Hey Everyone looking for some insight into Larch fence posts. Has anyone n here used larch for 4x4 or 6x6 farm fence posts? What's the deal? We live in a pretty heavily Amish area, and these guys have picked every stick of locust around. I ran into a fella that said with these lumber yard prices going sky high I should consider larch with some motor oil/diesel. I would appreciate any feedback on this.
Thanks!
Consider boring hole up through bottom to above grade. Plug bottom hole and drill access above grade to fill with oil and cork.
Sounds like a lot of work and expense to me. ???
Not only no, but heck no
The labor to replace in 5 yes or so for me doesn't out way the cheaper price
Larch is the turpentine tree , no treatment is necessary . Locust is the fence post of choice in these parts .
I wouldn't use larch. In my experience, it is very durable when exposed to the elements, but not in ground contact. I haven't used it for posts myself, but people that have tell me it's a waste of time.
Quote from: WV Sawmiller on October 10, 2020, 09:46:55 AM
Sounds like a lot of work and expense to me. ???
Not with the right tools. Have you bought any treated lately? Locust is not so good for posts now that we have termites. I stopped cutting them when mine only lasted 7 years and I do better sawing locust into 2" plank. The oldtimers would say to char those tamarack for posts and that is work also.
I use 25% diesel and 75% tar on Doug-Fir up here--- paint it on above the snow line--- most last 20 years or more
Do you have access to red cedar? We have 3.5 miles of fenceline and repaired a section where the metal T posts had rusted out to the ground and were in two pieces, but about 50% of the red cedar posts were still in good enough shape to be reused, and hold a fence staple. I don't know how long it takes a T post to rust in half, but it's several decades.
Moody,
No I have not bought any lately. I know they are sky high. I still have an adequate supply of locust for my use and any tree that falls or I knock over when cutting sawlogs or such I cut into 7' sections if it will make a post. Actually I cut them into 15' if they will make a pole and 7' if not and the rest becomes firewood. If I can get a hole in the ground through our rocks I put in a locust post, if I can't dig or bore a hole I drive up a metal T post and hope to find a crack between the rocks big enough to get it in the ground.
I need to consolidate my locust post collection into a central location or two again as they are scattered all over the pasture. I had a couple hundred I guess till my son decided to fence in several acres of pasture up at his place and my posts mysteriously disappeared then he called me to help him stretch a few hundred feet of field fence. He bought a used storage shed a few weeks ago and Dad had to loan him a couple of 15' ash 2X12's and 30-40 ash crib blocks and even had to go help him jack it up and load it. Its funny how those things happen like that around here. :D
I have been following along on this thread and was asked a few weeks ago to saw some ERC into fence posts for a neighbor.I told him that our experience on the farm has been that pressure treated SYP posts are the longest lasting.We have used ERC ,locust,WO and all of them did not last .
So today he drops off a a copy of some fencing post documents.
He still wants me to cut them into posts and does not plan on putting any treatment on them .
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52480/757AD290-49FF-4B62-A023-2023B5D08B35.jpeg?easyrotate_cache=1602627055)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52480/01F566F7-56AE-4FD9-AFB6-15709C1C4DCE.jpeg?easyrotate_cache=1602631140)
Zeke
Today I replaced some 8x8 locust piers I put in less than 10 years ago. Termites ate the bottoms. Times change.
was it black or honey locust?
ERC posts here last maybe 10 years and I think that's pushing it. I had one in the ground for 4 and it was rotting some already. I'll not 'save' money when it come to fencing. It's hateful enough the first time.
Do osage orange trees not grow where you guys live? They last sometimes 2 or 3 generations here in Kansas. I have replaced some my dad put in 50 or 60 years ago. He had to cut them with an axe and hand saw back then, so they are not as big as the ones I use. I couldn't set them without my skid steer.
i bought a gallon of the copper stuff to treat wood, and plan to try it for ground contact. i should be able to let you know how it works in about 10 or 20 years! :)
"Hedge outlasts the man who puts them in." I remember my grandpa saying that, even so I usually spend the money for creosote or other treated posts as I am about an hour half north of hedge country, so it's easier. If you're farther west ERC works ok in the sandy soils. Nothing like hedge though.
Quote from: doc henderson on October 13, 2020, 09:08:21 PM
i bought a gallon of the copper stuff to treat wood, and plan to try it for ground contact. i should be able to let you know how it works in about 10 or 20 years! :)
Poles.com sells 8% Copper Nepethenate concentrate that you mix with diesel or kerosene. If I recall correctly, 1-gallon of concentrate yields 5-gallons of finished product at the "recommended" mix ratio. I have some ground-contact EWP heart wood timbers and some cedar posts that were treated with it about 5-years ago and neither show any sign of rot or insect damage.
I think the ground contact longevity has a lot to do with the percentage and condition of the heartwood when the post is installed. I have no qualms using good quality cedar, locust, or hedge and in fact prefer it to pressure treated pine.
My former house I built a raised planting bed out of some 2x ERC lumber that I had culled that was a too defective for project type lumber. At the same time I also did some walkways/garden borders out of treated landscape timbers. 15 years later when freshening up the house for sale I removed both. The cedar looked like the day it was installed and the pine was completely rotted. Now I realize there are different levels of "treated" and the landscape stuff was probably dipped to look green but that doesn't discount that the cedar was buried at ground level for 15 years and remained in perfect condition. I remain confident that all the cedar and locust posts and poles I have installed will outlast me and most likely the wire and sheet metal they are holding up.
I have seen plenty of locust that had some sort of blight and did not have any yellow heartwood. I have also seen people use cedar for posts that looked like it might have made a good Christmas tree. That type wood won't last more than a year or two. Split, sawn, standing dead where you have a high percentage of sound heartwood is what makes a good post.
Quote from: stavebuyer on October 14, 2020, 05:02:03 AM15 years later when freshening up the house for sale I removed both. The cedar looked like the day it was installed and the pine was completely rotted.
I have had the same experience with my ERC. I've owned this property 20 years and the fence posts I have personally put in look new.
I've already had to replace some creosote and treated pine posts.
When a bass fisherman asks me what species of wood lasts the longest, I ask if they fish the stumps in the big nearby impoundments, lakes and rivers, and if they do, what species are the stumps? Always, always, the only stumps left are cedar. Everything else has long rotted away.
It's all about color and percentage of heartwood. Some of the nicest sawlog e.r. cedar I have seen was from N.J. It was just a little pinkish in the heart, this would never last in or near the ground. Fast, lush, 20 wet years in a row, sun light, good soil is no good for rot resistance. The walnut we have now is light brown and half sapwood. The good cedar post is from a starved runt that is almost dead and purple inside with a thin band of white.
sounds like you know your posts. around here they judge a farmer rancher by his fence lines. and they will tell you if a corner post is leaning or not done right. out near Hays KS, it is "post rock" country and the fence post are quarried limestone.
Quote from: doc henderson on October 14, 2020, 08:31:25 AM
sounds like you know your posts. around here they judge a farmer rancher by his fence lines. and they will tell you if a corner post is leaning or not done right. out near Hays KS, it is "post rock" country and the fence post are quarried limestone.
Along the long gone O&W railroad of my youth where white stone mile posts that came from the much older D&H canal.
The northern white cedar my ancestors cut and used for posts lasted a 100 years. It's now getting rare to see them still standing but 20 years ago they were still there. That was old growth timber. The cedar of today doesn't last.
Quote from: Corley5 on October 14, 2020, 07:53:10 PM
The northern white cedar my ancestors cut and used for posts lasted a 100 years. It's now getting rare to see them still standing but 20 years ago they were still there. That was old growth timber. The cedar of today doesn't last.
I have herd this 50 +- years ago from men who where old then. Down on the farm there are fat locust corner posts my great grandfather put in. Being interested in wood all my life I try to find the answers. Sometimes white pine [lumber] can last much longer then it should have. I think it is ring count [slow growth] and I know color and lack of sapwood is a big deal. And lack of termites. There must be other factors.