OldJarheads Milling Thread...

[ncsawyer]

Looks like a good job.  I would certainly want my tractor there to help out moving logs, slabs, stacks of lumber etc. 

If they didn't have one, mine would show up on site along with an "up charge" on the bill for "additional equipment". 

[Magicman]

My bands can get pretty well caked in a few hours if the wood is wet

Any buildup whatsoever on the blade is unacceptable. 

[OlJarhead]

My bands can get pretty well caked in a few hours if the wood is wet

Any buildup whatsoever on the blade is unacceptable.

Hence my changing them as soon as I see it's going on....not sure what else I can do.  Even pouring the water to them doesn't stop it.

[OlJarhead]

Latest potential customer asked for references (first time for that) so I gave her one and he gave me a 'rave review' (her words).  She asked if I could start Monday provided she gets the laborers (I've asked for 2 -- 1 at a bare min).

With luck I'll start Monday and get this one done in 5 days (doubt it will be less but who knows).

[Peter Drouin]

As you feed in the pile and the logs get farther away , Do you put down two lines of slabs from the logs to the loader?

[OlJarhead]

Yes.  If there are no runners under the logs (my preference but land owners who've never had a mobile mill before don't often do that) then I put slab cuts down to roll the logs onto.  In the case of this job I should have two laborers and I will have them do it and keep the logs rolled up to the mill at all times.  I don't want to waste time walking half a mile for the next log! ha!

Got word of another potential customer just now.   one that will be looking at the spring which is just right ;)  I would love to line up work a few months out :D

[Magicman]

Hence my changing them as soon as I see it's going on....not sure what else I can do.  Even pouring the water to them doesn't stop it.

I have never sawn your log species, but I would be changing/trying something.  When my blades get dull they are still clean.  No buildup.

[WV Sawmiller]

Hence my changing them as soon as I see it's going on....not sure what else I can do.  Even pouring the water to them doesn't stop it.

I have never sawn your log species, but I would be changing/trying something.  When my blades get dull they are still clean.  No buildup.

MM,

    I have a lot of sap buildup when sawing white pine. I replaced 3 blades completely coated in sap even though I was running the lube with dish soap (Wal Mart brand I think) in it. I took these crusty blades and put them on the mill when cutting ash, squirted ATF along a foot or so of the blade between the roller guides and starting cutting. The bands cut like new and cleaned up the blades 95% I'd bet. And I have historically had sap build up on my blades when cutting ash. I am going to be more diligent about the ATF on the blade for a while to confirm this is the reason the sap is gone. I haven't tried the diesel wipe yet but may in the future if I continue to get build up.

Eric,

   You may try the ATF if you aren't and see if you get similar results on your species.

[OlJarhead]

I'm scratching my head here a little.  It seems the bands don't last THAT long...on my LT10 they said 200 board feet or so and I think I heard somewhere from WM that the larger/longer bands can go 400-500bf or more....but I can't imagine milling all day on one band.

Only way I've milled in the 400-500bf/hr range is when milling big logs (24" dia se 16+ footers) and most of the time I'm milling in the 10-12" range (even 8-10") which in my mind dulls the band faster.  Why?  More bark.  On a 10" log you're in the bark for a shorter length of time (milling faster) but doing 3 or 4 logs in an hour (vs one)...so hitting more dirt (despite the debarker) than milling big wood.

I'm wondering if this isn't why I'm getting a half day (4 hours) out of my BiMetals (maybe I've done a little longer but not much)....and often closer to two hours on my Double Hards.

[Ljohnsaw]

I'm scratching my head here a little.  It seems the bands don't last THAT long...on my LT10 they said 200 board feet or so and I think I heard somewhere from WM that the larger/longer bands can go 400-500bf or more....but I can't imagine milling all day on one band.

Shoot, I cut pine for 3 or 4 days on a band...  But I'm cutting form or scaffolding boards on my manual mill so quality is not a prime concern! :D  And that was probably 800-1000 BF, so about 250BF a DAY. :D  I've cut some white and red pine (both fresh and dead) and haven't seen (knock on wood) any buildup without lube.  Same with the Incense Cedar.

[Bandmill Bandit]

If all I cut was 600 BF per sharp cycle I'd be putting a fresh band on every 1.5 to 2 hours. AND at times in some conditions that does happen. In a normal day of 10 ish hours I end up with the 3rd band going on to finish that last log about 50% of the time and that band often makes less than 6 passes to finish said log so it starts the next day. My average day is most often 3200 BF +/- 400.

FYI bimetals let me cut with the speed dial set between Noon and 1PM ish. The double hards run at 11 AM to noonish.

On a LT 70 you couldn't even get an hour out of a single band and there is no way you could get the BF/Hr WM says the 70 is capable of because you'd be changing bands a 1/3 of the time 

BUT if that were the case I would sell the mill and forget it. The biggest cost in running the mill is new bands and sharpening.
       
I can say keeping the de-barker in good working condition is a major factor in this regard. I did operate about 3 hours once where I didnt notice that the alignment had been screwed up by landing the debarker on the top of a log so that the groove was getting cut above the band path and doing no good at all and that cost me a band cycle at least. 

[OlJarhead]

Perhaps the lower powered mills abuse the blades more?  Though I think Bandits is a 28G so only a little more than my 26.

I usually run about 2-3 hours on a double hard and 4 with a bimetal.

Luckily my bimetals arrive back today! :D  8) so if I do this job next week I'll be set with 10 of them   That's 5 days of milling for me.

[Carson-saws]

OlJarhead....it is really great hearing about and watching the success and progression of you skills and knowledge.  Very impressive Sir.  Looks like quite a stack-o-logs you have there. That ever present pitch problem.  I personally do not have a good answer but I will say ...be it right or wrong...I have not cut nearly as much "pitch providing" logs as you have and are, but I do not understand how quickly you change the blade.  Do you have trouble on your head tracks with the build up? I thought there was a mixture that could be used in your water feed that helped to lessen the build up.  Either way...keep up the great work and keep havin fun.

[OlJarhead]

I change the bands as soon as I think they are getting dull.  Usually I see a rougher cut or a little wavy cutting.

I run the DH's around 12 o'clock in pin and fire unless they are wide logs then I slow down as much as it takes to keep a straight cut.

[Bandmill Bandit]

One thing I need to mention to be fair is that I have been cutting a lot more large dimension lumber this year.

I just finished a nice job that gave a yield of 3628 BF BUT just over 2900 of that was 2 5/8, 3 1/8, 3 5/8, and 4 1/8 on the simple set settings by 8, 10, 12 wide and 8' 10' 12' long.

This factor is significant because it means I probably make 30 to 40 % fewer passes per log.

Erik it sound like you and I cut very much alike BUT you are making more passes per log most of time I think.
 

[OlJarhead]

I'm thinking so ;)  I cut a lot of 1" stuff for customers and a lot of dimensional (1/8 over) or on the evens....so more cuts per log.

Got my resharp bands back tonight   8) I think it was a 3 day turn around too! 

[Brucer]

In theory dirt on the inboard side of the bark doesn't matter because the tooth blows the bark out ahead of it (same as when bucking dirty logs with a chainsaw). But if the "dirt" is thick, or muddy (or frozen!!) there will be more dulling than usual on the outboard side.

Check the height of your debarker very carefully. The groove it cuts is wider than the kerf, and you want the bottom of the kerf to be barely above the bottom of the debarker groove. When the kerf is high in the groove the blade has to cut through more bark at the top of the cut. This increases the chances of encountering dirt.

I always check the height of my debarker by stopping the saw part way through the cut and examining where the saw kerf is in the debarker groove.

Woods like Douglas-Fir, Western Larch, and Ponderosa Pine have very thick grooved bark (at least in the larger diameters) and this can really trap dirt.

The debarker usually won't cut beneath the surface of sound wood, so if the bark is off the log and the log is dirty, you're going to wear the blade quickly. I keep a steel wire brush (welding brush or barbecue cleaning brush) handy for cleaning dirt of bare log surfaces.

Dirt on the end of the log can do you in very quickly. If you can't avoid it, get the blade in there quickly. I use the wire brush on log ends as well.

Finally, if the far end of the log is cut at an angle and is dirty, at some point your blade will be cutting into the surface and dulling your blade.

If I'm faced with a lot of dirty log ends and I've got extra length, I'll chainsaw half an inch or so off each end of the logs.

I also notice a lot of small diameter logs in your photos. Not nearly as many BF per saw pass through the bark.

[OlJarhead]

Re: small logs. 

Yup.  My biggest job to date was 9000 board feet out of 8 to 10 inch diameter logs (mostly fir) and this next one is about 75% small diameter stuff that was burned in the fire....I can mill a 500bf fir or pine without worrying about the band and keep going afterwards...but might only get 7 or 8 50bf logs on a DH band or perhaps a dozen on a BiMetal.

[OlJarhead]

Well shoot!  I was all set to start my last big job of the year this Friday (day after Thanksgiving) however it looks like it will likely be put off till spring now as we're expecting up to a foot of snow on Friday.  The drive in is a bit treacherous and I could still pull the mill in and wait for the snow to clear but I'd hate to pull it in and then have to sit on it until the the weather clears and perhaps have to chain up the mill and truck in order to get out.  At times the road in is very narrow and windy with a steel drop on one side.  Basically a one lane dirt mountain road you don't want to be on if it's snowing heavily.  Forecast says:

Wednesday Night
Snow, mainly after 4am. Low around 29. South wind around 7 mph. Chance of precipitation is 80%. New snow accumulation of less than one inch possible.
Thanksgiving Day
Snow. The snow could be heavy at times. High near 36. Southeast wind 9 to 13 mph. Chance of precipitation is 100%. New snow accumulation of 3 to 7 inches possible.
Thursday Night
Snow. Low around 31. Chance of precipitation is 100%. New snow accumulation of 2 to 4 inches possible.
Friday
Rain and snow. High near 39. Chance of precipitation is 80%. New snow accumulation of less than a half inch possible.
Friday Night
Snow likely. Cloudy, with a low around 31. Chance of precipitation is 70%.
Saturday
A 40 percent chance of snow showers. Cloudy, with a high near 36.
Saturday Night
A 40 percent chance of snow showers. Cloudy, with a low around 22.
Sunday
A 30 percent chance of snow showers. Mostly cloudy, with a high near 33.
Sunday Night
Snow showers likely. Cloudy, with a low around 28. Chance of precipitation is 60%.
Monday
A 30 percent chance of snow showers. Mostly cloudy, with a high near 34.

[Magicman]

Your call, but sometimes it best to know when to throw in the towel.  You can't push a rope.   :-\

[OlJarhead]

I've milled in the snow many times though I prefer not to.  However, for me, the real issue is getting in and out of the site safely and I think this is one of those cases where discretion is the better part of valor ;)

I've suggested to the customer we wait until the sky's clear or the spring.  If, however, they plow the road and keep it clear and the site is cleared up a bit we can mill as long as the weather isn't too nasty.

Coldest I've milled in is 10F and while I don't mind that too much I only prefer to do so if the sun is shining ;)  If it's in the 20's and snowing it's just not worth it and safety can become a real issue.

[Kbeitz]

Your call, but sometimes it best to know when to throw in the towel.  You can't push a rope.   :-\

It's been done...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oZostccJHcg

[scleigh]

Not worth it, stay home and enjoy the holiday

[4x4American]

Does chaining up the mill help it track better?  I've never really thought to chain up a trailer.  Just curious!

[OlJarhead]

Does chaining up the mill help it track better?  I've never really thought to chain up a trailer.  Just curious!

It can.  However I've trailered my old mill (the SM-LT10) down my 3 mile driveway in the ice and snow and it stayed behind the truck just fine though it was a lot lighter than the LT40HD. 
https://youtu.be/aRIQnHLiwII
This is a vid of the last section of our road and the section that generally most worries me because it's long and steep and if you are going to slide it's going to be here if anywhere...and sliding here means damage!  The video doesn't do justice to just how steep this is either but trust me when I say it's very steep....you even get to see the SMLT10 in the mirror (just barely) as it tracks down behind the truck.

Oh and I'm running 4 ice chains on the truck so it aint going no where ;)