New heat source

[quilbilly]

I just bought a house. It's 1975 and 2500 sq ft with vaulted ceilings and has 3 heat sources. Forced air, pellet, and wood insert fireplace. Electric bill was over 350 for Nov and I'm quite worried about Dec when it arrives. 

The pellet stove is old and small and pellets cost money. I don't like the insert which is also old. I'm not sure how long I'm going to live here so I don't wanna pour tons of money into a new heat source. 

So option 1 would be a bigger new pellet stove, but that means I'm still buying pellets. But seems reasonably priced overall and 2nd cheapest. 

New wood insert would be cheapest but I hate inserts. 

Retrofitting the fireplace might be possible with a masonry heater but that seems more than the 10k max budget I have in mind. 

Wood boiler seems like I could hook into existing ductwork but could also push that 10K budget and not sure if I could keep my A/C. Ditto with replacing forced air furnace with wood furnace. 

What do y'all think is my best option.

[beenthere]

What are your fuels now?  Sounds like wood, pellets, or electricity. Any others? 

[rusticretreater]

Is your pellet stove ducted?  If not, finding some way to duct it is your cheapest option.

Most stoves and inserts are localized heat sources that don't have the advantage of ductwork to route the heat through the house, particularly the second floor.  Nothing like a freezing bathroom on a winter morn.

With an outdoor furnace you get to keep your A/C.  The heat exchanger is placed in the ductwork after the A/C exchanger.  Cold air from the A/C is blown through the heat exchanger.  If the furnace and its pumps are not running, you have A/C.  You can also route the tubing with valves so the furnace can heat your water but not send the heat to the exchanger in the summer.

I have recently installed a used outdoor furnace along with the necessary tubing, heat exchanger and wiring.  I paid $1400 for the furnace and $2230 for the piping which I manufactured myself.  $800 of the cost was just for trenching as my ground is rocky and heavy clay.  The furnace will be heating my workshop/garage and also my house.  So $3630 for two zone furnace installation.  My furnace is 150ft from the house and about 60ft from the garage. 

Depending on your climate, you may need to add antifreeze (raw propylene glycol, not the stuff used in cars) to the water. This can add another $1000-$1800 to the cost of installation.  As you live in Washington state,  that's probably likely. Then there is another additive that is a corrosion inhibitor.  One gallon of additive treats about 200 gallons of water for $45.00.

[Old Greenhorn]

Quilbilly, you don't mention the house layout for open air heating. You have 3 chimneys? Is there one near the forced air system?
 You may want to take a look at this company and their forced air wood furnace systems. Thermo-Control They were recommended to me by Spike60 over a year ago and I bought a woodstove from them this past fall for my shop. I am very satisfied. There are several nice things about this purchase for me. First USA (and locally for me) made, second it's a family company, third and most of all their systems are made so that they cane be configured after you buy them. I had inquired about a forced air furnace but when I called and talked to Tim (the owner) he asked me some questions and then suggested I get the woodstove instead and save a bunch of cash. I explained I might need the forced air down the road, and he explained their design and how I could just order the extra hardware later and put it on down the road. All their stoves come with all the holes pre-drilled and properly plated over. You can add a hot water coil, domestic coil, air jacket and blower for forced air, or just order it as you want it.  I have a minor issue with it and Tim was very helpful when I called. I will get into that further when I pull the stove apart for the first cleaning. I think it's just a matter of cleaning up some burrs on the bypass plate.
 The fourth reason I liked it was the price, and getting it without the forced air stuff saved me about 500 bucks. I also saved by going to inspect it and picking it up. All in for the stove with an existing chimney was less than 2500 bucks, I think. Just think hard on your sizing.
 Best of luck to you.

[PoginyHill]

For a rather mild climate like Washington state, a mini-split (heat pump and A/C) would be cheaper to run than electric resistance heat. New models extract outdoor heat down to well below 0F. It would duplicate your AC needs but might still be a reasonable option. I think some units come with a single outside unit (condenser) and maybe 4 separate indoor units (evaporators) with independent temp settings.

[Al_Smith]

Might sound odd but I can heat a slightly under 2500 foot house with an insert .Plus it's an L shaped house the hardest to heat by design .I've got duct work and what I think is happening is the natural convection of air going from heat to cool is what does it. However it's brick and well insulated with Andersen and Geld-Wen  windows plus Stanley doors .The insert BTW is circa 1980's Lopi glass front rated at 55,000 BTU with fans .It will run you out if you keep it fired hard .If it had forced induction I do believe you could forge a horse shoe in the fire .Fact for the last week I'm not running the fans as it would cause two old folks sitting around in their undies .

[Al_Smith]

I'm in different situation  than most .The house is 600 feet from the road with approx. 7.5 acres of woods .I never need to go more that 500 feet to get the wood and it's flat ground .I can  gather it up at my own pace which at my age is not real quick .I'll never run out of firewood the rest of my life although I'll certainly run out of ambition at some time .
Some people like to boast how fast their wood splitters run .Mine a very robust home built I seldom run over 1/3 throttle because it will out run me .End of the month I'll be 75 and I do tire out .That 11HP Briggs engine doesn't get tired .Doesn't take a coffee break and is happy as clam if it doesn't run out of gasoline .

[quilbilly]

Old greenhorn- I'll look into that stove. 

After looking over my bill again, I realize my actual electric usage was 2941 kWh for $230. The rest was a whole bunch of wonderful fees and taxes, $130 worth. That was with running my old pellet stove about half the month. It's on the way out though, has a bad sensor that I'm not sure I'm going to replace. Does that seem high?
 
To answer other questions, we have two chimneys, one from the old wood fireplace, which now has a wood insert. One vertical for the pellet stove. 

I don't do sketch up so the layout from left to right of a rectangular house, Den to the living room. Then the interior load bearing wall splits the bottom level up with dining room and kitchen on one side and bathroom and bedroom on the other, finally on the end of the house is the walk in pantry and laundry. Upstairs above the most recently mentioned is the second level which has master bed/bath and third bed and bath. Den and living room both have vaulted ceilings. Den is about 16ft and living room is 20+

I've thought about a mini split. It would work well for my temps which are about 25-90 and almost never above or below. If so it would never be for more than a week. I just hate the look of em. 

[stavebuyer]

I have the same issue with my electric bill. I think the probability of the "line-item" totals growing exponentially is more of certainty than a possibility and would factor into the decision of future cost/benefit analysis.

[GRANITEstateMP]

I like my word d stove, no power needed...but at some point, as Al states, my power will be less and I'll use more of the bought heat, vs MattMade heat.  Maybe a stove like OGH would work, but I also.like Southsides owb deal too. But thats just me. I'd love a mini split, but more for the cooling side of it

[SwampDonkey]

I heat nearly 3000 sq feet including basement where the forced air furnace sits. Got ducts into first and second floor, the second floor ducts are insulated. I only used 1000 kw in Nov, usually less, but I'm running a grow tent and I run electric furnace some in the night to. I heat water with electric. I've never had a bill over $170 with the grow tent included, without is typically $125 in winter. I cut and burn my own wood off my ground. I had a heat pump with electric backup in the other house, electric with that combination is 3x as much. A heat pump (and I had 2 over the years) does not keep up below 20F. They were the latest heat pumps you could get at the time. So be careful of claims about their capability in cold. :D Ask the neighbor Willie up the road, he's had one 3 years, if he has to supplement with wood on a 10F day. Hard to drive heat from one end of the building to other without it being rather cool down the hall and in a bedroom. Nowhere as hot as wood from the source to begin with. :D  I have an efficient AC unit that does the whole house, barely $40 in electric, so got that covered. ;D Got way less money involved and way less to use. :D If I was buying wood, that certainly adds about $300 in a cold month up here. So don't forget to factor that in. Definitely no more $$ to heat, but less investment, based on $$ they want up here for heat pumps and backup electric. If your old and in bad shape for one reason or another, maybe money for convenience is not a bad choice.

[711ac]

Quilbilly your climate is perfect for the "mini split" setup! 
I'm in Maine and I can't say enough good things about mine. We installed them for a/c as we have a (indoors) wood boiler and radiant heat for the real cold, but the m/s also work out fantastic for our "shoulder" seasons. 
I'd do a little more research on these before you dismiss them over an appearance thing. Kinda a "cut off your nose to spite your face" thing. 👍

[quilbilly]

I've used them, I'm not dismissing out of hand, I just don't like em. They're ugly. I paid to put one in my rental and my moms house. Within the last two years. 

[beenthere]

Among all your options and "dislikes", you will find the right combination for your new heat source. Hope you let us know what it is when it happens. 

[quilbilly]

Welp I've got an update. We have a Yukon Polar furnace in the barn. Worked when removed. Multi fuel. Is it possible to hook this up to the existing ductwork and work in tandem with the heat pump? I'm thinking it's my preferred option if I can get it to work.