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Author Topic: Poll: windfall profits  (Read 12776 times)

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Offline thedeeredude

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Re: Poll: windfall profits
« Reply #20 on: February 14, 2006, 08:58:08 AM »
More taxes is slower growth.  I have no grievances against oil companies.  They're just like any other business in America, some person saw a market and made his money there.   My solution, a team of belgians and an old farm wagon, is now a 1 ton truck.  A morgan horse and a phaeton are economy cars.  And they all run on fuel made here in America.  Not only that it would create more jobs, someoene would have to pick up "road apples" :D

Offline Cedarman

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Re: Poll: windfall profits
« Reply #21 on: February 14, 2006, 09:13:10 AM »
The incentive to make more has gotten me to grow a business that provides full time jobs for 14 families. If I am going to be taxed more because I make more, then I might as well go back to being a one man show, make what I can because any thoughts of getting wealthy are down the drain.

Our problem in this country is not that we pay to little in taxes, it is that the govenment spends too much because every Tom, Dick and Harry wants a bunch of freebies and they just cant stand the thought that someone else gets more goodies than they do.

I do not begrudge some else's profits, so don't begrudge me mine.
A few years ago I had a piece of property for sale. A couple was interested in it until I priced it. They said, "We know how much you paid for that and we won't pay that much". They just couldn't stand to see me make that much profit. Six months later I sold it for 30% more than I first priced it.  Also to this day I have never referred anyone to their business, always to their competitor.

I am much more concerned about my profits to worry about how much some else makes.
I am in the pink when sawing cedar.

Kirk_Allen

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Re: Poll: windfall profits
« Reply #22 on: February 14, 2006, 09:52:57 AM »
NO, NO, NO. Did you hear me? NO >:(

Offline crtreedude

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Re: Poll: windfall profits
« Reply #23 on: February 14, 2006, 09:59:46 AM »
Watch out - Kirk is going to hose someone down with the nozzle if they aren't careful!  :o
So, how did I end up here anyway?

Offline scsmith42

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Re: Poll: windfall profits
« Reply #24 on: February 14, 2006, 11:40:09 AM »
Cedarman - well stated!

The media has been really sneaky about focusing on the dollar amount of the oil companies profits. What they are not showing you is the net profit percentage amount..., which has not gone up by a "windfall".

Oil prices are impacted by futures traders, local distributers, as well as our insatiable appetite for oil.  Last year when the prices here in North Carolina approached $3.00, it got my attention and I started paying more attention to seeking ways to reduce my fuel consumption.  I was stunned though by the fact that very few other people did anything more than gripe about the cost.  I would still see most folks zooming 75 - 85mph down the road, wasting fuel.  There was no noticible decrease in traffic...

Why should the oil companies be punished because of our wasteful ways?  Should we punish ourselves in the future by reducing their ability to invest in more R&D, exploration, ect - ie creating jobs and expanding the economy?  I don't think that this would be the intelligent choice...

I do not agree with the premise of taxing them more.  Sopmething like 45% of our current federal budget already goes to entitlements (and I have a copy of the Constitution on my wall and the founding fathers vision was not for a socialized nation), we do not need to feed this monster more.

In almost every instance, when taxes are reduced companies and the general population spend more, thus expanding the economy and creating jobs (and new tax revenue sources- duh!).  Increased taxation only hurts us - lowering rates and expanding the tax base helps us.

We really do need to get serious about viable alternative fuel sources and distribution systems.  We're funding terrorism and wasting a precious global resource, and the health of our economy is linked to a resource that is going to become increasingly more difficult for us to control.

On a side note, since Congress won't act, we ought to have a national referandum and grant the executive branch a line item veto over entitlements.  I don't care which party is in office - they will both use it to curb waste from the other (and both parties are just as guilty here).

My 2 cents...
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Online Jeff

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Re: Poll: windfall profits
« Reply #25 on: February 14, 2006, 11:50:52 AM »
I know what a windfall is, and they can be good things if you get to them before they rot and if they dont damage anything when they come down, many make some fine lumber but can someone explain to me what a profit is?
Just call me the midget doctor.
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Offline Cedarman

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Re: Poll: windfall profits
« Reply #26 on: February 14, 2006, 01:14:01 PM »
Are we talking cash in the pocket profit or like my profits, paper?(Not the little rectangle pieces with old people's pictures)

Profit,  is it that guy that tells the future?

sc42, looks like I want to sing in your choir too.
I am in the pink when sawing cedar.

Offline florida

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Re: Poll: windfall profits
« Reply #27 on: February 14, 2006, 05:18:28 PM »
Oil companies don't set the price of oil, the market does. Just because the world market for oil is good right now is no reason to punish the stockholders of the oil companies. The oil companies made 9 cents on the dollar last quarter, Microsoft made 34 cents. Where is the hue and cry for taxing Microsoft more? What makes the last dollar of profit more valuable than the first?
General contractor and carpenter for 50 years.

Offline wiam

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Re: Poll: windfall profits
« Reply #28 on: February 14, 2006, 11:01:59 PM »
It is more valuable because it belongs to someone else.

Will

Offline IL Bull

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Re: Poll: windfall profits
« Reply #29 on: February 15, 2006, 05:09:00 PM »
NO!
Are they going to tax the sawyers in Louisiana and Mississippi for having low cost logs to mill?
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Offline Striker

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Re: Poll: windfall profits
« Reply #30 on: February 15, 2006, 06:02:47 PM »
Back before Jimmy Carter was elected President, gas and oil drilling was booming around here. A lot of people around here worked in the industry. President Carter decided that the people in the oil and gas business were making to much money. He and congress hit the oil and gas producers with a windfall profits tax. That killed the oil and gas business around here.

Jeff

Offline Paschale

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Re: Poll: windfall profits
« Reply #31 on: February 15, 2006, 10:38:55 PM »
I guess I wish the question was different.  I answered yes, though I've always been a low tax capitalist--I think taxes are too high as it is,  and I usually  tend to roll my eyes when people start talking about raising taxes.  But, in this case, I have a REAL problem with the oil companies.  On the heels of Katrina, and the Gulf War, they got their PR people on the weekend talk shows whining about how hard things are for them, about how their supply chains were irreparably damaged.  This hits the markets, and BAM, the price for crude goes up.  What I find VERY suspect is that when crude was half the cost, they were making half the profit.  Now...crude is twice as expensive, and they make twice the profit.  This tells me that clearly they are passing off far more than simply the higher cost of crude to us the consumers.  Bottom line.  To me...that's gouging.  Do I want to tax them exorbitantly?  No.  But to my thinking, making more profit than ever, while complaining about how Katrina and the War has deleterious effected them seems criminal to me.  I'd like the SEC to open their books and see what's really going on.  That's what I want.

Y'all can pronounce it "puh-SKOLLY"

Offline Bill

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Re: Poll: windfall profits
« Reply #32 on: February 16, 2006, 06:05:03 PM »
There may be more than two sides to this story but I'd add another two cents . . .

Sure oil costs alot - another guy on TV took the price of oil umpteen years ago ( 20, 30 whatever but he was making a point ) and then adjusted it for the cost of living of those years. Guess what - its cheaper today then it was then. Now I'm not trying to let the oil companies off the hook - they make alot of money - thats the way supply and demand works. Few companies ( and few substitutes ) so as long as the demand is high then the price is high.

What I'd like to see is more substitutes ( read ethanol, biodiesel, %^&@# ) and more conservation. Instead I see my neighbors jump into their gas guzzlers at the drop of a hat and then cry the price is too high.

Now rightfully I believe there are many ways to save - has anyone else noticed that their old ( 93 ) car that weighed 3300 lbs got just as good mileage as the new 4000 lb cars. What the car mfg's gained in efficiency they turned back into "features" that weigh more ( of course ) so no increase in mileage.

But this is where we come in. In the short term we bite the bullet and do our best to conserve what we use now - but the next time we buy a car/truck ( or heater, or bulbs, or windows . . . ) we need to vote with our $$$.

back on task here -  should we tax them because they made too much ? Why because they did well ? Why because we bought it ? Why because they now have to find more ? and just who will decide whose making too much next time around ? Maybe Microsoft ( all profits once the program is written as it costs zilch to stamp out them little CD's that cost $100 - $300 ) or maybe loggers ( or farmers or fishermen or your next door neighbor or YOU ) since mother nature really did all the "hard work". 

Sure we can tax the big guy -
Abe Lincoln once said that you can't improve the little guys lot by tearing down the big guy, you need to lift everybody up to do well.

So let them keep their profits and let us conserve and find substitutes ( and may they be careful lest they go the way of the town blacksmith )

Online SwampDonkey

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Re: Poll: windfall profits
« Reply #33 on: February 16, 2006, 06:19:20 PM »
There may be more than two sides to this story but I'd add another two cents . . .

Sure oil costs alot - another guy on TV took the price of oil umpteen years ago ( 20, 30 whatever but he was making a point ) and then adjusted it for the cost of living of those years. Guess what - its cheaper today then it was then.

There was a report recently released concerning average family income in Canada. It shows that annual income has only risen $500 over the last 15 years. In 1992 I was paying $0.42/litre for gas, now it's $0.96/litre. More than double, my wages didn't double.  In fact in high school I did a little research into wages of foresters and the average was $33,000 back in 1984. Not many making much more than that now. ::)
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Offline Bill

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Re: Poll: windfall profits
« Reply #34 on: February 16, 2006, 06:39:26 PM »
Ouch - shame on me for quoting a guy on TV - maybe he meant averages  ???  and I can't vouch for his figures nor math - of course I can say with alot of certainty that he makes more than you and I - probably combined .

The only thing I can do is try to change the things I can . . .

Offline WeeksvilleWoodWorx

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Re: Poll: windfall profits
« Reply #35 on: February 16, 2006, 10:51:42 PM »
SwampDonkey,

It's funny you mention the declining wages in Canada in a thread about TAXES. Here is a write up about that very subject.

"The promises of yesterday are the taxes of today."

Is the quote I liked the best. Good read.
Brian - 2004 LT40HDG28 owner.

Offline oldsaw

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Re: Poll: windfall profits
« Reply #36 on: February 17, 2006, 02:51:16 PM »
   Due to circumstances beyound my control I've had a "windfall loss" before. I don't recall the government pitching in to help then. I sure wouldn't want them trying to take any "windfall profits" from me. The increase in fuel prices drove down demand, and then prices came back down. I think the market worked. Beside the ROI is not that great for the oil companies anyhow, it's the volume that makes it impressive.
Mark


What ellmoe said....
So many trees, so little money, even less time.

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Offline Ron Wenrich

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Re: Poll: windfall profits
« Reply #37 on: February 17, 2006, 05:20:14 PM »
If I'm not mistaken, the oil companies did receive a lot of tax breaks during the last energy bill.  And, they got to drill Gulf oil for no royalty fees.  Does that qualify as a windfall profit or a windfall loss?
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Offline isassi

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Re: Poll: windfall profits
« Reply #38 on: February 17, 2006, 05:36:34 PM »
I really have no room to complain. I agree with Bill, and when I was in college, in economics, I remeber the graph showing gasoline prices in 1924 compared to 1994. In '24, gasoline was something like .24 cents per gallon, and wages were barely .80 on an average. (think of the $5 a day Ford employess were paid) In '94, the  ratio is compared to $1.70 a gallon and average wages of $13.00 (median). Gasoline is one of the cheapest things we consume, en masse.  I agree that the profits the oil companies post is obscene, but just another part of the fair marcket economy. What about the traders of the oil futures who probably have no idea what a drilling rig or a pumping unit looks like and the record profits they post is not a public record due to no pulic stock holding in their judgement? So back to the first point, I have no room to complain. The community I live in (most of my life) has an economy based on agriculture and oil. Now we all know how profitable farming is. Oil fuels the construction and economic growth here and everytime I cringe at $2.35 diesel, I only have to think about how well I am doing in construction, and how it benifits our schools and community.

Offline Cedarman

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Re: Poll: windfall profits
« Reply #39 on: February 18, 2006, 08:43:39 AM »
The only people I would put a windfall profits tax on is lawyers. They are the ones who make obscene profits. Politicians should be in there somewhere also.
I am in the pink when sawing cedar.


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