Very Interesting

[beenthere]

It doesn't cost one penny to offer an extra option.

It costs the mfg. money to offer extra options, at their risk that there is a market. I suspect that is just one of many hard decisions that they have to make, day in and day out.

[hamish]

It doesn't cost one penny to offer an extra option.

It costs the mfg. money to offer extra options, at their risk that there is a market. I suspect that is just one of many hard decisions that they have to make, day in and day out.

Hasn't cost the US arm of Woodmizer a penny, for they have never offered them in North America.  How do they know if there is a market of not. 

The simple handcrank is a low dollar item, whereas the electric motor on the Euro LT10 is a high dollar item, compared to a gas engine.  Cost of the mill considering the differences in the powerplant, currency, specs, country costs, etc.... are the same.

Seems some markets just demand higher quality goods.

[dgdrls]

The air cylinders are in the horizontal box at the very top of the head. They are the same size as those used on the rear door on a van with more pressure in, 225 and 250 lbs. So you not only fight the weight of the head but you also fight the pressure from the cylinders. To lift the head up you must use 100 lbs. of up pressure with your hands while trying to read the scale which of course cannot be done as all your strength and attention is on raising or lowering the head. It is equally difficult to get the head to the bottom to cut the last 1 inch board.
                                     Jim



 

Thanks for pointing out the lift cylinders Jim,,  I must not have had a "bad one"  Mine was "heavy" but not brutal.

"I shouldn't be in on this fray as I don't own a WM but the "10" is an entry level mill built as cheaply as possible and it is what it is. When you want the bells and whistles you step up to a "15" or higher.Of course this shouldn't stop you from making improvements on your mill." Frank C.

Respectfully, I don't agree Frank.  The U.S. spec 10 has a design challenge that needs to be corrected, I believe WM is too good a shop to sell a product that does not perform. They do offer the 30 day money back 2 yrs. warranty on the mill.   It appears the Euro spec machine does not suffer the same problem, so why not use one design for both continents or correct the US model accordingly. 

DGDrls

[Piston]

On a positive note regarding WM and their options, they never used to offer the electric autofeed for the LT15, and they started offering it a couple years ago, I believe when they introduced the LT28.  I haven't purchased one yet as I haven't been using my LT15 too much, but I do plan to buy this option for my mill.  If I bought my mill new and they offered it at the time, I would have bought it right off the bat as an option.  So, at least that is a start, at least their offering the autofeed as an option.  Perhaps they will introduce some new options in the future as well.

Not that motorcycles have anything to do with this, but I see all the time that Europe always gets the new model motorcycles at least a year before we do, and they eventually trickle over to the states.  Even still, there are some bikes over there that we will never get the option of buying, and in some cases, the ones that do come to the US only have certain options available, and not all the options that the European market gets.  So it goes beyond just WM, they aren't the only ones. 

[Happycamper]

I still believe that a simple steel had crank or sm. winch with a sprocket  and a piece of chain would be less expensive and much more effective than the cylinders, pulleys and cables presently used. I too wish WM would chime in on this.
                              Jim

[waho]

It's really frustrating when a good machine could be so much better if you can believe their hype.

 

[Brucer]

Perhaps instead of complaining about Wood-Mizer not chiming in, someone should send an e-mail to their head office, or a PM to their rep on the sponsor's page. Refer them to this topic and I'll bet they reply PDQ.

[Happycamper]

Bruce,
  Jacob Mooney said last "March" he was looking into this matter for me and I am still waiting for a reply from him.
                                           Jim

[roghair]

HC, I agree. I sent Moony a PM with my post https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php/topic,64876.msg968385.html#msg968385 on this subject but never received an answer or comment, which is fine but I was surpised to see the LT10 owners still have to solve this issue themselves.

[jcbrotz]

HC, I agree. I sent Moony a PM with my post https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php/topic,64876.msg968385.html#msg968385 on this subject but never received an answer or comment, which is fine but I was surpised to see the LT10 owners still have to solve this issue themselves.

Your closer to Mooney than we are he isn't stateside anymore. When Happycamper was overseas he should have stopped and saw Mooney and ask him.

If you put these options on the LT10 you then have a LT15 so why not buy that? The 10 is a good mill for what it is but it is ENTRY level and priced as such step up an buy a bigger one with these features if you want them.

[hamish]

HC, I agree. I sent Moony a PM with my post https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php/topic,64876.msg968385.html#msg968385 on this subject but never received an answer or comment, which is fine but I was surpised to see the LT10 owners still have to solve this issue themselves.

If you put these options on the LT10 you then have a LT15 so why not buy that? The 10 is a good mill for what it is but it is ENTRY level and priced as such step up an buy a bigger one with these features if you want them.

He's asking for a simple handcrank lifting system that works, that would be one option, that's it. Nowhere near the cost difference of an LT10 vs an 15.

Like buying a new car but ya gotta climb in through the windows, because the manufacturer is too lazy to have the doors open easily.

The LT10 is a great mill, just many of them have an issue that's not being addressed by the manufacturer efficiently by them, if its being addressed at all.

[Happycamper]

jcbrotz,
  Reasons I bought a small mill is I wanted the exercise working the mill and it sure does that very well. Another reason is I'm cheap if you will. And finally at the age of 78 now 79 how much should I spend on a mill?
                                      Jim

[5quarter]

Jim...at 79, You can spent as much as you DanG well please.  ;)

[WDH]

Happycamper,

You are one smart dude.  I take my hat off to you. 

[rimshot]

Jim...at 79, You can spent as much as you DanG well please.  ;)

=====

I have talked to several of the service folks in Indianapolis including Jim Brown who I believe is the service boss at the top.  Jim is a great guy and alwayS lends us his TIME.  WM knows we have an issue out here and have heard the growing crowd but I honestly doubt those of us with new lt10's will ever get the system rectified because of the costs involved.  I hope they realize too that many of the LT10 owners will move on to larger machines someday which may or jay not include wood mizer products. 
Despite this one flaw I love my Wood Mizer lt10 and think IT HAS all that is needed to be a dependable well thought out machine with very capable people supporting their product.  I believe it's time for them to get back to work on that LT10's interesting attempt to provide a system that can  raise the head and then they will be able to retake the throne.   

rimshot    (planning on a boat crank like Jim's to enjoy my LT10     

[Brucer]

...   Jacob Mooney said last "March" he was looking into this matter for me and I am still waiting for a reply from him.

And that's not an acceptable response.

If it were me, I'd be asking him if he's looked into it yet. You shouldn't have to, but sometimes things don't go as they should.

If that didn't get a quick response I'd be getting in touch with someone else at WM. Sparks and Deanna B are also moderators of the WM sponsor page.

[jcbrotz]

Happycamper,

You are one smart dude.  I take my hat off to you.

Happy Camper,
   I totally agree with this statement, And can only hope I make it that long :D I hope to still have my lt40 running but we will only see what the big guy upstairs has planned. My only point it with all respect, it that the lt10 is trying to compete in the cheapest mill market so staying cheap a much over all other. I also agree that woodmizer should be working harder on fixing yours and others problems.

[rimshot]

jcbrotz,
  Reasons I bought a small mill is I wanted the exercise working the mill and it sure does that very well. Another reason is I'm cheap if you will. And finally at the age of 78 now 79 how much should I spend on a mill?
                                      Jim

======

Hey Jim,

You, being the inventer makes me want to run this by you.  I will plan on a boat crank when I can line up the materels.  Since I screwed around with my LT 10' air cylinders experimenting with different rated poundage cylinders, My mill goes up alright but the problem has not been eliminated but has been transferred.  The hardest movement is not really up but down.  It is very difficult when I get to the last two or three inches on the bottom of the cant (1" through 3").  So swapping cylinders back and forth will not help.  My saw head want to come  back up now and it is very hard to keep the unit down.

What would you think   about providing a stirrup for the lt10?  If an lt10 operator had the problem I have described and simply steps in this stirrup he could use his powerful leg muscles instead of his lower back to force the machine down for those last few cuts.   Jim and I have our LT10's slightly elevated on trailers so we dont have to work off the ground.

Just trying to make it easier.

rimshot

[Happycamper]

Rimshot,
  Until you install a crank system get a little pulley and rope system about $12.00 and connect that to the head. A slight tug on the rope will pull the head down to where you want it plus you will be able to watch the scale and set the depth easily.
                                     Jim

 

[waho]

If you look at the LT 10 that Woodmizer sells in Europe, they have already solved the lift problem. I just finished building my copy of Happycampers crank system, now I'll have to wait before I get back to where it is so I can install it. Hopefully my 68 year old back will thank me.

[Dad2FourWI]

I am still "lurking" around and watching this thread!!!

After today especially! Groan!

Hmmmm, maybe one more glass of red wine will help! HA!

[rimshot]

Rimshot,
  Until you install a crank system get a little pulley and rope system about $12.00 and connect that to the head. A slight tug on the rope will pull the head down to where you want it plus you will be able to watch the scale and set the depth easily.
                                     Jim

 

-----

================

Just came from EBAY ..  I got one for $13.99 shipped to my door. Thanks Jim

[Happycamper]

Rimshot,
  Happy you found one it will make life easier till you put the winch on. Hopefully waho will post some photos of the one he made especially after it is installed. For a very few bucks it changes the whole attitude about the mill operation.
                                  Jim

[waho]

 

  Jim, here is a pic of my lift. Unfortunately it will be a while before it gets installed. If you really want to feel bad, take a look at Woodmizer's German website for the new LT 10. Why them and not us.

[Happycamper]

waho,
  Your system looks very professional, if fact you could market it. Congratulations and let us know how it works for you when you get it installed. As we already know the mizers in Europe are more expensive and my only point is that a simple winch system could be on those little mills for equal or quite possibly less money than the 2 cylinders, pulleys and cable system that they come with.
                                   Jim