Black Walnut

Weekend_Sawyer · May 06, 2002, 01:17:24 PM

I have just been given a stack of logs some large cedar and 5 Black Walnut logs. These logs are straight and look solid but have been on the ground for 2 years. they are an average of 15' long and from 12 to 20" small end. They want a few 8/4 boards out of the walnut for a table and the rest is mine.

I have never milled Black Walnut, what is the best way to mill it, quarter sawn or flat?

When I cut them down in length should they be end coated?

I saw the earlier post about Cedar, does it matter which end I start from on the Walnut?

Jon.

Weekend_Sawyer · May 06, 2002, 01:24:02 PM

Ah nuts! Sorry about the double posts, course I would like one o them hats...

Well, while I'm writing, I live in Maryland and over the weekend drove through La Plata, I was given a storm damaged cedar just south of there. Seeing the path of destruction that tornado made realy makes you feel small.

The cedar tree was in a patch of poison ivy. I got the itch to do some milling!

Jon

Ron Wenrich · May 06, 2002, 04:31:35 PM

Whereabouts in Maryland? I used to be licensed in MD, but haven't renewed. I did do work in LaPlata and Hagerstown. Now living to the east of Harrisburg, PA.

I never milled on a band mill, but on circle mills, we just saw walnut whichever way they load up the mill. Most people prefer flat sawn, since it gives a better grain profile.

If they've been laying for 2 years, the sapwood probably won't be any good. That's OK, since most guys don't want the sapwood.

I've never endcoated logs, but we don't keep lumber or logs that long. We do put some lumber on sticks and air dry for local sales. Good stickering will prevent most end checking.

Weekend_Sawyer · May 07, 2002, 05:48:37 AM

Ok, I thought I did a double post.

Ron, I live in Laurel, dead center between Baltamore Md and Washington DC.

I only get to saw on the weekends, if I'm lucky. This time of year the garden needs alot of attention. But folks know I do so when I get offers like the above and I collect the logs and stack them on old telephone poles to keep them off of the ground. If they are cut to length then I paint the ends with outdoor latex paint.

ARKANSAWYER · May 07, 2002, 07:03:11 AM

Black walnut can be sawn from either end just as well and flat sawn is what most want. I would invest in a bucket off end sealer and seal the ends of logs. I would trim off about 2 inches from each end of the log and seal befor sawing. (the hard ends will eat at your blades) The 8/4 I would take from toward the middle and save the wide good boards. The saw dust is bad for plants and is a bit toxic to most folks.
ARKANSAWYER

Jeff · May 07, 2002, 10:48:46 AM

You did double post. The Janitor cleaned it up. See him to the left working?

Rick-Wi · May 09, 2002, 05:29:20 AM

By the way, What are you guys chargung per BF for off the mill black Walnut.

Rick-Wi

ARKANSAWYER · May 09, 2002, 06:12:29 AM

Rick-Wi
I get $1.40 bdft for FAS walnut and $1.00bdft for 1C and about $.75 for the rest. Crotch and unique brings in the $3.00 bdft range green from the saw. Pay about $500 mbdft on doyle for good logs and $300mbdft for lower grade and buy truck loads of tops for next to nothing. Got all that I could haul on a 27' goose neck for $200 last week. Sawed out 3 chunks and made $175 so it pays for the effort.
ARKANSAWYER

Weekend_Sawyer · May 10, 2002, 12:10:29 PM

Arkansawyer,

I took your advice and ordered 5 gal endseal. They are nice folks, talked me into buying their sprayer AND made me feel good about it!

With any luck I'll be sawing on sunday. Saturday I am finishing up clearing a horse pasture which I get to keep the best logs. Red Oak, Choke Cherry, Maple and some Poplar.

I gotta clear out my backlog!
I gotta build a milling shed!
I gotta build my solar kiln!
I gotta keep my day job but it sure gets in the way!
I have given up mowing the grass.

See Ya
Jon

Ron Wenrich · May 10, 2002, 04:24:17 PM

Walnut Prices:

I'm told we're getting $2.50 for the uppers, and $1.50 for the rest. The uppers can have only limited sap. The rest goes to a casket company, and they ain't too picky.

Frank_Pender · May 10, 2002, 07:08:57 PM

Weekend__Sawyeer,

My wife gave up two years ago on me mowing the grass and hired one of my X students to do the work on a regular schedule. :D The best money I have about ever spent. 8) 8)

Bud Man · May 10, 2002, 08:41:15 PM

Frank , I've got three of the best type of lawnmower's, all broke and gonna stay broke. The teenager down the street has one that works just fine with me, and he comes attached to It. ;)

ElectricAl · May 11, 2002, 04:45:53 PM

Weekend_sawyer,

I'm posting this message for two reasons.

1) trying to add a photo for the first time.

2) If the photo comes through, it is lumber sawn from a Walnut log cut down two years ago.
It came from a college campus 100 miles from here. They wanted it sawn and dried.

When you go to saw your log, the jacket of the log will be very hard and abrasive. You may even experience a wavy cut at first, until the wetter "green" wood appears. Also you may notice heat buildup in you blade and your blade tension may drop.

Al

ElectricAl · May 12, 2002, 06:51:07 AM

Second try.

Al

inspectorwoody · July 04, 2003, 04:53:01 PM

Decided to take the time and go through every page of post here in the Sawmills and Milling area ;)

We saw our Walnut flat sawn and usually open our faces to at least 5" because of the grading rules. Sapwood can be a problem and I believe we can only have like 30% on a board. We steam it also. We have sawn it as 4/4,5/4 8/4 and 10/4. From what I have seen, Walnut can sit around for while and once deep enough inside the log, the lumber usually is still pretty nice depending on size of log etc. The Walnut market is one that has stayed strong for many years and when you make the littlest mistake can cost you big bucks! Re-man is a must on the grading chain if you can do it and make some money.

I love Walnut because of the money value and I ran into some Walnut logs in town last fall/winter that I was able to snag for free and ended up selling them to the log buyers at work and was happy to see the 3.00$/bf figures and than some ;D

I remember a guy saying that he could get 1.00 something for the most crookedest knotty walnut log!

SawInIt CA · July 04, 2003, 10:58:36 PM

I sure do like the left coast prices for walnut :)I sell my worst stuff for $4.00 a BF and most is in the $12 a BF range.

inspectorwoody · July 04, 2003, 11:16:11 PM

Sawinlt CA

Can I start shipping my Walnut to you ??? ;D

Money,Money, Money :D

8)

Gadget

woodmills1 · July 05, 2003, 09:57:20 AM

most of the pine I sell goes out at 50 cents, and the red oak sells for $1.00-1.67. The best I have done is with cherry at $2 and walnut and curly maple at $3. But I don't get to cut much of those.

Ron Wenrich · July 06, 2003, 03:27:25 PM

I talked to a guy this weekend who is sawing cherry for niche markets. His high end is $6/bf. Low grade is getting sold for $1/bf and used in flooring. He has no kiln, and sells everything green.

inspectorwoody · July 06, 2003, 05:34:03 PM

I think that "niche" market would become one I would shoot for all the time. Thats some nice prices for going out green.

solidwoods · July 12, 2003, 06:52:48 AM

You think the green walnut prices are good, look at woodmills1 prices.
If you are getting $.5bf for pine and Oak $1-1.67 .....green....you need to mill mill sell sell
JIM

woodmills1 · July 12, 2003, 07:39:12 AM

yes, if you can find the right customers this sawmill thing can work out. My best repeat customers are:
1. local fence company that buys 1x6x16 red oak at $10 each. That is $1.25/bd ft. I cut the trees from my land and they buy all the way through the tree. If I had to buy the logs I could still make money I would pay between 30 and 60 cents on scale and the over run would give me the scale amout as product.

2. excavation construction company that buys 2x8x9 hemlock as truck sides, again at $10 each. Their longer dump trailers take 5 boards per side, so they buy quite a few. Seems the loader operators hit them often. these go along the tops of the dump beds as protection for the metal. around here hemlock doesnt have a good market so I get it with junky pine for less than a nickel per bd ft.

inspectorwoody · July 12, 2003, 08:22:25 AM

If you are talking about white oak than yes those are some good prices. As far as Red Oak goes and in the Northern Market Fas is going for 1105/mbf Sel is going for 1335/mbf and 1com is going for 935/mbf.

Appalachian Market Red Oak is Fas 1260/mbf, F1F 1250/mbf and 1 com is 800/mbf.

This is the current market conditions but you guys may be getting more depending upon customers etc. and your own market standards.

Walnut right now is FAS 1860/mbf, F1F 1760/mbf, 1 com 900/mbf and 2 com 480/mbf....Prices reflect Steam treated Walnut.

All the above prices are for 4/4.

Ron Wenrich · July 12, 2003, 09:50:25 AM

We don't move that many fence boards at .75/bf. At $1.25 we wouldn't move any. Too many mills and too much oak.

Woody

Are those the HMR prices? I thought that was supposed to be an air-dried price.

Our area uses HMR as a base, but usually pay more, and is on a dead green basis.

inspectorwoody · July 12, 2003, 10:09:32 AM

Yep those are the HMR prices. These prices are a base foundation for the industry and do not represent exactly what you might expect to pay and or recieve.

The prices are per thousand, random width and length, green, rough and graded in accordance with the NHLA Rules.

As they state in the publication...."The prices published in HMR are presented only as guide.