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Milling project with a freind; what is fair to all involved?

Started by BWknothead, June 27, 2014, 12:00:45 AM

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BWknothead

I am taking down some buildings for a guy and since he's returning the land to farmground i asked if i could have the Ash and Maple trees on the place. A friend has a mill so we're going to mill them. I have the trees (pry 4000 + bf) and I'll round up a tractor or skid steer to move the logs and he'll mill them. If we go on shares, what's a fair persentage to hand over for the milling. Here's the other piece of the puzzle: This fall we'll mill some trees for him and i'll get the tractor and he'll have the trees and sawmill - do i get the same percentage of his logs? Help me think this through and give me your thoughts.
BWknothead
BWKNOTHEAD
"Just as fog is not uncommon in the natural world, perhaps confusion & lack of clarity are also part of living." Henri Nouwen

Magicman

Welcome to the Forestry Forum, BWknothead. 

Someone knowledgeable with sawing on shares will come along.   :)
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Sawyer697

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beenthere

BW
Welcome to the Forestry Forum.
Many years ago, I found trees that were dozed out for road clearing and they were free.
A friend had the equipment to move them (tractor, truck) and sawmill.

He said the deal was that half the lumber recovered would pay for the use of his equipment and the sawing, and we would split the remaining half 50/50. Sounded like a great deal for me.
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mad murdock

Welcome BWknothead. If I were in your situation I would try for a 50/50 split, if you are felling, skidding, and doing all the ground work, he is bring the mill and milling while you are there to help in that process as off bearer, I think it is fair at that, FWIW.
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dboyt

Cutting on shares is as simple or complicated as you choose to make it.  As a sawyer, my policy is simple.  I need enough value from the logs to pay for my work.  For quality cherry or walnut, I might even go 1/3 (for me)/ 2/3.  Typical for oak (if I have a buyer) is 50/50 with the logs delivered to the mill.

It all comes down to the dollar.  If the milling cost is $.35/ b ft, I have to be able to sell my half for at least $.70/bd ft to make a 50/50 split work.

But anything that has both of you coming out with a smile on your faces is good.  As Mad Murdock says, you'll have some equipment costs, as well.
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BWknothead

Thanks everyone for the warm welcome. I really appreciate all the wisedom and the bs that flows through this forum. I'm really looking forward to this project and i think my buddy is too. He hasn't done much milling before - just his own stuff so we'll have a good time. I'm sure I'll be back for more advise. Thanks again for taking time to respond.
BWknothead
BWKNOTHEAD
"Just as fog is not uncommon in the natural world, perhaps confusion & lack of clarity are also part of living." Henri Nouwen

Ianab

50/50 is a good starting point. You might adjust that depending on the value of the logs / sawn wood, but it's a starting point.

If you are felling and skidding and your buddy is happy with a 50/50 deal. Then makes two stacks of logs, as even as you can. Then let him choose his. Then it's luck of the draw what he chooses, and what each individual log produces. You tried to make the 2 stacks equal, and he had the choice.  ;)

Then you saw both stacks into what each person wants, and take your boards.

Only other real way is to scale and put an actual dollar value on the logs. Then he puts a price on the sawing. He does $500 of sawing, and you give him $500 of logs to do as he chooses.  No actual money changes hands. That might work better if you have different species. Saw guy may have a better market for cherry and walnut, while you want to build a shed and want the pine and cedar for that. Your stack of softwood might be bigger, but his hardwood is more valuable to him, and equals the cost of sawing your logs.

Just make sure both of you are happy with the deal.  ;)

Ian
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

YellowHammer

50/50 sounds reasonable, but really, the biggest issue with dealing with a friend is that someone (you or him) feels they are being taken advantage of, and you don't remain friends.  So I would rephrase 50/50 to whatever you BOTH think is fair to recover costs of labor, equipment, time and the cold beers you will be drinking as buddies when the job is done.
YH
 
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LeeB

Ask your buddie what he wants and needs to get out of the deal and go from there.
'98 LT40HDD/Lombardini, Case 580L, Cat D4C, JD 3032 tractor, JD 5410 tractor, Husky 346, 372 and 562XP's. Stihl MS180 and MS361, 1998 and 2006 3/4 Ton 5.9 Cummins 4x4's, 1989 Dodge D100 w/ 318, and a 1966 Chevy C60 w/ dump bed.

backwoods sawyer

Quote from: BWknothead on June 27, 2014, 12:00:45 AM
Here's the other piece of the puzzle: This fall we'll mill some trees for him and i'll get the tractor and he'll have the trees and sawmill - do i get the same percentage of his logs? Help me think this through and give me your thoughts.
BWknothead
Doing the first batch 50/50 may be a good deal for both but this second part may take some adjusting to account for the value of the trees since he will be providing them as well half the equipment and labor.
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