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Nyle l53 refrigerant recharge

Started by wills swamp, May 11, 2022, 01:23:02 PM

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wills swamp

Has anyone had to recharge the compressor in the Nyle l53? Is it possible a recharge is needed without having a leak in the system? Been running mine often over the last ten years. I'm having trouble with moisture removal. I've already hit the reset button and also checked voltage to the high and low pressure circuits. Thanks 
wills swamp custom sawing-2002 wood-mizer lt40/hydraulic/d33,nyle L53 kiln,case 1845sp,massey203/loader/farmi winch,john deere 450c crawler/loader,husqvana saws,logrite tools

K-Guy


It has to have a leak if it is low otherwise there is no place for the refrigerant to. The refrigerant fairy is just a myth. :D
Is it just this load or has it been taking longer to dry over the last several loads? If it is just this load, it is more likely the wood, or if it has been taking longer for the last few loads, you may want to bring in a tech to check for a lead. If you need more help call Nyle and push 6 for service or call me at 800-777-6953 Ext212.
Stan
Nyle Service Dept.
A common mistake people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools.
- D. Adams

rusticretreater

The good thing is that Nyle says everything on the unit is replaceable because they built it that way.

It is impossible to keep a refrigerant charge in a system indefinitely, so that's why regular service is recommended.  If the refrigerant has escaped, it has to be replaced with something and that is air.  Air has moisture and when compressed, it condenses into water.  This creates an acid inside the system and damages it from the inside out.  So all the air needs to be out of the system.

Recharging the system will restore some function, but will not be optimal and also will leave water in the system.  The dessicant(filter/dryer) will be saturated and useless.  And of course, in case of a leak will quickly fail again.

Any major leaks must be repaired, the system fully evacuated with a vacuum pump and then recharged.  The system also runs at pressures higher than normal A/C systems.

Your manual has some instructions on Page 31 or nearabouts on recharging the system, basically saying get a professional to fix it.  An online version of the manual can be found at the link below, though it may not be specific to your version of the product.

https://www.nyle.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/04/NDK-L53-Manual-2020-V1.0.pdf

Nyle is also an sponsor/advertiser on this site, so you will probably find contact information in their forum.  They can direct you further in repairs.
https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?board=106.0


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YellowHammer

If you have to recharge, you have a leak, unfortunately. 
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

wills swamp

wills swamp custom sawing-2002 wood-mizer lt40/hydraulic/d33,nyle L53 kiln,case 1845sp,massey203/loader/farmi winch,john deere 450c crawler/loader,husqvana saws,logrite tools

Ventryjr

10 year hvac tech here.  Definitely have a leak.   You will need a hvac/refrigeration company to properly top off your charge. And best to be done on a hot day 75+ with a load inside the kiln.  You certainly have a leak.   You might not have air in the system.  If you have a large leak and lost the full charge then you have air.  Otherwise if you have a tiny leak and lost a small amount of Freon. You most likely don't have air in the system.  You are running 40psi+ on the low side so if a tiny leak is present it still won't suck in outside air.   Don't let anyone put leak sealer or leak dye in your system.  It makes a mess of txv valve.  An acid absorber is only needed if you lost your compressor. 
-2x belsaw m14s and a Lane circle mill.

K-Guy

Quote from: Ventryjr on May 18, 2022, 05:16:30 AMDefinitely have a leak


I wouldn't say that too quickly, I have built and serviced these for years. If the wood has stopped releasing moisture, you may think you have a leak when it's the wood being stubborn. I've seen a lot of that lately.
Nyle Service Dept.
A common mistake people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools.
- D. Adams

YellowHammer

Are the coils cool?  You can lift the filter in the front and the coils should be cool, but not ice cold.  
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

wills swamp

Ventryjr thank you for the pro tips. Good to know about not using leak sealer and leak dye.
K-guy problems with multiple loads and species or air dried live edge slabs. Can't get to target moisture content. Been running this kiln for almost 10 years. Why do you think you're been seeing this a lot lately?
Yellow hammer starts off slightly cool but shortly turns warm. Bye the way I like your you tube channel.
Kiln still not running. The first hvac guy didn't have a vacuum pump. I'm trying to get another technician to come over. Thanks John 
wills swamp custom sawing-2002 wood-mizer lt40/hydraulic/d33,nyle L53 kiln,case 1845sp,massey203/loader/farmi winch,john deere 450c crawler/loader,husqvana saws,logrite tools

K-Guy

Quote from: wills swamp on May 21, 2022, 10:02:32 AMWhy do you think you're been seeing this a lot lately?


I don't know but walnut has been especially bad for it.
Nyle Service Dept.
A common mistake people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools.
- D. Adams

YellowHammer

If the coils are cool then warm, then the good news is that if there is any cooling at all, then there is still freon in the system, and moisture should not have gotten in and wouldn't be a problem, because the system is still pressurized.  So the issue is finding the leak, fixing it, and recharging the system.  Vacuuming the system is the gold standard technique, but if there is residual freon in the system, I don't think it's necessary.  

I've had several leaks in mine over many years time, and it's easy to do some of the preliminary work yourself, because it does sometimes "scare" some HVAC folks because it's a kiln, and they've not worked on one.  However, it's actually a very simple system, so you can do a good bit of groundwork yourself to help them out and keep your costs down by doing the pre work yourself.

If you are comfortable doing so, here are some steps to take.  The actual freon in the kiln is a blend of automotive R143a, which is a commonly available automotive refrigerant available at any Advance Auto, Auto Zone, etc.  So get a small can of recharge, hook it up exactly as if you were recharging your car, and starting putting the freon in.  R134a does not require a license, so it's available to the public, over the counter.  Don't get the stuff with the dye, it's a mess.

The true way to put a charge in this system requires it to be a weighed charge, but an automotive size can is about right, and this step is not to "solve" the problem but to identify it.

A couple things to note, the kiln has both a high pressure and a low pressure safety cutoff, so within reason there's no way to damage the unit with a small charge or an overcharge, you'll simply trip the safety, and they are reset with the mystical "little red button."  However, using a small automative freon can won't overcharge the system, anyway.  

Start charging the system, and keep putting it in until the frost starts to form and goes all the way to the condenser bulkhead.  That's where the frost line should be when properly charged.  At this point, the fins should be noticeably cool, and assuming the system is leaking, it's time to find it.  The good news is that finding a leak generally is done using rudimentary tools, such as your eyes, ears, and a little spritz bottle of Dawn mixed with water so it foams.  I have a high tech freon sniffer, but never use it, as I find that soap and water finds 99% of the leaks with careful observation and good lighting.  

First, take the side covers off, and start looking for any oily patches on the copper tubing.  The compressor has a small amount of lubricating oil in it, and will generally leave a"wet spot" where the leak is, although sometimes its very hard to see, sometimes it plain as day.  If you see a very small oily patch on the copper, that's your leak.

Then get a spray bottle of soapy water and start spritzing every joint of the copper tubing, and everywhere else, looking for little air bubbles to form.  This is the simplest and best way to find a leak.  There are even gel sprays on Amazon that are designed to bubble incredibly when there is a tiny leak.  So get into a Zen mental state, get some good lights, and start spritzing and looking.  Sometimes with strong backlighting, you can even see the soap spray atomize off the leak.  

The goal is to find the leak and see how severe it is, and where it is.  If its a joint (probably) then you can fix it yourself or get your HAVC guy to do it and since he charges by the hour, have him skip the whole detective thing, and have him fix the leak quickly and easily.  You won't have to explain how the whole kiln thing operates just say, "I found a leak, can you fix it?"  Then he can weigh in a proper charge and be done with it.

If you can find the leak yourself, then then you can save a lot of money and get a lot of peace of mind.

Thanks of watching the videos. I appreciate it.      

YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

wills swamp

Update. Tech found leak on top of compressor where electrical connects. Compressor will need to be replaced. Very small leak so I had him top off coolant just to finish this load. Thank you for all the replies.
wills swamp custom sawing-2002 wood-mizer lt40/hydraulic/d33,nyle L53 kiln,case 1845sp,massey203/loader/farmi winch,john deere 450c crawler/loader,husqvana saws,logrite tools

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