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Author Topic: Dating Viking Settlement in Nth America with wood scraps  (Read 1045 times)

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Offline GAB

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Re: Dating Viking Settlement in Nth America with wood scraps
« Reply #20 on: October 21, 2021, 01:59:06 PM »
 My favorite observation was "When the Europeans came to America they found the Indian tribes where the men hunted and fished all day and the women did all the rest of the work. And they worked hard to change this system - what were they thinking?" :D
Howard:
Simple answer to your question - They weren't.
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Offline Ianab

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Re: Dating Viking Settlement in Nth America with wood scraps
« Reply #21 on: October 21, 2021, 04:02:11 PM »
I suspect a small group of fishermen could not sustain themselves in such a harsh environment and without fresh young settlers including women to replenish the group they would simply die off. Also by that time the Scandinavians were converting to Christianity and taking up farming, the warrior way of life was disappearing.


There are records from shortly after that time that document the "adventures" of those explorers. It seems that they had a falling out with the Locals, and got into some skirmishes with them. While they had the better weapons, they were outnumbered, some of them got killed, and the rest basically decided to cut their losses and go home. They thought the land was good enough, but they didn't have the forces to take control of it from the locals, and it would have been an ongoing war to try. 
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Offline farmfromkansas

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Re: Dating Viking Settlement in Nth America with wood scraps
« Reply #22 on: October 21, 2021, 09:41:56 PM »
 Stories I have heard from the old country lead me to think that some of my female ancestors were actually from the Danish. They say the origination of the term "best man" was the guy that went along and kept the family busy while you grabbed the girl and headed for the boat. And the meaning of the "honeymoon", is that the grooms family furnished enough mead to keep the "bride" drunk for a month. Appears the Scots were raiding the Swedes when the Vikings were off raiding. Would be interesting for those of us who are of Scottish descent to get tested.
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Offline barbender

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Re: Dating Viking Settlement in Nth America with wood scraps
« Reply #23 on: October 22, 2021, 12:29:41 AM »
Yeah, human genetics are a big mishmash. No population is "pure", what is ethnicity more than a language and culture? How much Slavic blood is present in Germans? For instance, I was reading about a German WWII General, Heinz Guderian. He came from the West Prussian area that is now part of Poland. This area had been in Polish hands before, and Poland had invited immigrants from Armenia in the past. So it has been suggested that Guderian was actually of Armenian ancestry (it is an Armenian sounding name), which was somewhat of an embarrassment at that time. All of this to say, people have moved, been kidnapped, bought and sold, led conquering parties, and myriad other ways to mix genetics up that no population is "pure" anything. I find it all fascinating!
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Offline SwampDonkey

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Re: Dating Viking Settlement in Nth America with wood scraps
« Reply #24 on: October 22, 2021, 03:23:09 AM »
@farmfromkansas  :D :D :D Got'a be some humour in there someplace.
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Offline Ianab

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Re: Dating Viking Settlement in Nth America with wood scraps
« Reply #25 on: October 22, 2021, 04:37:14 AM »
eah, human genetics are a big mishmash.


Yup, some of my ancestry is on this page. Some of the first European settlers in NZ, who married one of the local Polynesian locals. His daughters married a couple of brothers from the later more organised settlement ships.

https://barretthoneyfield.com/2015/07/16/dicky-rawinia-and-family/

When Lil went on a Maori Language course for work (teaching), she got chatting to the tutors, and commented how their "tribal history" from the course was pretty much the same story as I'd told my family history. Suddenly she was part of the "tribe", by marriage. She was invited to be part of the Welcome team for the marae visit. But she chose to remain with the 'visitors". But the invite was there.

Likewise when we go to the Cook Islands, it's general knowledge that NZ was first settled from there. The locals identify as Maori, and speak a very similar language.

Fathers side of the family I'm not so sure about.... I can trace them back ~100 years, and the old family farm was a couple of miles from here.  
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Offline farmfromkansas

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Re: Dating Viking Settlement in Nth America with wood scraps
« Reply #26 on: October 22, 2021, 09:16:41 AM »
My son came up with some interesting stuff, including those mentioned above. Other sayings like "raining cats and dogs", came from the days of grass roofs, and during cold weather, your pets climbed up on the roof, and when it rained, the roof got slippery and the cats and dogs fell off the roof.
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Offline SawyerTed

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Re: Dating Viking Settlement in Nth America with wood scraps
« Reply #27 on: October 22, 2021, 11:28:57 AM »
Yes we are a big mishmash.  My mother's ancestry traces back to Spain and Portugal in the 1500's when Spain was colonizing Florida, Georgia, South Carolina and Western North Carolina.  We have determined that our ancestors were among the early Spanish and Portuguese settlers in South Carolina (St. Elena), Western North Carolina and Southwestern Virginia.  They were called Mulungeons.  At one time they held large tracts of land prior to the arrival of the Northern Europeans settlers.  Eventually, the Mulungeons, who apparently intermarried with native Americans (particularly the Cheraw and Lumbee), were deemed to be "free colored people" and laws were such that "colored people" could not own property.  Their land was confiscated by the Northern European settlers.  

Ironically, my dad's family is among the Northern European settlers, those ancestors come from Switzerland.  My dad's mother's family traces their ancestry to Germany.  

So yes we are a mishmash, some us more than others, and some us are less "Viking" than others. :) 
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Offline barbender

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Re: Dating Viking Settlement in Nth America with wood scraps
« Reply #28 on: October 22, 2021, 03:10:14 PM »
Those are interesting backgrounds, SawyerTed and Ianab! I really do find this stuff fascinating. I haven't done a DNA test yet, one thing I am interested to find out is if we have any Sub-Saharan African ancestry. The tribes my Grandpa descended from came from the New England area, and had became "civilized". They were known as "praying Indians" because they had converted to Chrisitianity in the many revivals that swept over the Northeast during the Great Awakening, which I think was in the early 1700's. There were so many revivals that part of New England was known as the "Burned Over" area because so many revivals burned through😂  Anyhow, the towns these Indians established were part of the Underground Railroad, and it is well documented that they took in many runaway slaves and free blacks, who were able to freely marry among these tribes. These tribes all later relocated to Wisconsin, and I have seen historical documents where Army officers that visited their reservations disparaged that they were all "half negro", also one of the tribes when they got their land allotments, it was specified that no one with negro blood qualified. Anyways, just curious. My one daughter actually like other girls I've seen that are 1/4 black. I always compare our family to our free range chickens. The hens keep sneaking off, laying clutches and hatching chicks. After about 4 years and many generations of chickens, what started out as Barred Rocks, Speckled Sussex, Frizzles and Americaunas it gets to a point where you never know what's going to cone out of that egg!😂 That frizzle rooster you forgot you had 4 years ago has genes that are living on and eventually they pop out again. So it is with my bunch😊
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Offline barbender

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Re: Dating Viking Settlement in Nth America with wood scraps
« Reply #29 on: October 22, 2021, 03:14:16 PM »
This is a picture of my crew about 5-6 years ago, with my Grandpa in the middle. 

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Offline Magicman

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Re: Dating Viking Settlement in Nth America with wood scraps
« Reply #30 on: October 22, 2021, 05:33:23 PM »
That is a fine looking crew and I see that the little man in the lower center is outgunned.  ;D
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Offline moodnacreek

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Re: Dating Viking Settlement in Nth America with wood scraps
« Reply #31 on: October 22, 2021, 09:23:41 PM »
Everyone is trashing on Columbus these days. His discoveries were a huge event and there is no getting around that. The Vikings were here, but for whatever reason disappeared and prompted no further exploration. I'm of part Native ancestry, I probably come from this from a different angle. I get sick of hearing my relatives whining about Columbus and "genocide" he committed, "stealing" Native land blah blah. With current historical interpretation, if another tribe invaded, tortured, mutilated and killed most of the invaded except for women and children they kidnapped, that was merely "inter-tribal warfare". Europeans come in, make a treaty and displace a tribe and are vilified, even if they didn't kill anyone. I realize there was plenty of double dealing, broken promises, and atrocities aplenty but I really tire of the narrative of the peaceful natives who never had any impact on the earth living their idyllic in tune with nature lives until the big wasteful selfish white man came it ruined it. All that to say, I like Christopher Columbus😁
Very good post B.B.  This is just what I wanted to say.

Offline barbender

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Re: Dating Viking Settlement in Nth America with wood scraps
« Reply #32 on: October 22, 2021, 09:29:55 PM »
Thanks Magic, God has blessed me far beyond anything I deserve, no doubt about it! And yes, Mr. Silas is way outgunned, but he doesn't know any different so he gets by just fine😊 
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Re: Dating Viking Settlement in Nth America with wood scraps
« Reply #33 on: October 22, 2021, 09:33:58 PM »
And that's a nice looking family.

Offline Southside

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Re: Dating Viking Settlement in Nth America with wood scraps
« Reply #34 on: October 22, 2021, 10:45:30 PM »
I dated a Viking for two years, has the red hair and all to prove it, then settled with her till this day. Don't recall any "carbon dating", but we did go fishing if that counts.   :D
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Offline barbender

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Re: Dating Viking Settlement in Nth America with wood scraps
« Reply #35 on: October 22, 2021, 10:56:49 PM »
Maybe she considers you spoils, Southside😂

Thanks moodnacreek, I'm pretty proud of them😊

SawyerTed, I had to go read about the Malungeons. A very interesting history that sounds a lot like my family's. In fact, a lot of the pictures I looked at, the folks looked like they could've been my family. 
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Offline reedco

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Re: Dating Viking Settlement in Nth America with wood scraps
« Reply #36 on: October 23, 2021, 01:41:33 AM »
 Look pretty american to me.  A lot to be proud of!
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Offline Tacotodd

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Re: Dating Viking Settlement in Nth America with wood scraps
« Reply #37 on: October 23, 2021, 02:38:04 AM »
In canine terms, we are all mutts! I love it. Heinz57. Its just the truth.
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Offline SwampDonkey

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Re: Dating Viking Settlement in Nth America with wood scraps
« Reply #38 on: October 23, 2021, 06:16:35 AM »
We should make a John Cabot day, he came 5 years or so after Columbus and began the first fishery in the Bay of Fundy. The one thing he is credited with was fishing with baskets dipped into the Fundy. :D

French actually made the first European settlements in this neighborhood yet Trudeau's "Canada: a Peoples History" claim it was upper Canada, which is totally bull crap. And the only reason upper Canada became the boom town was because of government policy called 'centralization'. That meant sucking everywhere else out to build it. I've always heard that confederation was the demise of the Maritimes. Bank of Montreal, was actually began as Bank of New Brunswick, if you are factual about it. Living in New Brunswick, when you invest your money in Canada, where do you think your money goes? :D
Transfer payments, everyone gets those, so no point in mentioning it. ;)
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Offline WDH

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Re: Dating Viking Settlement in Nth America with wood scraps
« Reply #39 on: October 23, 2021, 08:03:53 AM »
That is an impressive pack there, Mr. Barbender. 
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