small skidder---which one to buy ?

Timberjack5 · August 13, 2020, 04:44:20 PM

Thanks Satamax, maybe I should give a Gm a go, I'm good at repairing 4 stroke type diesels, just never been near a 2 stroke so it's new ground for me.

Satamax · August 13, 2020, 09:12:14 PM

My short encounter with a 6-71, makes me think I wouldn't like one in a skidder. They overheat at low rev. Guzzle diesel, repairs to the blower can be costly. For the rest, they are easy to work on.

barbender · August 14, 2020, 01:07:31 AM

My experience with the 3-53 Detroit that is in many, many small cable skidders is that they are REALLY LOUD, really easy on fuel, and have decent power.

BargeMonkey · August 14, 2020, 02:20:04 AM

Nothing wrong with a detroit, honestly they are a good engine, parts are still around. Just make sure you slam your hand in the door so your in the right mood to run it 😆

mike_belben · August 14, 2020, 05:40:51 AM

My big forktruck has a 353 that has been great. Ive done nothing but change oil and hardly ever add fuel. But it pretty much needs to see 3/4 throttle to get out of bed. Theres no quieting one down. You muffle yourself, not it.

Timberjack5 · August 14, 2020, 06:21:02 AM

Yeah ok. Thanks for the input fellas. I can live with muffling myself, done plenty of work where I had the earplugs plus the ear muffs. Carbon arc gouging and 9 inch high cycle grinder as a welder so the idea of making a lot of noise in the mountains is growing on me. It's fairly remote country so it's not going to bother anyone. I've done logging previously with dozer and wheel tractors but I have not had a skidder. For the interim while I'm looking for a good skidder I am setting up an old model Zetor tractor that has front wheel assist, 70hp with front blade, I'm setting up a big old 40,000 pound pto drive winch on the 3 pl with a butt blade and a draw bar pull wheeled logging arch. The winch is very slow 50feet per minute, the zetor has ground speed PTO so I'm hoping I can use the tractor gears while in neutral on the high low lever to create several speeds for the winch with the higher gears giving a higher winch speed. Just got the speeds idea yesterday so haven't tried it yet.

Timberjack5 · August 14, 2020, 06:24:41 AM

BargeMonkey, I did get a good laugh with the slam your hand in the door. :D

mike_belben · August 14, 2020, 07:09:50 AM

Would love to see some fab pics.

I thought ground speed pto only moved if the tires moved? Great for making a tractor into a forwarder.

Am i wrong?

Old Greenhorn · August 14, 2020, 07:40:58 AM

Quote from: BargeMonkey on August 14, 2020, 02:20:04 AM
Nothing wrong with a detroit, honestly they are a good engine, parts are still around. Just make sure you slam your hand in the door so your in the right mood to run it 😆

Kind of like banging your head against the wall..... It feels so good when you stop. ;D

tacks Y · August 14, 2020, 10:22:33 AM

Those Detroit's are load, I can here one 3 miles from my house. Looking for a smaller machine than 7 ton (440C) so I can haul myself. I see a TJ 207D but can not find weight of it? Other ideas?

barbender · August 14, 2020, 01:38:38 PM

I read before how in the Canadian maritime provinces the ground speed pto tractors were pretty popular for building kind of a forwarder. They'd build a trailer they called a power trailer with a truck rear end and power it with the pto, put a log loader on it and you got yourself a forwarder.

mike_belben · August 14, 2020, 03:19:46 PM

Lot of old european homemade forwarders built that way too. They have shows and get togethers of them, like a forestry parade.

Timberjack5 · August 15, 2020, 04:20:44 AM

Mike, the ground drive pto can be active utilising the gears while the tractor is stationary by putting the high / low range gear in neutral. I've used it a few times where I need to get the pto in the reverse direction. There is an old caterpillar D2 on the farm and the pony motor is not running so I put a pot shaft between the Zetor and the cat , run the pto in ground drive reverse with high / low range in neutral , works very well, let the cat main engine warm up just as you would with the pony motor, when the exhaust manifold is warm then give the old girl some fuel on the throttle and there's always a very healthy grunt to follow and the cat is running, through the pony clutch and then shut down the zetor. Always a bit of a nuisance if you happen to stall the cat while working it though.
You made me think for a day, I was nearly going out to run a trial but it's a cold day and the wife , kids and myself have a head cold so not much got done and then I remembered how it works.

mike_belben · August 15, 2020, 12:15:15 PM

Wow neat..

So the zetor can have the same shaft turn at rear diff speed and direction.. And also be selected to run as a regular pto? Is it a 540/1000 or just a whatever it is off the countershaft sort of speed? And the pto has a reverser?

This is sounding too good to be true.

Timberjack5 · August 15, 2020, 12:48:51 PM

Well yes it does have 540 / 1000 however the ground speed is a seperate selector. The reverse is achieved by selecting reverse gear. I have never tried it in the other forward gears except 1st forward however i will give it a try over the next few weeks just to be sure. I bought a little electronic rev counter a few days ago and so as soon as I can get a few spare hours I'll try the other gears while stationary and count the PTO actual speeds.

mike_belben · August 15, 2020, 12:55:46 PM

Awesome! Is this setup found on any other tractor or unique to zetor?

Timberjack5 · August 15, 2020, 01:13:53 PM

I've got a 60hp John Deere 4x2 that I do hay with, it has it though it is actually a badge swap that JD did with zetor in the 90's. I haven't had personal experience with others though I believe that other European tractors like Same, Valtra have this type of setup. I've watched ground drive forestry trailers on U tube with these brands.

Timberjack5 · August 15, 2020, 11:51:20 PM

I've run the tests with the rpm counter. Normal 540 pro gives around that (540) at about 90% revvs (2200 engine revs) a separate lever puts it into 1000 PTO which achieves just over 1000 at 2200 engine revs. The ground speed PTO is a completely separate setting where 540 / 1000 becomes irrelevant. 1st gear forward achieves about 350 rpm PTO. Top gear 5th achieves about 1300 rpm PTO which can be done stationary if the high /low range lever is in neutral.
So it will work well for the winch, it means I can get the winch to go about 2.5 times faster than the 50ft per minute plus can make it go slower and everything in between.

Timberjack5 · August 16, 2020, 12:03:53 AM

I was very fortunate to pick up this winch for $400au. I watched out for one for about 3 years and this I a very serious logging winch for heavy Australian hardwood. It was manufactured in Sydney Aust. It was built to be compatible with an Oliver crawler and it is most likely about 90 years old, certainly 80 years. It was tied to a tree and the tree had grown around it but it was also covered with corrugated iron. It still has oil in it, turns over and seems to be in very good order. It pulls 40,000 pound or approximately 20 tonne.