In the picture below, there's an example of slanted, intermediate beams supporting the rafters. I also saw an example of this in a building at the Hancock Shaker Village. Are these just considered slanted queen posts or is there another name for these?
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/26833/Queen_Post.JPG)
The are not called slanted but Canted queen posts and they are holding up a principal purlin plate.
The small timber joining the queen post above the two queen post braces is called a strut.
Jim Rogers
I use the term canted purlin post and reserve queen post for truss work, although the queen post in a truss isn't really a post, it just looks like one. The language I use is not logical, even though I pretend to be.
The vertical queen posts take up less floor space compared to the canted queen/purlin posts and struts. Do the canted queen posts offer any advantage? If so, under what circumstances would you choose to use them?
Thanks, Brian
Brian, in the mid-Atlantic the canted purlin post is very common in barn construction. The apex is left clear and hay tracks can be installed, loose hay is piled in and there is no issue with floor space. The structural advantage is that the roof load can be distributed over multiple points, a common technique in the pre-portland cement foundation era.
Amenable for the hay track makes perfect sense. You wouldn't have the horizontal beams between the vertical queen posts to contend with...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=84GfcCP1u5o
Quote from: Brian_Weekley on March 19, 2015, 09:50:51 AM
Do the canted queen posts offer any advantage?
With a canted queen post the top tenon enters the purlin plate with a standard straight mortise and tenon joint. The queen post bottom tenon is cut on the angle, and enters the top of the tie beam with a tenon mortise some what similar to a brace.
You would use this when you want a principal purlin plate to support your rafters.
Jim Rogers
These are canted purlin posts, and support a principle purlin. A plate has plumb sides, and a purlin is tipped into the roof plane. The canted posts eliminated the need for a straining beam, the beam in compression that would connect two vertical posts, which would want to tip inwards from the roof load. The hay track comes in about 1860, so this helps date the building.
Technically I think queen posts and king posts (and even prince posts) are reserved for truss descriptions. Don't ask about earl or duke or princess posts....
Thanks for the clarification, Will.
Jim Rogers
I had to go back and check that the Glossary you have so excellently provided on this site agreed with me, Jim. All these terms are used so interchangeably now that perhaps the distinction is moot.
Quote from: Brian_Weekley on March 19, 2015, 10:30:03 AM
Amenable for the hay track makes perfect sense. You wouldn't have the horizontal beams between the vertical queen posts to contend with...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=84GfcCP1u5o
The youtube that came up after this one is really interesting. It shows how the trolly actually works and the different types of hooks/claws that were used over the years.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UE8rHwD9eQ0
Yes, they are cool. I actually have a trolley, the hay hooks, and rafter brackets. Picked them up on Craigslist a few years ago. My plan is to restore it and install in my barn--not for hay, but just as a novelty. Maybe as a fun ride for the intrepid!
This is a very common Barn design in the mid-west too. Here in IL for sure.
Quote from: Jim_Rogers on March 19, 2015, 11:03:19 AM
Quote from: Brian_Weekley on March 19, 2015, 09:50:51 AM
Do the canted queen posts offer any advantage?
With a canted queen post the top tenon enters the purlin plate with a standard straight mortise and tenon joint. The queen post bottom tenon is cut on the angle, and enters the top of the tie beam with a tenon mortise some what similar to a brace.
You would use this when you want a principal purlin plate to support your rafters.
Jim Rogers
So would a non-canted (vertical) queen post add the same amount of support as the canted one in the picture?
Quote from: esarratt on March 29, 2015, 09:39:28 PM
So would a non-canted (vertical) queen post add the same amount of support as the canted one in the picture?
I would think they would be similar if a straining beam was also included between the non-canted, queen posts.
I suppose that the canted posts put more of the plate load closer to the outer posts and center post. If the Queen is vertical it would put the load directly in the middle of that crossbeam span. (Assuming one central post as in the picture.) Personally I have always liked this design, very snazzy! 8)