"Hardening" your property for weather

Ironwood · December 18, 2012, 09:25:47 PM

Anyone else here begun to look at 100/500/1000 year events as the new "norm" on a more frequent interval? I have a hilly 20 acre spread and now I have begun organizing alot of my drives, drainages, piping and such to hopefully accomadate more severe weather. I am keeping alot more fuel, supplies, and stuff on hand for these swings in weather. In the last few years we have had a tornado (nearly unheard of in these parts), a stalled thunderstorm dump 5" of rain in 1.5 hours, 52" of snow in one month (were lucky to get that over two or three normal winters). I keep thinking I must not be the only one. Some projects are new and I am increasing capacity of pipes and such, and others are to improve the carrying capacity of exsisting structures (ditches, berms etc...). Before Sandy hit NYC, I felt "short" on extra saw chains, and premix synthetic oil, and such, storm was hitting, rain, a little wind then HUGE snow flakes, and I thought "they have NO IDEA what things are going to happen", I was putting up 600 gallon of emergency water, and putting the snow plow on the truck at midnight (it was already a busy weekend), and was getting saw chains I had sharpened. The nieghbors must have thought I was nuts, but I just dont like to be caught swinging out htere and not being prepared. I maintain about 2 miles of drives, access points and such not to mention storage areas that i have built and the accompanying water runoff issues. The total elevation change is about 100' in spots highest to lowest, and several streams.

Ironwood

jdonovan · December 19, 2012, 06:14:45 AM

Quote from: Ironwood on December 18, 2012, 09:25:47 PM
Anyone else here begun to look at 100/500/1000 year events as the new "norm" on a more frequent interval? I have a hilly 20 acre spread and now I have begun organizing alot of my drives, drainages, piping and such to hopefully accomadate more severe weather.

I'm not that old, and have lost count of the number of times I've hear this is a 100 year storm, or the biggest ever on record. If the 100 year event seems to happen every 7-15 years, I think the 100 measure is too low.

We have been without power for a week at a time, twice in the last 10 year, and that was unheard of when I was growing up.

So as I'm starting to size things up as we are developing the new land, yes, lots of things are getting over sized. Substantially. The cost to put a 36" culvert where the tables say a 24 is fine doesn't cost me much more at the time of doing it; But that 36 can flow 60% more than the 24, and much of the cost was the installation, not the materials.

The wife is keeping a few more days of dry/canned goods in the pantry. The garage has a few more cases of bottled water on the shelf. There unfortunately is limited storage space so we have to be reasonable with what we are storing.

The lesson for us was the last big snow we got the neighborhood was blocked in for 3-4 days. Even once the county showed up with equipment it was about 6 hours before they had us cleaned up. If there had been an emergency in the neighborhood before they had come we were on our own.

Ironwood · December 19, 2012, 06:52:37 AM

Jdonovan,

I heard about that snow, they brought dozer contractors in to clear roads, serious stuff.

Ironwood

WH_Conley · December 19, 2012, 06:53:12 AM

They said in '97 we had 100 year flood. 2000 was higher than that, 2010 was higher and if that wasn't enough the second time in 2010 was higher. I don't pay much attention to those claims anymore. :-\

T Welsh · December 19, 2012, 06:57:16 AM

Ironwood, I am an old Boy Scout! And one motto was be prepared!!!!!!!!! I live a couple of hundred miles away from you 40 miles west of Philly and have seen the aftermath of the storms you talked about. You need to do what you think is warranted to be self sufficient.I do not rely upon anyone for help,because my my parents taught me that way. And I am thankful for it every day. Stay safe! Tim

jdtuttle · December 19, 2012, 07:05:20 AM

FEMA has done away with the 100, 500 year flood plains and now uses the following method. More of a percentage thing.

In high-risk areas, there is at least a 1 in 4 chance of flooding during a 30-year mortgage. All home and business owners in these areas with mortgages from federally regulated or insured lenders are required to buy flood insurance. They are shown on the flood maps as zones labeled with the letters A or V.

In moderate-to-low risk areas, the risk of being flooded is reduced but not completely removed. These areas submit over 20% of NFIP claims and receive one-third of disaster assistance for flooding. Flood insurance isn't federally required in moderate-to-low areas, but it is recommended for all property owners and renters. They are shown on flood maps as zones labeled with the letters B, C or X (or a shaded X).

jdonovan · December 19, 2012, 07:14:56 AM

Quote from: Ironwood on December 19, 2012, 06:52:37 AM
I heard about that snow, they brought dozer contractors in to clar roads, serious stuff.

ya they couldn't plow us. They had loaders digging out the road. We had a couple of farm tractors with loaders come take care of our streets.

The snow came in slow enough that cars had packed it down enough that there was 6" of ice at the bottom of the snow pack which made getting around for the next week or so a real challenge.

Ironwood · December 19, 2012, 05:23:18 PM

That ice pack problem on highways and roads is common up in northern NY, where the lake effect comes down so fast they cant get it of the road fast enough. Most roads up there end up looking like luge runs. I have driven up there ALOT for winter recreating.....

Ironwood

jdonovan · December 19, 2012, 08:07:57 PM

Quote from: Ironwood on December 19, 2012, 05:23:18 PM
Most roads up there end up looking like luge runs.

a luge would have been fine. Our luge looked like it had been carpet bombed, and resembled the surface of a golf ball.

There were a few days when I debated if a mouth guard and kidney belt were going to be needed if traveling above 2 MPH.

Ironwood · December 19, 2012, 08:17:08 PM

I meant luge because of the berms, but yes, the ice chips out frequently leaving gapping holes that swallow up my little Subaru tires. bumpy ride for sure, but at least if you lose control you will only "pinball" down the road until you stop (if your on the road alone, which we mostly were on those 11 hour drives thru the night). Crazy stuff, -10/-20 F air temp , wind hollowing, and sometimes snowing 20-36" overnight...... Slept at -20 in my Subie one time....BRR

Ironwood

scgargoyle · December 20, 2012, 06:06:12 AM

After living in FL for 32 years, we're going a bit overboard on our SC house. The ICF walls are 8" of poured concrete w/re-bar every 16", both horizontal and vertical. I've cleared any big trees that could fall on the house or lose limbs in an ice storm. We keep a pretty decent stock of food and other necessities on hand. Our generator and wood stove will keep us alive for extended periods (assuming I can get fuel!) We purposely built on top of a ridge, so flooding isn't an issue.

Sadly, the worst weather effect in recent years is drought, which is stressing mature trees, and many of the red oaks are dying from oak decline, a by-product of many years of drought. Our part of SC is about 12" behind on rainfall this year alone. That's about a 25% hit. I'm not exactly sure what you can do about a drought, other than milling a lot of timber as the trees die.

chain · December 21, 2012, 11:23:39 AM

I think what is most unusual for our area are the wind storms, some tornados but the frequency of straight line winds in large timber can be devastating also. Going on 32 years of forest management and can attest of more timber loss in the last 6 years than the previous 25 yrs from wind storms!

Was visiting with a neighbor who currently has loggers cleaning up from a recent storm. We reminisced about back in the eighties of very few dead or downed trees for firewood, it was certainly at a premium. But today, you could drive 50 miles in any direction and see damaged and uprooted and dying trees in the forest. :christmas:

Raider Bill · December 21, 2012, 12:52:31 PM

Quote from: scgargoyle on December 20, 2012, 06:06:12 AM
After living in FL for 32 years, we're going a bit overboard on our SC house. The ICF walls are 8" of poured concrete w/re-bar every 16", both horizontal and vertical. I've cleared any big trees that could fall on the house or lose limbs in an ice storm. We keep a pretty decent stock of food and other necessities on hand. Our generator and wood stove will keep us alive for extended periods (assuming I can get fuel!) We purposely built on top of a ridge, so flooding isn't an issue.

Sadly, the worst weather effect in recent years is drought, which is stressing mature trees, and many of the red oaks are dying from oak decline, a by-product of many years of drought. Our part of SC is about 12" behind on rainfall this year alone. That's about a 25% hit. I'm not exactly sure what you can do about a drought, other than milling a lot of timber as the trees die.

Howdy John! Good to see you back. How about a progress report?

Delawhere Jack · December 21, 2012, 05:32:26 PM

My familys' lumberyard flooded last night, a combination of rain and high tides. It was within a few inches of the flooding it got less than 60 days ago from hurricane Sandy, and that was by far the worst flooding to occur there since my dad bought the place in 1965.

I picked up a used F250 flatbed yesterday to use for mobile milling and parked it in the field behind the yard. Went down this morning to take it to get tagged/titled and I couldn't even get to it. Stacks of lumber had been floated all over the yard, tipped over, scattered. It was a real mess, not to mention 10-12" of water that had not receded yet.

Not much they can do to stop the flooding besides move the business.

Ironwood · December 21, 2012, 09:02:52 PM

WOW, that is impressive amount of rain from a "non-event".........Perhaps you have a large watershed that inundates you.? So, sloppy mess you probably cant fully clean up until it freezes?

We have had alot of rain here, but am on rock/clay and on a hill.... No farming here....

Ironwood

Resolute · December 23, 2012, 12:05:29 AM

I've been researching precipitation for Connecticut where I live. Over a 100 year span, we've been getting about a 1.25 inch increase per decade. This adds up to more than a foot of precip in a century and the trend seems solid. Some areas, the southwest, parts of the Midwest and south east have been experiencing serious droughts. Our FEMA flood plain maps are obsolete. The introduction of significant amounts of impervious surface, roofs, paved areas etc, compound the water problem and have resulted in increased flooding.
There is a lot of data showing the increased frequency and intensity of rain events.
Conclusion, it's getting wetter and warmer here. When sizing culverts and drainage basins, I've been ignoring the engineer's recommendations and doubling the diameters. After all, you're building for the next 30 – 50 years and the engineers have simply not caught up with the data.
No one knows the future, but with 100 years of data heading in one direction, this trend looks as though it will be continuing.
Resolute

thecfarm · December 23, 2012, 07:30:14 AM

I am lucky,SO FAR. No big storms,or maybe extreme weather is what I mean to say, that does alot of damage,in my part of Maine. I see it on the news and the paper and feel bad for all that is affected by it. We are up on a hill,not because I planned it this way,but for the view too. I only cut one tree that I felt was bad for the house,a good size white pine.I hate them trees. Those are the only trees on my land that I would not trust around my house. I have seen a nice looking white pine just snap off about 10-30 feet high with no defeat on the tree.

gspren · December 23, 2012, 08:24:13 AM

Our house and all of the outbuildings are on high ground so the only flooding is in the pastures and across the driveway. My biggest concern is power outages, even though I have several generators it gets less "fun" each year to go out in a nasty storm and fool around with generators. The entire power grid in our area is getting old and the local utilities don't have the number of employees they used to have so downed lines take longer to get fixed. I am thinking of a standby propane powered genny that kicks on automatically, a little pricey but neet.

Ljohnsaw · December 23, 2012, 11:29:18 AM

Quote from: WH_Conley on December 19, 2012, 06:53:12 AM
They said in '97 we had 100 year flood. 2000 was higher than that, 2010 was higher and if that wasn't enough the second time in 2010 was higher. I don't pay much attention to those claims anymore. :-\

The "100 year flood" is a catch phrase the media latched on to. What it really means is, there is a 1% chance of this amount of rain. If you extrapolate, then it WILL happen in 100 years (100%) - hence the 100 year flood. It just sounds really impressive to say it that way :D It just could be that the meteorologist didn't calc his figures right and perhaps the rain event of that magnitude was more like a 10 or 20% (10 year or 5 year flood).