gas motor with a hyd pump, way more realiable, infinite speed control plus you'll have hyd for a chain turner, toe boards, loader arms, log stop, clamp etc. Steve
Quote from: Kbeitz on July 10, 2017, 11:05:37 PM
Stepper motor controllers can only be used on stepper motors.
One of the reasons I used wheelchair motors is the low amps they draw.
Winch motors are high powered motors that draw high amps.
You best have a real good charging system if your going to use one.
The controller would also be very expensive for high amp motors.
Wheelchair motors are geared to turn a 12" wheel at walking speed.
That works out great for the carriage speed. Used wheelchair motors
are sold cheap on E-bay and if you have a junkyard around most of
them have old electric wheelchairs in them. I see about one a month
come in to our local yard. Another neat thing about the wheelchair
gear box is that they have a quick disconnect leaver. For raising the
carriage a wheelchair motor connected to a worm gear winch works
great.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/39553/5_to_1_sprocket_gearing~1.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1499742320)
How do you deal with them being 24 volt and the mill and charging system being only 12?
Quote from: bandmiller2 on July 12, 2017, 07:03:29 AM
Forget low volt electric go hydraulic and add a log turner too. Frank C.
I would love too but even using second hand parts a hydraulic system gets expensive quick.
I'm with Joe on that. I will be installing two toe boards that will be powered with 12V winches which I have on hand. That will take a third battery, but I don't get on the road with my mill. ;D
Repairing burnt out malfunctioning electric components get expensive plus wasted time, hydraulics will cost less in the long run. Steve
Quote from: Joe Hillmann on July 12, 2017, 02:55:39 PM
Quote from: Kbeitz on July 10, 2017, 11:05:37 PM
Stepper motor controllers can only be used on stepper motors.
One of the reasons I used wheelchair motors is the low amps they draw.
Winch motors are high powered motors that draw high amps.
You best have a real good charging system if your going to use one.
The controller would also be very expensive for high amp motors.
Wheelchair motors are geared to turn a 12" wheel at walking speed.
That works out great for the carriage speed. Used wheelchair motors
are sold cheap on E-bay and if you have a junkyard around most of
them have old electric wheelchairs in them. I see about one a month
come in to our local yard. Another neat thing about the wheelchair
gear box is that they have a quick disconnect leaver. For raising the
carriage a wheelchair motor connected to a worm gear winch works
great.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/39553/5_to_1_sprocket_gearing~1.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1499742320)
How do you deal with them being 24 volt and the mill and charging system being only 12?
For $70.00 you can buy a 24v single wire alternator off E-bay.
If you look real hard you can but 12v wheelchair motors.
Most are 24v for a reason. They work better and wire size can be smaller.
Wheelchairs are made to be used every day and they are very robust.
Do an E-bay search for "Invacare wheelchair Motor 12v" and you will see one.
I have had not problems with my system and I would do it again.
you can run a 24v motor on 12v but you will only get 1/2 power and speed.
Quote from: Kbeitz on July 12, 2017, 05:30:09 PM
Quote from: Joe Hillmann on July 12, 2017, 02:55:39 PM
Quote from: Kbeitz on July 10, 2017, 11:05:37 PM
Stepper motor controllers can only be used on stepper motors.
One of the reasons I used wheelchair motors is the low amps they draw.
Winch motors are high powered motors that draw high amps.
You best have a real good charging system if your going to use one.
The controller would also be very expensive for high amp motors.
Wheelchair motors are geared to turn a 12" wheel at walking speed.
That works out great for the carriage speed. Used wheelchair motors
are sold cheap on E-bay and if you have a junkyard around most of
them have old electric wheelchairs in them. I see about one a month
come in to our local yard. Another neat thing about the wheelchair
gear box is that they have a quick disconnect leaver. For raising the
carriage a wheelchair motor connected to a worm gear winch works
great.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/39553/5_to_1_sprocket_gearing~1.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1499742320)
How do you deal with them being 24 volt and the mill and charging system being only 12?
For $70.00 you can buy a 24v single wire alternator off E-bay.
If you look real hard you can but 12v wheelchair motors.
Most are 24v for a reason. They work better and wire size can be smaller.
Wheelchairs are made to be used every day and they are very robust.
Do an E-bay search for "Invacare wheelchair Motor 12v" and you will see one.
I have had not problems with my system and I would do it again.
you can run a 24v motor on 12v but you will only get 1/2 power and speed.
Ok once you have a 24 volt system how do you get 12 volt to your starter, ignition system (and in my case,) clutch? Can you tap into just one battery in a 24 volt system to get 12 volts or do you have two systems, one 24 volt with two batteries and a 24 volt alt and a second 12 volt system with its own battery and alt?
My system is all 24v ... but you can put a camper battery inisolator your system
And tap just one battery for your 12v.
E-bay also sells 24to12v converters.
Joe, granted I'am old and opinionated. With hydraulics you pay once, and once you have power feed and log turner you will be loathed to go back to manual rolling. Look back on this forum several pages and count the problems with electric controls, see if you can find a problem with manual hydraulics. Frank C.
If you can get past the requirement for 24 volt electrics (just ask KB how) your best bet by far is the motor and speed controller out of a handi-cap scooter (not a wheel chair) The speed reduction gear box is built in and the speed controller is usually rated at 70 amps. Wheel chairs use a separate motor and controller for each wheel. Scooters use a single, larger motor driving a reduction gear and differential, much more flexible for a sawmill..I have a lot of experience with both types, rugged dependable units. Only problem I have ever seen with the motors is worn or sticking brushes. The controllers, being electronic, do occasionally get trashed..
Some wheel chairs have better motors than scooters have...
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/39553/DSC03374~1.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1499959192)
This was another junkyard find.