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Author Topic: Whatcha Sawin' 2021 ??  (Read 105342 times)

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Offline Bindian

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Re: Whatcha Sawin' 2021 ??
« Reply #380 on: March 11, 2021, 11:48:11 PM »


I set up last night in front of this stack of logs. The customer is bucking them at 20'10" so there is no extra room to play with when sawing. I removed the rear bumper and bought myself an extra couple of inches and next time will remove the front bumper for even a little more.  

WV,
   That is how you do 20'10".  Here I thought 20' 6" inches was tight.  Thanks for the tip.
hugs,  Brandi
Mahindra 6520 4WD with loader/backhoe and a Caterpiller E70 Excavator.  My mill is a Woodmizer LT40HD Wide Diesel. An old Lull 644D-34 called Bull

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Offline longtime lurker

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Re: Whatcha Sawin' 2021 ??
« Reply #381 on: March 12, 2021, 06:09:45 AM »
Gotta remember to take some pictures of the hacking and stacking part this time.


(Image hidden from quote, click to view.)
 

Also the crane getting it onto the mill, because my gear ain't big enough to handle this one.:-\
So we banged it through this week.

Yah, it was a log, or half a log anyway because I put the top half of it through in January and this was the butt billet that was left to cut. It was wet and the loggers dozer was down for repairs so we used a pair of cranes to lift it on... 11.7 tonnes in that butt section... 25,795 lb for the metrically challenged amongst us. A pair because it was wet so they wanted to take it on the ropes and avoid some soft spots on the landing.  Volume 9.636 m3 (or 2420 BF doyle if that makes more sense to ya.)

Plan A was to crane it off here and toss it under the mill but the local guy with a 20t Franna only had chains good for 8.5 tonne so...
Plan B saw him take one end on the boom, me put the big loader under the other and we got it off that way. Then we attacked it with a Lucas Mill so we could gnaw it down to a more manageable weight for the loader. (knew I shouldn't have got rid of that other Lucas ... sometimes that easy to shift big log saw is a good thing)

So we hacked it apart, same as any other log I guess  - or at least any other log if you think a 4 gallon tin as a step up to a step cut in the log as a step so you can get on top of it to push the mill along is normal.  I seem to do it couple times a year so it's normal for me.



 
Young Benjamin doing his stuff - nothing like watching a professional at work.

Anyways we carved half of it off for an order that needed single log colour matching on some 10 x 4's. Then we tossed it into something a little easier to operate and finished the job.

Without a doubt this is the best serious hardwood log I've ever cut... nice even barrel on him and the heartshakes ran pretty straight so we didn't lose much in the middle. Got 7.1 m3 of sawn out of him or 3003 BF of lumber.... not too bad for scale overrun with a 7/16" bit circle saw. Normally I expect at best 45% recovery, this one got 72% which is unheard of here. I was due something nice to average up some of the trash we've been sawing I suppose



 

Mighta been all those big end sections maybe, first time I've ever calculated my recovery in BF against a scaled log cuz I found where I could plug in some numbers on the net and get a log scale measurement back. Normally I buy in either tonnes or cubic meters.

Anyway, job done. Back to hacking didgeridoos apart. :-\
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Re: Whatcha Sawin' 2021 ??
« Reply #382 on: March 12, 2021, 07:14:55 AM »
super log there @longtime lurker .   We struggle with the monster logs too.  Had to hire a crane 2 years ago, RO that took a whole tractor trailer.   Glad you got a special order out of it because those generally pay at a rate that makes the trouble worth while.

Out of curiosity, how was it loaded in the forest?
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Re: Whatcha Sawin' 2021 ??
« Reply #383 on: March 12, 2021, 07:23:07 AM »
Normally just roll them over the side with a dozer off a ramp.. This time the dozer was down for repairs so we used 2 cranes... lot easier on the truck for sure. Buttress root species tend to roll with a crash thump that breaks things; there's an awful lot of patches welded onto my truck floor.
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Offline WV Sawmiller

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Re: Whatcha Sawin' 2021 ??
« Reply #384 on: March 12, 2021, 08:53:47 AM »


I set up last night in front of this stack of logs. The customer is bucking them at 20'10" so there is no extra room to play with when sawing. I removed the rear bumper and bought myself an extra couple of inches and next time will remove the front bumper for even a little more.  

WV,
   That is how you do 20'10".  Here I thought 20' 6" inches was tight.  Thanks for the tip.
hugs,  Brandi
Brandi,

 Thanks for asking. You do them very carefully! My mill will cut 21' and has two black marks looking like pieces of black electrical tape-  one at the front and one at the back of the mill. The logs have to fit exactly between those marks. Too far forward and you can't get the blade in the wood. Too far back and it won't finish the cut and that is a long way to back out of a cut. Even 1/2" over and you can't get your blade in or out of the log.

   I removed the rubber bumper at the end that is held in place with a cotter key and that gave me about 2" more. I noticed there is another at the front and I will remove it next time. That should actually let me cut 21'4" or real close to it.

  Other concerns are the logs must be cut/bucked perfectly square or there will be an inch or two extra unexpected length to contend with. Also when you rotate the log for the second cut (I only had to turn once since we were doing live edge cabin logs) if you are not careful they will crawl forward or backwards a fudge and get over the line.

  When you load the logs you also have to raise the head and pull the debarker all the way out or the log will hit them. Once on the bed you can raise the toeboards and roll back or forward to adjust but they are very heavy. I had it with me but forgot use my Magic hook for it but if you raise the side supports all the way up and hook to the end of the log and a side support when you lower the arm you can pull the log backward a little. You should be able to pull it forward using the same technique from the back end starting with the side supports partly lowered, hook to the front end of the log then raise the side support and that should pull it to the rear. I think I have seen pics of the MagicMan moving logs forward or back this way and I will try it next time.

 BTW - 21' slabs and flitches are heavy too! Lacking the pair (or more) of burly, mentally challenged off-bearer helpers we needed we generally needed 2 of us worn out, broke down old men to carry each one to be stacked. Finally I just started sliding them off on to the bed of the mill or loading arms. When finished I'd raise the toeboards to full height giving us 5-6 inches of free space for the tractor forks to get under and lift and remove first the log then we'd do the same thing with the flitches. I do not like having anyone driving heavy equipment like that at and over my mill as a poor operator can easily tear something up but the neighbor with the tractor yesterday was very careful.

  Yesterday was just a concept verification day and it took us about 30 minutes per log. With properly bucked and staged logs and good help we should be able to do 3-4 per hour.

  I'd start at the center and make a mark 3" above and 3" below dead center to leave/take the 6" LE log from the middle. Heart checks had to be turned horizontal to the cut or the crack would show in the log when used. From my mark I'd come up 1-1/8" at a time (we were saving true 1" side lumber) till I had the face width I wanted, stop and set my SimpleSet for 1-1/8" drops, saw off side lumber to my mark, flip, start at 6" from the bed and raise and repeat so I had the 6" log left in the middle. I had to raise the appropriate toeboard a little on the first cut to level the heart then remember to lower it once I flipped the log or I would leave a long wedge and ruin the final log.

 Its not rocket science but it is tedious and heavy work.


Howard Green
WM LT35HDG25(2015) , 2009 4wd Dodge PU, Kawasaki 650 ATV, Sthil 440 & 441, homemade logging arch (w/custom built rear log dolly), JD 750 w/4' wide Bushhog brand FEL

Dad always said "You can shear a sheep a bunch of times but you can only skin him once"

Offline firefighter ontheside

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Re: Whatcha Sawin' 2021 ??
« Reply #385 on: March 12, 2021, 01:38:47 PM »
No sawing today, but I did replace the blade guide bearings and the wheel belts.  The guide bearings still rolled smoothly, but I wouldn't doubt that they are the originals so I figured now is as good a time as any.  I did replace the belts a few years ago, but I had the new ones so I went ahead and changed them.  I'll save the old ones for now.
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Offline Bindian

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Re: Whatcha Sawin' 2021 ??
« Reply #386 on: March 12, 2021, 03:02:29 PM »


I set up last night in front of this stack of logs. The customer is bucking them at 20'10" so there is no extra room to play with when sawing. I removed the rear bumper and bought myself an extra couple of inches and next time will remove the front bumper for even a little more.  

WV,
   That is how you do 20'10".  Here I thought 20' 6" inches was tight.  Thanks for the tip.
hugs,  Brandi
Brandi,

 Thanks for asking. You do them very carefully! My mill will cut 21' and has two black marks looking like pieces of black electrical tape-  one at the front and one at the back of the mill. The logs have to fit exactly between those marks. Too far forward and you can't get the blade in the wood. Too far back and it won't finish the cut and that is a long way to back out of a cut. Even 1/2" over and you can't get your blade in or out of the log.

   I removed the rubber bumper at the end that is held in place with a cotter key and that gave me about 2" more. I noticed there is another at the front and I will remove it next time. That should actually let me cut 21'4" or real close to it.

  Other concerns are the logs must be cut/bucked perfectly square or there will be an inch or two extra unexpected length to contend with. Also when you rotate the log for the second cut (I only had to turn once since we were doing live edge cabin logs) if you are not careful they will crawl forward or backwards a fudge and get over the line.

  When you load the logs you also have to raise the head and pull the debarker all the way out or the log will hit them. Once on the bed you can raise the toeboards and roll back or forward to adjust but they are very heavy. I had it with me but forgot use my Magic hook for it but if you raise the side supports all the way up and hook to the end of the log and a side support when you lower the arm you can pull the log backward a little. You should be able to pull it forward using the same technique from the back end starting with the side supports partly lowered, hook to the front end of the log then raise the side support and that should pull it to the rear. I think I have seen pics of the MagicMan moving logs forward or back this way and I will try it next time.

 BTW - 21' slabs and flitches are heavy too! Lacking the pair (or more) of burly, mentally challenged off-bearer helpers we needed we generally needed 2 of us worn out, broke down old men to carry each one to be stacked. Finally I just started sliding them off on to the bed of the mill or loading arms. When finished I'd raise the toeboards to full height giving us 5-6 inches of free space for the tractor forks to get under and lift and remove first the log then we'd do the same thing with the flitches. I do not like having anyone driving heavy equipment like that at and over my mill as a poor operator can easily tear something up but the neighbor with the tractor yesterday was very careful.

  Yesterday was just a concept verification day and it took us about 30 minutes per log. With properly bucked and staged logs and good help we should be able to do 3-4 per hour.

  I'd start at the center and make a mark 3" above and 3" below dead center to leave/take the 6" LE log from the middle. Heart checks had to be turned horizontal to the cut or the crack would show in the log when used. From my mark I'd come up 1-1/8" at a time (we were saving true 1" side lumber) till I had the face width I wanted, stop and set my SimpleSet for 1-1/8" drops, saw off side lumber to my mark, flip, start at 6" from the bed and raise and repeat so I had the 6" log left in the middle. I had to raise the appropriate toeboard a little on the first cut to level the heart then remember to lower it once I flipped the log or I would leave a long wedge and ruin the final log.

 Its not rocket science but it is tedious and heavy work.
Yep, found that out with my long, bigger logs.  When I turned it, it moved a little and I was out of travel with 1/2" left to saw.  To bump it back into position, I raised the toe boards and pushed it back with the telehander and had the tractor's grapple to stop it where I wanted it.

 
It is time consuming, but doable.  Can't wait til I get it in the shed and the 6 foot or so extension installed.
hugs, Brandi
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Offline WV Sawmiller

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Re: Whatcha Sawin' 2021 ??
« Reply #387 on: March 12, 2021, 03:49:11 PM »
Brandi,

 I tried to convince the customer to cut them to 20'6" so I had 6" to play with but she keyed on that 21' max and decided she needed that extra 4" of house space I guess. I guess I'm lucky she left me 2" of play. If she'd known about the bumper space she would have left them 21'. We pushed these with the toeboards up. It is much easier on the second turn when you have the sawed face resting on the toeboard than the round edge like we started with. We did not have a fancy telehandler to work with. I think the MagicHook will do what we need but I forgot about it yesterday. Straight logs don't shift as much as crooked ones.

 Maybe Marty Parsons will read this and have WM make a log shifter attachment for the mills to fix this issue and if it makes any money he will send us some of it. :D

EDIT/ADD-ON: All they have to do is provide power to the toeboards. ;)
Howard Green
WM LT35HDG25(2015) , 2009 4wd Dodge PU, Kawasaki 650 ATV, Sthil 440 & 441, homemade logging arch (w/custom built rear log dolly), JD 750 w/4' wide Bushhog brand FEL

Dad always said "You can shear a sheep a bunch of times but you can only skin him once"

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Re: Whatcha Sawin' 2021 ??
« Reply #388 on: March 12, 2021, 07:16:03 PM »
I had a chance to cut a little pine this afternoon. Im setting the slabs to the side to use for counter tops

 for a cabin project in Northern Michigan. The Lt40 will cut 28 , but it better be string straight on both sides. I had to work this back and forth a little to get it cut.

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Re: Whatcha Sawin' 2021 ??
« Reply #389 on: March 13, 2021, 12:40:28 AM »
Brandi,

 I tried to convince the customer to cut them to 20'6" so I had 6" to play with but she keyed on that 21' max and decided she needed that extra 4" of house space I guess. I guess I'm lucky she left me 2" of play. If she'd known about the bumper space she would have left them 21'. We pushed these with the toeboards up. It is much easier on the second turn when you have the sawed face resting on the toeboard than the round edge like we started with. We did not have a fancy telehandler to work with. I think the MagicHook will do what we need but I forgot about it yesterday. Straight logs don't shift as much as crooked ones.

 Maybe Marty Parsons will read this and have WM make a log shifter attachment for the mills to fix this issue and if it makes any money he will send us some of it. :D

EDIT/ADD-ON: All they have to do is provide power to the toeboards. ;)
Howard,
      If I hadn't had the squirt boom, the Mahindra's grapple would have been used.  I can't, by myself, slide a 5,000 pound log over a half inch, even with the toe boards up.
It would be nice if WM came out with a kit to do this.  Problem with the toe boards is the pivots both swing the same direction, which tends to have the log move that direction more so.
hugs,  Brandi
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Re: Whatcha Sawin' 2021 ??
« Reply #390 on: March 13, 2021, 06:37:05 AM »
WM does have powered toe rollers available. @Stuart Caruk put them on his mill. 
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Re: Whatcha Sawin' 2021 ??
« Reply #391 on: March 13, 2021, 07:48:36 AM »

Trim Guy,  That one does look string straight.  Sometimes I remove the blade and see if the saw head and roller guides will make a clear pass down the log.  
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Re: Whatcha Sawin' 2021 ??
« Reply #392 on: March 13, 2021, 09:31:52 AM »
WM does have powered toe rollers available. @Stuart Caruk put them on his mill.
  Boy, that was a fast response! Those WM people work fast don't they? :D

   I looked under the accessories list and the only toeboards I saw listed were manual ones.  Since this is likely a one off kind of a job it would probably not be worth the effort and expense for me to add them anyway although I am sure if I had them I would use them regularly on my other shorter logs too.

Howard Green
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Re: Whatcha Sawin' 2021 ??
« Reply #393 on: March 13, 2021, 09:46:20 AM »
Stuart Caruk's powered toe board roller.



Of course he is set up permanent and can saw 52' beams.  :o
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Re: Whatcha Sawin' 2021 ??
« Reply #394 on: March 13, 2021, 10:37:40 AM »
     I hope those are rubber fingers on the rollers. If not we sure could not use them on the sawed side of a a cant or it would chew it up.  Yeah, not something I'll be adding anytime soon. It is either a couple of mentally challenged helpers or the MagicHook for me especially on the round side. The flat side rolls a lot easier once you get to that stage.
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Re: Whatcha Sawin' 2021 ??
« Reply #395 on: March 13, 2021, 12:21:19 PM »
with those you do not need off bearers, just cut through the cant, go to the high speed and toss them off the end of the mill!   :D :D :D   :o :o :o   :) :) :)
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Re: Whatcha Sawin' 2021 ??
« Reply #396 on: March 13, 2021, 12:55:39 PM »
with those you do not need off bearers, just cut through the cant, go to the high speed and toss them off the end of the mill!   :D :D :D   :o :o :o   :) :) :)
I'd like to see a video of that, for sure.
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Re: Whatcha Sawin' 2021 ??
« Reply #397 on: March 13, 2021, 01:14:35 PM »
Doc,

   You had me scratching my head there for a minute then I finally realized you were saying the power rollers replace the off bearers. I guess that would be like a reverse dragback feature. I guess I will stick with the off-bearers.

   That reminds me of an old boss of mine who said he had an uncle with a sawmill and two old black men who cut the logs with a crosscut saw as a sort of retirement income. They did not work fast but just steady and he'd saw whatever logs they cut into lumber and sell it as a sort of sideline business. His sawmill was not something he tried to do full time. Linwood asked his uncle why he did not buy the old men a chainsaw. He said his uncle told him "A chainsaw would just put his helpers out of work because they would finish so much sooner and likely only needed one." He wanted to be sure the old men had and income but he was going to make sure they worked for it.
Howard Green
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Dad always said "You can shear a sheep a bunch of times but you can only skin him once"

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Re: Whatcha Sawin' 2021 ??
« Reply #398 on: March 13, 2021, 05:58:39 PM »
I saw I have used up all my 2" lath strips I use to make my simple crates and such so I figured I'd make some more stock out of a small 8' poplar top I cut several days ago. A couple days ago I cut 2-10' logs from about midpoint on the tree into 1X4's and a kid came and picked them up for his dad today.


 I just cut the "log" into 2" flitches and saved one 3/8" flitch about 5" wide between the bark. I stood the 2" flitches up and set my mark on 13" and SimpleSet to 1/2" and started edging. Every pass left me with 5 each 3/8" X 2" X8' lath strips.


I got 96 strips out the scrappy log. There will be some waste from splits and such but not much loss since I'm cutting them up into 12-16 inch lengths on my RAS to make crates. The dog boards were 1/2" and there was some serious pucker to cut them. I will use them for handles on the end of the crates or such. I have them stacked and stickered and they should be air dry in just a few weeks because they are so thin.
Howard Green
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Dad always said "You can shear a sheep a bunch of times but you can only skin him once"

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Re: Whatcha Sawin' 2021 ??
« Reply #399 on: March 13, 2021, 08:03:15 PM »
Those crates must be a hot item, WV. Nice work. 
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