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Useful sawmill mods

Started by Bibbyman, July 25, 2004, 08:27:09 AM

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YellowHammer

Yeah, it was mostly dead edge.   :D
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

DR_Buck

Quote from: YellowHammer on February 12, 2020, 07:35:57 AM
It works best with the stationary console, and it's a five minute mod.  Simply weld a narrow plate across the bottom of the dragback arm and you'll have complete control of dragging back the board and putting it where you want it on the table.

The stock dragback drops the board as soon as it clears the cant.  You can see that in @123maxbars excellent video.  This mod keeps hold of the board and allows it to be carried all the way to the end of the travel of the head, so to drop the board on the end of the outfeed table.  It really does work for such as simple thing.



 


I added the dragback fingers and the "shelf" to my LT40 Super Wide a few months ago.   It works so much better than chasing boards off the side of the mill. 
Been there, done that.   Never got caught [/b]
Retired and not doing much anymore and still not getting caught

jovol

Took some inspiration from another FF member and converted my hitch to a pintle ring. Only had it on 2 days, it survived its first 100 miles on the road without an issue. So much easier moving the mill around with the ball mounted forks, don't have to worry about locking down the ball mount latch 

 

 
2017 LT50 wide, stihl ms362 & ms660, echo cs7310, Logrite fetching arch, 2000 New Holland LS180, Ford 6.0, kubota L48, kubota KH-70, Ford F800 8.3

terrifictimbersllc

Sticky fingers for the 70 super dragback at least until the paint dries. Aka Yellowhammer fingertips. Not a spectacular weld job but good for me. Hope to try them out tomorrow.

Take control of them boards. Saw them and pull them.  

DJ Hoover, Terrific Timbers LLC,  Mystic CT Woodmizer Million Board Foot Club member. 2019 LT70 Super Wide 55 Yanmar,  LogRite fetching arch, WM BMS250 sharpener/BMT250 setter.  2001 F350 7.3L PSD 6 spd manual ZF 4x4 Crew Cab Long Bed

Bandmill Bandit

You may want to consider wedging them so the grabbing end of the block will slip between cant and board. Once you get used to them you will raise the head just enough to slip the wedge into the cut without very abruptly stopping the head and causing undesirable maintenance issues. 

When you do the physics energy calculations of stopping the head with even 6 inches of travel BEFORE you hit the very solidly clamped cant, you will understand that the energy those return bars get hit with is more than enough to bend them slightly every time it happens. NOT good! The wedge grind doesn't  cure it totally but drastically reduces the risk.  

I did it with the 1/4" plate piece I welded on mine. Grind that wedge  so it is angled down the bottom side. I ground it sharp and then rounded it slightly with a file. Rarely miss the cut slot now.

Thats actually how I figured out my arm was bent and strength compromised. I have to raise about 7/8"ths to 1" to hit the cut. If that changes something is out of kilter and needs to be checked.    
Skilled Master Sawyer. "Skilled labour don't come cheap. Cheap labour dont come skilled!
2018 F150 FX4, Husqvarna 340, 2 Logright 36 inch cant hooks and a bunch of stuff I built myself

terrifictimbersllc

Mine's got a 9/16 bump up button feature which raises the bottom of the fingers 9/16 above the cant for most of the dragging back. Or is this a concern of hitting the board to be dragged back and wanting to get some lift on it at the beginning?
DJ Hoover, Terrific Timbers LLC,  Mystic CT Woodmizer Million Board Foot Club member. 2019 LT70 Super Wide 55 Yanmar,  LogRite fetching arch, WM BMS250 sharpener/BMT250 setter.  2001 F350 7.3L PSD 6 spd manual ZF 4x4 Crew Cab Long Bed

YellowHammer

I made the Yellowhammer Finger mod to mine maybe the week after I got my new mill, because I felt crippled without it, and I have kept them dead flat in the front becuase I wanted them to be very strong and thick so I could grab big slabs with no bending.  A leading edge angle wouldn't hurt, as long as the bottom is dead flat.  After many hundred tons of wood dragged back, the only damage is that there is no paint on the front anymore.  

So I like to return at normal speed with the fingers pressing against the butt of the board, until just before the balance point where the board tips over, and then let the head coast for a second, which gives the board a chance to pivot and see-saw up on the cant and jack the back end of the board up.  At that point, it's game over, reaccelerate the drag back, hook the board and drag and drop it where you want it.



  

I did bend and crack a few welds on my LT40 dragback as Bandmill B says,  but these arms are strong and they haven't bent yet, because I can still slide my pin arm through them all.  

YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

Larry

What advantage do individual fingers have over the solid drag back?
Larry, making useful and beautiful things out of the most environmental friendly material on the planet.

We need to insure our customers understand the importance of our craft.

Bandmill Bandit

Quote from: terrifictimbersllc on March 30, 2020, 04:55:02 AM
Mine's got a 9/16 bump up button feature which raises the bottom of the fingers 9/16 above the cant for most of the dragging back. Or is this a concern of hitting the board to be dragged back and wanting to get some lift on it at the beginning?
Mostly to make best use of the carry capability of the mod so that it lifts the end of every board instead of just pushing it along. Carrying the board actually gives you a marginally quicker return cycle than pushing it along the cant and reduces the return amp load on the drive motor up to about 40% depending on board size.    
Skilled Master Sawyer. "Skilled labour don't come cheap. Cheap labour dont come skilled!
2018 F150 FX4, Husqvarna 340, 2 Logright 36 inch cant hooks and a bunch of stuff I built myself

YellowHammer

Larry,
The individual fingers are made of thick steel and very strong. They also cover a wider swath so are able to return wider, or out of position or more irregular shaped slabs and boards.  They are standard on the LT70 and I actually like them better than my old LT40 style.  

I especially like them for quartersawing because of their wider coverage, and when I'm RRQS way put toward the idle side wheel, they can return the initial cuts.   I had to weld an extension into my LT40 dragback to get that much side coverage.    
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

terrifictimbersllc

Quote from: terrifictimbersllc on March 29, 2020, 03:50:20 PM
Sticky fingers for the 70 super dragback at least until the paint dries. Aka Yellowhammer fingertips. Not a spectacular weld job but good for me. Hope to try them out tomorrow.

Take control of them boards. Saw them and pull them.  


⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️
Used this yesterday, wow!!!
No longer have the board falling off the cant and banging the mill table. Carry it back as far as you like, do the auto down to the next cut it will fall off as the head starts forward. Or just lower it almost to the table,Start forward, board comes off, and hit the auto down, head gos up to the next cut. If brought back to the balance point, or lowered almost to the table, the board doesn't fall anywhere. What a difference!
DJ Hoover, Terrific Timbers LLC,  Mystic CT Woodmizer Million Board Foot Club member. 2019 LT70 Super Wide 55 Yanmar,  LogRite fetching arch, WM BMS250 sharpener/BMT250 setter.  2001 F350 7.3L PSD 6 spd manual ZF 4x4 Crew Cab Long Bed

YellowHammer

Thats my first 5 star review for the Yellowhammer Fingertips.   8) 8)

I'm glad it worked out.

I agree, once you get to routinely using them, you'll feel crippled if you ever work with a mill that doesn't have them.  Its such a simple mod, no moving parts and it really makes a difference.  

It was kind of interesting, when I bought the LT70 with the different dragback system, the first thing my WM rep said was that I wouldn't be able to use my fingers on the new style dragback.  I was surprised they even knew about them.  However, after using the mill for just a few days, and being more and more frustrated from boards just coming off the cant randomly, and hitting the deck, then having to reach forward and hand tug and pull them, I couldn't take it anymore and had to come up with this design.  Its tough emotionally :D welding on a brand new mill, but it takes the dragback system to a whole different level. 

 
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

terrifictimbersllc

After consulting with you earlier I made them 2" long.  After one use seems to be a good length.

I cut the 4 2x1x1 fingers out of a travel rest pin WM sent that didnt fit the mill.  The fingers have some orange peeking through already.  When I was making them wife asked me what I was doing and I said I was making Yellowhammer Cheesyfingers for my mill.


.

 

On another note I doubt that these dragback fingers would ever bend.   If something has to give it might be the bar that is welded on to the mill that stops the top of the fingers as they hang straight down.
 

  
DJ Hoover, Terrific Timbers LLC,  Mystic CT Woodmizer Million Board Foot Club member. 2019 LT70 Super Wide 55 Yanmar,  LogRite fetching arch, WM BMS250 sharpener/BMT250 setter.  2001 F350 7.3L PSD 6 spd manual ZF 4x4 Crew Cab Long Bed

terrifictimbersllc

Quote from: YellowHammer on March 31, 2020, 08:03:56 AMIts tough emotionally  welding on a brand new mill, but it takes the dragback system to a whole different level.
They're about $35 each if it bothers anyone welding to them, buy a set and put them in a drawer if it makes you feel better.

ps i didnt even consider welding these on the mill, with 6 ECUs.

pss One could also make a heavy duty angle bracket, drill and tap the dragback fingers and mount it with bolts. Or maybe just drill and tap the base of the finger for a bolt, with our without head,  to itself act as a fingertip. 
DJ Hoover, Terrific Timbers LLC,  Mystic CT Woodmizer Million Board Foot Club member. 2019 LT70 Super Wide 55 Yanmar,  LogRite fetching arch, WM BMS250 sharpener/BMT250 setter.  2001 F350 7.3L PSD 6 spd manual ZF 4x4 Crew Cab Long Bed

Bandmill Bandit

If you've looked a little closer and read my notes about my ledge mod, you will have noticed that it evolved from the original post (by yellowhammer I believe) of a 3/4" flat bar welded to the bottom of the vertical drag back plate to a triangular  piece that is about 2 inches wide at the narrow side.

The 3/4" flat bar piece proved the concept was definitely viable and desierable but the reliability left a lot to be desired. The narrow piece was too small to get a good hold on the end of the board to make sure it stuck to the boards somewhere north of 90% of time. I rarely lose a board any direction with the way mine is set up and I am very sure you would all be happy with that mod at about 1.5" width minimum.  

This picture shows it quite good.


 
Skilled Master Sawyer. "Skilled labour don't come cheap. Cheap labour dont come skilled!
2018 F150 FX4, Husqvarna 340, 2 Logright 36 inch cant hooks and a bunch of stuff I built myself

terrifictimbersllc

This is the first I'm noticing about slipping the board return into the kerf.   Very interesting I see the advantage. Searched a bit didnt find it.  Is this a matter of getting it in then lifting up the board before beginning the return? How to avoid banging the cant or having the return arm riding on the cant? I take it I could cut an angle on the top of the fingertips I welded on,to achieve this. thanks
DJ Hoover, Terrific Timbers LLC,  Mystic CT Woodmizer Million Board Foot Club member. 2019 LT70 Super Wide 55 Yanmar,  LogRite fetching arch, WM BMS250 sharpener/BMT250 setter.  2001 F350 7.3L PSD 6 spd manual ZF 4x4 Crew Cab Long Bed

Bandmill Bandit

Quote from: terrifictimbersllc on March 31, 2020, 02:54:10 PM
This is the first I'm noticing about slipping the board return into the kerf.   Very interesting I see the advantage. Searched a bit didnt find it.  Is this a matter of getting it in then lifting up the board before beginning the return? How to avoid banging the cant or having the return arm riding on the cant? I take it I could cut an angle on the top of the fingertips I welded on,to achieve this. thanks
To be honest I dont know if anyone else does it that way but I do for sure.

Cut the angle on the underside of the "sticky shelf" tabs so the top side remains flat, Then figure out what your measurement that you need to raise the head to hit the cut to catch the board is. Once you get use to it, you'll catch the board and then raise the head a 1/4 inch on the fly to finish the drag back. Just takes 1 up tap on the head up/Dn lever to get off the drag back off the cant.
Skilled Master Sawyer. "Skilled labour don't come cheap. Cheap labour dont come skilled!
2018 F150 FX4, Husqvarna 340, 2 Logright 36 inch cant hooks and a bunch of stuff I built myself

terrifictimbersllc

My mill has a "bump up"button which raises the head by a programmable amount in connection with the use of the board return. So raising it to reliably hit the kerf ought to be easy. 

However because the "shelf" would be higher than the bottom of the existing finger tips, cutting off the wedge might result in needing to lower rather than raise. Have to look at it closer. 

I could just manually put a board up on the existing fingers to see what it would be like to return it that way.  The head return is engine hydraulic powered so not sure how much advantage there will be but who knows. 
DJ Hoover, Terrific Timbers LLC,  Mystic CT Woodmizer Million Board Foot Club member. 2019 LT70 Super Wide 55 Yanmar,  LogRite fetching arch, WM BMS250 sharpener/BMT250 setter.  2001 F350 7.3L PSD 6 spd manual ZF 4x4 Crew Cab Long Bed

Bandmill Bandit

Quote from: terrifictimbersllc on March 31, 2020, 04:36:40 PMHowever because the "shelf" would be higher than the bottom of the existing finger tips, cutting off the wedge might result in needing to lower rather than raise. Have to look at it closer.
Make sure the bottom of the shelf tab is EXACTLY the same position as the original bottom of the arms are and make sure the tabs are no more than a 1/4" material. I measured mine and I used 3/16"ths material and ground the angle and then rounded the edge.

As a rule I am pretty sure all Wood Mizer board return systems hang 1" lower than the bottom of the blade factory setting when in use.
Skilled Master Sawyer. "Skilled labour don't come cheap. Cheap labour dont come skilled!
2018 F150 FX4, Husqvarna 340, 2 Logright 36 inch cant hooks and a bunch of stuff I built myself

caveman

Most of these mods have already been done but these are the ones that I find useful.  The drag back shelf (YH), the VRO tank diesel drip, the caution tape, and eventually a hydraulics anywhere addition are the ones that I have found to be most useful.

I sawed over 1000 bf of butt log longleaf pine today and yesterday with one blade and probably less than one quart of diesel as blade lube.  My blade stayed pitch free and cut flat.  I was able to drag back three boards at a time.  I did not bang my head a single time today so I am confidant that my IQ remains above 50.  

The one thing that still frustrates me is not having hydraulics everywhere.  This is a small inconvenience but it does slow the sawing process when at the bottom of the cant.



 
This is a Kasco 7° after over 1000 bf of 1" or thinner longleaf pine.  I know that they say diesel ruins the B57's but a good board or two will buy replacements and gummed up blades will result in much consternation.
 
The VRO tank from an old OMC outboard mounted on top of the diesel tank when cotton picker spindle lube is not cutting it.
 
The valve to turn on or shut off the diesel drip (about one drop per 5-6" of blade movement while in the  cut).
 
The caution tape to remind the moron not to bang his head on the mill.
 
The board drag back mod.  The shelf was welded even with the bottom of the factory drag back.  This one is narrower than my first attempt and it works much better.  I'll paint it when it is covid 19 safe to go to TSC and get new Kubota orange.  Thank you YH.
 
These LL pines will get us started in the a.m.
 There is enough sap and sawdust that you cannot critique my stick welding (out of shielding gas).  I did grind a bevel on it like Bandmill Bandit has.
Caveman

Brooks1984

I tacked a shelf to the board return 2 months ago to try it. Today I added a little triangle piece to square it off and finished welded it then painted it.


 

 

47sawdust

caveman.I've used bar oil/diesel blade lube for 10 years and have no belt deterioration.
Mick
1997 WM Lt30 1999 WM twin blade edger Kubota L3750 Tajfun winchGood Health Work is my hobby.

caveman

The way I see it is that the belts are relatively inexpensive.  If you cannot keep your blades clean, saw flat lumber and have to spend and inordinate amount of time cleaning your blades prior to sharpening then you are p1$$1ng up a rope.  spitting into the wind.

The board drag back is a time saver, regardless if sawing solo or with a helper.
Caveman

Outlaw

With all the extra time on my hands, thought it was time to get the hydraulic log roller and clamp upgrades done.  I have a machinist buddy that is a genius that was willing to give me a hand. My TK 1600 came with a manual log turner so I had a good start.  This is what we came up with.  
 

 
TK 1600, old logging equipment,  sthil chainsaws

Crusarius

whats the first picture? is that just a clamp? I would love more detail on the full mod.

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