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Should I go with a wider blade ?

Started by arky217, April 09, 2021, 03:41:14 PM

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arky217

I was looking at some youtube milling videos and came across this one
by 'The Outdoor Guy'.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J846xqJbBiA

He has a Woodland Mills hm126 which uses 1.25" blades.
He switched to 1.5" wide x 0.055" thick blades and claims that they
not only work on his mill but give him about twice the life
between sharpenings and have eliminated making waves.

He doesn't say what hp his mill has but it's either 9 or 14
according to Woodland Mills web site.

Is there anything to what he's claiming ?
Would it be worth trying 1.5" x 0.55" blades on my
Norwood LM29 with a 13.5hp engine which uses 1.25" x 0.042"
thick blades ?

Arky217

ladylake

  


No, I have a 30 hp diesel and it will saw straight making the engine smoke sometimes with 1 1/4 " blades.  It's all about setup, guides. set  and hook angle.  I think he has those sandwich type guides, I think roller guides control the blade way better.  Also running .55 blades blade life will not be very good.  Steve
 
Timberking B20  18000  hours +  Case75xt grapple + forks+8" snow bucket + dirt bucket   770 Oliver   Lots(too many) of chainsaws, Like the Echo saws and the Stihl and Husky     W5  Case loader   1  trailers  Wright sharpener     Suffolk  setter Volvo MCT125c skid loader

Andries

Some here are running big mills with big motors, and sharpen their own bands.
There's more than few that have switch the other way, from thick to thin bands.
The advantages are that they're cheaper, have better flex life and sharpen as many times before they get past the tempered teeth points.
LT40G25
Ford 545D loader
Stihl chainsaws

Southside

Interesting observation by the YouTube guy.

I switched to 1 3/4" bands on my Super 70 to see if I could improve performance. Well, they do saw flatter faster but what I found odd was that I am getting more BF out of a sharp band. Can't explain why, but I am.

Yet to break a .055 Silvertip band yet with this setup. 

YMMV
Franklin buncher and skidder
JD Processor
Woodmizer LT Super 70 and LT35 sawmill, KD250 kiln, BMS 250 sharpener and setter
Riehl Edger
Woodmaster 725 and 4000 planner and moulder
Enough cows to ensure there is no spare time.
White Oak Meadows

barbender

That's because you're running those big wheels, quit mocking those of us that are still spinning 19's😁
  I think a 1.5"x.055 is a lot of blade for a low hp mill, but the worst you can do is try it and they don't work out. They will probably saw well but not last very long before they break.
Too many irons in the fire

Magicman

Neither a wider nor a thicker blade stay sharper longer.  It is only allowing him to saw longer with a dull blade which is false economy.
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

moodnacreek

Quote from: Magicman on April 09, 2021, 06:04:34 PM
Neither a wider nor a thicker blade stay sharper longer.  It is only allowing him to saw longer with a dull blade which is false economy.
Yes but what about production? I understand you can only flex so much gage as per wheel size but more iron [steel] means more wood sawed in any saw.

Southside

I hear what you are saying MM. But let's look at the other end of the spectrum. Big band mills, 6' air strain running 12" bands get more than 500 BF / sharpening. 

As to why, I have no idea. 
Franklin buncher and skidder
JD Processor
Woodmizer LT Super 70 and LT35 sawmill, KD250 kiln, BMS 250 sharpener and setter
Riehl Edger
Woodmaster 725 and 4000 planner and moulder
Enough cows to ensure there is no spare time.
White Oak Meadows

Magicman

Quote from: arky217 on April 09, 2021, 03:41:14 PMHe has a Woodland Mills hm126 which uses 1.25" blades. He switched to 1.5" wide x 0.055" thick blades and claims that they not only work on his mill but give him about twice the life between sharpenings and have eliminated making waves.
We are not talking about huge bands here which are being compared out of context. 

I am simply not giving much validity to increasing from 1.25 to 1.50 and .045(?) to .055 doubling the blade life between sharpenings.
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

JRWoodchuck

I've switched between the two pending on what's available from wood mizer without a real noticeable difference between the two. The 1 1/2 055s don't seem to fail any quicker on my 19" wheels than the 1 1/4 045s. 
Home built bandsaw mill still trying find the owners manual!

longtime lurker

You have to compare apples with apples here.

The strength of a  column is directly proportional to its depth. That's Engineering 101 stuff and it applies equally to wooden rafters, concrete piers, and bandsaw bands. The wider it is the more resistant it is to flex and the straighter it cuts.

The thicker a band the more strain it can handle so the straighter it cuts too.

Straighter cuts mean less material removed and less friction/ heat buildup.. so they stay sharper longer.

And then factor in deeper gullets for sawdust removal etcetera etcetera. And tooth options and saw profile options and on it goes.

BUT. A performance upgrade from the band requires more saw to achieve anything. A band that can cut faster straighter and longer on a saw that doesn't have the power to use it means that there is zero performance upgrade.

Theoretically though the potential difference between 1½x 0.055 and 1¼ X 0.042 is as great as the upgrade from 1" x 0.032 to 1¼ is.

If you got enough saw to make it sing: Apples with apples.
The quickest way to make a million dollars with a sawmill is to start with two million.

terrifictimbersllc

It is my impression from running .045" thick bands (1-1/4) for 19 yrs with 42 HP, then switching to .055" thick bands with 55 HP, that running the thicker band takes more HP.  So I would be surprised to hear anyone running 055 bands on a 9 or 14HP mill. 
DJ Hoover, Terrific Timbers LLC,  Mystic CT Woodmizer Million Board Foot Club member. 2019 LT70 Super Wide 55 Yanmar,  LogRite fetching arch, WM BMS250 sharpener/BMT250 setter.  2001 F350 7.3L PSD 6 spd manual ZF 4x4 Crew Cab Long Bed

KenMac

I watched the video and read the comments but I'm still uncertain that both blade sizes are the same blades (WM Turbo 7's for example). If not that may explain his better luck with wider blades. If wider blades are better quality than thinner ones they will obviously give better service. 
Cook's AC3667t, Cat Claw sharpener, Dual tooth setter, and Band Roller, Kubota B26 TLB, Takeuchi TB260C

Patrick NC

I tried some 1.5" standard 7° bands on my 23hp mill and didn't see enough difference over the 1.25" standard 7s to justify the extra cost. Both were 0.045.  
Norwood HD36, Husky 372xp xtorq, 550xp mk2 , 460 rancher, Kubota l2501, Case 1845 skid steer,

Magicman

I got a couple of 1½"X.045 Turbos to try but I have not had/taken the time to do it.  ::)
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

Beavertooth

To add to what Longtime Lurker said one of the main reasons you can get more bd.ft. with the wider blade is exactly because you can push that blade faster through the log and still saw straight and the faster you go the less time that blade is spinning in wood which is always causing it to dull. 
2007 LT70 Remote Station 62hp cat.

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