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Mill advice and comments invited...

Started by Lacplesis, March 24, 2006, 12:53:42 PM

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Lacplesis

Hello Everyone,


As you can see by my number of posts I am green.

I am in the market for a sawmill. I have been researching information from the various manufacturer's web-sites, user forums, and whatever other information I can gather, including old materials I picked up over the years.

This forum looks to be an extremely good place to pose a question regarding the type(s)? of mills that may be most suitable for my particular situation. With that in mind let me give some background on myself, what I wish to accomplish with the mill, and the resources I have available as these are the variables that most of you learned folks seem to base your answers upon.

First off I am no spring chicken. I am 60 years old and have a suspicion (hard to admit a few years back) that my physical abilities are lessening. My guess is this trend is likely to continue. It is not that I cannot do physical work (We use wood for our primary heat source and I split out my oak firewood by hand with a splitting maul), but more and more I appreciate qualities in tools and equipment that help lessen the burden on me.

I am planning on retiring from my present employment in the very near future and will have significantly more daylight hours to use in a manner I chose. One of the things that I plan on getting into is something I have wanted to do for many years. That is the harvesting, "milling", and construction of some buildings on and for my place. The idea of "doing it all" really appeals to me. If I don't get into it before long I may never get to do it. I do have experience in both harvesting and building as I worked in both of those areas some years ago. What I am a novice at is the milling end. Custom milling is not an interest for me. I will have far too many other things going on for that.

My goals are to build a combination of buildings, using both timber frame and standard dimension lumber techniques. The sizes would range from small to moderate (say 30X40). They will not be homes, but things like a garage, craft cottage (for my lady), and some other storage structures. Rough flooring would be used in the ones without a concrete floor. I would like to at least consider board and batten and/or bevel siding as well. Metal roofs definitely (no hand split shakes).

I now live in Central Missouri and have been here for the past 30+ years. The woodlands on our place consist primarily of oak species ie. Post, White, and various Reds. Over the past 20 or so years various timber stand improvements have been conducted under guidelines that were developed by my local Missouri Department of Conservation forester. Including such things as pre-commercial thinning. Also some sections have been identified as either suitable for harvest now or in the next few years. It would be rare for the sizes to hit or be in excess of 36" or 16-20 foot. All the wood lots are on my place and I would haul to a fixed milling site. I am quite confidant that there is far more harvestable material on the place than I would use as there is likely 40-50 acres that could be utililized.

Hopefully this will give you'll a place to start.



broker farmer

Where in Missouri are you located?  I'm in Pilot Grove Mo. (40 miles west of Columbia)  Your story sounds very similar to mine.  You're welcome to come over and look at what I've done since getting started last November.  We're about the same age so I can show you what works for me with my manual mill.  Watching something work will answer a million questions for you. 

ronwood

Welcome to the fourm.  If you have the money and want to make the job a bit easier a hydraulic mill would be a good choice. Manual mill will work but the log handling is harder.  What type of support equipment do you have.  I went with the hydraulic mill because of turning the log on the mill. Felt it was a lot safer and easier on the body.

Ron
Sawing part time mostly urban logs -St. Louis/Warrenton, Mo.
LT40HG25 Woodmizer Sawmill
LX885 New Holland Skidsteer

IL Bull

Welcome to the forum.
I bought a manual mill and mounted it to a concrete slab.  Then I milled lumber and beams and built a 15 x 30 lean-to around the mill with my own lumber.  The only thing I had to buy was the hardware and the metal for the roof.  It takes longer to build that way but your cost are low.  I used green lumber right off of the mill and used extra bracing to make sure the wood would stay straight. smiley_beertoast
Case Skid Steer,  Ford Backhoe,  Allis WD45 and Burg Manual Sawmill

brdmkr

Welcome to the forum.  You have come to the right place.  I got lots of advice here before buying my mill.  If you are looking for ease of use, I suppose hydraulics are the way to go.  I have a swing-blade mill myself and I love it.  It is all manual, but it is not really that tiring to run.   I suppose its chief advantages are that I don't have to have a lot of equipment to move logs, it can cut really big logs, and I can transport it easily.  Sounds like many of these issues will not be a factor in your case.

Sawmilling is addictive 8) 
Lucas 618  Mahindra 4110, FEL and pallet forks, some cant hooks, and a dose of want-to

Ianab

Welcome Lacplesis

It was discussed the other day how gravity seems to be increasing with time and boards are getting heavier than they used top be  ;) :D

I dont think you want to be manhandling 30"+ logs around on a manual bandmill. A hydralic one would be great, and good used ones come up for sale from time to time. Also consider a swingblade mill, they are usually manual, but you dont have to move the log to saw it. Just load the log onto the bunk with front end loader or similar and remove the dimensioned boards as you cut. The swingblades are designed to be portable, but that doesn't mean you HAVE to move them, they work just as well sitting on a concrete pad :)

Bottom line is practically any mill will do what you want, just which one is best for your situation.

Cheers

Ian
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

Larry

Welcome Lacplesis...and another member from the great Show-Me state. 8) 8) 8)

I've had my mill for 12 years now.  Enjoy cutting grade hardwoods.  On my way to the big 6O and hope to be still milling for many years to come.  I'm realizing for that to happen, me and the manual mill on the left are gonna part company.

Speaking from hindsight I would try to find a good used hydraulic bandmill.  Since you have no plans to be portable, electric would be my choice of power.  A lot of thought should be given to handling lumber...stacking a 2" X 10" X 16' green oak board tain't fun even for the wippersnappers.

In any case your in for a lot of fun and satisfaction on the ride.
Larry, making useful and beautiful things out of the most environmental friendly material on the planet.

We need to insure our customers understand the importance of our craft.

Ron Wenrich

Well, how deep are your pockets?   :D

There are about 5 ways you can go.  Circle, band, chainsaw, swing, and dimension.  All have pros and cons.

Right now your biggest bang for the buck is in used circle mills, especially hand mills.  You can get a ton of equipment for little money.  But, some will take some TLC. 

You might also think about selling some of those big logs off, especially the high quality stuff.  It makes no sense putting clear lumber into a building when you can sell it in the log for a lot more. 
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

Bibbyman

Welcome to the Fourm.  We need another guy from Missouri! 

60 ain't old.  You may need a young wife to help with the heavy lifting... ;D

My advice on a bandmill is Wood-Mizer - new or used.  Just get one that fits your needs.

'Corse,  TimberKing and Baker are made right here in Missouri.  But Wood-Mizer is just a phone call away and they also have a service center in Mount Vernion, MO just west of Springfield.

If you'd like to see all the Wood-Mizer mills in action and talk to people that own them,  there will be an open house at the Mt. Vernon service center on May 20'th.  Come on down.  We've not missed one yet.
Wood-Mizer LT40HDE25 Super 25hp 3ph with Command Control and Accuset.
Sawing since '94

sawwood


Welcome Lacplesis, Wow we sure are gitting a lot of Mo sawer on here.
I help JR with his Norwood Manual mill and if you like to see it work just
give me a PM and we can set up a time. Just where are you in Mo?

Sawwood
Norwood M4 manual mill, Solar Kiln, Woodmaster
18" planer/molder

highpockets

Lacplesis, 

There are a lot of sawmilling guys here and they will give you plenty of valuable information. 
In my opinion the quality and size of a mill a man should own is directly proportional to his friends. If you have some goooood friends that are interested in sawing, then a manual mill would do ok.  If you are short of friends and do not have a weighlifting wife, then add hydraulics.  To me it is fun to saw when there is someone around to help with the little things.  We drink a lot fo coffee and saw a little.
Louisiana Country boy
homemade mill, 20 h.p. Honda & 4 h.p. for hydraulics.  8 hydraulic circuits, loads, clamps, rotates, etc.

DanG

Just a tip for you old coots in your sixties;  Get something with a dragback.  That's the part that saves ya from having to lift those 2x10x16s.  I just park my old forklift behind the mill, and those big boys just slide right on to the forks. :)




Most of that stack is 2x10x16 pine, and I never broke a sweat or got all red in the face handling them.

Lacplesis, if you're inclined to purchase older, used equipment, you can get away pretty cheap.  I paid $9000 for my old Mobile Dimension Saw, and $1500 for the old forklift.  My needs were covered at that point. :)
"I don't feel like an old man.  I feel like a young man who has something wrong with him."  Dick Cavett
"Beat not thy sword into a plowshare, rather beat the sword of thine enemy into a plowshare."

lord_kenwolf

i think selection of a mill depends on 2 things,  how much will you be sawing and how much you want to spend. after you saw the lumber for your buildings will you be sawing just for your use, or will you be selling it.  if your not gona do any custom sawing like you said,  do you really want to spend 20-25 grand for a hydraulic mill. i guess it all comes down to how much do you feel justafied in spending to do the amount of sawing you want to do.

Lacplesis

Hello Everyone

Lot of comments here. Thanks for the input. I will try and respond to some of the questions you all had. Hopefully I won't miss anyone's.

Ideally it sort of looks like hydraulics would be the thing for me. But putting out 20-25k for a new one when I don't look to go into business with it may not be a wise way to go. A used one maybe if it is not too dear or bite the bullet and get a new one to resell after I cut up what I want. Thing is with the buy and resell route is I am certain after I get into this I will not be wanting to let go of a quality piece of equipment. I am not going to rush this thing however. Looks like I need to see some of these units in operation for sure. So when things slow down here a bit I will contact those nearby who offered to show and tell for me via PM and hit that Wood Mizer show in Mt. Vernon in May for sure.

Ron, I won't be cutting up veneer or stave bolt stuff for construction lumber. I had it cruised some years ago to establish it basis so I know some of that is out there. My plan would be to get a pro in to ID what I have so I do not waste the good stuff. I am sure I can get my friendly MDC forester or call in a consultant if needed to mark up just the trees for my purpose.

As far as equipment goes I do have a Massey 135 and a New Holland TN90F 4WD. The Massey is w/o cab and has no remotes. The New Holland has a cab and 6 remotes. The Massey is my go into the woods tractor. The New Holland would be what I would set up with forks on the back. It is not well suited for a front end loading as it is a Specialty Tractor set up for vineyards (the unit is narrow and has a special extended front end for making tight radius turns the combination of which makes it less stable than a standard tractor with a front end loader mounted). The vineyard is why I won't have the time to get into the wood milling business and why I am wanting to construct several new buildings. They would be very helpful for my second love viniculture.

Wes Lyon

Welcome to the forum.  You are welcome to come up and mill with me on a Mobile Dimension 128 in Chillicothe, MO if you like..........

Good luck in all your endeavors.

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