Need a saw with a 28 inch bar. Which one?

[ukwildcat53]

I have a farm in Georgia.  I heat with firewood in the winter but only cut for myself.  Often I will have trees down around the farm that I will remove.  I have a Husqvarna 346XP that I have had since 1999 and love the saw.  I am looking to buy a new saw and would like to have something with a 28 inch bar and would like to stay around $600.  I have checked out the Husqvarna 645 Rancher online and it looks interesting.  The specs say up to 28 inch bar but I wonder if it will really be able to handle it.  Looking for advice and suggestions.  All help will be greatly appreciated.

[jdonovan]

I'd consider a 24" bar. Unless you have a specific need for a 28, you're much more likely to find 24" bars/chains in stock at a local shop than you are to find a 28".

I assume you mean a 465 rancher?  If so that's a 4.29 HP saw. I run a 372, which is a 5.5 HP saw, almost 25% more power, and when I've got all 24" in oak, I'm wanting for more power. I can't imagine 25% less power, and 4 more inches of bar would be a happy combo.

If you want the longer bar so you don't bend over as much, but don't expect, or want to have all 28" in a tree, then I think your expectations can be met.

[Greyhound]

70+cc territory.  Husq 372XP/576XP, Stihl MS461, Jred CS2172, Dolmar/Makita 73/79cc.  If you plan to use it mostly with a 28" bar andchain, then go for the higher cc models (upper 70's into the 80's) rather than the 70-72 cc models.  You can get away with the 28" bar for occasional use on the smaller 70cc ones.  Saw won't be real happy, but it will survive.

Ignore the "recommended" bar length on the Husq website.  It recommends 28" for the 562XP (60cc, 4.7hp)  and the 576XP (74cc, 5.7hp) and the 390XP (88cc, 6.5hp), but somehow recommends 32" for the 576XP AT (74cc, 5.6hp).  That is totally nonsensical. I would never "recommend" a 28" bar on any stock 60cc saw and somehow adding the auto tune to the 576 adds 4 inches to the "recommended" bar length.

Unfortunately, none of the new saws in this size range is in your budget.  So, I would recommend rethinking your needs, rethinking your budget and/or considering a good used saw.

[HolmenTree]

Yup, when you get into 28" b/c territory your no longer into home owner saw class.

[ukwildcat53]

jdonovan you are correct, it is the 465 Rancher I was talking about.  The problem I have is that quite often I encounter trees in the 26 to 36 inch diameter range that I need to remove and with my Husqvarna 346XP and a 20 inch bar and chain it is an impossible job.  Even though Husqvarna says max 20 inch bar for my saw that is really pushing it with a large oak tree.

[4x4American]

Greyhound nailed it.  If it was me, I would be looking for a saw in the upper 70cc class, namely a 460 Stihl, or, if you can find a decent used one, a 660, 066, etc.  I bought an old 066 off a logger for $300 and it's been one of my favorite saws.

[HolmenTree]

Or with a little patience you can run a 1970's Echo 30 cc saw with a 28" b/c

Unfortunately Falleri died 5 years later at a young age 62 in 1979.


  

  

  

  

 

[DDW_OR]

how about the Echo cs=800
36 inch 80.7cc, and between $800 and $900

I have the cs-310, 14 inch 30.5cc, lots of power

[HolmenTree]

DDW_OR,
Good choice with the  800, I believe the Echo saws are still manufactured in USA.

[sandsawmill14]

i run a 28" on my stihl 441 mag and it does fine  it aint no racehorse but has plenty of power to do the job  but again it is above your price point  :-\ but if your trees are under 46" shouldnt have any problems getting by with a 24" bar and its fewer teeth to sharpen ;)

[HolmenTree]

20" b/c is all you need.  Trust me

[square1]

What Holmen Tree said

[Ianab]

20" b/c is all you need.  Trust me

Agreed, but maybe on a saw with a bit more grunt. A good ~60cc saw with a 20" bar is a good combo and can handle the occasional 36" tree just fine. The 20" bar on a 45 cc saw is a bit more than it's really happy with if the bar is buried in hardwood. To happily run a 28" bar and cut with the full bar you want a 70-80cc saw.

I run a 28" on my Dolmar 7900, which was one of Greyhounds suggestions. That's nicely balanced and has plenty of power. But then I've used that on trees up to ~50".

That 465 would cut good with a 20" bar. If you make a habit of cutting big trees, then a bigger saw is justified.

[ladylake]

DDW_OR,
Good choice with the  800, I believe the Echo saws are still manufactured in USA.

  Echo saws are either made in Japan or the USA. As with most saws now days the limiter caps need to be pulled and tuned for your gas, elevation and temp ( either by you or a good dealer).. Also Echo saws really respond to a muff modd, with that done they  run  right with the best of them. I think Echo clogs them up to get by regulations.  Steve

[jdonovan]

The problem I have is that quite often I encounter trees in the 26 to 36 inch diameter range that I need to remove

ok your statements aren't lining up... if you're just cutting a bit of firewood for personal use. You are in Georga, so its not like you have a 6-month long -20 winter that a guy from Maine would be facing. I'd guess your not burning much more than a few cords a year unless you're living in a really drafty ol' house, and trying to keep it at sauna like temps.

A 24" oak should net you 2-ish cords, and a  36" oak should net you 4-5.  So 1-2 24-36" trees a year, is just fine on a 20" bar saw.

[4x4American]

Thanks for that articale HolmenTree, that's a goodun.




Personally I prefer a 2' bar on a 70cc saw.  20" on a 60cc.  And 18" on a 50cc.  Then I have 28, 32, and 36 for the bigger saws (056 mag II, 066, 660)

[ukwildcat53]

jdonovan the problem is not cutting firewood.   I can do that just fine with the Husqvarna 346XP.  The problem is that with the drought conditions we have had here in the last 10 years there are trees going down constantly which I need to remove.  Many of them are very large trees.  My saw is a 50cc saw and I can use a 20" b/c but it is really lacking the power to cut when you are using the full bar in an oak tree larger than 20".  I can still cut from both sides and get it cut but it takes forever to get one cut and when the trunk is 15' long we are talking a massive job.  Maybe I just need something with more power and a 24" bar. 

[ukwildcat53]

The $600 price is not in concrete.  If I need to spend more money to get a really good saw then I will do so.  Whether it is a longer bar or more power I have to do something other than what I am doing now.  From suggestions here I have looked at the Dolmar 7910 and the Echo CS 800.  They both look like really good saws with plenty of power.  Is one saw better than the other? 

[Walt]

I not a Pro as so many here are but on occasion I like to stand on one side and cut with one cut, all from the same side. The last several tree's I fell'd were about 30 inches chest height. I bought a 461 with a 28 inch B/C for felling, haven't regretted the purchase. The saw is a beast. I since added in a 20 inch bar for cutting up fire wood. A longer bar for me adds in a comfort zone that I can't use as an option with a smaller bar, but then again I ain't a pro, but I'm very careful...Regards Walt

[SawTroll]

how about the Echo cs=800
36 inch 80.7cc, and between $800 and $900

I have the cs-310, 14 inch 30.5cc, lots of power

No Echo saws have "lots of power" for their size, that's the main weakness of the brand. Mostly the power rating is shockingly low, which likely is the reason they keep the numbers secret in North America.

The power of the CS-800 (-8002 by now) barely is on level with 70cc saws from the major brands (lower than all current ones), and it is a larger and heavier saw. That doesn't mean that it won't handle a 28" setup though, I'm sure it will.

[sandsawmill14]

the dealer should make more difference than the brand if i were you  the 460 is  great saw but so are most other saws BUT BUY ONE FROM A LOCAL DEALER that KNOWS how to do the service work instead of tractor supply or online or something like that  talk to some of the loggers in the area and see which dealer they recommend

[ladylake]

The $600 price is not in concrete.  If I need to spend more money to get a really good saw then I will do so.  Whether it is a longer bar or more power I have to do something other than what I am doing now.  From suggestions here I have looked at the Dolmar 7910 and the Echo CS 800.  They both look like really good saws with plenty of power.  Is one saw better than the other?

  I have both a 7900 Dolmar and Cs8000 Echo. Real close to the same cutting speed, the Dolmar revs higher but is more finicky, the Echo is lower RPM with lots of grunt that can pull a aggressive chain.  I'd go with the Dolmar as its a couple pounds lighter.  I'd take a 80cc Dolmar over almost all 70 to 85 cc saws.   Some on here only go by paper specs.  Steve

[sandsawmill14]

and the paper specs are like the bdft per hour rating in the sawmill ads  its in there if you can figure how to get it out  ;D
none of the companies say anything false but all tell it a little bigger than it is

[4x4American]

I agree with Sands, find a good dealer and buy that brand of saw.  I have a Stihl 461 and it is a beast, I don't think you'd regret buying that saw.  Just get it with a 28" bar and then have a 20" bar as a spare if you wanted.  I have a friend who keeps a 20" bar on his 460 and loves it.  I know a logger who's 67 years old, and ever since the 046 came out, them are the saws he's been running, with a 20" bar, day in and day out.  He works by himself, skids with a 640 john deere.  He says the 460 balances perfect with a 20" bar

[HolmenTree]

how about the Echo cs=800
36 inch 80.7cc, and between $800 and $900

I have the cs-310, 14 inch 30.5cc, lots of power

No Echo saws have "lots of power" for their size, that's the main weakness of the brand. Mostly the power rating is shockingly low, which likely is the reason they keep the numbers secret in North America.

The power of the CS-800 (-8002 by now) barely is on level with 70cc saws from the major brands (lower than all current ones), and it is a larger and heavier saw. That doesn't mean that it won't handle a 28" setup though, I'm sure it will.

You can't beat Echo's 5 year warranty.
Like ladylake said they really perform with a muffler mod.

[losttheplot]

If you modify the muffler on a new saw you would give the dealer an excuse to void the warranty.

Any warranty is only as good as the guy behind the counter filling out the paperwork.

[sandsawmill14]

their warranty is good 5 yr consumer 1 yr commercial  where most of the others are 1 yr consumer  90 days commercial :-\  only problem is we dont have a dealer that i know of

[sandsawmill14]

and i wouldnt buy a saw i knew needed modified to perform as i wanted it to and as losttheplot said there would go the long warranty

[ladylake]

  With a muff modd and tuning chances are near 0 that you would need the warranty and if needed for anything major just buy a unmodded muffler. We found out how good Huskys warranty is on the new saw coming thread, dealer blamed lean factory tuning on straight gas.  If the limiter caps had been pulled and tuned  right that saw wouldn't have burned up.   Steve

[sandsawmill14]

  With a muff modd and tuning chances are near 0 that you would need the warranty and if needed for anything major just buy a unmodded muffler. We found out how good Huskys warranty is on the new saw coming thread, dealer blamed lean factory tuning on straight gas.  If the limiter caps had been pulled and tuned  right that saw wouldn't have burned up.   Steve

that it true and we found out about the husky warranty first hand >:(   i would really like to know if husky wont honor the warranty or if it is just the dealer :-\

[ladylake]

 
I'd blame it on the dealer, some will turn in the warranty claim + charge the customer blaming it on straight gas.  Steve

[sawguy21]

That is called double dipping, at least two shops I know of lost their franchises over it after customers complained. Echo is a good brand with good performance once properly tuned as Steve points out, any I have run had surprising torque for the size. Their warranty is a sales gimmick though. Any defects due to design, workmanship or materials usually show up within a few hours of use, days at the most. They know the chances of a legitimate claim in the second, third, or fourth year are virtually zilch.

[thecfarm]

I know of someone that had a blazer. They was replacing the boots or something under warranty. As soon as the warranty expired,the replacements was done too.  ;D

[Canadiana]

My early 80's husky 61 (60cc) and 20" b/c takes a few minutes to buck 3 fters. I would be interested to hear how the bigger bars and skip tooth chains do on similar saws

[ReggieT]

Or with a little patience you can run a 1970's Echo 30 cc saw with a 28" b/c

Unfortunately Falleri died 5 years later at a young age 62 in 1979.


  

  

  

  

 

That is a phenomenal feat and article!
Thanks for sharing!

[Backwoods]

It really has to come down to how many trees you are cutting, and what size they are. A pro is almost always going to suggest a bigger saw because that is their context for what they need. A farm owner might say he has to cut "a lot" of wood, because cutting 20 trees per season seems like a lot. To a pro that might be a day's work.

If you are cutting up wood year round then I love the Husqvarna 372. It is 70CCs and can pull a 28 inch chain no problem in all but the toughest and biggest trees and a farm owner doesn't really need much more than that. Technically it is called a pro-series saw, and in my experience it is the best of both worlds. But it is beyond your $600 price range.

If you are doing less work than that, then stay in the 55-65CC class, save $300, and be content with what you have. Husqvarna and Stihl make what they call "rancher" saws in that range, which are well built and reliable and meant exactly for the purposes it sounds like you are asking about. If you know what you are doing you can easily cut a 36 inch tree with a 20 inch bar on a 60CC saw, and only a pro would complain that it seemed slow. (because they are used to running 80 and 90 CCs)

A pro with 80CCs and a 28 inch bar will get it cut down and bucked 1/3 faster than you. If that makes a difference to you, then go pro-series. If not, then get a rancher saw and be happy. If you are undecided in the middle, get the husky 372XP.

[CR888]

Holmens article was the best, he has heaps of old mags/cool info on saws and chain and stuff. While the Echo 8000 is a solid capable saw, IMO there are much better options out there. Going from a 346xp to a Dolmar 7910 with 24" b/c is like going from a Ford pickup to a Kenworth truck! It will make 20"+ wood a fast enjoyable task rather than a hard slow tough slug with a 50cc saw. Dolmar 7910 is a real performer with great power to weight and reliability. It is a saw that will impress you each time you use it like the 346xp but just with more grunt. Cutting big wood with an underpowered saw is very taxing on you and your gear. Other good choices would be a MS461 or 390xp. The 576 is really smooth and capable but about as heavy as a 390 without the HP. The Dolmar 7910 would be first pick though.

[4x4American]

I was just talking with a guy at the concentration yard the other day, he's into saws and gets to shoot the breeze with many loggers, and he mentioned that he hasn't met one person who likes the 576xp..and I said same here, even though I've only known 1-2 people who have had one. 
I have a 346xp, and I find that the AV on it stinks.  I have found that the bigger the saw, the less the vibrations.  I have girly wrists and some form of arthritis from when I had pins put in my fingers from being crushed and to me, I'd rather lug around some extra weight than run that 346.  It's just the ticket to have on my fourwheeler for trailclearing and small jobs, but if I'm doing any bit of cutting I prefer a 70cc saw. 
The best handling saw I have is a 372 husky, but that xtorq engine STINKS!  It's hard to start, even when warm, bogs out alot, and is underpowered.  It's in need of some modding. 
I also have a 461 and that thing is plain torquey and I regard it as one of my favorite saws.  It usually has a 28" bar on it, but sometimes it can be found dressed with a 2' bar.  Those Dolmars are supposedly pretty good but I've never ran one.  I have a dealer not too terribly far away, but a great Stihl dealer half the distance, so I do most of my business with Stihl.  I got the 372 so that I could have the right to complain about much I don't like it, but I ended up liking it, sometimes...well, it's a love/hate relationship...you could have found it for sale on craigslist a time or two  :D   You just can't beat the AV on it IMO, it is awesome.  I got it from Spike60 a few years back. 

[HolmenTree]

Here's a 1979 article on the death of Bruno Falleri the man who felled the 6 foot diameter redwood with a 30cc Echo chainsaw.


 

[HolmenTree]

I see the article  is hard to read.  Hopefully this works better.


  

 

[ukwildcat53]

The tree that started this conversation was a 26" Hickory that fell about a month ago.  Even though I could cut the trunk with my 346XP with 20" b/c it was really difficult to do so.  When you bury the bar in a tree that hard it really bogs it down.  I gave the wood away to someone on Facebook and I told him that I wasn't able to cut up the trunk so he brought his saw with him.  It was a Dolmar 7900 with a 28" bar.  I got to use it and that is a saw.  It cut through the trunk like it was nothing.  At this point I am considering the Dolmar 7910 and the Stihl MS461. 

[nitehawk55]

Not saying 63 is old Wildcat but I'm 61 and I prefer the smaller saws now .
I think a 60cc saw with a 20" bar should be lots of saw for you and a 26" Hickory .

[HolmenTree]

Not saying 63 is old Wildcat but I'm 61 and I prefer the smaller saws now .
I think a 60cc saw with a 20" bar should be lots of saw for you and a 26" Hickory .

I totally agree with you Nitehawk.
A 50cc 346 is a decent power saw in the right hands with the proper tuning and file sharpness.
But nothing replaces displacement. 60cc and over with a 20" b/c could easily buck up that 26" hickory.
Best bang for your money is the budget priced Stihl MS390.....

[nitehawk55]

Lots of good choices in the 60cc saw range out there , Husky 555 , Echo CS 590 ( Saw Troll will jump on that one ), Stihl MS 391 or 362 , Dolmar PS 6100 or Makita .
You don't need to go too big and as you age you'll find lighter is better .

[ukwildcat53]

In the first place it is not a 60cc saw.  It is a 50cc saw. In the second place I wasn't asking for your opinions about whether I was incompetent with a saw because I said it was really taxing on my saw to cut a 26" Hickory.  As I said I could cut it up with my saw but when your bury a 20" b/c on a 50cc saw it is about all it can handle and it is a lot of work.  You can't tell me that a larger displacement saw with a longer b/c wouldn't make the job much easier.  Since I can't get any constructive comments I will just make the decision on my own.  Thanks

[sandsawmill14]

guys remember he was asking what saw for a 28" bar NOT if he was able to use it or if he needed it ;)

wildcat go with the 461 you wont be disappointed  ;D if you think you want the mtronics go with the 441 it will pull the 28" bar fine i know because i run a 28" on mine about 1/2 the time the rest with a 24" bar  mine is old enough it doesnt have mtronics but my next saw will be a 461 so i can tune it the way i want to ;) good luck whatever you decide   and dont let it get under your skin ;)

[rburg]

Husky/jonsered 372/2172, stihl 461, dolmar 7310 all of these would run a 28" bar but would cost more than the $600 price range.

[HolmenTree]

I have a farm in Georgia.  I heat with firewood in the winter but only cut for myself.  Often I will have trees down around the farm that I will remove.  I have a Husqvarna 346XP that I have had since 1999 and love the saw.  I am looking to buy a new saw and would like to have something with a 28 inch bar and would like to stay around $600.  I have checked out the Husqvarna 645 Rancher online and it looks interesting.  The specs say up to 28 inch bar but I wonder if it will really be able to handle it.  Looking for advice and suggestions.  All help will be greatly appreciated.

You have a early edition 346XP -20" which you've been running for 17 years.  Now jumping up to a much larger saw may cause you some disappointment.

I had a 346XP New Edition with extra power and I ended up giving it away to my FIL.
My main saw now is a 62cc 562XP and it has the power to bury a 20" b/c all day in oversized hardwood. As well, a 30 year old Jonsered 630 at 61cc can also do too.

I have a 372XP-24" and a 395Xp-28"-32"-36" and I hardly ever use them in my tree service. But they're there for backup.

The joy of a 80cc saw with 28" b/c gets old fast unless your constantly felling and bucking big wood.

Step up to a 60-70cc saw with a 20" and a 24" b/c for backup.
You'll thank me.

[sandsawmill14]

husky 562  59.8 cc   13.23 lb
husky 372  70 cc      14.3 lb
stihl   362  59 cc      12.35 lb
stihl   441  70 cc      14.6 lb
stihl   461  76 cc      14.6 lb

these numbers are from from actual husky and stihl website specifications  so if they are not right dont blame me ;D :D :D :D
i cant see enough difference in the weight to make any difference especially for a fire wood cutter
the 461 is my pic of the saws listed remember he has a good 20" saw now he wants a 28" saw 
1 question why do alot of guys run 20" bars on 660s and 385/395s if a 362 or 562 would run a 28" bar good  ??? ;)

[nitehawk55]

................................

[HolmenTree]

1 question why do alot of guys run 20" bars on 660s and 385/395s if a 362 or 562 would run a 28" bar good  ??? ;)

Dry weight powerheads mean nothing. The bigger saws weigh quite a bit more when their fueled and oiled up with their bigger tanks.

The OP has been running a little 346XP for 17 years, the way I took it he was wanting the larger upgrade for all his cutting seeing the 346 is probably worn out.

On the subject of 660s and 395s with 20" bars. That's left for the cutters who want production in firewood or medium stem logging and still have  a much longer b/c for backup.
The 562-362 stock can just handle a 28" buried in hardwood, but not "good"  in my opinion.
Saying it's good is like cutting 26" hickory with a 346XP-20" all day :D

[sandsawmill14]

HolmenTree i may have misunderstood myself  ??? if he is replacing the 346 then i agree with you completely 
i understood it was in addition to instead of replacing is why i was defending the big saws if a guy wants a big saw and a small saw a 50 cc and 60 cc wouldnt make much since :D and thats what i was arguing ;) if he is replacing the 346 no way i would go big as a 461 i am only 44 yo and that wouldnt work for me
  i have the 441 and i dont run it cutting wood unless i need i use a 029 or 034 one or the other most of the time but the big saw is always in the truck ;D
i have an 038 with a 18"bar thats fun to cut with till it gets heavy which aint very long :D :D :D

and i hope i havent offended anyone :-[ :-\ ;D

[HolmenTree]

I don't think anyone took offence :D
There's is other site forums that take care of that
A good saw would be a good rebuilt Stihl 046 Magnum. Outfit it with a 20" for lightness and maneuverability, backed up with a 28" b/c. Pretty big upgrade from a 17 year old 346 but may be worth the try.
This pic is a buddy of mine who bought this nice used 046 for $300.


 

[sandsawmill14]

i cut wood for a guy when i was 17-18 yo that had a 044 & 046 i thought they were to small when he brought them out to me but i was sure surprised when i got to cutting with that 046 i loved it  i couldnt believe how a saw that light could have that much power :D :D :D  but at home i was running a 1050 super  ;D so it was 8 or 10 pounds lighter than what i was used to :D :D :D

[DelawhereJoe]

Only saw I have seen new, for near  $600 in the 70-80 cc range is an Efco "6hp" 80cc for around $640 + s&h. If the saying holds true and you pay for what you get...well....

[beauj5]

A 461 with a 28" bar would be perfect and last you a long time.  That being said, you're at $1000+.  If you can find an 044/440, that would be just fine as well. I have 28" bars on my 044s and 440s and it is a perfect set up. Good used ones, if you can find them are $600 give or take. If you're a husky fan, the 372 and 576 pull a 28" bar easy.