300 pegs to make - what would you do?

[JBailey]

Timberframers!  Thanks in advance for considering my problem and offering any advice.

Here is my situation:  
As part of a great room framing plan I have, I need approximately 300 1"x12" pegs.  My buddy, Steve Chappell at Fox Maple, told me "black locust makes the best pegs", so when a neighbor took down a mature black locust, I jumped on the opportunity to acquire the log for free.  As result, I now have 10 or so 12" long billets, each 20 to 24" in diameter.  Grain is nice and straight, w/ only a few knots - its good wood.

I have a big shop with lots of power tools, including resaw capabilities, but I would like to use hand tools when they make sense.  

So my solutions is as follows:

• seal ends with Anchorseal
• quarter the billets with splitting axe
• rive the quarters into 2x2" sections with a froe
• rip the 2x2" into 1x1"s with bandsaw or table saw
• turn the 1x1"s into 1" diameter pegs on lathe (shave horse and draw knife seems like a lot of work and the lathe probably results in a better product?)
• store in water?  (Pegs aren't needed for probably 12 months, if I am lucky)

I really appreciate any input.

-James

[Brian_Weekley]

With a shaving horse, it's probably easier and faster than you think.  Hand drawn pegs are the better product compared to a perfectly round pegs made on a lathe.  The edges on an octagon shaped peg work much better when driven in to round holes because they cut into the sides.  I find they have a little more give when draw-boring.

[timberframe]

Do you have a shaper in your power tool collection? I run blanks through the shaper with a dowel making head, once on each side and cut them to length.  

B

[Tom King]

Google found this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j1Az_wrxn78

[Brad_bb]

Why not just rive out all your blanks?  Why go 2x2?  I'd just rive them all out.  Do some test pieces to determine the actual size blank you need to rive to arrive at a 1" finished peg.  I think you will want a little bigger than 1".

The purpose of keeping blanks wet(in a tub of water- I use rubbermaid totes), is so that they stay soft and pliable for easy draw knifing.  If you do white oak pegs, and you don't keep them soaking, they are not fun to draw knife.  You cannot re-hydrate pegs for the most part, especially white oak.  Once you're done draw knifing them, they can dry out.  

For line to line pegs, I've been draw knifing a point on one end, and then driving the peg through a steel die to size it.  I wait until the pegs are dry before driving them through the die.  This way, they've already shrunk and they will stay the size of your sizing die.

If you're driving an oak peg (or a locust peg) into oak timbers, the timbers will not compress if you have octagon pegs.  The fit will likely be too tight.  This is why I size them through a die.  

You don't need to anchor seal them if you're going to keep them in a tub of water.  You really should rive your blanks as soon as possible from the rounds so they don't start drying, and then put those blanks in the water.

[Al_Smith]

I've never made a peg but I have made axe and cant hook  handles .I use a 4" power planer to rough them in and draw knife to finish .Obviously you would need something other than your hand to hold the piece .Otherwise a power planer could prune the fingers in a heart beat which is not the desired results .

[Hilltop366]

I made something similar to the pipe die in the first video but used a air chisel with a cup on the end to push the pegs through.

Possible ideas?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uV2wW9Y8-bc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-iAEYGk_AvQ

[JBailey]

Do you have a shaper in your power tool collection? I run blanks through the shaper with a dowel making head, once on each side and cut them to length.  

B

I absolutely do sir, a big Martin T-23 - 3ph 7.5 hp and 2000 lbs of Bavarian precision (you can tell I love this machine ;D).  

That is an excellent idea.  The Martin would make short work of that pile and the resulting pegs will be nuts on precise.

So my process would be:

• quarter the logs w. splitting axe
• Rive down all the way to 1x1" blanks as @Brad_bb suggests 
• shape them on the Martin

I liked the die method in the first video by @Hilltop366 but where would I get a die like that? The log splitter is another good approach but I don't own one.

There are some very very creative folks here.  Thanks much!
James

[btulloh]

Some of those methods like using dies go back a long way. Way before shapers and such. 

Riven wood has natural strength. You do have select your material carefully. Plus you end up with a lot of kindling. Sometimes those methods are much more pleasant than listening to a big shaper. After a while you even find out the old ways can be more efficient. 

You can make a die simply by drilling a piece of 1/4" plate. Drill a set of graduated holes. You can work your way down going from larger to finished size. It's a great way to make few dowels that match your furniture wood too. 

Nice shaper!  Good luck with your pegs and your timber frame. Keep us up to date. 

[timberframe]

Some of those methods like using dies go back a long way. Way before shapers and such.

Riven wood has natural strength. You do have select your material carefully. Plus you end up with a lot of kindling. Sometimes those methods are much more pleasant than listening to a big shaper. After a while you even find out the old ways can be more efficient.

You can make a die simply by drilling a piece of 1/4" plate. Drill a set of graduated holes. You can work your way down going from larger to finished size. It's a great way to make few dowels that match your furniture wood too.

Nice shaper!  Good luck with your pegs and your timber frame. Keep us up to date.

I may be a big shaper nerd, but I must say, it's hard to beat the sound of a well tuned machine with sharp HSS knives making fluffy shavings at 6500RPM.  Especially with the uniform feed rate of a power feeder....  
I do understand what you mean though.  When I do it, I just mill full length hoards, RIP them into blanks and feed them sometimes 10 feet at a time.  Set up a stop block on the mitre saw and they pile up in a hurry.

[timberframe]

Do you have a shaper in your power tool collection? I run blanks through the shaper with a dowel making head, once on each side and cut them to length.  

B

I absolutely do sir, a big Martin T-23 - 3ph 7.5 hp and 2000 lbs of Bavarian precision (you can tell I love this machine ;D).  

That is an excellent idea.  The Martin would make short work of that pile and the resulting pegs will be nuts on precise.

So my process would be:

• quarter the logs w. splitting axe
• Rive down all the way to 1x1" blanks as @Brad_bb suggests
• shape them on the Martin

I liked the die method in the first video by @Hilltop366 but where would I get a die like that? The log splitter is another good approach but I don't own one.

There are some very very creative folks here.  Thanks much!
James

Nice machine! I had a head made to hold carbide tips since I use oak a lot.  You could use a set of HSS knives in a limiter head and they'd last the job I bet.

[btulloh]

Some of those methods like using dies go back a long way. Way before shapers and such.

Riven wood has natural strength. You do have select your material carefully. Plus you end up with a lot of kindling. Sometimes those methods are much more pleasant than listening to a big shaper. After a while you even find out the old ways can be more efficient.

You can make a die simply by drilling a piece of 1/4" plate. Drill a set of graduated holes. You can work your way down going from larger to finished size. It's a great way to make few dowels that match your furniture wood too.

Nice shaper!  Good luck with your pegs and your timber frame. Keep us up to date.

I may be a big shaper nerd, but I must say, it's hard to beat the sound of a well tuned machine with sharp HSS knives making fluffy shavings at 6500RPM.  Especially with the uniform feed rate of a power feeder....  
I do understand what you mean though.  When I do it, I just mill full length hoards, RIP them into blanks and feed them sometimes 10 feet at a time.  Set up a stop block on the mitre saw and they pile up in a hurry.

That is also true. Especially for 300 pegs. And a power feed. They all have their benefits. It's good to have options. 

The op said he already cut his stock into 12" rounds or billets. That changes the game a little. 

The old school methods work better when you start making your pegs early and knock out some now and then when you're waiting for glue to dry or something. If your frame is ready to go up, I like the power feed. 

Any way you get three hundred pegs ready to use is a good way. 

[btulloh]

Making a die and having it under your bench is handy thing when you need a few bubinga pegs out of offcuts or a half dozen of something. 

[Dave Shepard]

I can't recommend any other way than to rive them. A shaving horse is easiest, but you can clamp them to the end of a timber,  too.

Power froeing by lantern light.



Straight grain red oak makes great pegs, but is susceptible to bugs. I layout a 2" grid and pop them with the power froe. Then I use a regular froe and eyeball the 1" split. I needed some pegs for a scarf joint I'm putting together tomorrow, so I busted up a bucket full of blanks. Phase one sill assembly is in a week or two, so I need to make a bunch more. They should get split a couple of weeks ahead of the raising. For long term storage, good rounds should be stored submerged in water. 

[rjwoelk]

Dave that is what I did also, running the processor and watch for nice straight splitting wood .
I then made 1x1 inch blanks on the table saw, set the blade to 45 and trim the corners, till they fit a 1 inch hole snug.  Now it I just had a big pencil sharpener.  :D

[CJ]

  James, for what it's worth and my two cents, what I did was using 3X5" maple stock in four foot lengths, I set up my table saw and moved the fence to the dimensions that the pegs I was making (27/32" for 7/8" hole) and ran the stock through rather than making them slightly larger and then repeating the process to bring them down to the finished size. Takes too long.
 Once I had all the stock sized to the peg diameter I chopped them into 12" lengths. I calculated what the dimensions would be for an octagon and again moved my fence over and angled my table saw blade to 45 degrees. I ran a test piece through to check on the accuracy of my cuts and sides, and once that was established I began doing all 100 pegs. It didn't take that long really, especially if your blade is sharp and you have a good saw. 
 I then got my WorkMate table out and placed each peg into the clamp to hone the ends to a point using a spoke shave. All in all, it took less than two days to complete all 100 from the original stock. Hope this helps somewhat. Cheers!


 



 

[Dave Shepard]

I made the four pegs I needed for my scarf joint today. 1"x14". Took about ten minutes. You should be able to make a peg a minute with a shave horse. I don't have a shave horse. 

[JBailey]

The op said he already cut his stock into 12" rounds or billets. That changes the game a little.

Yes, my black locust was basically delivered after the log was cut into 12" to 36" long pieces - it was not felled with the objective of using it for anything, but for getting rid of the "waste" as easily as possible.  So I cut everything to a uniform 12" length because that closely matches my desired end length.  It is a nice piece of locust and I was thrilled to get it for free, but I didn't have much of an option on the starting state.

So I don't have the advantage of using 8' long stock, ripping it to 1 1/32 square and then power feeding thru the shaper.  

I did start to rive the 12" long billets and they are coming out OK, especially if they are quartered first with splitting axe. They are not as good as @Dave Shepard 's red oak (which look great).   With these pieces, the die method would work great - if I had those punches.  The shave horse method of course would work.  And I'm not sure the shaper method would produce a good product as I'm not sure how it would follow the fence.

These little details are part of the fun and challenge of timber framing!  

[Don P]

A nipple of 1" pipe sharpened on the end with a grinder or even a belt sander with the bottom end of the pipe screwed into a floor flange that is screwed to a block of wood with a 1"+ hole in it would probably make a quick and dirty pipe die like in the video above. If the flange can take the pounding ???

[JBailey]

So here is what I ended up doing:

(1) quarter the logs w/ splitting axe
(2) rive into 3x3" or bigger pieces w/ froe
(3) resaw these blanks thru the bandsaw at 1 3/32"
(4) shape on the shaper w/ a custom knife profile (see my rough drawing below)

I just couldn't get the riving to give me 1x1" blanks that I could use on the shaper.  Probably cause I lack this skill. But I think I captured most of the 'straight grain' by riving into 3x3" or bigger pieces with the froe and the band saw did the rest of the work with very precise cuts.  The black locust, still green, machines really well - beautiful tight grain, smooth as baby's butt right off the shaper.  And the resulting pegs are all nearly 100% consistent and very strong (black locust is some strong stuff).

Here is my molding knife profile.  My custom grinder, Tim Yunger, at Custommoldingknives, made a few tweets to this design and did the knives for me in black nitride steel.  Note that this is an oval design, not a circle, as I wanted the sidess that are against the grain to have some 'breathing room' so they don't wedge and split the timbers. The sides with the grain are a tad over-sized to make up.  I drove a few test pieces into a 1" test hole (using the Wood Owl auger bit) - great fit with a bit of turpentine as lube.

Thanks very much to everyone that added a comment to help.  I have learned and continue to learn a ton from this forum.  Hopefully someone learned something from my question and my process as well.



 

[timberframe]

Very cool, would love to see the knives and head and shaper settup.  Got any pics of the end product?

Thanks for following up.

[Dave Shepard]

When riving,  you have to split the billet as close to in half as possible. If you split unevenly, the split will run to the thinner side. 

[Heartwood]

One issue with machine made pins versus riven is that if you drawbore, the pins should be tapered. That's hard to do unless you shave the machine-made pins afterwards by hand. Northcott's drawbore pins are made on a lathe that also tapers them (1/32" under to 1/32" over). The taper is necessary because each drawbore will vary slightly, so the amount you have to drive it will vary until the joint is tight. I just participated in a project where the pins were straight and the holes drawbored and they were a bear to drive. The pins had to be resawn to a smaller diameter to work, and then they didn't fill the hole on either side. If you just drill the mortise and tenon with the joint together and no drawbore then straight pins are OK.
If you are making straight octagonal pins I find that ripping square blanks 1/16" under the hole diameter works best, then when putting on the 45-degree corners the distance from corner-to-corner will be about 1/32" over the hole diameter–just right.
My 2 cents. Lots of different opinions on this topic!

[JBailey]

One issue with machine made pins versus riven is that if you drawbore, the pins should be tapered. That's hard to do unless you shave the machine-made pins afterwards by hand. Northcott's drawbore pins are made on a lathe that also tapers them (1/32" under to 1/32" over). The taper is necessary because each drawbore will vary slightly, so the amount you have to drive it will vary until the joint is tight. I just participated in a project where the pins were straight and the holes drawbored and they were a bear to drive. The pins had to be resawn to a smaller diameter to work, and then they didn't fill the hole on either side. If you just drill the mortise and tenon with the joint together and no drawbore then straight pins are OK.
If you are making straight octagonal pins I find that ripping square blanks 1/16" under the hole diameter works best, then when putting on the 45-degree corners the distance from corner-to-corner will be about 1/32" over the hole diameter–just right.
My 2 cents. Lots of different opinions on this topic!

Heartwood-
My timber framing mentor, Steve Chappell, said he doesn't drawbore, so I'm not going to either.  I drawbore on my furniture mortise and tenons, including doors, but I'm not going to on my timber frame.  So I think these straight pins will be OK.  I plan on lubing them with turpentine and will have my block plane handy (as it always is).  I'm glad a bunch of different views/opinions came up in this thread.  

When riving,  you have to split the billet as close to in half as possible. If you split unevenly, the split will run to the thinner side.

Dave, yes, I learned this on the riving.  I had a great time riving the bigger pieces, but when it came down to the final blanks, I just couldn't get a product I was happy with.  I couldn't get anything close to the beautiful blanks you got in your pictures.  So I dropped back to the band saw for a bail out.  Eyes wide open that I don't have all the skills I need.

Very cool, would love to see the knives and head and shaper settup.  Got any pics of the end product?

Thanks for following up.

Timberframe, the shaper is still setup with the knives on the head as I only have a dozen final pegs thru it.  Its out at my farm, where I'm doing this work on weekends.  I will try and remember to take a picture of the setup and the output.

 

[Dave Shepard]

I made a quick video of shaving a peg last week. I might get the chance to make one showing riving, if I get another oak log. I borrowed a froe, so I don't have to use the power froe, although it is very fast. 

Making pegs with a shaving horse. - YouTube