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Wheel loader vs Compact track loader

Started by Walnut Beast, November 07, 2020, 08:13:12 PM

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Walnut Beast

 

  The compact wheel loader is going to have a new home. They are a awesome machine in many different ways but it doesn't have hi flow hydraulics  and it's a little longer so getting down in the woods in tight areas is not ideal

Brad_bb

I'm not sure if there's a question here.  I will share that I have my rough terrain forklift that turns tight and love it.  I also have a tracked skid steer that I've had to use the last 8 months milling.  The tracked skid steer tears the ground up turning.  Even if you turn easy and do some back and forth, still churns stuff up.  The worst is in my gravel floor building.  It really churns it, whereas my forklift does not.  The track machine is good in the mud though, especially in a straight line.  I hate getting mud in the tracks from turning in mud.  And when that mud freezes, well you can't use the machine. You have to keep it cleared out, which is a chore or keep it in a heated space at night.  I'll take my rough terrain forklift most of the time.
Anything someone can design, I can sure figure out how to fix!
If I say it\\\\\\\'s going to take so long, multiply that by at least 3!

Walnut Beast

Good points Brad. I know if your backing up a trailer with a wheel loader it can be tricky with the articulation 😂

stavebuyer

Depends on your intended uses for the machine. Dirt work or cleaning barns you will be pleased with a CTL. Tractors are better than either one for bush-hogging unless its severe enough that you really need a dedicated mulcher. General loader work I predict that you will regret sending the little loader down the road.

Ease of access
Visibility
Tire life vs track life
Ability to load a truck or trailer from one side
Engine compartment access
Travel speed

For spotting trailers either machine would be great if you used a QA trailer hitch on the front loader.

OH logger

I use a CTL for bucking piling sorting and loading on my logging jobs. Have larger wheel loaders but they stay at home unless the trees are real huge. The CTL can basically Lyft everything I cut and work way faster. I have a buck saw for it which is the bomb. The ONLY drawback to it is when your loading a semi you sit lower to the ground than you do with a wheel loader. It's no biggie though 
john

mike_belben

A swinger is the best machine for loading/unloading pallets of loose stuff on rough ground.  Skid steer will toss stuff off the sides in turns unless you go real slow.   
Praise The Lord

Walnut Beast

OH Logger. Your home state is where this beast is going. The guy has five big Terex units and a Wacker a couple sizes smaller than this one for snow removal. He is getting this one for personal use of his own place. Thanks for pointing out that it works out pretty good for the logging. Turner logging in Stockton MO. Logs a lot of walnut. They have two big logging skidders but they really use there CTL for getting logs out in tight situations and filling in ditches to cross. I was going to use the wheel loader with a 16,500 electric winch mounted up front. I think it would have been fine. But I think the CTL will be way better. Most of my big walnut trees are in very tricky locations that need winching a long ways. I would love to keep this wheel loader. This size is incredible. But the CTL is going to be the Swiss Army knife for logging without tearing my woods up. All the duties of the wheel loader and the big one. Running a tree killer head. Plus I'm going to have a hydraulic winch on the back of the CTL that will be controlled through the joysticks that's 15k or 20k

SawyerTed

Next to an extending boom forklift with grapple forks, I like a wheel loader with grapple forks for logs and lumber handling in the sawmill yard.  I've looked very closely at the compact wheel loaders.  It's crossed my mind to rent one to see how it works out.  A compact tracked loader is more versatile but has limits for log and lumber handling in a sawmill yard. The speed of a wheel loader with a bucket in transporting loose material is probably the fastest.  Clearance height is an issue for some wheel loaders so where overhead clearance is an issue the CTL wins.  Length of the extending boom fork lift and a wheel loader can be a problem. I have a customer with a wheel loader, he is constantly replacing pole barn posts because he can't see the back of the machine well enough!

For excavation, grading work, cleaning barns or in the woods the CTL is what I'd want.

It mostly depends on the usage of a CTL or wheel loader.  On our farm or in the woods, a CTL would win.  At the sawmill the extending boom fork lift then the wheel loader would win
Woodmizer LT50, WM BMS 250, WM BMT 250, Kubota MX5100, IH McCormick Farmall 140, Husqvarna 372XP, Husqvarna 455 Rancher

Southside

I don't know guys.  Wheel loader or track loader for logging.  I am pretty careful with my equipment but my buncher and skidder still take a beating in the woods and they are armored for that work.  Awful lot of expensive connections, pins, joints, etc that are exposed on those non woods designed machines.  Plus I would not expect to get much life out of rubber tracks.  Just my $0.02 worth.  
Franklin buncher and skidder
JD Processor
Woodmizer LT Super 70 and LT35 sawmill, KD250 kiln, BMS 250 sharpener and setter
Riehl Edger
Woodmaster 725 and 4000 planner and moulder
Enough cows to ensure there is no spare time.
White Oak Meadows

Walnut Beast

 

 Stavebuyer mentioned a tractor. I also had this unit for a short time and didn't really care for it. In bigger open areas it would be fine

Walnut Beast

The rubber tracks last longer than you think. But everybody is different and some people are really hard on machines. Bruno knows that 😂. Yes Southside I didn't really want to rip the wheel loader up down in the woods

Southside

I can see them lasting longer with a mulcher head up front because most of the hazard has been removed, but bare stumps can sure tear into rubber. 
Franklin buncher and skidder
JD Processor
Woodmizer LT Super 70 and LT35 sawmill, KD250 kiln, BMS 250 sharpener and setter
Riehl Edger
Woodmaster 725 and 4000 planner and moulder
Enough cows to ensure there is no spare time.
White Oak Meadows

stavebuyer

In the woods my choice would be skidder, dozer w winch, 4wd tractor with winch, and mules. CTL will be the next item you send down the road if you plan on logging with it.

711ac

It's been my experience that the "Grouser" brand over the tire cast steel tracks will run circles around the rubber belts in the woods in terms of traction. 
Will you be skidding out or carrying? My comments are based on a long 55" wheelbase machine (Gehl 7800) AND wheel spaces that make the machine about 94" wide.

nativewolf

Quote from: Southside on November 08, 2020, 06:29:47 PM
I can see them lasting longer with a mulcher head up front because most of the hazard has been removed, but bare stumps can sure tear into rubber.
Yes they can!  700 hours...$1200 for generic replacement, OCHH
Liking Walnut

nativewolf

Quote from: Walnut Beast on November 08, 2020, 03:53:50 PM
OH Logger. Your home state is where this beast is going. The guy has five big Terex units and a Wacker a couple sizes smaller than this one for snow removal. He is getting this one for personal use of his own place. Thanks for pointing out that it works out pretty good for the logging. Turner logging in Stockton MO. Logs a lot of walnut. They have two big logging skidders but they really use there CTL for getting logs out in tight situations and filling in ditches to cross. I was going to use the wheel loader with a 16,500 electric winch mounted up front. I think it would have been fine. But I think the CTL will be way better. Most of my big walnut trees are in very tricky locations that need winching a long ways. I would love to keep this wheel loader. This size is incredible. But the CTL is going to be the Swiss Army knife for logging without tearing my woods up. All the duties of the wheel loader and the big one. Running a tree killer head. Plus I'm going to have a hydraulic winch on the back of the CTL that will be controlled through the joysticks that's 15k or 20k
He's running around in mostly floodplains on the various major rivers there. Could be fine analogy to you..not sure.  For me the rocks are deadly, tree stumps too.  Those floodplains are pretty open.  Fields are open.  
However, give me a forwarder any day instead.  Carry your logs out and a knuckleboom to load.  If really tight just a few chains and you've got it.  If you have one machine, that seems to be the best to me.
Liking Walnut

Walnut Beast

If I was doing this day in and day out getting the trees out of the woods there is no doubt the forwarder would be the way to go. I don't have a problem with rocks. I think things will work pretty good with the hydraulic winch for what I need to do. I'll find out 😂. Hydraulic winch is on back order from ASV till Dec 1st. So I won't get the machine till it's installed. The machine will be the ASV pt 120 Forestry. ASV new warranty is two years or 2000 hours which ever comes first on tracks and everything. 



Southside

Quote from: nativewolf on November 08, 2020, 08:35:43 PMYes they can!  700 hours...$1200 for generic replacement, OCHH


Pffft.... Decimal dust.  Tire company quoted me $4,800 per tire for my buncher tires last week.  :o  My answer was "put a tube in it"
Franklin buncher and skidder
JD Processor
Woodmizer LT Super 70 and LT35 sawmill, KD250 kiln, BMS 250 sharpener and setter
Riehl Edger
Woodmaster 725 and 4000 planner and moulder
Enough cows to ensure there is no spare time.
White Oak Meadows

Walnut Beast


Don P

Yeah but I slimed the tube the other day  :D, time to get off the wallet  :'(.

I've been stuck or high centered with the skidsteer so many times where Artie the wheel loader has the ground clearance. I had a big white oak log on the Lull forks a couple of weeks ago carrying it across what I thought was firm ground when I started to have that sinking/slipping feeling. I shot the boom and carriage forward while staying lightly on the forward motion to the relief of my partner, the Lull's owner. He said I made it out with only an inch or two under the belly and he was getting nervous, that thing would be a bear to recover. I dunno, a blimp is looking good  :D

moodnacreek

What is a ctl ? I thought it ment cut to length. And LOL means lots of luck and BLM is bureau of land management. I can't keep up with you guys.

Sedgehammer

CTL = compact track loader

I'm no logger, but I did stay at a holiday inn last night.....

I recut the stumps just a bit wee above ground to eliminate tearing tires up when I do cut do any tree cutting.  

Yes it's harder on the saw and chain. Yes it takes time. Yes it costs more. But it's $500 a pop for tires for my skid. i'll take the time.
Necessity is the engine of drive

farmfromkansas

Beast, can not read the number on that tractor.  Have one that looks like that, try to stay away from trees with it, windows are very expensive.  Use the old 4020 to grab logs.  Last year broke the weld on the front axle, local welding shop made it better than new. JD welder was not great on the original. Not familiar with the brand of the wheel loader, would be nice to steer instead of skid on your yard, but not going to give up my skid steer.
Most everything I enjoy doing turns out to be work

mike_belben

My 742 bobcat is not allowed to go more than 50ft off the driveway, its has a dandy self bury feature.  The 50yr old 2wd kubota has not been stuck yet and will run circles around the skid steer in any offroad situation.  My articulated forklift is on racing slicks with open diffs and is extremely front end heavy with a load so it is only good for solid landings, basically it stays in the bobcat zone too.  Skidder tires and lockers would make it pretty potent but itll never happen. Id buy a hydroax missing the hotsaw and put a grapple fork on front before doing that.


The D31 dozer on worn 24" pads will cross a swamp without a mark, is great on fuel and has hp to spare, but its slow as mollases and squeeks cost $1 each long term.


However... I speculate that the dozer could pull out 3-4 cord at a time on a big hydraulic drive axle forwarder trailer with a crane and hydraulic winch.  Maybe im wrong but the 2wd 27hp tractor brings out a cord on my bunk trailer and its maybe 1/5th of the dozer in drawbar power and carriage weight.  You need weight,floatation and hp to do big things on bad ground.  

For the money, dozers are the cheapest way to get all 3 at the expense of being slow and harsh riding.  It really surprises me that big forestry trailer behind a dozer or crawler loader isnt really common.  I feel like it could put out nearly as much wood as a forwarder for 1/4 the price and most loggers already have a dozer for the needed road construction.   $10k for a crawler loader any day.  Forks or even big hyd winch on front, crane trailer on back, you could make a living without much overhead IMO.  Would suck in lowgrade but i think prime timber not so bad. 
Praise The Lord

Iwawoodwork

Mike B,   in the 1950's and 60's where I grew up  (coos Bay, Or.) there were several one or two man loggers making a living with 955/977 cat type ,size track loaders.  The loaders usually had log forks on front and a winch on  the back and the out fit might have a short logger truck,  I think I recall seeing one that had a  military 6x6 and was working off dirt in the winter.

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