Drag sharpener vs CBN

Hilltop366 · September 15, 2021, 12:10:54 PM

I have only seen videos of the cbn sharpeners and heard the talk of the oil mess and it got me wondering if a cabinet around the entire operation would be nice to have (like a cnc milling machine would have), it would keep the mess pretty much contained and could be vented outside or through a filter.

Bruno of NH · September 15, 2021, 12:52:51 PM

My friend who passed away last year had 3 of the Woodmizer cbn with cabinets it still made smoke and oil in the air .
I have never seen the others run.
I would think an overhead draft hood would be needed

terrifictimbersllc · September 15, 2021, 12:59:36 PM

BMS 250 does come in a more or less enclosed cabinet with a duct on the top lid. If you ran a hose to a small fan to outside, the other openings in the lid would have fresh air coming into them and probablyAll the oil mist would go out the duct hose.

jimbarry · September 15, 2021, 01:37:02 PM

Quote from: terrifictimbersllc on September 15, 2021, 12:59:36 PM
BMS 250 does come in a more or less enclosed cabinet with a duct on the top lid. If you ran a hose to a small fan to outside, the other openings in the lid would have fresh air coming into them and probablyAll the oil mist would go out the duct hose.

Not probably, it would, and does. At least for me. I got rid of the K*N filter and now vent outdoors.

Quebecnewf · September 15, 2021, 04:53:11 PM

Now to add a bit more to the mix.

A friend sent me Dina Sharpener . A newer version and full auto where as mine is semi auto . He has not had any luck with it do now I'm going to give it a whirl .

The wheel on this one is a diamond wheel . Not sure about that . There is a broken normal grinding wheel in the box .

Anyone use diamond wheel on drag style sharpener ?

For some reason pics are tipped on their side . A job for our fearless adm .

Quebecnewf

Crusarius · September 15, 2021, 05:27:13 PM

Pretty sure diamond is for carbide and will not work as well or last on bimetal. hopefully if I am wrong someone will correct me.

Quebecnewf · September 15, 2021, 05:33:21 PM

I was thinking the same thing . I thought all the drag style used grinding wheels . That's all I ever used and I don't remember anyone in here saying they used a diamond wheel on their drag grinders .

And as we know if it hasn't been tried on this site then it haven't happened

Quebecnewf

Bruno of NH · September 15, 2021, 05:50:41 PM

Valley sawmills in Quebec is a stocking dealer in the right wheels for that new style.
The new wheels are quite different.
That's the sharpener I want.
The owner has passed and the company is in limbo at the moment.

Quebecnewf · September 15, 2021, 06:27:18 PM

Do you have any info on type of wheels . I've been to that location . They make some good mills

Quebecnewf

Bradm · September 15, 2021, 06:57:22 PM

Quote from: Crusarius on September 15, 2021, 05:27:13 PM
Pretty sure diamond is for carbide and will not work as well or last on bimetal. hopefully if I am wrong someone will correct me.

You are correct. The diamond will glaze over and stop cutting leading to overheating both the blade and the wheel. Very light grinding on steel won't hurt it too much (I'll hand sharpen small drill bits with one) but heavy or extended use will.

Quote from: terrifictimbersllc on September 15, 2021, 12:59:36 PM
BMS 250 does come in a more or less enclosed cabinet with a duct on the top lid. If you ran a hose to a small fan to outside, the other openings in the lid would have fresh air coming into them and probablyAll the oil mist would go out the duct hose.

A better idea would be to try and fab up a mist collector to filter and recapture the oil mist while also creating a negative pressure inside the work area that won't allow any mist to escape. I worked in a grind shop that didn't do this and the amount of mist that gets put into the air is quite excessive, not to mention expensive.

Quote from: YellowHammer on September 15, 2021, 07:27:31 AM
A dry CBN wheel will dull up very quickly.

When pushed hard, yes. Keep the grinds light and the wheel won't glaze over.

LeeB · September 15, 2021, 10:03:50 PM

At one time there was a fellow on here from Ireland that made CBN wheels for a drag sharpener. I had one and it worked well until I dropped it and broke the grinding edge. The grinder I have is similar to a cooks and I think it was made by the same people before cooks started selling them. It's labeled as Suffolk. They no longer sell it.

Quebecnewf · September 16, 2021, 05:01:42 AM

Would the grinding of bandsaw blades constitute as " very light grinding " I'm wondering .

The diamond wheel mounted on the unit ( there is another spare in a box ) is thin and the edge is about the same profile as the rock stone that I use on my olderDinasaw sharpener .

Would be great if it worked . A lot less mess . I will try to reach out to the manufacturer in AU. If I can and see what they say .

The company in Quebec's eastern townships that sell s these units also offers a sharpening service based on these soi will look for info there ?

Quebecnewf

Quebecnewf · September 16, 2021, 05:35:55 AM

Preferably use ABN / CBN wheels and wear a suitable dust mask.

The above is a line from the instruction Manuel for the sharpener .

Guess that answers the question?

Quebecnewf

YellowHammer · September 16, 2021, 07:34:15 AM

I didn't really like the mess of my dry grinder drag grinder, the grinding residue would fall all over the floor, and was a mess. I like the WM style CBN style, it come with a hood, but smoke and vapor comes out. Both have their drawbacks.

I mounted mine to a rolling cart and simply roll mine outside on the concrete apron and get to sharpening. In my mind, one of the significant advantages of a wet CBN system is a one and done grind with no burning, about 2.5 minutes around the band and done.

In contrast, my Cooks dry drag grinder was 7 minutes around to not burn the teeth and required 2 to 3 light passes, so resulted in 14 to 21 minutes per band. Way too much time.

The WM sharpener has a hood and a blower suction port, so if I was going to do it inside, I would mount a vapor suction unit to the port and send the vapor out the duct.

Cedarman · September 16, 2021, 08:38:29 AM

I adjust the oil sprays so that during grinding there are no sparks or very few to be seen. Never see any smoke. I set up a small fan and hose to blow outside. But have not noticed any difference of fumes inside. When not using fan. Most oil seemed to stay inside. there would be a few drops fall to the flow while sharpening, but they evaporate. So I know some is getting into the air. If a blade sets after sharpening the oil on the blade evaporates also.
Anyone got any masks these days.!!

Quebecnewf · September 16, 2021, 12:39:09 PM

This is the type of wheel that is on the grinder . The box it came out of . Googled that company and it seems there closed .

What type of wheel would you say this is . I'm saying diamond but that is just what is on the box and I realize that is a company name .

Quebecnewf

Bradm · September 16, 2021, 08:48:27 PM

Are there any markings on the wheel itself or other labels/writing on the box? I've got both diamond and CBN wheels that look like that. Being as the wheel is electroplated, as opposed to a resin bond, using aluminum oxide dressing sticks to open up a dull wheel is not advised as the grit layer is only 1 cutting grit deep.

Quebecnewf · September 17, 2021, 05:13:44 AM

No there is nothing at all written on the wheel . There is a label on the side of the but it is so badly faded that I can't get any info of it .there was a dressing stone in the box but I'm assuming it goes with the broken grinding wheel .

Is there anyone on here that runs this type of sharpener I'm wondering ?

Quebecnewf

Bruno of NH · September 17, 2021, 06:14:14 AM

There is member that has this and knows about the different wheels
Ulcer maybe ?

jimbarry · September 17, 2021, 07:15:09 AM

Quote from: Quebecnewf on September 16, 2021, 05:35:55 AM
Preferably use ABN / CBN wheels and wear a suitable dust mask.

The above is a line from the instruction Manuel for the sharpener .

Guess that answers the question?

Quebecnewf

Quebecnewf, yes, wear a mask. I use a similar disc on my chainsaw chain sharpener (Oregon bench type). Its not a drag type, more like a BMS250 (chop saw motion). I ordered the wheels from China, same company I get the CBN wheels for the BMS250MU I have. So I know its CBN, not diamond coated.

Quote from: Quebecnewf on September 16, 2021, 05:01:42 AM
Would the grinding of bandsaw blades constitute as " very light grinding " I'm wondering . ...
The diamond wheel mounted on the unit ( there is another spare in a box ) is thin and the edge is about the same profile as the rock stone that I use on my older Dinasaw sharpener . ...

Yes to answer your first question.
You will have to determine if it's a diamond or cbn wheel. Some info at https://www.eaglesuperabrasives.com/capabilities-bonds/cbn-wheels/

Quebecnewf · September 18, 2021, 05:33:45 AM

Still no time to start learning on the new sharpening machine .

It seems from some reading and poking around that maybe the MSA option while good, isa little tricky to maintain .

I'm wondering if you have everything set and running well doing the sharpening without the MSA engaged is it then possible to engage that option without having to completely recalibrate the machine ?

Would be great if as you get up to say 5 or 6 sharpens on a band you could then click on this option for that band to extend cutting life of the band without having to reset the band .

They say in the instructions that a blade sharpened this way requires less set .

I could be just wishful thinking here but I'm always ( as we all are I'm thinking ) chasing that holy grail of a sharper blade .

Quebecnewf