Tamarack do for a fence post?

[Stan P]

good morning.  putting in a vegetable garden and have an opportunity to buy rough cut tamarack for posts and boards and maybe a tree house for the kids.  I know black locust would be best, but dont have any.  I have heard tamarack is pretty good at resisting rot.  I was wondering if anyone had experience with the wood.  Also, do posts for a fence need to be center cut or would 5X5 posts hold their shape. 

thanks

Stan

[shinnlinger]

Stan,

No direct experience, but I think Tamarack and Larch are the same, and yes, I think they offer decent rot resistance.  Especially if you dip the ends.

[ID4ster]

You'll need to dip the ends or soak them in some sort of preservative. I put untreated tamarack posts in my garden a few years back and they all rotted off after two seasons. The cedar I put in lasted a little longer but it too is rotting off. I've heard of one method of preserving that I'm going to try and that is to char the ends of the post that will go into the ground rather than soaking them. You then wrap the ends in several thicknesses of plastic bags, tie them off securely and then bury them in the ground. The charring produces a natural cresote and that saves you from having to put them in some sort of oil that might be more toxic.
Tamarack that is untreated and in the air like a cross member or fence board will last a long time but in the ground it will rot just about as fast as anything else.

[moonhill]

Án interesting point about post rot is it happens at ground level not so much below the surface.  I think it has to do with it getting wet than drying  than getting wet than drying, you know that cycle.  Where the part in the ground keeps more constantly wet, sort of like a log in a river left from the river driving days, wet all the time.  I don't know if it would help but maybe worth a try,  extend the tar up the post above the ground level say 6"or so, in hopes to keep that part more on par with the part below ground level.  Than report back in 5 years.  You would have to do some the regular way as a comparision.  Black locust is great in the ground, 25 years in the mud and as good as new, same color as PT also, green.  Tim B.

[Mooseherder]

Tamarack is the featured Tree in the new issue of Sawmill and Woodlot magazine I received today.  Here is a small excerpt from the article.

Slow growing trees develop wood with high resin content, making the wood decay resistant and useful for posts, poles and railroad ties.  Tamarack lumber is ideal for outdoor furniture products as it has proven to be stronger and less brittle than cedar.  It has better defined grain than teak and it is more resistant to decay than pine.  There is more but you gotta get the magazine. ;D :D

[Dave Shepard]

Any tamarack around here you would need a boat to get to. I've pulled up cedar posts that have been in the ground for decades. The outside has long since rotted away, but the red is left, and you couldn't snap it off for anything.


Dave

[Stan P]

thanks.  that is all very helpful.  what kind of preservative do you think I can use, considering I will be growing vegetables inches away?  will let you know what I do

[moonhill]

Don't use any you will be better of, don't worry, be happy.   Tim B.

[HARLEYRIDER]

thanks.  that is all very helpful.  what kind of preservative do you think I can use, considering I will be growing vegetables inches away?  will let you know what I do

Coppercoat....like I used on lennons fence. that and fill the hole(hole that is deeper than the post bottom) with crushed stone, so groundwater can drain away.....and a little concrete to cap the hole if you got time.


Get back to work ;D

[SwampDonkey]

We always used northern white cedar, not Atlantic white, and they lasted decades on pasture fence.



Here is a cedar telephone pole that has been standing since the 40's. It's up the end of our road and there used to be 3 houses up there. All gone and abandoned now.

[Stan P]

thanks for the advice.  After hearing from you, I tracked down a supply of cedar and will be using that. 

Stan

[moonhill]

Did they use any crap to preserve that power pole back in the 40's?  I have to keep relating to the TTRAG meeting I just attended.  There was a speaker on the topic of preserving  wood timber, and his final coments were "use a species of wood which has natural abilities to deter rot, white oak, cedar, locust etc..  Tim B.

[SwampDonkey]

No, those poles where never treated. They cut the last of them off at ground level here where people live about 1980 and put creosote poles, then the copper arsenate poles. Anyone that had them cedar poles on their land used them for kindling. The power company just cut and laid them where they fell in the grass. And the line fences made from white cedar are still up on some woodlots I cruised. Most people removed them for firewood (kindling). Anyway, mature timber on some of the more remote woodlots with old cedar rail fence now. One area I know of that became forest again even went through budworms in the mid 80's. It was the weirdest farm grant I seen. There were two isolated lots but up against one another out next to the US border. They were triangle as most lots are, but running north - south, instead of east - west toward the road. Then there's one farm blocking those two off that came out to the road. An old guy bought all three farms in later years so it didn't matter. But those fences are all through the woods, they make great kindling to. ;D I talk to the guy's son once in awhile and he just putters part time with a skidder out there. He works in a garage in the day job. But they got more wood then they know what to do with. One of the few good fella's that hasn't let someone come in and slaughter their ground.  And proof that budworm doesn't kill the whole woods.

[moonhill]

Did my last post get fixed?  Sorry and thanks.  Tim B.

[thecfarm]

I have a few of those cedar fence posts as swampdockey is talking about.Most of them are on a stone wall.High and dry,they will last for years.

[FrankLad]

I'm getting ready to build a mailbox stand out of cypress.  I was given similar advice with that species:  "cypress is good when totally submerged or totally dry, but changing from wet to dry isn't the best for it".  I'm learning this is a good rule of thumb for lots of wood species.

Thanks for the tip about charring the bottom of the post.  That's something I'll certainly try, along with wrapping the bottom.

By the way... I have some leftover waterproofing tar.  Would that work or would the plastic bags last longer?

[moonhill]

How about char'em, tar'em, and wrap'em.  Most likely not over kill.  Tim B.

[Stan P]

sounds like cedar is going to outlast me.  Is red cedar ok?  you all mentioned white cedar.

thanks

Stan