trail culvert reccomendations?

[Jeff]

I have a couple trails on the new property that have low spots that I want to fill, but I don't want to spend an arm and a leg on draining through them. Any suggestions?  Probably 20ft width.

[mike_belben]

its a lot of work but bigger chunky demo.  brick, block, concrete and various cobbles.  obviously big stuff on bottom and smaller on top.  if you have a lot of silts or clays they eventually fill in and clog but itll remain as a firm spot.  if the low spot is needed as a flowing draining to prevent impounding water, thats a bit more of a struggle.  pipe is hands down best but spendy.  big slabby chunks of concrete can be laid over a trough to somewhat preserve it.  like laying steel plate over a pipeline trench on the interstate.


alabama dept of forestry i think it was had a video publication from the 70s about laying 6" rock in wire cages for forestry crossings but it takes a lot of rock.  the creeks just filter through it.  laying cinder blocks side by side to make a double barrel pipe will work well i bet. then throw some landscape plastic or carpet or tarp over it and cover with dirt.

[GAB]

I used some 8" (if I remember correctly) sewer pipe as a culvert.
I believe you need to consider how much dirt will there be over it, and how much water will need to pass through it during strong storms, and how heavy will the loads or equipment going over it are all factors needing consideration as far as size and wall thickness of the material you decide to employ to avoid having to redo it later. 
GAB

[Jeff]

Let me see ifI can get a still shot from a video. I do have a large stone pile within 50 yards of the one hole.  My thinking was like that black corregated pipe, maybe 8" covered in rock then covered up with dirt.

[mike_belben]

there are 2 challenges.  keeping soil out of the rock voids, and keeping the soil that is outside of the rock area from being eaten away. 


in flatlands a heavy downpour can be dissipated in all directions. in hill country a heavy downpour is like a rush hour interstate and will erode anything that tries to get in its way, eventually.  it looks like youre in flatlands, so hopefully we arent talking about creeks that become rushing torrents, which is what the southeast has, and thus really needs oversize genuine culverts.  not much else lasts long.   if we put a rock basket out, it needs to be a huge rock basket area wise to accommodate the maximum GPM of a normally trickling creek.  if insufficiently sized, the banks will just get wider and wider as the water goes around the rock tunnel.  if i put one cinder block tube in a single block sized trench and theres too much water, it will completely eat channels around both sides of the block and now its a 2 block wide trench. 



to keep the rock voids from filling in with surface dirt is the other issue.  when you cap the rock layer in dirt, the rains will wash the dirt into the voids and now you just have some really solid ground, not a passage any more.  this can be avoided pretty well with filter fabric or non permeable sheeting and good pitch to shed water off the cap dirt. 

a hand mixed concrete spillway and some wood decking over it on your trail cross may also be viable options for some people. 

[Jeff]

The. Trouble spots were not rouble spots just seasonal puddles until someone else's kids started blowing through them with atvs. By the time the foot that mattered was put down, not mine at the time, the damage was done.

[Hilltop366]

Two drainage ditches that crosses the farm road by my house had a culvert that was made from logs on each side with large flat rocks across the top. I changed them with concrete culverts when I built my house 20 years ago.

Not sure how old they were but they were there when my grand father bought the land in the 40's, to my surprise the hard wood logs were still good when I dug them out.

A wood structure would be possible too (bridge/board walk). Logs, sawmill, tractor, build.....great video material.

[mike_belben]

ahh..  


this is gonna seem counter intuitive.. but when its fully muddy, fill the holes/puddles with native dirt and churn it all up like concrete mix.  when it finally hardens in dry season you should be back to solid ground.  


people love to add gravel to a hole and wonder why it just continues to eat gravel.  because its a bowl of water with gravel in it and the water keeps slaking the dirt below so the rock can keep being pushed deeper.  

dig the gravel out, fill it with water, fill it with dirt, mix to batter, let cure.  repeat until original compacted height is achieved then re-gravel.    i fix my continual excavations in the pouring rain by shovelling into every puddle and churning it to mush.  the dirt must displace the water. 


if you live on that sandy super draining stuff i hear about forget everything i said because i have no idea with that dirt.   

[Corley5]

Hollow logs.

[newoodguy78]

What about building a wooden culvert in my experience wood that is always soaked lasts a long time.
Maybe mill some stuff up and alternate the seams to get a long enough piece. Possibly triangular shape for strength 

[newoodguy78]

Hollow logs.

That would save milling lumber  :D

[chet]

ya got any cedar logs left from that pile? Any hollow?

[barbender]

If there isn't much flow just a 4" PVC pipe could suffice. Obviously you have to account for all times of the year though.

[Jeff]

No, all good and they were all solid. I've got about 50 ft of 4"corregated solid drain pipe. What about laying two chunks side by side, landscape then the field stone then bring it back up with sand.  Problem e
With this property is it has a clay ledge about 3ft down, sand topsoil above.  Everything has to migrate the off, or evaporate.

[Tacotodd]

@Jeff a picture would help.

[Jeff]

Im press
Im disgusted with myself on some photo and video opps I blew this weekend. One was 30ft from a cow moose in the water eating.

[Joe Hillmann]

I work for a township and we replace several culverts a year.  Most are rotted out on the bottom but would still work for a private road.  I would suggest going to your local, smallest government road crew and ask what they do with the old ones.  

[SwampDonkey]

Im press
Im disgusted with myself on some photo and video opps I blew this weekend. One was 30ft from a cow moose in the water eating.

Happens, I had a cow with her baby, the baby was diving for lilies in Napadogan Lake. No camera that day. But you've seen some other vids of mine with mature moose wading around in there. Sure you can see it on 'Nature of Things', but those aren't my moose. :D

[luap]

For the money the plastic corrugated material is good. If heavy equipment is going over probably would need the double wall. It needs to be covered with compacted dirt to prevent water from flowing around the outside of the pipe. You could get some high volumes of water in the spring runoff. Put your rock around each end of the pipe and as top layer if desired. Go on you tube and watch Lets dig 18 install pond pipes and driveway culverts. He explains the do's and don't thoroughly. If you lay two pipes side by side,you have to make sure the space between is filled with compacted dirt or that will be a channel that will allow water to erode through. Fwiw single wall 4" corrugated covered 12" will not hold up to a 9500# excavator crossing it. Your ford tractor would probably be okay.

[SwampDonkey]

I've been making new trails this spring to get back with the SS into other wood. I just have some seasonal wet runs that go dry, but the ground is black so a bike could tear it up unless you go softly. So I have been putting down brush and then some rails and then more spruce brush. So corduroy crossings essentially. It has worked well. My trails are slow trails, so no one can go like a maniac on them anyway unless they plan on destroying a bike and themselves in the process. :D I've got acres of rail sized trees all around between the bigger trees, so I don't have to lug stuff far. Well, no lugging because they fit in the back dump anyway, but end toward the cab. I just cut mine 8 ft or so, and not really measuring. This got me out to an old winter road where I can reach more firewood. But I still have 2 or 3 years of firewood just within 100 feet of the main road.

[upnut]

I had a wet spot on a main trail where a tile outlet crossed the trail making it a muddy mess certain times of the year. Had a used 12"X20' driveway culvert laying around for years, decided to put it to use....



 

It took about 6 yards of bank run gravel to cover the culvert and blend in the approaches which made kind of a hump in the trail. Also improved the waterway to carry water away. Naturally this was a mild winter and spring so not much run-off but I'm sure it will be an improvement.

Scott B.

[stavebuyer]

From what you describe I think I would put some logs/pipes/cobblestone to let water pass and get some geotextile fabric over the top; then build up your road bed.

[samandothers]

What about a 12" double wall culvert.  Split in half with a chainsaw.  Then lay some gravel ... or not an turn 1/2 culvert upside down.  Back fill over it leaving the ends open.  This would give you a 6" opening for water and a stronger pipe structure to drive over.

[Jeff]

Im in real need of s I me ditching to move water. There is a small pond I want to enlarge that is in the runoff from the trail that needs love first. Im putting together a video right now of a side by side ride through our current trails. There are trails only on the front 20. The back has no trails to it, but possibly has the best trees.
 And hunting, but its a long ways back and a wet belt cutting it off from a trail, but a trail is doable.

Video coming in a bit. Then Drone footage maybe in a couple weeks.

[Tacotodd]

WE WANT VIDEO, WE WANT VIDEO. WE WANT VIDEO....