So, what do you all think about the practice I'm about to describe to you. We just caught on to it going on here.
Short Question, What do you think about a company, not knowing yet if it is a company practice, or just an unethical marketing employee that registers for The Forestry Forum as An Average Joe, to ask a question, but then we find is also registered as another user so he can answer said question with a little knowledge and a link to a product they recommend. This person was not clever enough in his deception to use generic emails. but used domain names belonging to the company as email addresses. The posts were designed to deceive you, and use that deception to advertise.
To be clear, this company is NOT or never has been one of our sponsors. It is a large, online multifaceted power equipment company.
So, what do you think? A fair thing to do to the forum and its members or to say the least, underhanded?
I am known for my gentle disposition. Is it possible to figurative castrate these types?
Send him to be gasified.
It's not fair to the forum, it's owner, the forum sponsors, or the members. That should call for banning both of the user names, and calling out the firm name. What other tricks would a person / firm like that come up with? If it's an individual employee doing it unknown to the firm, that's the firm's problem. And I'm not even from Texas.
Norm
Need to let his firm know of that practice and see if they will own up to knowingly letting this happen. And I for sure would want to know the name of the company so I would be careful about having any dealings with them. Andy
First they should be banished, second we should know who they are and/or at least what product they recommended.
I hate deception!
I want to add that I have made several purchases based on information I got here, some from sponsors and some non sponsors but I like to believe that the recommendations were sincere. If a business wants to recommend their own product that's fine as long as we know who's making the recommendation.
Off to Disney land for that one. :snowball: 8)
Good catch Jeff. That is why you are so clever at fixing up these contests.. ;D
I am pretty new to the FF I don't think it's fair at all I would like to know the name of this company so I don't buy form them :snowball:
unfortunately I think in this digital age, it is a gowing practice, having said that though, I do think it is unscrupulous to the hilt!! I have heard of firms paying their employees to sign on to various sites online and write reviews about their producs, as well as firms paying web saavy individuals to do the same about their products, makes it had to know who or what you can believe. As for this forum, I think it is one of the best run sites I have been on, here on the WWW. Thanks Jeff for looking our for all our interests!
Not illegal
Caveat Emptor...whether it is a hard good or intellectual information
I doubt Jeff will openly name the company
I'll bet there are 20 more just like him/her on these boards that you haven't caught. It's a fairly common practice.
Quote from: nmurph on December 18, 2013, 02:40:56 PM
Not illegal
Caveat Emptor...whether it is a hard good or intellectual information
I doubt Jeff will openly name the company
Many things in this world are not illegal. But that don't excuse them same things from being held up to a moral and ethical scrutiny.
Quote from: nmurph on December 18, 2013, 02:40:56 PM
I doubt Jeff will openly name the company
Don't bet on it. I've called the company and went up the food chain as far as they would let me to begin with. I want to know if this is a company practice or if this is one employee's dumb idea of a good marketing idea. I've heard there are actually bots out there that will do this automatically. Register, and post, and answer its own posts via another registration.
Quote from: kevin19343 on December 18, 2013, 03:05:15 PM
I'll bet there are 20 more just like him/her on these boards that you haven't caught. It's a fairly common practice.
Maybe, but I doubt it. One of the reasons we are so adamant on making sure new registrations are real people. We have quite a process we go through checking I.P. addresses against all posts ever made on the forum.
So far from my contact I got "Well, I don't think he was really trying to deceive anyone". HUH?? And then, "Well, we'll have to look into is, and maybe we can get back with you". Again. HUH?? I am going to give them the benefit of the doubt, and give them a chance to get back with me and explain themselves before I make any final decisions on how to handle this. For now, that user(s) has been banned.
It's definitely deceptive. The person and both of his identities should be booted out for good. If you would rather not name the company, then direct us to the thread involved, (if it's still up), and essentially the person will be naming himself. I'd say it's more important for the members to know who he represents than for him to remain anonymous.
This is too slimy and sneaky a way to promote a product. Gives a bad vibe and I wouldn't want to do business with anyone that operates that way.
Thanks also for running this by the members to see how we feel. First class all the way Jeff. :)
Quote from: Jeff on December 18, 2013, 03:07:30 PM...that user(s) has been banned.
Ban the user and block the IP address.
You've registered your disdain for the practice. It's up to the company bosses to do the rest. If it was a rogue sales weasel trying to drum up business, then the company will take care of it.
Was anything the user said incorrect or derogatory toward a competitor?
I feel its only fair to POST the company name and let the members choose for themselves whether to do buisness with or not. There "product" should be able to stand on it's own merit without deception.
Deception.. yes.. :snowball: >:(
If it's not a company policy, I feel like an executive from the company should come forward and apologize to YOU for the attempt to decieve YOUR forum and members.
Sincerely
John
As a few have said,I trust the reviews and past experience of others. Trust is the key word here.
I think it is deceptive and underhanded. If I owned the forum I would ban/block them.
Uplander
Wow....I've never heard of anything like this and really didn't imagine somebody would do something like this.
I'd like to know who they are......if its OK.
Testing Testing, nope, wasn't me
It would be easy enough to post in such a manner as to better disguise the fact that the posts are in "collusion" with one another for a purpose. No question it's deceptive. On the county fair midways they call these planted people "shills". That's exactly what they are here too.
As a way of moving this forward for the protection of the Forum and its members, I might suggest that the members and certainly the administrators be alerted for any post recommending a product with a link to another site. While cumbersome, I am not sure how often these recomendations occur without further support and corroboration via posts by other members, which is really where our faith in the opinions posted here is generated. I think it's a serious enough misuse of the Forum that we may need to discuss it further as administrators and bring a policy to the readership. Could be a new addition to the Forum rules.
I know that I am fairly new but one of the big reasons that I finally decided to stop lurking on the forum was the way that the forum was run and it was a nice break from a lot of the nonsense that goes on day to day with the world we live in now.
As I remember reading many times from members that were welcoming newbies...."pull up a stump" (I edited out all the stuff about grits :D) If this type of activity was going on within a group around the campfire I would probably place my stump into the fire and walk away from the group. I don't ever want to feel like I have to throw my forest forum stump into the digital campfire. I don't agree with the behavior and I agree that when discovered should be dealt with appropriately.
My boss would say I have waaaay too much time on my hands. Their boss should say that too. If they are that big, maybe they should be a sponsor and come out of the garage on this. More the merrier!
I do not like deception and or people that practice it. You know what to do Jeff. Tim
I would be willing to bet that the company does not have a specific marketing practice suggesting such deceptive behavior. Frankly, if the company does have such a "policy" then it likely would be considered "deceptive marketing", "false advertisement", and several other terms used in different jurisdictions and both the state and feds would be most interested, (large fines). Most larg(ish) companies actually have within their "policy handbooks" or "sales training manuals", that company employees are barred from taking such deceptive actions and will face termination if caught doing so.
Frankly, many companies just use this language as a shield to protect them from potential liability, while turning a blind eye to deceptive practices of their sales force. Others, really do try to keep their sales force from doing such deceptive practices.
Likely, you are dealing with an unscrupulous salesperson/sales manager who is trying to either meet his sales target, or to increase his paycheck. I worked for a Fortune 500 company while going to law school as an Inspector/salesman. I sold a large commercial job at one point, only to have the branch manager decide to cut back on the materials used, so that he could make his "materials" records meet company guidelines. When this deception was discovered, the manager was fired and the company went back out to the customer and did extensive retroactive applications to try and correct the potential problem.
At least in that case, it really was just one unscrupulous person that was trying to make his "numbers" look better.
If I were in your position Jeff, I would certainly run this issue up the corporate ladder. I would also ask to be kept apprised of any investigation they conduct, and the results thereof. You can mention to them that their reputation has been damaged by these deceptive practices, and you want to make sure they have the opportunity to correct such issues.
The more I think about it.......this company should have came forward right off the bat and ask Jeff if they could be a sponsor on the Forum.
This could have been a win, win for both sides.
I have no idea who this praticular "average Joe " is but the name rings a bell .
Several years ago on two sites I visit a similar thing happened with a persona touting the virtues of a Husqvarna clone .At first as an interested party and finally as a distributer from Australia .
When he showed up at the second forum being a rather forward fellow I quized him about it at which he took great offensive .He wasn't welcomed with open arms so to speak .Left, went away only to return spewing the same nonsense 6 months later.
More on this .It's not uncommon on some forums for posters to use several identities and often under full knowledge of the site administrators maybe even the admins themselves .Why they do this I haven't a clue .I guess it's a game or something .
it is stated right in our rules and in our registration agreement that this is not allowed.
It pretty much says it on all forums Jeff which doesn't stop certain admins from allowing it .The worst offender is one whom is having difficulites with the forum as I type in case you didn't know it .
You run a clean game I've always said that but some few don't .
I believe I read those posts, but I do not remember what the product was. I at first thought it was an advertisement but when I read the first reply, it was like a thank you you're right that is a great thing. Made me think it was ok. Quite deceptive .
Jeff can you show the first few post without putting the product in the post?
I'll eventually, one way or another. I want to give the company a chance to get back with me first. The post today had the smell of spam to it. When shown to me, that led me back to October where the real deception occurred and got past all of us.
To the woodshed with them. aaarrrggghhh.
Is there a pirate in the woodshed? :D Maybe they need to walk a plank.
If it was a company testing the waters with their product prior to becoming a sponsor sure, they would have to see it it's worth their time and money. But be upfront with it.
They tried the act of deception, lock them out. :snowball:
When I was looking for a new saw, or when family mentions a used saw they are looking at. Where do I search first? Right here, for the honest real world facts :P
Seems like lie's and deception are a way of life for some these days. Wonder where they get their example from? ;) Nice to know that this deception was caught and somethings being done about it.
Oh the tangled webs we weave, when first we practice to deceive. (Old Saying.)
Very recently over 80 FF members entrusted me with thousands of their hard earned $$$. That is a responsibility taken very seriously. They did it because the FF and it's members are regarded as being honest and their integrity is beyond reproach. Any individual or company that seeks to undermine this solid integrity base has no right here and their presence is a dis-service to the FF and it's members.
It is the old snake oil sales trick.
This company's opinion of the FF forum is u are bunch of rubes.
Banning them, doesn't mean they will not come through more circuitous route.
I would divulge the company, so we know their true opinion of the customers they seek to sell to.
JJ
Quote from: Magicman on December 18, 2013, 07:50:53 PM
Very recently over 80 FF members entrusted me with thousands of their hard earned $$$. That is a responsibility taken very seriously. They did it because the FF and it's members are regarded as being honest and their integrity is beyond reproach. Any individual or company that seeks to undermine this solid integrity base has no right here and their presence is a dis-service to the FF and it's members.
Well said! smiley_clapping
Quote from: Magicman on December 18, 2013, 07:50:53 PM
Very recently over 80 FF members entrusted me with thousands of their hard earned $$$. That is a responsibility taken very seriously. They did it because the FF and it's members are regarded as being honest and their integrity is beyond reproach. Any individual or company that seeks to undermine this solid integrity base has no right here and their presence is a dis-service to the FF and it's members.
well said MM and cant wait to here the name thanks jeff
I am only gonna say it once GET A ROPE
After lurking and reading the FF for some time now, it seemed like a lot of good people with a lot of knowledge they were willing to share, so I decided to jump in, and while registering I thought what is up with the 20 questions ??? Now I have a better understanding!
I hate liars. fudd-smiley spam_
I don't get on here to talk with a salesman. I read and ask here to hear it from the folks who have used a product and say yay or nay. Then I go talk with a salesman.
I think what gets me is this person is basically trying to steal from you, Jeff. I feel it would be the exact same as me going on your for sale section and sneaking around your back and not giving you your percentage.
Allan
I follow half a dozen boards almost every day, fishing, news, travel. I don't think I've bumped into a more honest group of folks on the Forestry Forum. They don't necessarily agree on everything, (Ford vs Chevy,) but they are completely civil and never trying to hard sell anything. What you described certainly sounds like deception. You don't expect that from your friends.
My trust in a person or comp. rep is not hard to get, but so easy to lose, once you lose my trust I will never do business willingly with that person ever again if I can. that being said, deception is high on the list of getting yourself on the wrong side of my good side. I don't know what comp we are talking about, but can they still makes things right if it was one of the reps that was out of line ??? Should we take the compagnie down over that, guess we need to know the reason behind the action before banning all for life. I was always willing to give the runner a chance, but he best not step on my toes while going around the bases.... :snowball: :snowball:
Such practices, if tolerated, says loads about the culture at that company. If deceptive practices here, then how can they be trusted with anything else they tell you? I'm willing to listen to a salesman (or woman), as well as to real users here on the forum, as long as they identify who they are and who they are representing. Even whether or not they are a sponsor.
The forum should be zero-tolerant. One bad apple brings into question the integrity of the whole. And that's not the high standards set by the ordinary good people that make up this forum.
I'm all for forgiveness, but to date none has been requested. The company either needs to issue an apology to Jeff and the forum, with their name attached, or my vote is to get out the plank, rope, tar and feathers, thumbscrews, ... (whatever that looks like electronically).
Might I recommend what we used to call The Scandal Sheet or Wall of Shame or the like and at the very least list the posters that rate it. This list would be easily seen by all members. If you have high confidence that the company that employs such people at least knowingly tolerates such behavior, they go up there too.
GRRRRRRr >:(
There are some forums where the members will indeed point out who is a bad flea bay seller ,bad supplier etc .Likewise they tell the good ones too .
Keep in mind those I'm talking about are either privately supported or member supported and don't have to play the politics of catering to any praticular sponser .
Maybe we need a link to a list of fraudulent usernames, websites and or company's?
Deception is the root to all evil. Who needs it? Not me. bg
The user name of the person(s) was sort of a red flag. ;)
Its been going on a long time:
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave,
When first we practice to deceive."
Sir Walter Scott
1808
Quote from: SawyerBrown on December 18, 2013, 08:59:26 PM
Such practices, if tolerated, says loads about the culture at that company. If deceptive practices here, then how can they be trusted with anything else they tell you? I'm willing to listen to a salesman (or woman), as well as to real users here on the forum, as long as they identify who they are and who they are representing. Even whether or not they are a sponsor.
The forum should be zero-tolerant. One bad apple brings into question the integrity of the whole. And that's not the high standards set by the ordinary good people that make up this forum.
I'm all for forgiveness, but to date none has been requested. The company either needs to issue an apology to Jeff and the forum, with their name attached, or my vote is to get out the plank, rope, tar and feathers, thumbscrews, ... (whatever that looks like electronically).
Ha! I hear you! I was on another forum once and made it two years before getting the boot [temporarily]. The guy that owned it ran it like a boot camp. But, after all said and done, I had to respect the man. He was of the old school, if you wanted to learn the trade and learn it correctly, no foolishness! And no lies.
OK - now I understand which post you were referring to. I participated in that thread and noticed the link.
That 'family' of companies (I assume they are related due to the similarities) is very aggressive in their web marketing. I once visited to look at a log splitter and found their 'discount' based off an inflated price. Then I got pop-up ads from them for months on Yahoo!, FaceBook, etc.
That said, there is an established practice in many industry magazines for a company to submit 'reader' questions along with a technical answer that are published as if the magazine brought them together.
I agree that this is misleading, but it is not without precedent. Since these guys went beyond expressing a legitimate opinion, or starting a discussion on a topic of interest to actually promoting a (non-sponsor) site, you have every right to shut them down.
Philbert
I agree with Allan...that's basically stealing. Not only from you, but all of the members. I'm about fed up with being tolerant of stuff like that.
John
I agree with what has been stated (public lynching) and I'll be checking back to find out who I won't be doing business with in the future!
I fell right into the last one, too! Thought someone wanted a users opinion, then later wondered why they hadn't come back on. I did note that it was only their third post, but it didn't bother me enough to check their earlier posts. Great catch, Jeff.
Got it ---Quote from: Magicman on December 17, 2013, 09:18:05 pm
Welcome to the Forestry Forum, yardpro. I wonder about your forum name??
Interesting eh?/end quotes
Good catch indeed.Nice detective work .
Actually, I appreciate this guy posting like this on the forum. It took some minor league detective work to figure out the company involved, and now I know what kind of operators they are. I might have accidently heard of them at a later time and become a customer. It is better to be forewarned as to the kind of operation they run. I guess the powers to be will get around to naming this company "direct"ly.
Mark
:o Holy mackeral .I Googled it and believe you me it would take a gaggle of Philidelphia lawyers to get to the bottom of that can of worms .
That company changes names about a zillion times as to who owns what and who is who .Wow!
I haven't looked at forum software in years but I suspect it is still very easy to block a domain. Since the company owns that domain themselves, block them. If it is a rogue employee sooner or later the company will be asking why they are blocked. More likely this was a deliberate move by the company though.
This type of game playing is more common than many realize and there are often over a dozen users with multiple identities to support themselves on a fair sized forum. Funny thing, these users are almost always businesses or unofficial backyard businesses doing a ton of buying and selling.
I have even seen user's various ID's arguing with each other so the user can shoot down weak arguments against their point of view while dodging tough issues. Once administrators and moderators focus on someone it is usually very easy to locate their various ID's, these multi ID people aren't nearly as clever as they think they are.
Hu
But I would suspect that the sheer number of them would be mind boggling. :o
The sheer number is mind boggling who just go multi to play games .Some of them are amusing though especially when they forget which name they are posting under .
Deception and lying are two things that really light my fuse. Im sure i speak for a lot of us on here Jeff saying were sure you will do the right thing!
I have been making more and more purchases online, as shopping choices are pretty slim in my neck of da woods. Sad ta say, I almost made a purchase from these people recently. :embarassed: Not going ta make that mistake again.
I cannot say anything that has not already been said and agree with most all of the comments. I joined this forum, feeling that there is a lot of knowledgable gentlemen (and ladies) that I can possibly relate to and maybe I could give some advice on things as well. So far, I still feel that this is a great forum to be a part of. Having said that, in order to maintain the high level of integrity of the site, I personally feel that the people who are doing this need to be "let go". This is just my opinion, and I want to thank you for keeping up with this. I do not see how you do it. Thanks again for having a great forum.
Oh, no worries, they were let go. G O N E. Still no reply from said company. I found the supposed facebook page of the person that says that he is the founder and president and sent him a message. I doubt if I here back. His friends list is just a circle of people from multiple domains of this business. Each type of equipment has its own direct website. If you check the friends, about the only friends they have are back in this circle. Looks like the pages were all created just for marketing.
QuoteMr. Hoch, I am the owner of The Forestry Forum. Since calling your company yesterday didn't really get me any answers to my questions, and it was rather apparent that the supervisor "Todd" I talked to didn't seem to be to concerned, I figured I would look you up (If you even actually take care of this facebook page, as it looks to simply be a circle of your various web face associates.) Anyhow, you might want to take a look at this topic. It explains my problem with your company's marketing tactics, and it also shows what could have been your potential customer base thinks of them as well. https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php/topic,71307.0.html
I told "Todd" I was giving your company a chance to make this right with our members by getting back with me. So far no one has. I'm hoping this practice is via an over zealous marketing employee, and not something you personally condone or even know about. Deceiving the tens of thousands of Forestry Forum members and guests, and through that, basically stealing advertising from my company is not something I appreciate.
Jeffrey Brokaw Owner and Founder of The Forestry Forum
Just guessing, I didnt see the link on the other thread, and if mentioned in this thread I missed it, but is it Power Equipment Direct of Bolingbrook, IL ? That operates Chainsawsdirect . xxx. ?
Thanks Jeff. I got suckered into that thread with the intent of helping a fellow ff member with some needed info/opinions. My time is too valuable to become part of somebodys unscrupulous marketing ploy. Very astute Magicman. Thanks again Jeff. I will try to be more wary, but not so as to withold, in any way I could, helping a fellow with a legitimate want/need.
mark
Sad. Thank you for your vigilance Jeff. I do not like the practice and had hoped it the operation of a lone deceptive sales person. Sounds though like the apple may not fall too far from the corporate tree.
every one is doing an awesome job many many thanks to jeff
To me this situation is very underhanded, though it might not be illegal but as Jeff said, violates the Forum rules. I see they were banned so thats were I would start. Next I would work with the corporate office explaining that the Forestry Forum is an independent forum that several major companies (Woodmizer, Baker, Timberking, Logrite, etc.) direct customers to for finding fair and honest reviews. By having an employee, whether they knew it or not, conduct this scheme, does not go inline with the purpose of the forum and that the forum does not associate with companies that do.
Jeff, as always, you run a tight clean ship and everyone benefits from it. Whatever you decide to do, its still your ship, and I'm still gonna ask for permission to come aboard. (I like sailing so boating refernces are easiest for me!)
I'd show both names the door and block all IP addys, emails etc too.
I do recall that thread and thought it odd that the poster did not reply to where he was located so others could give him better advice. Magic Man - great observation on his username. And Jeff, thank you for going the extra mile to be certain everything is above board here. I recall when I joined, there was some comment about if you are here to sell things we should not try to do so - this was a site about information and sharing experience. That impressed me at the time, but rings true even more now.
Perhaps it is good to keep this and the other thread as a reminder of how some people would abuse the trust of others.
Thanks everyone for making this one of the best places on the internet!
Deception will bite you in the hiney. Honesty and integrity is what this forum is about. I too have a supply company and have never mentioned the name or directed anybody to the web site. I have shared my experience of a few products on some of the threads but never for financial gain, just insight. I am not a sponsor and it would not be ethical to "pound my chest".
Quote from: kilgrosh on December 20, 2013, 02:06:04 PMNext I would work with the corporate office explaining that the Forestry Forum is an independent forum that . . . direct customers to for finding fair and honest reviews.
They don't care. All they care about is sales $$$. They care as much about Jeff's forum rules as an average telemarketer cares about a 'do-not-call' list.
If they smell potential customers here they will be back in some form.
Philbert
I've given them a reasonable amount of time to contact me back. I sent this topic to the email of record they used here as well as wrote a note to the president and founder whose facebook page I found. He probably never checks it, as it looks like it was created only for marketing. His friends list are just other people associated with different faces of the company.
So, so you all know for future reference, this is the company. I'm not making any recommendations on how you mike interact with them if you ever happen to come upon one of thier websites or products for sale.
Power Equipment Direct They have many web fronts depending on what type of equipment you are looking for such as chainsawsdirect.com, chippersdirect.com, tillersdirect.com and on and on. I know what I will do if I am ever in need of a product that I can not get from one of our sponsors and come upon them in the future. See ya!
Good to know. ;)
Thanks Jeff for the update, I too will stay clear of said companies. bg
I wonder if chimney direct is an affiliate? It's in NY state. I have dealt with them and even called to talk to a voice, which I believe was the owner. I bought brushes and rods for flu cleaning and they were top quality items, not from China. The rods were from England and the brushes USA. Same gear any chimney sweep around here would have. I had my stuff in less than 10 days by US mail.
I have no idea what transpired here, or even if they are related (web domain registry).
I do for a fact know that the exact same webpage (chimneydirect.com) comes up under a different domain name. But lots of times domains change and you are redirected as well.
Their related websites are listed on their main site. I will not be giving you a link. :D
Well you got it fereted out .In a way though I kind of wish it was the guy pedaling fake Husqvarnas .I had about as much fun with him as I do with the great oil debate . 8)
Well that part don't matter about the link, was just wondering. I get the hint though. ;D
Anyway I got my stuff and cleaned 3 flues. :)
Al, are you still fighting them fellows over Amzoil? ;D
I just use good Stihl or Husqvarna oil. Must be good, same saw since 2007 and cut hundreds of acres with it, 74 acres this year.
Would be interesting how many of our FF readers ferret out this company in other sites they visit, where likely the very same thing is happening and the owners/mods don't know it.... yet!
Thank's boss darn sure gona keep my eye open for them guy's :snowball:
Take it to the bank that the people trying to get over on websites are also people you would have grief with as a customer. I might think it was fun to bury them in price checks and inquiries but messing with people like this is like trying to pick up a "log" by the clean end, just ain't possible!
Hu
Quote from: SwampDonkey on December 20, 2013, 05:19:18 PM
Al, are you still fighting them fellows over Amzoil? ;D
I just use good Stihl or Husqvarna oil. Must be good, same saw since 2007 and cut hundreds of acres with it, 74 acres this year.
'taint a fight Swampish .Good natured debate . .It's my self appointed job and I take it seriously .
Tell now old great brusher of the frozen tundra how exactly did you cut 74 acres of brush using just oil . ???
Quote from: Al_Smith on December 20, 2013, 05:57:05 PM
Tell now old great brusher of the frozen tundra how exactly did you cut 74 acres of brush using just oil . ???
By mixing it in the gas jug and filling the saw tank for starters. :D
I got one for ya. How do you get 27 litres in a 20 litre gas jug? I couldn't figure it out neither. So I never went back to that filling station again. :D
:D
Condensed gas maybe? I would assume a litre is the same as our liter being 1.056 quarts .
Geeze it was a pint's a pound the world round then some metric guy threw a wrench in the works .
How in the world will they ever figure out 100 to 1 oil ratio with litres .This could be bad .
100ml oil to 10 litre fuel but you gnu that ;)
Look at it on yelp. Little good to say about it.
Oh, man, this company had to be based in Illinois .... As if we weren't already the biggest deadbeat state in the union, with 2 former governors in prison, ongoing Chicago politics, etc etc etc.
We do have GOOD people in Illinois, too ...
Thanks, Jeff for catching this. It is unlikely that I would have done business with them, but this practice strikes at the very heart of the forum, Trust. I lurked for years and finally joined when I bought an OWB. I consider that trust as one of the hallmarks of this forum, and the main thing that keeps me comming back. I do not have all the super firewood equipment or logging experience that some here have, but I know I can turn here for honest, honestly given advice on almost any subject.
Once again, Thank You Jeff, for your work in keeping this forum just what makes it great.
Quote from: Onthesauk on December 20, 2013, 08:16:56 PM
Look at it on yelp. Little good to say about it.
What is 'yelp' ??
It is like a forum where they rate businesses, restaurants and so on. Check it out. Really handy when traveling to see where you want to stop to eat and so on. ;D
Quote from: mesquite buckeye on December 20, 2013, 09:19:24 PM
It is like a forum where they rate businesses, restaurants and so on. Check it out. Really handy when traveling to see where you want to stop to eat and so on. ;D
Yelp, you are right.
Yelp?
I thought that was what a dog did when it got tangled in an electric fence.
There is a word for what they did: 'fraud'.
Fry them (pun intended).
This kind of deception is widespread. One of the rare times I sat down to watch tv, an ad came on for web.com. They offer to build you a free facebook page and then populate it with glowing but completely made up comments about your Company in an effort to deceive the general public. and people wonder why nobody trusts anyone anymore.
I don't post often, and tend to mind my own business but thanks Jeff. your behavior is why this is the ONLY site I.m on
Joe
Bury the hatchet and invite them to the Pig Roast. :)
Quote from: POSTONLT40HD on December 21, 2013, 09:33:11 AMBury the hatchet and invite them to the Pig Roast. :)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/24625/DSCN0079.JPG)
Sweet Dreams David
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/20011/DSCN0017S.JPG)
You can bury yours, but I ain't burying mine. :D
That's a good idear. :) Maybe right up there with donating the poston contact information to tellamarketersareus 8)
LOL That's just mean. But DanG funny.
POSTONLT40HDdirect :) You see we saw 8)
Glad this was detected and dealt with. Great work Jeff. To bad there is not some justice that could follow. Like prosecution for fraud or maybe banned from the internet somehow. At least banned from their current provider or something. In Calif we have a Department of Consumer Affairs. Businesses get their licenses there. We can file a complaint against their business license and action is taken by Consumer Affairs. It gets some attention.
As has been mentioned by many, one of the reasons we love this site is the professionalism and integrity that is shown by the administrators. Keep up the good work.
Quote from: Jeff on December 21, 2013, 10:11:21 AM
That's a good idear. :) Maybe right up there with donating the poston contact information to tellamarketersareus 8)
And after I wax your T-BIRD and clean out the Coy pond, and re-work your food plots......what else do you need
done Boss? smiley_chop
I'm not overly computer literate by any means, most of what was discussed here went over my head other than fact it was a little dirty under handed on how it was done, I don't really know what spammers are let alone much of the rest either, but the question I have is this, is there a list of those doing underhanded things or the spammers that try to post on here, that is kept up to date for some of us less computer literate to see and browse their business and names of, I got this name, but how about others? Maybe its not even an ethical question to ask, if this is somehow a wrong way of looking at it, please advise me and explain why, maybe there is a list here somewhere of all the spammers that have been banned, but I don't know where it would be located to view the list of names?
Maybe inviting them to the pig roast with a big old name tag on would be a good idea. I doubt they'd make it to dinner. :D :D
Good catch boss. I absolutely despise Astro Turfing, although it's a far too common practice. When I used to work for a large regional telecom organization, every campaign season I'd have to put in temporary data lines for some of the campaign headquarters. They'd all be staffed with a dozen or so eager interns, waiting for the link to be up, so they could start polluting cyberspace.
Speaking of Astro Turf, somebody up thread mentioned a site that rates eating establishments. For a fee, there are outfits that will arrange very favorable reviews. Be afraid. Be very afraid.
Quote from: Randy88 on December 21, 2013, 08:05:34 PM
I'm not overly computer literate by any means, most of what was discussed here went over my head other than fact it was a little dirty under handed on how it was done, I don't really know what spammers are let alone much of the rest either, but the question I have is this, is there a list of those doing underhanded things or the spammers that try to post on here, that is kept up to date for some of us less computer literate to see and browse their business and names of, I got this name, but how about others? Maybe its not even an ethical question to ask, if this is somehow a wrong way of looking at it, please advise me and explain why, maybe there is a list here somewhere of all the spammers that have been banned, but I don't know where it would be located to view the list of names?
I'm not positive but it would probably open this site to legal action if they posted a blacklist of people not to patronize. Ridiculous in my viewpoint but the stupidity of tort law is beyond belief.
No help from the providers supplying their hosting either in my experience. I had dead bang proof of criminal acts by the owners of two separate internet forums, neither provider cared in the least. I went to plan "B", drove one site so far underground that they ceased to exist for all practical purposes, I suspect did dry up and blow away, and forced the other site to do far more censoring than I ever did which was the objection to my site by nonusers that had stumbled across it in a search or something. That site died too. The owner had a choice between that site and his day business since he was licensed by the federal government and they frown on felonies by people with some licenses. If someone on the net gets too annoying there are usually ways to make life miserable for them but it isn't worth the bother unless they launch major attacks.
Hu
Quote from: goose63 on December 18, 2013, 02:38:47 PM
I am pretty new to the FF I don't think it's fair at all I would like to know the name of this company so I don't buy form them :snowball:
Tell us what company this is.
Hay, goose63, are you really 963 years old? :D :D
Quote from: John R on December 30, 2013, 12:21:32 PM
Quote from: goose63 on December 18, 2013, 02:38:47 PM
I am pretty new to the FF I don't think it's fair at all I would like to know the name of this company so I don't buy form them :snowball:
Tell us what company this is.
Hay, goose63, are you really 963 years old? :D :D some times i feel like it but am 63 dont know the 9 got there or how to change it say_what
thanks jeff, i just seen this thread and i too value the opinions obtained from the family... good work.
late to the party but I'm glad you caught this Jeff. This is outright lying and ban worthy in my books. Could be the work of one employee who took the initiative or could be higher up. We may never know. Regardless, I think most members here will avoid doing business with this company BECAUSE someone connected with them was deceitful. Happens in many places (I never trust online restaurant reviews for example).
Thanks Jeff
I let this fall throught the cracks . Jeff i'm glad you posted the Name of the company, I've been on thier site before, Neither bad or good, just looking.
Sawer Brown : I was going to make a comment on where they were from, but I see you beat me to it, maybe it time to move north! Lazerdan
Not enough likes on facebook?
Don't have enough twitter followers?
Why not just buy them:
http://www.pressherald.com/news/Global_market_grows_for_fake_clicks_.html
Our State Department even spent $630K buying fake facebook fans ::)
UN-believable. All used and supported by our government. Why am I not terribly surprised.
The internet is filled with this kind of deception. I doubt any sort of blacklisting would have any effect, the company would likely just start operating under a different name.
There's a whole science behind deceiving people to con them out of money online. Look up "social engineering" and "phishing".
Quote from: Mark Wentzell on January 07, 2014, 06:20:42 PM
There's a whole science behind deceiving people to con them out of money online. Look up "social engineering" and "phishing".
I love phishing through da ice this time of da year, especially for Bluegills and Crappy.