Stihl Platinum bar oil

[338longranger]

What you paying for the Stihl Platinum bar oil per gal?

[DHansen]

Ace Hardware has it here locally for $16.99 u.s. a gallon.  I called today to check stock on the product.

[Tacotodd]

I want to see how well it performs, but my local Stihl shops will only get a gallon in if I buy an entire case, because he doesn't think that it'll sell to anybody else!

But he doesn't know that for sure, because he is likely to have someone else like me come in that wants to try it out. It kinda pithes me off! He's kinda arrogant about it. 

But, WHAT DO I KNOW?!!!!

[sawguy21]

How far away is the next closest dealer?

[Tacotodd]

6 miles, but he wants to do the same thing.

I can't win, at least not yet.

Now, if everyone here would give me their opinions on the performance of the stuff, then that's going to guide my decision on whether it's worth the price of an entire case or not  :

[Tacotodd]

Oh, the next good one is 45mi further, and I'd have to call him to see if he even has any, cause I ain't playing the come in and pay for it if he ain't got it. And then have to drive 60mi each way just to go get some.

And with my luck, he'd want me buy a whole case also. But I'll call him, if I decide to try it, and see if he's got any.

Oh well!!!

[DHansen]

As to the performance of Stihl Platinum I have no input.  As I have used and tried many brands and blends.  I have yet to use a bar oil that gave me a problem.  So $8.00 to $13.00 I have not seen a difference that I could measure or detect.  So if I can save a buck or two, or buy a case at a time that's what I did. 

[Old saw fixer]

     I use the Stihl Platinum bar oil exclusively.  Back in the day I used the logger special unlabeled stuff, and it worked okay.  I never saw an oil related problem with bars and chains when working on the logger's saws, unless the oiler broke.  The small amount that I would save buying the Stihl orange jug is a pittance, in my little world. 

[338longranger]

What I noticed is the oilers dont put out as much as did before. The bars have smaller holes in them and Stihl is putting out lower quality orange jug oil.  I have put west coast oilers [bigger] on my saws and that helps some. But still need better oil.

[Real1shepherd]

I don't want to get into another 'us versus the world' debate, but sawguy21 & I have both seen pro saw oiler failure with recycled motor oil. It's our recommendation to use NEW real bar oil in actual application to avoid issues. Some of you won't use a saw hard enough and long enough to show up problems with used motor oil. But you can't jump to the conclusion however, that used oil should work for all.

Given that, price seems to be a good indication of the quality of bar oil. I remember I was on a job one hot summer day and ran out of bar oil. I went to the nearest town and bought what I could find;Ace Hardware brand bar oil. Back on the job the stuff was like water once things got heated back up. NOT a suitable bar oil.

I use the orange, Stihl gal jugs because that's what the dealer carries. I've not had any issues with it. But I run non-Squeal vintage saws and older bars.....Squeal seems to be stingy with their oiler output from what I read.

Like DHansen, I have no input or reason to try the silver, Stihl Platinum. Maybe it's more critical on newer saws?

Kevin

[Tacotodd]

Maybe my problem with what I call premature wear is the brand name of f the bar that I have. I've only ran two chains from new to completely past the witness marks. With a brand new chain, that I've verified to be the correct ones, it is already leaning so much that the Oregon catalog says that the bar is worn out. Just for info, .063 gauge bar and chain. The quarter trick fits the bar and the chain is marked 75. I'm wondering if I should do @HolmenTree trick of resorting to the hammer and closing the rails back up. I've got nothing to lose at this point. Oh BTW, Oregon brand bar as well. New Oregon chain Still don't pass the flat on table test.

[Tacotodd]

And I've got the oiler set to MAXIMUM! Full tilt boogie.

[Real1shepherd]

Maybe my problem with what I call premature wear is the brand name of f the bar that I have. I’ve only ran two chains from new to completely past the witness marks. With a brand new chain, that I’ve verified to be the correct ones, it is already leaning so much that the Oregon catalog says that the bar is worn out. Just for info, .063 gauge bar and chain. The quarter trick fits the bar and the chain is marked 75. I’m wondering if I should do @HolmenTree trick of resorting to the hammer and closing the rails back up. I’ve got nothing to lose at this point. Oh BTW, Oregon brand bar as well. New Oregon chain Still don’t pass the flat on table test.

There's a tool for not that much money.....probably one of our vendors here carries it....it's a bar rail closer.

Basically, a small hand frame with two opposed ball bearings and you set it, then drag it all the way down the bar on one side, flip the bar, rinse & repeat.

Check your bar rail by fitting in a new chain for tightness. Foolproof if you keep checking the rails with a new chain after each pass.

Kevin

[HolmenTree]

This is my 3rd attempt writing this post,  :
This is the only forum where if you accidentally hit the back button or let the phone time out your post is gone before you can hit post. Shouldn't we have some kind of auto save?

Todd is your bar laminated? If so their bad for spreading the rails and can't be successfully re tightened for any length of time.

I always run solid body like ES or PowerMatch. Easy to hammer the rails back to spec.
Never used any bar oil that harmed the b/c. Even canola works great.

Never saw Stihl Platinum here in Canada.  Only have 3 grades light medium and heavy for summer.

I don't run my tree service anymore in winter so I just use medium and heavy.
Been running this Husqvarna all season lately, works great and a good price $14 Cad ($11 US)


 

[Tacotodd]

My bars are all solid, replaceable tip styles. It's just the Oregon's that are giving me this trouble, so far. Fingers crossed. I'm going to be switching to the Stihl bars (with the spacer adapter) to see if they are any better. But Kevin, according to our resident "guru" Willard there, yeah @HolmenTree I was paying attention to you, bar rail closers don't have the staying power that beating them back to shape does, unless Willard, something has changed that I need to know about. But Kevin, yeah, I have ready access to a bar rail closer already, but I've been holding off on using it. Here comes the brass hammer unless I've had more recent information to revert me back to using the bar rail closer. I don't have the luxury of a full copper version like Willard showed in the  one post. Oh I can buy one that is ready made by a reputable supply company, but I about had a coronary when I found out the price. Jeez Louise! They are ridiculously proud of that thing!

[HolmenTree]

If this may help , I once used a axe and bar cleaner hook as a shim hammering on top of a skidder's blade.
Anything's possible :D

[donbj]

 

 Call me a Husky Junky but this is all I buy, for many many years. I'm in no way commercial level but I use the oil rated for the season and haven't been let down yet.

[Real1shepherd]

My bars are all solid, replaceable tip styles. It’s just the Oregon’s that are giving me this trouble, so far. Fingers crossed. I’m going to be switching to the Stihl bars (with the spacer adapter) to see if they are any better. But Kevin, according to our resident “guru” Willard there, yeah @HolmenTree I was paying attention to you, bar rail closers don’t have the staying power that beating them back to shape does, unless Willard, something has changed that I need to know about. But Kevin, yeah, I have ready access to a bar rail closer already, but I’ve been holding off on using it. Here comes the brass hammer unless I’ve had more recent information to revert me back to using the bar rail closer. I don’t have the luxury of a full copper version like Willard showed in the  one post. Oh I can buy one that is ready made by a reputable supply company, but I about had a coronary when I found out the price. Jeez Louise! They are ridiculously proud of that thing!

From a metallurgic point of view, beating with a brass hammer on cold steel won't have a better effect on a solid bar over a rail closer. The rail closer is more consistent and accurate.

I've always liked Willard's postings, but he's not my guru. I've been at this as long or longer than he has....although I don't climb trees. So in that realm, I give him complete dominance.

Kevin

[Old Greenhorn]

My bars are all solid, replaceable tip styles. It's just the Oregon's that are giving me this trouble, so far. Fingers crossed. I'm going to be switching to the Stihl bars (with the spacer adapter) to see if they are any better. But Kevin, according to our resident "guru" Willard there, yeah @HolmenTree I was paying attention to you, bar rail closers don't have the staying power that beating them back to shape does, unless Willard, something has changed that I need to know about. But Kevin, yeah, I have ready access to a bar rail closer already, but I've been holding off on using it. Here comes the brass hammer unless I've had more recent information to revert me back to using the bar rail closer. I don't have the luxury of a full copper version like Willard showed in the  one post. Oh I can buy one that is ready made by a reputable supply company, but I about had a coronary when I found out the price. Jeez Louise! They are ridiculously proud of that thing!

Metallurgically speaking there is a difference between squeezing the rails closed and beating. When you beat it there is a (very) small level of re-arranging of the molecular grain structure which occurs due to the shock load. Many, many, many light hammer blows will have an effect in re-aligning the grain, but it is slight. (It's called cold working.) Using a rolling tool with many passes can have a similar effect, squeezing with a vise or something like that will have the least effect and is most likely to spring back.
 At 30 bucks, that rail closer tool is pretty neat and can give you a lot of control. I make keep my eyes open for one when I have enough bars stacked up. You get a lot of control with that device. I have some cheap bars that seem to demand more maintenance than they are worth. But 28" bars ain't cheap so a little time to keep them working is worth it to a point. 

[DHansen]

I was at my local saw shop today.  Asked about the Stihl Platinum bar oil.  He does not stock it due to the cost and slow moving off the shelf.  The hardware type store tends to move the product if it is their only brand (type) on the shelves.  The buyer in that environment needs it today and is not shopping around or restocking a supply.  I think it comes down to personal preference and needs.  I think I have four brands and three weights on hand.  YMMV.

[HolmenTree]

My bars are all solid, replaceable tip styles. It's just the Oregon's that are giving me this trouble, so far. Fingers crossed. I'm going to be switching to the Stihl bars (with the spacer adapter) to see if they are any better. But Kevin, according to our resident "guru" Willard there, yeah @HolmenTree I was paying attention to you, bar rail closers don't have the staying power that beating them back to shape does, unless Willard, something has changed that I need to know about. But Kevin, yeah, I have ready access to a bar rail closer already, but I've been holding off on using it. Here comes the brass hammer unless I've had more recent information to revert me back to using the bar rail closer. I don't have the luxury of a full copper version like Willard showed in the  one post. Oh I can buy one that is ready made by a reputable supply company, but I about had a coronary when I found out the price. Jeez Louise! They are ridiculously proud of that thing!

Metallurgically speaking there is a difference between squeezing the rails closed and beating. When you beat it there is a (very) small level of re-arranging of the molecular grain structure which occurs due to the shock load. Many, many, many light hammer blows will have an effect in re-aligning the grain, but it is slight. (It's called cold working.) Using a rolling tool with many passes can have a similar effect, squeezing with a vise or something like that will have the least effect and is most likely to spring back.
At 30 bucks, that rail closer tool is pretty neat and can give you a lot of control. I make keep my eyes open for one when I have enough bars stacked up. You get a lot of control with that device. I have some cheap bars that seem to demand more maintenance than they are worth. But 28" bars ain't cheap so a little time to keep them working is worth it to a point.

Old Greenhorn, yes you're getting the right idea.
Solid body guide bars do develop a "memory" when the rails start to spread and light to firm hammering can reverse the memory through realigning molecular structure.
I watched our lumber division head saw filer hammer bent circular saw blades many times and it doesn't take that many beatings to do, just a trained eye and hand coordination.
I've tried those roller bar rail squeezers and they have about as much success as trying to hammer laminated bar rails. But a thin piece of rubber belting between the laminated bar and anvil does help keep the rails to spec a bit longer.

I've been making a living with a chainsaw since 1974 and have field tested bars, chains  sprockets and powerheads as a hand faller in the late 1970's, 80's and early 1990's .
Oregon/Omark's field test engineer loved us testing their prototype products because we were about the only cut and skid loggers in the world who worked into -40 below temperatures. Metal molecular structures change dramatically past -40 and I proved it when cutting with their products like the PowerMatch bars, 72LG chain and the radial port rim sprockets that were introduced in the early 1980's.

As matter of fact we have a cold weather testing station up here in Thompson Manitoba that serves Rolls Royce aviation, Toyota,  Honda, Mercedes etc.
Funny memories I have 35 years ago when I saw camouflaged Mercedes driving up and down our logging strip roads.
A few times I had to clear a felled tree off the road for them to pass. :D

Willard Holmen

[Real1shepherd]

My bars are all solid, replaceable tip styles. It’s just the Oregon’s that are giving me this trouble, so far. Fingers crossed. I’m going to be switching to the Stihl bars (with the spacer adapter) to see if they are any better. But Kevin, according to our resident “guru” Willard there, yeah @HolmenTree I was paying attention to you, bar rail closers don’t have the staying power that beating them back to shape does, unless Willard, something has changed that I need to know about. But Kevin, yeah, I have ready access to a bar rail closer already, but I’ve been holding off on using it. Here comes the brass hammer unless I’ve had more recent information to revert me back to using the bar rail closer. I don’t have the luxury of a full copper version like Willard showed in the  one post. Oh I can buy one that is ready made by a reputable supply company, but I about had a coronary when I found out the price. Jeez Louise! They are ridiculously proud of that thing!

Metallurgically speaking there is a difference between squeezing the rails closed and beating. When you beat it there is a (very) small level of re-arranging of the molecular grain structure which occurs due to the shock load. Many, many, many light hammer blows will have an effect in re-aligning the grain, but it is slight. (It's called cold working.) Using a rolling tool with many passes can have a similar effect, squeezing with a vise or something like that will have the least effect and is most likely to spring back.
At 30 bucks, that rail closer tool is pretty neat and can give you a lot of control. I make keep my eyes open for one when I have enough bars stacked up. You get a lot of control with that device. I have some cheap bars that seem to demand more maintenance than they are worth. But 28" bars ain't cheap so a little time to keep them working is worth it to a point.

I agree. The differences between cold forming a solid bar by a brass hammer and rail closing with a tool are negligible in the field.

That's why when I use the tool I set it up to make many passes....the worst mistake you can do is try to close the rails in just one pass. Using the tool on pro saw bars gave me much extended life. And if the bars got too bad(rare), I'd take them to a shop that specialized in bar repair. I'm not so sure many of those exist anymore outside the PNW. Although you'd think harvester bars would have similar issues.

Kevin

[Old Greenhorn]

My bars are all solid, replaceable tip styles. It's just the Oregon's that are giving me this trouble, so far. Fingers crossed. I'm going to be switching to the Stihl bars (with the spacer adapter) to see if they are any better. But Kevin, according to our resident "guru" Willard there, yeah @HolmenTree I was paying attention to you, bar rail closers don't have the staying power that beating them back to shape does, unless Willard, something has changed that I need to know about. But Kevin, yeah, I have ready access to a bar rail closer already, but I've been holding off on using it. Here comes the brass hammer unless I've had more recent information to revert me back to using the bar rail closer. I don't have the luxury of a full copper version like Willard showed in the  one post. Oh I can buy one that is ready made by a reputable supply company, but I about had a coronary when I found out the price. Jeez Louise! They are ridiculously proud of that thing!

Metallurgically speaking there is a difference between squeezing the rails closed and beating. When you beat it there is a (very) small level of re-arranging of the molecular grain structure which occurs due to the shock load. Many, many, many light hammer blows will have an effect in re-aligning the grain, but it is slight. (It's called cold working.) Using a rolling tool with many passes can have a similar effect, squeezing with a vise or something like that will have the least effect and is most likely to spring back.
At 30 bucks, that rail closer tool is pretty neat and can give you a lot of control. I make keep my eyes open for one when I have enough bars stacked up. You get a lot of control with that device. I have some cheap bars that seem to demand more maintenance than they are worth. But 28" bars ain't cheap so a little time to keep them working is worth it to a point.

I agree. The differences between cold forming a solid bar by a brass hammer and rail closing with a tool are negligible in the field.

That's why when I use the tool I set it up to make many passes....the worst mistake you can do is try to close the rails in just one pass. Using the tool on pro saw bars gave me much extended life. And if the bars got too bad(rare), I'd take them to a shop that specialized in bar repair. I'm not so sure many of those exist anymore outside the PNW. Although you'd think harvester bars would have similar issues.

Kevin

Well, just back up the truck a bit here. I said it was a slight effect. I did not say it was negligible. In fact, it can be extremely effective. I began to learn this dark art at a very early age watching my father straighten things nobody else could it takes skill and very good aim. If you use a ball peen hammer accurately aimed the effect is the stretch the material ever so slightly on the side being struck. Cumulatively over the course of many blows, it has the effect of stretching one face of the material which in effect, bends it. With a lot of practice you can do some amazing things with this skill. On harder materials this is much more difficult. I myself have never gotten as good at it as I would like, but understanding the physics has allowed me to salvage things everyone else thought was lost. Moving the grain and stretching material surfaces is done in very slight amounts, but they add up. Very small increments, almost microscopic, but they all add up. It is in no way negatable in the hands of someone who understands how the metal behaves. This is the very same process a tin or coppersmith will use to stretch and form material.

[Real1shepherd]

Well, just back up the truck a bit here. I said it was a slight effect. I did not say it was negligible. In fact, it can be extremely effective. I began to learn this dark art at a very early age watching my father straighten things nobody else could it takes skill and very good aim. If you use a ball peen hammer accurately aimed the effect is the stretch the material ever so slightly on the side being struck. Cumulatively over the course of many blows, it has the effect of stretching one face of the material which in effect, bends it. With a lot of practice you can do some amazing things with this skill. On harder materials this is much more difficult. I myself have never gotten as good at it as I would like, but understanding the physics has allowed me to salvage things everyone else thought was lost. Moving the grain and stretching material surfaces is done in very slight amounts, but they add up. Very small increments, almost microscopic, but they all add up. It is in no way negatable in the hands of someone who understands how the metal behaves. This is the very same process a tin or coppersmith will use to stretch and form material.

We're not talking about cold forming a saber to hold an edge, here. Willard admits to using an axe head on the back of a skidder at one point. I don't think the nuances you mentioned are being practiced here.

I've had no ill effects using the rail closure device....no metal getting soft, no 'addiction' to it because I've weakened it or having to do this more frequently once I start etc. Let's just say I'm a Danny Doubter on strengthening the rails with a brass hammer on a 'just to close the rails' session. 

Kevin

[Old Greenhorn]

Well you are certainly welcome and entitled to hold any doubts you may have.
I can tell you, that for my own part having worked with this art from, as I like to call it because few understand it today, over a period of many decades and having made dozens of micrograph cross sections for comparisons under electron microscopes while picking the brains of some very talented metallurgists I have met in my career I can tell you with certainty and confidence, this is how steel behaves. What may seem very unlikely to many is a certainty for those who have actually seen it work and tried it themselves. You simply have to examine it under a very small field of view to see what is happening.
Here is a way to demonstrate it for yourself. Take a piece of flat sheet metal, like 18Ga or something and lay it on a flat steel plate. Take a ball peen and start dingling it, not really hard, but enough to make a tiny dent. cover an area or follow a straight line back and forth. Do that 50-100 times and then see which way the metal bends. I can promise you the hammered side will lift up.