After Tammy and I bought our chunk of da U.P., We knew we wanted some professional advice concerning the property due to its obviously sensitive nature. We want to be able to enjoy the property, improve it, but most important, not harm or cause detrimental change to what it is. We also wanted to use our experience as first time woodland owners to share on the Forestry Forum. The hope is of getting more information to help in the management of our new property as well as perhaps giving some sort of guideline for those that may find themselves in a similar need down the road.
My first and natural thought was to try and enlist Ron Scott to help. I could not have a greater respect for a forester, or any professional for that matter, on how he approaches his chosen profession then I have for Ron. I carry that respect for him here as well in his role as a Forestry Forum administrator.
Last month, Burlkraft and I took off for the cabin in the U.P. where we spent the rest of that day taking a look at our property. Steve stayed the night at the cabin and then left for Cheeseville the next morning, leaving me behind to meet with Ron Scott the following day.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/management_trip_1.jpg)
View from the Mighty Mac as Steve and I crossed into the U.P. There was a fog bank rolling in and it was amazing looking. Photo does nothing for the real scene.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/management_trip_2.jpg)
We stopped for gas at the Casino in St. Ignace after crossing and was greeted by this rainbow.
Steve and Ice and I explored my property a little bit, although it was quite wet in the woods due to the rain we had received the day and night before. This was Ice's first time in the woods and it was a very pleasant surprise to find out how well behaved she is out there. She stays close, within 30 or 40 yards or so, and minds very well. She is a joy to have along with me. On this day It was funnier then all get out. Steve and I were ready to go to the truck, and it almost seemed like she was telling us she was not ready to go. She ran up the trail ahead of us, turned and barked at us. I told her to stop barking. Then she did the weirdest thing. There was a mucky hole right in front of her. She jumped forward and shoved her head into it.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/management_trip_3.jpg)
Then she jumped back and looked at us again, muck dripping from her head. Once again she jumped in and rolled and rolled in the muck. She jumps back up and barked at us one more time as if to say, "HA! Now we can't go, I'm to muddy for the truck!" I guess you had to be there, but it was hilarious. We found out that Ice rides very nicely in the back of the truck. In fact she likes it. :)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/management_trip_4.jpg)
Off to the lake for Icy Baby.
More to come...
You got the first part right, Boss. You can't do a genuine Forest Management Plan without a Dog :D.
I am confident that Ice will make a fine contribution to the plan ;D.
The next day, after attending SAF meetings in Escanaba, Ron traveled back east and arrived at my Sister's Cabin to meet up with me to walk our property the following day. Our Camp cook was there, my Brother-n-Law, Pete. He made us some Italian sausage soup for supper. It was great as always. The next morning he made us a big breakfast before we took off for down the road to spend the day going over the property.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/management_trip_5.jpg)
Ron and Ice getting ready to go in the woods.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/management_trip_6.jpg)
Ron and Ice IN the woods. :)
Ron and I walked most all areas of the property, looking at not only the trees, but the soil types and other vegetation. We looked for signs of Wildlife and Wildlife habitat. Ron spent a long time answering questions I had about how to do this and that. He was careful to explain what things I should avoid and things that I should try to achieve.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/management_trip_7.jpg)
Ron using a prism to check the aspen stocking on the west end of the property. I have some very nice aspen trees that's time has come to do something with. I plan on using them for framing material. Ron explained to me that on this site, the aspen would be short lived and should be utilized now. Basically I will remove it from this forest type.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/management_trip_8.jpg)
Ron and I stop back in the south east cedars near what he explained to me was an intermittent stream. It flows above and below ground, probably fed by a spring (or springs) right near where we stood. There were some excellent spots in this stream where some muck could be removed to make small wildlife watering holes.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/management_trip_9.jpg)
Here is a whatzit plant that was growing on the property. I don't know what it is. YET. :) Hopefully you folks can help with that.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/management_trip_10.jpg)
Here is one of several natural bear dens on our property. They really are neat features back in the woods.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/management_trip_11.jpg)
These "Marsh Marigolds" grow in the ditch at one end of our property.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/management_trip_12.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/management_trip_13.jpg)
This area is just off of our property and up into the hardwoods to the south. The Trillium sure are easy to look at. :)
I sure learned a lot the day I spent in our woods with Ron and plan on learning more and more. Ron made a lot of notes on our walk and wrote up a basic management plan that I received from him this past week. I'll share that in my next post. :)
Hmm, from saw mill rat to tree hugger. Way to go, boss!!!! 8)
ARC CONSULTING SERVICESRONALD E. SCOTT, CF, ACF (Ret.)
ALL RESOURCE CONNECTIONS
REGISTERED FORESTER #612
http://webpages.charter.net/arcwoods
May 24, 2007
Jeff Brokaw
3210 Bischoff
Harrison, MI 48625
Reference: Private Property Land and Resource Management Prescription
Dear Jeff:
A field review was made on 5/11/07 of your woodland property of two 10-acre parcels located in the Township of Detour, County of Chippewa, Michigan described as follow:
Parcel A:
The Northwest ¼ of the Northwest ¼ of the Northwest ¼, Section 27 Town 42 North, Range 3 East.
Parcel B:
The Northeast ¼ of the Northwest ¼ of the Northwest ¼, Section 27, Town 42 North, Range 3 East.
OverviewThe property is bounded by N. Caribou Drive (county blacktop) on the north and Piesly road (county gravel) on the west. A gravel access site and vehicle-parking spur is located on the north side of the property off of North Caribou Drive. It is suspected that the access site/parking spur was constructed to provide legal access to the property when N. Caribou Drive was constructed /reconstructed and blacktopped some time back.
A high voltage power transmission line traverses the property at approximately 45 degrees from the northwest corner at the intersection of N. Caribou Drive and Piesly road. The transmission line rights-of- way is not easily assessable by two-wheel drive vehicle due to excessive wetness, heavy rutting, and a heavy matted vegetative cover of thick cannery grass.
The woodland ecosystem is primarily lowland conifer with included lowland hardwoods. Tree species are northern white cedar, balsam fir, white spruce, eastern larch (tamarack), aspen, balsam poplar, red maple, and white and yellow birch. The basal area averages 110 – 120 square feet/acre of saw timber and pole size timber.
1. The terrain is generally flat with a high water table through much of the year. Deer, bear, rabbits, and grouse are active on the area. An intermittent stream runs through the southeast corner of the property with some included small ponding waterholes.
SoilsFive (5) soil types for the property are described in the Soil Survey of Chippewa County, Michigan issued February 1992. They are (see included soils map):
(149B) Kalkaska Sand, 0 – 6% slopes, stony. This soil is located in a small triangular area in the southwest corner of the property bounded by Piesly road and the south property line. This soil is a very deep, somewhat excessively drained nearly level and undulating. It is usually on broad plains and upland flats. Surface runoff is slow.
Northern hardwoods are usually the dominant cover type on this soil. The soil is good for hardwoods, conifers, and wildlife shrubs. Trees to plant include red pine and white pine.
Major management concerns are equipment limitations, seeding mortality, and plant competition.
This soil is deeper to water and the best suited for building site development on the property, but septic filtering may be poor.
(89A) Kinross-AuGres Complex, 0 – 3% slopes (Hydric Soil). This soil is found in a diagonal band to the northeast parallel with the power line. This soil is very deep, nearly level, poorly drained Kinross and somewhat poorly drained AuGres soil on low ridges and knolls.
Kinross soil is frequently ponded. It has a surface of black muck about 5 inches thick. Typically, the AuGres soil is covered by about 1 inch of well-decomposed leaf litter.
Permeability is rapid in the Kinross and AuGres soils and the available water capacity is low. Surface runoff is slow on the AuGres soil and very slow or ponded on the Kinross soil from fall to late spring. The Kinross soil has a seasonal high water table of 1 foot above to 1 foot below the surface October - June and the AuGres soil has a water table at a depth of 0.5 foot to 1.5 feet November – May.
These soils are used as woodland. Aspen and swamp conifers are the dominant cover types of these soils. Trees are generally not planted on these soils, but trees that may be planted are white spruce, red pine, eastern white pine, and Norway spruce.
This soil is poorly suited to building site development and the use of equipment is limited because of wetness and ponding.
(36) Markey and Carbondale Mucks (Hydric Soil). On to the northwest, these soils cover the majority of the property. They includes the diagonal transmission line rights-of- way.
These soils are very deep, nearly level, and very poorly drained. They are organic soils in broad depressions, swamps, and drainage ways. They are frequently ponded and have excess humus.
Available water capacity is high in both soils. The water table is 1 foot above to 1 foot below the surface from fall to summer, September – June, and seldom drops below a depth of 1 foot. Surface runoff is very slow or ponded. The potential for frost is high.
These soils are used as woodland. The swamp conifer cover type is dominant on these soils. Trees are shallow rooted, and wind throw may be common. These soils are good for wetland plants and shallow water areas favorable to wildlife.
They are unsuited for building sites and use of equipment is restricted due to the severe wetness.
(14A) Gaastra Silt-Loam, 0 – 3% slopes (Hydric Soil). This soil is located in a small area along the center of the east property line. This is a somewhat poorly drained, nearly level soil on broad plains and in depressions. Permeability is moderately slow. Available water capacity is high. Surface runoff is slow.
A seasonal high water table is at a depth of 1 – 2 feet from late fall to late spring, November – May. The potential for frost action is high.
Most areas are used as woodland of swamp conifers and lowland hardwoods. White spruce and eastern white pine may be planted. The major management concern is excessive wetness. Use of equipment is limited and it is poorly suited for building site development because of wetness.
This soil may be prime farmland if drained.
(98) Ermatinger Silt Loams muck (Hydric Soil). This soil is very deep, nearly level, poorly drained soil on broad flats on former glacial flood plains. It is frequently ponded. Permeability is moderate. Available water capacity is high. Surface runoff is very slow or ponded. The seasonal high water table is 1 foot above to 1 foot below the surface from fall to early summer October – June.
Because of wetness, trees on this soil are shallow rooted. Many may be blown down during periods of high winds. The aspen cover type is dominant on this soil and it is good for wetland plants.
Use of equipment is limited and it is poorly suited for building site development because of wetness. A major management need is removing excess water during wet periods.
Management DirectionThe following management direction is recommended for the property under its existing condition:
1) Manage the majority of the area in its existing natural condition for wildlife, wetland, aesthetics, and timber stand improvement.
2) The primary timber management direction for the woodland is to improve its future quality and value through timber stand improvement by release, culling, and weeding for development and improvement of hardwood and conifer crop trees.
A suggested work method to complete timber stand improvement is:
- Divide the woodland into 1-5 acre grids as preferred to serve as work and control areas to insure completion of the entire woodland acres in a systematic manner. Within the grid areas identify crop trees and release them from competition. (Crop trees are those trees that will be grown to maturity and will not be removed from the woodland before final harvest. Crop trees are usually selected on the basis of its species, location with respect to other trees, and quality.)
- Paint mark or number the selected crop trees. Identify crop trees that are spaced 20 to 25 feet apart. If crop trees are scarce or unevenly distributed, you can leave two trees as close as 10 feet as long as you treat them as one tree when thinning. Remove trees with crowns that encroach on those of crop trees.
- Free all sides of sapling and small pole timber-size trees and at least three sides of larger trees. Trees below the main canopy will not affect crop tree growth, but you may cut them if they can be used for personal use, firewood, or are marketable.
- Do not damage crop tree stems and roots while thinning the stand. Repeat the thinning every 15 to 20 years. The thinning may then be done commercially, but only during winter freeze up conditions when the trees are of pulpwood and sawlog size. In simple terms "always manage for the best tree in place and remove the worst first".
- Give preference to any hardwood tree species when found in any segment of the woodland and retain any included hemlock, red pine, and white pine. Designate all aspen and balsam poplar for removal.
3) Daylight some of the existing small openings throughout the lowland woodland to encourage diversity of ground vegetation for wildlife. Leave 1-2 grouse drumming logs/acre.
4) Clean out and if possible expand the small wetland ponded areas along the intermittent stream in the southeast corner of the property for wildlife watering holes.
5) When doing timber stand improvement activities, retain the limbs and woody debris for placement in brush piles for rabbit cover.
6) There are a number of "natural bear dens" throughout the area. Retain such sites and improve them as possible with additional slash bedding and woody debris.
7) Remove the existing reed canary grass cover and level the heavy ruts along the power transmission line rights-of-way. Obtain a soil analysis and after the reed canary grass has been controlled, seed the rights-of-way with wildlife northern seed mixtures and plant low growing wildlife shrubs. Plant a vegetative screen along the rights-of way at its intersection with N. Caribou Drive and Piesly road.
8) Complete a registered landline survey of the property and obtain a Certificate of Survey. Mark the surveyed lines with steel fence posts and monument all corners with an above ground steel pipe.
9) Place a "Stewardship Forest" sign along the north boundary along N. Caribou Drive and place one along the west boundary along Piesly road. These signs are the same as those placed by Lou Kurtis, the neighboring landowner. Mr. Kurtis stated that he could make some such signs available to you.
10) Continue to work with the Chippewa/Mackinaw east ½ County Conservation District Forester and/or a local Professional Consulting Forester for continued land & resource management.
Sincerely,
RONALD E. SCOTT, CF, ACR (Ret.)
ARC Consulting Services
That is really nice! You have some work laid out for you Jeff, but I'm sure it will be more fun than work. There is nothing better than being out in the woods and especially if it's your own. 8)
My first impression of the whatzit plant is hemp. :D
Did you have any luck with the powerline owners on those ruts?
Gary, I decided to go the route of trying to take care of it myself. As it turns out, I can easily go anywhere I like on the powerline. Its good and solid and even the ruts have solid bottoms from what I have seen. I plan on killing the grass and dealing with the ruts with tools at hand, a small amount at a time.
Here is my grass conquering tool. ;D
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/powerline_3%7E0.jpg)
I'm already using a trail that goes clear to my back line on the powerline to remove some dead birch for firewood I have cleared from trails.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/powerline_2%7E0.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/powerline_1%7E0.jpg)
This past week I created almost 3/8s of a mile of maintenance trails that the quad can easily traverse. I sprayed around an acre of the powerline with roundup to start my improvements there.
Quote from: Gary_C on June 02, 2007, 01:02:01 PM
My first impression of the whatzit plant is hemp. :D
I 'spose that's fer da bears...then... ??? ??? ???...Eh ???
Ron S.,
Very nice management plan.
Jeff,
Now you are a "multiple use" resource manager ;).
Thanks. It will be interesting to see how much Jeff improves the parcel, given some time. It is great bear habitat, so I'm sure it will keep his interest. ;)
I think its pretty good deer territory as well, problem is also wolf and coyotes find it a nice place to congregate. I saw what I think was a male and female yote cross in front of me while on the quad heading back to the cabin.
I had been driving on a path I created on the powerline for a couple days. On the third day my grass killer arrived so I hooked up the sprayer and headed down to spray. Just as I turned into the powerline I saw a nice big doe walking away from me a couple poles up, walking right in the quad trail I had created. She was followed by two wobbly legged fawns. I had heard that mamma's always separate their fawns, but these two were together with her and they were tiny. I had turned into the trail and driven in about 40 yards before I noticed the deer. My camera was in the back box in a case. By the time I got it out, the fawns were scampering in two different directions into the tall grass. Mamma just turned and watched them, then stood and watched me. They were right where I was going to spray, and I knew that if I went on down, the fawns would stay right there, hiding in the grass. So... I decided to put spraying off for a couple hours, and backed out and left them to leave in their own time. Fair trade off for me. :)
Here is the photo I did get. You can see in the zoom that I caught one of the fawns just before it disapeared in the grass to the right. They were probably 80 yards or so from me when I snapped the photo.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/powerline_4.jpg) (https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/powerline_5.jpg)
Looks like the Honda was the right choice for maintaining your property, it looks as though things may get a little soggy here and there.
Dave
Jeff, I can't help but be excited for you. I know that it is a good feeling to arrive at YOUR land and as you ride around it probably crosses your mind that you still can't believe it is yours. Good luck with your ventures and I wish I was close enough to come help with the hard labor. Don
That is quite the report.Good luck with all of your plans,projects.Is this a site that you want to build a house on some day?How far away is this from your home now?I use to do alot of projects here before I built here.There were times I came here to do something,but I forgot to bring it with me.I would just start something else.I did try to keep a few things here,but it's kinda hard,costly really,to have 2 of everything I own.I know you will have fun.Keep us all posted on the fruits of your labor.
It gives special satisfaction to work on your own property. Soon, Jeff, you will have had a conversation with each tree on the property as you implement your forest management plan. Every little step is progress, and the little steps add up to big steps.
The property is 3 hours drive from here. That makes it tough due to the price of gas. We want to spend more time up there, but I can't forsake my duties here or other web jobs in order to spend longer periods there to save gas. So... Today we got hooked up so we can get on line via my cell phone and lap top. It will work at the cabin but be painfully slow, but at least I can go and still get work done and check email on the computer. I think I will have real good reception right down in De Tour at the big marina. I can see me down there, looking out over the water and the boats, sitting at the picnic table, reading the forum and my email. ;D
If we can find a way, yes, we want to build there and eventually move there full time. I have been visiting this part of the U.P, since I was a youngster and feel like its home. Its odd. Its always been that way when I get to the eastern U.P. It doesnt seem like I reached a destination like when going on vacation or something. It really feels like I am home again. :)
Don K, you come on up. :)
Let me know when the timbers are cut, I'll come out and help cut the joinery. (Just don't get them cut before I get a new transmission for my truck. And that could take a while. :o ::))
Dave
If you need to do some serious tree-talking, I can come up and help. I am experienced at talking to trees ;D.
If you tell them how nice they look you think they might swell with pride? I might be able to harvest enough cedar for a log cabin and never see a dent if we can do that... :)
What a great management plan Ron. Jeff it sounds like you've got your work cut out but it sounds like fun too. Try to keep the wind to your face spraying with the quad. You can also get cheap chem suits and respirators at most farm supply stores. I know it's a herbicide but chemicals are chemicals.
Isn't it great to watch your own land come to life in the spring, beautiful place. :)
Norm, I'm real nervous about those chemicals so I waited until dead calm to apply.
Ron's report of the property looks great. Your well on your way to work or pleasure, whichever way you choose to look at it. ;)
The bog plant looks like a species in the heath family with that big terminal flower bud. Probably sheep laurel Kalmia angustifolia
A feature of this plant's flower is the 10 stamens (whose anthers are tucked into pockets of the corolla) pop out when touched. The flowers are pink and saucer-shaped, and are densely clustered around the stem. Leaves are in whorls of 3. Plant is up to 3 feet tall.
Wear a charcoal filtered mask and be sure to shower ASAP after spraying. Read and follow ALL directions, never think they are not meant for you. I have a private applicator's license and must take the recert every few years. Don't take any chem lightly, If you are not properly protected it can and does have a cumulative effect.
One thing I've seen is some people will use too much pressure and make too fine of a mist that drifts farther. I learned from spraying lacquer & varnish to use just enough pressure to atomize and no more. I know it's not exactly the same, but the larger the droplets the less it will travel.
Which type of log is a favorite for the Grouse? I hear them quite often but can't tell exactly where they are drumming.
BTW those marsh marigolds look just like our Buttercups 8)
I think anything hollow with a solid exterior. In other words, Drum like. :)
The logs don't need to be hollow. They don't actually beat their wings on the log. The sound comes from air being moved by their wings. :) :) :)
They dont need to be, no, but I'm sure the birds know that hollow logs resonate the sound.
Any log will do them fine. They'll show no preference to a hollow log unless it's all that's available. Ever see a video of them drumming ??? They are standing tall and pushing air in front of them not down
Yes, any larger diameter log will do, but a log with some cover around it is preferred. If you are placing "drumming logs", northern hardwood logs are also preferred over aspen since they will last much longer. The same goes for wildlife nest, den, snag, or cavity trees.
I don't have any hollow logs - spruce and cottonwood blowdowns only in that area. They seem to hang out in the spruce more, guess thats why they are called Spruce Hens ;D
Quote from: Sprucegum on June 03, 2007, 10:10:35 PM
BTW those marsh marigolds look just like our Buttercups 8)
Kind of similar. We have them here too, but not too common. The only place I see them is wetlands like in Jeff's pic, and usually where cedar have grown. It may be that they do best in those soils with calcarious bedrock. Just a speculation.
Quote from: Sprucegum on June 04, 2007, 12:51:51 AM
I don't have any hollow logs - spruce and cottonwood blowdowns only in that area. They seem to hang out in the spruce more, guess thats why they are called Spruce Hens ;D
probably spruce grouse, which tend to be vocal during courtship like a blue grouse, and not a 'drummer' ruffed grouse. ;)
In our hardwood stands we often have a light scattering of balsam fir logs on the ground. They do tend to be hollow because of the but rot during their devise. Often if they are drumming on old hardwood logs on the ground, those logs were near logging yards and trails. And edges tend to be thickets. There will often be decedent elm trees as well in low lands. Cedar blow downs are another nice platform, since they are often concealed by fir thicket. I see a lot of grouse in cedar stands.
Jeff,
I am very glad for you and Tammy. What a great feeling caring for a plot of ground and the vegetation on it is. :)
If you wish for the grouse to remain be sure to leave a grove of pole size trees with a spacing comparable to the grouse wing span. The grouse rely on the closely spaced pole size trees to escape larger predator birds. The trees will not remain pole size for long so you might consider opening up an adjacent area that will grow saplings to become pole size about the time the current area increases to saw log size. Of course with the wetter soils this may all occur naturally and all you will need ot due is observe smile_banjoman
Anyway the one thing I have learned about managing a plot of ground is there is no need to be in a hurry or regret not being able to stick to a time table. Nature moves at her own pace and is very forgiving.
Introduce yourself to your district forester and wildlife biologist if you have not done so already. Local resources are invaluable.
I hope someday I will have the pleasure of walking your woods with you.
Quote from: Jeff B on June 02, 2007, 12:13:48 PM
Ron using a prism to check the aspen stocking on the west end of the property. I have some very nice aspen trees that's time has come to do something with. I plan on using them for framing material. Ron explained to me that on this site, the aspen would be short lived and should be utilized now. Basically I will remove it from this forest type.
A quick question about the recommendation that the aspen being short lived on this site, and needing utilized.
Is this based primarily on the site index for aspen (and your poplar) on that soil or some other particular piece of knowledge in Ron's head? Also when you say you want to remove it (aspen) from the forest type, is that because these species are deemed less than desireable - commercially or for some other reason?
I think I have a similar situation, I have a very robust abundant population with tulip poplar, and I plan to utilize/thin some of them to make room for other species, like swamp white oak. Another reason for doing this in increasing the species diversity.
I'm not doubting anything your doing. Just curious as to the whys ;-)
Greg
Greg, I'm going to let Ron Answer that one when he gets back in town. He is gone for a day or three. I THINK the major reason is that the site conditions are not conducive to a thriving quality aspen stand. Good question, as I would like Ron to explain it to me again. :D
Robert, thank-you. :) Plan an extra day or three after the pigroast and we could do just that. :)
The Kalkaska Sand soil type on this area primarily favors a northern hardwoods cover type. However, the site is growing an overstory of mixed aspen of sawlog size and pole sized balsam fir with included white cedar and lowland hardwoods with included white and yellow birch.
The area is part of a transition zone into the adjoining mixed conifer swamp and lowland hardwoods area to the east with a rising water table.
The sawlog size aspen is 60 + years of age and somewhat offsite in the transition to the are of a higher water table. The aspen is mature and starting to break down and should be harvested or it will become decadent and lost. There are no aspen clones on site to favor aspen aspen regeneration within the balsam fire, cedar, and lowland hardwood cover type.
This is the preferred area "soil's wise" for Jeff & Tammy to construct their cabin. The management direction to meet Jeff's objectives is to clear the proposed cabin site, remove all sawlog size aspen for personal construction use, and selective harvest within the balsam fir, cedar, and lowland hardwoods, and included white and yellow birch. Retain all "heathy" white birch for diversity and site aesthetics.
The integrated resource management direction is to develop and improve a future cabin site and to develop and improve an aesthetic woodland in a boreal ecosystem surrounding the proposed cabin site.
Great stuff ;D.
Ron, what do you charge to come to Georgia ??? :D.
It depends upon how good the turkey and deer hunting might be? ;)
Congrats to you and your wife on the forest stewardshippin', Jeff! I look forward to staying posted on the progress.
That was the first formal management plan I've ever read....interesting. ;D
Quote from: Ron Scott on June 13, 2007, 09:22:21 PM
It depends upon how good the turkey and deer hunting might be? ;)
Ron, simply outstanding. Our limit of deer is 12 per year, and you are most welcome to come and hunt them on my property (and while you are sitting on the deer stand, you can be thinking about the management plan ;D).
I posted in another thread about starting to work on the powerline that crosses our property. THis work is part of the management plan that Ron drew up for us. I have some photos here of a week after I did a test spray to try and kill the canary grass.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/canary_roundup_1.jpg)
This photo looks past where I sprayed to where I was going to continue spraying. Since it looked like things were working, I went ahead and sprayed about an acre, which is about two thirds of the area the powerline covers.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/canary_roundup_2.jpg)
Well, I found one of the monster ruts that crossed the powerline. They dont dry out because of the grass cover. Every thing is hard other then in the ruts and if you drop all your wheels in one, you go down. Luckily I was close to the edge here and used the winch for the first time to get out. The mud was clear to the top of the tire.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/canary_roundup_3.jpg)
Another note, the boom sprayer I built worked perfectly and is just what I needed. :)
The first shots have been fired ;D. After the first skirmish:
Boss 1
Grass 0
Looking good ;).
What was the concentration on the round-up?
Actually I am using Pronto, which is Tractor Supply's clone. If I remember correctly the glyphosate is something like 43%. The recommended mix was 2 ounces of concentrate per gallon of water.
The kill looks good. I usually mix a 2.5% solution to 3% solution, which is a little over 3 ounces per gallon, but I have never sprayed that type of grass.
Would it be possible to burn the grass after the herbicide has done its work?
I know how I missed this thread .. took a while to go throught it ... :P Nice job Mr. Ron , first one for me to . I like the way the property is discribed , you are a true professional .
Jeff ... I like your boom , I would like to see the " How I did my own boom sprayer " ;D
Tanks Marcel ;D
Its right here Marcel. :)
https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?topic=26061.0
Thanks , I didnot get that far in my looking into the forum .. I gots lots of catching up to do ... A whole few weeks :D :D
We are making maintainance trails on our property as one of the first steps. The cedar is thick and portions of the ground sensitive so we are walking through and flagging where we want trails. The east west trail on the North side of the property winds through very dense cedar not far off the property line. We decided we needed a way across the ditch on the east end of the trail so we could not have to drive the entire trail every time we needed to access that part of the property.
Standing right near the spot we wanted to cross, about 20 feet from the corner stake were two spruce. One was dead, and the other only had about 3 foot of the top with foliage. We cut those two trees down to use as the stringers for the bridge. The poles are actually about
6" in diameter but the photo makes them look smaller.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/bridge_1.jpg)
I suppose, ideally, we should use treated lumber, but free is better. ;D We thought about getting treated 2 by for the top, but the thoughts ended at 7.50 a piece for 10 foot 2by6s. We have 16 feet of bridge so that was out of the question.
Along the power line lays a spruce tree that the power company must have taken down when they put the new poles in (and rutted the place up). We went down and gave that a look-see and decided it would be perfect for hauling out and sawing into 5 foot bridge boards.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/bridge_2.jpg)
So thats what we did. :) We bucked the log to 5 foot lengths cause thats all we could handle with the tools at hand and thats the length we needed for our boards. The Little trailer we bought last year at an engine show turns out to be perfect for hauling behind the quad. :)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/tammy_spruce.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/bridge_3.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/bridge_4.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/bridge_5.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/bridge_6.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/bridge_7.jpg)
I got the spruce sawn into 6/4 boards yesterday and they are now ready to take up the next time we go North. Out of those 4 logs I got 22-6/4 by 5 1/2, 1-6/4 by 7 1/2 1-6/4 by 9 1/2 and 3-1 by 6's :)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/bridge_8.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/bridge_9.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/bridge_10.jpg)
Love the going down the road with a load of logs picture. ;)
This is gonna be a labor of love for you two. :)
Now I see the real picture, I think Tammy broke her wrist to get some rest. ;) :D :D :D
Stew
Quote from: Radar67 on June 20, 2007, 08:16:40 PM
Now I see the real picture, I think Tammy broke her wrist to get some rest. ;) :D :D :D
Stew
You could be right. :D Actually, she has as much fun as I do. We have worked ourselves to the bone a couple times last week in the heat but get up the next morning wanting to go do it again. I think this is going to be good for me. I'm actually working too, even though appearances say different. :D Here I am coming out of one of the trails we are working on. This one is going to go back to the "Intermittent Steam" area. :)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/scratch_crotch.jpg)
You can see by the photo that the property is dense. It takes quite a bit of doing to get a trail down through. So far I am guessing we have built about 1/2 mile of trail.
Its one of the best ways to get tired .. ya just dont get tired of getting tired ;D :D :D
Breaking trail is tough...when I first bought my place, I spent a couple of months hand clearing one of the property lines. I opted to push my lines clear and concentrate on the interior by hand and sprayer. At least now I can manage the lines twice a year with my tractor.
Regardless of how or what you do on your place, it does bring a lot of satisfaction and pride to know you did it yourself. ;)
Stew
I like the Forestry Forum decal on the back of your tailgate, Jeff! ;D
Boss,
All that work you are doing brings back fond memories :D. 1/2 mile of trail is no small task ;). Each ounce of investment will bring back a pound of satisfaction. A man (woman) has to have a purpose, and what you are doing with that property is impressive :).
Jeff,
Thanks for sharing that pictures with us!
Now I know, I have a lot of work to do.
Good going! :)
Quote from: Jeff B on June 20, 2007, 08:21:00 PM
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/scratch_crotch.jpg)
You can see by the photo that the property is dense. It takes quite a bit of doing to get a trail down through. So far I am guessing we have built about 1/2 mile of trail.
Hey is that............Oh that's you in da background, Boss....Fer a second there I thought.....Oh....Never mind...... ;D ;D ;D
Its a Michigan Bigfoot, you know, a scratchcrotch.
Quote from: WDH on June 20, 2007, 07:14:44 PM
The kill looks good. I usually mix a 2.5% solution to 3% solution, which is a little over 3 ounces per gallon, but I have never sprayed that type of grass.
Would it be possible to burn the grass after the herbicide has done its work?
I wish it was, but we have had some pretty high fire dangers. I'm pretty certain that the fire would contain to the dead grass cause I think I was right about something once before. :D
Well Jeff - pretty cool stuff. Just got down catching up a bit (impossible to catchup completely). Somehow I wasn't able to figure out how many acres you have.
You get your own land like that and it really gets into your blood.
There is a real slick Logrite arch that Tammy could surely use....... ;D ;D
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/tammy_spruce.jpg)
Fred, we have 20 acres. :)
Very nice, big enough to give you something to do, not so large it because a major undertaking (we will soon be at 500 acres... !)
I am very interested in your sprayer by the way. We have to spray about 100 acres a year or more, might be just the thing. Of course, just bought a tractor so maybe we will just use that.
Nice management plan Jeff and Ron 8)
Thank you for sharing a proper plan.
IMO all woodlot owners should at least walk their land once with a Forester. You can learn SO much..
So many buy a chunk of land abuse or neglect it then get sick of it clear cut it and sell it :-[
Looks like you got some nice healthy NWC in the mix too:D ;)
max
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/scratch_crotch_2.jpg)
Huh, Jeff, thought I might mention when they say to put a winch on your ATV, they aren't talking about a woman... I know up there in Yooperlandia that wench and winch sound very similar but there IS a difference...
WINCH. I don't use that other word, especially now that The Thumper has a big new fiberglass thumper.
https://forestryforum.com/media/stuck_rincon.wmv
It is nice to know that if you get bogged down in life, you can depend on your favorite winch ::) to help you pull out of it :).
The 'spruce' logs from the powerline looks a lot like tamarack to me. ;D ;)
To bad the upper branches on the tree didn't look that way too. That would have made it tamarack instead of spruce then. Much more durable then the spruce for a bridge :)
Yup, it would. Thought I'd try to catch ya off guard. :D :D :D
I was able to get my bridge completed the first day my sister and BIL and I went up North last week. I found just enough left over green floor paint in the shed to slop on a coat of paint so it doesn't stick out along the road like a soar thumb. :)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/bridge_11.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/bridge_12.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/bridge_13.jpg)
This is my Brother-in-law Pete, checking out my start of my remote controlled gate.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/bridge_14.jpg)
I like the natural gate. ;D
Nice bridge and gate ;D.
Nice to see you had your PPE on while testing the bridge.
I thought you might call me to stop by and load test it. ;D
Is that Evil Knieval or is that the Boss ???.
Gonna get respect from the wing man on the snowplow this winter? Or just pull the bridge into the woods before he comes by?
Nice bridge and gate.
What's the top speed limit on that bridge? ;D
The bridge is well below the shoulder of the road so safe from the plow blade. I hope. :D
I got a video of the first crossing too. No holds barred. ;D
Well that does it for me. She's tank proof. ;D 8)
Nice bridge and gate. I don't have a wheeler, but if I did I would make some foot bridges across some wet spots on my trails. They are dry in summer and stiffen up in winter, but in spring and fall they can get the pant legs wet and muddy. :-\ Did I mention moose use those trails and they are kinda dumb like cows and ............. well. ::)
Tank proof eh? :D
THE VIDEO (https://forestryforum.com/media/bridge.wmv) ;D
DanG it all, Jeff. You make bridge building look so easy. Kinda makes me embarrased I've been putting off building mine for so long. Only difference in the bridges is mine needs to be about 20-30 foot long and support 20 tons. The post Paul_H posted with the excavator making a bridge made me feel like a slacker too.
Better get the other half of those grouser cleats welded up this weekend and get out there - I can't have you all showing me up!
But on the other hand...if I don't do it whose gonna know? ;)
20 tons? What the heck you driving across it?
JD450C crawler/loader with big logging winch on back pulling a forwarding trailer with logs.
Now why would anyone wanna do that?
can you use culvert pipe? That is a life saver when heavy loads need to be carried.
Uh, boss? What is that crashing sound at the end of the video? bike_rider
Its there for your imagination.
I sure like the winch on our ATV. With our soil type, a few cuts on the obvious major roots and you can use it to pull small stumps out when creating maintenance trails.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/atv_stumps.jpg)
Something I learned when I made my driveway. Don't open up a straight line of sight from the hard-road that a passing motorist can shoot down. You might be sitting by the side of the trail one day and he'll think he sees a deer.
Put a kink in your trail next to the road.
Yes, you should build a kinky trail! :D
None of my trails run in from the road and believe me, none of them run anywhere straight. :D I think my newest one, out in the boondocks might have one long straight stretch of 30 yards. :D
I'll try to create a video small enough to share that I took one handed down the trail I was building this week to show an example.
Lets try this. I joined Youtube so I could put long videos there. The quality aint the greatest, but they are watchable. :)
http://www.youtube.com/v/HWJAqeGRshI
Thanks for the tour 8)
I'm working on the first trail video I took of our first trail. I have to compress it to make it fit Youtube, then they compress it more. I'll post it when I get done.
Pretty woods y'all have up there. I was up in Wisconsin (near Iron Mt., MI) working in January. Sure looks different when it's 'green'! Y'all have more bars than churches up there! 8)
Quote from: wmrussel on July 12, 2007, 01:19:58 PM
Y'all have more bars than churches up there! 8)
:D
Here is a video clip of a jurney down the first trail Tammy and I made. It is the one that now has the bridge at one end. The video was made before the bridge, and also the trail has been improved a tad since recording.
http://www.youtube.com/v/5uC-548ZMkQ
I created a slide show with some photos I have taken, from mostly this year, that sort of show why Tammy and I like the east end of the U.P. so much and why we are so happy to have had the chance to get our chunk of property.
The URL is:
https://forestryforum.com/eastern_up (https://forestryforum.com/eastern_up)
Some of these have appeared on the Forestry Forum, several have not. :)
Down in the lower left corner of the slide slow page, the 5th icon from the left starts the slide show
What a bummer! You forgot the ice cream place.
It burned down, remember...
We have five ice cream places now to replace it. ;D
Are they ice cream parlors or take outs? ;)
I only count places that will dip you an ice cream cone or put it in a Bowl. There are two in De Tour, one in Goetzville, one at the Raber Bay Bar and Petersons on the Gogamain Rd. 6 if you count the one in Pickford, but thats about 20 miles.
Can you hit them all in the same day? ;D
Very beautiful part of the country Jeff. I'd love to come visit some day, better start work on a bed and breakfast after showing those pictures. :)
Quote from: Kevin on July 16, 2007, 07:23:03 AM
Can you hit them all in the same day? ;D
I think I could. :D
Quote from: Norm on July 16, 2007, 07:30:30 AM
Very beautiful part of the country Jeff. I'd love to come visit some day, better start work on a bed and breakfast after showing those pictures. :)
Norm, we got room anytime you want to visit. :)
A week ago this past Wednesday I planted my powerline into what I hope will be some good food for the local wildlife. I planted a mix of red and white clovers, some rape, with a cover of oats on one portion and rye on another. Hopefully it does well this fall and this following year I can follow up with a spray plan that will kill only the grasses. We will see. This is the way I left the field last week after planting. I'm hoping it looks different the next time I see it. :)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/powerline_planted.jpg)
Below is what the unimproved powerline looks like between my food plot and the road. Its still knocked down some from my driving on it.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/powerline_planted_3.jpg)
Beyond my food plots on the next property the canary grass is in places over 8 foot tall. It is all way over my head. You can see it in the far distance in the first photo.
It seems a little late for your planting. My brother counted 20 deer on a rape field here yesterday. Do you have enough moisture in the U.P. to get them to germinate? We might have nothing but sand dunes by deer season!
Quote from: deutz4 on August 18, 2007, 10:47:52 PM
Do you have enough moisture in the U.P. to get them to germinate?
Sorry, but after being on the property, I have to laugh at that question! :D :D :D
The UP has been extremly dry, but I'm gonna take a wild guess and say Jeff has enough moisture. ;)
Early to mid august is a fine time to plant to have nice tender young stuff for fall in most years. It wont make much for winter feed, but not much I can do this year. We really do need some rain.
I took these photos last week. Still no rain as of this morning up there, but we were hoping for some yet today and tomorrow. My soil is still moist due to the heavy mat of dead canary grass but I really need a rain now to kick things into gear and activate the fertilizer I spread when I planted.
Oats, rye and rape are all coming up good. If I get down and look real close the clover is just starting to emerge.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/foodplot_1.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/foodplot_2.jpg)
Must have been a kernel in the mix eh? :) I plan on planting several rows of corn or sorghum next year to divide food plots into zones the bucks have to visit to see into rather then just stand at the end and look the length to view the does and then trot to the neighbors to see what he has to offer. My goal is to give them things to keep them busy here. :D I'm pleased to see the corn do so well so quick though. :)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/foodplot_3.jpg)
Mighty healthy green to those plants there. That's a good thing. Shame you can't get in a few ears of sweet corn before frost.
Don
You are making a significant improvement in the habitat. For both the animals and the humans :D.
I was worried about the seed making it through the grass mat for germination, but all seems well. :)
Don K, I drove a total of 13 miles on the small fields with my knobby ATV tires after planting. My intent was to drive the seed through the mat. I think it may have worked. Germination is not quite as good in the areas where I did not spend as much time driving on. I had left that area as a control to see if the driving made a difference. I figured if my control plot was as successful as the areas where I drove over, next time I wouldn't have to do the driving. As it looks, Driving on it was key.
If you can keep the canary grass (I think I remember it being called that) under control and you a good stand of the cover crop grasses this year, It should greatly reduce the thatch that the seed has to work through.
hi jeff
as someone mentioned elsewhere, i think our woods do look a lot alike. pretty flat with a tendancy to be quite wet in the spring/early summer? i think i have about an equal amount of 5 types of trees: soft maple, cedar, yellow birch, hemlock and balsam fir. also quite a few spruce in one quarter.
but my pride and joy are my white pines. i have almost exactly 100 of them which i have inventoried and measured. they seem to be about 80 to 90 yrs old mostly about 20 - 30" in diameter. it breaks my heart to see any of them die or fall. that was the only reason i cut that one down in my video, it had died so i salvaged it before the bugs got into it. i think its interesting that my white pines are either "full grown" or seedlings. there arent any young white pines say 4-8" in diam or 10 to 20 feet tall. seems strange.
theres actually thousands of very small balsams but they die out pretty quick, and none of the balsams get past 8" in diameter before they die.
i dont have any oak trees :(
just thought i'd tell you all that so you could compare my western UP woods to your eastern woods. :)
i've made trails like yours all thru my woods over the years. i never tire of taking walks. one thing i do is take a 24" length of plumbing pipe and walk thru the woods "off trail" knocking all the dead branches off the trees up to about 7 or 8 feet. i've almost got the 40 acres done and dont have to worry about eye-pokers anymore.
Although balsam will grow in a wide range of medium, including moss, they do not size up too well on wet ground and often die before they get 8". They are more nutrient demanding than spruce is seems. Sometimes those 8"ers might be 60 years old or more. Balsam fir is not know to die out to well unless it is wet ground, on well drained ground it can be so thick you can't even walk in it. Up on the Christmas moutains after the big blow down in 1995 , the density count of the fir regen was well over 40,000 stems per ha (many areas over 100,000) and 6-8 ' tall. Machines had to be used to cut swaths through the thickets in order for the thinning crews to get any headway. Imagine having to walk on top of 1/2" wide by 6" tall stumps all day with a thinning saw. That's how thick it was. Then add the granite boulders and blow down to it. ::)
I QUIT !! would be a common saying. :D :D
I can't hardly wait to get back up to the property to see how my food plots are doing. We were getting the rain we needed when Tammy and I left there Tuesday. This is a shot of the oaks and rape from the day before that. Just starting to pick up some clover in it now. THe rain should activate the 12-12-12 I put down the day of planting and I would think I will see some real change when I get back up there. What I hope I see is that is is getting mowed off faster then it can grow by the local critters that have become our neighbors. (More accurately, we have become their neighbors)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/foodplot_4.jpg)
Quote from: Jeff B on June 02, 2007, 12:31:13 PM
ARC CONSULTING SERVICES
RONALD E. SCOTT, CF, ACF (Ret.)
ALL RESOURCE CONNECTIONS
REGISTERED FORESTER #612
http://webpages.charter.net/arcwoods
(149B) Kalkaska Sand, 0 – 6% slopes, stony. This soil is located in a small triangular area in the southwest corner of the property bounded by Piesly road and the south property line. This soil is a very deep, somewhat excessively drained nearly level and undulating. It is usually on broad plains and upland flats. Surface runoff is slow.
Northern hardwoods are usually the dominant cover type on this soil. The soil is good for hardwoods, conifers, and wildlife shrubs. Trees to plant include red pine and white pine.
Major management concerns are equipment limitations, seeding mortality, and plant competition.
This soil is deeper to water and the best suited for building site development on the property, but septic filtering may be poor.
Thanks to the purchase of my dear dragsaw by a forum member (It went to a very good home) Tammy and I were able to get a little mechanized help at the location described above by Ron. I had spent the last week or so before the following photo clearing and brushing the driveway location from the road, then turning to the left in back portion of the following photo on back to where will be the eventual building site. There is a lot of ash, birch, yellow birch and aspen at this site. The top soil is about 8 to 12 inches thick before the Kalkaska sand. This was the morning we left. I have not seen the finished drive yet.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/driveway_up_1.jpg)
I has some "discussions" with the county road commision engineer on his requiements for the driveway on the permit. He specified a 15 inch culvert (no problem) New (o.k., I suppose)
30 FEET LONG (PROBLEM!) First of all, I went around the area and could not find anything over a 20 foot culvert anywhere. Even some new ones on the south road were only around 16. I called around up there and down here and only could buy 20 footers. To get 30 I would have to buy two twenties as no one would sell halves. I became determined that I was being treated like a flat lander on this one. So, I called the guy back and began to explain to him that I had no need for passing lanes on my driveway. The turn lane was not necessary either. I had no intentions of pushing a mobile home in there SIDEWAYS. A 30 foot culvert would take more then twice the money to put in as a twenty, and this was just not right. In the end, he listened and said that he would not change the permit, however, if I was to put the 20 in, he was the one, if any one that would be inspecting it, and he would allow it, he just would not change the permit. Something about liability for the county if they were to allow less then twenty. I dont know about that. Most of the reasonable stuff he told me still somehow seemed very unreasonable. To most they probably would have give in. I think he gave in when he saw he was in for a tussle. I'd like to hope he gave in to better judgement.
When the twenty arrived, it looked plenty long. I got lucky on the ordering. I went into De Tour and they said, we dont have them here, it'll come from Pickford. "Well" I said, "I'm only 200 yards out of the way, do you think the driver can load it on the side, then take peasley across and roll it off where I'll be waiting for him?" They said sure! Less then an hour later it was in da ditch. :)
I was only reguired to have a 20 foot culvert.I did have the town put it in for me.I know it cost more than what you did,but they own it.If it gets blocked up with gravel and leafs and washes out my drive,its there fault.I live on quite a hill.I do try to keep the worst of it cleaned out.Looking forward to more pictures.I can remember having work done here.I work 12 hours a day and about a 45 minute drive and the wife would viedo what went on with the builders and the ground work and I would watch it each night.Was a good way to keep up on what was going on until I was able to get there.Like one of my friends would say about the dozer,We could do some damage with that. ;D
Ours are required to be 30' too Jeff but it's probably because we're in farm country. The best part is the county sells you the culvert for pretty much their cost and will cut it into 10' increments over the 30' lengths. You do have to go to their yard to bring it back though.
I'm guessing it won't be long before Tammy and you will be drawing up house plans. :)
Norm, in fact thats my current goal, is to get plans underway. But not because we are in any hurry to build or move. At least not for a couple years. We wont have money to do anything until our mortgage and a second mortgage is paid and that is only 13 months away. 24 years of making house payments will be OVER! Anyhow, the reason I want to get started is because of the local building inspector up there. Anthony is first cousin to a goods friend and is rather liberal when it comes to letting people do things like build with rough sawn lumber and such. Anthony is retiring in less then two years. I have been told he may end up being replaced with someone who is very pro local contractor and would be very tough to try and build anything on your own through. I want to get all our ducks in a row and the paper work with stamps of approval before Anthony retires.
What diameter is that culvert pipe?
15 inch double walled plastic.
Here it is in da ditch
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/culvert_up_property.jpg)
We can't go below 18" on roads constructed across water courses. But, public roadside ditches are the DOT's responsibility. We are allowed one ditch culvert per property. I had part of an old concrete one collapse a couple years ago and the DOT replaced it free of charge the day after I called. ;D
Quote from: Rokky Rakkoon on August 28, 2007, 08:36:56 PM
there arent any young white pines say 4-8" in diam or 10 to 20 feet tall. seems strange.
One of the reasons for the lack of smaller white pines is because we have too DanG many deer. The deer love to browse on those white pine buds and they kill all the new growth by overbrowsing.
The MN DNR is trying to regenerate white pine stands and have to go out and staple "bud caps" on the young white pines to keep the deer from killing all the new growth.
So if you want more white pine, one method is to eat more venison. ;D
And if ya got moose they not only rip the buds off, but the whole darn stem gets ripped up and down and tramped into the ground. >:(
Had something exciting happen tonight. Well, atleast exciting to me.
We came hoe from running some errands just before dusk and as we were passing my corner where you can see down the powerline, there were 4 adult deer down there grazing on the foodplot. first time ever to see multiple der down there, other then catching a glimps ofa couple as they crossed it.
You gotta love it when a plan comes together. ;)
I never see a fawn in the summer around the 2 or 3 does that travel together around here. And the deer move out of here in winter, I never see a track. They can't be too far, but not on my woodlot. They will come to winter here as soon as the softwood mature, but that's a looong way off.
I regularly see a couple of does on my 35 acres, especially as I show up on the property. Not afraid of me at all, I drove within 50 feet of one the other day on the tractor. The twin fawns are a little more skittish. The neighbor on one side is an animal lover, feeds them and puts out a salt lick. The neighbor on the other side is rebuilding his deer stand. That's me in the middle, I like to see them, then cuss at the damage they're doing to my oak seedlings.
Speaking of deer, somebody seems to be moving my flags. I lined the long driveway with red oak, white oak and red maple bare root stock a couple years ago. To keep from mowing over them, I marked them with the orange landscaping flags. When I went back a couple days later, some of the flags were missing and others were laying on the ground. The critters are messing with me.
I find deer much cuter down here than I did in NJ. ::) Down here they are nearly all gone but we have a small herd in the first finca - you can see them at times among the trees. Pretty exciting in truth.
Jeff - nice to see your plan coming together. We are big time into expansion right now and I yearn for the days when construction is finished - at least temporarily. We have been building things for 5 years now I feel. :o
Just a partial list:
4 houses, 2 storage places, 10 kilometers of roads, 3 bridges, 3 ponds, 2 workshops, 2 rebuilt homes...
I am going to stop there before I depress myself... ::)
The local construction supply place thinks we are wonderful people...
Well, there's nothing wrong with that Fred. ;D
We're headed south and I should be home in about an hour or so. I took some more photos of my food plots today. Unreal how fast stuff is growing for September. I planted a bunch of Austrian Peas today. I am anxious to see how well they do planted this time of year. 8)
Greg, I hit the post button on that last post right at the Wolverine exit ;D ;)
8) 8) Things have really greened up here since we've gotten about 4" of rain the last week or so. That and the almost 90 degree heat. I'm ready for fall and it sounds like it's coming next week. Forecasts are calling for highs in the mid 60s 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) Small game season opens in 10 days. How many days til bow season Jeff ??? :)
I dunno. I derw my bow back for the first time in 5 years this past spring. I got it back, but then knew I was in trouble as I had no arrow and had to let it off. That hurt me and I have not tried since. HOWEVER. I am in the mindset right now that I can do it. I'm planning on getting a couple of bales tomorrow just as if I was going to have no issues. I'm hoping. I've been building my arm strength working on the property and my shoulders have been holding up better then they have in years. I'll let you know how it goes. I'll have Tammy record my first effort and shot just so I know myself weather to pursue it or just give it up and hunt with my camera.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/foodplot_5.jpg)
The clover is starting to get foothold now. :)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/foodplot_6.jpg)
Deer Salad. 8)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/deer_salad.jpg)
One of three birch next to the field that the Bear have all barked up.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/bear_sign.jpg)
Ya know... with your shoulder issues you probably qualify for a crossbow permit. Get a note from a Dr that says you can't draw a regular bow :) :)
I've had that note for the last 4 years, but I refused to use it. If I cant draw the bow, then I cant do the other things that are necessary for me to take a deer. I'm usually on my own when it comes to bow hunting so if I can't be totally self reliant, I'll continue to pass. Besides, it aint all about getting a deer. Being able to get out there with or without the bow is more to me then any of the rest of it. Until unable to do so, I had bow hunted since I was 12. I've always been pretty proficient with the bow and that continues to be important to me, so if I can't do it, I don't want a cheap replacement.
I hope you don't have any problem with the road warriors.
Remember, we won an award for fence building. I figure 8 to 10 foot cedar with the nice little tree cut outs and a gate with a transmission company lock on it will fit the bill. Besides, it gives me more places to hang these: ;D
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/cedar_research.jpg)
2 months from now ... >:(
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10030/target.PNG)
:D No produm. :D Actually if they try it, I would be the least of their worries. Lou keeps telling me that at 80, he can afford to do things that he couldn't do before. That includes performing burials. :D
State law allows you the use of a crossbow. It's your choice not to take advantage of the law but it's your loss as well :( :) ;D ;)
I'm not a bow hunter never have been but if I qualified for a crossbow permit I'd be one 8) :) :D ;D
Your right, but the best part is, I dont consider it a loss not using the crossbow. Its just a personal choice. I may change my mind at some point when if stubbornness retreats. ;)
Greg, you certainly can use a crossbow. Between November 15th and 30th.
Why use a crossbow during the time I can use a high powered rifle 8) 8). I check deer other people have killed during that time anyway and have little to no time to hunt so using a crossbow during archery season would really suit me better ;D ;D
Looks like a lot of mustard or turnip to. ;D
Quote from: Jeff B on September 06, 2007, 10:02:49 PM
Remember, we won an award for fence building. I figure 8 to 10 foot cedar with the nice little tree cut outs and a gate with a transmission company lock on it will fit the bill. Besides, it gives me more places to hang these: ;D
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/cedar_research.jpg)
Shouldn't you at least post them
cedar research signs on cedar trees. ::) :D :D :D :D
No... I'm not labeling trees. smiley_dizzy
Thats not mustard or turnip. Its rapeseed.
I wasn't sure where to post this but I decided to post it here since it includes some of my plan to manage. Just down from our property a dozen yards or so is a thing of beauty. A small patch of wild Highbush Cranberries. I've been watching them and waiting for the day to get them before the birds and the bears with two goals in mind.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/wild_highbush_cranberries_1.jpg)
Goal number one was to pick some and play birdie. That is "fly" (stumble) around my property looking for a similar area where I could introduce the berries like a bird might, although mine will not have gone through the digestive tract. :D Goal#1 has been completed. :) I hope they take. I have no idea how long they take to propagate but I reckon it is years.
Here is goal number two. smiley_smug01
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/wild_highbush_cranberries_3.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/wild_highbush_cranberries_2.jpg)
When we go back up I will be making two batches of "Wild Highbush Cranberry" Jam. ;D
Maybe Jelly, by dripping the cooked juice from a permeable sac? How ya gonna get them big seeds out in the jam? ;D
Well, same family. Even canola fits. ;D
That's neat. Those are nice looking berries.
Don
I was always getting fleeced by the hornets when picking cranberries for mother. I said the last time, that was it. :D :D
When I first saw the picture I thought Jeff was curing salmon eggs...
Quote from: SwampDonkey on September 07, 2007, 07:13:31 PM
Well, same family. Even canola fits. ;D
Yes it "can". Although not all rapeseed is canola, but all canola is rapeseed. :)
Jeff,could you plant some beets or is the ground too wet?One year I got busy and left the beets in the ground.The deer pawed through the snow to get at them.The snow was purple.They liked the carrots too.
THis next year I will plant some turnips in the mix. The ground isn't wet at all. :)
Deer love beet greens, and I bet turnip tops to. Ask any gardener with deer around. ;D
Jeff could plant tulips - I know that deer like them. :D
Lilies to, and some are native. ;D
Part of the management plan that Ron had prescribed for my property is the removal of the Aspen and Balsam Poplar.
I think I invented a new word. ;D "Aspendectomy" :)
Most of you know that I spent most my entire working life in a saw booth with a few stints in the woods and on the road in a log truck, plus a little hauling lumber when times were lean in the mill. My Logger experiences though were limited to mechanized machinery. I ran Skidders and Loaders, Slashers and total tree chippers, and a bobcat with a feller buncher, however I never did any felling with chainsaws. I did work behind a feller as a limber and bucker, but never any felling. This leave me inadequately prepared, safety wise, for starting the removal of some of the larger aspen on my property. I just don't want to go up there with only book knowledge and end up killing myself or worse. (I figure there are fates worse then death).
So, I have found some help in giving me some training. Friday, Tammy is taking me up to the cabin and dropping me off and Saturday morning Kevin is coming down to spend the weekend. Were going to start taking down some of my larger aspen that I am going to use to saw framing material out of. The start of my management plan's Aspendectomy :)
Tuesday, Burlkraft is coming over and we're going to probably start skidding logs our with the Logrite Mark7 arch. That is if it isn't to wet in there yet. If it is, then were going to transplant some Balsam fir to a place where I need a visual screen.
Sounds like a fun weekend. Too bad I am so far away as the forwarder is not being used much right now. But it would cost more to get it there and back than the trees would be worth.
Hope you have a good winch to pull them down after they are cut.
How many do you plan to cut?
My land is to sensitive to use a fowarder on. I'll be using the Logrite arch. I don't know exactly how many saw log size trees, but my guess is less then 20, but not necessarily all this weekend. Pete has some good size Tamarack that he wants me to take at the cabin as well since several died last year, were guessing due to the very dry conditions they went through.
Heard a land owner ask someone today. Should I cut that old cedar down there and replant it?
First, I was wondering if he knew it lives a mighty long time. And I wondered if he knew how bad the cedar actually was and if it was worth trying to market. Sometimes it's best left standing, for wildlife if nothing else and maybe for greater significance, water quality. Be dang shame a deer or moose might have a cedar stand to winter in. ::)
Then a respond was given that it has a long life. And pretty much followed my additional thoughts given above.
Then I wondered how he thought a wet cedar swamp was going to be reforested with anything other than cedar and maybe balm of gilead, possibly tamarak and how was he going to achieve it. I never heard a solution.
I don't agree with clear cutting cedar, yet this is the attitude around here. The guy that owns it will be long dead and that cedar will be there for a long time to come.
Jeff,
Remember to bring your video equipment
so we can see your post on youtube! ;D
Mrs. B.S.
How did the "Aspendectomy" :) GO?
Still in da O.R. in da U.P. No good way to post til I get home next weekend. Lots of work. Its good for me. Wait until you see the video of a Logrite cant hook felling a 75 foot tall aspen!
Wish I had the camera today Jeff. I coulda showed ya some big old whallopers for cedar where I was marking out for thinning. There was 3 huge ones within a tight circle, each about 30 inches or so on the but end. Many are dying in that spot from age. I bet they are over 300 years old. Most would be hollow. I seen a few cords laid to waste along the roadside. Criminal. ::)